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one

1:01

to decoder on the lived to tell editor in chief

1:03

of the verge kotor is my so of

1:06

big ideas and other process that

1:08

, of the ways of i think about coker

1:10

is that we're just taking a tour for

1:13

all the parts of running a modern this this

1:16

we talked to a boss a we

1:19

had steel officers and chief

1:21

officers officer you

1:23

all know how much i love talking to people in

1:25

the creator industry which is still

1:27

industry inventing itself figuring

1:30

out what the road rules even heart says

1:32

a rules i have asked about

1:34

the airport her understanding the structure

1:37

of businesses you understand all to breath

1:40

working as always struck the decisions

1:42

is how little any of us really pay attention

1:44

to the advertising and

1:46

, easily connect if this to almost

1:49

every other tests tests

1:51

all even start a company invent agree products

1:54

the so me to market new to tell people

1:56

about it and eventually convince them to bite

1:58

and in the past bunnies that we all depend

2:01

on running at google's,

2:04

entire business is at met

2:06

his entire business is at

2:08

i mean, what's the mark zuckerberg center?

2:11

we run out and when we talked to all those they're

2:14

even more tied at their distribution

2:16

platforms like tik-tok and youtuber all

2:18

ad supported and adds make up a

2:20

huge portion of their revenue and

2:23

then on the the flip side, there's so much noise

2:25

and our media ecosystem that actually

2:27

making effective at figuring

2:29

out where to put has dramatically

2:32

changed over the past s 5

2:34

years ago, no one was but

2:37

now it's all anybody wants a know

2:39

it's all anybody want because this weekend talking

2:41

to kneel the ceo of wyden

2:44

intended one the the major independent

2:46

ad agencies in the world may be

2:48

the coolest one i mean, it's definitely

2:50

got around wine is the agency that

2:52

came up just do for

2:55

nike bud, light legends, for above

2:57

like they've done campaigns for cover for

2:59

miller microsoft e s p n isn't

3:01

it coming out for a conversation last

3:03

week with katie well trump building a brand from

3:05

the ground up using influencer marketing and

3:07

potentially never hiring an ad agency

3:10

i wanted to get of you from the other side how

3:12

does a big ad agency work where

3:14

does their money come from so many

3:16

of the big ad agencies are merging into

3:19

what are called holding companies eyes

3:21

widened still independent want

3:23

to show how neil stinks about platforms right

3:25

now is the economy remains on shaky

3:27

ground the airbase possum companies

3:30

are posting pretty bad financial results

3:33

ad agencies seem to be doing okay why

3:35

is that and does he worry about advertising

3:38

in a world that is dominated by google and facebook

3:40

how much of his time to this been thinking about

3:42

tic tac the end with a recession

3:45

coming over here already over

3:47

whatever it is is he worried about the old

3:49

cliche that add budgets are the first to go

3:52

the top of all that the used the new

3:55

ceo taking over for some

3:57

pretty iconic sanders which isis

3:59

your dakota

4:01

the conversation was really fun neo

4:03

was game to get deep into the weeds of all

4:05

of it think you really like it okay

4:08

numerator ceo of lightning

4:23

new arthur you are the global ceo

4:25

of widening kennedy which is very

4:28

famous very big at agency deals

4:30

on it's the coolest and agency where to talk about that

4:33

welcome to decode the i definitely

4:36

yeah i'm very excited to talk to i

4:38

want to start with some basics i think a lot of people

4:40

work with a picture of agencies

4:42

in their head like more or less

4:44

comes from madman but

4:47

that's not how it works anymore give people the short

4:49

version of what of what ad agency

4:52

does i mean if someone

4:54

loses his semi controversial and so

4:56

i suspect that dissimilar can sense

4:59

that mad , he knows

5:01

he has people who sit around the room

5:03

and and talk about ideas that can have

5:05

captured the collective imagination people people

5:08

it's similar an intense and

5:10

design an design but

5:13

no smith there's like tons of time

5:15

and people just come hanging just the country

5:17

than martinis and between

5:19

is where it kinda goes around right like ask

5:21

that that that really the business anymore and for lots

5:23

of reasons for from to age for

5:26

which is because

5:29

there's just so much more to do so

5:31

it's midnight his sixties advertising i

5:34

might have three months to figure

5:36

out a tv spot because i'm here

5:38

for acts but i just

5:40

got social policies got down

5:42

final direct marketing and advertising

5:45

is a million things that need to get made every

5:47

single back to the time

5:49

making and production and kind

5:52

of out into the world is like compress

5:54

dramatically to the impact that a made

5:57

see is that there's less tagged as can sit

5:59

around madmen takes a

6:02

much more bite more enough working

6:04

figuring stuff out and because and lot more to spit

6:06

making spit making did you with that

6:08

at that time it's similar in that the ideas

6:11

and incomes coming up with ideas as can still his

6:13

name of the game but like the manifestation

6:15

how that works

6:17

that is not my right ear i'm not trying

6:19

to you and say i need to address something and christmas sales

6:22

you're going to come up with a pets in some smart

6:24

creative people are going like make some advertising

6:26

that's going turn an authentic assets that and the

6:29

distribute on the various media

6:31

platforms famously in a sort

6:33

of madmen days the buying

6:35

the space is where the agency's made

6:38

money you would by the time from tv networks

6:40

using a cut of that cost and

6:42

that's money that's like not

6:44

the case with the and six grams of the

6:46

world i don't think how don't you make your money

6:49

the service model it's kind of i

6:51

guess similar nature to like other substances

6:53

which offers you know your pity

6:55

day retainer or a project fi

6:58

by a clumsy and you'd turn to discover

7:00

surfaces scum for that engagement

7:03

and in from there you have people you

7:09

pay for to from for wave of and

7:11

so we make money to disagree with the past

7:13

for labor and to him in the or output

7:15

as a point of view in the brand how the

7:17

shows up in advertising asked to preserve

7:20

the committee for me it's and fifteen it's a

7:22

myth or in a platform some of them others etc

7:24

etc said the money is

7:26

it's retainer base and if works with

7:28

other service company

7:31

that might as i was as a lawyer melissa

7:33

lawyer lawyers famously bill and six

7:35

maintenance which is very

7:38

great for their business i law firm hardly

7:40

not through hassle what is that the law firm fear

7:43

is that are you think about it he like okay words

7:45

were in a sign a big car company where

7:47

to put ten people on their account where your daughter time

7:50

and if they go over we're going to go the more or

7:53

if some if you have like a central

7:55

planning team or something gets involved will built for that time

7:57

to or is it a little fuzzy

7:59

the seat of approximately we we are

8:02

a

8:03

very much a creative ideas driven

8:05

agency

8:06

a lot of what we do is a labor

8:08

of love fried so when we think we're

8:10

close to making something are coming up

8:12

for something really great there's , way

8:15

we'd go to a point like i'm were over

8:17

on hours hours know because that's

8:19

actually for heavy that that beneficial

8:21

for them or to us so we

8:23

worry so far less about our

8:25

sisters not game that people are

8:27

much more focused the moon and

8:30

so are they would we're talking to from his we

8:32

want to make sure that we have to break people

8:35

on their business and then from merits

8:37

can we can unlock can lot of different things and

8:39

hopefully you'll get far more output and you ever

8:41

it dissipated because you got the right key

8:43

my is all about securing the right team

8:46

and then from there and that worrying about our

8:48

his or her nickel and diming or been to

8:50

specific about the litter box because at

8:52

today's world he knows you never really

8:54

know what you're going american to get started

8:57

yeah that is very similar to me welcome

8:59

to this podcast spanish to be who

9:01

have it every week or so

9:03

years i he got some people dedicated

9:06

some clients you must have some central functions

9:08

how is one can be structured

9:10

turkey structure

9:12

you've got a very traditional

9:14

structure of happy to see works were you

9:16

have a tougher house and eclectic

9:18

mix with your use , a half

9:21

of those weapons to business and this of

9:23

erupts is deprived such as pretty traditional

9:26

at the negativity

9:27

the creatively lead agency snacks a very

9:29

distinct so even though i'm the ceo

9:32

of an eruption come as a society my

9:34

partner com a lever mean he's the queen

9:36

of us the hippocrates

9:42

no for that that's our cats are

9:45

you're trying to create

9:47

a condition and and space creature

9:50

v to exist

9:54

he's not around the scotch

9:57

and those teams have some basic functions

9:59

compared with they have creative

10:02

leadership cds chris paterson credits have

10:05

media oftentimes august strategy

10:08

those are functions are always can fly

10:10

facing another a lot of other functions or can make

10:12

everything work if you , have

10:14

use a defenseman give

10:17

a lot of lot directions

10:19

help support decreases and making

10:21

of work into top level it's

10:24

kind of business a creative and

10:26

then for mary of thieves or put the

10:28

round the

10:30

no seems a little sensor and

10:32

clients i know the answers they're

10:34

busy all the time the already said to this l times

10:37

but i was wonder right like a big company

10:39

will come to you as usual and company and clumsy and say

10:41

we need a new ad campaigns and

10:43

money i make it you're not immediately

10:46

on to the next ad campaign what

10:48

happens with that team after

10:50

the super bowl ad ships and my the

10:52

assets are out in the world

10:54

that's all exception that might be the biggest

10:56

shifts this has happened in the industry like

10:59

a source is all about big you know

11:01

and he has big moments in sequence

11:03

it's a big everything and really secure

11:05

a lucky authentic and seems to

11:07

liverpool so like let's make up of

11:09

a good riddance to ,

11:12

movies it's uncertain somewhat a super

11:14

was if if would have to be campaigns

11:16

deal with tb prints out of ingredients

11:18

for those for a

11:21

modern brand as it's something like that on and

11:23

that of staff can afford

11:26

threat fashion show us and assume that people shop around

11:28

that the his life that of brand

11:30

of operated to

11:33

if matter are working on is hop

11:36

on a thursday the indies

11:39

with this happy you're

11:41

managing the suits of has it's you know every

11:43

single second the day there with severe

11:45

sepsis in the world that you're responding to iraqi

11:47

something that to be the country

11:49

and feared the didn't expect and so you're kind of feeding

11:52

muslim so since has more dynamic

11:54

process you know been wet where it's less about kind

11:56

of you launch wet campaign maybe

11:59

take over and it's tough

12:01

to figure out what the next campaign is very much

12:03

in it and and always on you're

12:05

thinking about the brand and how to respond

12:07

to what's happening in the real world of

12:10

what were you through that because we we just had can you

12:12

else on from where beauty that selena gomez as

12:14

he runs much smaller companies companies

12:17

work with but their whole thing is like redress

12:20

consumer the were doing that ourselves

12:22

like the eighty person company

12:24

twenty three of them are like online

12:27

all day or habitats oh they do in emerging

12:29

read our to consume platforms other

12:31

brands are doing that now right if you run any kind of

12:33

company bringing their

12:35

okay we're gonna talk to our customers on the internet

12:37

function closer to the center

12:40

of the company seems really important

12:42

but you're describing you are agency

12:44

as to in everyone wants to split

12:46

are lots of different models you know how they

12:49

do that sometimes to see him over the ceo

12:52

as it themselves for you know oftentimes know oftentimes

12:54

company's the voice of that friends comes from

12:57

the family themselves i would send that cuts both

12:59

ways from the sprint yeah to the

13:04

yeah

13:11

he believes murders managed at

13:14

least as an effigy that has

13:16

since passed around printing

13:19

of which are free and

13:20

the winning that voices actually you it

13:22

is pretty natural and so

13:25

we have lots of different dynamics were sometimes

13:27

were own the interest of for brands such

13:29

brands presence and ethics we owed

13:31

more of the voice of personal and

13:34

the

13:40

different models but i'd say if it's

13:42

still very valuable to the

13:44

, nurses understands the voice

13:46

of a brand freebie really well and

13:49

can talk about things are happening in there can be

13:51

in the world outside of you are silo

13:54

as company graphs that i would recommend

13:56

that for companies at every step

13:58

aside for which can be reach can level

14:02

it

14:09

how does not managing the size of wine

14:11

iraq as you've got these like central production

14:13

teams from syria central business administrative

14:15

functions finance a toilet seat

14:18

but as you get new clients you gotta build new creative

14:20

teams around those clients the

14:22

have like a ratio in your head is how

14:24

big the central themes

14:27

should be as you get more clients is at a cost

14:29

that you manage

14:31

i don't think i would say that we can sink

14:33

a pastor is like a good could have managing

14:35

to a size or ratio to our to

14:37

our dollar the challenge i think

14:40

for any a to see as skills

14:43

agencies are built around

14:45

the creativity and attendant of

14:47

it's tracks

14:50

, they have potential for a sign that comes

14:52

directly from what it

14:54

thinks it was trying to do apply them as

14:56

to treat more of a foundational

14:59

approach that gives people the space

15:02

and and the inability to could have snakes

15:04

figure

15:12

if things average person i

15:14

, knew people given the space

15:17

and then scales switch tales through

15:20

creating the and omit and actor gets will spend a lot

15:22

of time talk about the environment of creativity

15:24

and the culture of creativity and that allows

15:27

somebody you may ask what someone else

15:30

the command and go oh i get it i get

15:32

the why dynamics now i'm gonna to apply

15:35

that to this and

15:37

you can scale that

15:40

the nation and get the right people

15:43

i think if we would excited

15:45

like mandate a way of doing things i think we'd be a very

15:47

limited

15:49

having a the company

15:51

i think we are sixteen hundred

15:53

globally

15:54

we have offices all over the world but a

15:56

we started in portland portland oregon

15:58

a and we've been in the

15:59

and when am

16:02

i wanted where it shanghai when

16:04

mumbai when tokyo

16:06

a power

16:07

you talking the destruction of the company a little bit there's you to

16:09

see how he's going to chief creative officer how much

16:11

time do you get to spend on the creative

16:14

how much time do you spend reviewing campaigns

16:16

and giving notes on it sort of thing that's

16:18

definitely the best part

16:20

in a unique part of why we can you because it is

16:23

that is our whole thing we get in a lifetime

16:25

and you're talking about

16:26

we get teams

16:29

, what isn't a token ideas of

16:31

on it's the reason i look

16:33

displeases reason i love my job

16:40

the just sitting ,

16:42

talking to people about i guess we say the concept to

16:44

be and we try to create as

16:46

many forums as possible the

16:48

war it proves to people write a team

16:50

who's working on it a day to day like

16:53

the comic five seconds that he was

16:55

reading and then and us and

16:57

as an officer a to sea level of

16:59

you must have to the beach screen

17:01

about idea

17:05

harper

17:06

the this is like good set of decoder

17:08

questions you have been at one

17:11

for a long time as you are in the planning

17:13

department and your the managing director than he ran a new

17:15

york office now you are the global ceo

17:18

you also

17:19

that you have a new ceo after that the last founder

17:21

lust if there's a new team and

17:23

charge in the founders of exited they were very

17:25

same as they set this culture when

17:28

i say because ad agency there is a lot of them

17:30

that makes how do you make decisions

17:33

and how the changes you've gone up in a company and

17:35

i you're in the summer

17:36

pick one of

17:38

the things that's from me pause if it's

17:40

i've grown

17:43

, after

17:45

trying to of and david he gets

17:48

around with him and we were we were very

17:51

close to everything close to way the same his

17:53

decisions i think that's the most formative same process

17:55

that is if it's like we're coming in off the street

17:57

and secretary infographic place

17:59

warmer

18:02

than anything else and my life with my

18:04

honest with yourself

18:08

it becomes second nature to

18:10

have a sense for least

18:13

i didn't care about and is supposed

18:16

to be in , and it

18:18

looks as if it's tricky with

18:20

africa for good at for good map

18:23

if is a real phrase is legit

18:25

there is also

18:26

the theory you'd go to the

18:28

antibiotics you look what you did and he has

18:30

it's of have access to good i'm from

18:33

i'm from that you have an existence

18:35

of worms

18:40

the

18:43

actual words of the founders and apply

18:45

them can be manic you

18:47

can apply them as philosophies

18:49

do this and they can work so as we

18:52

know that are creatively live video below to make requests

18:54

people caught up in the world with you know that they're

18:56

super general principles ah

18:59

and today's context might mean something

19:01

different

19:02

the want to add of your treated us and

19:04

it's okay so far as you ever like our job from

19:07

a decision making prospective students

19:09

we hold the philosophies and

19:11

be light on the rules so he put this

19:13

into practice when he must become a big reason decision

19:16

to widen , famously

19:18

but lights agency for a long time

19:20

route bottom was a famous commercials commercials

19:23

soccer portsmouth trades bud light said hey we're going

19:25

to reopens can't you can pitch us again if you want to

19:28

and you are declined he said we're not gonna do that were awesome

19:30

way that's way cute account i'm

19:32

assuming that the money how did you make that decision

19:35

the other things aren't easy but if

19:38

you take the principal at the philosophies i

19:40

was it you wanna work on things were

19:43

the but what what's huge if it's a little bit

19:45

like dating where he says he fears

19:47

enemy like you can kind of try and show up to

19:49

be the person you think somebody

19:51

wants you to be or v who you are

19:53

and see if that works a were always i

19:56

think we try to be very cool and

19:58

accepting

19:59

the idea that point we may not be the

20:02

thing that you want and a scoop it up

20:04

as in a sea sick was like they had

20:06

a new team in place and they wanted to go different wretched

20:09

in the site ethical

20:11

we'd rather save go forth

20:13

and wish them the best of luck instead

20:15

of trying to thank you the do

20:17

something that really

20:19

we don't

20:20

that's not a model for most by client

20:23

service type companies

20:25

prayer trying to attract business retain business

20:27

slowly razor fees over time i'm not saying

20:30

that i know anything with my interest businesses but

20:32

if there's like a game that's ,

20:34

different for wine red wines known for

20:36

for moves like that for

20:39

acting against it's revenue interest in terms

20:41

of cultural interest how

20:43

do you think about that not agree about to center since

20:45

think sounders are very able to do

20:47

right they retain the capital inside the organization

20:50

to make decisions like that you're

20:52

in a new spot how do you think about those

20:54

trade offs in communicating them and making

20:56

forever and buys into the tradeoff

20:58

so

20:59

the have to acknowledge like the one thing it's a different

21:04

cities are stupid right so we're not

21:06

publicly held

21:07

held by off the company

21:09

a quarterly pressure

21:11

and allows us to make

21:14

decisions for the won't and

21:16

ultimately our brand is defined by are

21:18

afraid of integrity it

21:20

along if we get

21:22

to mess with that really yeah

21:24

roads we are men our

21:27

long term success will pick

21:29

so

21:30

but for gonna be in a position where vaccines

21:32

in jeopardy and the opportunity to mix and thing

21:35

really compete for behalf of with

21:37

actually it's time

21:39

for us even not my past

21:42

term sort of outside

21:44

that i go out in his pocket

21:46

let let's focus on the launch of so as

21:49

, being part of how the company being

21:51

independent last meters it's and

21:53

then in terms of how do we make those decisions

21:56

you don't think it's first thing is actually to get

21:58

has he done everything that we

21:59

in to demonstrate what

22:02

we do and the value of what that would be

22:04

you know and as long as it's understood and

22:06

then there's like a in our and

22:08

never has been it's like okay rocket

22:11

you know is is making sure that you've reached that point

22:13

that you've made is what you

22:15

do and what you're about super

22:17

clear with at least the decisions clear bizarre

22:20

to become less than at that point

22:22

is have to

22:23

the coffee

22:25

when you go to patch clients to say look this is who

22:27

we are he wanted you got

22:30

it mean there's only so many clients the

22:32

budgets to afford you in

22:34

the world are you singing say there

22:36

are just rotate through us at some point or

22:39

are you thinking man we gotta i

22:41

hope there's more competition a d d c because

22:43

those countries are going to need ad agencies in the competition

22:46

heats up the how do you think i go into business

22:48

i think we can think

22:51

this is it matter you totally backwards

22:53

and very best bet that business and

22:55

i'm like the real you for this week

22:57

we don't think about growing the business

22:59

we think about growing the opportunity and

23:02

like starts hundred for that opportunities

23:05

abundant and you have it of texas

23:07

the types of people that are into

23:10

the crate of nature of what we do and

23:12

sometimes it's a lot of but like we

23:14

know over time

23:16

there's huge value in the thing that we do

23:18

and so

23:19

trinity thirsty so when we shop a new

23:21

business i feel like our goal in

23:23

a new business environment you

23:26

again as clearly as possible

23:29

me to kick who we are that's the goal

23:31

it's not to try to convince you of something

23:34

i would never send you i this has come over and us

23:36

like and i cannot not say all things have a maybe we could

23:38

do and i'll do anything that says he is so it's

23:40

more just that if i think it's you

23:42

understand what we're about

23:44

what have a safe space for

23:46

it to get suspicious to get

23:49

to see your point is is there a cap

23:51

on because there

23:53

aren't enough companies in the world that want

23:55

to do interesting creative stuff oh

23:57

think so i think about it any more

24:00

the trees are

24:02

thinking about their brands and i think

24:04

the other brands joseph in the world and they're having a fight

24:06

for attention in a way that was never seen before

24:09

and so up there's actually more value to what

24:11

we did

24:12

the fbi and an elite least seven years

24:14

of my

24:15

we prefer it asserts the

24:17

upside potential purposes you time

24:19

of being publicly traded vs independence a

24:21

lot of your biggest competitors are gigantic

24:24

public companies wpp

24:26

omnicom that was as whatever there's such

24:28

as holding companies there's like boutique

24:30

ad agencies and the on the com

24:32

monster says up to eat them and

24:35

a promise and was to so far as

24:37

i've heard i've they say what will take all the

24:39

boring parts away run

24:41

your financing your hr and you guys and just

24:43

be creative and will have a

24:45

huge library of creative shops for people

24:47

to come into and like if you don't like them

24:50

you can go to someone else and will stay inside

24:52

the holding company even out the revenue and

24:54

this is a promise sometimes it works sometimes

24:56

it doesn't you still have to

24:58

retain all of that administrative

25:01

function writing and it's it's you like inside

25:03

of your job as ceo you've got the

25:05

big creative partner in it's crit of a company

25:08

so a lot of like us you doing is like making

25:10

sort of businesses operating so the creative

25:12

uncultured can happen the you ever think

25:14

man i should have what two things

25:16

one is companies are will do have a business us

25:18

i think about it being creative like that's

25:21

attached to have at least

25:23

the actor

25:28

administrative work if we do is very

25:30

little

25:31

we try to stay leave and

25:33

focused on the things we do for the well and

25:35

we popular with people

25:37

and companies the thing that

25:39

we don't do very well so interesting

25:42

early enough we work with a lot of the

25:44

caprice so there a place

25:46

where we are the creative

25:49

or city police

25:50

the we have to the shooters it exists

25:54

because , a bunch of services as much stuff

25:56

that we don't give and so we just

25:58

probably super analyst

26:00

we do and then

26:02

cool about

26:04

will be different partners different open to

26:06

working with because our independence does allow us to

26:08

say like it's a you know it's it's called like and

26:10

holding company exeter if you've gotta on

26:13

a direct marketing armed it's the beginning

26:15

what's

26:17

i think the push you would be

26:20

tskhinvali to they start to feel that more of

26:22

those services because there's nothing to opportunities

26:24

that are business growth opportunist than the

26:27

, that as we kind of only look at

26:30

our troops should only could some creative up to

26:32

the as as

26:35

british federal funding

26:37

for shooting and which was

26:39

the hottest on thinks we do well and parking

26:41

for that can do other things

26:43

anything to values and saying independent

26:46

or size

26:49

the darkest sweet

26:51

is a little known think i'd be

26:53

cancelled company is awesome

26:56

so happy i'd exists within

26:59

the trust and it's advances made

27:01

it clear that legally binding fit with it

27:04

why because people will be so

27:06

the no no gigantic private

27:08

equity see how plenty for you sign

27:10

up going to love to

27:14

see it as well as well as don't have a job

27:16

i target i do a lotta sea as and the so

27:18

and the background works the gigantic

27:20

feet at it we we like very

27:23

literally toss and i was i the realities

27:25

of when

27:27

you said break to make a mac when it's hot what to social

27:29

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27:31

the ads wide mix

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to shopify dot com flashed [unk]

29:57

decoder all lower

29:59

hi go

30:08

to shopify dot com watch decoder

30:22

there's two sides of your business the

30:24

creative side and the distributions

30:26

let's talk about the distribution i'm

30:29

very curious how you think the

30:31

platforms are doing and habit dynamics

30:34

of advertising the social platforms are affecting you

30:36

are the big ones facebook snap

30:40

he added that having bad quarters their businesses

30:42

are down i can't see your

30:44

financial results but i look at the big agency

30:46

financial results cause a problem companies

30:49

they seem to be doing great enter very

30:51

optimistic about next quarter her

30:53

yesterday

30:54

during well and we fill bullish on the on

30:57

the future you don't accept it works

30:59

some suffer from to going epic

31:02

if you know how to say this your secret there's

31:04

a lot of issues russians seems

31:06

and to teach me is media committed smith

31:08

issue and that's that when i can for says up and

31:10

replaces control this

31:13

that's , that's of about around everybody's trying to figure

31:15

it out the things escalated

31:17

from our perspective we think

31:19

about it less is kinda for

31:22

all of he isn't it digital

31:24

social inventory and more still using

31:26

those classrooms is to create of

31:28

opportunities enough because this was

31:31

interesting since you can do on

31:33

the a class marx or integral

31:35

to gaining a hot and consciously

31:37

to making an awful spots to we think

31:39

of them is kind of like advertising

31:42

revenue business and it's and

31:44

more about to print of kansas in

31:46

a better cafe things it's a bit of a misnomer

31:49

as long , it was like once

31:51

or social strategy and it was like taking

31:53

a tv commercial and on the subsurface

31:55

fox right but now he sips of platform

31:58

is getting more distinctive looking for

32:00

back and i think there are opportunities

32:02

for us but we look at creatively to release

32:05

can i thought i was exploit topic but

32:07

you know take advantage of

32:09

i mean teresa dollars and i want to ask

32:11

lot about the created and that and differences in how you plan

32:14

for the perform spread com is a weird place

32:16

hunter officers echelon that

32:19

it's a the first ago usually when things

32:21

go south the platform companies

32:23

have sell the inventory we're having

32:25

bad quarters publicly

32:28

traded ad agencies that i can look at

32:30

to have a good quarters and they're optimistic about

32:32

next where there's a weird dynamic him as

32:34

i don't quite understand where do you

32:36

sit in are you having a good quarter and you're optimistic

32:39

are you saying well things are going weird

32:41

the quarter an optimistic and that's how around

32:43

it anything just to be you know it's a super

32:46

quarter of a i don't want to just

32:48

expensive and oracle of any kind of but i

32:50

think the models changed models changed because

32:52

i think even the notion that the minute

32:55

you have a hint of recession you cannot spending it's

32:58

a little different because just a way

33:00

that media works and the always on nature

33:02

of brands i don't think you can look

33:04

at the same way you can't just be like ah nevermind

33:07

of smell not show up and public anymore

33:10

and he knows i suggest

33:13

you may not five books this year for example

33:15

you know but like maybe but like

33:17

you so that's your everyday

33:19

you know any have to have something have say enough to have

33:22

content to be and the season

33:24

so i just season very different

33:26

scene i think that the always of nature of

33:28

brilliance always kind of the man's death we stay

33:31

salient there was stay sort of

33:33

engage in conversations

33:35

even in recessionary to pick pick

33:37

the philosophy of how brands show

33:39

up and philosophy difficult economic times

33:42

show think my teeth

33:44

they do you think that's why the agencies are doing

33:46

okay and are optimistic and platforms

33:48

are not doing okay because they'd still need you

33:50

to stay in a conversation but maybe you're spending

33:53

wacky money with the platforms himself

33:55

i'm sad to think about that more but

33:57

i think it's certainly is a worthwhile hypothesis

33:59

for your

34:01

the demand for concepts as high as ever do

34:03

you necessarily need to spend the

34:06

see that everyone maybe not an

34:08

epic i know efforts to high so pitiful really

34:11

looking at the media next morning everything

34:14

and and seeing a little bit more emphasize front

34:17

of it does can flick it spent it's kind of like our

34:19

maybe off put it on hop on that

34:21

number you know same as what deployment

34:23

of roulette table little bit differently in

34:26

what's the matter to misery and odyssey that

34:28

you don't you pitcher values and here's why hadn't read

34:30

or listen to radio they are you're saying we can

34:32

increase your sales is that the

34:35

key number at the end of the day the bottom line

34:37

sales come up for clients

34:39

in our world we'd ya it as

34:41

much as anything interest rate so

34:44

brand health and another suspicious

34:46

and are

34:48

atheists to stop that

34:51

is your brand and how will that shop in is your

34:53

friend resonating with the

34:55

audience if you'd she tried to feel like a lot my bread

34:57

anymore relatively young people with jersey

35:00

then it's like okay that's the task that comes

35:02

before needing to you know

35:04

similar which is right is it

35:06

differs from okay what's your brand about

35:09

why will people talk about that removing

35:11

of emotional relationship threatening

35:13

authentically more open to be a threat

35:16

is , you just restrict

35:19

the fact the really is institutes

35:21

just as

35:22

it how it you benefit from

35:24

the short term but then once you can just

35:26

cut the , thing i can see the same

35:28

route and sikorski a master branch as

35:31

wanted to our metric

35:33

is actually for brand related we're

35:35

talking about branch off with a brain to discuss

35:37

this of operate mean it's a lot to

35:39

see the pay for that we work with would see their

35:42

brains show up and most lafrance and was

35:44

you know and then it's almost always

35:46

then case that a sales generally

35:50

one of my favorite sales tweets is

35:52

when people like the brands are added again they

35:55

just means brands are while being

35:57

on twitter usually a lot

35:59

of what you're describing

35:59

the is

36:01

brands

36:01

going to be more national they're going to be worse than take but

36:04

in fact there's a gigantic global company

36:06

but manufacturing that authenticity do

36:09

you think that's a weird dynamic that

36:11

brands are acting while people

36:13

so much knew i could not get too crazy

36:15

bespoke like your i friends around and i

36:17

could say that we're talking to see that

36:19

produces unit of unit of that quickly the

36:22

just is kind of everything when i say for

36:24

you should show up more like people i

36:27

do not love it when brains are mimicking

36:29

behavior of others what

36:32

i do love is when a brand has brand clear

36:34

sense for what it believes the

36:37

know have a shot accordingly so

36:39

life i don't me like the intercept

36:42

pro tweets you

36:44

, from clients that like that

36:46

is cringe all over what i do

36:48

mean is knowing that if

36:50

climate change huge pillar of your company

36:53

figuring out how to use social media to

36:55

like actually advocate for that those

36:57

positions into to garner support

36:59

to pray conversation so i think

37:01

it's i think more like people in the sense of

37:04

having passions and individual

37:06

personalities that can come through

37:08

not mimicking what what what's

37:10

going on you know whatever

37:13

personal twelve you that you want to pay

37:15

there imagine jersey this

37:17

isn't a my sheep i target just have to ask us let's

37:19

go you ran the new york office

37:22

during what i would called the

37:24

millennium wars on a global

37:26

sea air and ever and as much nz are you finally

37:29

there were just like do in the shit again because

37:33

we live we all live through that millennia wars

37:36

there

37:37

the

37:39

don't feel like that isn't

37:42

, issue i got got advertising

37:44

so who because it's such

37:46

as and of the movements industry

37:49

like if it's not like it's always that

37:51

he didn't realize that feel like i'm home i'm sort of

37:53

like cultural storm you know

37:55

cultural storm it is i'm a gin actually i

37:57

didn't i did not get the settlement in the

37:59

media

37:59

advertising industry is there like you're a slacker

38:02

like please had a job and then

38:04

like then money i'll shut up and i was like we have to think about

38:06

the now it's like we have to think about genji

38:08

like that feels new to me in some way

38:11

no no no no a real challenge that because

38:13

i feel like as long as i've been in this business

38:15

like we're always getting a priest it's like we gotta win

38:17

with the activity

38:20

of the to get like a that's always the

38:22

free you know but i will say

38:24

that it does feel like

38:26

the collective conversation

38:29

origins he is bigger it

38:31

doesn't feel like it's just a brief anymore it feels

38:33

like it's a world there's

38:36

huge dependency the sea is a huge

38:38

cultural shift and had some impact

38:40

that are happening right now because

38:42

it's the of what's being led by the generation and

38:45

so it's weird experience in the

38:47

workplace with it's

38:50

the work in the media interviews

38:52

it is it's like it as a as a as a much

38:54

larger and

38:56

you just like okay well the money as or old now

38:58

when it was quite a spread that's

39:00

like that's what seems not to me as i

39:02

will they date like they're spending their money

39:04

they got their brands they're good

39:07

the the next if group i

39:10

would see the cheesy gets outsize

39:13

share of the conversation in our

39:15

in our meetings etc daddy's

39:18

to say this but it's like you're always trying to make

39:20

work at you can whispering

39:22

somebody the neck if you overheard

39:25

a million years so

39:27

i think the same that we try to do is tap

39:29

while where where whatever we're doing specific

39:32

resnick deeply most clearly with

39:34

the honest if to the kids

39:35

that should feel like it's got broad residents seat

39:42

at like

39:43

it ever do to can have a perspective on

39:45

quick were never turn it to push it away

39:48

in entire and yeah and yeah xanax i died

39:51

i met a singularly pushed away sir

39:53

alan famously where it's really resistance advertising

39:55

i is not a don't be shy

39:57

shit

39:58

the time a young people oh we're time on social

40:01

platforms we have to talk

40:03

with your every social platform

40:06

every company or media company is

40:08

like tic toc is a huge her instagram

40:10

, blowing itself up to more like tic toc

40:13

you tube has sorts which are

40:15

tix sucks and you tube how

40:17

much of your time or you strategically

40:19

spending on tic toc

40:21

the rise of tic toc is wild you know and

40:24

it's been a short amount of time to have to cause

40:26

harm us and the does is really crazy i think that

40:28

the thing is interesting about to talk is

40:31

that it's no longer

40:35

if you're she really distinctive audible

40:37

the english are attached to it i think he thinks that's interesting

40:40

about it right now was it like people are starting

40:42

to use it for all sorts of differ functionality

40:44

right it's not just like clearly not just

40:46

answer yes it's a how to for life

40:48

for many ways and it's a

40:51

really great platform for

40:53

ago as we will know that businesses

40:55

kind of a thrives in video

40:57

and can communicate so much their video it's a crippling

40:59

for she would take would take undoubtedly

41:02

a big part of our conversations and

41:05

require my

41:09

god exists what's different is that now you'll go with

41:12

mr castro she was my is to strategy

41:14

smile and instead

41:16

of just like mr social strategy generally so

41:19

that less that less at

41:20

are you second a lot of meetings really kendall

41:22

from successions like i need some banger tic

41:24

tacs that's

41:27

like i'm not to be how different factors like

41:29

spirit sounds like that's occupying

41:31

more of your time and he would think yes

41:33

yes it comes up of it as a little

41:35

bit of the year bit want to viral video effect

41:38

from ten years ago you know this with

41:40

limp another enough is what's what

41:42

what we do it it's doc the kids may or may not

41:44

be there

41:45

and i were brands want to spend

41:47

right so they come to you and i like we

41:50

needed tix out strategies got your playbook

41:52

of movies of movies creatives like make the stuff

41:55

and then you got any you're running it on tic

41:57

toc you're paying to talk for promotion

42:00

might never get paid to talk strategy the

42:02

thing node aussie organic is

42:04

it more like we're going to make fun vertical videos

42:07

and put him on all the plants

42:08

they're not a ladder that the phone vertical

42:11

video

42:12

jesus is essentially a desperate

42:14

i get a fit smells like reputation

42:18

as you can actually can feel like an adequate from

42:20

to get some somebody says you

42:23

, to cater for the view from the best at the or you

42:25

can do is just feel like it's

42:27

not like the tv and that you see

42:29

snow thousand or it's not like the instagram

42:32

post that you man is is

42:35

sensitive to understanding

42:37

how platforms work if you can demonstrate

42:40

a basic understanding of the differences

42:42

between the platforms and how they can have their consumed

42:45

era it era i

42:47

think it's yes are quite spinning with started

42:50

talk about this and more to come up with something

42:52

at the moment you know and and videos with

42:54

features for this that sitting in a minute and

42:56

from our perspective for true to think

42:58

about were from

43:05

and and repeat and for the

43:07

cigarettes to get estimate we

43:10

huge prize in printing the counted

43:12

the people want to consume and actually seek

43:14

out and then chef so we folks more

43:16

dirt or but yes efficiently

43:18

as updated essence happy with

43:20

i think it's a bag and i think about who are

43:22

the people in this world the can affect the platforms

43:25

and how they behave that's very

43:27

few people it's like bag kim kardashians

43:30

then you like your the money

43:32

through you don't censor money for advertising

43:34

on these platforms that is the bulk of their revenue

43:37

we have seen it with a you tube

43:39

weird stuff happens on you tube there's an apocalypse

43:42

on the advertisers leave youtube

43:44

changes changes six months later everyone

43:46

agrees that everything's fine maybe nothing has changed

43:48

but that there's a dynamic there were

43:51

you control a bunch of money the

43:53

can actually move the platforms in various

43:55

directions do you feel

43:57

that that you have that influence

43:59

for them do you feel that they're listening

44:02

to your concerns your clients concerns

44:04

it is funny if it isn't as you're saying can

44:06

fraud south feeling i have a mistake

44:09

i mean we've met with

44:11

you know sizable investments

44:13

you know the pacific it's a by the way it's

44:15

like if we don't have a level of control

44:18

where we get to dictate that interchanges and

44:20

algorithms and of us are

44:22

these are you think that's right but the others another model

44:25

much older yeah where you are buying inventory

44:27

from magazines and tv and radio

44:30

and famously advertisers did have did have of

44:32

control over what those media

44:34

outlets like for better or worse

44:36

like united states did not

44:39

appear to be spiraling into democratic

44:41

chaos in that media environment

44:43

and in this when they do because no one seems have any

44:45

country

44:46

you're right there was probably more

44:48

control from a spin perspective

44:50

of at the troops which you got from a spin perspective

44:53

it's traditional media us

44:55

by i don't know that when

44:58

we talk about control and governance

45:01

and and regulation and social be dismissed i don't

45:03

know that it's because with my to

45:07

be taking back control you don't be so

45:09

i guess i don't think the answer should be that spends

45:12

pretty quick to more control

45:14

yeah i agree of in a massive

45:16

wrestling and spanish for sale may have a career because

45:18

there's no gatekeepers on the internet but yes

45:20

code strikes me that they are very

45:23

few strong influences

45:25

on platform behavior yeah and the money

45:27

it tends to be the strongest influence of all day

45:29

after day i'm like as you represent your clients

45:31

to go and say you to recommendations

45:34

art of hand and like the money is

45:36

that coming to you and unless you get another country

45:40

no at get this is my yard unique

45:48

the earth

45:50

it ruin it by creating something it

45:53

will give a shit about so

45:55

making would be do think you can spend

45:57

your way into

45:58

a huge oh shit

45:59

it

46:03

the platform as aswell most

46:05

distinctly with that is actually still tic toc right

46:08

the other because i companies according

46:11

i'd say it's they've united states based executives

46:13

we know who they are adam

46:15

has been on the show i feel

46:17

comfortable making fun of his video that we've almost

46:20

everyone or instagram side and said

46:22

sorry for a change at like they'll

46:24

come back on the show will talk about it we can put

46:26

our tiny media pressure on him kim

46:29

kardashian can put pressure on him to talk

46:31

is a flag box writers but

46:33

one executive anyone really knows

46:35

vanessa promise you're

46:38

more to bite dance right

46:40

answers even darker boxes and

46:42

tasaday rights how do you think

46:44

about the relationship do you think okay to talk is growing

46:46

is where the young people are sending money there but

46:48

there's actually a geopolitical tension

46:51

with allowing a very opaque chinese company

46:54

dismissed access to americans

46:57

collective consciousness

46:59

i've ever listened to everything

47:01

you see on for me constitutes it's

47:03

it's it's just a difficult conversation because

47:06

in , business world

47:08

really where

47:10

, are are idea

47:13

to cut his were off the block and you've

47:15

taken his knees in terms of

47:17

the future us where we go from a regulation

47:20

perspectives and can and beans

47:22

for privacy and information as

47:25

express that we just continue to watch and

47:27

i guess the only thing i guess as a some us if we

47:29

have just ask me from a business perspective a

47:32

little harder right now to make you

47:34

moved her

47:35

americans question

47:37

he's

47:39

gonna take anything for davis we've got

47:41

more you

47:45

thirty , california in our biggest band

47:47

you upon able to how plan worked

47:50

for next and youths in a made man of for

47:53

an hour for reevaluating for risk and media

47:56

almost on almost weekly basis that's

47:58

basis huge shift to as in

48:00

one species of the rise and

48:02

fall and fall platforms events geopolitical

48:05

regulatory issues that are all catholics into

48:07

your clients worry about the geopolitical

48:10

issues geopolitical tick tock

48:11

that's where you hear like a loner into dog

48:13

bites and are we represent

48:15

an iconic american brand and maybe

48:17

we shouldn't associate ourselves with this congress

48:20

advocates

48:23

actually service in the back when it may be

48:25

but it's not something that we we we sit and talk

48:27

to clients about a lot but now because

48:30

there's a , researchers

48:32

assessed site address

48:37

we need to take a break the when

48:39

you come back when asked me about something called

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then my time putting marketing cousins together

50:49

and more time putting unsecured

50:53

the brands like have an idea

50:55

these hands were your

50:57

breath away do

51:03

you get your free and

51:06

i did not nine

51:16

one of things i think about a lot when it comes to platforms

51:18

access organic reach is

51:21

just democracy have access right

51:23

you can start a new brand you

51:25

make toothbrushes you can make a

51:27

banger tic toc maybe you're going to get a bunch of

51:29

toothbrush customers and you're going to you're off to the

51:31

races why didn't the kinda just made

51:33

like made amazing ford raptor

51:36

spot like a raptor jumps over

51:38

the desert like great commercial other

51:40

those companies are not worried about hey

51:43

we gotta find more customers make them aware

51:45

of us like ford is ford the

51:47

smaller companies after just like start

51:49

with some sales do you think

51:52

there's a point at which those companies

51:54

grow up and they say actually we never need

51:56

an ad agency we're just going to be good at tech talk

51:58

you the recent never been like

52:01

sure it's was probably not because

52:04

often times when a company starts to

52:06

primary battle is for awareness

52:08

because he assisted phonebook difference

52:10

that if you can just let people know that you exist

52:13

your gift either me as if if if

52:15

you have i got a thin and writer my device

52:18

on a detective tickets example but i

52:20

think of that three second apps you

52:22

know it's like i skipped healthy like a free sick max

52:24

it out i'm a , but the success

52:28

of a nice as the products growth

52:31

the category skirts mature that inevitably

52:34

beans the , new

52:36

interests and which be

52:38

specifics be prefer to the found

52:40

a sweet sort of get super for oxygen out as much

52:42

as a president i mean more stuff

52:45

and you're going to need to figure out how to

52:47

have an honorable position for your

52:49

brain respect

52:52

to the category is even if they

52:54

need to go talk about why that brains

52:56

difference in y de france relevance and

52:58

a lot more spaces with a lot more nuanced

53:01

it's a fulltime job is not dissimilar

53:03

to life

53:04

when you can we got like minded

53:06

in your own it's

53:08

in our plans

53:11

to it's it's a service becomes more

53:13

applicable in use his computer

53:16

executives he comes with a petition with this

53:18

is this maturity and forty seconds this

53:20

app

53:22

i don't see companies be like

53:24

oh and and ten years when i'm good

53:27

company acts and didn't do much

53:29

effects and

53:30

i feel hypersonic

53:32

companies that are feeling that way right now

53:34

on a limited scale past it but the thing

53:37

that really sucks and all that is what really enables

53:39

that is targeted ads

53:41

man you're so company at least

53:43

until recently you could buy facebook ads

53:45

target them with extraordinary precision

53:48

he could measure the conversion sales with extraordinary

53:50

precision because all the tracking

53:52

that's happening apple famously block

53:55

that on i was i was accustomed

53:57

ten billion dollars which is

53:59

just an amazing zoc from one settings

54:01

change on one platform

54:03

the argument is that really hurts and as a circus

54:05

right there had spend gets more

54:07

opaque it's harder to target it

54:09

was sales are firing more money into things are

54:12

lowered i you conversions do you feel

54:14

that to at your level hey we can't

54:16

measure things as well as we were before

54:19

sir finds her room where and see

54:21

okay first of all their

54:23

marketing with an acquisition at

54:25

a small business records very different him or

54:27

to have reached such thing as aren't you know that rights

54:30

like and small businessman who that

54:32

turkey now because it's it's it's not

54:34

just like and and it's like is a single

54:37

to right it's like a dispute is direct conversion

54:39

oftentimes my here but cookie

54:41

populates my to the casinos and the game seven

54:44

we go to larger corporations

54:46

it's less about measurement in terms

54:49

of like advertising fucking the speak to

54:51

build have to trust that's convincing

54:53

trickier you know home because you

54:55

believe the follow people in the increase of

54:58

an ongoing conversation

55:00

the good for us the purely for one can be

55:02

perspective doesn't really our

55:05

take right or game is cooperating

55:08

level where you're having have ideas archer

55:17

idea that going to draft is this at all

55:19

asks asks the canopy guess we're

55:22

sounds as you very directly how about summit

55:24

meeting soon ceo one can the biggest

55:26

coolest ad agencies in the games have you

55:28

ever walked into a meeting and sat down and

55:31

had someone give you a presentation of the word cookie pafilis

55:35

the out now

55:36

the

55:37

there's an award other than cookie pasta dishes

55:39

has no , but kitty

55:42

vakalis comes up because it's a great great

55:45

said something i'm just imagining the meeting

55:47

was like could he possibly strategy

55:50

and strategy very seriously and if that years you've

55:52

got that the fate of interest of the sucks

55:54

for affect his office service does it come

55:56

up as off to dismiss

55:59

the that

55:59

the whole turmoil that's happening between apple

56:02

and google and facebook in the ad

56:04

tech world

56:05

as a filter last year and it's resting somewhere

56:07

else in the company i , it's at

56:09

rest right now in the world bad check out

56:12

and it's a huge secrecy submit it's

56:14

less and world of branded coffee

56:16

because it's more of a of performance marketing

56:19

sort of dynamic and an

56:21

immediate concern initially itself

56:24

as different sides to build

56:25

what kind of data do you look at in your

56:28

role where you say these campaigns are effective

56:31

creatives are effective what are you looking at that

56:33

helps you make us decisions

56:34

you're obviously cobbled together the

56:37

queer as indicators of

56:40

genuine engagements so

56:42

he can't really look at any message on it's own

56:44

you get some cookies kids look at likes

56:47

it a capital if all of it together

56:49

because you receive the

56:52

world if they seem and it's were splitting

56:55

two things that you've created on

56:57

path from worcester clients see look at twitter

56:59

trending topics you look at aggro diffuse

57:01

you do look at like be pretty slick it altogether

57:03

as you're trying to get a sense for have

57:08

, exposure than your to look

57:10

at sentiment was it was positive it a

57:12

negative way there are instances where

57:14

necklace its meter that a bath

57:17

is a long as you have positive

57:19

since fit with the right audience right and

57:21

nike's examples at this point it is that really

57:23

well as i said exit to sanctioning looking

57:26

, general sense of awareness general

57:28

sense of in case with some sentiments in

57:31

an overall you're constantly fifty

57:33

impact the collective body

57:36

of what you're doing has an abrupt

57:39

decay , reduce

57:42

risk the considered

57:45

to be seems to can look

57:47

at happy to take happy picture frames and what

57:50

he wants some actually the world oppressing

57:52

as comes less amorphous world soft

57:54

because they're real time mattress these plans to

57:57

travel to

57:58

the you feel like your idea what metrics that are important

58:01

are the same as your clients are you educating

58:03

the clients on a stop counting retweets

58:06

look at this more important metric instead

58:09

the idea of measurements is one of the

58:11

bigger keep the sixty this before have i

58:13

consider you can look excise before

58:16

or whether you're going to whether or not it was a really

58:18

simple mechanical like nielsen really can

58:20

of tv him and i can speak to the media

58:24

now there's lots of data and

58:26

last me last measurement the activities

58:28

with useful was ,

58:30

tickets and so we have a lot of humor

58:33

section of of what are the the

58:35

mystery it is with news of

58:37

three interest in the to feed the

58:39

zippers are against her to success

58:42

to question we ask question

58:44

it is

58:47

it's my mom and my dad see a thing

58:49

you talk about as at that about move more

58:52

says if we see people talking

58:54

about the breed more often with those are

58:56

all things that are valid and you just

58:58

have to get really fun of a clear

59:01

and hopefully ideally and dream it what

59:03

that looks like and therefore you have a greater

59:06

success

59:07

if reaching your goal

59:09

we're coming up on time usually

59:11

end of his in areas like the alton sophocles

59:13

what's next for one imagine out here threat

59:16

i know a lot of people mad world are

59:18

producer creighton used to be an advertising producer

59:21

and all of them tell me that everybody

59:23

who's ever worked in advertising has one

59:25

horror story of a suit the just went completely

59:28

sideways and that's what you all talk about bar

59:30

you have a long career in advertising i want

59:32

to know your best

59:33

shoot that went disastrously

59:35

that are you a bear to i'm not like

59:37

really hurts at that that

59:39

is is suited exciting suddenly since

59:42

i quit his job either have one advertising

59:44

disaster everybody i know has one i

59:47

have one i don't even work in advertising oil what's your

59:49

as i got a you got to somebody or show i quickly

59:51

it's a long story this is like to see him i was ago i

59:53

can't be blamed for this let's see i'm

59:56

we had a series sponsored by a company

59:58

i was at the at job mulvaney show

1:00:01

in new york city there was the radio city scherzer

1:00:03

that the special and i get a call middle

1:00:05

shelf from some is freaking out that

1:00:08

i know well or bug was why he said read

1:00:11

and average i truly i don't

1:00:13

care and i'd turn up and was tested

1:00:15

young lady show and i found out later that everyone

1:00:17

had worked at all my the figure out

1:00:19

the the video was not such

1:00:22

that a red bug would have are so as white

1:00:24

lucas is the dumbest thing i've ever never

1:00:26

, a scramble night six adept

1:00:31

at risk as at as as question because

1:00:33

every issue i'm being honest

1:00:35

in some ways to disaster it's is

1:00:38

either a socialist never you

1:00:41

do before you like talk about like

1:00:43

that was real serious this about the

1:00:45

metrics that when and we three and affects all it's

1:00:47

very analytical then you find yourself

1:00:50

on a set would like a grizzly bear guys

1:00:53

, like was like you know

1:00:56

it's just not even set up to go smoothly

1:00:59

we have go smoothly where the cryptographic

1:01:01

no joke that was forty countries where

1:01:03

it was a live freely bear and as

1:01:06

a very few of them who are kind of

1:01:08

actors and and

1:01:10

this say the grocery business was kind of like

1:01:12

a lethargic as one would be a

1:01:17

when an account suggested that we we give it for

1:01:19

the any kind of like

1:01:21

the tinted his

1:01:24

trailer , are presented with

1:01:26

nice nice we were we

1:01:29

halloween she's winnie the pooh assistance no

1:01:32

way this specific explicit

1:01:35

monstrous for a sleeper were tennis

1:01:37

for a and

1:01:39

so we had to have like this really delicate

1:01:41

conversation that was like hum

1:01:43

, say that this is not not

1:01:46

, a fan and

1:01:48

this is gonna refuse the sunset

1:01:50

strip the ideas that the feel like

1:01:52

us to hate us you know of course

1:01:54

of course on the sofa

1:01:57

and out so yeah that that

1:01:59

was that great

1:01:59

even i

1:02:02

, it snores these

1:02:05

passages what's next for widening kennedy

1:02:08

we to spend at a comma

1:02:10

time thinking about what a

1:02:12

out of different ways the creativity can manifest

1:02:14

itself differently in fact he is alex i think that

1:02:16

the campus has gotten broader is how do you

1:02:19

do interesting stuff feels

1:02:21

like it's activities redefining the way the

1:02:23

france europe it's is was interested people

1:02:26

are dominating social media me

1:02:29

too active feel more like people need to

1:02:31

give take for risk to know what to do

1:02:33

things that feel more genuinely

1:02:35

interesting and sick more the ages of

1:02:37

would it needs to be a corporation so like we

1:02:39

spend a lot of time talking about how branch

1:02:42

of and an entirely different way about

1:02:44

how big or small company isn't as

1:02:46

it's of the biggest excited about so just sticking

1:02:48

our say a thing of and taking

1:02:51

big ideas and creativity but not the

1:02:53

world and just using the campuses that we have

1:02:55

to do that as

1:02:57

, money on thank you so much for coming under two hundred

1:02:59

they use arsonist or the clients fantasies about

1:03:01

this great houses really

1:03:06

the patience of your arthur for teens and

1:03:08

sa say thank you for listening to decode our hope you

1:03:10

enjoy this is always at love to hear

1:03:12

we think of the show email us at decoder

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mean at the show i will almost certainly retreat

1:03:30

retreat a production of urged in part of the box in your

1:03:32

pocket network says episode was produced by

1:03:34

creighton dismounted jackie mcdermott it was edited

1:03:37

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1:03:42

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1:03:46

is eleanor dot for seen as