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items. This is your moment. Hey, it's me Paige DeSorbo, and

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I'm so excited to share my

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new shoe collection at DSW, filled

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with my favorite styles and trends

3:01

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future is

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bulletproof. The

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aftermath is

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secondary. Welcome

3:34

to Better Offline.

3:37

I'm your host

3:39

Ed Zetron. Today

3:43

we're joined in beautiful Los Angeles Nevada, and

3:45

I'm joined by Andy Richter though the comedian

3:47

Andy Thank you so much for joining me.

3:50

Thank you for being here I on the

3:52

way to the studio I got to see

3:54

a man smoking crack It didn't Which I

3:57

haven't I haven't seen that in a long

3:59

time. That's kind of that's nostalgia. Sure

4:01

it is. People are still doing

4:03

crack. People are still doing crack

4:05

in this town. Good to know.

4:07

That's what they're saying. So Andy,

4:10

you've been... So 90s. Oh 90s,

4:12

I know. We're bringing the 90s

4:14

back. I was listening to a

4:16

system of a down... Sorry, I've

4:18

been down this rabbit hole of

4:20

listening to this band called O2

4:23

that does covers of bands in

4:25

the style of bands song. Wow.

4:27

It was truly amazing. Like they

4:29

nailed both the Scatman rap and

4:31

the system of downtown. Wow. And

4:34

the comments on these things are

4:36

amazing because it's like 50% people

4:38

like me saying this is really

4:40

great. 50% people are being like

4:42

no it's not. Yeah, anything like

4:44

the fucking Scatman. The Scatman fans

4:47

are all out there. Anyway, you've

4:49

been fairly online for a while.

4:51

I've noticed you on social media.

4:53

When did you first get online?

4:55

Well first online like on the

4:58

internet, like on the early 90s.

5:00

when I started working on Late

5:02

Night with Conan O'Brien, that was,

5:04

that was when sort of, you

5:06

know, there was AOL, and in

5:08

fact, yeah, we were, I was

5:11

the first time online, it was

5:13

AOL, you know, I've got one

5:15

of those disks in the mail,

5:17

you know, out of a magazine

5:19

or whatever. And it was dial-up

5:22

and I had these clunky old

5:24

Mac, uh, power books. And at

5:26

work there was the internet and

5:28

it, because at first the internet

5:30

I was like, wait, is it

5:32

just like catalogs? You know, like

5:35

Pepsi would have a website and

5:37

it'd be like, well I kind

5:39

of know what Pepsi is. And

5:41

there was that initial period when

5:43

I got online when I was

5:46

like 10, just like looking up

5:48

companies. Yeah, exactly. But everything you

5:50

went to because it was dialogue

5:52

was very much a commitment. Yes.

5:54

Absolutely. Yeah, yeah. And to go

5:56

from one thing to the other

5:59

took so long. Oh, yeah. But

6:01

then email was pretty fun. Facebook

6:03

was fun for five seconds and

6:05

then I immediately got off of

6:07

there. Right. And of course then,

6:09

you know, like at the Conan

6:12

show, it was, you know, everybody

6:14

was experiencing this new thing altogether.

6:16

Right. And as usual, with every

6:18

new technology, the... One of the

6:20

first primary uses is pornography. Of

6:23

course. So it was, you know,

6:25

plenty of... And because it's a

6:27

comedy show, it wasn't just like

6:29

people fucking. It was like... people

6:31

filling up plastic pants with diarrhea.

6:33

Okay. You know, stuff like that.

6:36

And that's what we'd be swapping

6:38

around the office. Yeah. Wait, so

6:40

you were on dial-up doing this?

6:42

Yes. Well, we were at work

6:44

doing that. So I don't know

6:47

what our internet connection was at

6:49

work. So it was like the

6:51

late night's T1 connection. Just something

6:53

like to bring up the clown

6:55

pornography. It was better than home,

6:57

but like I don't think I

7:00

had to. log on right with

7:02

the work computer you know so

7:04

you were just looking up various

7:06

kinds of pornos and would people

7:08

send everybody what they would just

7:11

remember they're being around I don't

7:13

and I don't remember exactly how

7:15

we would find them and but

7:17

I just there'd be like files

7:19

of oh 300 you know weird

7:21

sex photos, you know, sex photo.

7:24

Of course it would have been

7:26

jepex back then. Yes, I don't

7:28

know. I don't know, I don't

7:30

know, you know. Well, just were

7:32

people crowding around one screen or

7:34

was it just an like an

7:37

F2? Oh, there was some crowding

7:39

around one screen. There was one

7:41

guy in the office. who would, his,

7:43

his desk faced the door, so he,

7:45

you'd see the back of his computer

7:48

screen, and he would, he would, I

7:50

fell for it like three times, like,

7:52

hey come here, I want to show

7:54

you something, and you come around, and

7:56

it's just the most horrific, that most,

7:59

like, not at all sexual. sex thing

8:01

and so after a while he'd say

8:03

like hey come here and I just

8:05

fuck you no I'm not I'm not

8:08

falling for that again so I am

8:10

cursed with two brothers and Matthew and

8:12

William are they older or both older

8:14

my sister and older as well Matthew

8:16

is a grotesque fellow and has shown

8:19

me terrible things so I've become kind

8:21

of desensitized to the whole thing and

8:23

I remember the first one of the

8:25

first days working at a PR firm

8:28

I got too. All the guys are

8:30

like, hey Ed, come check this, you

8:32

should come check, type this into you,

8:34

and it was meat spin. Do not

8:36

look this up. Okay. But I remember

8:39

them being like check out meat spin,

8:41

and it is a man's willy going

8:43

in a circle. Sure. I sat there

8:45

in complete silence for several minutes. My

8:48

fingers just steepled. And could see out

8:50

the corner of my eye, the deep

8:52

discomfort. Right, right. But you were soaking

8:54

it. And after that I never got

8:56

sent anything gross again. They wouldn't send

8:59

me anything because they knew that just

9:01

also I think they kind of knew

9:03

that I might retaliate one day. Yeah.

9:05

And I really this entire episode doesn't

9:08

have to be about gross stuff but

9:10

I come from a darker place of

9:12

the internet like I was on like

9:14

early forums and like bulletin boards and

9:16

news net. But not the worst part

9:19

of news. Buying and selling foreign babies.

9:21

No I was like 12. Okay. And

9:23

so the people were doing that around

9:25

me. And so. That was fun, but

9:28

I also got to see so many

9:30

horrible things. Yeah. And like there's pain

9:32

for, and you listen to remember pain

9:34

for, do not look up any of

9:36

the things we're talking about. It is

9:39

funny though, because that used to be

9:41

a lot of the early internet, was

9:43

just like, hey, I found something gross,

9:45

look at this shit. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

9:48

And that's gone now, because there's now

9:50

entire redids for it. Yes, and I

9:52

don't, yeah, and also it's just like...

9:54

The novelty sort of yeah, you know,

9:56

it's like too quick. Yeah, that was

9:59

like oh that was because it's like

10:01

oh do you can you get like

10:03

the worst kind of You know the

10:05

worst kind of pornography. Oh Yeah, you

10:08

can. And then, you know, it's like,

10:10

okay, that. Now you can get it

10:12

immediately. Yeah, it's not my, and because

10:14

if it's not your thing, which is

10:16

like, not my, you know, like, my

10:19

pornography, I like it, like I said,

10:21

like, if there was a search on

10:23

a porn website for people being nice

10:25

to each other, like that would be

10:28

my, I'm very. boring. For me it's

10:30

a man and a woman they walk

10:32

into room they shake hands and they

10:34

sit and complete silence for an hour.

10:36

Rockhart every time. And then they start

10:39

fucking. Yeah but the video ends fine.

10:41

I'm not interested. The implications are enough

10:43

for me. Right. But I think and

10:45

I will say there's nothing wrong with

10:48

having you. particular proclivities. Yes, sex positive

10:50

show and all that. But nevertheless, it

10:52

is funny watching the internet move away

10:54

from pornography and towards being insane now.

10:56

Yes, yes, exactly. We just had Gita

10:59

Jackson and Nathan Grayson from After Gaming

11:01

website. And it's just talking about how

11:03

games used to be like, when I

11:05

start on the internet, it was like,

11:08

oh, you could look at like forums,

11:10

video games, and be tall, talk about

11:12

which characters were all cool. Now it's

11:14

like, oh, you don't like cloud strife,

11:16

cloud strife, drive, and Final Fantasy Seven,

11:19

and Final Fantasy Seven. Do you get

11:21

involved in any internet communities? I know

11:23

you're quite active in Instagram. Yeah, I,

11:25

well, Twitter was my main one, you

11:28

know, which Twitter, Twitter was a new,

11:30

like the, a real step of being

11:32

online, for me. And I got on

11:34

Twitter, you know, this was, social media

11:36

was a new thing, you know, a

11:39

couple years old. And like I say,

11:41

I got on Facebook for a minute,

11:43

and then I just. was like, oh,

11:45

there's too many people going. You know,

11:48

it was, it just felt like having

11:50

an open door in your house that

11:52

just people could come and go, hey,

11:54

you want to talk? And like, no,

11:56

I do not want to talk to

11:59

you. Yeah, the sandwich, what are you

12:01

talking about? Actually, how Twitter is now,

12:03

anyway, continue. But so, I actually, it

12:05

was, it was right before I went

12:08

back to work for Conan on the.

12:10

tonight show I believe, I think the

12:12

time, because it was like 2010. Yeah.

12:14

Twitter would have been, that would, a

12:16

few years into Twitter. I can't remember.

12:19

That would make sense though, because that

12:21

was a few years into Twitter when

12:23

it had become more than just digital

12:25

perverse. Yes, yes. And I had friends,

12:28

like my friend Steve Agee, comedian Steve

12:30

Agee actor, he told me, oh, Twitter's

12:32

really fun. Like it's like, it's like,

12:34

it's like. jokes. And I was like,

12:36

oh, okay, because, you know, and I

12:39

had already quit Facebook. I was playing

12:41

in the Major League Baseball All-Star game

12:43

was down in Anaheim. And I played,

12:45

and I did this a couple times,

12:48

I played in the Celebrities and Old

12:50

Time Baseball Guys charity Softball event. It's

12:52

like a couple days before the actual

12:54

All-Star game. So I was going down

12:56

there. And the production coordinator for Conan

12:59

called me and said, hey, we got

13:01

an offer, they know you're playing there.

13:03

If you would get on Twitter and

13:05

tweet about the game, you might get

13:08

a new iPhone. And I was like,

13:10

oh, all right, sure, no problem. So

13:12

I in the car on the drive

13:14

to Anaheim, I signed up for Twitter

13:16

and now was. And then it was

13:19

like, I very quickly did see like,

13:21

and as I've referred to it. for

13:23

me in those early days, it was

13:25

like the joke, Jim. Yeah. It was

13:28

like where we all went to be

13:30

funny, you know, and just, yeah, just

13:32

think up silly stuff. And it wasn't,

13:34

and I never, and it's, I think

13:36

the reason I liked it so much

13:39

is that I wasn't, it was just

13:41

for pure enjoyment. Yeah. You know, I

13:43

mean, I think, you know, I'm saying

13:45

funny, smart ass shit all the time.

13:48

Right. And so, you know, you know,

13:50

something funny will occur to occur to

13:52

me. I don't have an act. I,

13:54

you know, I mean, and there's no

13:56

pressure to get one. And I'm not

13:59

going to, you know, and it's like

14:01

a place. something funny on the street

14:03

I'm not gonna like take it to

14:05

the TV show and say here's this

14:08

funny you know Chinatown sign I saw

14:10

you know so I just would do

14:12

it for fun and it was and

14:14

it was fun and it was also

14:16

just fun to give away happiness and

14:19

funniness and I started to meet like

14:21

comedians who are like, why are you

14:23

on there? Like, why would you waste

14:25

your material? I'm like, so funny. Oh

14:28

my God, waste? What are you talking

14:30

about? It's, you know, there was very

14:32

little sort of professional urge or, you

14:34

know, motive behind anything I did on

14:36

Twitter. I mean, I would promo things

14:39

when I had things to promo, but

14:41

it was mostly just fun. And I

14:43

met people, you know, people who are

14:45

now my IRL friends, you know, like,

14:48

you know, And it was certainly in

14:50

those early days, it was what was

14:52

great about it just in comedy terms.

14:54

And it probably holds in poetry terms

14:56

and in, you know, technical writing terms.

14:59

There's no gatekeeper. Which is why there

15:01

were so many women that, you know,

15:03

funny comedy women that came up and

15:05

got their start with Twitter. Right. Because

15:08

they, you know, there were gatekeepers that

15:10

kept women from... Being funny in front

15:12

of people and I think the and

15:14

Twitter is the other problem of women

15:16

female comedians being like Corrected for their

15:19

jokes. Yes, you still see that on

15:21

blue sky And it was kind of

15:23

a more democratic force. I think for

15:25

any kind of joke telling the thing

15:28

that the only thing that really bothered

15:30

me with it was this the you

15:32

ever see faith star? Yes. Yes. So

15:34

there was I mean I don't even

15:36

does it still exist? It doesn't but

15:39

the the soul lives on yeah or

15:41

caliber and it's What it was, explain

15:43

for the listeners, so there was this

15:45

thing called FabStar and around it this

15:48

growing clique of deeply unfunny people that

15:50

we all repost each other's shit, and

15:52

it created this kind of noxious version

15:54

of what you're talking about, where what

15:56

you're talking about... I'm talking about, it's

15:59

like, as a funny person, I've found

16:01

a thing that made me laugh at

16:03

post there. These people, you see them

16:05

on Blue Sky now, and you can

16:08

tell they're on Blue Sky because they

16:10

have a list in their profile, Auto

16:12

Block. If I'll see someone with a

16:14

list of their posts and their Blue

16:16

Sky, I'll see someone with a list

16:19

of their posts and their Blue Sky,

16:21

I'll see someone with a list of

16:23

their posts and their Blue Sky, I'll

16:25

see someone with a list of their

16:28

posts with your posts with no replies.

16:30

And very actually heartening to hear that

16:32

there is also the honest comedy side

16:34

on Twitter. Yeah, yeah. Do you think

16:36

it's going off to Blue Sky at

16:39

all? Or is it different? Yes. I

16:41

mean, and that's why I mostly do

16:43

Blue Sky now is because it feels

16:45

the most like. Yeah. Like the joke

16:48

gym, you know, whereas, and I'll look

16:50

sometimes at threads, which has a, I

16:52

mean, and I'm not very technical, so

16:54

I don't understand, like, you know, like

16:56

I likened it once, I actually was

16:59

on. a conference call once with just

17:01

like kind of different people that like

17:03

from somebody that I'd done political organizing

17:05

with was also doing sort of like

17:08

social media like how do we make

17:10

social media work for us and there

17:12

was this big call about you know

17:14

different formats and what's next now that

17:16

Twitter sucks And I just said like

17:19

I'm I feel like I'm with auto

17:21

executives and I just want to drive

17:23

the thing like I don't I don't

17:25

care about how it works or the

17:28

different sort of programming behind I just

17:30

wanted I want to I want a

17:32

particular experience I want to point it

17:34

in a direction and go in that

17:36

direction and so I don't know what

17:39

threads is but I just know that

17:41

like the way that it shows me

17:43

shit is out of order and you

17:45

know and just irritating and lots of

17:48

let me tell you a four-part story

17:50

about this old man that you know

17:52

gave me advice and changed my life

17:54

yeah and it's just sort of okay

17:56

that's nice and all but you know

17:59

it was the jokes where's the weirdos

18:01

I've And where's the chaos? I described

18:03

it as it reminds me specifically of

18:05

a mall in Dallas. called the

18:07

Galleria Mall in Dallas, like

18:09

a luxury mall, Galleria. Galleria,

18:12

pardon me, I'm glad you're

18:14

correct. I just, I don't,

18:16

and I'm not being a

18:18

wise ass, I just, you

18:20

know. Oh no, no, no,

18:22

it's good, we go. I

18:24

would want to know if

18:26

I was. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

18:28

yeah. A thread's just weird.

18:30

I went on there earlier

18:32

and... There was just a post where

18:34

a guy said, yeah, I had a conversation

18:36

with a guy, and it was just a

18:38

completely made up conversation with a person about

18:40

using Mac products. And there were like

18:43

11 replies to people like, yeah, and

18:45

it's like, did you all just

18:47

get in the same car crash?

18:49

Yeah, yeah. And it's bizarre. And

18:51

I think what it is is,

18:53

tech companies don't seem to understand

18:55

how human beings interact, and the

18:57

more that they wield that power

18:59

to that conference call you're on,

19:01

the moment transsystematize this stuff. the

19:03

joy exits yeah yeah yeah so

19:05

have you have you felt like

19:07

social media change how you

19:09

do comedy though mmm like

19:12

the feedback loop even

19:14

well I mean I

19:16

shouldn't even have paused

19:18

because yes for sure a

19:21

big reason a big thing

19:23

a big effect was learning

19:25

what's not funny anymore

19:28

You know, and you might call it

19:30

wokeness or you know, how do

19:32

you mean? I mean like learning

19:35

things The one that I've always

19:37

that I is just the

19:39

most one of the most

19:41

forefront ones is the M

19:43

word for little people Right,

19:45

and that used to be

19:47

like, you know, comedy MSG. Oh,

19:50

yeah, if there was a gap

19:52

just throw in the M, you

19:54

know, you know, like or tossing

19:56

in, you know, somebody, you know,

19:58

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Empathy is our best

29:50

policy. So

29:54

it is a fun story for you,

29:56

so twice on the show I've talked

29:58

about, just another instruction for any... Anti-trans

30:00

people listening, just another update on my

30:03

instructions. You should be in the garage,

30:05

the door should be closed, the car

30:07

may not be started yet. Rev that

30:09

engine, baby. Rev that engine, now if

30:11

you're not getting sleepy, get the tube,

30:14

go to the exhaust, and then put

30:16

that bad boy in the window. That's

30:18

the sleepy juice, you need more of

30:20

that. Now, I got several emails from

30:22

people saying, you can't suggest anti-trans people

30:24

kill themselves, and the answer is, watch

30:27

me, watch me. I think the whole

30:29

fucking, who's the Joe Rogan of the

30:31

Left thing doesn't make sense, and I

30:33

think if you break it down into

30:35

what it is, it's everything you're talking

30:38

about, which is there is no like

30:40

insane propaganda unit across the left and

30:42

also the left. I fucking hate the

30:44

term as well, because it's like, the

30:46

left, depending on who you talk to,

30:48

it refers to like CBSists. Yeah, yeah.

30:51

It's complete meal of different things. But

30:53

ultimately, it's because people actually have... beliefs

30:55

that they stick to and those can

30:57

change within distinct groups versus the right

30:59

way. Yeah and they also too don't

31:02

walk in lockstep on every single issue.

31:04

You know people have like you know

31:06

you can think that socialized medicine is

31:08

a wonderful thing but you also are

31:10

you know because you're Catholic or for

31:12

whatever reason you know you're you know

31:15

anti-abortion and that you know so there's

31:17

like there's too many varying issues within

31:19

the liberal whatever you want to call

31:21

it the not right world that it's

31:23

never you don't get locks which is

31:26

why don't you know which is which

31:28

is inconvenient and also the right the

31:30

right wing of really unlocks it with

31:32

what they hate yes and that's the

31:34

thing is you can hate them like

31:36

I just feel like there is a

31:39

certain degree of meekness with it and

31:41

also when Pods save America is the

31:43

one of the largest that's also never

31:45

a great start also Another really simple

31:47

thing is, and even if it's been

31:50

into this as well, and others have

31:52

as well, where it's like, there's also

31:54

not multi-billionaires backing every single leftist, which

31:56

would be really funny. That would be

31:58

awesome. It would be really funny. If

32:00

there was just like billions of dollars

32:03

going into guys just doing like 18

32:05

hour seasons of podcasts about why Medicare

32:07

for all is necessary. Yeah, yeah. Sadly,

32:09

we don't have that kind of unity

32:11

in any way. And it sucks. And

32:14

it sucks as well because I think

32:16

that there is this, getting back to

32:18

comedy as well, there's this assumption with

32:20

comedy as well, it's like it has

32:22

to be rude to be funny. Yeah.

32:25

It can be tragic. It can be

32:27

tragic. And one of my favorite things,

32:29

one of my favorite things that made

32:31

me laugh, and I'm not laughing at

32:33

the event, you're going to know where

32:35

I'm going with this in a second,

32:38

a guy did a wonderful stand-up thing,

32:40

not funny, describing like post-911, how he

32:42

was a Muslim, he was horribly mistreated,

32:44

and he was, I'm going to look

32:46

this up and get a like, talking

32:49

about how people hated him, hated other

32:51

people of color, anyone who was treated

32:53

horribly, was treated horribly, Did 9-11 work?

32:55

And it's just like fucking amazing. Just

32:57

like perfectly done. Because someone could scold

32:59

him if he was not describing his

33:02

actual experience. Right. And it's just, I

33:04

feel like the future of comedy is

33:06

going to be so fucking weird because

33:08

both the subject matter and the speed

33:10

at which things work and happen is

33:13

so different how it used to be

33:15

used to. Actually, it's a question. How

33:17

did you prepare for the show? Just

33:19

a very basic like a... For the

33:21

show, how much work did you have

33:23

to do? Oh, like day to day?

33:26

Day to day. Well, I was, earlier

33:28

on, you know, like back in the

33:30

late night days, I was a writer

33:32

on the show and was expected to

33:34

do, for the first few years, as

33:37

much as any other writer, like, you

33:39

know, we had a board. That had

33:41

five you know five columns which were

33:43

the days and then act one at

33:45

two at three at four at five

33:47

at six and you had to fill

33:50

them and you know some of them

33:52

were filled with guests or a guest

33:54

band and stuff But you had to

33:56

fill those spots with bits that you

33:58

can't up so they'd put a card

34:01

in there that would be like you

34:03

know whatever you know zoo detective right

34:05

and it would be up there with

34:07

your initials you know down on the

34:09

corner so I was expected to do

34:11

that and then there were also like

34:14

just different bits that kind of were

34:16

handed to me that that I that

34:18

we they'd come up with a new

34:20

one they'd be like here you write

34:22

this because you're good at writing this

34:25

particular kind of thing right kind of

34:27

thing and then there was also too

34:29

I started I was the first one

34:31

to do remotes because Robert Smigel, who

34:33

was running the show, didn't want to

34:35

send Conan out on remotes because that

34:38

was very much a David Letterman thing.

34:40

Like the host going out and being

34:42

the host out in the world, whereas

34:44

I was kind of going out and

34:46

being this naph, you know, this kind

34:49

of boy, man boy out in the

34:51

world. And so I was doing remotes

34:53

and I would have to edit those.

34:55

You know, I'd come back from the

34:57

Arkansas State Fair and... you know, get

34:59

off the, you know, go to bed

35:02

and then go into the work the

35:04

next day and start cutting that piece

35:06

and working sometimes to, you know, three,

35:08

four o'clock in the morning, getting that

35:10

ready. Was this physical media or was

35:13

this? It was video. Okay. Yeah, it

35:15

was video. It was all on. big

35:17

three-quarter-inch tape. That was kind of what

35:19

yeah. So that's because that wasn't it

35:21

was not digital back in those days

35:24

in the 90s. Because that's the thing

35:26

the speed of iteration there and the

35:28

speed of things happening like it sounds

35:30

like several days. Yes. Yes. What's fascinated

35:32

me have you ever seen Josh Johnson?

35:34

Incredible stand-up comedians. So the name's from

35:37

I'm maybe a lot of jays in

35:39

comedy go. He is this he's on

35:41

the Daily show he's fantastic African American

35:43

American American guys. One of the funniest

35:45

guys has this amazing kind of like

35:48

slow drawl to everything he does but

35:50

I think he might be the future

35:52

of comedy for one reason he's I

35:54

can write really I've never seen anyone

35:56

who writes that fast other than me

35:58

and I write newsletters and they swear

36:01

and all he will have a new

36:03

bit about something that just happened immediately

36:05

yeah he will have like a 10

36:07

minutes of fucking material yeah yeah and

36:09

it will be about Elon Musk or

36:12

something. He had this amazing thing about,

36:14

oh damn it, there was a lawsuit

36:16

with a rapper and I can't remember

36:18

the name now, with just this insane

36:20

long thing where like a lawyer nearly

36:22

got censured or like sanctioned I mean

36:25

by the judge because he would not

36:27

reveal something that he shouldn't by law.

36:29

Nevertheless, it's insane watching these comedians have

36:31

to go from this thing where they,

36:33

I don't know, I'm not a stand

36:36

up, I know a few of them,

36:38

it would go up and prepare material

36:40

and they'd workshop a bit and... in

36:42

open mic nights and they try it

36:44

and then they have a real show

36:46

where they do it. Now it's just,

36:49

you have to just fucking burn material

36:51

all the time, you have to keep

36:53

it relevant. And it almost feels like

36:55

it's going to read in a different

36:57

kind of comedian, one that can respond

37:00

just way faster. Well, yes, absolutely. And

37:02

also too, there is the real thing

37:04

with comedians and I'm... You know, it's

37:06

one of the reasons that I'm not

37:08

a stand-up comedian, and I'm glad I'm

37:10

not a stand-up comedian, is that because

37:13

you can't, well, just kind of part

37:15

of me that's like, really, can't you?

37:17

Like, if you tell a joke on

37:19

internet, what I was going to say

37:21

is, if you say, if you're, there's

37:24

a bit on Instagram, it can't go

37:26

into your hour. Why not? Because that

37:28

joke has already been heard and been

37:30

heard and been seen. Yeah, it's just

37:32

sort of a, what do they call

37:34

it, common wisdom or whatever you call

37:37

it, conventional wisdom, that's the phrase I'm

37:39

looking for. And I've always kind of

37:41

been like, really, you know, and it's

37:43

the same reason that there's come from

37:45

more of an improv background and never

37:48

had to like guard. Yeah, you know,

37:50

like a constantly grind it out. Like,

37:52

you know, guard my words, my precious,

37:54

precious words. But they, so they can't

37:56

do that. That's why you see so

37:58

much crowd work. Because crowd work is

38:01

disposable. Like, and that's why, and you

38:03

do find, like, there's some really fantastic

38:05

crowd work comedians, you know, that you

38:07

do see, and they will. Also, sort

38:09

of, I mean, the best ones, the

38:12

funniest ones, and this is the main

38:14

point that I want to make about

38:16

this whole thing. The best ones, the

38:18

funniest ones. you'll see them doing crowd

38:20

work, but you'll also see a little

38:23

bit of their act. Like, they're not

38:25

afraid to give you a little bit

38:27

of their act. Right. And the reason

38:29

is, is because they're artists. Right. And

38:31

the difference between the people that are

38:33

bitching about, like, I can't say difficult

38:36

things anymore, is because they don't know

38:38

how to do it artfully. Because they

38:40

will know how to tell you it

38:42

in a way... that resolves itself. And

38:44

it's not inherently exploitative or mocking. Yes,

38:47

yes. Because that's the thing, with all

38:49

of these comedians, are like, oh, you

38:51

can't say this anymore, then find something

38:53

fucking else. Absolutely. Isn't this your god-dam

38:55

job? The notion that you can't do

38:57

comedy is just demonstrably false. There's comedy

39:00

fucking everywhere. What are you talking about?

39:02

And life is more absurd than it's

39:04

ever been. Yeah. I mean, doing this

39:06

show, I'm not a... comedian I'm funny

39:08

in the other way it's but even

39:11

within the tech industry it's just like

39:13

right now and you're not a techie

39:15

guy you've got just like multiple multi-billion

39:17

dollar companies trillion dollar companies chasing AI

39:19

in this direction where like they all

39:21

lose money and no one really wants

39:24

it right it's inherently fucking hilarious it's

39:26

also very grim to watch but watching

39:28

these kind of like damn little weirdos

39:30

and freaks walk around and say stuff

39:32

that no human being should believe about

39:35

making calls. It is funny and there's

39:37

so much, I don't want to say

39:39

joy because there's a lot of misery

39:41

right now, but there's so much different

39:43

things that you can make material from.

39:45

I choose Josh Johnson because he's even

39:48

moved into some text stuff. Because guess

39:50

what? Everything is approachable from a human

39:52

position. If you don't know, well, and

39:54

it's just like, oh, if I can't

39:56

be racist or sexist anymore, I'm out

39:59

of things. What do you fucking do

40:01

with your day man? now that I

40:03

think about it probably that's what those

40:05

guys do. And it's also just like

40:07

it's it's people that want to recycle

40:09

old tropes, you know, like about for

40:12

fucking women, you know, or you know,

40:14

or in a cross dressers or whatever,

40:16

you know, like they just want to,

40:18

they're not coming up with anything new.

40:20

They're just regurgitating this sort of zeitgeist

40:23

that guys with backward baseball caps are

40:25

going to go woo at you know

40:27

and it's inherently also kind of regressive

40:29

because it's not really it all it

40:31

says about them is man you know

40:33

what would be funny if I said

40:36

something hurt for yeah I'm not meant

40:38

to do right right right right what

40:40

makes it funny what was weird though

40:42

is you want it you want to

40:44

have a really horrible experience try watching

40:47

family guy it is insane that that

40:49

show air just to any listeners I

40:51

don't really recommend watching it was insanely

40:53

sexist racist racist Like, they say actual

40:55

slurs on there? It's crazy what used

40:57

to be... And I have to wonder

41:00

if some of these right-wing comedians, or

41:02

even just kind of like people wouldn't

41:04

say that that was their identity, I

41:06

just like watching family guy and things

41:08

like that, I'm being like, we used

41:11

to be able to just do entire

41:13

episodes about Peter Griffin being Mexican. And

41:15

that is an actual episode of family

41:17

guy, by the way. There is an

41:19

entire plot where he's an illegal immigrant.

41:22

It's fucking what used to be considered...

41:24

funny and aired on TV. Yeah. In

41:26

fact, there is a show called Black

41:28

White. Have you heard of this? There

41:30

was a show on Fox in like

41:32

2005 where a white family got backed

41:35

up, like full black face. It's insane.

41:37

And then a black family got whited

41:39

up and it was called Black White.

52:46

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53:17

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53:32

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is our best policy. tonight,

1:06:07

brings, I finally got to realize where

1:06:09

he comes from, because he will go

1:06:11

down these rabbits holes with me. Rabbits

1:06:13

holes? Jesus Christ. Rabbit holes. Rabbit holes?

1:06:15

There we go. Rabbits holes. And he will

1:06:17

go down these rabbit holes, except he's

1:06:20

like, you should email my mother. And

1:06:22

his mother's in some sort of finance.

1:06:24

So I've now got both. his mother

1:06:26

and him sending me links about the

1:06:29

same thing. See, that's a kind of

1:06:31

lovely fun story that can be told.

1:06:33

Yeah. However, the funniest stories are things

1:06:35

like me moving the arm on my

1:06:38

tonal and smacking myself right in the

1:06:40

nutsag. Yeah, yeah. See, that's funny. You're

1:06:42

like when you shoot your pants.

1:06:44

How'd you don't know like 20

1:06:46

years ago? Anyway, less about that

1:06:48

the better. But it's something that

1:06:50

strikes me of all this that's

1:06:53

really funny. Basic broadcast fundamentals

1:06:55

seem to actually be very

1:06:57

fucking interesting. That's what people

1:07:00

really come to. We want

1:07:02

connection. We want to hear

1:07:05

the absurdity of life. As

1:07:07

the radio died, all of what

1:07:09

the radio was filled with just

1:07:11

came over here. Yeah. People talking

1:07:13

about stuff, learning about you, being

1:07:16

a listener, learning about stuff. You

1:07:18

laughing, you. Crying you know

1:07:20

you hear in creepy stuff, you

1:07:22

know gossipy stuff. That's just it

1:07:24

was just the radio and now

1:07:27

it's the radio over here and

1:07:29

it's you know and The one things

1:07:31

I think I think about it.

1:07:33

It's the same thing with streaming

1:07:36

you know TV network TV is I

1:07:38

mean, who fucking watches network television? I

1:07:40

watch some of it, you know, it's

1:07:42

it's it's astounding sometimes, you know, I

1:07:44

think Blue Bloods is on every channel

1:07:46

now. It's just there, you know, yeah,

1:07:48

it's all. Except it's really fictional because

1:07:50

the police appear to solve crimes in

1:07:53

it. There's all kinds of cop shit,

1:07:55

like network TV, she is just like

1:07:57

cop worship, you know, and they solve

1:07:59

crimes in it. grown-up paw patrol. But

1:08:01

TV, you know, moved to streaming. And

1:08:03

somebody pointed out because streamings aren't, you

1:08:06

know, these companies pour a ton of

1:08:08

money into streaming and then they go,

1:08:10

okay, now how do we get that

1:08:13

money back out? And they all go.

1:08:15

I don't know. I don't think of

1:08:17

that. More subscribers? Yeah. There's a Brazilian

1:08:19

people on here. So they don't know

1:08:22

how to get the money back out,

1:08:24

so they start talking about advertising. Right.

1:08:26

So we're just like, okay, we're just

1:08:28

back to television then, but like somebody,

1:08:31

I don't even remember who, I should

1:08:33

have remembered who, because it was an

1:08:35

excellent point. We've gone back to the

1:08:37

broadcast model, advertising, paying for it, except

1:08:40

all the worker protections have been blown

1:08:42

up. And all of the money? Yes.

1:08:44

All of the money is going to

1:08:47

like very small places. You know, yeah.

1:08:49

And it's the same with podcast. Yes.

1:08:51

Radio died. You've got podcasting and, well,

1:08:53

you know, podcasting. is surviving on advertising

1:08:56

dollars. Don't I fucking know if the

1:08:58

emails are getting, oh did anyone, by

1:09:00

the way, you one of the listeners

1:09:02

who emailed me about the AI ads

1:09:05

that run off the air? I know,

1:09:07

150 of you, email me, every extent,

1:09:09

did you hear the AI ad? I

1:09:12

know, you were not the first person

1:09:14

to tell me. I'm now gonna get

1:09:16

30 emails being like, hey did you

1:09:18

know? I like that they think that

1:09:21

you're so like royal that you don't

1:09:23

even know who's advertising on your show.

1:09:25

Didn't know I would know now because

1:09:27

I I also get a fair amount

1:09:30

of very nice email so I can't

1:09:32

complain And I was but you do

1:09:34

yes, it's very evident that you do

1:09:36

but it's I Think what it is

1:09:39

is like what you're saying with with

1:09:41

podcasting it's The advertising has to drive

1:09:43

it. I know people who start podcast

1:09:46

and like shit. I can't make this

1:09:48

work because like where do I get

1:09:50

the money from it? Read a pledges

1:09:52

and it's like what a surprise? One

1:09:55

of the bigger problems in media right

1:09:57

now, there are things that people will

1:09:59

pay for. There's four media in tech,

1:10:01

there's de facto in sports, like there's

1:10:04

some really great publications out there. And

1:10:06

Flaming Hydre as well, another great one.

1:10:08

But at scale, it doesn't exist. And

1:10:11

I don't think it exists for podcasts,

1:10:13

like you have like 30 podcasts that

1:10:15

can make money on the reader thing.

1:10:17

And it's just for, it's frustrating. And

1:10:20

also I don't know if it's the

1:10:22

one that's the most honest. I have

1:10:24

no input on those things. I have

1:10:26

that is so beyond me and I

1:10:29

don't I'm terrible with business and stuff.

1:10:31

I mean I understand making things entertaining

1:10:33

right and I and that's that's it

1:10:36

for me and that's whenever I've been

1:10:38

approached about a television show and they're

1:10:40

like we wish more young women would

1:10:42

watch I'd be like well I don't

1:10:45

know I mean I guess. I mean

1:10:47

one of my shows that was an

1:10:49

actual note and it just seemed to

1:10:51

come out the other end of just

1:10:54

like lots of scenes of the characters

1:10:56

telling each other how much they liked

1:10:58

each other which I just at a

1:11:00

certain point at a certain point I

1:11:03

was like is that is that it

1:11:05

and it just seemed like what the

1:11:07

woman do just throwing against the wall

1:11:10

and hoping it sticks woman have emotions

1:11:12

like yeah it's no when we did

1:11:14

the Because a lot of what we're

1:11:16

talking about is just kind of broadcast

1:11:19

fundamentals at some point. And so we

1:11:21

did a long 13 and a half

1:11:23

hours in five days at CES. Big

1:11:25

consumer electronic show. Oh wow. It's called

1:11:28

the consumer electronic show. Yeah I know.

1:11:30

A big thing we got. I did

1:11:32

a remote there. If you're ever in

1:11:35

you'll join us for one of the...

1:11:37

No, please. But the big thing I

1:11:39

did was we talked about loving everyone,

1:11:41

like the fact that we had friendship

1:11:44

and all this thing. We got so

1:11:46

many emails being like, it's so nice

1:11:48

to hear people saying they like each

1:11:50

other. Oh, absolutely, yeah. And you have

1:11:53

to wonder if some of these shows,

1:11:55

the big problem is they're like, how

1:11:57

do we get young woman to listen

1:11:59

to this? Have you tried fucking asking

1:12:02

a woman? You're like, no, no, no,

1:12:04

no, no, you can't do that. Yeah.

1:12:06

We have to focus group it. And

1:12:09

there'll be a bird in there, I

1:12:11

think. It's just... And then even with

1:12:13

podcasts that don't do well, and they're

1:12:15

like, why is this not doing well?

1:12:18

Does it suck? Yeah. Is it boring?

1:12:20

Because the other side of it is,

1:12:22

there are a ton of podcasts that

1:12:24

don't bother to try. They just, I

1:12:27

don't know, a chap or trap house

1:12:29

or something like, oh, there's just a

1:12:31

bunch of guys talking. But when you

1:12:34

get down to the core of it.

1:12:36

Good talking and words and such. Well

1:12:38

Andy it's been such a pleasure having

1:12:40

them. Oh thank you. Thank you. It's

1:12:43

been really a fun and interesting conversation.

1:12:45

So where can people find you? My

1:12:47

podcast The Three Questions which is available

1:12:49

at your podcast store. I will put

1:12:52

the leaves in there as well. And

1:12:54

in the same feed you will get

1:12:56

replays of my calling show which is

1:12:59

on SiriusXM Wednesdays. Wednesdays. One p.m. Pacific

1:13:01

what would that be four p.m. Eastern?

1:13:03

Usually live sometimes to tape but lately

1:13:05

it's just been live because we've been

1:13:08

able to and I've been getting I

1:13:10

get I have a guest host usually

1:13:12

somebody really funny cool and it's somebody

1:13:14

that I want to be there that's

1:13:17

that's the nice thing about my show

1:13:19

too is like there's never somebody that's

1:13:21

just like you got to talk to

1:13:23

this person yeah so it's a it's

1:13:26

one of the most fun hours of

1:13:28

my week which I have always felt

1:13:30

That if you have fun your viewer

1:13:33

or listener will have fun you have

1:13:35

if you genuinely have fun So that's

1:13:37

on on Sirius X-M channel 104, which

1:13:39

is the Conan channel and I love

1:13:42

I am I'm honestly I am an

1:13:44

early adopter of satellite radio and I

1:13:46

love satellite radio I have it in

1:13:48

my car I listen to it on

1:13:51

my phone and not just because of

1:13:53

Howard, but it's like it's great. There's

1:13:55

a very very sort of niche specific

1:13:58

music channels and that's totally up my

1:14:00

alley. Oh yeah. Yeah. Well, I've had

1:14:02

a lovely time and you're gonna get

1:14:04

this thing after this where it's a

1:14:07

recording that I recorded at the beginning

1:14:09

of the show and I like my

1:14:11

swagger and boldness. I will then promise

1:14:13

that I'm gonna re-record this, and he'll

1:14:16

say, oh, it's gonna do it this

1:14:18

time. I probably want. Nevertheless, I love

1:14:20

you all for listening. Thank you so

1:14:22

much. Thank

1:14:30

you for listening to Better Offline.

1:14:33

The editor and composer of the

1:14:35

Better Offline theme song is Matosowski.

1:14:37

You can check out more of

1:14:39

his music and audio projects at

1:14:41

matosowski.com. m-a-t-t-o-s-o-s-s-w-s-s-k-i.com. You can email me

1:14:43

at easy at betrofline.com or visit

1:14:45

Better offline.com to find more podcast

1:14:47

links and of course my newsletter.

1:14:49

I also really recommend you go

1:14:52

to chat.where's your ed.at to visit

1:14:54

the discord and go to our

1:14:56

slash Better Offline to check out

1:14:58

our read it. Thank you so

1:15:00

much for listening. Better Offline is

1:15:02

a production of Cool Zone Media.

1:15:04

For more from Cool Zone Media,

1:15:06

visit our website, Cool Zone media.com,

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