0:15

Pushkin. Mary

0:24

Clayton is a legendary backup singer

0:26

and one of the few who managed to consistently

0:29

steal the spotlight Sven

0:33

Man, You bet Up, keep

0:35

you all Hair, don't

0:38

forget what are You good?

0:41

Book Ship. Mary

0:43

grew up singing in her father's Baptist church

0:45

in New Orleans before becoming a part of

0:48

Ray Charles backing group, the Raylettes

0:50

in nineteen sixty six. From

0:52

there, her powerhouse vocals appeared

0:55

on a number of classic songs from

0:57

artists like Leonard Skynard, Neil Young,

1:00

and Carol King. Mary's

1:03

journey from a renowned backup singer to a

1:05

solo artist was documented in

1:07

the Oscar winning documentary Twenty

1:09

Feet from Stardom. In twenty thirteen, almost

1:12

exactly one year after the film was released,

1:14

Mary was involved in a near fatal car

1:16

accident in Los Angeles. That

1:19

accident resulted in her losing both

1:21

of her legs. After

1:23

years of intensive physical therapy, Mary

1:26

was back in the studio working with her longtime

1:28

producer Lou Adler on brand new

1:30

material. Her new album,

1:32

Beautiful Scars is a testament

1:35

to her enduring faith, featuring

1:37

songs by famed songwriter Diane Warren

1:40

and also cold plays Chris Martin. On

1:43

today's episode, Mary Clayton talks

1:45

to Bruce Headlam about the lasting impression

1:47

hearing Mahalia Jackson and Arita Franklin

1:50

singing Church left on her as a

1:52

little girl. She also recalls

1:54

how the Rolling Stones convinced her to get out

1:56

of bed in the middle of the night and sing on

1:58

their nineteen sixty nine classic Gimme Shelter,

2:02

and how Chris Martin was the first person

2:04

to get married back in the studio after

2:06

her tragic car accident. This

2:12

is broken record. Liner notes for the digital

2:14

age. I'm justin Richmond. Here's

2:21

Bruce Hadlam and Mary Cleaner. So

2:23

this new album, it's it's got

2:25

some great old songs. It's got a

2:27

lot of gospel. When did the idea

2:29

for the album come to you? Well,

2:32

it actually, in the beginning

2:34

didn't come to me. It came to my uncle

2:37

Lou. I was when I was in the hospital after

2:39

my accident. I would speak to

2:41

lu like every day, you know, maybe

2:44

two or three times a day. And

2:46

because I was in the hospital for almost five

2:48

months, I would speak to Lou and

2:50

he kept saying to me, said Mary,

2:53

when you get out of there, you need to be singing.

2:56

I said, yeah, sure, suresh sure. You know,

2:58

he would keep he would keep revisiting

3:00

the same thing, and of course I said,

3:03

well, yeah, well I'll think about all of this. So

3:05

when I finally got out of the hospital, he

3:07

said to me, well, what do you think you think

3:10

you want to you want to record again? I

3:12

said, well, I really don't know. I've

3:14

got to get through what I'm going through before

3:16

I even think about recording again.

3:19

He said, but you gotta be okay, don't don't

3:21

you know, don't worry. The main thing he

3:23

said, I want you to do is get well,

3:26

and want you get well, we're revisited again.

3:29

So about eight months into my recovery,

3:32

I got a call from from

3:34

my then manager and he says, you know,

3:37

I got a great call from well

3:39

from Chris Martin. Let's say Chris Martin.

3:41

What do they call it? Boy? He said, well,

3:43

they wanted to call to see how you were doing,

3:46

and how's Mary and how she fielding,

3:49

how's the recovery going and whatever. He said,

3:51

well, well, we're gonna be in Talented about two

3:53

weeks and we would love it if

3:55

married we can get married to come by the studio.

3:58

So I spoke to my manager and I said,

4:00

you know what, that would be a great time for me to get out

4:02

and just kind of hang in the studio and hang with

4:04

the guys, you know. So I went to the studio and

4:08

we just kind of out and talked

4:10

and listen to them. This is when they were recording

4:13

Kalidoscope. But now in the

4:15

meantime, Lewis called me said, I

4:17

hear that you're visiting Chris Martin. I

4:20

said, yeah, I'm here with the guys at

4:22

the Old A and M studios. So of

4:24

course, after the Kaleidoscope sessions,

4:27

he kept saying to me, Mary, you

4:29

need to be recording. So

4:32

we called my great producer

4:34

f and Terry Young, and

4:36

Terry said, you know what, I've got three great

4:38

songs. I'm coming over. I said,

4:40

okay, And he came over with Old

4:42

What a Friend? That was the first song, and

4:45

then he came back with God's Love.

4:47

Then he came back again with another

4:49

song, and we just went

4:51

over the songs and Lou heard it and

4:53

we loved it. So he says, you know what,

4:56

I'm gonna make a call and we're gonna get going to

4:58

studio. Where would you like to do this? I

5:00

said, well, I'd love to do it at I'd

5:02

like to go home and do it, which is a in

5:04

recording studio to me, which is the Hanson

5:07

studio, And we would Henson

5:09

and it was on That's

5:12

amazing. Now had you known cold

5:14

Play before you sang on that album? I

5:16

knew Chris, I didn't know the rest of the guys.

5:19

So what was it like, first time after

5:21

your accident to be in there singing? What did it feel

5:23

like? Well, it felt

5:25

like any other recording session really, or

5:27

any of it, you know, just hanging out with some friends

5:30

and they wanted my presence and my

5:32

spirit to be there. So as

5:35

I as we were kind of hanging out, Chris says,

5:37

you know what, let's go out to the piano. So

5:40

here he comes, you know, he's wheeling me out

5:42

to the piano. And

5:45

we got to the piano. He said, Mary, can you sing

5:47

this little part? So what

5:49

little part? I wasn't supposed to sing? He's,

5:51

oh, you can sing this little part. So he

5:53

says, go on the booth. Let's let's go on the booth

5:55

and put that on. But that's how that

5:58

started. Then I put one part on a

6:00

background part of then I put another background

6:02

part on. Then they called me two

6:04

other times to do

6:06

the same thing again, and we just kind

6:08

of kick didn't had a great time and did

6:11

a little recording. But I didn't have a problem going

6:13

in the studio. That was like drinking

6:15

water. What songs had you done in that

6:17

studio? Well? I did the Mary

6:20

Clayton album there, and that very

6:22

studio, which I didn't even know where I was going. I

6:24

had no idea that the studio that the session

6:27

with Coldplay was even going to be at

6:29

Hinson A and m I just you

6:31

know, they were driving and they wouldn't tell me anything.

6:33

So when I got there and they took

6:35

me into the studio, I said, oh my god,

6:38

this is my studio. You

6:40

know this is where I did this Mary? What did you do here?

6:42

I said? Did the Mary Clayton help here? And

6:44

we also did Tapestry here. The

6:47

Mary Clayton album was your second album,

6:49

right, Was Gimme Shelter your first? Yes?

6:52

So that had that incredible version of

6:54

Southern Man on it. Yes, do

6:56

you remember recording that? Of course?

6:59

I remember every session I ever did. I

7:01

want to hear about that one because it's such a great song.

7:04

The way you do it it was fabulous. Well,

7:07

thank you. Lou. Had just

7:09

at that song to my husband,

7:12

who also worked for Lou at on

7:14

the A and M lot, and we got

7:16

home on it even and he said, you know what, we need

7:19

to listen to this song. Lou asked, you

7:21

know, to check it out to see

7:23

if you'd like it and if you want

7:25

to record it. So I listened to it, and

7:28

I listened to it again. I listen to it a couple of times.

7:30

I said, you know what, if we just bump this

7:33

up a little bit, I think this would be a

7:35

great song. The message was incredible at

7:37

that time. So then

7:39

I had my great friend Billy Preston played

7:41

on that. I had I think Joe

7:44

Sample, I had a

7:46

couple of the Crusaders, I had

7:48

David T. Walker, I had all the great musicians

7:50

on it. So we got through it and did

7:52

the way we wanted to do it. Then we loved

7:54

it. Had you known Billy Preston

7:57

from Ray Charles then when you sang

7:59

with him, Well, this is another story.

8:01

Billy and I were childhood

8:03

friends. We knew each other from nine years old. Are

8:06

you kidding? No, Billy went

8:08

to a church called Victory Baptist Church,

8:10

he and his mom and family, and I

8:12

went to a church on the other side of the town called

8:15

Mariah Baptist Church. So

8:18

these two black churches

8:20

would always visit each other. They

8:22

would like hold revivals where a minister

8:24

would come in and preach for a whole

8:27

week, you know, and hold these great new

8:29

Bibles, and they have these great choirs to sing.

8:31

And I went to Billy's church and saw

8:33

this little guy nine years old playing

8:36

this Hammond organ, and

8:38

I said, well, who is that? And my

8:40

mom said, that's Billy. That's Robbie, Robbie's

8:43

Robbie's son, Billy, little little Billy.

8:46

So they got us together and we became

8:48

great friends as kids. And whatever

8:50

Billy would do, I would do. Wherever Billy

8:52

would play, I would play, so we kind

8:55

of mimicked each other. And where every record company

8:57

he would go to, I would go to. Whatever he would

8:59

do, he would always recommend me to

9:01

do vocals. So that's how our whole

9:03

situation worked until you know,

9:05

he left this earth. Did

9:07

you sing with him in church? Where? When?

9:10

Oh God, yes, yes, absolutely.

9:14

When we were kids, we always sung. Billy

9:16

would play and I would sing. And

9:18

did you sing solo in your church? Of

9:21

course I was the baby.

9:23

I was the baby girl from

9:26

God. I've had to be four,

9:28

maybe four or five years old. And

9:30

your dad was the pastor, Yes

9:32

he was now. But

9:35

New Orleans had such great secular

9:37

music as well as church

9:39

music. Yes, when you got

9:41

older, did you go out and start seeing

9:44

like New Orleans greats or did

9:46

your dad not like that? What

9:48

happened in my situation was at

9:51

my dad's church. It was every

9:53

maybe two weeks, there would be great singers

9:55

that were in town doing gospel in

9:58

New Orleans, and they would all

10:00

come to my dad's church to sing.

10:03

You know. My dad's

10:05

great friend was Mahalia Jackson, and

10:08

Mahelia loved I

10:10

just loved. They were really great. They kind

10:12

of came up together. And she would

10:14

always when she was in talent, you'd always come and I

10:17

some kind of way would find where

10:19

she was and go and sit us nestled

10:21

myself right up under her. She

10:24

would be on one side, and Lynda the Hopkins.

10:26

She would always sit with Lynda Hopkins.

10:28

Lynda Hopkins was my dad's friend also. She

10:31

was a great singer. So when

10:33

Mahelia was there. Whatever

10:36

she was saying, I would mimic her the next Sunday

10:38

and different sundays. Sam Cook

10:40

may walk in, and you know, he may be

10:43

in town, and he would come and sing your dad's

10:45

church and with the Solstres. He was the

10:47

solstress at that time. So

10:50

all the gospel, all the great gospel singers,

10:52

and Rita's dad, remember Franklin would come and

10:54

he would, you know, have a word or whatever,

10:56

and Aretha would sing, you

10:59

know, so everybody kind of knew each other,

11:02

you know. And I was like, I was about like seven

11:04

or eight years old. Did you ever sing

11:07

with Aretha or with Mahalia? Well

11:10

I didn't sing with Mahalia, but

11:12

I did sing with Aretha.

11:15

If anyone knows me more than thirty

11:17

years, my family doesn't

11:19

know me as Mary Clayton. All my family

11:21

and close close friends call me

11:23

baby sister to my sister named

11:26

me that. Before I was born. My

11:28

mom asked her what does she want for Christmas? And she said,

11:31

I want a baby sister. So Christmas Day

11:33

I came. So all my life

11:35

I've always been known to my family, close

11:38

inner circle friends as baby sister. So

11:40

Aretha would call me and say,

11:43

let me speak to Big Daddy. I said, she speak

11:45

to Big Daddy. But that's what they would call

11:47

my husband, Let me speak to Big and Curtis

11:50

would get on the phone and he'd work out whatever

11:52

they wanted to work out. And my husband would come to

11:54

me and say, the queen wants you to come

11:56

to New York. I said, the quick, come to

11:58

New York. Yeah, she's doing Avery Fisher

12:00

Hall, or she's doing whatever, and she wants you

12:02

to come. She wants to see you, and she wants you to

12:04

come and sing with her. So they

12:07

would pack me up and send me to New York or where Wheretha

12:09

was. And I was singing with her group. You

12:12

know, I was saying, whoever, whatever she wanted me

12:14

to do, I was there for her and this one

12:16

all for years. I have to ask you,

12:18

do you remember Sam cooking the Soulsters

12:20

singing? Absolutely? Do

12:22

you remember what they sang? I

12:25

think it was Jesus gave me water and it

12:27

was not from the whale. Jesus

12:31

gave me water. Jesus

12:34

gave me water. Jesus

12:37

gave me water. I want to let

12:39

us play this way. Yeah,

12:43

yeah, I remember that. Wow, What

12:46

I don't understand is how you went from your

12:48

singing in your dad's church. You were in New Orleans

12:51

and then you moved to

12:53

LA. I think it was pretty young you moved

12:55

to LA. I moved to LA when I was

12:57

eight, almost nine years old. Oh,

13:00

I see, when did you start

13:02

singing on records? Then? When did you start doing

13:04

backup and that kind of thing? Well?

13:07

I started doing back up at

13:10

fourteen. I would think. I was in junior

13:12

high school, getting ready to go to

13:14

high school. And I

13:17

went to a session with someone I

13:19

don't remember who, and they

13:21

heard me sing it said, you know what, you need to join the

13:24

group. Why don't you come and just sing with us?

13:26

So they picked me up. I went

13:29

to the session and I sung just so

13:31

happened. This particular session was

13:33

for Bobby Darren. Was that

13:35

the song who Can I count On? No?

13:38

No, no, no, no no. It wasn't that particular

13:40

song. This is where he heard me sing

13:43

and asked me, who are you? What

13:45

is your name? He said, you're singing

13:47

really loud, and I would back up

13:50

and we start again, and I

13:52

would start singing loud again, you

13:54

know, and I'd back up some more, and

13:56

then they he said, well, who is who is that voice?

13:59

So he finally brought me in the booth, brought me

14:01

behind the board and said sing

14:03

your part. So i'd sing my part. He says,

14:06

wow, you sure can't sing. And

14:09

we had another session. He said, you know

14:11

what, I would certainly like to speak to your parents

14:13

because I like to record you. You

14:15

know. You got with my mom and they

14:18

talked about what was necessary.

14:20

And what was necessary was that I take

14:22

a nap. They would pick me up from

14:24

school. I'd take a nap and they

14:27

had to correct my homework and then I could go downstairs

14:30

and cat Capitol Records and sing with Chordy

14:32

Rogers in the big band. Was that scary

14:34

for you? Well, no, when you know,

14:36

when you when you come up singing in the church,

14:39

I came up with singing with some great singers.

14:41

So I wasn't intimidated at all. I

14:43

never happened and intimidated to sing with anybody

14:46

at any time, anywhere and with

14:48

anybody. It really didn't bother me at all. And

14:51

I remember that session because

14:53

it was sort of late in the evening,

14:56

almost like about six six thirty seven

14:58

in Eden, and I kept saying, what are

15:00

they going to do my song? What are we going to do our song?

15:02

So mister Darren, he would tell me. He says, well, so

15:05

the next song is going to be our song. So

15:07

they put me in a booth. My section

15:10

was on one side and he was in front of me

15:12

on the other side in the microphone.

15:14

So I would start singing and he told

15:16

me what he wanted me to sing, and I just sung it, and

15:19

he was like, where does that

15:21

come from? It was funny to me, where

15:24

do you how We'll talk to you how to sing like

15:26

that? You know? I said, I don't know. I just

15:28

sing like that in church all the time. He

15:30

says, well, you should

15:32

be singing all the time.

15:35

So when when we did the listing back, I

15:37

was able to hear myself and say to me.

15:39

I said to myself, oh my god, that really

15:42

sounds good.

15:43

Did you want to be a singer

15:46

at that point? Was it just something you did? No,

15:49

I didn't particularly want to be

15:51

a singer. I just wanted to

15:53

sing, you know. I didn't know that

15:56

it really meant being a singer.

15:58

I just loved singing. And what

16:00

was Bobby Darren like? Was he was he a nice guy

16:02

in the studio? Was he helpful? He was

16:05

wonderful. He was just a

16:07

joy, what a joy, A very

16:09

kind, very loving man. I

16:12

mean, he was very It was a big

16:14

session. This was a huge session. And

16:16

this was with short You are just big band,

16:19

you know. So to hear that, to

16:21

hear that orchestra, and well

16:24

you heard the song, you heard the orchestration,

16:26

yes, it was it was just it

16:29

was killer. I said, Oh

16:31

my god, I get the scene with all

16:33

of this. And I would always say,

16:35

wow, that sounds like Ray Charles is bad because

16:38

he was like the only guy that we would get a chance

16:40

to really see maybe once a year, was Ray

16:42

Charles. Growing up, you'd only

16:44

see Ray Charles was the only guy you would see.

16:47

Yeah, why was that? Well,

16:50

my father was a minister. You couldn't be hanging out

16:52

and lollygagging somewhere

16:54

you had no business being at that age, at four

16:56

eighteen fifteen years old. That was not gonna

16:58

happen, not my house. Did

17:00

he make an exception for Ray Charles? Absolutely,

17:04

m Do you remember the first time you saw him,

17:07

Yes, Billy and I here here we

17:09

go again, Billy and I. Billy and

17:11

I and my sister went to see

17:14

him. And my dad allowed that, and

17:16

my and my music professor Eddie Kendricks.

17:19

So we go and see Ray and Billy

17:21

and I find our way at

17:23

the really front of the

17:25

stage. They were standing you could stand and

17:27

watch the show. And we were standing

17:29

at the front of the stage and I was talking to

17:31

Building. He was talking to me, and he looked

17:33

at me and he said, we can do this. I

17:35

said, I could sing like those girls. He

17:38

said, I can play like those guys. And

17:40

we looked at each other and said, you know, one day we

17:42

may just get a chance to sing with Ray Charles.

17:45

I said, boy, that show would be great. And

17:48

you know, about five or six years later, you

17:51

know, he heard Billy and just lost his

17:53

mind when he heard Billy loved the Billy.

17:55

Ray absolutely adored

17:58

Billy. So Billy called me

18:00

one day and said, hey, what are you doing. I said, I'm

18:02

folding towels. He says,

18:04

you need to get up here. Did you get up here?

18:06

And saying for Ray? I said, Ray, who Ray

18:09

Charles, but all something cute and

18:12

come up here to the RPM building. Well,

18:15

of course I did what he said, and I

18:17

went to the RPM building, had

18:19

my sister to take me to the RPM building

18:22

and sung for Ray and left with

18:24

a contract. He wanted to go out on tour with

18:26

him. So he spoke to my mom,

18:28

you know, my mom and dad, and they said, you know, we

18:31

have to see about that. And then we

18:34

my mother found out that Billy was going, and

18:36

his mother found out that I was, you know,

18:38

thinking about going, and the

18:41

parents talked and you know, they figured

18:43

out, you know, it's be a good gray experience for them. We have

18:45

to have somebody to look out for them. So

18:48

the lookout person for us was Curtis Amy,

18:50

who was the musical director. He's

18:52

a pretty good lookout guy. Yeah, he

18:55

was. You know, I met him.

18:57

We fell deeply and love

18:59

with each other and married

19:01

in nineteen seventy and was married

19:04

for thirty two years. So when

19:06

did you start touring with Ray Charles?

19:08

Then? What year was that in nineteen

19:10

sixty six? What was he

19:12

like as a bandleader, Ray Charles? Oh

19:15

boy, he was a taskmaster.

19:17

You had to be on your game. If

19:19

you were not on your game, you could not be on tour

19:22

with him. He was a wonderful man

19:24

and a great teacher. Everything

19:26

I learned. I knew how

19:28

to sing harmony, but I mean I really

19:30

knew how to sing harmony when when you know, when

19:33

I parted and left to Ray Charles,

19:35

he had that very close close because

19:38

he had four singers, four girls. That's

19:40

hard harmony to sing if you're not you

19:42

don't have a good ear, you know. But

19:45

he taught us. We would rehearse for us every

19:48

day because

19:50

he wanted a certain sound and you had to sing

19:52

it, and you know, you had to sing it the way

19:54

he taught you to sing it. So did

19:56

he did he do a lot of the arranging himself

19:59

or he did he have arrangements

20:01

for you know, he had arrangements

20:04

for us. He knew what he wanted his girls to sound

20:06

like, right, he knew exactly.

20:08

He already had his big arrangements. But he

20:10

know what he knew with his book, he wanted his vocals

20:13

to sound like you know.

20:15

So that's why that's why he meticulously

20:17

took time. I mean, we were rehearsed

20:20

every day. We get into a city and he'd ran

20:22

out the ballroom and we'd sit in this

20:24

big ballroom with this big

20:26

baby grand and we'd sit around

20:28

the piano and he'd work out parts with us every

20:30

day. It didn't matter if you knew it and knew the part or

20:32

not you were you.

20:35

You had to sing it again because he

20:37

had to know that you knew it. Wow.

20:40

Yeah, can you remember what were the hard

20:42

songs to sing with him? Of his

20:44

heads? For me, it was Together

20:47

Again. If you saw twenty feet from starting

20:49

I talked about that song. I

20:51

mean I could not hear the second part. I

20:54

just could not hear it. Bobby

20:56

Wolmack was in the band at that time, and

20:59

Bobby everybody had everybody

21:01

was trying to help me with these notes. He said, Baby,

21:03

I'm gonna play this part. I'm gonna play a

21:06

first note. And when you hear that note

21:08

on my guitar, you that's the part you come

21:10

in on. My husband, Curtis said, okay,

21:12

I'm gonna play this particular note on the saxophone.

21:15

Everybody was trying to help me. I could not hear the

21:17

note. So we

21:20

were in Carnegie Hall, and

21:22

do you know when when it came time to sing that

21:24

song, I got ready to sing.

21:27

The song was Together Again and

21:30

my part was twogether rocking

21:33

the Great Skies An that

21:35

was the second part. I could not hear

21:37

it and I did not sing the

21:39

correct note. And do you know that he took his finger

21:42

and banged out my part. He

21:45

took his finger and banged

21:47

out my part where I tell you one thing. No

21:49

one had to tell me about that part again. I

21:51

could sing that part in my sleep because

21:55

I wasn't gonna be made to look like a fool. Did

21:58

you sing on recordings with him as well? Yeah?

22:01

I did Let's Go Get Stone with him,

22:03

which was his very first hit, and

22:17

I also worked on Oh God,

22:19

eleanor Rigby for the movie In the

22:21

Heat of the Night, and Oh God.

22:23

I worked on several things for him. Did

22:26

you decide to leave to do more backup in your own

22:28

work? Then, Well, I wanted

22:30

a career for myself. My husband and I had discussed

22:33

it. I was engaged Curtis by then, and

22:35

we had discussed it, and I discussed with my mom,

22:37

and you know, I just felt

22:39

like I could, I could be a great artist by

22:41

myself. Did ra Charles understand

22:43

that, Well, No, he didn't want us to leave.

22:46

He didn't want me to leave at all, and he sure

22:48

didn't want his conductor to leave. Yeah,

22:50

because like we were, we were his fame. He loved

22:53

me and Billy, and he loved he

22:55

loved Curtis. So he said he did not

22:58

do that did not make him feel too good

23:00

at all. Later, later years we

23:02

talked about it. He would always says, Sistemia,

23:04

you just left me. Oh my god,

23:06

he's still horning on Systemia. You just left

23:09

me, because that's what he would call me. It was to

23:11

Mary, you just you just left

23:13

me. I so well, you know, I

23:15

wanted a career. I couldn't have

23:17

a career out on the road with you. We'll

23:19

be back with more from Mary Clayton after

23:22

a break. We're

23:25

back with Mary Clayton and Bruce Headlam.

23:28

So when did you meet Lou Adler

23:30

and all of this? Okay, So

23:32

I met Lou. Lou was doing

23:34

an album called Dylan's Gospel all

23:37

Bob Dylan songs, but he wanted to do them

23:39

in a gospel flare. So he

23:41

wanted to call all the great singers in the

23:44

LA to do these particular sessions, which

23:46

consisted of the honeycomb. He

23:48

wanted all the great background singers. So

23:51

you know, he put out the call and Gene Page

23:53

called me the great arranger. He

23:56

says, Mary, you know, I'm doing this record with

23:58

the producer Lou Adler, and I have a

24:00

couple of songs but may be great for you.

24:03

Come to my office and let's kind of go over them.

24:05

If you feel like you liked them, we'd like you

24:07

to sing them on this record. So I went

24:09

to Jeans and I loved the songs, you know, and they

24:11

were right they were right up my alley because

24:14

they were you know, they had a gospel flare

24:16

to them and I could sing that in my sleep. So

24:19

the section was in about two weeks. Went

24:22

to the studio and everybody

24:24

had a different lead on different songs. So

24:28

I met Lou at

24:30

the studio and then

24:33

we did I think the first

24:35

song was Quinn the Eskimo

24:38

and times are changing, well by times in the

24:40

change were changing. Lou pulled

24:42

me in the hallway said, you know what, I'd like to

24:44

talk to you after all this is over. So

24:47

we met with Lou at his office, my

24:49

husband and I, and he offered me a deal.

24:51

Wow, and I was I was really

24:54

ready for a deal, and he gave me a great deal

24:56

and we decided to sign

24:58

the Lou. That was in nineteen sixty nine. Now

25:01

you you had a lot of friends who were who

25:04

were background singers. Yeah, was

25:06

it really competitive? Among you to

25:08

get jobs. Was it a tough business

25:10

to be in? I didn't think it was

25:12

tough. It wasn't tough for me. I just

25:15

always thought that if it was for you

25:17

to have or for you to be on, you'd be on

25:19

it, you know. I mean, if it wasn't,

25:22

then you wouldn't. I

25:24

mean there were so many different

25:26

singers, so we all just loved each other.

25:28

We really really cared for each other.

25:31

So whatever somebody could help

25:33

each other. Somebody would call me and said,

25:35

well, you know what, they're doing a session from

25:37

Motown and they need a top or

25:39

they need a second soprano. You sing everything,

25:42

Mary, so can't you just come to the studio for

25:45

sure? And I'd go and there would

25:47

be other singers. It would be Clydie King, to be

25:49

Vanetta Fields, maybe Shirley Matthews.

25:51

Maybe if you treat somewhere in the holloway, but

25:53

there would be Gloria Jones.

25:56

These ladies were all great singers

25:58

and writers. So I

26:00

did there. I didn't. I didn't detect any competitiveness

26:03

in that. We were all just grateful

26:06

to be doing this wonderful work. And

26:08

then before you did your first album, you did

26:10

the Guinea Shelter session, Yes,

26:13

which is very famous. They called

26:15

you in the middle of the night. Yes. Now

26:17

do you still understand

26:20

why when you were called in the middle of the

26:22

night you were very pregnant. Yeah, you

26:24

delivered just such an incredible performance.

26:28

Well, I think every

26:31

time I go to a record date or do

26:33

anything, I bring everybody

26:35

that has ever been good to me, everybody

26:38

that has said anything

26:40

nice to me, everybody

26:42

that has prayed for me are really

26:45

been for me, meaning all of my ancestors.

26:47

I bring all my ancestors with me wherever I

26:49

go and whatever I do, especially when I'm singing

26:52

or doing my craft. And I brought

26:54

all of them with me that night because they had to help

26:56

me, because that was a long It

26:58

wasn't a long night, but it was a very strange

27:01

feeling that night in the in the

27:04

air, you know, it was a beautiful feeling.

27:06

It was a little strange, you know, getting

27:08

up almost eleven o'clock at night to

27:10

go into a session and Jack Niche

27:13

calling that late. Jack has never called me

27:15

that late to come to the studio. So

27:18

as you know, of course, you probably heard my husband.

27:20

I'm talking to Jack, and my husband takes the phone

27:22

and say, hey, man, what's going on as

27:24

well? We'd love this

27:27

group to call the rolling And

27:29

before he could get stones out, my husband grabs

27:32

the phone. He said, what's going on? He says, well, they

27:34

would love to have a lady sing on this part,

27:36

and Curtis Jack when he Jack

27:39

talked, he would always talk like Curtis.

27:42

I think it would be something great for Mary

27:44

later on down the line. I think

27:46

he was always really great and always in my corner.

27:49

Jack Nichi. So he says,

27:51

well, baby, I really think that you should

27:53

maybe, he said, you know how you are, it won't take

27:55

you long to do this. So opened

27:58

the front door and the car is sitting down

28:00

at the end of the stair wheel

28:02

down there waiting for me, and the

28:04

drivers standing on the kind of leading

28:07

on the car. So I go to the studio and

28:09

Nick and Keith had been out in the back,

28:11

so they're coming through the back door. They

28:14

were out doing whatever that they did, and they said are

28:16

you marry? I said yes. It says, well,

28:18

we want you to do this part, and

28:20

of course that's the old children just a shot away, just a

28:22

shot away. So I did that, and

28:25

then it got to the part

28:27

of rape murder. Well, first

28:30

of all, old children just a shot away

28:32

was very very high. It was

28:35

very very high. So

28:38

I sung it, and of course I had everything

28:40

and everybody around me that I brought with me, and

28:42

they helped me to get through it. But when

28:44

they got to rape murder, I

28:47

was like, rape murder. I

28:49

turned to Keith and I said, honey, I'm here

28:51

by myself. I know you don't want me to sing nobody

28:53

no rape murder. They said yeah, they

28:56

said, well tell me what does this

28:58

mean regarding the song. So when they gave me

29:00

the gist of the song, I said, okay.

29:03

So we started to sing rape murder, and

29:06

boy, it even got higher when I started

29:08

singing rape murder, and I mean, being

29:11

pregnant like that. I don't know if

29:13

I really should have been singing that high, but something

29:16

just took me over, you know, just

29:18

took over my whole being almost And at

29:21

that time, it was a lot of racism

29:24

going on. It was the war

29:26

in Vietnam, it was Doctor

29:28

King and you know, the Black

29:30

movement going on. It was just a lot

29:32

of it was just very weird out there in the

29:35

street police from the brutality,

29:37

and I think I kind of took that spirit on

29:39

that night, and I was like, I was

29:41

just crying out to the heavens to

29:44

please give me shelter, to give

29:46

a shelter from all the stuff that's going on here,

29:48

because it touched me very deeply. So

29:51

by the time I got finished with that, it was like I

29:54

left myself and then I came back to myself.

29:56

And by the time I came back to myself, they said,

29:59

well, they were hooting and hollering in the

30:01

booth, just hollering and screaming in the booth,

30:03

and I'm looking at them and I

30:06

said, okay, do you want me to do one to say,

30:08

oh, just one more? Can you do one more?

30:10

Can you keep the crack? Oh? Can you keep the crack

30:13

that's in your voice? And it was so late my voice

30:15

crack. That's why my voice cracked, right, you

30:17

know in that song in my voice crack And

30:19

it apparently that was that was

30:22

good, And they said, can you give us

30:24

one more? Please keep the crack, don't don't,

30:26

don't get rid of the crack. I said, well, I tried,

30:28

but that's just what my voice

30:31

did at that time of night. So I

30:33

did it again, and before they could come out, I was

30:35

waving goodbye and I was on my way home, and

30:37

that was about the I did about three tapes of that

30:39

and I was done. Were

30:50

you surprised when it became a big hit? Yeah,

30:57

it was a humenous hit. Yes, I

30:59

was. What was it like when you did it for

31:01

your album, because it's very different. Oh,

31:04

I was having fun. I as I said,

31:06

I bought everybody with me, you know, and

31:08

I have all my great musicians in there with

31:11

me, and I had some of my family there

31:13

and we just had a great time. It was just a

31:15

great time because it was my first album, Perie,

31:18

my first record, and as Mary

31:21

Clayton, and it

31:23

was wonderful. I just had really a great

31:26

time with a great groove. When we sheltered on

31:28

the guitar, it was just wonderful.

31:30

You do a version of Bridge over Troubled Water, yes,

31:34

which you know people know the original

31:36

and they knew Aretha Franklin's version,

31:38

but this version is it's very different.

31:42

Yes, it's really wonderful. Can you talk

31:44

a bit about that. When we did

31:46

that song, you know, that

31:49

was just how I was feeling. I

31:52

was feeling like a bridge over troubled

31:54

Water. You know, you have to have a

31:56

certain feeling to sing those

31:58

type of songs, and was still a lot

32:00

of trim all going on in the world, and I felt

32:03

like we were definitely a bridge that was over

32:05

some troubled water, you know. And

32:07

I just bought all of the spirit stuff

32:09

into the session with me that day,

32:12

and everybody just seemed to love it. But it

32:15

was just my spirit, That's

32:17

what that was. Was dwelling in my spirit

32:19

that day. I think that we had just we

32:21

had just done the Moderate Pop Festival and

32:24

I had the whole Love Unlimited

32:26

band with me at that

32:29

festival that day, so I tried

32:31

to recreate that when I went into the studio and

32:34

it just turned out so great. We were

32:36

very happy with that. And then you did

32:39

your next album with Southern

32:41

Man and Steamroller, and yeah,

32:44

you did a Carol king Son you had sung on Tapestry,

32:47

Is that right? Yeah? I didn't do it with Carol

32:49

on Tapestry called Way Over yonda. Oh.

32:52

I didn't realize that was you. Yeah,

32:54

that's me. And did you do other

32:56

background on that album as well? Yeah?

32:59

I did all the wocal background on Tapestry

33:01

myself and Julia Waters did Oh incredible,

33:04

what was Carol King like to work with. Like

33:07

my sister, we're very cold. We're

33:09

very very close. We've always

33:12

been closed. We're still close. She was

33:14

a joy. She she loved my husband

33:17

and he did brother to brother

33:19

with her and he worked on tapestry

33:21

also with her. You know. But

33:23

we were like family. You know, we're the

33:26

same record labeled and we would

33:28

all we would always do everything together. You

33:30

know. We had kids, you know, and we

33:33

would never we never talk about anything but the children.

33:37

We didn't talk about music at all. You

33:39

know, sometimes we talk about me, but our main conversation

33:42

was always about the kids. You know. The kids were always

33:44

on the lot there at A and M and kind

33:47

of hanging out. She said, oh, come

33:49

and get Kevin. Mary Clayton's

33:51

son is an office cause it having Carol's

33:54

kids would be there. So we were like a big family.

33:57

And she was like, I came

33:59

one night. I was taking a girlfriend

34:02

out to dinner and I didn't have the credit

34:04

card, so I stopped by to

34:07

get the credit card from my husband, and

34:10

Carol was waving me in, did come

34:12

come here? Come here? And said what's going

34:14

on? She says, come, I want you to sing the

34:16

slu part. And it was way over

34:18

Yonder. So I sung that part and

34:20

I went on out to dinner with my girlfriend. Is

34:24

that funny? But we want to do the listening back. She

34:26

said, this is what you did. Listen to yourself?

34:29

Is the sun shutting?

34:37

Shut it write down? I

34:40

said, oh, Carol, that's great. She said, Oh,

34:42

lucays, oh, Mary was wonderful and

34:44

it turned out really, really great, so we were happy about

34:47

that. Why were you able to do things

34:49

so quickly? Did

34:51

you read music by this point? Of

34:53

course I did, but I didn't

34:55

have to. I didn't have to read music to do Way

34:57

Over Yonder. I mean it was like it was like a

35:00

church field. Way Over Yonder was a place where

35:02

I know that I could find shelter

35:04

from a hunger and cold, and the sweet

35:07

taste in good life is so easily found own

35:09

way over Yonder. That's why I'm bound.

35:12

It was very It was like going to choir

35:14

rehearsal. She says, Sing to these lyrics

35:17

and sing them how you feel it. So that's what I

35:19

did. Wow, did you make your dinner

35:21

reservations? Of course I did.

35:24

You made it on time, and you you sang

35:26

a hit on the way there. I

35:29

think Lou called the restaurant

35:31

said they're going to be about maybe twenty twenty

35:34

five minutes later, and then when we got

35:36

there, everything was set up in Randy. Oh

35:39

nice. So you know so

35:41

many people know you from twenty

35:43

feet from stardom. Yeah, and

35:45

you said something in that film I think

35:48

about a lot, which, as you said, every

35:50

time I get ready to do something, something

35:53

would knock me to my knees. Yeah.

35:55

And you were talking about solo stuff

35:58

and other things you would do. You

36:00

know, you had this accident. It's very traumatic.

36:02

You lost your husband years before that. Did

36:05

your faith in your ability

36:08

to get up and do this did it ever wane? No,

36:12

never wavered. My faith has

36:14

never wavered. From a child, I

36:16

knew what I knew. I knew who I was. I've

36:18

always known who I was. But more

36:20

than that, I've always known whose I

36:23

was. I always knew and

36:25

I was always taught that I was special,

36:28

that I was a gift, and that I was

36:31

descendants of royalty. I

36:33

was a queen and and and

36:35

I was and I was great. I was always taught

36:37

that. You know, we were always taught that we

36:40

were wonderful just the way we were, and we

36:42

were always God's property, So never

36:45

waver. Whatever God does

36:47

or whatever God allows in my life,

36:50

you take it. It's how you it's how you deal with it,

36:53

you know. It's It's like I was speaking to

36:55

a great lady in my life one

36:58

day at a huge party

37:01

and I got her ear

37:03

and I was complaining about something. I

37:06

think it was a deal that was about to go down.

37:08

It was making too long and oh,

37:11

I don't know if I want to do it. And la

37:13

la la la. I said why why why

37:15

does it take so long to get

37:17

stuff done? So she looked at me

37:20

and stared at me for a long time, and she says,

37:22

baby, she said, that's called l

37:24

I f E. She said, that's life,

37:27

she says, but it's about what you do in

37:30

life. How are you going to handle a situation

37:32

in life? It's not the situation, it's how

37:35

you handle it that would help you get through it. And

37:37

I always remember that that

37:40

was that lady was my guy, mom, Delarese.

37:43

You know when when I had my accident, she says,

37:45

Now she went back to the same thing.

37:47

She says, Well, however you deal with this, it's

37:50

how you're going to come out of it. She said,

37:52

Okay, she said, I want you to gather yourself. She

37:54

said, and how are you gonna deal with this? I said, I'm gonna

37:56

deal with it with love and with dignity. She

37:59

said, you know who you are? I said, I know exactly who

38:01

I am. Mom, And she

38:03

said, well, you're gonna get through this, and you're gonna

38:05

get through it in victory. So don't waiver

38:08

on what you've known all your life. So

38:10

no, my faith has never wavered. And I've

38:12

never asked. You know how some people when

38:15

they go through things, they always oh God,

38:17

why, And I don't think of myself.

38:20

You know what this happened. I talked to spoke

38:22

to my brother, and you

38:25

know, I tried to cry the blues to my brother.

38:27

I said, well, I don't know. You

38:29

know why this particular thing, you know, had

38:32

to happen. He says, Well, there's

38:34

a purpose in everything, you know,

38:36

he says, So again he says, you know

38:39

who you are, and again,

38:41

you know who'se you are because this is what we were taught.

38:44

So you'll get through it. But it's also

38:47

it's going to be a challenge, he says,

38:49

But such as life. You know, life

38:51

is a challenge. No one kind of gets out of this without

38:53

stars. We'll be back with Mary

38:55

Clayton after this quick break. We're

39:02

back with the rest of Bruce Edlam's interview with

39:04

Mary Clayton. But first, here's

39:06

some of the title track of her brand new album,

39:09

Beautiful Scars. I've

39:20

been on the battle

39:23

field of life. I've been through

39:26

it, but

39:29

I just had to go through

39:32

that to get to these.

39:36

I've

39:39

been not doubt, I've been

39:42

kicked down, but face

39:45

brought me back and I'm

39:47

just handing here now.

39:50

These are beautiful stars and

39:53

I have on my heart. This is beautiful

39:56

proof that I've made it this far,

39:58

every herd I've been through, every

40:01

cut, every bruise, wearing power

40:03

like a bag, wearing like a tattoo.

40:06

These are beautiful stars. These

40:11

are beautiful scars. Your

40:14

album is named Beautiful Scars for a great

40:16

song. Was that song written for you by Diane

40:18

Warren? Yes? It was? Okay?

40:21

Have you had you known her before? Oh?

40:23

God, yes, everybody

40:26

knows Diane Warren. But I think

40:28

there was a movie score that I did that she was involved

40:30

in. I think that a

40:33

background says she also, my granddaughter worked

40:36

with a little group that she was working with

40:38

from school. And they would go to her

40:41

studio, and she came to you one day, she said, Grandma.

40:43

She says, do you know you know Diane

40:45

Warren, don't you? I said yes, She said where our studio?

40:48

Does? Said what I said, did

40:50

she know you were my granddaughter? She said, Now, Grandma,

40:52

I didn't go up to her say anything. She

40:54

says, but she is really wonderful.

40:57

I says, she's only one of the greatest writers

40:59

in the entire world. But when we were

41:01

doing the album, we were sitting

41:03

in the studio behind

41:05

the board and Lou and Terry I were

41:07

just talking, you know we did. We were doing a listen back

41:10

and we were just talking. So Lou looked

41:12

at me. He said, you know what he said to think,

41:14

I'll give a call to Diane.

41:17

And I looked at him and I said, Diane, who Diane

41:19

warred? He says, yes, let's call

41:21

Diane. And when he called Diane,

41:24

he told her what he was what he was

41:26

about to do. She says, what in

41:28

a studio of Mary Clayton. She's doing an album and he

41:30

says yes. She says,

41:32

well, I'll have something to you in two weeks.

41:35

And this woman wrote this beautiful

41:37

scars, And when Terry came in with

41:39

it, we all just had to leave out

41:41

of the studio because everybody was just in tears

41:44

when I heard this song, because it was so much

41:47

what I had been through. I

41:50

have definitely been on the battlefield of life

41:52

and I have been through it. But

41:55

I had to go through that to get to you where I am

41:57

today, you know, And those words

42:00

they were so what I have been

42:02

through in my life as an artist. But

42:04

these are still beautiful scars. What

42:07

was it like for you to sing it the first time? Oh?

42:10

Man, it was. It was a tear

42:12

jerker. You know. I had to really get myself together.

42:15

I had to really get because every time I started

42:17

to sing you, I started to cry. I would

42:19

cheer up, and you could hear it in my throat.

42:22

I'm sure you'd probably hear it in a certain part of the

42:24

song. And when I say everybody's

42:26

got scars, you know, and that's true. Everybody

42:29

have some type of scar or another. But during

42:31

the time I was recording it, the first time

42:33

I recorded it, Luc says, you know what he

42:35

said, I think you need to go home and really, really,

42:38

really really horn in on the song and

42:40

we'll come back into two days. Okay, Mary,

42:43

I said, okay, Uncle Loo, that's cool. So

42:45

I came home and played it over and over and over and over

42:47

and over and over and over and over until I got

42:49

it in my spirit. Once I got it in

42:51

my spirit, I was ready to go. So we

42:54

got to the studio and the first take they

42:56

loved it, and then here I go again,

42:59

and then we did another one for safety, and

43:01

then we did one more and that was it for beautiful

43:03

Scars, because they wanted to capture

43:06

the performance of it. Yeah, and

43:08

that's what we did. I want to ask

43:10

you just about one more song. It's full

43:12

of great gospel songs by your producer, but

43:15

you redo a song I think you

43:17

did on your first album, which is Leon Russell's

43:19

a song for you. Oh yes,

43:22

oh Bruce, my my,

43:24

my, my, my my, you know

43:27

that song. You know, like couples

43:29

have songs that they really like and they

43:31

go back and remember things that

43:33

they were doing at that time in their lives, and when

43:36

that song come on, you can just look

43:38

at each other and say, oh boy, I remember

43:40

that song. Well, that song applied

43:43

to my husband and I and

43:46

that was kirk My and Curtiss song

43:48

because he would always say, I

43:51

always feel married that you're singing that song

43:53

for me. I said, well, I am singing that song for you.

43:56

And when I recorded that song,

43:58

we just fell in love with it, and of course we love

44:01

Leon. And when I

44:03

recorded it for this album, see,

44:06

I didn't know that Lou and Terry

44:08

were going to pull O curtis Is solo from

44:11

the Mary Clayton album and put

44:13

it on this particular record. So

44:15

one day we're kind of hanging

44:17

out and he calls me and say, Mary,

44:20

I'm gonna send a song for you, but

44:23

I want Kevin to be sitting with you when you listen

44:25

to it. So Kevin is my sons. I

44:27

called Kevin. I said, you know, uncle Lou wants

44:29

you to be here. When I listened to song for

44:31

you. We had no idea what was going on. So

44:34

we have these great speakers in the house. So he's

44:36

sitting and we're listening. So Karvin

44:39

took his finger and he was pointing to the

44:41

music and I said, why is he pointing? He said,

44:43

Mom, that's dad, that's dad. I

44:46

said, oh my god, Lou, pull

44:48

that's solo from that album,

44:51

and we both just you know, it just brought us

44:53

to tears. It brought us to tears.

44:55

It was just it was just so wonderful.

44:57

That's why this song is so special to me. Well,

45:00

it's an amazing version. Thank you. It's

45:03

a terrific album. What's next for you? Are

45:06

you? Are you waiting to see about when

45:09

you can perform again in public? Absolutely?

45:12

I think we're getting ready to do a video, a couple of

45:14

videos, and it's

45:17

a lot of things brewing, a lot of things coming up

45:19

there. They tell me we're looking forward

45:21

to doing great things with this record. I

45:23

want people to really be blessed by hearing

45:26

this and be able to really touch

45:28

somebody or help somebody in

45:30

some kind of way with this music.

45:33

You know, it's very important to me that, you

45:35

know, I was I was telling Louisa,

45:38

LOUI, you know, if I don't get a

45:40

dime, it doesn't matter. I

45:43

just want people to be touched because this

45:45

record has healed my soul and my spirit.

45:48

It's really made me feel like me again. So

45:50

I just wanted to bless people and people

45:53

to be to be really touched and delivered

45:55

from whatever they're going through and to

45:58

be lifted up in this record.

46:00

You've already touched one. You're going to touch a lot

46:02

more. It's just wonderful. Thank

46:04

you, and I couldn't be more thrilled

46:06

You're singing again and doing it so so

46:09

thank you, Thank you so much. God bless you guys.

46:14

Thanks to Mary Clayton for sharing so many wonderful

46:17

stories with Bruce. Do You're. A

46:19

playlist of our favorite Mary Clayton songs and

46:21

classic tracks that feature her on background

46:24

vocals. Head to Broken Record podcast

46:26

dot com. Be sure to subscribe to

46:28

our YouTube channel at YouTube dot com slash

46:30

Broken Record Podcast, where you can

46:33

find extended cuts of new and old

46:35

episodes. You can follow us on Twitter

46:37

at broken Record. Broken Record

46:39

is produced with helpful Leo Rose, Jason Gambrell,

46:42

Martin Gonzalez, Eric Sandler,

46:45

and Jennifer Sanchez, with engineering

46:47

help from Nick Chafee. Our executive producer

46:50

is Mia la Belle. Broken Record is a

46:52

production of Pushkin Industries and

46:54

if you like the show, please remember to share, rate

46:56

and review us on your podcast at Our

46:59

theme musics by Kenny Beats. I'm justin Richmond

47:01

Pace