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1:53

guy cannot be intimidated. But is

1:55

that something that's admirable? No! Should

1:57

we celebrate that? I'm not celebrated.

2:00

Don, it's time

2:02

for our cooking

2:04

segment. I don't know if

2:06

you know this, but I

2:08

make a mean omeblet. I

2:11

make a mean omelet.

2:13

Don here? I'm here.

2:16

Roll call? Keep them

2:19

waiting. Lemon? Keep them

2:21

waiting. Try to intimidate

2:23

them. Come in? What time

2:26

is it? It's 530. I

2:28

am never late and never

2:31

have... You never let you

2:33

hate being late? And I find

2:35

it rude when people are. And

2:37

I really don't like it when

2:39

people go, they're late all the

2:42

time, they go, you know, I'm not

2:44

a rude person. Well, my thing is

2:46

you are what you do. If you're

2:48

late all the time, you are a

2:50

rude person. But no, 5.30, you're

2:53

here early, I appreciate that. It's

2:55

a work day for me. I

2:57

know when you're doing it. This

2:59

is my pleasure time. So it's

3:02

busy, it's got to be crazy

3:04

for you. Yeah, you know, it's like,

3:06

hey, I've been doing it forever. It's

3:08

a, I'm a person of habit, I

3:11

like a ritual, I like that Monday

3:13

I do this, Tuesday I do this,

3:15

Wednesday we do this part of the

3:17

show Thursday, Friday we, it's game day,

3:20

you know. I like that. So it

3:22

doesn't bother me, but you know.

3:24

Whenever there's a change in administration

3:26

people always say, you know, what are you

3:29

going to do? Bush is gone. Is there a weird...

3:31

Yeah, I think there'll be comedy, even

3:33

when the Democrats in office. There's always

3:35

a lot of comments. I've never get...

3:37

I never get the newspaper and there's

3:39

nothing in it. Like it's blank that

3:41

day. There are slow newsdays, but there's always

3:43

something. Not these days. But then, that's a

3:46

good challenge though. Whenever there's a slow news

3:48

day, I find that sometimes I do my

3:50

best and... But have you seen one since

3:52

January 20th? I have not. No, I have

3:55

not. There's always too much. I can't

3:57

get it all in if that were just

3:59

the things that... That would be

4:01

headline kind of making

4:03

news or just that's like

4:05

the fifth or sixth

4:08

story, you know, with the

4:10

vibe change. It's a lot. I

4:12

thought it was a lot in

4:14

2016 and then in 2020

4:16

during the election, but this

4:18

is a lot. I mean,

4:21

the first 40 days was

4:23

like the first 40 years.

4:25

And the odd thing is actually.

4:27

you know, in many ways, worse.

4:30

I mean, there are things that I

4:32

like even less than the first

4:34

time, and there are some things

4:36

that I'm not going to judge

4:39

yet, I might even be positive,

4:41

but mostly I'm thrilled with a

4:43

lot of things, like switching sides

4:45

in the Cold War, you know,

4:47

little things like that. And yet,

4:49

my mood is so much better.

4:52

Because I've been through it once.

4:54

Yeah. And I think, you know, I said that in

4:56

the lead up to, you know, free one, I was

4:58

like, you know, he got the White House, he's not

5:00

going to get my mind this time, and

5:02

I think everybody kind of, at

5:04

least everybody I talk to, kind of feels

5:06

the same way. I always say you can be informed

5:09

without being inundated, and it's good for

5:11

me that, you know, I'm not on cable

5:13

news anymore, because I would just, I'd

5:15

have to absorb all of all of it.

5:18

24-7 because you know what do you know

5:20

what do you know they're always in touch

5:22

as you know you have a show what

5:24

you want to do with this this guess

5:26

is on this canceled blah blah

5:29

blah so you were sort of in it

5:31

but now I find that I can go in

5:33

and out of it whenever I want and

5:35

I figure I read the headlines I read

5:37

the papers you do your YouTube show and

5:39

I do my show what what I need

5:42

to say and kind of for us

5:44

yes and no so with the YouTube

5:46

show With my show, the Donovan show

5:48

on YouTube, I don't have to,

5:50

um, I don't have to pretend.

5:52

And I don't have to, um... John,

5:54

we know you're gay. What? You don't

5:57

have to pretend, not here. We love

5:59

her. Oh, you know? Are you out

6:01

of me? I don't have to pretend

6:03

that I don't have to give false

6:06

equivalence. I don't have to invite someone

6:08

on to lie. I don't have to

6:10

have an election denier on. I don't

6:12

have to if I want to. I

6:15

do. And it's all my decision. So

6:17

I've chosen not to in many ways

6:19

insult the viewer's intelligence by just having

6:21

someone purposely who's going to lie or

6:23

just to fight. I get that. It's

6:26

also a very dangerous thing I feel.

6:28

I feel. to think you always know

6:30

what's a lie and what isn't. And

6:32

to kind of like summarily think that

6:35

only one side is lying. One side

6:37

is lying more than the other. That's

6:39

true. But it is a slippery slope.

6:41

I don't believe that's just one side

6:43

lies, but I mean, I think you

6:46

should have people on who can tell

6:48

the story on the other side. But

6:50

I don't have to have, I don't

6:52

have to book people just to fight.

6:55

I hate that. I do too. Yeah.

6:57

Yeah, I stopped doing that. I mean,

6:59

that was, that was the old show,

7:01

politically incorrect. I love that show though.

7:04

It was much more of a, well,

7:06

people like fighting. Well, it was just

7:08

because I actually got, I thought, excuse

7:10

me, I got more out of that

7:12

show than most news shows on television

7:15

back then. Yeah. But there were fights,

7:17

but I thought they were organic, but

7:19

I thought they were organic. guess. They're

7:21

booking people to come on and yell

7:24

at each other because they're desperate for

7:26

ratings. So you think your old network

7:28

doesn't? I think they all, I don't

7:30

want to specifically, I think they all

7:32

do. I think, not, not they all

7:35

do. I think, I'm not, not they

7:37

all do. I think, it's, NBC doesn't,

7:39

because you don't see people on there

7:41

who disagree. I see many of them,

7:44

I do see some cable shows doing

7:46

that, which is, for me. At the

7:48

end of the fight of the argument,

7:50

I wonder, like, what did I get

7:53

out of this? I usually don't get

7:55

anything out of it. And I think

7:57

people need to be informed more than

7:59

ever. I know you think

8:01

like broadcast TV is dead. I

8:04

think I heard you say that.

8:06

No, I don't think broadcast TV

8:08

is dead. I think it's on

8:10

the decline. I don't think it

8:12

has as much influence as it

8:14

did you say that when you're

8:16

used to be on it. Yeah.

8:18

Yeah. No. I was I was

8:20

on broadcast TV for a while,

8:22

but do you mean cable? You

8:24

mean just in general? Well, I

8:27

mean broadcast cable. It's a

8:29

pretty primitive TV set up you

8:31

have, but let's say legacy media.

8:33

I mean, legacy media, the polling

8:35

from people has it in the

8:37

toilet, you know, it's down there

8:39

with Congress, that they don't trust

8:41

it. I've been really surprised by,

8:43

yes, you're right about that they

8:45

don't trust the corporate influence. you

8:47

know and look in order to

8:49

stay afloat they need corporations to

8:51

own them right but they just

8:53

don't like I think they I

8:55

think people believe and rightfully so

8:57

that the corporation is influencing that's

8:59

part of it but that's that's

9:01

well it is but also they're

9:03

not holding people to account and

9:05

also that they are they're just

9:07

not doing a very good job

9:09

that well at some things you

9:11

know why I don't trust it

9:13

why because I never feel like

9:15

I'm hearing what the whatever outlet

9:17

I'm listening to. They are asking

9:19

themselves first, not what's true. They're

9:21

asking themselves, what does this audience

9:23

want to hear? How does this

9:25

audience want me to interpret this

9:27

story? And I'm going to give

9:29

them that. So to get like

9:31

a full story, I can never

9:33

get it just from one source.

9:35

And what I always try to

9:37

do on real time is be

9:39

that source. Be that that place

9:41

where if you watch the full

9:43

show. You get the full story

9:45

now of course what people do

9:47

in this media atmosphere that we're

9:49

in is Many people don't watch

9:51

the full show they see clips

9:53

so you can you can you

9:55

could carve up any one of

9:57

my hour-long shows and Just feed

9:59

and a lot of people only

10:01

see it this way just feed

10:03

them the part that they either

10:05

will make them love me Or

10:07

hate me. Yeah, they can feed

10:09

to both sides. Something that they

10:11

think is right, they just feed

10:13

it, and then something they think

10:15

is left. Yeah, but that's always

10:17

been the case, don't you think?

10:19

Not this bad. No, no, no,

10:21

I don't. You think it's worse

10:23

now? Oh, way worse. I think

10:26

the New York Times, just to

10:28

take the most prime example, because

10:30

it is the paper of record,

10:32

blah, blah, blah, blah. Not to

10:34

me anymore. I mean, every page.

10:36

That's just a change they made.

10:38

Now, part of that is because

10:40

of Trump, it's very hard to

10:42

be honest and true and not

10:44

say he lied, basically. Newspapers never

10:46

used to say the president lied,

10:48

even though presidents have always lied.

10:50

But they just basically, they just

10:52

went out and said, because you

10:54

can't not, because he took it

10:56

to such a different degree of

10:58

lying that you just have to

11:00

say. So that is true. He

11:02

did lie. Yeah, or it does

11:04

lie about many things. We saw,

11:06

I mean, there was lots of

11:08

crazy stats in the speech he

11:10

made last night. The fake state

11:12

of the union? It was the

11:14

joint address to Congress. Yeah, you

11:16

know. Luckily, I had a joint

11:18

when I was watching it. Is

11:20

it better to watch high? Everything's

11:22

better high, Don, don't you get

11:24

high? But can we get back

11:26

to the New York Times? I

11:28

don't disagree with you on some

11:30

things about the New York Times,

11:32

but I do believe it's still

11:34

the paper of record. I used

11:36

to compare, I used to read

11:38

the New York Times and then

11:40

the Washington Post. And the Washington

11:42

Post I found was much more

11:44

straightforward than the New York Times.

11:46

I thought that the writing... in

11:48

the New York Times was much

11:50

more interesting and flowery and perhaps

11:52

that may have sort of influenced

11:54

people. But then I read it

11:56

and I said, you know what,

11:58

after a while, I said this

12:00

is a left, a more left

12:02

leaning message. than the Washington Post,

12:04

but the Washington Post now, I

12:06

don't know what the fuck is

12:08

going on with them and Japanese.

12:10

Well, they just had a big,

12:12

yeah, shift. I mean, they went

12:14

super woke, too, like the New

12:16

York Times. It's a generational thing,

12:18

you know, a certain, Calgary. You

12:20

think the Washington Post went super

12:22

woke? Oh. I gotta give you

12:24

my book that came out last

12:26

year. I was on your show,

12:28

remember? You gave me a copy

12:30

of it. Okay, well, well, there's

12:32

a, there's a really funny one,

12:34

there's a really funny one in

12:36

there's a really funny one in

12:38

there about... The story in the

12:40

Washington Post, there was a Dave

12:42

Weigel, I think, is his name.

12:44

One of the star reporters. I

12:46

think he's somewhere else now. Very

12:48

respected guy. And he tweeted something

12:50

that was so benign. I think

12:52

it was all women are polar.

12:54

You just have to find out

12:56

whether it's bi or sexual. Oh

12:58

no. What? No. All women are...

13:00

Why? You just have to figure

13:02

out if it's polar or sexual.

13:04

Something like that. That makes more

13:06

sense. I'm making... You're high. I'm

13:08

fucking, I'm high. Anyway, it was

13:10

benign. I thought, it was benign.

13:12

I thought, it was just somebody...

13:14

It was just, it's just a

13:16

joke for Christ's sake, get over

13:18

it. The insanity that went through

13:21

the newsroom, and we did the

13:23

thing on it, it's in the

13:25

book. It's just hysterical, it's hysterical

13:27

hysterical. I mean, I hardly had

13:29

to embellical. I hardly had to

13:31

embellish, I had to embellish, but...

13:33

Like there was a reporter who

13:35

was just, but shall we say,

13:37

a lot. And she went ape

13:39

shit about this. And of course,

13:41

nothing can be done behind closed

13:43

doors. Everything had to be done

13:45

on Twitter. And so, you know,

13:47

he was let go and then

13:49

somebody else joined the Twitter fight

13:51

on his behalf and that he

13:53

was the person who had to

13:55

be like, it was like the

13:57

fact that this fucking kindergarten went

13:59

ape shit over this silly. little

14:01

joke on Twitter. So please, the

14:03

question, do you think they've changed?

14:05

Yes, they have. Well, two things.

14:07

I wouldn't know about what you're

14:09

talking about. Joking is kind of

14:11

my story. Read the piece. Yeah,

14:13

but I get it. But I

14:15

mean, I'm talking about the content

14:17

in the post. I understand. I

14:19

agree with you on the fallout.

14:21

I think it's ridiculous. But on

14:23

the contents, at least the people

14:25

who are writing for the New

14:27

York, the Washington Post. I think

14:29

that they are really good journalists

14:31

and they tend not to be

14:33

as biased or as left. But

14:35

there are some for the New

14:37

York Times too. Yeah, but what

14:39

you're talking about is ridiculous. And

14:41

I think, look, that's the reason

14:43

I think that Democrats are in

14:45

the place that they're in now

14:47

is because of shit like that.

14:49

And because they get rid of

14:51

their strongest allies for some stupid

14:53

thing that no one is perfect.

14:55

Look at Al Franken. It was

14:57

the dumbest thing that I've ever

14:59

seen. you know, filling in the

15:01

dot for Christian Gillibrand because she

15:03

did that into such, you know,

15:05

virtue signaling. Don, I'm sure if

15:07

you had a nickel for every

15:09

time someone's hand twisted down your

15:11

waist, when you were taking a

15:13

picture with them, you'd be a

15:15

very rich man. I'm just guessing.

15:17

I would. I've been harassed by

15:19

women and men in the work

15:21

and some things are not even,

15:23

it's just... Ridiculous. Now look, tell

15:25

us I'm very interested. There are

15:27

some things that are... No, no,

15:29

no, I'm interested in this. There

15:31

are some things that are really

15:33

egregious, right? And that, but not,

15:35

but not everything is Harvey Weinstein

15:37

level. No. That's great. And then

15:39

some of the, right, that's a

15:41

whole different story. I'm not talking

15:43

about that. And I'm not saying

15:45

it makes it right. Tweak my

15:47

nipples and said, oh, it's cold

15:49

in here. And I said, okay,

15:51

you realize if I did that,

15:53

they'd be walking me out the

15:55

door right now, but I didn't,

15:57

I didn't care to go to

15:59

HR. say anything because I was

16:01

just like it's a double standard.

16:03

Good for you. And also, but

16:05

I've never told this story as

16:07

well, someone who I worked with

16:09

also harassed me at CNN and

16:12

I never went to management. First of all,

16:14

I was so mad or a woman and

16:16

she knew I was gay. And it was

16:18

just bizarre. She was going through a

16:21

divorce. It was just weird. And I

16:23

never went to management. First of all, I

16:25

thought like, okay, they may find a way

16:27

to get rid of me because. If I

16:30

tell this story, I don't know if they're

16:32

going to believe me or not. But then

16:34

she's so mean to me after that. I

16:36

said, I should have told the story. But

16:39

yeah, I've been harassed by men and women.

16:41

But what constituted this harassment?

16:43

Like, what did she physically, like in

16:45

the office, like come in and twirl

16:47

for me, Don? It wasn't a twirl

16:49

for me, but it was not in

16:51

the office, but yeah. It's all, I

16:53

won't go that far. So you had

16:55

to be with her in certain business

16:57

occasions, but outside the office, I got

16:59

a cocktail party, places like

17:01

that. No, I know, because like

17:04

in our business and media, there's

17:06

a lot of cocktail parties, there's

17:08

a lot of assholes. A lot

17:10

of cocktail parties, and remember, this

17:12

was a while ago, and there

17:14

was not Uber, anything like that,

17:16

and if you are in Atlanta,

17:18

the taxis aren't available. And so,

17:20

you know, you say, hey, you know, I'm gonna,

17:22

uh... We've had a couple of drinks

17:24

and do you mind if I like,

17:26

you know, or whatever? No, no, no,

17:28

don't go home, stay in the guest

17:30

room, that sort of thing. So, yeah.

17:32

The guest room? Yeah. Oh, you were at somebody

17:35

staying at somebody's house.

17:37

Right. Well, I mean, look, let me

17:39

go back to the cocktail

17:41

party because something very important

17:43

about those kind of cocktail

17:45

parties. Yeah. They serve these

17:47

garlicky or derivatives. Yeah. And

17:49

people have the worst sort

17:51

of breath. male reporters and they

17:53

pin you to the wall and

17:56

they're talking to you and their

17:58

breath stinks. If someone was... sexually

18:00

harassing me with that breath I would

18:02

definitely go to HR but if they

18:04

did not have the garlicky breath I

18:06

would let the nipple tweaking go that's

18:08

just where I draw the line we

18:11

had that just shows that we're all

18:13

individuals we're all individuals and I'm an

18:15

adult and look maybe it's I think

18:17

it is different for men and women

18:19

you know depending on the power

18:21

structure and that sort of thing

18:23

I wish I had been harassed

18:25

this much quite well I think

18:27

it's flattering as long as you

18:29

can Offend them off easily. Yes.

18:31

I know as a man I

18:33

could say no I'm not interested

18:35

or just right but also as

18:38

someone is it look as

18:40

someone who was molested

18:42

as a child for you were yeah

18:44

oh so for me it is

18:46

a horrible different thing I know

18:48

how I know how to share

18:50

must be very triggering well

18:53

yes and no Because you know

18:55

how to deal with it and you know

18:57

what's really important or not and you know

18:59

like who has the power I figure as

19:01

a man I have the power to say

19:03

I don't want to do this and you're

19:06

and you're bigger and stronger. Yes I don't

19:08

need to go to HR or in your

19:10

career I just tell you I'm not interested

19:12

in this you were drunk we had a

19:14

couple drinks or whatever let's let's let it's

19:17

quite frankly yeah whether it's you

19:19

know who whoever it is, but

19:21

some people have, but in many

19:23

ways, in many times, most times

19:25

it's legitimate, but there are times

19:27

that it's not. I think it's

19:30

a little bit more. I mean,

19:32

look, I can't relate to that.

19:34

I'm almost the opposite. I remember

19:36

the first time I was lucky

19:38

enough to say to my friend, what

19:40

does it mean when a girl grabs

19:42

your dick? You know, that to me

19:45

was like, oh, I've really arrived, I've

19:47

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19:49

A man. Whose name is? I can't

19:51

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Text random to 511-511 today.

23:27

Message and data rates may

23:29

apply. We were at a

23:32

restaurant and they were drinking. They're

23:34

like, oh my God, look at you,

23:36

you've lost weight, you look so hot.

23:38

And I was like, whoa, and there

23:40

were people around me, they're

23:42

like, what the fuck just happened?

23:44

Yeah. The guy was drunk. And

23:46

I just said, okay, he's drunk.

23:48

a lot to men, more often to

23:50

men I think than people realize.

23:53

Yeah. Oh, from your lips to God's

23:55

ears. But, you know, again, I pray

23:57

for this to get to return. say

24:00

this because this world of cancellation I

24:02

don't know I'm not a woman so

24:04

I don't know how it feels to

24:06

be a woman and that happens to

24:08

a woman I'm not a woman and

24:10

I do know how it feels awful

24:12

of course how could it not I

24:15

know I know I'm not I'm not

24:17

going to speak for women in this

24:19

situation I can only I will I

24:21

will totally for women and it's just

24:23

terrible it's not hard to imagine because

24:25

they are I know because we have

24:27

to pretend differently with gender stuff these

24:30

days that we're all kind of the

24:32

same we're smaller generally weaker generally. This

24:34

is not a criticism of it's just

24:36

science it's just biology and so you

24:38

just feel the same way I think

24:40

we're saying the same thing if a

24:42

six if richer was trying to reach

24:45

around to me I would be like

24:47

oh I'm powerless against this might be

24:49

a different story for me but no

24:51

we're saying the same thing I'm just

24:53

saying I don't want to speak for

24:55

women I can't imagine how awful it

24:57

is for a woman I'm not so

24:59

no it's terrible for a man too

25:02

I mean look look they say that

25:04

because of prison oh I know I

25:06

don't want to mess up that statistics

25:08

but if you asked the person in

25:10

the street you know who do you

25:12

think it's raped the most men or

25:14

women they would and maybe it is

25:17

women and maybe it's by 10 to

25:19

1 I don't know women get raped

25:21

the most okay but like because of

25:23

prison I believe in facts I think

25:25

yes I do too that's why I

25:27

said I don't have them but because

25:29

of prison Like it's not as one-sided

25:32

as you think Yeah, right? So it's

25:34

not like men don't get raped. It's

25:36

just That's where it happens and why

25:38

we allow that I mean what you

25:40

think we could control prison You know

25:42

why it why is something like that

25:44

such a? They just accepted you know

25:46

like well if you go in there

25:49

you're gonna you know, you know, you're

25:51

gonna you know, you're probably happens I

25:53

think that's sort of a I

25:57

think that's sort of a myth

25:59

that people have. I'm not saying

26:01

it doesn't. happen in prison but

26:03

as often as it you know

26:05

people would like to believe that

26:07

it happened in prison but also

26:09

on the other end it's men

26:11

men are dogs are horny right

26:13

yes some prison sex is certainly

26:15

consensual yeah but I'm sure all

26:17

of that happens but I mean

26:19

It's a weird conversation we're having.

26:22

I never thought I'd be talking

26:24

to Bill Maher about. This is,

26:26

uh, present sex. I play the

26:28

long game. This is just my

26:30

way of tweaking your nipples, but

26:32

I'm just not, I'm just, I

26:34

just do it verbally. No. We've

26:36

seen Oz, you've seen Oz, right?

26:38

Yes. Oh, Oz scared the shit

26:40

out of me. Why? You're afraid

26:42

someone was gonna prison rape here?

26:44

You're not in prison? It was

26:46

just a... People don't remember, this

26:48

is HBO like 20 years ago,

26:50

before streaming and all that. His

26:52

name is on JK Simmons? No,

26:54

JK Simmons. Was the Nazi in

26:56

prison? And the guy who's, why

26:59

can I think of his name

27:01

on law and order? Yes, absolutely.

27:03

Yes, absolutely. Him. And that guy.

27:05

He was the, he was the

27:07

holly man. And he also does

27:09

the commercial where his face is

27:11

always the bottom of a car

27:13

getting beat up. No, that's the

27:15

other guy. Oh, that's the other

27:17

guy. That's the other guy who

27:19

does the mayhem guy on the

27:21

commercial. Yes. I'm talking about Chris,

27:23

whatever his name is from... Oh,

27:25

yes, Chris Maloney. Chris Maloney. Yes.

27:27

Chris Maloney was the main character.

27:29

Right, Dean, the other guy. Yeah.

27:31

Yeah, there was a show that

27:33

like so many HBO shows spawned,

27:36

you know, a lot of big

27:38

talent. Yeah, it's a good show.

27:40

But Chris Maloney was already on

27:42

law and order SBU and was

27:44

very famous. I think this is

27:46

sort of a side gig for

27:48

him. But I tell you why

27:50

it was scary, Don, because of

27:52

course they have to have the

27:54

character through whom we can see

27:56

ourselves as the regular person. So

27:58

do you remember? Who were we

28:00

all? We were beecher. He was

28:02

this guy who went to prison

28:04

because he had a few too

28:06

many drinks one night and hit...

28:08

a little girl with his car.

28:10

Okay? So you can go to

28:13

prison for that. That's manslaughter. Okay?

28:15

But he's just like a regular

28:17

normal guy. I never thought of

28:19

himself. So that's who we all

28:21

sit. That's us. And so in

28:23

the first episode, the Nazi Jay

28:25

K. Simmons, who I still can't

28:27

get past that when I see

28:29

him, he pretends to befriend Beecher.

28:31

And he says, you know, it's

28:33

okay. come in myself, I'll protect

28:35

you. And then of course, cut

28:37

to, he's tattooing a swastika into

28:39

his ass, into Beecher's ass. So

28:41

not good. And you made more

28:43

attention to that than I did,

28:45

but go on. I did what?

28:47

You paid more attention to that

28:49

than I watched. I don't remember

28:52

all those things. I just remember

28:54

that there was a lot of.

28:56

So you've seen more men's asses

28:58

than I have, but when I

29:00

see- I'm not sure about that,

29:02

Bill, right now, that you're talking

29:04

about- I've seen none, except mine.

29:06

When I see a guy who's

29:08

like, he burnt something with a

29:10

match, and so it was, he

29:12

could, yes, he tattooed a swastika

29:14

into his ass cheek. So yes,

29:16

that did stay with me. Yeah,

29:18

but stay with you, you were,

29:20

you weren't word someone was gonna

29:22

do that to do that to

29:24

you, right? There's going to hit

29:26

us in 2032. They say there's

29:29

a one or two percent chance.

29:31

I'm not worried about it, but

29:33

it could happen. I mean, the

29:35

common could happen and somebody could

29:37

frame me and I'm there with

29:39

a swastika on my ass. It's

29:41

not even the ass part. Maybe

29:43

I should light up a joint.

29:45

Come here, Bill. Really? Oh, it

29:47

was something so important that I

29:49

wanted to... You wanted to talk

29:51

about... You were talking about the

29:53

possibility of that happening in men

29:55

and... But that was way off

29:57

the, that was off the beaten

29:59

path. This is crazy. I never

30:01

thought I'd be having this conversation.

30:03

Well, you know, that's the joy

30:06

at all, but along with you.

30:08

That's the joy of this podcast.

30:10

It is all conversations you never

30:12

thought you'd be having, because in

30:14

real life, do you plan your

30:16

conversations? No. You're saying my philosophy

30:18

that happens and people. You know,

30:20

often when you're just having a

30:22

real conversation, you say things that

30:24

are brilliant sometimes, and you say

30:26

things that are stupid, and that's

30:28

the whole point of a conversation.

30:30

But somehow we have- Mayor and

30:32

people in general. Just people in

30:34

general. Right, right, right. But somehow

30:36

we have forgotten that I feel

30:38

that that's what television should be

30:40

like. that you said television can

30:43

never be that way because I

30:45

wouldn't even try to do it

30:47

on my show because I could

30:49

it's boring for the audience to

30:51

go through all that it's just

30:53

it just isn't believe me if

30:55

anyone knows I think it's me

30:57

I try to make real time

30:59

as real as you can in

31:01

that setting it's just not this

31:03

first of all I'm not high

31:05

believe me I'm talking about real

31:07

time ever no that would be

31:09

a disaster I mean I have

31:11

You know, Senator Tester on Friday

31:13

night, I'm not going to get

31:15

high with him. Couple cocktails? No.

31:17

No, I mean, Don, I'm almost

31:20

70. You can't, like, drink. I

31:22

mean, I'm drinking tonight. Okay, so,

31:24

already I'm going to shit. No,

31:26

you just can't drink a lot.

31:28

I say, but, like, for this.

31:30

I do enjoy drinking, but, you

31:32

know, you just can't. Every one.

31:34

two hours later I would do

31:36

a show I didn't feel like

31:38

I was drunk but the conversations

31:40

were really good. Yes, oh absolutely

31:42

I mean look the history of

31:44

drugs of all kinds improving art

31:46

yeah that's why they do it.

31:48

That's an LSD was for us

31:50

in mind expanding. Yeah I mean

31:52

if I had been lucky enough

31:54

to get a message that resonated

31:57

with me when I was 20

31:59

and starting to smoke, it would

32:01

have been, hey kid, cigarettes, they

32:03

don't get you anything. They don't

32:05

make you smarter. But you know,

32:07

I pot, yes. I mean, LSD,

32:09

my record collection would be very

32:11

different without it. Even heroin. I

32:13

wouldn't do it. I wouldn't recommend

32:15

it. But you know, it would

32:17

be Miles Davis. Not without it.

32:19

Yeah, you know, why is music

32:21

so good when you're high? Because

32:23

it was made when they were

32:25

high. Partless. No, no, it's just

32:27

it works. It works both ways,

32:29

you know, it's just we'd like

32:31

drugs for a reason. They work,

32:34

okay? It's just that there is

32:36

a downside and it's very hard

32:38

to convince people when you're in

32:40

your 20s when your body is

32:42

so strong that you can come

32:44

back from anything. It's just hard

32:46

to convince you. That, oh, you

32:48

know what? Think about when you're...

32:50

Yeah, I'll never be that. And

32:52

now I have that. And I

32:54

wish I had thought about it

32:56

then, but, you know, that's youth

32:58

versus age. Well, I think, Bill,

33:00

you know, I'm going to disagree

33:02

with you on. I think that

33:04

we can have conversations like that

33:06

on television. I think it's... Like,

33:08

what happened now? Never. Well... I

33:11

think that's the reason that there

33:13

that linear television is on the

33:15

decline is because people are craving

33:17

that real and they're not giving

33:19

the people what they want just

33:21

it just moved to a different

33:23

place it's a different your shows

33:25

on YouTube it's a different mechanism

33:27

it's the same thing though it's

33:29

a smaller screen watch you on

33:31

YouTube then watch you on CNN

33:33

I think now I think they

33:35

do know the answer to that

33:37

question I think You know in

33:39

my early days on CNN I

33:41

would say more people watch me

33:43

on CNN. And then also when

33:45

I was there it was different

33:47

time. I think more people watch

33:50

me on CNN. I don't know.

33:52

I think more people watch me

33:54

now. But I think the highest

33:56

point of CNN was during COVID

33:58

and we had COVID and... George

34:00

Floyd at the same time and Donald Trump and

34:02

that was the height that was the highest ratings

34:04

the most profitable of CNN and so it was

34:07

amazing to be there people watched every night right

34:09

and they sort of relied on us because you

34:11

were stuck in your home and you had nothing

34:13

else I bet you more people see you now

34:16

more to you're right and more people see me

34:18

now and more people recognize there's lots of stories

34:20

I can't think of any specifically right now,

34:22

but about, like for example, streaming versus

34:24

the theater and directors. Maybe Martin's course

34:26

says he said this, I don't know,

34:29

but somebody like that. And one of

34:31

their movies, maybe it was the Irishman,

34:33

maybe this is just, I'm making that

34:35

up, but I've heard this story about

34:37

movies from directors before who said, you

34:39

know, this movie I made and I

34:41

fought it to go to streaming and

34:43

it went to streaming and 20 times

34:45

more people saw it than would have

34:47

in the theater. Yeah. You know, it's

34:50

just, I'm that person, like, I see

34:52

all the movies in my bed. Why

34:54

wouldn't I? Unless I have to see

34:56

something like the next day, which only

34:58

rarely happens, or there's like a reason

35:00

maybe for my, we want to comment

35:02

on it on the show, I would

35:04

go to a theater, but I think

35:06

the last movie I saw in the

35:08

theater was Barbie. I didn't even

35:11

see that. I can't remember the

35:13

last time. Unless I go to

35:15

an opening like a friend or

35:18

someone, some group invites me to

35:20

come to an opening house.

35:22

I mean, I just watched

35:24

the Dylan movie. What's it?

35:26

No direction. A complete unknown.

35:28

Yeah. I just watched that. With

35:30

Shalene. In my bed. Yeah. Which

35:32

is what I agree with you. Yeah.

35:35

So I look, I don't pay

35:37

attention as much because... I'm used to

35:39

people going, oh Don Lemon, hey

35:41

CNN guy, whatever. My husband says

35:44

Don. More people recognize you now

35:46

than when you're on CNN. I'm

35:48

like, really? Yes. But no, that's

35:50

a crime. But also not just

35:53

because of, you know, the podcast

35:55

or whatever, the streaming show, but

35:57

because of social media. And

35:59

my... Pledge to myself someone asked me

36:02

like, you know, what is your purpose?

36:04

And I said my purpose as my

36:06

professional purpose is to meet the audience

36:08

where they are and the audience is not

36:11

On cable the audience is on

36:13

social media and it's on digital and

36:15

on YouTube and those kinds of

36:17

places twitch or whatever and that's

36:19

where I'm meeting the audience is success

36:21

with it. People think I'm nuts some

36:23

of the things I do on social

36:26

media. Yeah, you're a little crazier than

36:28

you're wacky things I do things that

36:30

are... Man in the street kind of

36:32

stuff. I do, well I do man

36:34

on the street, every single journalist has

36:37

done man on the streets and that's

36:39

where the real, that's where you, you

36:41

want to be where the people are,

36:43

you want to know what they're saying.

36:45

I love the people Don. No, seriously,

36:47

you do. And if people who are

36:50

sitting in studios, you know, you

36:52

know, on a nightly basis in

36:54

talking to people with suits on

36:56

and ties or cocktail dresses about,

36:58

they're not, they're not, Tell me

37:00

about it. Especially if it's

37:02

a Republican event. Those are

37:05

the titty twisters. Especially if it's

37:07

a Republican event. What? Oh

37:09

my gosh, Republicans are so

37:11

repressed to the guys. They're

37:14

always... If there's a Republican

37:16

event or a convention, I

37:18

try to stay in my hotel room.

37:20

Because they hit on you more? 150

37:22

percent. Yes. You measured it.

37:24

I'm just joking. I'm joking

37:26

with it. So the Republicans

37:29

hit on you more. This

37:31

is so interesting. I mean, I'm

37:33

not surprised. You know, I

37:35

used to do this gig every

37:38

year in Hawaii, 12 years,

37:40

New Year's Eve. It's the

37:42

best. And the promoter of

37:44

the event was a gay

37:46

man. I mean, I love this

37:48

guy. We worked together for 12

37:51

years. I miss him. It does

37:53

a lot of other shows. We

37:55

stayed at the Four Seasons

37:57

in Maui. Beautiful.

38:00

love that place. And

38:02

he said grinder was

38:04

very active with the

38:06

bathroom in the lobby and

38:08

I'm like who is that?

38:10

And he said married men

38:13

whose wife had a massage

38:15

that day and fell asleep

38:17

in the room and they

38:19

cut down and hook up

38:22

with guys. Wow. That

38:24

never happened to me

38:26

there. But I'm not surprised.

38:28

Grinder, by the way,

38:30

crashes during the Republican

38:32

convention. You know, where have you been?

38:35

Are you kidding me? You don't know

38:37

this? No. Are you serious? No, I'm

38:39

not in that world. Why would

38:41

I know that? Well, I mean,

38:43

it's just been reported, like, it's

38:45

a thing, people know. I mean,

38:47

I think it's because they're so

38:49

repressed, and they can't, because they

38:51

can't be themselves, because they, you

38:53

know, kind of have this whole

38:55

thing, right? Do you know Baccari

38:58

Sellers? Sure. So Baccari Sellers

39:00

is a friend. And on

39:02

inauguration night 2017, Baccari

39:04

says, let's go to the Trump

39:06

Hotel. And I said, are you kidding

39:09

me? No way, I'm not going there.

39:11

And he said, why? They're not going

39:13

to I'll not go on there. And

39:15

he said, why? They're not going to

39:18

out. I'll kick their ass. So so

39:20

much rage inside of this body. I

39:22

will kick their ass. And he said,

39:24

why. You gay guys, you want

39:26

every straight guy to begin? I'm

39:29

like, no. And he said, come with

39:31

me. I was like, okay. So

39:33

I go, everyone's buying me drinks,

39:35

Don Lemon is here, blah, blah,

39:37

blah. And then all of these guys

39:39

are over talking to me and

39:42

sort of rubbing up against me

39:44

and whatever. And Bakari's like,

39:46

oh my God. You're right, I have

39:48

no idea. He had no idea. And

39:50

it's, I don't think they're doing it

39:53

to... gay men who they know because

39:55

they know that they're gay and so

39:57

they're shooting their shot. I hate to

39:59

say that. It's a true. No, and

40:01

that really doesn't surprise me. But

40:03

I do think that the idea that

40:05

you would go over there, even if

40:08

it was, this was a Trump. The

40:10

Trump hotel on inauguration night, yeah, it

40:12

was a Trump crowd. Okay. The idea

40:14

that they would be hostile, I mean,

40:17

I know a lot of MAGA people.

40:19

One person was hostile. Right. See, let

40:21

me ask you your opinion on

40:23

this. Saturday Night Live, 50th anniversary

40:25

show. They did one thing. There

40:27

is a sketch where Tom Hanks

40:29

puts on a magga hat, so

40:31

he's a crumper, and then Keenan

40:33

comes over to shake his hand, and

40:36

he won't shake his hand. And I

40:38

said this on for Reed show the

40:40

other day. I found that so old.

40:42

You know, I didn't vote for him.

40:44

I get all the bad

40:46

things about that administration, but

40:48

if you think they don't

40:50

shake black people's hands, it's

40:52

just... You're wrong. That's not who

40:55

they are. Matt Gates shakes black

40:57

people's hands. You know, Kid Rock

40:59

will shake your hand. It's just,

41:01

it's just, it's just too, it's

41:03

just not helpful to like think

41:05

that half the country, that's where

41:07

they are. That's your step. You're

41:09

a comedian, you know, it's part

41:11

of its comedy. I understand it.

41:13

Let's be honest. There's a huge

41:15

faction of the MAGa movement that's

41:18

really fucking racist. I wouldn't

41:20

say huge, no. I would say

41:22

huge. Yeah, okay. Well, we

41:24

have different perspectives. I would

41:26

say huge. Yeah, but and

41:28

even if they're not, you

41:31

have to overlook a lot

41:33

of that in order to

41:35

support Donald Trump, which

41:37

I think is maybe even more

41:39

egregious than just saying

41:42

I'm a racist. So what do

41:44

you think is the worst? I

41:46

mean, to me, like the most

41:48

egregious thing. Because it just seems

41:50

so like, and then of course the

41:53

Obama birth certificate, which you mean with

41:55

Donald Trump, what's the most egregious, yeah,

41:57

I mean he sued me, Trump did.

46:10

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47:31

When it comes it comes to is

47:33

believing. believing. Chevy That's why Chevy

47:35

Trucks camera Technology offers up

47:38

to to eight of what

1:00:13

he thinks. Yeah. And he doesn't

1:00:15

care if you don't like it.

1:00:17

Kanye. I mean, that is, to

1:00:19

me, that's his performance art. He

1:00:21

is at the very edge of

1:00:24

that, like, I dare you to completely

1:00:26

destroy me. I'm just going

1:00:28

to say, I don't know if

1:00:30

he even believes that shit about

1:00:32

Hitler, but it's more the fact

1:00:35

that I will say it than

1:00:37

what he's saying. If there was

1:00:39

something else that was more egregious,

1:00:42

I think he would say that.

1:00:44

But he found that thing,

1:00:46

and that's his litmus test.

1:00:48

And there's, he will always have

1:00:50

fans. Okay. So, you're right,

1:00:52

he will always have fans,

1:00:54

but my question is why. Why

1:00:56

be... Because why be an

1:00:58

anti-Semite? Well, I just explained

1:01:01

why. Not because I don't think he

1:01:03

really cares that much about it.

1:01:05

But because it's a way to

1:01:07

demonstrate, you cannot intimidate me

1:01:10

into not saying anything. I think

1:01:12

it is, I don't think it's

1:01:14

that. I think when people do

1:01:16

that, it's the shortest line to

1:01:19

the front of either promotion. And

1:01:21

whatever sense it is, it could be

1:01:23

promoting a product, it could be promoting

1:01:25

themselves, and you are doing something that

1:01:28

is out of the box to get

1:01:30

attention just for the sake of getting

1:01:32

attention or just for the sake of

1:01:34

pure ambition. Where the same thing that I, when

1:01:37

I see, not all black Republicans,

1:01:39

but I see a black magga person

1:01:41

who is carrying Donald Trump's water and

1:01:43

they know that he's lying, it is

1:01:45

the shortest line to the front. Because

1:01:47

if you're black and you're whatever, any of

1:01:49

you, you're just in line with a bunch

1:01:51

of other Democrats that are doing the same

1:01:53

thing that you're doing. But if you become

1:01:55

a black magga person, it's like, whoa, let's

1:01:57

book this person, let's put them on television.

1:01:59

I think you can be a sincere

1:02:02

black Maga person. No, I just

1:02:04

said, I don't think that, I just

1:02:06

said I think there can

1:02:08

be sincere Republicans. But you

1:02:10

can't be a sincere black Republican?

1:02:13

I don't think that you can

1:02:15

be a rational Maga person. I

1:02:17

think you can be black and

1:02:19

be a Republican. I think they

1:02:22

would find that very insulting. Well,

1:02:24

I mean, the truth is often

1:02:26

insulting. That's true too. Yeah.

1:02:28

Yeah, I wouldn't say that, because

1:02:30

there are cases to be

1:02:32

made that they're making. I

1:02:34

never would go all the way to Donald

1:02:37

Trump, because he does

1:02:39

not concede elections. That's my

1:02:41

biggest issue with him. So,

1:02:43

like, the Republican types would

1:02:45

think, oh, someday Bill Morris,

1:02:47

no, no, Bill Marxists are

1:02:49

always going to be where

1:02:51

Bill Morris always been. I

1:02:54

mean, if you change enough,

1:02:56

yeah, you could, you're going

1:02:58

in the wrong direction. But,

1:03:00

you know, I think 20% of

1:03:02

black men voted for Trump.

1:03:04

Well, I think that's okay,

1:03:06

that 20% of black men voted for

1:03:09

Trump. Can't they just think differently? Can't

1:03:11

people just have different... Like you're informed

1:03:13

about everything? Like you don't think anything

1:03:16

you have this. I don't think you're

1:03:18

hearing me. I said that I believe

1:03:20

that black people can be Republicans. Remember,

1:03:22

there were lots of Republicans, Frederick Douglas.

1:03:25

It was different in those areas. It

1:03:27

was different in those areas. I was

1:03:29

a Republican, by the way. But I

1:03:32

started it. Is the Republican? Yes. But

1:03:34

so I think that a lot of

1:03:36

what MAG does is irrational and it's often

1:03:38

based in... Lies and it's not factual.

1:03:41

It's people that you said you

1:03:43

don't like people who are who

1:03:45

deny elections who deny instructions or

1:03:47

whatever So that's the magga party

1:03:49

that is the magga party. I'm

1:03:52

not saying that's all Republican. So

1:03:54

for a person of color a black person

1:03:56

To you know lend their to believe you

1:03:58

know in that when it is based in

1:04:00

irrationality and a lot of it

1:04:03

is based in racism. For me,

1:04:05

I have lots of questions about

1:04:07

that. I don't question black republics.

1:04:10

I'm going to let me, I mean,

1:04:12

do you talk to people like that?

1:04:14

Like I had Byron Donald on

1:04:16

my show, maybe two weeks ago. I

1:04:18

got to my office today and it

1:04:20

was a lovely pin that he had

1:04:22

sent me. It had his name on

1:04:24

it, an American eagle, and you know.

1:04:27

I liked Byron. I like Byron. I'm

1:04:29

just, you know, I just can't,

1:04:31

I just can't live in this

1:04:34

country where I hate half the

1:04:36

people who, yes, think fundamentally differently

1:04:38

about a lot of things. I've

1:04:41

said this here before. We

1:04:43

have to be able to get to

1:04:45

this point where you can say to

1:04:47

somebody who you agree with A, B,

1:04:49

C, D, but E, whoa, how can they

1:04:51

believe in E if we both believe in

1:04:53

A, B, C, and D? And it is

1:04:56

a conodrum. But it does happen

1:04:58

in human nature. And you just

1:05:00

have to be able to go,

1:05:02

okay, we just, we have different

1:05:04

upbringings, different influences in our life,

1:05:06

different, I don't know, metabolism, different,

1:05:08

just, we're just different, and we're

1:05:10

just different, and we come to

1:05:12

different conclusions. I understand that bill.

1:05:14

And it can't be so... But

1:05:16

it doesn't be, because I am,

1:05:18

because I can see what is

1:05:20

happening and I live in reality,

1:05:23

it doesn't mean that I live

1:05:25

in reality. Right. But I

1:05:27

understand that magga is based

1:05:29

on the you were not born in

1:05:32

this country. Magga is based

1:05:34

on Mexicans or rapists. Maga

1:05:37

is based on that Donald

1:05:39

Trump did not inspire an

1:05:41

election. Maga is based on Donald

1:05:43

Trump didn't try to overturn an

1:05:46

election. Donald Trump, they don't believe

1:05:48

that he was found guilty and

1:05:50

a court of law. So they're

1:05:52

built, it's built on lies. So

1:05:54

that's why, that's why I question

1:05:57

that, to understand and to be

1:05:59

able to... see through that it,

1:06:01

it doesn't mean that you hate

1:06:03

people, it just means that you're

1:06:05

being rational and logical. As I

1:06:07

said, I think they're black Republicans,

1:06:09

I was one, I think that's all fine,

1:06:11

but I think that MAGA is, I

1:06:14

think it's, you know, it's problematic and

1:06:16

it's based on lies and racism.

1:06:18

And that doesn't mean I hate those

1:06:20

people, I actually kind of feel sorry

1:06:22

for them. Yeah, I mean, it's not

1:06:24

untrue, there is racism in it, and there's

1:06:27

certainly a lot of lies. So

1:06:29

what do you do in the morning,

1:06:31

John? Are you an early riser? It's

1:06:33

time for our cooking segment. I don't

1:06:35

know if you know this, but I

1:06:37

make a mean omelet that I think

1:06:39

you're... Moving on. No, tell me about

1:06:41

your day. I'm not a morning person.

1:06:43

Me neither. I hate the morning. I

1:06:45

hate waking up in them. I like

1:06:48

to wake up in the afternoon. I'm

1:06:50

like, I like to rise to the

1:06:52

afternoon. I like to rise at the

1:06:54

crack of noon. My father used to

1:06:56

say that. Usually I like to rise

1:06:58

at about 11, maybe 10, but 11.

1:07:00

Because I am a night owl. Exactly what

1:07:02

I do. Right. But now, because I want

1:07:04

people to be informed about what's happening, I

1:07:07

think we have to have an informed electorate.

1:07:09

I wake up at like eight. a 30.

1:07:11

I do a live 10 o'clock show on

1:07:14

YouTube to Don Lemon show every day. I

1:07:16

do a live show live stream. Why is

1:07:18

it going to be so early? 10

1:07:20

a.m. Because most people are

1:07:22

starting their day and are going

1:07:25

about their day and I think

1:07:27

they need to be informed and

1:07:29

I think that there is a need

1:07:31

for content there and

1:07:33

for people to understand

1:07:35

what was happening. And I don't

1:07:37

think anyone was fulfilling that. And so lucky I

1:07:40

only have to show up in makeup once a

1:07:42

week at four o'clock on Friday after. Well, I

1:07:44

used to have to show up in makeup at

1:07:46

nine o'clock Eastern every night and that's it and

1:07:48

then go on at ten. But I mean, that's

1:07:51

fulfilling for you. That was fulfilling to me

1:07:53

at the moment. But this is what's fulfilling to me

1:07:55

now. And I do a live stream or a live

1:07:57

show every day at five Eastern as well. I do

1:07:59

two. live shows a day working for you.

1:08:01

I'm glad you all came out in the

1:08:04

wash for you. No, because for a while

1:08:06

there, like CNN, there was just

1:08:08

lots of, it's amazing how much

1:08:10

they cover what goes on at

1:08:12

CNN and MSNBC, considering that their

1:08:14

ratings are not exactly through the

1:08:16

roof. But I mean... It's a

1:08:18

good point. But, you know, it's the

1:08:20

media. The media loves the media. But

1:08:23

we heard everything about you and Chris

1:08:25

Cuomo, you know, it was just always

1:08:27

this stern and drunk and it's being

1:08:29

taken over by this guy and this

1:08:31

guy and he was fired. We got

1:08:33

to get C&N is such an online

1:08:35

C&N. They re-show my show and I'm

1:08:37

thrilled about it. But that's one thing

1:08:39

that's also, when people do that, that's

1:08:41

a sign of your relevance. Where you

1:08:43

are in the culture. Right. And so

1:08:45

you don't hear that much anymore, do

1:08:47

you? Well, yeah, I mean, they definitely

1:08:50

have to find their footing again.

1:08:52

I think the guy that got

1:08:54

there now is heading in the

1:08:56

right direction. And I mean, Don,

1:08:58

when they said to me, we want

1:09:00

to put your show on CNN,

1:09:03

I said, what about all the

1:09:05

fuck? And they don't care. And

1:09:07

I'm like, they don't care. CNN?

1:09:09

I'm like, wow. Do they beep

1:09:11

it? This, no! Oh, I, wow.

1:09:13

I'm like, this world has changed.

1:09:15

When I first went on the

1:09:17

Tonight Show, you couldn't say

1:09:19

ass. And now you can say

1:09:21

fuck on CNN. I mean, I

1:09:23

try to keep the, keep the

1:09:26

cunts to the minimum. I mean,

1:09:28

I'm not an unreasonable, I'm not

1:09:30

an unreasonable man. You know, it's

1:09:32

a word that I would never

1:09:34

even think of saying. I think

1:09:36

the gays should take it over.

1:09:38

It's hard for us to do

1:09:40

that because the gays love women.

1:09:42

I know. Yeah, but the British use it

1:09:45

in a way that isn't demeaning.

1:09:47

You know? Yeah, but it's different.

1:09:49

The British press, they have a

1:09:51

different sense of everything. But like,

1:09:53

couldn't we call the asshole like

1:09:56

demand or something and it would

1:09:58

be kind of fun? Or I

1:10:00

want to get in that month tonight, you

1:10:02

know, I mean it could also be

1:10:05

sexy. That's what I'm saying. No,

1:10:07

that's gross. I don't think that

1:10:09

would appeal to any. You're turning

1:10:11

red and you're a black man.

1:10:13

Rust, rust, it's unbelievable. We have

1:10:15

a word for that. The gays

1:10:18

have a word for that. Do

1:10:20

you want to hear it? I

1:10:22

want to know everything about it.

1:10:24

It's called busy. Busy. That's

1:10:26

better. Yeah. What's the bee for. What's

1:10:28

the bee for? Boys? Wait, what

1:10:31

am I getting wrong? Pussy,

1:10:33

I get that part. B,

1:10:35

I don't know, I really

1:10:37

don't know, my stones. How

1:10:39

do men have sex? What

1:10:41

do they do if they

1:10:44

do? Usually. They do it

1:10:46

in the naughty place. What is

1:10:48

a naughty place call? Yes,

1:10:51

the booty? The booty, but a

1:10:53

butt. The butt, but, okay, okay.

1:10:55

All right, well there's lots of

1:10:57

words for it, you can't hate

1:11:00

me that, I guess. What do

1:11:02

you, what, what, like,

1:11:04

like anthropolomologically, what, what

1:11:06

do you make of, like, anthropologically, thank

1:11:08

you, John, I need a, I

1:11:10

need a real anchor here to

1:11:13

help me with that, we can

1:11:15

do a show together. I could

1:11:17

arrest you when the cameras went

1:11:19

off, anyway, they, um... And then like

1:11:22

anthropologists always why is

1:11:24

there a homosexual element in nature?

1:11:26

I'm not pleased. It's a wonderful

1:11:29

thing. I'm not saying there's anything

1:11:31

wrong with it. It's just different.

1:11:34

Just ask me a question. I

1:11:36

don't. It's just counterintuitive. Like why

1:11:38

would you have a certain segment

1:11:41

of the population that isn't for

1:11:43

repopulating and You know, if you just drive

1:11:45

from scratch, would you have sex where the

1:11:47

shit comes out? You know, that kind of

1:11:49

thing. Well, I mean, if you look in

1:11:51

nature, that homosexuality is in it. Even in

1:11:53

animals. Even in animals. And there are sometimes,

1:11:55

there are two members of the same sex

1:11:57

who can actually repopulate or whatever, but sex...

1:11:59

is not necessarily for yeah

1:12:02

sex is not necessarily

1:12:04

for repopulation because I

1:12:06

mean how many kids do

1:12:08

you have I've never been married

1:12:11

okay I'm way behind how often

1:12:13

have you had sex today yeah

1:12:15

Zero. Okay. And how have you helped to

1:12:18

repopulate the earth? No, I'm really actively against

1:12:20

it. I rest my kids. Yeah. No, but

1:12:22

I'm just saying about it. It feels good.

1:12:24

No, but I'm talking about nature. Like nature

1:12:26

usually, I mean, you believe in evolution and

1:12:28

all that. Of course. Okay, so. So like

1:12:31

everything in nature seems to be driven toward

1:12:33

just this like very often cruel how animals

1:12:35

kill each other and the way they die

1:12:37

off and if you lose a step in

1:12:39

nature you know I mean if you lose

1:12:41

a step on the jet you get cut

1:12:44

but if you lose a step in nature

1:12:46

you die you know nature's cruel like that

1:12:48

you know what I mean so like everything

1:12:50

has a purpose and everything seems to be

1:12:53

just to keep the fucking species

1:12:55

going it's just to keep the

1:12:57

fucking species going it's just what

1:12:59

is the anthropological... explanation for that.

1:13:01

It's just, it's interesting, right? The

1:13:04

answer is called explanation of homosexuality.

1:13:06

Yeah. Like why does nature want

1:13:08

this? Nature, I've seen, wants this

1:13:10

element. I don't know if nature

1:13:12

wants it. I think it's to

1:13:15

keep it. Maybe it's population control.

1:13:17

Is that what you're going to

1:13:19

say? Yeah. Maybe it's population control.

1:13:21

And maybe it is not such an egregious

1:13:24

thing except for religion. Correct.

1:13:26

It's not egregious at all. Okay, so

1:13:28

then that's what I'm saying. So why

1:13:30

does nature want it? Maybe nature wants

1:13:32

it because it actually feels good and

1:13:34

because it's actually normal and because

1:13:36

of people's religious beliefs in this. Oh

1:13:39

no, religion is totally the villain in

1:13:41

this one. Yeah. And some people like

1:13:43

you, remember we had this conversation the

1:13:45

other week at a party. It's a

1:13:47

couple things. We did? At a party? Wait

1:13:50

a second. We're at a party and I

1:13:52

think that you were... Oh, I know. The

1:13:54

Grammys. Yeah, we're at the Grammys. Oh, remember

1:13:56

I was torturing the poor, I remember. Yeah.

1:13:58

Because you look so... and I look

1:14:01

good and then somebody else came

1:14:03

in and Ari wore the wrong

1:14:05

jacket and I love Ari not

1:14:07

a slubby jacket it was a

1:14:10

slubby jacket I love Ari don't

1:14:12

get me wrong it was it

1:14:14

was Hollywood you know we know

1:14:16

this shit yeah all right I

1:14:19

told him I said Ari you

1:14:21

need a gay friend remember Anyway,

1:14:24

so we were at this party, yeah. And

1:14:26

we were talking about, like, you know, I

1:14:28

think we were talking about attraction and who

1:14:30

were dating or something. Right. And I don't

1:14:33

know if it was you, maybe it was

1:14:35

you, I don't know, but like, you are

1:14:37

a heterosexual guy, you are a heterosexual guy,

1:14:39

you're not attracted to men, and that's okay,

1:14:41

but there are some men who may choose

1:14:44

to spend their life married to a woman,

1:14:46

being in relationship with a woman, but they

1:14:48

may find gay sex. In the bathroom, four

1:14:50

seasons in Maui. But if we didn't have

1:14:52

such a thing about it, they wouldn't have

1:14:55

to do that. Of course. No, I know.

1:14:57

And the same thing. I mean, maybe

1:14:59

there are some gay men, maybe once

1:15:01

in a while I might like to

1:15:04

hang out with a woman. Oh, they all

1:15:06

do. Yeah, once in a while. I do.

1:15:08

I mean, I like boobs. I like

1:15:10

boobs. I think they're beautiful,

1:15:12

like the way they look.

1:15:14

Yeah, they're okay. You're an ass

1:15:17

man. No, I mean like

1:15:19

talking about this conversation is

1:15:21

getting weird. This is Robinson,

1:15:24

but no I like the mid

1:15:26

section Like if I had to pick

1:15:28

yes, like the mid You like the

1:15:30

chacha Or that the next section

1:15:32

of the body. Yeah, like like

1:15:35

like like from that like I'm

1:15:37

not against any but I love

1:15:39

women like like trust me. I'm

1:15:41

like the last guy Who's going to

1:15:44

like to experiment with your side of

1:15:46

the street? That was our conversation. I

1:15:48

told you right. And that's just that's

1:15:50

okay. There's a spectrum. There truly is

1:15:52

a spectrum. You know, I mean, I'm

1:15:54

totally on that page. But you know,

1:15:56

I know that you are a 100%

1:15:58

homosexual. I mean, heterosexual. Excuse me. I'm

1:16:00

100% heterosexual. It's because you're

1:16:02

okay with it and you

1:16:04

get it. Totally. Like if

1:16:06

I, you cannot say, you

1:16:08

cannot make yourself be with

1:16:10

someone that you're not attracted

1:16:12

to. No. No. No. I mean, do you

1:16:14

think it's wrong if a person

1:16:16

asking for a friend doesn't even really

1:16:19

like to watch gay sex in like,

1:16:21

say, a movie? No. I mean, I

1:16:23

think it makes a lot of

1:16:25

people uncomfortable. PDA makes me uncomfortable.

1:16:28

You know, seeing a man and

1:16:30

a woman kiss on television or

1:16:32

movie doesn't make me uncomfortable. But

1:16:34

sometimes in public, I'm like, okay

1:16:37

guys, I don't really need to

1:16:39

see it. Right, I agree. And

1:16:41

maybe it's my internalized homophobia, but

1:16:43

sometimes it makes me uncomfortable to

1:16:46

see like two men kissing or

1:16:48

whatever. And I'm like, why don't

1:16:50

I go that about women? Because

1:16:52

it's much more accepted in culture

1:16:55

and society. And guys were like, oh

1:16:57

my gosh, this is hot. Breakfast

1:16:59

at Tiffany's the other day.

1:17:01

I've ever seen it. Wait,

1:17:03

are you sure you're not

1:17:05

gay now? You're watching Breakfast

1:17:07

at Tiffany's? In the kitchen. I

1:17:10

take things in the kitchen. You

1:17:12

know, I watch it like at

1:17:14

15 minutes at a time when

1:17:16

I'm making food. Have you ever

1:17:18

seen it? Yeah, of course. So awesome.

1:17:20

I had never seen it. I

1:17:22

just watch it. Yeah, because it

1:17:25

always looked kind of gay. No,

1:17:27

I'm kidding. It's actually not. I

1:17:29

forget. Who's the guy in it?

1:17:31

What's his name? George Papard. Went

1:17:33

on to be the head in

1:17:35

the lead in the 18 in

1:17:37

the 80s. This was 1961, Audrey

1:17:40

Hepburn, Truman Capote, a guy author,

1:17:42

his book. And I always knew

1:17:44

it was about, she's like

1:17:46

a hooker. It's so interesting,

1:17:48

like a hooker in 19. She's a gal about

1:17:50

town. Well, you know what it was? This is

1:17:53

so, this is 1960. Maybe the books she was

1:17:55

a hooker, but not in the movies. No, no,

1:17:57

no, no. No, it was true to the book.

1:17:59

Here's what it is. In 1960... Gentlemen give

1:18:01

her $50 to go when she

1:18:03

goes to the powder room, which

1:18:06

you know, maybe you tip

1:18:08

a dollar. Now $50 in 1961

1:18:10

was like 500. So that's

1:18:12

as close as they could

1:18:14

get to say that she

1:18:16

was a hooker. And then,

1:18:18

I mean, there's no sex

1:18:20

in it. And he. That's

1:18:22

why I never knew I knew

1:18:25

that about the movie because it's

1:18:27

so famous. He's a fucking whore

1:18:29

too. He's a whore too. He's

1:18:31

a hooker? Not a hooker but

1:18:33

there's this older woman who like

1:18:35

writes him checks. So they're both

1:18:37

fucking hoars. I mean sex workers

1:18:40

because they're the new group that

1:18:42

since the Oscar's now. Oh man,

1:18:44

the Oscar's out a good night

1:18:46

for hoars. Am I wrong? I

1:18:48

mean... What happens if you have

1:18:50

to... P on Club Random. Oh,

1:18:53

you just hold it. No,

1:18:55

no, go ahead. I can't

1:18:57

hold it anymore. No, no,

1:18:59

I'll wait. Hold that thought.

1:19:02

It's right here, right? Yeah,

1:19:04

yeah. Oh shit. Oh great. Yeah,

1:19:06

yeah, right there. I'm sorry, don't.

1:19:09

No, no, no. I've done it

1:19:11

myself. I mean, P, not

1:19:13

like P on camera. No,

1:19:15

no. There's no cameras

1:19:18

in there. That I know

1:19:20

of. That's

1:19:22

so good have you done. I

1:19:24

love that we're having the

1:19:26

interview continue

1:19:29

while you're in the

1:19:31

bathroom because this is

1:19:33

a first for club

1:19:35

random, but I don't

1:19:37

dislike it. And you're

1:19:39

such a pro. Such a pro.

1:19:41

A lot of people will

1:19:44

not continue the

1:19:46

interview while they're

1:19:48

being. You can put it on TV

1:19:50

if you want. I don't give a shit.

1:19:53

Wow. I didn't like, you know, it

1:19:55

wasn't or anything like that. Honestly, Dom,

1:19:57

they're not watching this for the

1:19:59

guest. Okay. That's all good.

1:20:02

That was amazing. Thank

1:20:04

you very much for that.

1:20:07

Yeah. Is anyone... I'm so

1:20:09

happy you came. Is my

1:20:12

mic still working? I'm so

1:20:14

happy you came here. I'm

1:20:17

so happy you came here.

1:20:19

I appreciate you came here.

1:20:21

I'm glad I'm getting

1:20:23

to know you. First you

1:20:26

do such a progression. I'd like

1:20:28

to hang out with you. Yeah,

1:20:30

we go, but like that's how

1:20:32

it happens. People say they've seen

1:20:34

me out with somebody. Like, how

1:20:36

do you guys know each other?

1:20:39

I'm always like, you know what?

1:20:41

I don't remember. And he's having,

1:20:43

first you do real time. Okay,

1:20:45

great. You know, that's on the

1:20:47

air. We talked a little after.

1:20:50

Okay, great. You know, that's on

1:20:52

the air. We talked a little

1:20:54

after the show. I met my

1:20:56

husband at a restaurant

1:20:59

slash bar. So, no,

1:21:01

it's weird. Well, most

1:21:03

restaurants have a bar.

1:21:05

It's kind of a

1:21:07

boogie story. Do you

1:21:09

want to hear? Yeah, I

1:21:11

really do. So, um, I was

1:21:14

renting with friends in

1:21:16

the Hamptons one summer.

1:21:19

And we were renting

1:21:21

in Bridge Hampton. 2015.

1:21:23

And so I was renting

1:21:26

and then on Friday night

1:21:28

this restaurant called Allman on

1:21:30

Friday night it's gay night

1:21:32

and so you go everybody's

1:21:35

there all the gays that

1:21:37

you would know famous gays

1:21:39

not famous gays everybody. The

1:21:41

other nights it's it's heterosexual.

1:21:44

Boy, I feel bad for the guy who

1:21:46

gets his days wrong. They do.

1:21:48

That happens and they walk in.

1:21:50

Yes, it happens. And they're like,

1:21:52

holy shit what's going on. Really?

1:21:54

Yeah. So I rented the year before

1:21:56

that, but I didn't go to the

1:21:59

bar or whatever. I was just kind of

1:22:01

like getting used to whatever. So we rented in

1:22:03

2015, I'm like, I was single, you know,

1:22:05

I was just starting CNN, I was like,

1:22:07

you know, in prime time, it was great, I was living

1:22:09

the life. And then, so I was there one night

1:22:11

and I met this guy, he had a boyfriend, he

1:22:13

talked to me, whatever. So I met my, when I

1:22:15

met my now husband, he had a boyfriend,

1:22:17

I'm not a home record. And so we became

1:22:20

friends and I had this, this, this, this

1:22:22

is going on too long, this is going on

1:22:24

too long too long, this, this, this, this, this,

1:22:26

this, this, this is going on too long, this

1:22:28

inflatable paddle board, And I couldn't get it back.

1:22:30

This sounds so boogie. Because I got,

1:22:32

I was, I would go to the

1:22:34

Hamptons in a helicopter. Because I bought

1:22:36

these things in a helicopter and I

1:22:38

couldn't, it was too heavy for the

1:22:40

helicopter and he drove back because he was

1:22:42

from, he actually grew up in the Hamptons.

1:22:44

Damn that DER. Yeah, I know. So he

1:22:47

grew up in the Hamptons and he took

1:22:49

my paddleboard in the car back to the

1:22:51

city and it sat in his apartment for

1:22:53

a year. Why did he take it?

1:22:55

Because he was in a car, the way

1:22:57

it was too heavy for the helicopter. Okay.

1:22:59

And so he had a car, he drove

1:23:02

it back, it sat in his apartment for

1:23:04

a year. And I would see him at

1:23:06

events and he'd go, you gotta get your

1:23:08

paddleboard. I'm like, yeah, I'm so sorry, you

1:23:10

can bring, I had no big deal. And

1:23:12

so then the next summer, I bought a

1:23:14

house there. And so because his family is

1:23:16

from there, he would start to come over

1:23:18

to come over to the house. We became friends

1:23:21

and one day in the summer he came

1:23:23

over in the morning we went for a

1:23:25

run and I said you know you're going to

1:23:27

be my husband one day right. He's like

1:23:29

wait what? And I just had this sort

1:23:31

of premonition thing. So he came over

1:23:33

at like nine in the morning and

1:23:35

we went for a run and then at

1:23:37

night at night he was still there. We

1:23:39

had spent the day together and he was

1:23:42

still seeing someone and I said. I'm

1:23:44

not a home record, whatever you're seeing, somebody, I can't

1:23:46

see you anymore because I'm starting to have feelings

1:23:49

and this is weird, I didn't realize it. And

1:23:51

so he's like, okay, and then like a month

1:23:53

later he broke up with his boyfriend, we went

1:23:55

out on our first date. Sounds like you are

1:23:57

a home right now. On election night. It sounds

1:24:00

like... exactly what a home record does. No,

1:24:02

I told him not to, it was his

1:24:04

decision to break up with his boyfriend. We

1:24:06

went on our first date, election night 2016.

1:24:08

Well, okay. When Trump was elected. That's exactly

1:24:10

what a home record does. They say, they

1:24:13

say, they say, I'm not a home, I

1:24:15

have feelings for you and they plant that

1:24:17

seat and the guys like, okay, I've been

1:24:19

with this person for a while, it's kind

1:24:21

of tired because we've been there for a

1:24:23

while, and I'd really be trading up. And

1:24:26

it's hot. I didn't know it's going to

1:24:28

be hot. So yes, and you should not

1:24:30

feel guilty about that. Maybe

1:24:32

you're right. That is human

1:24:34

nature. That's human nature. We're all

1:24:36

in the jungle. Okay. And we all

1:24:38

know that there's no, you know, there's

1:24:41

no morality in love and war.

1:24:43

We just are out there. And

1:24:45

so good. So and lasted 10

1:24:47

years, obviously. Well, it was election night

1:24:49

2016, almost 10 years. And we

1:24:51

got, we went on a date.

1:24:53

It was funny because we

1:24:55

were at this huge, can

1:24:57

I tell you about this

1:25:00

party? Yeah. You know who

1:25:02

had, who was holding the

1:25:05

party? Peaditty. No. Close.

1:25:07

Um, Kanye? No. Think about,

1:25:09

one more movies. R. Kelly.

1:25:11

No. Okay. I'm hoping for,

1:25:14

you know, even worse than

1:25:16

those. Seriously. So, um. Harvey

1:25:18

Weinstein invited me to a

1:25:20

party, an election night watch

1:25:23

party at Cipriani in New

1:25:25

York City. And I wasn't on that

1:25:27

night because that's when the political folks

1:25:29

are all on. And so I said,

1:25:31

sure, I'll go. And then I asked my

1:25:34

now husband Tim if he wanted to go.

1:25:36

And I said, sure. And so we walked

1:25:38

in a little bit early. We met like

1:25:40

downtown and we walked in. And he was

1:25:43

not used to going out with me. He

1:25:45

had, you know, they expand the expand the

1:25:47

tables. They put like a board on top

1:25:49

of the table and he sat down and

1:25:51

kicked it over. That was our first night.

1:25:54

And so then, you know, didn't, didn't that

1:25:56

give you the ick? No, I mean, it

1:25:58

was, I was just like. He was embarrassed.

1:26:00

But then, you know, who was there?

1:26:02

Governor Cuomo was there. Miles Teller was there.

1:26:04

Martha Stewart was there. Like just all the folks.

1:26:07

And they were all like, many of the people

1:26:09

there were like, oh, she's got, she's got Florida.

1:26:11

No, no, she's got pissingly. She's got that. And

1:26:13

I'm looking at the CNN thing going. So Tim

1:26:16

and I looked at each other. So let's let's

1:26:18

get the fuck out of here. So then we

1:26:20

went to the polo bar to the polo bar

1:26:22

to meet the polo bar to meet my agent.

1:26:25

And then that was our first date

1:26:27

and that's where our reception was at

1:26:29

the polo bar. Well, I must say

1:26:31

I find this story very inspiring. Boring.

1:26:33

No, no, no, not boring at all.

1:26:35

Inspiring because I'd always thought of gay

1:26:37

men having sex or something that happens

1:26:40

immediately. Oh, I hook up the first

1:26:42

night. We don't have to leave the

1:26:44

bar. That's lesbians. They hook up the

1:26:46

first night and then the you hall

1:26:48

happens the next day. There were people

1:26:50

leaving at the height of the height

1:26:52

of the age crisis crisis who said.

1:26:54

Bathhouses, I'm sorry, that's the whole

1:26:57

point of this lifestyle, and I don't

1:26:59

want to give that up, even though

1:27:01

AIDS was like a sort of Damocles

1:27:03

over their head. Okay, can I tell

1:27:05

you something that I think may surprise

1:27:07

you. But I know, I'm being facetious.

1:27:09

No, no, no, not really, you're not

1:27:11

wrong about that. No, there is that

1:27:13

element in the gay world, but it

1:27:15

is not the vast majority of gay

1:27:17

people who, when they finally did pass

1:27:19

gay marriage, and we saw them showing

1:27:21

up at courthouses and sweatshirts and looking

1:27:23

slubby like the rest of us, that's

1:27:25

what America went. Oh, okay. It's, it

1:27:27

is just as everyone else. I think

1:27:29

people should be having fun and I've

1:27:31

certainly, look, I have gone to heterosexual

1:27:33

swingers clubs. So the heterosexual are just

1:27:36

as kinky as the gay people, maybe

1:27:38

even more. But I think that that

1:27:40

was a part of gay culture and

1:27:42

I actually liked it when gay people

1:27:44

were kind of, you know, a little

1:27:47

bit different, a little bit of, you

1:27:49

know what I mean? We were kind of dangerous

1:27:51

or whatever. And now we

1:27:53

have become so heteronormative. Yeah, it's

1:27:55

boring sometimes. All of them, most

1:27:58

of my friends have kids. And

1:28:00

so I understand that. And if

1:28:02

you're two men and you're just

1:28:04

having fun, I don't put a

1:28:07

judgment on sex and what people

1:28:09

do, as long as it's two consenting

1:28:11

adults, I don't really give a

1:28:13

shit. But there still is something

1:28:16

about, to me, the look, mostly of

1:28:18

a gay man. I used to, one of

1:28:20

my first jokes was about, why are they,

1:28:22

I would love to be mistaken

1:28:24

for a gay man? Why are they

1:28:26

better looking? Great looking guys just look

1:28:28

in the mirror and go, oh I'm

1:28:30

not wasting this on chick. I think

1:28:32

it's both. Now look at the competition

1:28:34

as you said, so you gotta like

1:28:36

take care of your body, you gotta,

1:28:38

you know, you gotta look good if

1:28:40

you're a gay man. There's a lot

1:28:42

of competition. There's a certain look that's

1:28:44

like agents. Have a certain look, don't

1:28:47

you think? They really do. They do

1:28:49

with spot of a mile a fucking

1:28:51

way. They have the suit coat on,

1:28:53

it's just leisure pants, and the sneakers,

1:28:55

and the court jacket. Yeah. I can't

1:28:57

even put it in words, but it's

1:28:59

just something, it's a good hair, I

1:29:01

don't know. And then, yeah. But you

1:29:03

think gay man have a certain look?

1:29:06

Better looking, yes. Like clean and like

1:29:08

better skin, and like better skin,

1:29:10

and I just think there's

1:29:12

something maybe that is connected

1:29:14

with... Whatever makes someone gay with

1:29:16

the skin I do I do and

1:29:18

it's not a dermatology as someone who

1:29:21

struggled with skin probably I'm serious but

1:29:23

you know I understand what you're saying

1:29:25

that's somebody we're gonna say of these

1:29:27

being very you know sort of stereotypical

1:29:30

whatever but because we come in there's

1:29:32

generally better looking the out ones

1:29:34

are generally better look right because there

1:29:36

are a lot of them that are

1:29:38

not out and they're not generally better

1:29:40

I'm sure that's true too yeah So

1:29:42

I don't, I can't disagree with you

1:29:44

on that. That's probably something from a

1:29:46

bygone era that I, you know, I'm

1:29:49

always trying to yell at people for

1:29:51

zombie lies. It may be a zombie

1:29:53

lie. You're right. But now you don't

1:29:55

know when I wrote that joke, people

1:29:57

weren't out. No. Yeah. Now people are out.

1:29:59

No. I don't think anyone gives

1:30:02

a shit. I mean, nobody

1:30:04

does. Well, there are certain

1:30:06

people. The criticism, if you

1:30:08

read the comments on my

1:30:10

channel or whatever on social

1:30:12

media, it's always something that's

1:30:14

gay, he's a homo, it's whatever,

1:30:17

he's blowing. Children use

1:30:19

whatever they have to get you.

1:30:21

If you're fat, again, I don't

1:30:23

think they even do whatever. They

1:30:25

don't care that much. about what

1:30:28

it is. It's just a cudgel to

1:30:30

hit you with. So if they can

1:30:32

use that one, they will. It's,

1:30:34

you know, I wouldn't trip on

1:30:36

that. I mean, but do you read

1:30:38

your social media a lot? No,

1:30:40

but my, the guy sent me

1:30:42

like, oh my gosh, I'll say

1:30:44

this one, this one, this one

1:30:47

was really good, this one wasn't

1:30:49

so great, this one like, oh

1:30:51

my God, I can't believe the

1:30:53

trolls on that. And then, but

1:30:55

when I'm on, I'm on, I see. I can

1:30:57

see the audience. The numbers are there.

1:30:59

It's in real time. It's not just

1:31:01

minute to minute. You get the Nielsen

1:31:03

ratings. It's in real time. So I can

1:31:05

see how people are engaged and I'm reading

1:31:08

the comments from the people who

1:31:10

are streaming with us at the same

1:31:12

time. So you know it's much closer

1:31:14

to the bone than television. It's much

1:31:16

more real. And you do that? You

1:31:18

follow it along? You follow it along,

1:31:20

but I don't let the engagement. determine

1:31:23

what I'm talking about or what I

1:31:25

think is important just because the audience

1:31:27

is absolutely 100%. You can really think you

1:31:29

trust yourself that much to see what they're

1:31:31

liking and not go with the like? Yeah,

1:31:33

they didn't like what I said about Joe

1:31:35

Biden during the election. They didn't like some

1:31:38

of the things I said about Kamala Harris

1:31:40

during the election. They didn't like that I

1:31:42

was interviewing people as I was going around

1:31:44

the country during the election and there were

1:31:46

a lot of people telling me. I heard

1:31:48

a lot of Trump out there. And so I

1:31:50

knew before everyone else like... I'm like, I'm

1:31:53

hearing a lot of Trump, I contacted the

1:31:55

campaign, I'm like, you guys have a problem,

1:31:57

especially with black men, never contacted me

1:31:59

back. But... I knew before that they

1:32:01

were in trouble and my subscribers

1:32:03

didn't really like it. And I

1:32:05

said, you may not like it. I

1:32:08

want you to stick with me,

1:32:10

but I'm not going to tell

1:32:12

you something just because I think

1:32:14

you want to hear it. I'm

1:32:16

always going to be honest with

1:32:18

you. And a lot of the

1:32:20

streamers and podcasters who are more

1:32:22

progressive or to the left or

1:32:24

center or whatever, they lost

1:32:26

a lot of subscribers after

1:32:29

them. Certainly my formula. It is

1:32:31

your formula. But I don't, but I

1:32:33

mean, I would not trust myself. You

1:32:35

know, my, they had a billboard here.

1:32:37

Your ratings whore? I am the opposite.

1:32:40

My billboard says he's not in it

1:32:42

for the likes. That's the catch word. Yeah.

1:32:44

And, you know, I'm sure there are snarky

1:32:46

people on the left who was like, yeah,

1:32:48

that's right, Bill. That's, you know, that's why,

1:32:50

we hate you. No, I mean, it's a

1:32:53

way of saying you can't, you can't, you

1:32:55

can't, you can't by me. You can't by

1:32:57

me. You can't by me. Yeah. And that's so

1:32:59

if you're on that page, we need more of

1:33:01

that. I am. I thank you. I appreciate

1:33:03

that night. I appreciate the platform that

1:33:06

you have when people ask me, what

1:33:08

do you want to do? What's your ultimate

1:33:10

goal? I said, I would like to have

1:33:12

a platform like Bill Mar. I don't want

1:33:14

to be Bill Mar. But where there's honesty,

1:33:16

you said earlier, you know, you can't do

1:33:19

that in television. I think. Folks in

1:33:21

television now should start serving people what

1:33:23

they want instead of what they think

1:33:25

that they want I mean instead of

1:33:27

what the bosses and the people in

1:33:30

the suit what no you can be

1:33:32

honest on television. I'm totally

1:33:34

I'm roofing you Oh, you know, you

1:33:37

have no idea what's going to happen

1:33:39

after this no jing I drink it.

1:33:41

It's a way to make just regular

1:33:43

sparkling water into tasty diet soda. Oh

1:33:45

got okay. So you were saying about

1:33:48

linear television and what I work

1:33:50

I Is that water? That's a...

1:33:52

Toquila? Toquila? You're putting

1:33:54

it toquila? Yeah, well it's

1:33:56

like if you mix it with diet

1:33:58

coke it would have its... to it,

1:34:00

this just puts a flavor to

1:34:02

it. You want some? Jing, I

1:34:05

drink it. I'll try it. I

1:34:07

usually just like, you

1:34:09

know, my... What are you

1:34:11

drinking there? Reposado, Casa Zool,

1:34:14

Reposado with some lime. Jesus,

1:34:16

you are okay. Reposado, what the

1:34:18

fuck is that? It's a darker

1:34:20

smokier tequila than a blanco. Oh.

1:34:23

No, you can, what you can

1:34:25

do, you can be honest on

1:34:27

television, what you can't do is

1:34:30

veer from a conversation like we're

1:34:32

having right now, to the one,

1:34:34

uh, really? It tastes like a fricking

1:34:36

seven up now, what did you do?

1:34:39

Like a fanta. People like seven

1:34:41

up. They're deluded with this. It's

1:34:43

just too, it's just too, uh... No,

1:34:45

I would like this maybe if I'm

1:34:48

drinking water during the day, I'm not,

1:34:50

I don't think I necessarily wanted it.

1:34:52

I think, I think you'll like it

1:34:55

after that. Oh wait, no, I'm gonna,

1:34:57

I would prefer a sparkle. I'm gonna

1:34:59

do a sparkle. Okay. What were you

1:35:01

saying? I'm saying you can be honest

1:35:03

on TV. to what should we call

1:35:05

a man's ass? Because that's life where

1:35:07

it just flows where it flows and

1:35:10

then it comes back and we talk

1:35:12

it's like there no agenda I could

1:35:14

have called this show no agenda no

1:35:16

agenda no agenda no agenda no notes

1:35:18

no you know I'm high whatever was

1:35:20

that's what you can't do on TV

1:35:22

I'm not saying it should go in

1:35:25

that what I'm saying is that people

1:35:27

should be more honest in their conversations and

1:35:29

because in conversations people say dumb things they

1:35:31

make mistakes. And I don't think people should

1:35:33

be canceled for that. I think that I

1:35:36

actually think in television they should be applauded

1:35:38

for that because it makes a better television.

1:35:40

People should, but you know if shoulds and

1:35:42

bucks would be or in lots we'd have

1:35:45

a hell of a party. But I also

1:35:47

think that linear television would not be quite

1:35:49

in the position that it is now with

1:35:51

people who are unsubscribing or people who are

1:35:54

cutting the cord if they actually had more

1:35:56

interesting people on more people like you

1:35:58

and more people like me. that and they

1:36:00

said we're not gonna cancel we're not gonna

1:36:02

we're not gonna go for the woke left

1:36:04

or the woke right you know there's a

1:36:07

woke right right of course there's a woke

1:36:09

right who are there always was they

1:36:11

canceled Colin Copernick faster than

1:36:13

anybody the Trump canceled AP

1:36:15

the Associated Press because they wouldn't

1:36:17

call it the stupid off of

1:36:19

America oh well they threw him out of the

1:36:22

press room mean can't do you think it's

1:36:24

kind of canceling them mr. Mr.

1:36:26

Free speech No. I mean, who reads

1:36:28

news? I mean, newspapers are kind of

1:36:30

dead anyway. I mean, people read... The

1:36:32

Associated Press is not the newspaper. I

1:36:34

get my stuff from the Associated Press.

1:36:36

I have a respect for them. Oh,

1:36:38

yeah, I do too. I just don't

1:36:40

know. I mean, all I ever read

1:36:42

about is how newspapers are dying

1:36:44

and, you know, I mean, again, the Times

1:36:47

is doing well because they went with that

1:36:49

model that I was describing before.

1:36:51

How do our readers... want to interpret

1:36:53

this story and then write the story

1:36:56

that way. That's the difference between the

1:36:58

New York Times of today and 20

1:37:00

years ago. Don't you think, I'm glad

1:37:02

you mentioned that except I forgot about

1:37:05

this earlier, but don't you think that's

1:37:07

kind of your show, you're the interpreter

1:37:09

on the show? Yeah, but I'm not

1:37:11

pretending to be a newspaper. It's an opinion

1:37:13

show, it's a debate show. That's not a

1:37:16

newspaper. If I was a newspaper, I would

1:37:18

just try to keep it as much down

1:37:20

the middle as I could. I give my

1:37:22

opinion on everything. When

1:37:24

the Democrats are, as

1:37:27

they were, under Obama, I

1:37:29

thought, much more sane

1:37:31

and not championing silly things,

1:37:34

I was much more always

1:37:36

on their side. Then they

1:37:38

became... crazy woke about a lot

1:37:40

of bullshit and I wasn't going to hold

1:37:42

my tongue like a lot of people did

1:37:44

just because it you know oh it's your

1:37:47

team there's no teams I'm on team what's

1:37:49

real yeah and I'm dealing with that right

1:37:51

now all the time when I'm out like

1:37:53

I was at the vanity fair Oscar party

1:37:56

the other night oh my friend invited me

1:37:58

I didn't go unless you know Why? I

1:38:00

was in New York. Lee Daniel said, do

1:38:02

you want to be my day to

1:38:04

the us, to the Vanley Fairford? I've

1:38:06

gone. I just didn't. I was in New

1:38:08

York. What a dick. Should I have

1:38:10

gone? Of course. Why? Why? Because it's

1:38:12

like this town, people think it's such

1:38:14

a party town, it's not. This is like

1:38:17

the one weekend a year people party.

1:38:19

I flew in on Monday night, it

1:38:21

was so boring. I'm always amused like

1:38:23

every year. Somebody's always like, boy, what

1:38:26

happened in the Vanity Fair Party. What

1:38:28

happened to it? Everybody came to it.

1:38:30

That's what happened to it. Everybody comes

1:38:32

to it. If you didn't see somebody

1:38:34

there, it's because they didn't want to

1:38:37

see you. Where do the magazine comes

1:38:39

out in two months and they have

1:38:41

pictures? Everybody was there. It's one of

1:38:43

the few times here in the Petting

1:38:46

Zoo, we call the Hollywood Zoo, Hollywood

1:38:48

Zoo, you see all the stars

1:38:50

in the same room. It's just

1:38:52

fun. It just feels great. Everybody's

1:38:54

like fucking dressed in the nines.

1:38:56

You know, all the tension from

1:38:58

the show is over. The winners

1:39:00

are there and they are beaming

1:39:03

and the losers. Okay, they lost,

1:39:05

but it's that fucking shit is

1:39:07

over. Timothy Chalame, it's like, it

1:39:09

didn't look like he was suffering.

1:39:11

You know, I mean, the chicks.

1:39:13

are dressed like crazy. They always

1:39:15

turn up, if you're a 10,

1:39:17

you turn it up to 11

1:39:19

on Oscar Knight. Now you're making

1:39:22

me feel bad. Yes. And you

1:39:24

would have went with Lee Daniels.

1:39:26

That's cool. Lee's a friend. He's

1:39:28

a really good friend. You know

1:39:30

what? People would be very surprised

1:39:32

to know about me if I once

1:39:34

did one of those 25 things you

1:39:36

don't know about me things. Yeah.

1:39:38

I've seen all the Tyler Perry

1:39:41

movies. I haven't. I love that.

1:39:43

I love Tyler, but I haven't

1:39:45

seen all the movies. But you

1:39:47

were mentioning, you were talking

1:39:50

about the, I'm getting it

1:39:52

now. Well, they're like, Bill, what

1:39:54

are we gonna do? And my answer

1:39:56

is, well, there's not much you

1:39:59

can do. You lost elections matter,

1:40:01

you lost all the branches

1:40:03

of government. So what can

1:40:05

you do? I mean, apropos

1:40:07

of the speech the other night, show

1:40:10

up, you know, with the paddles that

1:40:12

you were very amusingly making fun

1:40:14

of. And then some people

1:40:17

wore pink, like, and then

1:40:19

some people wore like white

1:40:21

for Ukraine. It's like, they look so

1:40:23

disorganized. And weak. But there's a way to do it

1:40:25

that they're not doing it and I think they feel

1:40:27

weak. And I also think the people, then look, again,

1:40:29

I don't want to keep beating up on the Democrats.

1:40:31

I do think, I'm not a Democrat, I'm an independent.

1:40:33

I do, I want to keep beating up on them,

1:40:35

independent. I do, I want to keep beating up on

1:40:37

them. I think that they are, they should be, I'm

1:40:39

a Democrat, I'm an independent. I do, but I want

1:40:42

to keep beating up. I think that they're not, I

1:40:44

think they're not, I think they're not, they feel weak,

1:40:46

they feel weak, they feel weak, they feel weak, they

1:40:48

feel weak, they feel weak, they, they feel weak, they, they, they

1:40:50

feel weak, they, they, they, they feel weak, they, they, they feel weak,

1:40:52

they, they, they, they, they, they feel weak, they, they, they, they, they,

1:40:54

they feel weak, they feel weak, someone who I'm very close

1:40:56

to who is one of the savviest

1:40:58

political people I know said that exact

1:41:01

thing. I just don't, I think behind

1:41:03

the scenes he's very good, he's very

1:41:05

good at I'm sure negotiating and coming

1:41:08

up with a plan. I feel the

1:41:10

same way about I love Nancy Pelosi,

1:41:12

I think she's a very smart woman,

1:41:15

but I think that era of the

1:41:17

Nancy Pelosi type in the Democratic Party

1:41:19

is over. I think that this is the

1:41:21

era of whether, and I didn't like her

1:41:24

policies. AOC. People love Jasmine

1:41:26

Crockett. People love Eric

1:41:28

Swalwell and the like. And I

1:41:30

think that the Democratic Party

1:41:33

should put the people out there who

1:41:35

the people want. They should put the...

1:41:37

politicians out there who the people want

1:41:40

who they're asking for who are meeting the

1:41:42

moment with the same energy that they're not

1:41:44

asking for AOC yes they are the people

1:41:46

you party with no no no no I

1:41:48

party with don't like AOC oh please no

1:41:51

they don't at all well most people don't

1:41:53

but she's very far left this let me

1:41:55

tell you why I've saying that because

1:41:57

AOC the because people will vote for

1:41:59

AOC see and Donald Trump on

1:42:01

the same ticket because they're authentic. No,

1:42:03

because they're authentic. I don't think,

1:42:06

I, that, that, Don, I think

1:42:08

you're wrong about that. What people

1:42:10

like about people like Trump and

1:42:12

Federman is there, because it's irrelevant

1:42:14

to her life. But you don't

1:42:16

know her life. I, I know

1:42:18

that. being a gorgeous woman who I

1:42:20

wouldn't even know was Hispanic in a

1:42:23

city that has a million Hispanics and

1:42:25

does not treat them badly. That doesn't

1:42:27

mean she doesn't struggle. That doesn't mean

1:42:29

that she was set down. It implies

1:42:31

it. But that doesn't mean that she

1:42:33

was set down in Hispanic ghetto in

1:42:36

the Bronx and had to deal with

1:42:38

that growing up. And that she's not

1:42:40

somebody working class family. It implies that's

1:42:42

for some, that inside, it implies that in

1:42:44

some way she's behind the eight ball.

1:42:46

Because of that, and it's just not true. And

1:42:49

so I don't know if she's behind the

1:42:51

eight ball, but I don't think she's as

1:42:53

privileged as many people who are in

1:42:55

Congress right now. Is that privileged or

1:42:57

not? She was a bartender. Yeah, you

1:42:59

know, so I was a delivery policy.

1:43:01

But I'm saying sometimes, like, just Bill,

1:43:03

like, you don't agree with, with, um,

1:43:05

Donald Trump's policies. No, but that's what

1:43:07

the people want. Some of them, whether

1:43:09

you like her or not, whether you like

1:43:11

her or not, I don't like what she did

1:43:13

with Amazon or not, But I think AOC is

1:43:16

a democratic icon. Well, she's a wrong...

1:43:18

If you think that's the direction, the

1:43:20

country, the democratic party... I'm not saying

1:43:22

the policies that she espouses, that's the

1:43:24

direction, but I'm saying that you have

1:43:26

to give the people who are, the

1:43:28

people who are out front speaking for

1:43:30

the party, not the people who are...

1:43:32

If you think... She's evolving? Yeah, she's

1:43:34

evolving. As we all are. And she

1:43:37

is moving into... Right. She understands the

1:43:39

game a little bit more and if

1:43:41

you notice she is sort of becoming

1:43:43

a sort of normal kind of Democrat

1:43:45

in many ways. I think she's a very

1:43:47

smart topic and she's very smart. Let's get

1:43:49

behind that. Another one who's doing that, Gavin

1:43:52

Newsom who I've always been a fan of

1:43:54

and thought always could and should be president

1:43:56

and then I recently had a conversation with

1:43:58

somebody and I said Gosh, I've always

1:44:01

been hoping Gavin would move toward

1:44:03

the center. It doesn't seem to

1:44:05

be happening. And then as if

1:44:08

I had just manifested it, I

1:44:10

see this headline somebody sent me

1:44:12

a few days ago. Gavin Newsom

1:44:14

named checked me in how much

1:44:16

he wanted to, or how he

1:44:19

wanted to move. Is he starting

1:44:21

a podcast? Yes. What he wants

1:44:23

to talk to dissenting voices. Yeah.

1:44:25

So I'm like. Thank you, Jesus.

1:44:27

This is the direction we want

1:44:29

to go. So if you can

1:44:31

get AOC there toward the middle,

1:44:33

but you know, again, for the

1:44:35

people that come up to me, Bill,

1:44:38

what are we going to do? Well,

1:44:40

you can't do much because you lost

1:44:42

all the levers of power. What you

1:44:44

can do, the thing that you can

1:44:46

do, is get on your side to

1:44:49

not look crazier than him. That's

1:44:51

all you can do. Now

1:44:53

go back to your $800 for-play

1:44:55

dinner. Are you worrying about

1:44:57

how the world is going

1:44:59

to end? What are you saying

1:45:02

you don't want to look

1:45:04

as crazy as he does? That's

1:45:06

the only thing liberals can do.

1:45:09

Just don't do shit that makes

1:45:11

people go, oh, Trump, he's

1:45:13

just crazy, but at least

1:45:16

he doesn't. And then whatever

1:45:18

the... Crazy story of the day is

1:45:20

from the world. So you're making my

1:45:22

point. The other side should I don't

1:45:25

I don't believe that they should not

1:45:27

be as crazy. Why not? Crazy in

1:45:29

what way? Like the guy was

1:45:31

shaking his cane. You said the

1:45:34

only thing that Democrats should be

1:45:36

is not be as crazy as

1:45:38

Donald Trump, but why not have

1:45:40

not not hold policy positions and

1:45:42

beliefs and support silly things that

1:45:45

are crazier. Not to give it away,

1:45:47

but I guess it'll air before

1:45:49

this does Friday night. My thing

1:45:51

that I was just working on

1:45:53

is about the Oscars. I saw

1:45:55

it started with a land

1:45:57

acknowledgement. That's the kind of

1:45:59

thing. that makes people roll their

1:46:01

eyes. The land acknowledgement, I guess

1:46:03

that part will listen. It's like

1:46:05

when you're at some place, like

1:46:07

the Oscars, and before you can

1:46:09

even start, you have to acknowledge

1:46:11

that this is the land that

1:46:13

we are standing on that really

1:46:15

belongs to the proud Chumash people,

1:46:17

you know, and it's like, as

1:46:20

I said, either give it back

1:46:22

or shut them fuck out. So

1:46:24

like every day, there's some little

1:46:26

thing like that that the left

1:46:28

does. And it may not be

1:46:30

politicians. I mean, democratic politicians weren't

1:46:32

really for defund the police, but it

1:46:34

got out there that that was what

1:46:36

the liberal, woke thing was. And so

1:46:39

it just gets in people's heads.

1:46:41

Oh, defund the police. That's not really

1:46:43

something that's going to help my

1:46:45

life a lot. I mean, I know

1:46:47

people who are very liberal, who said

1:46:50

to me, son of Ocher, when Trump

1:46:52

won. I'm not unhappy that the police

1:46:54

are going to get their morale back.

1:46:56

Yeah. You know, where, you don't live here.

1:46:58

It would be an interesting thing though.

1:47:01

You know, where do you live? I

1:47:03

live in New York. Or you live

1:47:05

in New York. So we've had a

1:47:07

really tough time out here with not

1:47:09

just the fires, but the crime, even

1:47:11

before the fires, like people who never

1:47:13

ever said, I don't really want to

1:47:16

go to that restaurant. They demurina.

1:47:18

when you ask them to a restaurant

1:47:21

in a part of town they

1:47:23

consider a little too dangerous. I

1:47:25

have not witnessed that in LA or

1:47:27

they don't wear watches when they go

1:47:29

out. You know, they're in New

1:47:31

York City. Here. Here. Here. You know,

1:47:33

okay. They don't want to live like

1:47:36

that. You know, where they, I mean,

1:47:38

there's been like robberies and grow

1:47:40

daylight under a day out drive.

1:47:42

You know, where you just get

1:47:44

this creepy feeling that, wow. The whole

1:47:46

order is broken out and

1:47:49

we elected a very different

1:47:51

DA here. You know, like, we're gonna,

1:47:54

we're gonna, crime's gonna

1:47:56

be illegal again. Here in

1:47:58

LA, it was basically... what

1:48:00

he ran on. I don't know a lot

1:48:02

of that if I can disagree with

1:48:04

you on because this is where

1:48:06

the conservative side of me comes

1:48:09

out. Like I think people should

1:48:11

be tough on crime. As someone who

1:48:13

has witnessed one of those

1:48:16