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terms apply. Well

1:26

go Markham! Welcome to

1:28

Arm Chair Anonymous Who?

1:30

Juicy Episode: Monica. Why

1:32

we gap calls. Wow.

1:35

Really See? This one runs

1:37

the gamut. I love this episode

1:39

with tremendous heartbreak for people. Who.

1:42

Grow up in some of these me

1:44

to micro cultures or culture whatever you

1:46

want to call him. oh. Culture.

1:49

Colt. That's what it comes from. Wow.

1:52

No thought of as. I think I say this

1:54

and that episode bet even though we tell

1:56

people not to listen. And. This

1:58

one's have tough to list into. I think

2:01

this is required. Listening? Yeah, this one

2:03

is pretty required. Listening? Not did

2:05

I. I've never acknowledge this, but

2:07

it was yet again another opportunity.

2:10

Do acknowledge: You can start in

2:12

a pit. You just get brought

2:14

home from the hospital in you

2:17

don't pick since. And so wherever

2:19

I've evolved to needs a big

2:21

ol' Astor like I started in

2:23

a super open dialogue house where

2:26

the the truth was the reigning

2:28

principal. Where there was just is

2:30

where. I could have my own opinion.

2:33

Yeah, when I look at where I

2:35

started to where I ended, it's probably a

2:37

tenth of the ground that some the

2:39

people in this episode of Covered in their

2:41

lifetime. Yeah, and flock am. I am

2:43

so lucky. To have

2:45

been born in Lore The both household

2:48

shutout Lore The Boa Love you. And.

2:50

I'm so lucky. In my heart

2:52

Breaks for people. yeah it's tough to.

2:54

Also juicy though as I write episodes

2:56

yes it's great. Have some. Oh before

2:58

we go we have prompts for next

3:00

month. so. Tell.

3:03

Us about crazy cause play.

3:06

Whatever that means the i mean I'm

3:09

doing this prompts I don't really understand

3:11

cause players nine on Amazon incredibly Yeah,

3:13

I guess some tells about a crazy

3:15

cosplay experiences. Okay, tell us about your

3:18

worst day. This is inspired by Alexander

3:20

in the Terrible Horrible. No good, very

3:22

bad day. You. Guys both knew

3:24

that, but I don't know anything about militants

3:27

that okay so tells what you're worse. Decks

3:29

tell us your best cautionary tale that the

3:31

same as worse they are. No. Such.

3:34

As an Intel is like a story

3:36

that when he say it. Like

3:38

dong. He. The shrimp at

3:40

say what? that? Is

3:43

a pretty wide yeah Matt attacks and

3:45

then this one I'm particularly excited about.

3:47

Tell us about a crazy experience you've

3:49

had as a delivery driver. That can

3:51

be U P S that could be

3:53

They can be any kind of delivery

3:55

service for years. Entering people's property Gap

3:57

our food delivery you name it. message

3:59

your i was a messenger how he

4:01

made as the by we should almost

4:03

often made for that early said about

4:05

dropping something auto. I'm. Okay

4:08

Cbd, please enjoy armchair

4:10

anonymous costs. So

4:14

much. Else.

4:36

Says hello. Is this Christina? It

4:38

is. I'm Dax. This is Monica.

4:40

Where your real name it as

4:42

you're young to me. I nazis

4:45

thirty already. Went on to the

4:47

regulations. You made it to thirty.

4:49

I dead A Where are you

4:51

in the world? I'm. In

4:53

Brooklyn that I'm actually in the

4:56

process as moving to Spain on

4:58

Monday? Oh no way. like sightings.

5:01

Are you so excited? Are you nervous? or?

5:03

both? I'm. Super excited I'm going

5:05

to move to finally be

5:07

the no longer since boyfriend

5:09

has two years. Oh wow.

5:11

and is he a Spaniard, Keys

5:14

and assailant? Oh Venezuela. No one

5:16

of the nose on his family.

5:18

That's improbable number. And since I

5:20

saw. A specific be great. There

5:22

are a family. Just meet online.

5:24

Now we know in Spain

5:26

as cousin is my sister's

5:28

ex boyfriend. Us I meet

5:30

his All right. So you were

5:33

so crazy to say right? you

5:35

are not. Hold on how there's

5:38

a whole story yes self. it

5:40

starts. And funny sixteen. You're

5:42

twenty two. Yes at that.

5:44

Some in my dad and my

5:47

step mom had just done this

5:49

south develop link course said they

5:51

were super pumped to now cause.

5:54

Executives Success Program

5:56

now known as

5:59

the. While my

6:01

guys I almost. Got to

6:03

easier like my brain old I sell

6:05

my body's in Enjoy! You might be

6:07

a merry Uphills will know you might

6:09

be a i'm a response of arousal

6:12

purse ah lazy or Iraq or to

6:14

a say or twenty two in your

6:16

dad and years step mom made took

6:18

a course in by the way when

6:20

I was watching the doc. The courses

6:22

are good. they're very similar, the many

6:24

landmark always ones that would help you.

6:26

There's some good find the truth of

6:28

the story you're telling yourself right? there's

6:30

some good shit. It. Actually changed my

6:33

life and my family size.

6:35

My mom and my dad

6:37

had a really tough divorce

6:39

in our sir. Doing.

6:41

This. It brought. My

6:43

entire family together. And

6:46

we now stand Thanksgiving all together with

6:48

my mom and my step dad. Just

6:51

as they were able to go back

6:53

in Seal, That's great! A lot of

6:55

positives came from it. not all bad

6:58

guy asks. so they ended up convincing

7:00

my sister nice to. Do

7:02

it though. it's you have to do this

7:04

will pay for you to do the first

7:06

course. It's worth it. We go to this

7:08

five day in town says from. Eight

7:11

am to nine pm. In

7:13

the photo studio where it's

7:15

twenty people, you're sitting in

7:17

front of the screen and

7:19

you watch videos and two

7:21

exercises and these as easy

7:23

as I like from. The

7:25

eighties. Okay okay now so this is

7:28

probably a tricky thing to go through

7:30

because you now have a relationship or

7:32

feeling about all of it but you

7:34

have to kind of access would you

7:36

felt like Batman so I'm imagining the

7:39

twins who use your been like this

7:41

is awkward but pretty quickly in does

7:43

it serve feeling fine and productive. Some

7:45

things are signing. Some things are

7:47

really emotionally hard. There was a

7:50

lot of crying. Oh, really

7:52

have to face a lot

7:54

as fears and it's all

7:56

about separating the emotional from

7:58

the actual experience. You have,

8:00

right? I think that's a positive that you

8:02

get out of it. but any. It

8:05

wasn't the most enjoyable super

8:07

exhausted. I mean, you're there

8:09

for thirteen hour? Ago. They

8:11

were you in your sister kind of

8:13

having parallel experiences a receipt taking it

8:15

differently than you see. To the definitely

8:17

see to get Very much like

8:19

I am not a fan of

8:21

Israeli an eyelid site I think

8:24

this is great. I'm committed, I'm

8:26

in. I mean they start. Every

8:28

staying with like a pledge and they

8:31

have the sashes and I was in

8:33

a sorority so those things to me

8:35

where as will will a my sister

8:37

is the opposite so for her she

8:39

is skeptical super and a few months

8:42

later was this thing they do called

8:44

the week. Which. Is Keats

8:46

renew his birthday? That they celebrate

8:48

and they call him vanguard? Oh

8:50

who am I saw at and they call

8:52

him. To

8:54

all of these programs have way to

8:57

an acronym. Scientology is all got acronym.

8:59

They live on acronyms. To that's not the

9:01

weird part. The part is have a dedicated

9:03

his whole week to this. Noise. As far

9:05

as I know, everyone deserves a weeklong

9:07

birthday. Is whole thing was I'm not here

9:09

to celebrate myself. I'm here to celebrate my

9:11

mother. She's the one who birth to me.

9:13

A lot of oh humility. Via The way

9:15

I was able to go is because I

9:18

was going to volunteer for the kids Can.

9:20

They. Had the cycle other programs

9:22

school for kids called Rainbow

9:25

Cultural Gardens. Similar to like

9:27

a montessori sort of structure

9:29

but it was all based

9:31

on. Exposing. These kids

9:33

to different languages. Sorry, we

9:35

just laugh. But as more to do with,

9:37

we were just arguing the merit of requiring

9:40

people to take two years of a foreign

9:42

language for college. so you just kind of

9:44

wandered into the aftermath of that debate. So

9:46

kind of funny, but he just said diane

9:49

of them to keep running Area agrees with

9:51

you. Ah

9:55

of hours. funny well

9:57

as the surface of.

10:00

Oh yeah, Because I speak English and Spanish.

10:02

They were like even better. More

10:05

languages, more cultures. great. So this

10:07

is where I was introduced to.

10:09

India who was one of the

10:12

women she tells her story in

10:14

the documentary she was one of

10:16

the like mean women who ended

10:19

up being and dos i was

10:21

watching Sarah Edmunds and science I

10:23

was around i really big numbers

10:26

loss assassin and I will call

10:28

her gabby knocking the say her

10:30

name is she still anonymous in

10:32

the world she was one is.

10:35

T for of friends I didn't know

10:37

the time she and I got really

10:40

close to. she was the other Spanish

10:42

speaker. And teeth would

10:44

do these big speeches in the auditorium

10:46

and would sit and talk and share.

10:49

And at the end she's like i'd

10:51

love for you to meet teeth and

10:54

she brought mean introduce me to him

10:56

and it felt very much like a.

10:59

Presentation. Mail up to this

11:01

point so you like the program and you

11:03

see the merit in it and you had

11:05

a good time. How enamored are you with

11:07

t their you kind of bind him yeah

11:10

that listener leaves the know this on that

11:12

same as to make you uncomfortable your own

11:14

rages li to your like Soviet empire had.

11:17

Also I'm already thinking the girl from May

11:19

Be wanted to introduce you just living

11:21

in a new girls I just there's no

11:23

he didn't notice you when the girlfriend. Not

11:26

want to bring not so easy. For

11:28

told them they were getting more love from

11:30

him by getting more girls for him. I'm

11:33

sorry I shouldn't be. You would know better

11:35

than you but my understanding is like the

11:37

girlfriends would go out and recruit new girlfriends.

11:39

Yak! As they wanted to please him and

11:41

so the more women they could bring to

11:43

him the better of his urine. mammary by

11:46

hem to I was like. Wow,

11:48

this man is so smart. He's

11:50

taught so many things, he has

11:52

so many ideas and I was

11:54

twenty two and I so wide.

11:56

Also your most trusted figures in your life

11:58

their into your parents. Like the whole thing

12:01

here. So I had no

12:03

second thoughts about anything and

12:05

just after that I was

12:07

planning on moving to London.

12:09

I hop around, know I?

12:11

yeah and. They. Have

12:13

one of the rainbow centers the

12:15

schools in London and they were

12:17

like you should go work there

12:19

be so great and I was

12:22

like sure that way I have

12:24

a job. They're also. Been repaid you.

12:26

I. Mean minimal, right? right?

12:28

And they have a lot

12:30

of well known clients that

12:32

have their kids, their as

12:34

students and what they. Ended.

12:37

Up having me do is one of their

12:39

clients. One in one of the teachers to

12:41

go with them to their house in Madrid

12:43

to stay with them for two weeks to

12:45

be with their kids. Sort of like that.

12:47

many. Teachers and I was like

12:49

great you're not gonna wilde adventure

12:51

through This is. Sites all over

12:54

the place. I go in this.

12:56

Poor kid wants nothing to do with. Me:

12:58

She hates Me. He. Says

13:01

he has so many nannies and

13:04

teachers and people being rotated and

13:06

he lists for. These I just give me

13:08

my fucking mall. He saw his parents.

13:10

Thirty minutes a day. And.

13:15

Eventually, because of the stress, I

13:17

ended up having a seizure. Pixel.

13:22

Resolution guy shows really you.

13:25

They rely on. Yes,

13:29

Yana. Scary. It was like my second

13:31

or third caesar so they didn't really

13:33

know what was happening yet and what

13:35

was going on and say. Ended up

13:37

going to the hospital and sign back

13:39

home to California which is I'm from

13:41

and then I was like okay I'm

13:43

sort of done with this. And

13:45

Gabby had reached out. And

13:48

she was like I'd love to

13:50

continue mentor a new. Let's.

13:52

Try and get you to do more courses

13:54

and work on these things and I was

13:57

like a i can't Afford this completely. My

14:00

budget and I have too much going

14:02

on a cat and that was when

14:04

I have dropped out. but during all

14:06

of this my step mom and my

14:08

dad are like full on. Reiser

14:10

noise My. Step mom was

14:12

in all of the women's groups

14:15

in going to different events in

14:17

Mexico and she was full on

14:19

moving up the ranks also and

14:21

try new bring as many people

14:24

in the she played because she

14:26

was completely obsessed with everything that

14:28

they offered. Really good when you

14:30

laugh. Would you say you are disillusioned

14:32

about what are? you knew you had

14:34

other shit, nudist was interest or you

14:37

like? This is weird and I actually

14:39

don't want agree. With a bit of

14:41

both people are a bit of grass

14:43

is forcing things on you and emotionally

14:45

people are just on your back of

14:47

like I need you I once you

14:49

you're so great you can see through

14:51

at a bare. definitely. But I was

14:53

like you do you to my parents

14:55

sits working for yogurt. Oh my god

14:57

your purse sister. Or you're lucky sister.

15:00

One know this is my whole family's

15:02

in. As.

15:04

My step mom gets. More

15:07

involved she was having more as

15:09

the higher ups also reaching out

15:11

to her as hey we actually

15:14

had this sort of discreet. Confidential.

15:17

Group with love for you to be a

15:19

part as. But. To

15:21

do so, we need you

15:23

to give us collateral. Yeah and

15:25

for remove not watch the dark. Woods.

15:28

You sure it's incredible Collateral is going

15:30

to mean something that you'd be incredibly

15:32

embarrassed to get out so that they

15:34

have some kind of leverage over you

15:36

to make sure your maintain secrecy see.

15:39

Was very much like this seems

15:41

super wrong but I also love

15:43

this I don't know what to

15:45

do And finally she that cyclists

15:48

it's too weird. I. Got

15:51

to the crossroads Nc Wow. Good.

15:54

And because of how high

15:56

up she was. they like

15:58

black keys outlay sort of

16:01

shine you. As I getting

16:03

labeled and S P N Scientology

16:05

a suppressive person, your persona non

16:07

grata and a threat to everything

16:10

exactly. And as more women

16:12

and more people started dropping

16:14

out and they started talking,

16:16

they're like something. Isn't right

16:19

here. And then finally when

16:21

she heard that Sarah Edmunds

16:23

since. Spoken. Out

16:25

about it see decided to be

16:27

one of the witnesses that when

16:29

against him in. Court. Oh wow,

16:31

She's part of that trial. See. Was

16:33

part of the trial. She ended up. Writing.

16:36

A book about her whole experience and

16:38

it to sit was a lot of

16:40

ups and downs. See one of keeps

16:42

coming for hims now. Doesn't I'm wondering

16:44

like I can totally understand. been enamored. The

16:47

person's like a Dali Lama or something there

16:49

on some different spiritual plane. but when the

16:51

rubber meets the road that when you actually

16:54

end up in a bedroom with them as

16:56

is gonna be a mommy, we're like well,

16:58

wait, the staunchly creature. Not a huge

17:00

thing for here. and I was i oh

17:02

yeah I hear another Sam oh. I'm

17:04

happy for you cause I can't imagine he would

17:07

have very much wanted. You are are going be

17:09

easy for us? Yeah yeah because I was the

17:11

dog and I realize you're a bull's eye or

17:13

what he was looking. Yeah. Yeah yeah

17:15

auf die. It was an experience in

17:17

a wild story to tell when all

17:20

of the documentary their stories were coming

17:22

now ever see. So while for you

17:24

to watch the.and know you are a

17:27

part of it and see all these

17:29

people that I was with. Mind blowing

17:31

that I'm so grateful that my insanely

17:34

A got a lot of good things

17:36

out of it and also didn't go

17:38

too deep. Also. Weird to

17:40

be thankful for, but epilepsy know why.

17:42

I mean literally them might be and

17:45

how you don't end up saving your

17:47

mind. Deeper and deeper are you in

17:49

cap or temporal? Didn't work for me.

17:51

I'm on Law makes done is

17:54

done again and it's called free

17:56

Tonight the my epilepsy is. Drug

17:59

resistant. Oh wow return. they put

18:01

me on one. It'll work

18:03

and then are has breakthrough seizures

18:05

and so I actually just did

18:07

a procedure where they test to

18:09

see if I am a surgical

18:11

candidate or. Whatever. and your

18:13

brain. They. Put in seven kinda

18:16

electrodes and opened up my

18:18

train you to put a

18:20

stripper lectures on my brain

18:22

and found that I am

18:24

a candidate. Sure I'll be

18:26

getting Mr Er Seine. lots

18:28

of love for that. Big time.

18:31

In and look for the prompt. Have

18:33

you ever gotten brain surgery? A couple

18:35

my I bet now apply. Have you

18:37

ever gotten railway? Brunell. You've done it

18:39

before. We added R I. A. Meringue?

18:41

that? yeah this is delightful. I hope

18:43

you have so much fun in Spain!

18:46

Think. He! I'm so excited it's time

18:48

for me to feel my legs. Oh

18:50

wonderful or I will have far

18:52

as mean you. Nice meeting you

18:55

guys! I. I. Guess

18:57

was wearing a medical bracelet. Jews were

18:59

more those on cough syrup bunker session but

19:01

also says wearing a medical personnel on assassins

19:03

it was ready but with them center was

19:05

the imminent one. Is Tiffany Bolger Funny Now

19:07

look at the book of as a big

19:09

boy like you were and I'm talking about

19:11

the one. A lot of people have the

19:13

same that has circles in it like with

19:15

the screws is popular. Oh and are no

19:17

thousands? Of house here. no. Specific.

19:22

Is is really. I. Mean

19:24

and sauce. Hello!

19:30

Oh look it's just bizarre microphone I

19:32

know it was you know when it's

19:34

on just for the listener. you're holding

19:36

a very solid and the chef is

19:38

glowing blue sky lights in at any

19:40

some great thanks is this is a

19:42

good trillion dollars this thing now I

19:44

got it on amazon to is recommended.

19:46

I'm a podcast there's well I think

19:48

I'm I want this is very high

19:50

tech if we ever did and made

19:52

episode okay They finally like the armchair

19:55

in the dark new window and we

19:57

have grown we microphone. Was we have

19:59

gone? From the sun went down and there's no

20:01

lighting in here. Okay I feel like I have

20:03

of memory but maybe it was a dream

20:06

where we did one in the dark. We

20:08

shall we do one in the dark. I don't

20:10

think we have has and I made that and

20:12

then let's get these glowing microphone through on. You

20:14

have really opened up the door for a whole

20:17

new thing for as a specific glad I could

20:19

contribute something. Okay so rule on you are involved

20:21

with a call I was oh my god last

20:23

least tell us a little over ten years ago

20:25

do on via say how he into it that

20:28

things glowing blue or means your heart was just

20:30

a a sub I said talks a lot When

20:32

I was in college one I kept going back

20:34

to it was titled Orgasm the Cure. It's the

20:37

hunger in the West. Or woman. oh my.

20:39

I was a nice inroads man so

20:41

I clicked on it. Obviously it was

20:43

the founder of the occult. I was

20:45

in see gave a talk that was

20:47

kind of about sex is really about

20:49

connection and it really spoke to me

20:51

as a title. Lonely, very anxious nineteen

20:53

year olds. what was the premise of

20:55

hurts had taught? I've heard this one

20:57

thing. That's maybe it's a call, but

20:59

it's about orgasm yoga. Yeah, orgasm meditation.

21:01

is that what the topic was? Have

21:03

heard said.yeah was about how she sounded

21:05

how intimate such was a waiter. Deeply.

21:08

Connected away the most people than connects

21:10

in society, so that spoke to me.

21:12

I never thought about that or that.

21:14

I was quite socially disconnected and awkward

21:16

and pretty lonely without realizing it right

21:18

a couple years later. Same Ferris who's

21:20

books I really enjoyed had a sapper.

21:22

The orgasm chapter in his second book

21:24

was written with one says the call

21:26

thousand know a new as the calls

21:28

back then. That was a couple years

21:30

after college and I kind of decided

21:32

that I really wanted to take classes

21:34

with them. They seem to have the

21:37

answer to my dysphoria. Quarterlife Crisis as

21:39

you will or long lenis we might call

21:41

at all of those things that a lot

21:43

going on there based in San Francisco but

21:45

they're setting up a New York branch. I

21:48

started going to their insurer events. I didn't

21:50

really understand what they're about but the got

21:52

me to speak vulnerably in a way that

21:54

I was not use you as a at

21:57

that point twenty three year olds ends one

21:59

thing led to another Seem like this magical

22:01

group of people there were super expressive and

22:03

could read people in an amazing way. And

22:05

you know there was sexuality is part of

22:08

their practice that was intriguing but was the

22:10

extent of that will. It's authors practice Connor

22:12

Grass meditation and actually is in aeration of

22:14

a practice. Other calls from the sixties did

22:17

this a whole I family tree of cults.

22:19

Maybe even use Discover This already with your

22:21

other interviews. but is it practice? Romance shows

22:23

the woman's clutter isn't a meditative fashion home.

22:26

I have high to achieve various benefits somewhere

22:28

greatly exaggerated, but it was like. You

22:30

feel a level of connection that you

22:32

normally feel and day to day what?

22:34

We know, my allotted regular Sachs jurors

22:36

and we know biologically. Yeah, after an

22:38

orgasm a woman gets a big release

22:41

of oxytocin which is the love hormone.

22:43

That is true, you do connect from

22:45

post orgasmic activity Yes daddy as you're

22:47

entering a state of high sensation together

22:49

where the man is not being stimulated

22:51

I worked for them, cyanide explain this

22:53

and and their fashion of course, but

22:55

the man trains as intuition to put

22:58

his attention and a woman which most.

23:00

Men are not trained to do so. I

23:02

mean within a couple months I moved in

23:04

with Sam. they had residence in Harlem. it

23:06

was a penthouse is kind of like a

23:09

reality show mix with like a yoga us

23:11

from. We got up as seven every day,

23:13

we did the own practice you meditated, we

23:15

did yoga rate super healthy. did you feel

23:18

great if the me I'm in the first

23:20

couple months? it was very weird because is

23:22

a totally different worlds is also a female

23:24

run colts wish I think it's kind of

23:27

unique as a kind of anti patriarchal and

23:29

Salmon as an egalitarian and all about connection

23:31

and not competition. So the spoke to me

23:34

at this time my life and then within

23:36

a few months I started working for them.

23:38

That's when I started see the dark side

23:40

of how they mixed sex and seduction and

23:43

with sales I mean a lot of it

23:45

was driven about trying to get people's money

23:47

essentially wrong. They sold for some development courses

23:49

for really high prices, a lot of people

23:52

went into debt including myself to pay for

23:54

their courses and as basically in for two

23:56

years and I saw a lot of things

23:58

that were both incredibly possibly transforming for me.

24:01

But all though lot of the dark side

24:03

of human nature people getting mine fogged and

24:05

brainwashed and gas lit, emotionally shattered Edu fallen

24:07

in love with anyone there and that two

24:10

years could you have a girlfriend yet will.

24:12

One of the things they did and probably

24:14

all called do this to some degree is

24:16

they wanted to control how people selling love.

24:19

So if you answered in a relationship that

24:21

relationship users broken up. And. And

24:23

somehow you'd be encouraged to be with someone

24:25

else but was kind of was in the

24:27

cost structure because everyone kind of in love

24:30

with the Colts. Ultimately that's what they wanted.

24:32

I'd also imagine to like when you fall

24:34

in love with somebody and many developed this

24:36

real bond of trust you're gonna maybe start

24:38

airing some of your questions that normally you

24:40

wouldn't bring up to someone that you don't

24:43

trust self as to people get closer in

24:45

the trust bond gets their they might defense

24:47

and seems potentially damaging for the call. it's

24:49

like they wanted set have control of the

24:51

reality and when you're. In Love separately can

24:54

have your own personal reality. So a made

24:56

people fall in love. I did fall in

24:58

love the few times while I was there

25:00

but it's almost under the guidance or approval

25:02

of my called mentor because the causes and

25:04

like a family and my mental jokingly should

25:06

say she was my mom like a work

25:08

mom in like of office but she actually

25:10

was my mom is far as our behavior.

25:12

but did you have to stimulate her ever

25:14

know it had to do anything about kind

25:17

of one of their principles like everyone acted

25:19

by desire but then they found ways to

25:21

twist people's desires rise. Okay so the. Answer

25:23

question I didn't have to. I did because

25:25

everyone did this but it always felt weird.

25:27

We'd really did have like a mother son

25:29

bonds even for her. I think this kind

25:32

of strange for as I pointed a little

25:34

comforting because all these men when you give

25:36

them unlimited access and power is a will

25:38

indulge in this way and I will obviously

25:40

were terrible. I'm a lease comforted that women

25:43

to will do this. yeah I'm your mother

25:45

but also stimulus that's very scumbag to. I

25:47

think it's a dynamic of power that corrupts

25:49

people in this weird way. It once as

25:51

interesting about this group. And I think

25:54

it's because his female ryan is that because

25:56

women are encouraged to be expressive and outward

25:58

with their desire, it kind of. The script

26:00

where women were kind of the hunters and

26:02

a lot of men were like please leave

26:04

me alone for a second a long as

26:07

they were pushing off the sexual advances to

26:09

make us feel what it's like to be

26:11

a woman in like a normal dating environment

26:13

for that time that yep I'm anymore compassion

26:16

and I'd imagine totally. So when did the

26:18

we'll start coming off Within my first year

26:20

there and I was working for them I

26:22

saw how them using sex for sales and

26:24

also I romanced for sales. That's when I

26:27

started go nuts and my stomach and like

26:29

my conscience. As having trouble with this

26:31

because I really looked up to my

26:33

mentor to group itself it helped me

26:35

a lot. They did have a lot

26:37

of wisdom. I still think that's true.

26:39

Yeah they also the all these weird

26:41

things was little bit challenging. I did

26:44

spend another year kind of is a

26:46

leader, was in the community trying to

26:48

distance myself by it's in that year

26:50

they became pretty successful in the mainstream.

26:52

Like they got endorsements from Tony Robbins

26:54

and Process and a bunch of other

26:56

celebrities. A magazine listed them in the

26:58

top ten female run companies. Are soft

27:00

sand on health and Wellness like they were

27:02

really blowing up really quick. I just wanna

27:04

put a point on what you just said

27:06

which is like people to acknowledge the things

27:08

have good things to offer. People wouldn't be

27:10

there are doesn't surprise me at all but

27:12

you say some percentage of are you still

27:14

really cherish. If it didn't have anything appealing

27:16

and transformative, You want new men there? We

27:18

talked to someone for next to him. What?

27:20

Yeah, a lot of the shit is appealing

27:23

and works until you get to the zone.

27:25

Words not Yeah. I mean they had a

27:27

really good front end products and I got

27:29

you into their sales funnel. Everyone in the

27:31

called there was an but also culti people

27:33

I've met. They all are powerful in the sense

27:35

that they can create an effect in you and

27:37

of course they're gonna give you a positive

27:39

effect at first. I see in the

27:41

Excellencies community there's a saying that once a

27:43

shows your power and and sells it that

27:45

you piece by piece because like the first

27:48

few months or amazing showing your their guys

27:50

get off porn addiction, women who ever sat

27:52

down physically have orgasms for the first time

27:54

or fall in love for the first time

27:56

in years could have a trauma like they

27:58

really did amazing things in the first. Months

28:00

for almost everyone. Maybe the movies to like?

28:02

Go through all of these calls and just

28:04

see the first three months and then bounce.

28:06

I think if it's an effective. Have you

28:09

pie wall mri but if you go

28:11

the game plan to. Were

28:14

used only nam any physical ailments like

28:17

was your body telling you you're not.

28:19

Comfortable. With all this but you're pushing

28:21

it down. The first few months I was

28:23

working for them I was hired as like

28:26

a bunch of other young people and all

28:28

of us we know didn't have a career

28:30

like this is awesome are saving the world.

28:33

We're gonna help people get connected and we

28:35

had the sites maybe two month period of

28:37

fairly sleeping doing all sorts of stuff over

28:39

one hundred hour weeks. We're working seven days

28:42

a week and not tired or like wow

28:44

we're like so spirits fully charged up or

28:46

charge of with orgasm so to speak It's

28:48

amazing But of course we all dressed like

28:51

after two months the all had red eyes

28:53

and or zombies and were same for being

28:55

zombies snatch me to worry about is the

28:58

dude ever allowed to come in? It was

29:00

an advanced practice hear something that only after

29:02

some amount of time you're considered able to

29:04

do responsibly com and also like they change

29:07

the definition of orgasm. There's like a sequences

29:09

definition changes to every corsi so it's like

29:11

an intro class. They said people think of

29:13

orgasm from the male perspective as coming whereas

29:16

orgasm for a woman is acidify sensation and

29:18

then we take another. Class is like will

29:20

orgasms also all the emotions the com with

29:23

feeling good and is also kind of the

29:25

dow like and hours them is kind of

29:27

like see in chinese medicine and eventually becomes

29:29

got slowly over time. the definition sifts were

29:31

like oh the orgasm is selling on serving

29:34

the orgasm and is kind of joking at

29:36

first the first time you say it but

29:38

all of the terminology it starts off facetious

29:40

and then you kind of take it seriously

29:43

this even talk in that way for so

29:45

on friday desensitize your shot at to. Anyone

29:47

in your life like parents

29:49

or siblings are friends outside

29:52

where they like this feels

29:54

a little. Salty are. They call

29:56

anything al. I joked about it. Has it

29:58

been my calls with everyone? I'm. Is what

30:00

I was a good way to talk about.

30:02

I guess it was a strange environment by

30:04

the has so many benefits and especially knows

30:06

working for them. I learned how to speak

30:08

about the benefits well the know into really

30:10

argue with me. Oh wow okay so and

30:12

is a crash and burn for hims asteroid.

30:14

I worked for them especially as an employee

30:16

and burned out. I. Less the company as

30:19

an employee. those cylinder out as soon a community

30:21

and I knew I wanted to leave eventually. but

30:23

as having a great time as growing as a

30:25

person I want to stay for a while but

30:27

they are putting a lot of pressure on me

30:29

to work for them again. Is that in my

30:31

eyes at least I becoming a liability because I

30:33

wasn't directly controlled by them but I had some

30:35

influence for used to work for them. I was

30:37

like the protege of the Second in command sites

30:39

and have had some status. I reached out to

30:41

the cult leader the Sounder because I wanted to

30:43

write a book with her. I've always wanted to

30:45

write a book. I'm writing a book about my

30:47

calls experience Nagi. Ironically. Fussy agreed to write a

30:49

book with me by an exchange without saying it

30:51

directly ahead to commit my life because I would

30:54

guess given me a lot of status. And

30:56

after lot of pressure I just decided I

30:58

had to leave because I couldn't commit my

31:00

life and I was basically the choice to

31:02

commit your life for leave right now. will.

31:04

This is one of the few calls I

31:06

feel like I haven't followed the trajectory of

31:08

have they been exposed as one are they

31:10

still thriving thing happened to them? Yeah, in

31:12

Twenty eight seen there's a Bloomberg Expos A

31:14

that was a source for and that kind

31:16

of brought a lot of the negative attention.

31:18

Cspi is now investigating them. Sound was just

31:20

indicted a few months ago. I think there's

31:22

also Netflix special that I meant was already

31:24

out lesson of them. Are. Calling out to

31:27

watch out. oh sorry, who is to November's

31:29

Ago? Orgasm Inc or has I mean we

31:31

haven't seen as I didn't love the documentary

31:33

personally but you know is a complicated story

31:35

to tell you that it was one too

31:37

sensational. The I think they went for kind

31:39

of the typical sensational stories. sucks for him

31:42

a missed nuance and it might have just

31:44

been challenging because I think the only people

31:46

that were willing to talk to them were

31:48

either really traumatized or men. It kind of

31:50

gives like a weird impress him because he

31:52

was a mostly female cards but I think

31:54

five of the seven people and speaker. Men

31:56

L and what was the ratio? At least

31:59

in New York. It was. I think sixty

32:01

forty in California might have been actually the

32:03

opposite, But the New York. Part. Of

32:05

it was mostly women, man as

32:07

ass. and yeah, Thank you for

32:09

sharing! Yeah, that was incredible. How do

32:11

you feel now you've been out of

32:13

it for a while. I guess give

32:15

a hard time reconciling that you are

32:17

susceptible to that. A Overall had a

32:20

positive experience honestly even though they did

32:22

some really bad thing right sometimes they

32:24

saying we shouldn't have to do something

32:26

like that like if I was an

32:28

anxious as a teenager I probably to

32:30

sort of had a normalize. it was

32:32

excellent adventure right now quite a bit

32:34

of life experience forever was rule on

32:36

that was incredible. I've received telling a

32:38

settlement on they send me you. Don't have

32:40

a title for your book yet. The thousand

32:42

name your podcast, Rwanda podcasts and the book

32:44

is orgasm A memoir by so everyone look

32:46

for that will thank you so much. Good

32:48

luck with everything I guess by. These.

32:51

Are some of. The.

32:53

So many. We.

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33:20

I wanna say I would write and

33:22

read My New Years resolutions. Yeah, Ah,

33:24

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to learn more. I'm

36:25

sorry we're late. These have been juicy

36:28

or than anticipated. They've gone a little

36:30

longer than we are expecting. No

36:33

worries, they planned or same the same

36:35

vein of pet owner was so sad.

36:37

Where are you? I'm currently in Los

36:40

Angeles Outward? oh okay. nearby or it's

36:42

a you were involved in a call.

36:44

Please tell us what happened. Okay, so

36:46

when I was fourteen, I was actually

36:49

sent to a circle against my will.

36:51

for two years I wasn't able to

36:53

communicate with my family for the. Vast

36:55

majority of Army Guy was aired. it's them

36:58

feel like I'm to be around but it's

37:00

important for just the contact with gonna Years

37:02

later at the communications that were allowed word

37:04

and be an email and was thus authored

37:06

so that they could decide what information I

37:09

was given from my family and what information

37:11

they have a family needed Here for me

37:13

is is a similar situation or like the

37:15

Paris Hilton saying it's exactly bow Myself have

37:17

to. The staff at my school had opened

37:20

a previous school ten years or so before

37:22

and it had been shut down to my

37:24

Jos Forty eight not. Been in

37:26

that was eighty, two thousand seven and

37:28

Edinburgh hearing about when my staff members

37:30

being like yeah for a certain went

37:33

to our program and she was airlifted

37:35

out of your i've never been like

37:37

are so the school year to single

37:39

people's names. twelve years later she's from

37:41

Congress talking on the slap you sounds

37:43

like no fucking way what behavior. Or.

37:45

You exhibiting that your parents wanted to send

37:48

you their so externally my behavior had lots

37:50

do like drug use at work in i

37:52

had been ecstasy I had to a lot

37:54

of read I was thinking I was stealing

37:56

I'd driven a car illegally I was just

37:59

defying a lot. What my fear is

38:01

wanted for me see also the do like

38:03

me being gay thousand something that I had

38:05

said out loud hr you are having a

38:07

crisis to say the least. August he did

38:10

that for two years, fourteen or sixteen. Was.

38:12

Sexual. The discussed in there are They Like

38:14

a known can be Gay was that the

38:17

premise sexuality was off limits completely. we were

38:19

only allowed to talk about sexuality and or

38:21

of from a wizard lotta times. Was.

38:24

Based in like shame and a lot of

38:26

the staff would use it against us so

38:28

they're a lot of times were like we

38:30

would you disclosure circles it was workshops as

38:32

whole school programs is built off of this

38:34

thing of see do see Edu that's the

38:36

beginning for all of these programs from Paris

38:39

is to mind of a canyon discovery ranch

38:41

or of the for I went with other

38:43

it is a use that as a incubator

38:45

of like their ideas like that's really like

38:47

same ideas came from and things like that

38:49

so i. Personally, Went to school

38:51

that was supposed to be for twelve

38:54

like eighteen months and they had an

38:56

I Q thresholds it like specifically wanted

38:58

to get a hold. The people have

39:00

a certain echelon it was under the

39:02

influence. do the people are like affluent

39:04

or or the and I was a

39:06

bad kid and foul play my whole

39:08

life so I would air with the

39:10

understanding like I'm a kid and is

39:12

exposed to help me It became very

39:14

clearly that this was on a plan

39:16

season in South Boston Virginia Sold really

39:18

beautiful homes of sprawling area with mental

39:20

a really. Nice. and it wasn't

39:22

registers. I'm at the whole institution

39:24

specifically for the reason of protecting

39:26

our kitchen, so that was inducted

39:28

colleges. Or that really middle of

39:31

the didn't have to have I think

39:33

of was rise I have very quickly

39:35

this leases really phony early usually take

39:37

everything on this drink the kool aid

39:39

and everything will be fine and I'm

39:41

not a cooling off at a defiant

39:43

kid is translated really poorly for me.

39:45

While I was there we were incentivized

39:47

and his group attack therapies to and

39:49

at each other for like was any

39:51

minor impacting and didn't scream at them

39:53

or a cost family as a group

39:55

your associates in on it and I

39:58

was caught. Doing. Work. Ah,

40:00

really great to see Do Foundation who came

40:02

up with that? Where's that come from? Like

40:04

I'm starting to throw from the sixties or

40:07

seventies, but it just became more more popular

40:09

drug that it is in the nineties and

40:11

in a lot of these troubled teen industry

40:13

programs are based off of his ideas or

40:15

their ideas. Buy and sell. This is very

40:17

cod, racist and communism or year incentivized to

40:20

write each other out and constantly be telling

40:22

on each other to yield. Trust nobody. It

40:24

becomes really pressing the I'm I'm a rookie

40:26

year old who just like skills wrong and

40:28

have all these words. In all of these

40:31

things express why that feel so wrong but

40:33

even the staff were due to the middle

40:35

of nowhere bridge you know it's from I

40:37

doing this isn't the colleges, These weren't people

40:39

who were qualified to be like live in

40:41

residents of Therapy. Advisors.

40:44

For all of us any other caseload

40:46

that we're way beyond their means and

40:48

we would be encouraged him to stop

40:50

the participate in each gene therapies in

40:52

and it's screaming assault to be fellow

40:54

get up to the suggestion box at

40:56

someone name pounds you could make sure

40:58

they will use a prelude to sit

41:00

on my and South Terrifying! and did

41:02

you feel uniquely picked on by everyone?

41:04

Absolutely. Oh the gays southerner you I

41:06

came out three weeks before I got

41:08

sent to display. In the Woods is

41:10

a quoted as program at a prerequisite for a

41:12

lot of this and so I went to that

41:14

came out there. Think that's into this program is

41:16

very much like. Why? Do you if you

41:18

bring up that you're gay we don't care

41:20

that you're gay of his other things need

41:22

to do with as that I just came

41:25

out with what if is a funny critical

41:27

element is is what all the other things

41:29

are built on top of the i mean

41:31

we need to get into this exactly with

41:33

and all of my sexuality with used to

41:35

shame he died when staff member to new

41:37

I felt really dirty and discussing groupings. I

41:39

had done it for team at at At.

41:41

They weren't biblical yes see in one group

41:43

in front of thirty of my tears. Told

41:46

me. How do you feel

41:48

like if you're disgusting? And.

41:51

You like. That's right if you don't buy into this

41:53

program, if you don't. Do. What we're

41:55

all here doing. You're. Gonna

41:57

end up being. A thirty faggot. It

42:00

for money all out that this is a

42:02

reference to something someone else had said in

42:04

the group to me oh I'm sure you

42:06

just feel like a dirty faggot and I

42:08

was a guess I do and I'm like

42:10

play along. Side

42:12

it would you say I'm not so

42:15

was horrible that sentence I've said it

42:17

in the have a million times that

42:19

of couldn't decide to a forty year

42:22

old boy and I don't do this

42:24

program those who live like was with

42:26

users ah I know young guy yeah

42:29

they. Pretend like it's school

42:31

is a like math class. Also

42:33

been. Murdered themselves as a college preparatory boarding

42:35

school. He emphasized the lot on my you

42:37

send your Kids your it's the and of

42:39

such a great education. I was put in

42:41

a solution which is out of school suspension

42:43

know the word for it For six months

42:45

I was allowed to go to school so

42:47

I was like held back I was said

42:49

in a room for twelve hours a day

42:51

or defeats forward security guard sudden after the

42:53

rule of law to raise my hand if

42:55

I need to go. I wasn't

42:57

allowed to dream. I had to look up a be no I wasn't

43:00

Loves turned to look at. Anybody walking out of

43:02

the root of the women's bathroom with also years.

43:04

Ago I was not allow us to be

43:06

a type of reference What was going on

43:09

You're describing like a P O W Expanse

43:11

I so fucking while is if your parents

43:13

are only reading edited transmissions from you how

43:15

do you get out of the said sixteen

43:17

was ended up happening with like this is

43:20

right around My birthday was about sixteen seventeen

43:22

month mark at that point I'd had my

43:24

from have taken away with your given one

43:26

on column and it was monitored by an

43:29

agreement to do in front of own houses

43:31

him as soon as which meant frying are

43:33

saying it was really going. On. So they

43:35

remove my phone call. About three weeks before I

43:37

was I was actually kick and program thank God

43:40

exactly and I had called my parents give me

43:42

a bird phone call and I used it to

43:44

just say. Everything I was like mom,

43:46

it's too far gone. I can't redeem myself

43:48

here. Every group I'm in I'm in violated

43:51

have no interest in building the backup I'm

43:53

here as an example of and as are

43:55

wasting your money which while with the so

43:57

expensive now we're talking multiple six figures. The

44:00

went bankrupt right? Help their children. All this was

44:02

just a nightmare. So I got kicked out because

44:04

I was just so defiant. My peers visit some

44:06

point so that we can keep paying you for

44:09

going to prove his room to do this for

44:11

six months. Yeah I'm sitting me so I got

44:13

tricked out and says when other programming it's. That's

44:16

a similar program. So you thought

44:18

the have of all that mormons run this whole

44:20

industry and a have the Mormons are they in

44:22

Utah. I'm not saying all Mormons are bad and

44:24

thing and ninety percent of troubles in industries are

44:26

among the board. So I was into a different

44:28

program at this program when I would other about

44:30

what the other programs like of the doing was

44:32

registered. they were. Horrified. While

44:35

he's there was a big improvement it was a

44:37

noticeable difference. I think it was way more. Structures

44:39

are in a lot more rules about why and

44:41

how vs just the dogma and you'll die if

44:43

you know what we say. As the for school

44:45

we had a thing of switching to the end

44:47

of every day. We are also still likely get

44:50

her and at each other and like spoon stop

44:52

include it. Was bizarre,

44:54

was so manipulative you'd stay at his

44:56

excitement. aggressive, angry, attacking like nobody's they

44:58

ever. And then at night they do

45:01

like know that your friends and coddle

45:03

them and. Everything's gonna be okay. we're

45:05

all in this together. And Stafford nothing

45:07

you gets like beating a dog and

45:09

then inviting the dog up on your

45:11

lap and central area as they are

45:13

home. Yes, yes. So when I described

45:15

be a Saturday for the switching alone

45:18

useful You're like that's not legal South?

45:20

yeah but you have it was so

45:22

brain was at that altitude I simply

45:24

kool aid only during the Glad I

45:26

target as you'd like survived. I think

45:28

ultimately what protected be in the reason

45:30

I get to be like a normal,

45:32

well rounded, successful person in my thirties.

45:34

Compared to the unfortunate percentage of people who

45:37

have committed suicide or have died from overdoses

45:39

from the school is the fact that I

45:41

instantly put myself in isolation and I missed

45:43

out on so much brainwashing program. The workshop

45:45

only got to go through two of the

45:47

five workshops or Murdoch of the one that

45:50

the prefer the great surveillance. Also like having

45:52

a lot of people listening be like yeah,

45:54

that wouldn't work on me in this would

45:56

work on every one over a long enough

45:58

period. I'm like no one's conviction is so

46:00

strong when near community around. use all doing

46:03

one thing. You can only resist that for

46:05

so long. It is the reality you live

46:07

in so you have to contend with that.

46:09

You live in a one mile bubble. You

46:11

are never not monitored and everyone that you

46:13

trust, the focus is either unleashed or it's

46:16

on someone else. So have I done with

46:18

a focus on the i have to kill?

46:20

What? Am I correct? Yeah, I guess it's

46:22

Hunger Games if you didn't Hockey group. Don't.

46:25

Like where he talking, are you hiding everyone?

46:27

the dog on you and everyone would he

46:29

urged it as. Was. Hungry Honors math

46:31

say sorry Charlie advances trying to protect

46:33

themselves. So did you stay at the

46:35

Utah One all the way to adulthood?

46:37

No other says wait fourteen It's full

46:39

of foods Was two years so I

46:41

spend the vast majority of the first

46:43

program. and then like clockwork of months

46:45

I was at. His. Youtube program

46:48

which because it wasn't so.

46:50

Mind lucky I could manipulate and a

46:52

my way for ages understood or another

46:54

uttered in the stall speed the cow

46:56

it was a ranch so I was

46:59

able to the like navigate that little

47:01

little utter and get out that sixteen

47:03

when you got home. did the bad

47:05

behavior continue or didn't stop and putting

47:07

bad in quotes the cries for how

47:09

did they continue I guess I can

47:11

also says the cries for help is

47:13

different lyrics of time when I came

47:15

back from Iraq as the original school

47:17

I can say it has been shut

47:19

down does exist anymore but. I still

47:21

lived what I call the corporate machine resistance like

47:23

my mental need to processing through the lens of

47:25

the people there what they want it for me

47:27

And so once I got out a deaf we

47:29

had a stockholm syndrome I first got home even

47:31

after the other program I was like. A

47:34

happy go lucky. Prove to them that I can finish

47:36

this program. that's all this other kid and I'm not

47:38

gonna die and package with a My mom was like.

47:40

Your. Nights: A: we're not in a you

47:43

back there a Buick. What's going on The

47:45

guy? would you want to? Ah, what is

47:47

your resentment leveled Source: Mm was their guilt

47:49

level about this whole experience. It's in fifteen

47:51

years. In February when I got it took

47:53

about ten years of be processing before I

47:55

was able to be honest with records ballot.

47:57

My father's very empathetic of if you ask.

48:00

Today my dad will tell you we had

48:02

to do something and we did something. If

48:04

you ask my mom, she feels terrible. I

48:06

arbor a lot of guilt when the fact

48:08

that like my parents needed to do this

48:11

yourself a what universe? mm yeah and as

48:13

a corner that they were so desperate which

48:15

at fourteen I didn't have. Thought patterns get

48:17

kid doesn't do that By the way,

48:19

like you didn't see you are a

48:21

kid right? But nonetheless like I thought

48:23

the lot of disappointed in myself to the

48:26

know my parents financially took a big hit

48:28

to try to protect me. I know that

48:30

my parents did all of the stuff of

48:32

love and affection and like chair for me

48:34

and believes in me and my success and.

48:37

I know that ultimately of sharing with them with

48:39

he did. Was. Probably one the

48:41

were things that were happy. My life feels

48:43

really shitty even now and guitar will that

48:45

Stevie about it? You will be further as

48:47

your life. It's the people that are there

48:49

to protect you for you in a situation

48:51

where you are harmed. I am one hundred

48:53

percent forgive them for they saw my peers

48:55

many of them had side of overdose and

48:57

did not have the caring loving parents are

48:59

they did they were sent the way because

49:01

it burns in Monterey them if they were

49:03

difficult they were rich and they just didn't

49:05

want to deal with it. I the only

49:07

was none of appears wanted to protect me

49:09

from myself. Yeah. Fuck

49:11

man isn't some rough situation or

49:14

on him. And also fifteen years

49:16

ago the vibe was different. You

49:18

see these people on daytime talk

49:20

shows and they're like success stories.

49:22

Popular culture is. Kind. Of

49:24

supporting at this is a good solution known

49:26

speaking out yet about point know during periods

49:28

of the talk about it know that she'd

49:30

been on the bike has gone are. Busily,

49:33

About an hour long interview and Emmys.

49:35

Be so happy to note months of

49:37

blink of an happened or more people

49:39

like us exists. That industry still exists

49:41

deployed so profiting millions of dollars. have

49:43

a secure parents who just want to

49:45

help the kids. And. It takes

49:48

somebody like her. Giving. Somebody

49:50

like me or whatever a platform to

49:52

tell that story so that like maybe

49:54

we can steaks this stuff. We should

49:56

stop doing this to Dover. Absolutely.

50:00

That I'm very sorry that you

50:02

had that experience so unfair. Appreciate

50:04

that. We appreciate you sharing and I

50:06

do think it will help people to know

50:08

more about it. Was she was seen.

50:10

The numbers are all ranges. There's like tens

50:12

of thousands of kids who have gone through

50:14

these programs and yes, just enough feel alone.

50:16

The comforts he gave you is that you

50:18

weren't alone. Swipe for can a Hayworth exactly.

50:21

Their communities will says thanks so much for

50:23

sharing that with us. Absolutely! I appreciate you

50:25

both for having the on the major research

50:27

or I will be well advised by. Hours.

50:35

What is wrong with likes? Doing

50:39

this to silver and. Unfortunately have

50:41

two options. You gotta either a truck

50:43

the whole thing up to the there's

50:45

someone evil who wants to her kids

50:47

vs. More. Likely in my opinion,

50:50

someone who really believes this works

50:52

in the wrong, which is even

50:54

trickier to confront. Was sit as

50:56

the illegal league and have regulations that

50:58

make these things illegal. Now the

51:00

for perez know ship. Given

51:04

the new. Allows

51:06

any here as I just punch Monica money

51:08

and it turns out she is a bad

51:10

me. I didn't even our is it Rosie's

51:12

yeah okay that yi ay it's hard to

51:14

go anyway. it's. Because all the roads the

51:17

I he was taken out like I

51:19

gotta be unique and somehow. Sandra, One

51:21

of my cardinal complaints about the English

51:23

language is I before E except for

51:25

After See but that's not even closer

51:27

to the truth or something. A lot

51:29

of our best. And the ads alive.

51:31

One of many lies well it's called

51:33

in sick have to as this english

51:35

language my okay so you have very

51:38

exciting i make upon our think year

51:40

and then you have angel wings behind

51:42

you So. Part of my journey sir.

51:44

healing religious trauma as then. there's a

51:46

lot of cause play make up that

51:48

sort of thing. This is from the

51:50

a the men cause play that I

51:52

just ended up putting on the back

51:54

of my streaming set up here and

51:57

it's very dramatic. Yeah man, those

51:59

are kinda like whites. I'm going to

52:01

try to not get derailed on cause play

52:03

because I think we need a prompt about

52:05

colleague of mine so intrigued and Dom about

52:07

what that means and what people do. Okay

52:10

colts and where are you from? Where did

52:12

this occur? I. Am a pastor's

52:14

daughter from the Southern say as

52:16

insists organization or what I have

52:19

referred. See you online and my

52:21

content as A Cold Tours for

52:23

legal reasons. Tell me about Seventh Day

52:26

Adventist. Seventh Day Adventists originates in the

52:28

car the same place with a cult

52:30

of personality which is William Miller. From

52:32

William Miller you go from As and

52:34

says the guy is so Jehovah's Witness

52:36

he was former as insist preacher. It's

52:38

all under the same umbrella of William

52:40

Miller back in the day. From upstate

52:42

New York as well. With As insists that

52:44

is actually miss again and it's all

52:46

from a spot called Battle Creek and

52:48

there's the profits. Has a lot about

52:50

how the government's going to sue Hunters

52:52

Down for. I believe. I basically grew

52:55

up believing that my family was going

52:57

to be murdered in front of me.

52:59

Someday we're gonna have to run for

53:01

the hell's. So Battle Creek, Michigan

53:03

home of the cereal brands. Kellogg

53:05

is one of the founders of As and

53:07

says I'm oh. There's

53:10

a lot we could go and see

53:12

what's as Kellogg Alone which includes Eugenics

53:14

female genital mutilation that there is a

53:16

device he invented to shoot about four

53:19

gallons of hot water. Up his

53:21

way into animals running know, he

53:23

had, like, a small retreat where

53:25

he thought he could cure people

53:27

of their common maladies. So it's

53:29

absenteeism and sanitarium go way

53:31

back. Did you see the movie

53:33

about him? Sir Anthony Hopkins played him

53:35

when. I haven't seen the movie, but that

53:38

would probably be a very good cast. There's

53:40

a her. Think the

53:42

guy pretty well so as and

53:44

says I'm is one of the ones

53:46

that went almost second ml lamb roots

53:49

Most people would not see something

53:51

wrong there basis as their house message

53:53

so people look at it and I

53:55

like oh that's a good thing

53:57

right? So I was raised in a

54:00

lot of very ah the dietary programs

54:02

restrictions course sell alcohol stuff know coffee

54:04

protein is quite often replaced with

54:06

soy and tofu which causes a lot

54:09

of long term health issue. Towards

54:11

obsession was the stool. He was

54:13

obsessed with having a big fluffy

54:15

stool. Yeah, so they're very big

54:17

on the in isn't vegetarianism so for

54:19

myself I'm about fourth generation as incest

54:22

at least on my mom's side. My

54:24

dad was brought in, she went through

54:26

an Evangelist stick series they both met

54:29

at like and as into school. Evinces

54:31

I'm is contained environment. They have their

54:33

own hospitals, they've got their own educational

54:36

system like you can exist within. Admin

54:38

says I'm essentially and never really go

54:40

outside of it's. Like almost or

54:43

something. practically. However, Adventists are very

54:45

perform at as to look at them

54:47

you wouldn't know they do exist out

54:49

and about in the world, but they

54:52

are very much in their minds the

54:54

protagonists of the planet's as most of

54:56

these organizations think they are the main

54:58

characters though to them to go out

55:01

there. and essentially you can't work on

55:03

Saturdays. so you get all of these

55:05

prescription for how to get out of

55:07

tests, how to talk to employers Things

55:09

like that, there's a lot that's close

55:12

off for you. Employment wise because you

55:14

can't work on Saturday or do a whole

55:16

bunch of stuff so as insists on the

55:18

keeps to itself as much as possible. But

55:20

it's big money. This is one of like

55:22

the big earners in terms of religion. Worthy

55:25

primarily concentrate rather big

55:27

pockets. Loma Linda is one

55:29

Walla Walla, Washington's another, of course

55:32

Michigan say so up. and things

55:34

like Time Magazine for the Blue

55:36

Zones. Ah have interests are known

55:39

as one of the organizations that

55:41

lives. For. Very long time due

55:43

to their health messages what they claim

55:45

but if you actually look at a

55:47

blue zone it's lots of money, very

55:49

warm climates, access to medical care, and

55:52

so there's little that a confirmation bias

55:54

in what they sell you with are

55:56

blue Zone As someone. Like you pushing on

55:58

blues on People are obsessed with. The essence of

56:00

I could say about that having been

56:03

raised in it and when I was

56:05

a student I was put through their

56:07

educational system assessing university of the nurses

56:09

on the west at the local hospitals,

56:11

the beginning fluids and was immediately because

56:14

we would all be low on vitamins

56:16

nutrition. We are all malnourished. Ah,

56:19

how did they deal with the reality that they

56:21

have an express diet that's going to result in

56:23

peak health? but they are regularly have to

56:25

send their kids to the hospital to get infusions

56:28

of. I was like, how would they write that

56:30

all for Dismiss that fact. It's something that

56:32

they don't necessarily acknowledge, does and says

56:34

i'm and as a pastor's today and

56:36

tell you that masking is the big

56:38

thing. It's all about presentation and you

56:41

don't really want to tell other people

56:43

you're having health issue because endured not

56:45

right with God. So usually what happens

56:47

is is not going to be discussed.

56:49

You're not going to be open about

56:51

it. Students would be with each other

56:53

by it's by no a higher level.

56:55

You're not going to talk about it

56:58

so that's kind of how it'll continue.

57:00

On his it as a ton of food things. And

57:02

then one or the other kind of

57:05

restrictions. I don't have you seen

57:07

the shiny happy people thing that happened

57:09

with the Duggar family. Their whole thing

57:11

was on the learning channel. They pumped

57:14

out a bunch of kids and they

57:16

got their stuff from a guy I

57:18

believe the same as Builds authored and

57:21

Gothard is one of the darlings of

57:23

the Adventist Church. His thing was the

57:25

umbrella model of Christian marriage, so consensus

57:28

is not exactly as bang. Your body

57:30

is owned by your father and then

57:32

see her husband's They do an umbrella

57:35

godfather. Wife, kids and then if

57:37

it's the opposite, it's Satan Wife

57:39

has to him. Kids. Intimacy. So

57:41

then dating I presume is completely

57:44

off the table. Leave. Room for

57:46

Jesus Thai As saying by a lot

57:48

of my friends myself included, you get

57:50

married very young. Does your dad pick

57:52

your husband's so album says and it's

57:54

not arranged marriage is conversion therapy. That's

57:56

the one that Aventis or Big on

57:58

day one of the. Impossibly

58:01

the first religious organization

58:03

to find conversion therapy.

58:05

Or. To make gave hold stray. Yeah. But

58:07

conversion therapy goes also under

58:09

the umbrella of you're starting

58:11

to. They convert and

58:13

bringing you back. So part

58:15

of how I got out

58:17

of the whole situation i

58:19

married another pastors kid so

58:21

essentially have some of the

58:23

timeline for myself is that

58:25

my mom passed away under

58:27

mysterious circumstances. As. The pastor's wife

58:30

own more. That started a d

58:32

conversion process for me. However, I

58:34

have married back into it so

58:36

their family put in a lot

58:38

of effort to try to get

58:40

me back and so the person

58:42

I married there was some non

58:44

consensual sex happening social media was.

58:46

Basically. The Shields at the time

58:49

I was telling people if you don't

58:51

see me post and seventy two hours,

58:53

call somebody. Twenty twenty was a rough

58:55

year. Basically at the time he was

58:58

saying things like i'm the only thing

59:00

standing between you and disappearing into conversion

59:02

therapy. Your husband. Yeah. A lot

59:04

of people wouldn't look at Athens is

59:06

them from the outside as being that and

59:09

ten however from the back end of at

59:11

my side of the family and the family

59:13

a married and see their the high up

59:15

at least in the Canadian side of and

59:18

says i'm I took it very seriously when

59:20

I was started getting that messaging from

59:22

handy cause with what happened with my mom

59:24

and the way that's my dad's employers. Reacted

59:27

to that. It was creepy and very

59:29

much like are oh no, I'm in

59:31

an organization that has a lot of

59:34

money and doesn't treat women well. What

59:37

was your journey? mentally at any point

59:40

did you buy? I'm fully when did

59:42

it start cracking? I. Was fully bought

59:44

into this because I was born into

59:46

I saw as dedicated as a baby

59:48

baptized and Suez when you grow up

59:50

in other organizations. As a woman you're

59:53

very much the caregiver and I eldest

59:55

daughter see take care of the family.

59:57

So I thought ensue some cycling the

59:59

program stuff because I want to see

1:00:01

a counsellor and then I search realize

1:00:03

I can't be an effective counselor and

1:00:05

and as incest that started really clashing.

1:00:07

I'm supposed to be converting. People fly

1:00:09

at all of what I'm learning about

1:00:11

Ethics says otherwise. So when I started

1:00:14

getting out of that I had have

1:00:16

friends who works in the oil fields

1:00:18

I'm out in Alberta. he would be

1:00:20

gone for a few months at a

1:00:22

time and I was like hey can

1:00:24

I just like crash your place for

1:00:26

a little bit. At one point I

1:00:28

just didn't go back home because. Certain

1:00:31

types of people in a relationship as

1:00:33

they start losing control, they get. Weird.

1:00:36

A. Started doing things that are just

1:00:38

trying to get back so I started

1:00:41

posting all the time on tic toc

1:00:43

and instead basically being like if I

1:00:45

do disappear if something happens to me

1:00:47

along those lines because when my mom

1:00:49

passed no one ask questions. And was

1:00:52

your. Father. Largely emotionless

1:00:54

about her passing allows.

1:00:56

The weird thing about that is I was

1:00:58

at an avid says university and it was

1:01:00

my third year. I got a call from

1:01:02

him very early in the morning where he

1:01:05

was sobbing about how she had passed and

1:01:07

house she had and his words suffocated in

1:01:09

her sleep. Keeping in mind she's up forty

1:01:11

three or so the not suffocating yourself. on

1:01:13

your mouse knows your name is like

1:01:15

are crazy drug user. Will that's what

1:01:17

he was claiming is that her pain medication

1:01:19

because she was in a lot of chronic

1:01:21

pain however your central nervous system and I

1:01:24

talked to few medical experts since they'll tell

1:01:26

you that will still role you over. So

1:01:28

when I it showed up on fully expecting

1:01:30

him to be a math but for the

1:01:32

week I was there I flew home the

1:01:34

same day. When I walked in the door

1:01:36

all of her journals have been collected and

1:01:38

he was hauling them out in a garbage

1:01:40

bag. Basically telling

1:01:43

me that she had written that he'd done

1:01:45

this, sat in the other and he didn't

1:01:47

want the police funny. It has evidence, that's

1:01:49

weird, but at that point I still trust

1:01:51

in him. And then for the week I

1:01:54

was there before the funeral, it was like

1:01:56

deadpan. Nothing had happened, normal and then as

1:01:58

her family started showing up. Their wings. That's

1:02:00

when the tears started. You can cry and

1:02:02

you. I've seen him do it for his

1:02:05

sermons. This is the live on

1:02:07

planet earth. Now I know it's

1:02:09

so scary. Scary out and I will

1:02:11

disclaimer: this was a few years back. I've

1:02:14

been through therapy, all that stuff and old

1:02:16

some fairy have ears you were born in

1:02:18

should I was. No one is like you

1:02:20

blame a lottery, You come out of somebody

1:02:23

like what householders you know land in and

1:02:25

it could be insane. Yeah, I've thought

1:02:27

about that before was like why

1:02:29

did I get the Doomsday parents

1:02:31

The Conspiracy Theory parents lucky me

1:02:33

by it's I eventually got my

1:02:36

hands on her autopsy reports and

1:02:38

what the autopsy said obviously did

1:02:40

not align with what he said

1:02:42

that across like immediately as I

1:02:44

say accidental suffocation. you say that

1:02:46

cynthia thing for a grown woman

1:02:48

who is mobile even on have

1:02:50

a pain meds. The autopsy says.

1:02:53

Something. Completely different. Still be questioned

1:02:55

anything. It's not her siblings, not all

1:02:57

the employers and south at her funeral

1:03:00

her friends were not there. it was

1:03:02

all these guys from the Us, the

1:03:04

a conference, a look around and it's

1:03:07

just like men. Such hand means

1:03:09

tell. With. Felt very dystopian and

1:03:11

then within a couple of months

1:03:13

my father had moved on to

1:03:15

dating somebody else had married down

1:03:18

there. much younger side of the

1:03:20

younger brother called them us to

1:03:22

point Now he basically got a

1:03:24

more functioning family for the pastor's

1:03:27

commercial that they sell. Then he

1:03:29

was promoted to working in the

1:03:31

capital of Canada after that situation.

1:03:33

So as I'm trying to get

1:03:36

out of my situation word I'm

1:03:38

experiencing not as safe relationship. I've

1:03:40

got him. Plus our dads. Plus.

1:03:43

The whole conference behind them and so

1:03:45

it's like oh dear, this could turn

1:03:47

out really terribly for me. has to

1:03:50

be going through social media ends being

1:03:52

like hey I exists anybody out there

1:03:54

and started talking about it. Wow and

1:03:57

so you save with your friends. Drilling

1:03:59

or. All right, you got to

1:04:01

have some alone time on brainwashed

1:04:04

up receiving the signals. Yeah, After

1:04:06

my mom passed, I started to very

1:04:08

gradually move away from the church and

1:04:10

has started to become a trigger point

1:04:12

for me. And during the time that

1:04:14

I was married, I basically stopped attending

1:04:16

and was really pulling away. And then

1:04:19

we're in the same city as his

1:04:21

parents. so we had a lot of

1:04:23

things, including his father attempted to make

1:04:25

us to marriage counseling with him he's

1:04:27

a passer. He's not qualified to do

1:04:29

that. It's also his dad's. Is.

1:04:32

Were very controlling environments and we actually

1:04:34

had somebody from the youth group comments

1:04:36

for home and then report back to

1:04:39

the youth pastor about what was going

1:04:41

on in the house. According to them,

1:04:43

I was an alcoholic because I had

1:04:45

a bottle of wine that I used

1:04:48

for cooking. Pasta sauce says lot that

1:04:50

can be laid out to probably keep.

1:04:52

You for hours haji get a divorce.

1:04:54

That's is actually still being processed. I've

1:04:57

been separated for a while by it's

1:04:59

because of covered. Everything is backed up

1:05:01

but they let you for the first

1:05:04

so that it was tough. But fortunately

1:05:06

because a social media they wanted to

1:05:08

distance themselves from me as fast as

1:05:10

far. As

1:05:12

he came the Fall in Woman

1:05:14

according to them I met one

1:05:16

of his coworkers and stay claims

1:05:18

that he told them I have

1:05:20

seen with coated they claim a

1:05:23

lot of Spiritual Warfare software essentially.

1:05:25

I'm aware smuggling. Your dressing up

1:05:27

like one to same plane and

1:05:29

you certainly an advantage your way

1:05:32

of empowering com away. It's my

1:05:34

like which I absolutely played in sewage

1:05:36

I think for low but I wrote

1:05:38

that like good Christian girl. so pagan

1:05:40

pipeline. Reduction. Plan It Definitely

1:05:43

played into that sealed because Avon's isn't

1:05:45

is all about image. They want to

1:05:47

look as professional as possible. They wanna

1:05:49

look as put together Com to ten

1:05:51

Smart like. It's all about selling you

1:05:53

the lifestyle so Adams isn't Didn't go

1:05:56

the route of like child marriage or

1:05:58

anything like that. that would. That

1:06:00

you are. They're trying to sell you

1:06:02

almost in the same way. And Ammo

1:06:04

Lamb would sell you essential oils. Oh

1:06:06

man. What I guess I would hope for

1:06:09

you. But. The gift you

1:06:11

have now. Is. That is

1:06:13

you can. Talk. To

1:06:15

people who have gone through what you

1:06:17

have gone through and you can come

1:06:19

for people in the of Spidey senses

1:06:21

now and you are gonna be intuitive

1:06:23

and helpful. Funniest. Say that because I

1:06:25

ended up building a whole life and

1:06:27

platform around that concepts were essentially at

1:06:29

mean it. He as the conception that

1:06:32

also became like a big part of

1:06:34

the social media site as a whole

1:06:36

bunch of other people are deconstructing from

1:06:38

the south at the same time Inside

1:06:40

that organization they'll tell you that you

1:06:42

need their community. the world's out to

1:06:44

get you. If you go out there

1:06:46

your whole life is gonna fall apart

1:06:48

and it will feel like that. For

1:06:50

a beds it's going to feel awful.

1:06:53

You're going to feel. Disoriented. all.

1:06:55

Alone in the world. As scary as feeling

1:06:57

you can have it. Is it's very scary?

1:06:59

Why tell people is essentially if you're in

1:07:02

that feeling of deconstructing you're questioning South East

1:07:04

has to get past that time period that

1:07:06

they're counting on. You're going to feel so

1:07:09

awful that you come back just for the

1:07:11

comfort of what you know. You have to

1:07:13

get past that point to there's the whole

1:07:15

world of people waiting for you will interact

1:07:18

with the that are going to love what

1:07:20

you do that are gonna wanna be part

1:07:22

of your life. You gotta get past the

1:07:24

drop of exit. If

1:07:27

someone that's listening can relate to this and

1:07:29

wants to find you how to, they do

1:07:31

that. They. Can sign into Rosie Core

1:07:34

It's just about anywhere with Rosie like

1:07:36

the R O Se I and then.

1:07:39

Seattle said quartz crystal. Of

1:07:41

regular. Thank you for. Waters

1:07:44

story. Honestly, This Say thank

1:07:46

you for the opportunity to talk

1:07:48

about it because whenever I can

1:07:50

I just try to put out

1:07:52

there hey there is this organization

1:07:54

that you might be vulnerable to

1:07:56

because they intentionally target people, are

1:07:58

struggling with house. The call

1:08:00

or mental and also lack of

1:08:02

community so this is something to

1:08:04

be on guard for. And be

1:08:06

careful of snow Fame. Or you know,

1:08:09

hours those insanely informative. I wish you a

1:08:11

ton of luck. I hope a lot of

1:08:13

know find you and can hear we're saying

1:08:15

thank you very much as I sit here.

1:08:19

Is so lucky. Zola. I do

1:08:22

think many people walk around thing

1:08:24

I can never be me through

1:08:26

I would never been. it's all

1:08:28

circumstance. Semillon paid way more like their

1:08:30

parents who prefer Southwards. You know you

1:08:32

just brought home do a house and

1:08:34

then they tell you what rio the

1:08:36

use and it is into some crazy

1:08:38

intervention happens to break that and most

1:08:40

is how it does that will. This

1:08:42

is heavy heavy. You advise that we

1:08:44

didn't Yeah me too. We hit it

1:08:47

all. Really hit it off as I

1:08:49

love him. So what, You're not in

1:08:51

a cold. I'm

1:08:53

in one sense tricky

1:08:55

notices. Know because there's multiple definitions

1:08:57

of in. one of it is

1:08:59

side controlling. That was all four

1:09:02

of these and yours is not,

1:09:04

so it doesn't qualify. It's not

1:09:06

high control. And there's also no whatever

1:09:08

air. By the way, I guess there's

1:09:10

no here is mega leader of the

1:09:12

top either. Became Money elevates. There's no

1:09:14

status to be game Boy whose loyalty.

1:09:19

To. The singer Tunis Aluminum

1:09:21

so. You

1:09:24

know, the. For

1:09:27

those are here I

1:09:29

go Go go we're

1:09:31

gonna have some random

1:09:33

was his new move

1:09:36

doing just. Fine

1:09:40

arises. Disney.