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ConnectiveMedia.com. Connective with a K. Parla

0:28

Charlene and listeners welcome to Behind the

0:30

Numbers an E Marketer video podcast made

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possible by Connective Media by United Airlines.

0:35

I'm Marcus. Join me for today's conversation

0:37

we have with us. Three people, let's

0:40

meet them. We start with our analysts

0:42

covering demographics based in New York, it's

0:44

Powler Flores, Marcus. Hello everyone.

0:46

Hello there, we also have our VP

0:48

of content living up there in Maine.

0:50

Paul Werner. Great to be here, thanks

0:52

for having me. We also have with

0:54

us the VP of inclusive insights at

0:56

Nielsen, based in Maryland, is Charlene Polite

0:58

Corley. Hey everybody, how's it going? Hello,

1:00

very good, very good. Welcome to the

1:02

show. So when external guests are on,

1:04

we quickly get to know them with a

1:07

speed intro. 60 seconds on the clock, let's

1:09

do it. Three questions. Charlene, you are based

1:11

in Maryland, as you mentioned, but where are

1:13

you from? I am from a one light

1:15

town down down down south called

1:17

Hollister Florida, called Hollister Florida.

1:19

Oh cool, very nice. How long have you

1:22

there? How long have you been in

1:24

Maryland? Oh my gosh, I've been

1:26

in Maryland now since 2013. A

1:28

couple different states, but love it

1:30

here. Shout out PT County. Very

1:32

nice, very nice. Powell, are you

1:34

from there? No, I lived in Silver

1:37

Spring for like six years. That was

1:39

great. Yeah, it was great. I miss

1:41

it. Very nice. Paul will

1:43

probably live there at some point.

1:45

Paul's like a thousand years old.

1:48

A million. I am. You can

1:50

just tell by looking at me.

1:52

But yeah, I've been around a

1:54

bit. What do you do in

1:56

a sentence, Charlene? In a sentence,

1:58

I use Nielsen. center historically

2:00

excluded audiences and highlight the growth opportunities

2:03

for players across the media industry based

2:05

on really not just reaching us but

2:07

connecting through content through campaign and messaging

2:10

and really tapping into identity how that

2:12

can drive loyalty and engagement and all

2:14

the things we need to continue to

2:17

make businesses grow. Very good. Our final

2:19

question here because we're talking some sports

2:21

today favorite sport play growing up. And

2:24

as you were saying before we have

2:26

recorded the recording, I'm assuming that you've

2:28

played sports and or decent. I did

2:30

participate in sports. I don't know if

2:33

you would call it being very good.

2:35

My answer to the question is baseball.

2:37

My family is going to think that

2:40

is hilarious because fun fact when I

2:42

was a T-ball center fielder actually took

2:44

a book into the outfield. Oh. And

2:47

just stood with my glove and read

2:49

a book while I was playing so.

2:51

Did no one, was no one like,

2:54

where are you going with that? They

2:56

just let, they just let the game

2:58

continue? No, they did not. There was

3:01

an intervention. There was definitely intervention, but

3:03

like a big baseball family, my older

3:05

brother went on scholarship, you know, it

3:08

just, it was, yeah. It's a great,

3:10

it's a great idea though. Leader and

3:12

scorekeeper, however, I will hype you up

3:14

for days. Also, Charlene, it seems like

3:17

you were combining academics and sports and

3:19

analytics, right from the get-go, right? Right.

3:21

Those who cannot do, I think there's

3:24

something in there about. Read. Those who

3:26

cannot do research, that's one of my

3:28

life's been given. That's our way of

3:31

life here, marketer. But super competitive, love

3:33

to talk the facts and the stats

3:35

and again, how it impacts culture and

3:38

just kind of brings so many different

3:40

kinds of people together. But yeah, love

3:42

some baseball. Very nice. How about you?

3:45

I also read a lot of books

3:47

as a child. It's my favorite thing

3:49

to do. But I did do kickboxing

3:52

for a really long time. My dad

3:54

is a natural athlete and so he's

3:56

like, you got to do one sport,

3:58

at least one. and it has to

4:01

be consistent. And so yeah, I still

4:03

think about how I upper credit kids

4:05

so badly one time and I still

4:08

feel bad about it like decades later

4:10

and Joe, if you're sorry, I mean,

4:12

if you're out there, I'm so sorry.

4:14

So it's so bad. Oh, Joe. I

4:17

know he's probably like finally an apology.

4:19

Yeah, he's been watching for years. Paul,

4:21

how about you? Well, being a

4:23

southerner from. the real South as

4:25

in South America of course I

4:28

grew up playing football aka soccer

4:30

very nice he reminds me

4:32

about it that they won Argentina

4:34

won the World Cup daily yeah

4:37

I'm glad you mentioned that Marcus

4:39

because I have time to get

4:41

it in a while You have

4:43

an opportunity for redemption coming soon.

4:45

I know, I know, that is

4:47

very optimistic of you, but we

4:49

probably will probably lose. Today's fact,

4:51

let's get on with that real

4:54

quick. Major sports championships by North

4:56

American City. So I thought this

4:58

was quite fitting. And then, so

5:00

it's a great article and it's

5:02

very interesting, but I realized that

5:04

they're they're including, it's the visual

5:06

capitalist article and they're

5:09

including a lot of different

5:11

sports which folks might not

5:13

include as the major

5:15

sports. If you think

5:17

major sports in America,

5:19

you're normally going with

5:21

the the MLB, the

5:23

NFL, NBA, they're including

5:26

the AAFC, the AAFL,

5:28

we've got the ABA is

5:30

counted in here, the Grey

5:32

Cup winners Canada, I've never

5:34

heard of it, I'm sorry,

5:37

but that's the thing. So

5:39

they're including a lot here.

5:41

New York has the most though. 65,

5:43

about 40% of those are from the

5:46

Yankees. The city has won at

5:48

least one championship in every

5:50

major league. They're kind

5:52

of cheating. They have two teams

5:54

in every major sport for the

5:56

men. So that's kind of cheap.

5:59

But Toronto. second shout out Canada

6:01

13 from hockey most a ton

6:03

from the CFL which no offense

6:05

Canada I don't know if that

6:07

counts and then Boston is third

6:09

with two fewer championships than Toronto

6:12

but this is for these of all

6:14

for men sports for the women's sports

6:16

I mean if you count in college

6:19

you probably go in where's where do

6:21

you con play Hartford yeah I think

6:23

you got to go Yukon with

6:25

that one right if we're

6:27

talking women's basketball it has

6:29

to be you can't somewhere

6:31

in Tennessee maybe after that?

6:34

Maybe South Carolina and maybe

6:36

in Tennessee as well. Yeah,

6:38

absolutely. So yeah, which is

6:40

quite efficient because we're talking

6:42

NCAA. Today, the men's and

6:44

women's basketball tournaments, how they

6:46

did, we'll talk about some

6:48

viewership numbers, we'll talk about

6:50

how women's sports has exploded,

6:52

and if that's been sustainable,

6:54

because of the Caitlin Clark

6:57

effect last year, and we'll

6:59

talk about some of the

7:01

demographics that are driving all

7:03

that engagement. Today's episode all

7:05

about the explosion of sports

7:08

for brand engagement. Let's

7:10

get into it. We've got Nielsen

7:12

here, which is amazing, because you

7:14

guys track very closely the viewership,

7:17

the numbers of the March Madness

7:19

basketball tournaments, and it just finished.

7:22

Congratulations to, so was it Florida?

7:24

Who beat South Carolina? Yukon to

7:27

get from South Carolina for the

7:29

women's tournament. Paige Beckers, okay, very

7:31

good. Yes. And then Florida on

7:33

the men's side. On the men

7:35

side, go gators. They are back on

7:37

top for the men. And so another

7:40

great showing for the conclusion of the

7:42

men's tournament. Very good. Let's talk some

7:44

numbers. Let's go, let's go men's first,

7:46

because after the women's, I want to

7:48

get into some other stuff. So let's

7:50

go men's first. How was viewership this

7:52

year? Starting with the men, a great

7:54

showing. Again, go gators coming out on

7:56

top after four number one seeds took

7:59

to the tournament. and like you said,

8:01

the Florida and Houston game really

8:03

showed out with, it was up

8:05

22% compared to last year with

8:07

over 18 million fans tuning in.

8:09

Wow, that is a market increase,

8:11

about 15 million last year, close

8:14

to 80, so you said about

8:16

18 this year for the men,

8:18

that is quite a significant jump,

8:20

and quite surprising because they're not

8:23

big, sorry Houston or Florida

8:25

if you are, but they're not.

8:27

you know, the typical kind of basketball

8:29

schools, you know, Duke or Yukon.

8:31

They're not the kind of big

8:34

program, so I'm surprised that those

8:36

numbers were so high. Yeah, well, remember again,

8:38

the fandom around these schools and

8:40

colleges in general, Florida's actually taken

8:42

that tournament a few times. It's

8:44

been a while. But, you know,

8:46

Gainville, it has a little bit

8:48

of a title town reputation. So

8:50

I'm sure there are, although the

8:52

Gator fans are happy to be

8:54

back on top. But I think, you know,

8:56

part of what makes the entire March

8:59

Madness culture so empowering. It's not

9:01

just about the viewership, a lot

9:03

of times it's about the storytelling

9:05

that drives the that final. And I

9:07

think both of these teams had such

9:10

really fascinating stories around their programs that

9:12

also drove a lot of engagement to

9:14

show up and see who was going

9:17

to come out on top. Okay. Yeah.

9:19

Probably help too that that incredible comeback

9:21

by Houston against Duke. Yes. And then

9:23

by Florida against Houston in the fight.

9:26

Like I think that sets up even

9:28

more interest. Not probably on a regional

9:30

fandom level because those fans are going

9:32

to tune in no matter what. But

9:35

just in terms of the. attention and

9:37

people wanting to, you know, see what

9:39

happens next. I, yeah, I was at a bar

9:41

on Saturday. I was at a dance party, a

9:43

Taylor Swift dance party. I was not, I

9:45

am not a siftie, but my friends are and

9:47

so we were there, we were dancing and

9:49

they had the game. Oh, okay. There was, they

9:52

had the game on the big screen and

9:54

there was like, you know, a bunch of like

9:56

guys just sitting there watching it and all

9:58

of the girls dancing, dancing, stopped. to watch

10:00

Houston come back and the whole

10:02

crowd went wild. And yeah, one

10:04

of my friends was like, yeah,

10:06

I'm not, I didn't go to

10:08

Houston, but my, like, my school

10:11

is the art rival of Duke.

10:13

So by default, I'm like rooting

10:15

for Houston. Yeah, it was exciting.

10:17

It was great. Okay. I guess

10:19

the men's game as well. It

10:21

does see, I said, do kind

10:23

of said, was it North Carolina,

10:25

North Carolina, Kansas. I think of

10:27

those as the big schools and

10:29

the ones that win all the

10:31

time. And it's probably because I'm

10:33

Mike Shefsky and some major, but

10:35

major coaches, but they don't. I

10:37

remember looking back, so men's college

10:39

basketball in the last 20 years,

10:42

it's quite a range of teams

10:44

that have won, you come five

10:46

times, this is, I maybe did

10:48

this a year or two ago,

10:50

so I might have missed the

10:52

most recent championships, but you come

10:54

five, North Carolina three, Villanova two,

10:56

Kansas, Kansas, It's dominated by a

10:58

few teams. In the last 20

11:00

years, Yukon 7, South Carolina 3,

11:02

Tennessee 2, the last 30 years.

11:04

It's Yukon 11, Tennessee 5, South

11:06

Carolina 3. So they win, those

11:08

three schools win more than half

11:10

the time. So women is dominated

11:12

by a few programs. What was

11:15

a viewership like on the women's

11:17

side? Yeah, so again, talk about

11:19

the storytelling. I think there's been

11:21

so much momentum in the last

11:23

several years around the women's game

11:25

as they continue to just expand

11:27

access to be a fan, right?

11:29

We've only been in an official

11:31

March Madness era for the women's

11:33

game for the last few years.

11:35

really is that last year with

11:37

the Clayton Clark effect was just

11:39

so impressive. But this year still

11:41

is breaking records. So the final,

11:43

or on the road to the

11:46

final, there was a lot of

11:48

second and third most ever across

11:50

the tournament. So ESPN said four

11:52

of the top 10 elite games

11:54

to ever air were placed this

11:56

year. And then you have stories

11:58

from Juju Page, Flage, Malaysia, Malaysia,

12:00

and. and A.C. So many stars

12:02

and their stories all across the

12:04

tournament to watch and I think

12:06

that just helped fuel consistent fanship

12:08

showing up. And so they had

12:10

the second most watch elite eight

12:12

ever averaging about 2.9 million viewers

12:14

and then showing up to the

12:17

final with over 8 million viewers

12:19

and I think at peak at

12:21

9.8 million. So again, I think

12:23

the. The overall theme here for me

12:25

is that there is still so

12:27

much growth available for women's collegiate

12:30

ball and professional. There's a lot

12:32

more access to the games and

12:34

we're seeing that the fan base

12:37

is consistently showing up to that.

12:39

But it also shows how many

12:41

fans of Caitlin Clark showed up

12:44

last year as well. Yes, but

12:46

it sounds like that number has

12:48

gone down, but it hasn't gone

12:50

down past the year before. It's

12:52

a staircase growth, but with a few

12:55

years or one year of a normally

12:57

jump. Yeah, so if we call last year

12:59

an outlier, so to speak, and

13:01

so there was a lot of

13:03

comparison between this year's tournament and

13:05

like 2023, the games were up,

13:07

I think, about 34% the networks were

13:09

saying. So still showing, you know, growth

13:12

in the right direction or movement in

13:14

the right direction, if you will. And

13:16

I think as continue, again, a lot

13:18

of it is about access, not just

13:20

to the games themselves, but the storytelling

13:23

around the players, the programs, there has

13:25

been a lot of, to your point,

13:27

dominance around certain schools, taking the tournament,

13:29

and I do think that those are

13:32

elements that we haven't fully kind of

13:34

examined, where you've had Ellis, you show

13:36

up recently, you've had a lot of

13:38

cinderella, comeback stories, and you know. programs

13:40

for the first time. I think it was

13:43

UCLAs first time to the dance. So there's

13:45

a lot more folks who are breaking through

13:47

and the strength of programs across more than

13:49

just a few schools. Yeah. And there are

13:51

just a lot of numbers that suggest things

13:53

are going in the right direction, right? This

13:56

is just one number, one tournaments. There are

13:58

a few other ones I found. expecting

14:00

global revenue for women's sports

14:02

to reach 2.3 billion dollars

14:05

this year. That's up from

14:07

about 700 million three years

14:10

ago. Collective in RBC found

14:12

TV viewership for women's sports

14:14

expected to grow 32% for

14:17

the WMBA. 24% for the

14:19

professional soccer for women by

14:21

2027. And that's the other

14:24

thing, the Caitlin Clark effect

14:26

and Angel Reese is well

14:28

coming through and then joining

14:31

the the the W. M. B.

14:33

A. that gave W&BA a bump as

14:35

well, a huge bump. I think

14:38

over 200% the 2020-24 W&BA regular

14:40

season grew 200% versus the year

14:42

before that. So it's now close

14:44

to a million people in terms

14:47

of average audience per game. It

14:49

was closer to 300,000 the year

14:51

before. So you've seen that carry

14:53

through. Yeah, and another add-on to

14:56

the W's growth is we've also

14:58

just come off the first season

15:00

of unrivaled. And so seeing there.

15:02

first time out as a three

15:04

on three league. really show up

15:06

with consistent amount of viewership. I

15:08

think they averaged over 300 viewers

15:11

across their games, record compensation for

15:13

the athletes, and broke even, which

15:15

is like unheard of for a

15:17

new league in their initial season.

15:19

So I think another part of

15:21

this for me is I look

15:23

at these viewership numbers that are

15:25

technically down from last year, which you

15:27

know, that's the math. But I think

15:29

when it's still pointing to is like,

15:32

again, the access. There's actually a lot

15:34

of competing places. to see and engage

15:36

with women's basketball in particular. And so

15:38

following like, hey, if I'm an Angel

15:40

Reese fan and she's not in this

15:42

tournament, I'm tapped into what's coming ahead

15:44

in the W&B A season or her

15:47

coming off a winning unrivaled season. There's

15:49

just so much more ways to engage

15:51

and tap in. And then the other

15:53

way to look at it too, again, as we

15:55

try to kind of make sense of what happened

15:58

this year, but we saw the same matchup. with

16:00

Yukon in South Carolina a

16:02

couple of years ago. The audience

16:04

numbers are up 75 % compared

16:06

to that same match up

16:08

in 2022. So again, the momentum

16:10

is going in the right

16:12

direction. Yeah. And the ad dollars

16:14

too. This number really impressive.

16:17

ESPN seeing ad sales for women's

16:19

college basketball tournament nearly 200 %

16:21

higher than last year. It's

16:23

just a remarkable figure. We're talking

16:25

about basketball, but there is

16:27

mentioning there are a ton of

16:29

other sports as well that

16:32

are seeing a lot of growth.

16:34

Jeremy Goldman, who writes for

16:36

our briefing was noting the college

16:38

college volleyball women's college volleyball

16:40

women's gymnastics NCAA women's college lacrosse

16:42

as well and making some

16:45

great points as to why these

16:47

are great places to put

16:49

your ads not just going to

16:51

the bigger audiences of basketball and

16:53

soccer with women but saying

16:55

they're less cluttered and environments the

16:57

mainstream in sports. They're highly

17:00

engaged, passionate fans. They're lower cost

17:02

entry points. They're seasonal complement

17:04

to some of those major sports

17:06

like like basketball or soccer

17:08

for women and growth potential tied

17:10

to Olympics exposure as well,

17:12

which leads me to this next

17:14

point, which is, you know,

17:16

there are so many other sports

17:18

that people are watching on

17:20

the women's side. LG had some

17:23

numbers. Olympics is the most watched

17:25

sport for female athletes, about 32 %

17:27

according to their numbers. Then you've

17:29

got pro basketball, college basketball in

17:31

a close kind of second place

17:33

tennis as well. But then you've

17:35

got hockey, auto racing, golf, baseball,

17:37

softball. So there are just a

17:39

ton of opportunities here. Paola, how

17:42

are viewers of women's sports different

17:44

than viewers of men's sports and

17:46

also the same? I

17:48

think Jeremy summarized it pretty well, right? That

17:50

it's like an incredibly incredibly passionate group that's

17:52

already like invested. I'm

17:54

like, can I say misogyny on the

17:56

podcast? I feel like that

17:58

plays a huge role in it. right? Like, I

18:00

think it's people who are willing to, like, um,

18:03

to decide their prejudices about how women

18:05

are. Change their views. Yeah. Yeah. About how

18:07

women are expected to perform or should

18:09

perform. I think the Caitlyn -Karlik effect is

18:11

so interesting because it really speaks to

18:13

this level of appreciation for talent. It just,

18:15

it's, I think it's unfortunate that it

18:18

takes, like, something so, I don't know, individual

18:20

or, like, outstanding to make people pay

18:22

attention because women like that exist all the

18:24

time, right? Like, the women's, like, uh,

18:26

the USA women's soccer team is always kicking

18:28

butt, like, constantly, consistently. Yes, for decades.

18:30

The way that the men's, that does not.

18:32

Yes. So it's Same with

18:34

English football as well. Yeah.

18:37

Um, so I do, I do think

18:39

that plays, like, a really, really role. Not

18:41

a word, Paul. I know you're going to say

18:43

something about Argentina winning. My lips are sealed.

18:45

I could just feel it. Um, it's a great

18:47

point, though. Please, Charlene. No, I was just going

18:49

to jump in there and I think you are so right around,

18:51

um, part for me, part

18:53

of the Caitlyn Clark effect is

18:55

also the divine timing about

18:57

the era that she showed up

18:59

in because, you know, there

19:01

have certainly been those, um, generational

19:03

players before, but between social

19:05

media, but between the change in access

19:07

and games, you know, the rivalry element

19:09

and just the amount of conversation around

19:11

it. Um, really the, the zeitgeist was

19:13

just there. And I think we

19:16

had a different era of a couple

19:18

of players had that same coverage.

19:20

We may have also had a breakthrough

19:22

moment. So it was a combination

19:24

of her incredible talent, with an incredible

19:26

rivalry narrative, with an incredible media

19:28

coverage across platforms. And so all of

19:30

that kind of, you know, sparking

19:32

the fire that we're continued to see.

19:35

And so I completely agree with

19:37

your number around the global opportunity for

19:39

investment. What's

19:41

interesting that I'm also watching too is

19:43

how college continues to be a launch

19:45

pad into professional so people can continue

19:47

to support, um, female athletes and their

19:49

sport. Um, in addition to on rival,

19:52

there's also, um, a new women's pro

19:54

soccer league that has launched in the

19:56

U S new pro softball league that

19:58

has launched. So there's now places for

20:00

these athletes to land. So you can actually,

20:02

thanks to the NIL era, they can get

20:05

compensation in their college era and then go

20:07

into a professional career, the audience can grow

20:09

along with them. So we're excited to see

20:11

how that continues to grow, but as I

20:14

like to say, you know, if you're only

20:16

just, if you're just now paying attention to

20:18

the WMA, the price of the bag has

20:20

gone up. And you might need a different

20:22

price point. And unfortunately, there's

20:25

a lot of options for brands to

20:27

choose to choose from. And what we've

20:29

actually, you know, to Powell's point, the

20:31

payoff for not just fan loyalty, but

20:33

brand loyalty. When you show up and

20:35

support those leagues and stars and teams

20:37

that fans care about, our data actually

20:40

shows that they're more likely to be

20:42

an advocate for your brand, to make

20:44

a purchase, to engage. We've seen that

20:46

heavily with women's basketball and you know,

20:48

it's interesting that, you know, there's just

20:50

so many opportunities now and I think

20:52

sports will continue to be one of

20:54

the safest places for brands to show

20:56

up, but also to really demonstrate their

20:58

values because they just bring everybody together

21:00

so many different cost sections of life.

21:02

Yeah. I was reading a Nielsen article

21:05

actually from this from last summer and

21:07

it was saying exactly what you're saying

21:09

that WMBA fans much more likely to

21:12

engage with a brand online. talk about

21:14

the brand with friends and family and

21:16

actually make purchases as well.

21:19

I think audiences are really

21:21

responding to empowerment and and

21:23

very very strong figures in

21:25

women's sports whether it's Serena

21:27

Williams or Simone Biles or

21:30

now you have Alona Mayor

21:32

the women's US women for

21:34

every player just totally stirring

21:36

things up in Europe and in general

21:38

I think there's a sense of

21:40

these very powerful women are resonating

21:43

with audiences, even when they're

21:45

showing vulnerability, which is something

21:47

that is a very slippery

21:49

slope in the male dominated

21:51

sports culture that we all

21:53

live in. But I think

21:55

that goes along with the team

21:57

loyalty, the brand loyalty, it's just...

22:00

inspiration from these amazing

22:02

stories and how women have

22:04

to balance a lot more

22:06

things to be successful in

22:08

really any field but definitely

22:11

in sports. Yeah, so true. I did

22:13

not know that I was a rugby fan

22:15

until I came across along the soft feed.

22:17

And I was like, now I'm a rugby

22:19

person. I don't know. Don't ask me

22:21

any rules, but I know about her.

22:24

And I'm sure a lot of, you

22:26

know, a lot of people who may

22:28

not be huge basketball fans were swept

22:30

up by the Caitlin Clark Angel Reese

22:32

effect and are continuing to do that.

22:34

I think it also raises like a

22:36

lot of really. interesting like tangential questions

22:38

right like when we talk about mental

22:41

health too and someone violence taking that

22:43

break a couple years ago like and

22:45

was it Naomi Osaka yeah as well

22:47

and I was in conversations with people

22:50

who follow sports regularly and I had

22:52

older sports fans being like well you're

22:54

an athlete they're paying you to just

22:56

stick it out this is your job

22:59

blah blah blah and like younger people

23:01

in the conversation being like no like

23:03

they are human beings who are like

23:05

you know, we should respect that they have

23:07

limits and like they cannot perform at their

23:10

best if they're not taking care of themselves.

23:12

Absolutely. And it was been so interesting, particularly

23:14

around Simone Biles and the conversation between her

23:16

and Dominic Dawes and the difference in their

23:19

experience where they were, you know, I remember

23:21

the Kerry drug incident where everybody celebrated the

23:23

one foot landing that she did to get

23:25

the gold and whatever. It's like, that's

23:28

probably. the best, the way that we

23:30

should have celebrated. So again, through sport, especially

23:32

when we think about black culture and black

23:34

communities, specifically to see these black women saying,

23:37

you know what, I need to rest and

23:39

you take care of myself first and then

23:41

I can come and perform at my best.

23:43

And if there's ever a case study in

23:46

doing that, I mean, someone coming back and

23:48

dominating in last year's Olympics is proof that

23:50

that is okay. And I love how, you

23:52

know, one of the magic of sport to

23:55

sport to me is the ability to really

23:57

have some of those conversations. and healthy behaviors

23:59

that just speaking of again the the

24:02

cultural connection and impact our latest

24:04

Nielsen diverse intelligence series report around

24:06

black audiences showed you know the

24:08

not just for black sports super

24:10

fans to show up for the

24:12

game, but we over index in

24:14

the sports commentary. So I want

24:16

to I want to tune into

24:18

the game, but I also want

24:20

to tune into the conversation around

24:22

the game. And so that makes

24:24

how we talk about the athletes,

24:26

how we position, you know, women

24:28

as caddy or whatever, and not

24:30

just competitive, those narratives really matter

24:32

and folks are tuning in and

24:34

paying attention. And so our data

24:36

actually supports that the commentary around

24:38

the game can be just as

24:40

important. as the live event itself.

24:42

Mm-hmm. I think Uga reports that

24:44

like... Younger age groups are reporting

24:46

that top sports is not in

24:48

their top interest at a lesser

24:50

rate than like older age groups

24:52

But they're much more engaged with

24:54

it in social media and like

24:56

getting it through other digital channels

24:58

So to just echo Charlene's point

25:00

about there are so many different

25:02

avenues about there are so many

25:04

different avenues through which through which

25:06

not just to reach these sports

25:08

fans But like people who are

25:10

just scrolling through their feeds little

25:12

chains chance of property issues. So

25:14

I think yes, that is just

25:16

echoing the level of like opportunity

25:18

there. Yeah, yeah, that's an excellent

25:20

point. I want to end just

25:22

by mentioning this, because I thought

25:24

these numbers are really important. It

25:26

kind of speaks to that, a

25:28

stereotype of, you know, men watch.

25:30

men play sports and women watch

25:32

women play sports. Nielsen, these numbers

25:34

are from Nielsen, global fans of

25:36

women sports. 43% of women sports

25:38

fans are male. And then this

25:40

other number from a Forbes article

25:42

from Brad Adgate, overall the performances

25:44

of female Olympics and Paralympics athletes

25:46

in 2024 inspired over 40% of

25:48

boys. And so, you know, it

25:50

just, I just think these.

25:52

really good figures to

25:54

the the crossover of men being

25:56

being inspired by women

25:58

athletes female female athletes

26:00

vice vice well as

26:02

well being inspired by

26:04

inspired and yeah watching. really

26:06

changing and it seems really

26:08

things are really

26:10

changing and it

26:13

seems like that

26:15

momentum momentum kept up

26:17

kept up we've seen what we've seen Paul. You

26:19

mentioned Clark and of other female athletes

26:21

as well. of That's what we've got

26:24

time for for this episode. Thank you

26:26

so, so much to my guests for

26:28

talking with me today. thank Brilliant, episode.

26:30

Thank you so much to Pala. Thank you

26:32

so much, Marcus. Thank you, Paul. to Paul.

26:34

Thank you. And thank thank you to Charlene.

26:37

Thank you so much for having me. me.

26:39

It's an absolute pleasure. Thank you to

26:41

the to crew, Victoria, Victoria, John Lance, and Danny, Stuart,

26:43

who runs the social media, thanks to everyone

26:45

for listening to Behind the Numbers

26:47

and to everyone for made possible by the numbers. An

26:49

e-marketed video podcast. May Sarah will be back

26:52

on Wednesday Media, by show talking about the

26:54

French be store that's trying to change

26:56

Retail Show show talking about the French Department Store.