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Wonder Plus subscribers can listen

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to episodes of episodes of Brighton

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and early Join Wondery Plus

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in the Wondery in the on

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Apple on Apple Go on.

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on. Hello listeners. Today we

0:13

are revisiting one of our are

0:15

revisiting one of our most

0:17

popular episodes, packed with unforgettable

0:19

stories, fresh insights and hilarious

0:21

anecdotes. Hi

0:31

Rob. It It looks like Alan Alan

0:33

me. to are you? Sorry, I'm

0:35

late joining you. That was

0:37

a mistake on my part. on

0:39

there are no mistakes, there Bob

0:42

Ross once said, as accidents. said, just happy

0:44

a Bob Ross fan. a

0:46

Bob Ross fan? that? You don't know

0:48

who he is? know who he is? No. Okay,

0:50

I'm gonna I'm gonna try and

0:52

bring him to life him to life through...

0:54

Here comes ready ready. Now we're gonna

0:56

do a a little cloud here. Oh, that's

0:59

a beautiful cloud. Look at that, a little

1:01

bigger than I was expecting, but A little

1:03

okay, it's my cloud. was expecting,

1:05

but that's okay. It's my cloud. how about

1:07

this? I'm Bob Ross. Welcome to

1:09

the Joy of Painting. to

1:12

the Joy of Painting. Still nothing. I

1:14

like the sound of Rob. I

1:16

do. Are you honestly telling

1:18

me that me Bob Ross Ross

1:20

means nothing to you? nothing

1:22

to you? Nothing. Good Lord. Nothing at all.

1:24

Well then it won't upset you

1:26

to learn that he's dead

1:29

now now because I'm... I'm not upset, no. I've not taken

1:31

you on an though. I've not taken

1:33

you on an emotional roller dipped

1:35

What I've done is the shallow

1:37

your toes into the shallow waters

1:39

of dementia. what... Exactly what,

1:41

that's exactly what googling dementia

1:43

yesterday. And yesterday what you were

1:46

then you forgot

1:48

what you were doing

1:50

it. I forgot I was

1:52

doing. doing! Babo, babo! Well look,

1:55

because one because one

1:57

of the worst things

1:59

on podcasts is

2:01

these untied up threads. we we

2:04

So have to just,

2:06

let's lay the

2:08

whole Bob Ross thing

2:11

to rest. although in person

2:13

he was laid to rest some time

2:15

ago he was an American and he

2:17

had a show where he would paint

2:20

very quickly very beautifully and he's he's

2:22

got a beautifully therapeutic voice you they've

2:24

got him on calm on the app

2:26

to send you to sleep oh well

2:29

and I would just say to you

2:31

Alan as a friend get a bit

2:33

of Bob Ross in your life Listen,

2:35

first of all, we've started, I should

2:38

tell you that, and secondly, thank you

2:40

so much. You've been on my list

2:42

from the very beginning, so thank you

2:44

for doing this. Oh, very kind. It's

2:47

nice to be here. Well, I was

2:49

saying here, I'm at home. But in

2:51

a way, we're together, aren't we? And

2:54

I'm going to start with a... There's

2:56

no chronology to this, but it caught

2:58

my eye. In 2009, Alan, you published

3:00

a book and you can deny it

3:03

if you wish. My favorite people in

3:05

me, 1978 to 88. And I scanned,

3:07

these are your heroes. No, I like

3:09

it, I like it. I scanned the

3:12

people and two names resonated with me.

3:14

Starski and Hutch. Oh yes. How nice

3:16

to meet a fellow fan of Starski

3:18

and Hutch. Because they're kind of forgotten

3:21

now. I think they are forgotten. Yeah,

3:23

it was a different time, Rob. It

3:25

was a different time. What I remember

3:28

about them perhaps most was I used

3:30

to have posters of them on my

3:32

wall. Yes. And once, one night I

3:34

was watching Coronation Street, which is, as

3:37

you may remember, in the 80s was

3:39

probably the best sitcom on television. Very

3:41

funny. And I think it was feared

3:43

Duckworth. She is moving into a new

3:46

place and she put, the first thing

3:48

she did was she put up on

3:50

her wall a huge poster of Starzki

3:52

and Hutch. Wow. Just a smiling photo,

3:55

midshot, pair of them. And that was

3:57

the same poster that had on my

3:59

wall and I realized... then that if

4:01

I was having the same posters as

4:04

Fear at Duckworth, something was awry. Was

4:06

it was it the iconic poster blue

4:08

background hutch sitting Starski standing in the

4:11

cardian? No, they were both standing and

4:13

they were just midshot. bit outstanding. One

4:15

of those ones you could buy them

4:17

would fold out numerous times. Those are

4:20

a big deal in those days. If

4:22

you got Kung Fu monthly, the Bruce

4:24

Lee thing, that would fold out into

4:26

a big poster as well. Yeah, on

4:29

my last tour I did, which was

4:31

a few years ago now, the merch

4:33

guys, wasn't a lot of money in

4:35

the merch, I'll be honest, but they

4:38

produced a fold-out thing of me. And

4:40

of course... It delighted me hugely to

4:42

now be the same. Even though it

4:44

was something that I financed myself, there

4:47

was almost zero interest in. In fact,

4:49

I have a box of them here.

4:51

That doesn't surprise me, Alan. That doesn't

4:54

surprise me at all. You said, I'm

4:56

going to go tangentially, we're going to

4:58

come back to Starski and Hutch, but

5:00

you mentioned Vera Duckworth, and her name

5:03

has never been raised on this podcast

5:05

to date, and it reminded me of

5:07

one of the many times that I've

5:09

made Steve Coogan look down his nose,

5:12

and one was we were filming the

5:14

first trip, and we're in the north

5:16

of England, and we're just improvising some

5:18

stuff looking at a pond, and there

5:21

were ducks in there. And I said,

5:23

oh, look at those. Those are the

5:25

markings. Those are very distinctive. I said,

5:27

those are Vera ducks. I said, and

5:30

he said, are they? Because if I

5:32

ever know anything, he's always shocked. And

5:34

as are they? And I said, yeah.

5:37

And I said, they're very expensive. I

5:39

mean, I said, it's very hard to

5:41

say, you know, people ask, what's a

5:43

Vera duck worth? Wow. And the look.

5:46

You've got a bit of compassion in

5:48

your face, which is nice. He had

5:50

he had none. None? No. No. The

5:52

heart of value. No one knows. It's

5:55

quite nice. What's a very reduckworth? No

5:57

one knows. What's a veera duckworth? No

5:59

one knows. What's a veera duckworth. You

6:01

could see it. It's slightly grammatically incorrect.

6:04

It doesn't quite. But normally I have

6:06

quite a low threshold for that logic

6:08

in a joke not working. The audience

6:11

will be laughing on a minute. Wait,

6:13

now it doesn't, doesn't, but anyway, he

6:15

was, he was very dismissive. Back to

6:17

Starzkeen hutch. So, who were you as

6:20

a kid then? Because you're very similar,

6:22

you're a little bit younger than me.

6:24

Were you Starzke or were you hutch?

6:26

Oh, Starzkem. So was I. And what

6:29

about the Starzkeen hutch's car? It was

6:31

a Ford Granderino and at the time

6:33

the most exotic automobile you could imagine.

6:35

Beautiful thing. I had several toy versions

6:38

of different sizes. Yes, me too. And

6:40

a few years ago, I was lucky

6:42

enough to drive a replica of one

6:44

of those. No. Yeah. As part of

6:47

some television program. No, I think I've

6:49

been a photo shoot. Anyway, Guy turned

6:51

up with a Starzkin Hutch car and

6:54

I got in. and drove it, it's

6:56

a terrible thing to drive, terrible, huge,

6:58

great boat of a thing, you can't

7:00

see any of the four corners, and

7:03

then we drove it around a bit,

7:05

you press the accelerator pedal for ages

7:07

before anything happens, and then eventually you

7:09

can hear some rumbling in the distance,

7:12

the engines miles away, you've used about

7:14

a gallon of fuel, just pulling away,

7:16

and then I've got to a narrow

7:18

bit in the road where there are

7:21

two posts, it said now, and I

7:23

thought I can't get this through. I

7:25

cannot see and I was terrified of

7:27

damaging the stars getting hutch car and

7:30

I got out I said can we

7:32

get through here and the guy's car

7:34

it was in another vehicle behind and

7:37

he said you got loads of. The

7:39

Irony is that when they used to

7:41

drive it in the opening titles they

7:43

drove like Lunatics didn't they? Lunatics but

7:46

very big roads. in Los Angeles. They

7:48

are always roaring out of a side

7:50

street across about eight lanes of traffic

7:52

and I think you need at least

7:55

that to judge where you're going in

7:57

that thing. The steering wheel I think

7:59

it was about 18 turns lock-to-lock. Well

8:01

those big cars are hard to drive.

8:04

I have another example sitting behind me

8:06

on there. Can you see it? Is

8:08

the 1960s Batman TV Batmobile. Oh I

8:10

had a toy one of those as

8:13

well. Yeah well I bought that as

8:15

an adult make of that what you

8:17

will but I had a friend who

8:20

had a birthday party for his young

8:22

son about four or five years ago

8:24

and he got because there was more

8:26

than one of those made of course

8:29

he got one of the originals driven

8:31

to the house and a guy dressed

8:33

in the Adam West Batman suit and

8:35

this was a guy who had once

8:38

been in East Endus I believe and

8:40

he took my kids and my friend's

8:42

kids into the car. and drove them

8:44

around Muswell Hill, Primrose Hill, kind of

8:47

around there. And he said, I said,

8:49

oh, what's that like? And just like

8:51

he is, oh, it's an absolutely bugger

8:54

of a car. I think in the

8:56

cover behind me, I think I've got

8:58

a very large star-skinned hatch replica car.

9:00

Would you like to see it? Oh,

9:03

I would love to see it. I'm

9:05

going to have to take my head

9:07

friends that. So I won't be able

9:09

to hear you worry about that. You

9:12

take all the time you take all

9:14

the time you need. Well, for listeners,

9:16

I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm

9:18

going to help you. Alan has moved

9:21

to the back of his room. He's

9:23

slightly out of frame, looking to the

9:25

right, as we look at him, and

9:27

looking for this Dachianhach car. And he's

9:30

saying we're in luck, we're in luck.

9:32

He said it a third time. And

9:34

he's coming, how big is this going

9:37

to... Oh, look, oh, look at, oh,

9:39

that's nice. There you go. And you've

9:41

kept him. You've kept it in the

9:43

box. And that, Rob, I confess, bought,

9:46

as you said about your back and

9:48

cut as an adult. Yeah. An inexplicable

9:50

purchase. What was I thinking? No, I'll

9:52

tell you what you're thinking. I'll

9:55

tell you what you

9:57

were thinking you

9:59

were craving comfort You

10:01

you stared into the

10:04

abyss of your

10:06

own mortality as you stared into

10:08

the abyss of your

10:11

own mortality. It's

10:13

a curious thing that

10:15

the heroes we have

10:17

as It's a curious thing that

10:19

the heroes we have as children, and

10:21

then, you know, in our line

10:23

of work, we get to meet quite

10:25

a few of them. Certainly the

10:27

comedy heroes, I've met many of them.

10:29

Some of them have become friends,

10:31

but still the Starsky still the Starski that

10:33

kind of stuff. And here's

10:35

a thing. And Tell me what you

10:38

make of this, or it's over

10:40

there. make of this, or it's a loft

10:42

the other day, a and I found

10:44

a whole load of a stuff, of

10:46

old stuff, certificates, certificates, details of what to do

10:48

what to do when I went

10:50

to drama school, what I

10:53

would need, all that kind of

10:55

stuff. of And also, also scrapbook book. A

10:57

scrapbook dedicated to Sylvester Stallone. Stallone.

10:59

Wow! That sounds marvelous.

11:01

How many pages sounds

11:04

fill, How many pages did you

11:06

know roughly? I do you know

11:08

what? May I now the compliment

11:10

now that you've shown me? May

11:12

I just edge out a

11:14

frame and get this and show

11:16

it to you? to you. it do.

11:18

And then I want to

11:20

tell you to reaction of my

11:22

children, both adult and still in

11:24

childhood. He was in one

11:26

of these, right, one of these

11:28

He was in one Quite a right? One of

11:30

these I see, yeah. Wow, quite a hard...

11:32

I see, yeah. College documents, 1984. Right? You you take

11:34

it out one one of the things,

11:36

I I mean there's a book about

11:38

book but that's neither you but that's

11:40

neither you know there. This is

11:43

it. is it. Wow. One of

11:45

of those old things. You

11:47

would never know from the

11:49

cover that it was all

11:51

about cover that it just flowers. sly.

11:53

just flowers. there's flowers. It's just flowers. So

11:56

we're keeping pressed flowers, isn't

11:58

it? isn't it? And in

12:00

a way he is a precious bloom,

12:02

look at this. And this is an

12:05

article taken from the, and I've put

12:07

it in, an article on Stallone from,

12:09

it says, the male on Sunday, the

12:12

12th of the 6th, 83. I was

12:14

18 years old, Alan. Wow, when you

12:16

were sticking sliced alone pictures in an

12:18

old lady scrapbook. And my kids, think,

12:21

my kids, because, you see that one

12:23

there, I've cut that one out from

12:25

Rocky 3. Oh, he's gorgeous there, isn't

12:28

he? What a hunk. Well, what a

12:30

ring. That's the reaction. And my kid

12:32

said to me, Dad, were you, you

12:34

know, they began to question my orientation

12:37

because of that, but that's just a

12:39

young guy, isn't it? Hero worshipping. I

12:41

think you've got some very deeply buried

12:43

and that. I could entirely understandable sexual

12:46

desire there, Rob. Towards Sylvester. Towards Sylvester.

12:48

At least, that's spectacular spectacular chest. Anyway.

12:50

For the first time ever, Rambo... Which

12:53

one? I've watched the first two. I

12:55

watched the first one a couple of

12:57

weeks ago and I watched the second

12:59

one last week. And... Don't know what

13:02

made me watch them. Well I found

13:04

them fascinating, but the second one really,

13:06

the way the camera lingers over his

13:08

torso, which is always glistening. Yes. And

13:11

there was one sequence where he's being

13:13

tortured, strapped up shirtless, being tortured by

13:15

a kind of electric... electric... like a...

13:18

I suppose a car battery or something

13:20

and they keep putting electric current through

13:22

him. And every time he rides and

13:24

twists and flexes absolutely everything he's got,

13:27

which is a lot. And nobody was

13:29

allowed to take their shirt off and

13:31

nobody else has had allowed to have

13:34

any muscles. He's the only one. And

13:36

he appears to me the biggest man

13:38

at the world. But we know in

13:40

fact, actually, he's diminutive, isn't he? I'm

13:43

told he's the same height as me

13:45

though I find it hard to imagine.

13:47

I can imagine it. Can you honestly?

13:49

You've stood next to me. Surely there's

13:52

more to still own than me. No,

13:54

I don't think there is. I'm... five

13:56

foot seven on a good day. I

13:59

think that's what size of him. And

14:01

the films are kind of ludicrous, you

14:03

know. I mean, he's a one man

14:05

army. He can do everything. Yeah. And

14:08

he can get shot at a million

14:10

times and never be hit. And he

14:12

can shoot a million times and never

14:15

miss. The first one was more realistic.

14:17

I mean. real estate with a small

14:19

art. But the first one I remember

14:21

thinking was rather good and gritty and

14:24

you know the bit where he jumps

14:26

off the cliff in the first one

14:28

onto those pine trees he genuinely broke

14:30

some ribs. I think they did the

14:33

shot twice and he says oh you

14:35

never you never give him another take

14:37

if you know it's good I'm doing

14:40

Sylvester Stallone and he said he did

14:42

it once and they said it was

14:44

great just give us another one slide

14:46

just for safety just so we know

14:49

we got it for safety how ironic

14:51

how ironic and he jumps off yeah

14:53

and he and I think that's the

14:56

stop the the tape they use where

14:58

he goes in the and and yeah

15:00

shut down the movie for a few

15:02

weeks that's right that's right But there

15:05

is something in there, isn't there? There's

15:07

more than just a daft. Oh yes.

15:09

Saw them fast and furious. Yes, yes,

15:11

yes. And certainly the first one was,

15:14

you know, I can remember going to

15:16

see it. Remember in those days, this

15:18

was probably the beginning of VHS recorders

15:21

and stuff, but obviously a universe away

15:23

from where we are now with the

15:25

accessibility to media and stuff. I used

15:27

to, I remember, I recorded the review.

15:30

on Barry Norman's show on a cassette

15:32

player. I was that much of a

15:34

fan. You were a real fan. Yeah.

15:37

Well there are other fans in South

15:39

Wales. Of Stallone. Of Stallone. There must

15:41

have been, surely. Yeah. But I would

15:43

challenge. That fell Rocky 3. Yeah. I

15:46

saw that in the cinema. Uh-huh. A

15:48

packed cinema probably on a weekend. And

15:50

the crowd were cheering. Yeah. Yeah. And

15:52

that doesn't often happen in a cinema,

15:55

does it? No. They were cheeringering. Because

15:57

they really do manipulate you, don't you?

15:59

He's really down on his luck and

16:02

there'd be, isn't that the one where

16:04

the old coach dies or something terrible

16:06

happens? Was that, was that, was that,

16:08

when I was that the four, yeah,

16:11

I think, yes, I think Mickey dies

16:13

in the third, in Club Alang, who's

16:15

then training him in the fourth, I

16:18

don't know much about these films, Alan,

16:20

Club Alang. play, not club a lang,

16:22

Apollo Creed, the club a lang is

16:24

played by Mr. T, Apollo Creed is

16:27

played by Carl Weathers, and I think

16:29

that he dies when sly is fighting

16:31

Ivan Draggo played by Dolf Lundgren. Yeah,

16:33

what a fine figure of a man

16:36

he is. But I've never really noticed

16:38

the films much. I didn't, while we're

16:40

talking about heroes and to gently move

16:43

away from my early Homo-eroticism-filled scrapbooks, note-to-self

16:45

must explore with therapists. I must get

16:47

into press flowers. Time has come. Talking

16:49

about heroes, I saw that you did

16:52

that show about the Great Britons and

16:54

you had to say, well, there was

16:56

a BBC thing, who was the greatest

16:59

Britain, and you chose a beetle, and

17:01

you chose John Lennon, and of course

17:03

a wonderful man, but you choose him

17:05

over Paul McCartney. Well, I'll give you

17:08

a bit of background on that. That

17:10

was a, I was asked to front

17:12

that documentary. and it was made in

17:14

about, I think it was about 2003,

17:17

and there was a public poll, about

17:19

40,000 people took part, so quite a

17:21

significant poll of Britain, and asked to

17:24

choose their greatest Britons. And John Lennon

17:26

made the cut, he made the top

17:28

10. So in a way I was

17:30

a little bit surprised, not that he

17:33

wasn't a great man, it was, but

17:35

that it was such a long time

17:37

really since he'd been a major public

17:40

figure, you know. I had no connection

17:42

with the city of Liverpool. fine city

17:44

though it is. I had no connection

17:46

with the Beatles, amazing band, though they

17:49

were, but they said well I do

17:51

this thing. So I said yes I

17:53

would, I would advocate for John Lennon

17:55

and then I found myself immersed in

17:58

the world of John Lennon and didn't

18:00

really know much about his life, his

18:02

losing his mother which is something that

18:05

happened to me when I was young.

18:07

I went to visit his childhood home

18:09

in Liverpool and it did... really did

18:11

quite strongly resemble my own child at

18:14

home and I started listening to the

18:16

albums and thought God all of these

18:18

albums sound like other bands and then

18:21

of course the penny drops all those

18:23

other bands that you love all of

18:25

the other bands that you love sound

18:27

like the Beatles yeah the single most

18:30

influential popular music combo ever and why

18:32

why the public voted for Lenin and

18:34

not McCartney. Perhaps many people probably did

18:36

vote for McCartney, but he didn't make

18:39

the top 10. I don't know. I

18:41

don't know. I think there's a kind

18:43

of a, there's a tragic hero figure

18:46

there, isn't there? Because he was murdered,

18:48

because he was only 40 years old.

18:50

There's a kind of martyrdom element, really,

18:52

isn't there? And I really became quite

18:55

immersed in it and really, I really

18:57

felt for him. He was very troubled.

18:59

kid and one of the worst thing

19:02

about it I think was this story

19:04

of his mother and father saying to

19:06

him when he was about 10 years

19:08

old, I think, who do you want

19:11

to live with? And he chose his

19:13

dad and his mum's upset and then

19:15

he was torn and he went back

19:17

to his mom and the story goes

19:20

that his dad then went and left

19:22

and joined the Navy didn't see him

19:24

for years. It's just too much to

19:27

bear you know. Anyway, there we are.

19:29

We've spent most of our time talking

19:31

about heroes. How are you. I'm not

19:33

bad, thanks Rob. What are you up

19:36

to at the moment? Where are you?

19:38

I'm trying to write a novel at

19:40

the moment. Oh. We're in the middle

19:43

of recording. a QI series. Yeah. We

19:45

started last week to three episodes last

19:47

week and we got one tomorrow and

19:49

two more on Wednesday and that's how

19:52

we kind of do it three shows

19:54

in 24 hours. And you do, I

19:56

never did it when it was two

19:58

in a day. Now I always did

20:01

it when you do a couple a

20:03

week or a few weeks, how do

20:05

you find doing the two in a

20:08

day? Well I complain about it a

20:10

lot. Do you? But once you've done

20:12

it, and no one died. Yeah. The

20:14

financial saving is so great that you're

20:17

never going back. I know. Yeah, it's

20:19

a genie in a bottle. It really

20:21

is. You have to die on that

20:24

hill before it happens. You never retake

20:26

the hill. But you know that as

20:28

we're saying this, as we're talking about

20:30

how we don't like doing, well I've

20:33

not done it for, but two QIs

20:35

in a day, there will be people

20:37

throwing things at their device while they

20:39

listen to this, saying, you know, get

20:42

over yourself. The problem is, by the

20:44

time you get to the third show,

20:46

if you do three and 24 hours,

20:49

your capacity for invention and spontaneity is

20:51

greatly diminished. And not only that, when

20:53

you do think of a joke, and

20:55

you know how precious that moment is

20:58

when something comes to mind and you

21:00

know that's funny, and then you have

21:02

a little moment of thing, oh hang

21:05

on, no, I'm referring back to something

21:07

that happened this afternoon in another show.

21:09

Yes. There are various sort of trip

21:11

hazards associated with just squeezing too much

21:14

into one place. It's also very difficult

21:16

for the host, less so for me

21:18

because they keep me in the dark

21:20

almost literally, so I don't know what's

21:23

going on, but the host has to

21:25

turn up and rehearse two shows all

21:27

the way through with stand-ins and then

21:30

recall two shows. And so both Stephen

21:32

when he was the host and Sandy

21:34

now, at the end of that second

21:36

day. hey look absolutely spent but of

21:39

course it's uh we are well remunerated

21:41

and it is not working as a

21:43

junior doctor. Yes, Okay. yeah, but

21:46

the only the only

21:48

thing I would take

21:50

issue with is

21:52

I would say are

21:55

many ways that

21:57

one can feel stress

21:59

and become stressed and

22:01

I I think it's

22:04

perfectly fair to

22:06

say that say that ,000

22:08

people on a stage

22:11

night after night

22:13

in different towns after

22:15

not without its stress.

22:17

What would you

22:20

not agree? its stress,

22:22

would you not agree? I've

22:24

never found stand up stressful,

22:27

I must say. say. I never have. I said the

22:29

the only time I really found it

22:31

strong, it when I started doing it when

22:33

I was I started doing it, when was completely

22:35

terrifying. And even in the smallest

22:37

even in the a pub, pub my hands would be

22:39

shaking, would be be anxious all day. day. And in

22:41

And in fact, if you're doing a show

22:43

in the evening, you do start to think

22:45

about it in the afternoon. That's right. it in the

22:47

But the time I really felt the time I

22:50

I hadn't done stand -up for ten years. done

22:52

stand up for 2001 and about

22:54

2011, I didn't do stand do stand up.

22:56

and I was coming back to

22:58

it. did some did some shows in

23:00

Australia, by my friend by my

23:02

friend also my who's also my promoter

23:04

Come Australia. on, on, and stand up

23:06

while you're here. We were there

23:08

doing here. We were there doing right. And I came

23:10

came back I I was invited to

23:12

take part in a charity gig

23:14

for the teenage cancer trust. You know these events they

23:16

do at you you know these events they

23:18

do at Albert Hall? the Albert Hall. I've it's

23:20

the Albert Hall. I've never played

23:22

the Albert Hall. I want to tick

23:24

that off. That's a bucket list

23:26

thing for a comedian, a comedian, right. and it's

23:28

it's I ,000 people. a I haven't played

23:30

a gig in London for years. know if

23:32

my stuff's don't really know if my to

23:34

the to work. three times, Rob. Three successful

23:37

I went to the and three times,

23:39

Rob. Three successful visits. room. No one else

23:41

was in the dressing room. around. else for a dressing

23:43

room. No one else was in the dressing

23:45

room. Everyone else was just hanging around in

23:47

the green think they I think they thought I

23:49

was being a bit precious, but the truth

23:51

was I was just pacing around. I around.

23:53

with nerves and anxiety. And before I

23:55

went on, Jimmy Carr was on. was on

23:57

and Jimmy Jimmy was standing. You

24:00

know how composed and relaxed, he comes

24:02

across on stage, just these honed gags,

24:04

this perfect rhythm, and then right at

24:06

the end it goes off like a

24:08

hand grenade in the audience. And I

24:11

was standing there by Stuart Francis, the

24:13

Canadian comedian, came up behind me and

24:15

he goes, I'd hate to be following

24:17

this guy. Which of course made me

24:19

laugh, and it's a sort of gallows

24:22

humor that comedians are very good at.

24:24

And I went out and initially I

24:26

was a little bit sticky and then

24:28

I found my feet. I did a

24:30

little bit longer than I was meant

24:32

to because I really wanted to get

24:35

going. And then the next day there

24:37

was a little write-up in the Sun

24:39

newspaper about it that said that I

24:41

was the funniest comedian on the night.

24:43

All right. And I found new respect

24:45

for the Sun newspaper. That's not the

24:48

accuracy of perspicacity if they're writing is

24:50

second to none. I was very grateful

24:52

for that. Yeah, I've been getting those

24:54

guys wrong for so long. It turns

24:56

out these these guys are at the

24:59

top of their game. They really know

25:01

their stuff over there. at one of

25:03

those teenage cancer things once I was

25:05

on tour at the time so I

25:07

was feeling you know match fit as

25:09

we say and I went out I'd

25:12

never played a room of that size

25:14

or scale before that and I start

25:16

off it's going pretty well and I'm

25:18

quite I'm quite happy and some I

25:20

think somebody shouted something and I used

25:22

a put down I'd used to great

25:25

effect in the past and it got

25:27

nothing literally nothing and I bottled it

25:29

in that instant and I wanted nothing

25:31

more than to leave the stage which

25:33

I did within decent haste within about

25:36

a minute of that happening. I've always

25:38

remembered that. I just went, oh God,

25:40

I don't belong here and I yeah

25:42

bottled it and I got off. I

25:44

tell you what it happened to me,

25:46

Rob. It happened to me in the

25:49

90s. I was doing stand up in

25:51

the early 90s and I was pretty

25:53

good at. I was pretty confident of

25:55

my stuff, you know, and if I

25:57

was on at John Glares in London

25:59

or the comedy store, I knew I

26:02

had a really good 20 minutes. I

26:04

was going to go down well and

26:06

they had me closing the show quite

26:08

a lot. I had the kind of

26:10

the confidence of the people who ran

26:13

the club and I felt great. I

26:15

loved it. I loved those nights and

26:17

sometimes on a Saturday you do five

26:19

gigs. You know, you'd be back and

26:21

forth around London. They start at the

26:23

store, go to Junglers, go somewhere else

26:26

in the middle, go back to Junglers,

26:28

go back to the store, finish it

26:30

two in the morning. Wow. And then

26:32

in the mid-week, I'd be in Birmingham,

26:34

comparing two nights a week, I'd be

26:37

comparing it in Cheltenham, I'd be up

26:39

and down the motorway everywhere in the

26:41

secondhand, Vauxhall Cavalier. And then I started

26:43

doing Jonathan Creek. And that took me

26:45

away from stand-up. They were long summers

26:47

filming filming, five months filming. and I

26:50

came back to the comedy store in

26:52

about 99 and I used to if

26:54

I was in good form I used

26:56

to go on and kick about for

26:58

five or six minutes just riffing off

27:00

what was going on in the room

27:03

or what the MC had said or

27:05

what somebody was doing or and enjoy

27:07

it's fun doing stuff off the cuff

27:09

and the audience like it and then

27:11

you the longer you can put off

27:14

getting to your material the better you

27:16

know. and I started to try and

27:18

do that and then someone shouted out

27:20

something about Jonathan Creek and then someone

27:22

shouted out something about Caroline Quentin who

27:24

was my co-star at the time and

27:27

then someone else shouted out leave him

27:29

alone and someone else shouted out it's

27:31

a though that my hair was a

27:33

perm I think that was what happened

27:35

anyway the audience were then going at

27:37

one another having a row about me

27:40

and I lost control of the room.

27:42

I just lost control of the room.

27:44

And I hadn't, while I was trying

27:46

to get control of the room and

27:48

think what to say to that person,

27:51

what to say to that person, what

27:53

to say to that person, I also

27:55

couldn't remember any of my act. Oh.

27:57

And I had that moment as you

27:59

describe where suddenly, it's like the floor's

28:01

gone away. Yes. It's like you in

28:04

a cartoon when we run off the

28:06

cliff and your legs are still going

28:08

and then they drop into the canyon.

28:10

I've got nothing to stand and I

28:12

can't think. And also what happened to

28:15

me was I was really upset about

28:17

it because I loved playing the store

28:19

and I loved doing those gigs. I

28:21

thought I would love being famous and

28:23

being recognized and actually I didn't love

28:25

it. For a while I thought it

28:28

was going to be great. feeds your

28:30

ego. And of course you've got a

28:32

big ego. Why would you get up

28:34

there in the first place? Why would

28:36

you want to be the only person

28:38

in the room of 500 people talking?

28:41

It's not just because you've got an

28:43

aptitude for comedy, you know? And I've

28:45

thought, I can't, this is, my life's

28:47

ruined. I can't play the store anymore.

28:49

But why did I do this to

28:52

myself? And I had kind of lost

28:54

a plot a little bit. Stop doing

28:56

stand-up completely really. No. For years. Then

28:58

years later when I... Well that was

29:00

a big part. I didn't go back

29:02

to the store for years. And the

29:05

other comedians loved it because they thought,

29:07

look at this, this is the famous

29:09

one, we've always thought he was a

29:11

bit overrated. He's gone down the toilet,

29:13

brilliant. But then subsequently to that I

29:15

went, you know, after that night at

29:18

the Albert Hall, I went back to

29:20

Stan, got back into Stan and got

29:22

back into Turing and went back and

29:24

go back to the store from time

29:26

to time. And I love it again.

29:29

And I know what you have to

29:31

do is you've got to go out

29:33

on the front foot and take control

29:35

of the situation. If they think you're

29:37

in control, it doesn't matter whether you

29:39

are or not. But you know that

29:42

you're saying that thing about, yeah, exactly.

29:44

It doesn't matter whether you totally agree

29:46

with that. You saying about you starting

29:48

off and you're just improvising, you're ad-living

29:50

and yay, do that for as long

29:53

as you can before you get to

29:55

the material. That transition can sometimes be

29:57

a challenge. I've been out there and

29:59

I'm inventing stuff and I think this

30:01

is great. I think, oh, but at

30:03

some point, I've got to make that

30:06

decision. I've got to jump to the

30:08

old stuff and which never seems... often

30:10

doesn't seem as funny to you because

30:12

the lovely, the beauty of the improv

30:14

stuff in the ad lib is it's

30:16

new to you as well and you're

30:19

enjoying the laugh and you're inventing it

30:21

and it's nice. I've had several times

30:23

something and come on, I've got it,

30:25

it's like jumping out of an airplane,

30:27

you know, I've got to go back

30:30

to the normal stuff. Yeah, and the

30:32

audience feel that gear change, don't they?

30:34

Yeah, yeah, and that's part of the

30:36

challenge, I suppose, is to try and

30:38

hide that, try and disguise that. So

30:40

it just was, it just was, one

30:43

other thing, and we were sort of

30:45

running out of time, but one other

30:47

thing, to go back a bit, something

30:49

you said, which is very interesting, you

30:51

were talking about when you're on QI

30:53

and you have a thought, like having

30:56

a thought, and you think, oh, oh,

30:58

that's funny, I want to get this

31:00

funny, I want to get this, I

31:02

want to get this, I want to

31:04

get this out, I want to get

31:07

this out, I want to get this

31:09

out. is I'll have one of those

31:11

thoughts. Someone says something, right? And I've

31:13

got something that will complement that quite

31:15

nicely and I will get a laugh.

31:17

But there's a kind of statute of

31:20

limitations, isn't there? Because you've got to

31:22

have your moment to get in, right?

31:24

And then the time the boat is

31:26

going further away from the port. And

31:28

you're thinking, I can still jump on

31:31

the boat now. I can still say

31:33

my thing now. And they'd still remember

31:35

it. And then you get to that

31:37

hazier. Oh. jump to that boat, but

31:39

would they, do you know what I

31:41

mean, that thing of, yeah, and especially

31:44

if you think it's a really funny

31:46

thing, you get to that point, you

31:48

go, no, it's too late. Yeah, I

31:50

know what you mean. I would always

31:52

say to the guests, just say it,

31:54

say it, no matter how far away

31:57

from me, can I, yeah. Can I

31:59

refer back to that? Sometimes what happens

32:01

to me, you know, QI, is a

32:03

picture will come up and the pictures

32:05

are a good source for if you

32:08

can't think of anything. A picture will

32:10

come up and I think, oh, I've

32:12

thought of something funny about that picture

32:14

and then before you've said it, the

32:16

picture's changed. Yes, yes, yes. I did

32:18

this the other night. I said, could

32:21

we put that other picture back up?

32:23

Yeah. Then I said this thing that

32:25

I thought was funny and I thought

32:27

was funny, and it was funny, and

32:29

it, and it was funny, and it,

32:31

and it, and it, and it was

32:34

funny. Pretty confident with this thing I'm

32:36

about to say. Gets nothing. And of

32:38

course conversely, a casually tossed out comment.

32:40

Wow. Wow. Really? Was that funny? Okay.

32:42

I'll say it again. Tonight and tomorrow

32:45

night. And the night after. We're kind

32:47

of out of time. One of the

32:49

lovely things, you've got nothing to promote.

32:51

What a nice man. You just said

32:53

yes to my request. I always love

32:55

the people that just come on. In

32:58

the same way, you used to see

33:00

Kenneth Williams on Wogan. And he never

33:02

seemed to have anything to promote. He

33:04

was just there for the joy of

33:06

it. I imagine he perhaps did, but

33:09

he just forgot what it was. Yeah.

33:11

Once he got in front of an

33:14

audience, I imagine he just couldn't stop.

33:16

Did you cross over at all with

33:18

his generation? Did you ever encounter him?

33:21

No, I didn't know. I mean, I

33:23

adored. It's so funny. Yeah. Of course,

33:25

the carry-on films, which would never be

33:27

seen again, I imagine. They've been locked

33:30

in a vault, I believe. I think

33:32

I have. Yeah. they were on all

33:34

the time but also what was on

33:37

all the time growing up was Lauren

33:39

Hardy and my kids have never seen

33:41

Lauren and Hardy you know yeah it's

33:43

a different it's a different time isn't

33:46

it but my heroes were the were

33:48

the young ones they were when I

33:50

was team and I was 16 yeah

33:53

and I did cross over with yes

33:55

that's right with them because they came

33:57

and guest started in Jonathan Creek and

33:59

and I just had such a nice

34:02

time with Rick Mayan in particular. Well

34:04

the impact of that first young ones

34:06

episode, I've said this before, was you're

34:09

roughly the same age, so it would

34:11

be the same for you. I can

34:13

remember going into the youth wing, I

34:15

was in the sixth form, going into

34:18

the youth wing the next morning and

34:20

the vibe being, did you see that

34:22

thing last night? Well we were exactly

34:25

the same, we were 16, exactly the

34:27

same, it just felt like it was

34:29

made for you and also it coincided

34:31

with the VHS. That's right. Recorder. That's

34:34

right. I hadn't thought of that. That's

34:36

right. We could watch them 10, 12

34:38

times. But don't you remember Rick Mayo

34:41

in particular, because there was a softness

34:43

to him that were as opposed to

34:45

Adrian's, uh, uh, Edmund's, and Vivian's character,

34:47

right, which was a sort of nihilistic

34:50

sort of thing. but because Rick had

34:52

a vanity and a vulnerability and a

34:54

pomposity, I remember with that thinking, oh

34:57

yeah, that's a type of person, but

34:59

I've never seen them represented on a

35:01

screen before. Yeah, it was quite, there

35:03

were students, weren't they? And I do

35:06

remember being a student thinking, but the

35:08

one I, I mean, Neil used to

35:10

make us laugh so much. Yes, Nigel

35:13

Planar is Neil. Yes, and so many

35:15

times would be somewhere. a bunch of

35:17

teenagers and someone goes, guys, guys, look

35:19

at us. Are you in? Bickering. Bickering.

35:22

We didn't used to be like this.

35:24

That's right. Yes, we did. That's right.

35:26

That's right. And what about, I remember

35:29

when Rick Mail goes, when he said

35:31

he would, what if I were to

35:33

die? Oh, the people's poet, what, Vic,

35:35

dead, the people's poet. Oh, it was,

35:38

oh, do you remember that, do you

35:40

remember that, two, two, two, okay, two

35:42

things, two things, but Rick, but Rick,

35:44

under the table and he says well

35:47

I find that pretty hard to believe.

35:49

Yeah well I like with Vivian they've

35:51

only got one toilet and it's filthy

35:54

and disgusting and Vivian's in bed and

35:56

he goes that's why I always go

35:58

before I get up. Oh

36:01

yeah, it's wish that's brilliant and then they'd

36:04

have the puppets and the music and the music. All

36:06

right, listen, old guys just reminiscing. Thank you

36:08

for doing this don't have anything to promote

36:10

but you've dangled that you're writing a

36:12

novel So in a way this could be

36:14

the first interview for the novel this could be

36:16

be, interview I can sell it, be

36:18

if I can sell it. Yeah. I see my

36:20

other my other books, think one of

36:22

my two books is still in

36:24

print. in print. Well, and hey, imagine now, now, when this

36:26

novel, this novel comes out, think

36:29

of all the novel out, think of all

36:31

the have as well. Yeah, that'll be

36:33

an opportunity. I'll do a fold -out

36:35

poster. do a A fold -out poster,

36:37

wow. All right, Wow. thanks, hey, thanks

36:39

talking to you. It's been really enjoyable. Thank

36:41

you, my friends. Thanks, Rob. to you.

36:43

It's been really enjoyable. Thanks,

36:46

Rob. If If you've enjoyed

36:48

listening, remember you can

36:50

see highlights over on

36:52

the Bryden YouTube channel. Oh, and

36:54

and remember to subscribe! Follow

37:05

Bryden and the Wondery app, App. Amazon

37:07

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37:14

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