0:07

What's that at the Bed's

0:10

spooky?

0:11

Hey, Joky, I'm really sure it's dead.

0:13

It's coming this way. Wait

0:15

a minute, I said,

0:19

I das

0:24

pease.

0:26

Hey boo, it's me

0:29

Ros And welcome to

0:32

Ghosted by Raz

0:34

Hernandez, the podcast where

0:36

I talk to people that I like about

0:39

the paranormal. I

0:41

have been talking to people lately that

0:44

I like, but I did not know them before.

0:47

Uh, because you know, we're trying we're trying out

0:49

different things in this new year,

0:52

and uh, I'm talking

0:54

to someone that made

0:58

a documentary about a

1:00

very famous alien abduction,

1:03

the Pascagoula Abduction,

1:06

which is a.

1:07

Fun word to say.

1:10

The time that we had the

1:13

host of That's Messed

1:15

Up, Kara Klank and

1:18

Lisa Trager, when the two of them

1:20

were on the show a little while back,

1:22

we talked about this case, but

1:24

not nearly as in depth

1:27

as we do on today's episode,

1:29

because we have on this filmmaker.

1:32

He's got a new four part

1:34

series called Pascagoula

1:38

seventy three, and he

1:41

really really researched

1:43

this one, and I think it's a compelling

1:46

story. I also realized, I don't think

1:48

we've ever had a UFO

1:53

alien person quite

1:55

like this on the show. But this

1:58

is definitely a UAU episode,

2:01

And you know, I'm very curious what you think of

2:04

this, and with me doing

2:07

what we're doing, which is sometimes

2:09

not having silly people. And

2:11

when I have people on like this, I

2:14

save the dolls, I save

2:16

the the EVPs. We

2:20

don't do that with our expert

2:23

type guests. But

2:26

I hope you enjoy this conversation

2:29

today. Let me just tell you a

2:31

story I read in my email. This one

2:34

comes from Melissa, who

2:36

writes the subject line,

2:39

my dead grandmother ruined

2:42

the surprise of my engagement.

2:45

And then in parentheses, happily.

2:47

Melissa writes, one night in September

2:50

twenty fourteen, I had a wonderful visit

2:52

with my maternal grandmother while I was

2:55

asleep. When these types of

2:57

dreams happened, the majority of the time

2:59

are surround a completely white

3:02

There might be a cowch or a table, but

3:04

that's it and we don't have to

3:06

talk. It's absolutely the most

3:09

peaceful, joyful, stress

3:12

free place I could ever imagine.

3:15

During this visit, she was sitting on a love

3:17

seat with pretty green decorations

3:19

in her hair, her favorite color. She

3:22

was smiling from ear to ear and gave me

3:24

the tightest hug of congratulations.

3:28

Well, the next day, Sunday,

3:31

I had taken off from work and my boyfriend

3:33

and I made plans to drive out to mon

3:36

Talk, which is on the east end

3:38

of Long Island. Aside from the

3:41

rich snobs you sometimes run into, it's

3:43

my favorite place on Earth, built

3:45

with beach memories that started in my childhood.

3:49

While we were making the two hour drive out

3:51

there, I knew he

3:54

was going to propose to me on the beach, and

3:56

yes, that's what happened. I

3:59

was looking out at the water and the waves,

4:01

and I turned around and he was on one knee. I

4:04

happily said yes, but didn't tell

4:06

him about the dream for quite some time because

4:08

I didn't want the moment to be ruined for him.

4:11

I was so happy, not only for

4:13

the obvious reason, but because it was such

4:16

clear confirmation that my grandmother

4:18

is with me, which I feel often.

4:21

I hope that everybody out there realizes that they

4:24

have some type of guardian angel and

4:26

or spirit guides. My grandmother

4:28

passed away of breast cancer when I was only

4:31

seven, but we always had a

4:33

special connection both before and

4:35

after her passing. AH

4:38

now thank you for sending that, Granny.

4:42

We love the congratulations, but wait, wait

4:45

until the night after. Don't

4:49

jump the gun, Grannie.

4:51

Now I think it's adorable. That's so sweet.

4:53

Thanks for sending that.

4:55

Okay, here we go. We're gonna talk

4:57

about an alien abduction. Here's

5:00

my conversation with filmmaker

5:03

Darcy Weir and with

5:05

the show.

5:10

Oh my god.

5:11

I am joined by

5:14

a documentary filmmaker who

5:16

has a new film called

5:19

Pascagoula seventy three.

5:21

Darcy, We're hey, Ross,

5:24

Hi from Canada.

5:26

From Canada.

5:27

You're pretty nice, and that's what they say.

5:30

Thanks, not all of us, but I try

5:32

to be.

5:33

Yeah, I haven't. I have not met those

5:35

people yet, but I assume you

5:38

know there's assholes everywhere.

5:40

Yeah, it's true.

5:43

But we're here to talk about

5:45

UFOs. Let's do it. You're

5:47

not a ufologist.

5:50

I don't consider myself a ufologist.

5:52

I consider myself an independent

5:55

filmmaker and you know, documentarian

5:59

I interviewed upologists.

6:01

Ah okay, yeah,

6:04

is that is that like a

6:07

like a it's not a degree someone

6:10

can have a ufologist.

6:12

I think there's people within uphology

6:15

that are trying to push degrees right now, Oh

6:17

really, Yeah, there's a guy named Danny Shean that

6:19

has like the new Paradigm

6:22

Research Institute and he sells courses

6:24

for like ten thousand of pop.

6:26

Oh maybe this is the business

6:28

I should get into. Maybe

6:32

what are you going to teach uphology?

6:35

You I don't know.

6:36

I like ufo ology, ufo

6:39

oology. I like, oh, yeah

6:41

that's true ufo. No, I

6:43

say, borrow the first Oh you

6:46

ufo wait ufo

6:49

ufology.

6:50

Yeah you got it.

6:51

Yeah, that as good because it's one

6:53

of those things like biopic

6:56

or biopic.

6:57

It's biopic.

6:59

People say biopics, people say biosity.

7:01

It sounds like a medical procedure.

7:03

It sounds like an eye thing for sure. But

7:05

okay, so this film,

7:08

yeah, would you consider it a

7:11

film or is it a docu series

7:13

series?

7:14

Four episodes and we

7:17

just cover a different thing each episode,

7:20

but.

7:20

All based in this one case. Yeah.

7:24

Yeah, I mean it's like

7:28

Jerry Springer doc that just came out two

7:30

episodes.

7:32

Loved it.

7:32

I wish it was longer than two.

7:33

Episodes me to So this one's

7:36

four Yeah, that's one hour each, pretty

7:38

much great amount perfect. Some

7:41

of these it's like just stop toney,

7:43

this is a ten minute story.

7:45

Yeah, I think this story merits

7:49

four episodes because there

7:52

was like a lot to unpack and I never thought

7:55

I was going to go into it and make

7:57

four episodes. I thought, okay, I just do this

8:00

in an hour and a half, make it a feature link doc.

8:03

But I flew over to

8:05

England, believe it or not, to speak

8:07

to this ufologist, Philip

8:10

Mantel, who's, like you

8:12

know, been researching cases

8:15

in Europe and abroad.

8:18

He's based out of northern

8:21

England for over

8:23

decades I think now, and so essentially

8:28

I sat down with him. He unpacked

8:31

everything, and once I started

8:33

editing and pulling archival

8:35

data and all that stuff, I was like, okay, I can

8:37

do this in four episodes.

8:39

Yes, well, that's what I love

8:41

so much because I saw the first episode

8:43

and it's it's so great to

8:46

see all of the media, to

8:48

see just the interviews,

8:50

the news star is, the audio, the documents,

8:53

just having it all there, and

8:56

I imagine that there is a

8:58

lot over the years.

9:04

This story we

9:06

have talked about on this podcast before really

9:09

and actually it's one of my favorite

9:12

of the abduction cases.

9:14

I love it for a very specific

9:16

reason because, by far

9:20

the hottest, sexiest

9:22

abductee of all time, the

9:25

younger one. What's his name is Parker how

9:27

Ben Part that's exactly

9:30

in nineteen seventy three, who I would have abducted

9:32

to.

9:33

Well, you know what, he's flattered

9:36

from the grave.

9:37

I'd say, he is so hot.

9:40

And I because

9:43

we had a couple of comedians and sometimes

9:45

I'll do my little research about

9:47

these cases and we couldn't get we couldn't

9:49

get it, like, we couldn't get past how hot

9:51

he album. And you know what's even

9:54

hotter about him? He kind of disappeared

9:57

after and didn't really want to like

10:00

give interviews, is my understanding

10:02

of that.

10:02

Right, he became the Mississippi abductee

10:05

man of mystery, which makes.

10:07

Him even hotter.

10:08

There you go.

10:09

I'm sorry, but you're already hot. You

10:11

don't have to have the most interesting

10:13

story in the room.

10:15

He knew that.

10:16

He said, I'm just gonna go be hot

10:18

somewhere else.

10:18

There you go. He was afraid of being

10:21

too hot in public.

10:23

And you have the story

10:25

about getting taken up into it ufo.

10:28

Please.

10:29

Yeah, I mean there was some sexy

10:31

stuff going on up there.

10:33

No, I mean his story.

10:38

I didn't know that much about when I

10:40

was looking into this, like obviously, the first episode

10:42

is all about Charlie Hickson, who's

10:44

the elder man that he was with, forty

10:47

two years old at the time Calvin

10:50

was nineteen. They were

10:52

family friends because essentially

10:57

Charlie's best friend

10:59

was cal Dad, and Calvin

11:02

was looking for work. He said, you

11:04

know, can I get a job at the shipyard

11:06

in Mississippi on the river past Googlea

11:08

River. So Calvin

11:11

moved in with Charlie Hickson at

11:13

an apartment there. Shortly

11:16

there after, like the first week he moved into

11:18

this place, he gets hired, and

11:20

I think one of the funny things that Calvin

11:24

remarked was that he was hired,

11:26

abducted, and fired within the

11:29

same day.

11:30

What a day. What a day, and became

11:32

a heart throb.

11:34

And became an international heart

11:36

throb.

11:36

I guess, well, he's also, by

11:38

the way, a nineteen seventy three,

11:41

nineteen year old, which is like a

11:43

thirty five year old.

11:44

Man, like he's a grown

11:47

man.

11:47

But that's what instantly,

11:50

when I watched the first episode, I was so

11:52

grateful for because not

11:55

that I've delved too deep into this case,

11:57

but like I didn't know any I didn't know their relationship.

12:00

I just knew that they both worked together. But

12:03

that's really it's really fascinating that they

12:05

were living together.

12:06

And there's some weird stuff

12:09

that I unpacked. I mean, I

12:11

don't think I included in the documentary. But apparently

12:13

after they got abducted, they

12:16

went back to the apartment that they were staying in

12:18

and Calvin like showered

12:20

himself in bleach because he was so frightened

12:23

by the experience and like

12:25

thought that he was, you know, getting something off

12:28

of him. That's

12:31

pretty bad.

12:32

Hey, give us so give us the details.

12:34

So for anyone that doesn't know, So

12:36

these two guys, they go fishing.

12:39

Yeah, at night.

12:40

Didn't seem like the cutest

12:43

place to go fishing, by the way.

12:44

Yeah, it was kind of like a garbage

12:47

dump by the river.

12:48

Is that where they planned on eating those fish? Don't

12:52

know, because that might be your first problem.

12:53

I think it was maybe let's have some

12:56

beers, chat and get

12:58

lucky catching something

13:00

on the river, you know, maybe, I

13:02

don't know. Shortly after

13:04

they started chatting and you

13:07

know, getting everything set up and casting

13:10

their real they

13:12

apparently saw a blue light

13:14

in the distance and then suddenly

13:16

it was behind them and

13:19

they thought it was the police because

13:22

this area they were not actually supposed

13:24

to be in, they were trespassing.

13:28

So when they turned around, to their astonishment,

13:30

it was apparently a craft and

13:34

these three beings that

13:36

they couldn't quite see at first, came

13:39

floating down grabbed them. They

13:42

apparently felt like a pinch or

13:45

some kind of like instant pain when they

13:47

were grabbed, but then that went away,

13:49

and they were relaxed, and

13:52

they were taken on board

13:54

this craft and they had their

13:56

experience. They were taken

13:58

away and kind of examined,

14:01

so to speak. And this is kind of like a common thread

14:03

in the abduction tales

14:06

of ufology totally.

14:12

They also said that these beings

14:15

they weren't your run at the mill gray

14:18

aliens either. They were something

14:20

a little different. It's so weird, but

14:23

I know of a lot of abduction

14:25

cases, and I especially

14:27

love it when it's a different type,

14:30

because it makes sense that there

14:33

would be more than one species

14:37

of these, you know, beings,

14:39

and so when you hear

14:41

about these, it's way

14:44

more outrageous, and I think it's probably

14:46

harder for people to wrap their heads

14:48

around.

14:48

But at the same time, I'm like, makes

14:50

sense to me.

14:52

Yeah, I mean it's a standout

14:54

case because the creatures

14:56

or beings that took them on board the

14:59

craft were not yeah like gray

15:01

aliens, which are described as like these

15:04

short, spin lee built, large

15:07

headed, big black eyed

15:10

like small, slit mouth, no nosed

15:12

like automatons that have

15:15

no real emotion. And other abductees

15:17

reported that, actually there's an interesting

15:20

study. Have you ever heard of doctor

15:22

edgar Mitchell, the sixth

15:26

man on them Apollo fourteen.

15:28

Astronaut, No tell me about him?

15:31

So doctor edgar Mitchell was

15:34

a very intelligent guy. They called them

15:37

the Brain in Houston where

15:40

he worked for Capcom for a number of years

15:42

in the prior Apollo missions and assisting

15:45

with the Gemini missions and stuff with

15:48

our exploits in space. Going to

15:50

the moon and Pollo

15:52

fourteen was his turn. He actually got

15:55

to go land on the Moon and walk

15:57

around do a moonwalk. He came

15:59

back for that mission and he

16:02

had something

16:04

that astronauts do when they're in space

16:07

is stick to checklists, like they're

16:09

so busy and following

16:12

protocol that they don't really have a

16:14

ton of time to kind

16:16

of marvel at where they are until

16:19

things slow down a bit. And NASA

16:23

on like ground control. They're constantly

16:26

keeping them doing a routine

16:29

so they don't mess up, screw

16:31

up the mission gets lost in space.

16:33

Notice the aliens that are right next to them.

16:35

You notice the alien craft following them,

16:37

which is something people have

16:39

alluded to. Some astronauts have said

16:41

it might have happened like a Paulo

16:44

eleven buzz Aldron reported

16:46

something like that. Flip flopped

16:48

on the story over the years. But

16:52

on the way back from landing

16:54

on the moon Edgar Mitchell had

16:56

this epiphany moment. He

16:59

said that heperience kind of like I

17:02

guess, like a transcendent experience,

17:07

and he felt like it was kind of spiritual

17:10

but also psychic. He also

17:12

did what is called remote

17:14

viewing sort of exercise with

17:17

some friends that were on Earth

17:20

and practiced a psychic

17:22

modality to see if they

17:24

could guess a picture he was

17:27

holding on the Apollo spacecraft. Like he had

17:29

time to do kind of random experiments.

17:32

He got back from that and he

17:34

started up the Noetics Institute,

17:36

which studied these kind of you

17:39

know, wild out there theories

17:41

about psychic phenomenon, extrasensory

17:44

perception, how we're all connected,

17:46

and stuff like that. He also started

17:48

up the Edgar Mitchell

17:50

Research Foundation, and they

17:53

published a study called

17:55

the Free Study. I think it's the Foundation for

17:57

Research on Extratras

18:00

and Extraordinary

18:03

Claims, and that compiled

18:06

over three thousand contact

18:09

ye experiences, so people

18:11

that had abductions or

18:14

experienced non human intelligence

18:17

of various kinds. And the gray that

18:19

we talked about before comes up often

18:23

in past Goula seventy three, I'm

18:25

landing the plane here. These

18:27

things were not grays. They

18:29

had gray complexion, but it was more like

18:32

this elephant wrinkly skin. They

18:34

had these like metal spike

18:36

protrusions coming out of their heads, no eyes,

18:38

no mouth, and they kind of had a

18:40

like fused leg

18:43

sort of podium thing that

18:46

wasn't separate legs, and they

18:48

were flying.

18:49

They sound cool.

18:50

Yeah, it sound like robots, and I

18:53

think Calvin Parker and

18:55

Charlie Hickson both echoed that that's

18:57

what they thought they were because

19:00

they were very like robotic in nature.

19:03

The two men had very different

19:06

experiences because one

19:09

one into a room on the right that

19:11

would have been Charlie Hickson. He

19:14

said that he was kind of suspended in

19:16

the air and he had this like orb come

19:18

out of the wall and examined his body

19:22

that was kind of like an eye. And then

19:25

Calvin went to the left. He was

19:27

in a bigger room with a table, like

19:30

an invisible table that he was laid on, and

19:34

he discussed many

19:36

years later when he started becoming

19:38

more comfortable with talking about the experience

19:41

being physically poked

19:44

and prodded. So he had like blood taken from

19:46

him. He had some other liquid

19:48

put into him, apparently, and there

19:51

was a reasonably hot

19:53

alien woman that was kind

19:55

of orchestrating this whole thing.

19:58

Oh my god. Wait

20:00

wait, you didn't know about that. The hot, I don't remember

20:02

that part.

20:03

So she.

20:05

She was not like a robot lady. She

20:07

was more like a human.

20:09

So those spiky had automaton

20:13

things were one of them at least

20:15

was present in the room kind of, he said,

20:17

was like shut down, and this

20:20

woman was like hovering

20:23

over him and kind of like conducting

20:25

stuff. And apparently

20:28

she was not very chesty but

20:30

had a pretty face. And he recalled,

20:33

you know, if I had a couple of beers

20:36

in me, I'm out of taken her out on a date.

20:38

Stop, I'm serious.

20:41

That dirty dog.

20:44

Wait a minute, but was it freaky

20:46

deeky? Did they give because

20:49

you know that's a common one.

20:51

Yeah, I know for experiencers

20:53

there is sometimes

20:56

sex on the craft. Somewhere

20:59

in that thousand non

21:01

human intelligence experiences that Edgar

21:04

Mitchell's Foundation compiled, I'm

21:06

sure there's some sexy time.

21:07

Yeah, And there's been a few where they're like, she

21:10

was so hot, It's like, what

21:12

is she? Are you just trying to make it sound like you

21:15

exotic?

21:16

Yeah, that's what I think is kind of

21:18

reported that the women were

21:20

considered exotic.

21:22

So neither of them reported

21:25

anything of that nature.

21:27

No, he just thought the

21:30

female looking one was mildly

21:32

attractive and he would

21:34

have had a beer with her.

21:36

Okay.

21:37

But when you say poked and prodded, like,

21:40

where are we talking about, because you know that's

21:42

another part of the story that you hear

21:45

with these things. Yeah, there's a lot of butt

21:47

going.

21:47

On in a lot of these stories. Not

21:50

this one though.

21:51

So the second episode

21:53

of the series, we cover Calvin's experience

21:57

from his perspective and we have a

21:59

hip session where which

22:01

is actually the last hypnosis session

22:04

that was recorded. I think Philip

22:06

mantled the man in the UK. He

22:08

had it remotely done by

22:11

a lady named Chanel, and the

22:14

third episode is a

22:17

new person named

22:19

Maria Blair.

22:20

Yeah. I didn't know about this.

22:21

Yeah, so I didn't either write

22:23

like I was learning about this on the fly.

22:26

But Maria Blair came forward, I

22:28

think in the past five

22:31

to six years, because she went to meet

22:34

up with Calvin at like a memorial

22:37

spot that they set up on the side of the Pasca

22:39

Goula River in Mississippi, and

22:43

she was there with her husband and she wanted

22:46

to meet him and say, you know, we saw

22:49

the lights across the river

22:51

that night on the dock that you guys

22:53

were in that area. We

22:56

think we saw you being abducted because

22:58

my husband and I or like

23:01

she apparently said she pulled up the car

23:03

he was getting on. He was hired by

23:06

a captain to go on a fishing trip

23:08

or whatever and you know, work that because

23:11

I guess commercial fishing is a thing there

23:15

and maybe in the

23:17

seventies. And while

23:19

they were waiting, they saw the lights and she

23:22

they had like some kind of missing time experience

23:25

and then she got put under hypnosis,

23:29

and so we have that hypnosis session

23:31

of what she recalled that night, and she said

23:34

she was taken aboard the craft

23:36

and they took her reproductive

23:38

material that took her eggs. Oh

23:41

my god, yeah, for real, this

23:43

is what she says.

23:44

Wow, what about her husband?

23:46

She says that her

23:48

husband might have been on board the craft,

23:50

but he like she

23:53

claims that he kind

23:56

of set her up in a way, like

23:58

he knew that they were taking they

24:00

wanted to take her, and he made a deal with

24:03

the aliens to take her or something

24:05

like that.

24:06

What for realon she stayed with him,

24:09

she loved it's love. He made

24:11

a deal with aliens. You can

24:13

have my wife if you let me free

24:16

and you let me have a beer with the one

24:19

lady.

24:19

This is what they say. Wow, No,

24:22

that's Calvin.

24:23

Yeah, but maybe this guy saw

24:25

that lady and said the same thing.

24:27

I have no idea, can't speak for him.

24:30

Wait a second, Okay, this story,

24:33

this story is also This is

24:36

something that I've said before, and I'm sure in some

24:38

way whatever it could be considered problematic

24:40

to say this. But I feel like

24:43

if you have heterosexual

24:46

men, like a working class

24:49

just your average Joe that

24:52

is saying that they saw a ghost or

24:54

they were taken up into a UFI

24:56

or whatever, it's a demographic

24:59

that doesn't I want to appear super

25:01

vulnerable or be called crazy or

25:04

you know, make it seem they

25:06

don't want that. So when they come forward,

25:09

I'm kind of like I believe it a little bit

25:11

more than anyone else.

25:13

Well, I think the interesting story with Maria

25:16

and Jerry is that apparently, like

25:18

the real reason she found out that

25:21

this had all happened, she had

25:23

like these repressed memories and

25:26

didn't really recall she saw the lights.

25:29

She recalled that she didn't recall really

25:31

getting abducted.

25:32

Apparently not until the hypnosis.

25:34

Something like that. And then Jerry

25:37

was in the hospital, possibly dying,

25:41

and we have that like deathbed confession

25:44

video in the doc. She

25:47

shared it with Philip, and he

25:49

basically was saying, like I

25:52

knew all along. I was abducted

25:55

too, for like some time,

25:57

and you know, I kept it from you, the

25:59

truth, because I

26:02

didn't want you to be living

26:04

a life of panic or feel

26:06

traumatized from the whole experience, so I

26:08

just hit it, That's what he says.

26:11

Were the two guys

26:13

Calvin and what's his name

26:16

Charlie Hickson Charlie and Calvin, were.

26:18

They still alive when these people came forward?

26:21

Calvin was Charlie had passed.

26:24

Was he like, you kind of sets up

26:26

then it really would have made me not look

26:28

crazy.

26:29

Well, Yeah, they appeared on local

26:31

Mississippi news channel together and

26:33

Calvin proclaimed he was very happy she came

26:36

forward so that he wasn't like

26:38

the only person remaining alive that was

26:41

tied to that event.

26:42

Yeah, but it's nice and helpful. But

26:44

I would also be like, it's been a

26:46

long time that people have just said

26:49

that nobody else saw this.

26:50

Yeah, in a while, take take

26:53

it and Calvin.

26:55

So Charlie ended up going on

26:58

to always kind of talk

27:00

about it. Yeah, so he would give

27:03

speeches and he was like,

27:05

I don't care, I'm gonna let everyone know he

27:07

was.

27:08

Yeah, he was out there talking,

27:11

slanging the story. You know, he was at all the conferences,

27:14

he was in multiple

27:16

documentaries, TV

27:19

interviews, news. You know. I

27:22

think Calvin just had a hard time with it.

27:25

Like there's a story that I

27:27

think Charlie was trying constantly

27:30

to get Calvin to come on the shows

27:32

and stuff, and early on,

27:35

I think it was like the second TV

27:38

interview that they were invited to, the

27:41

first one that they did. I

27:43

met the guy who conducted, but

27:46

I didn't include the video in the

27:48

dock. Their backs

27:50

are to the camera and they

27:52

didn't really want to show their identities. But I think

27:55

an actual TV in studio interview

27:57

they were invited to, and

27:59

Calvin been overheard

28:02

the sound guy making fun of him

28:04

on set and punched him out. Oh

28:07

so he got kind of like taken

28:09

off the set. And then after

28:12

that Calvin just tried to stay out of the spotlight

28:14

about it because he just wasn't comfortable.

28:16

You know. That makes it even more real,

28:19

because that's the thing. Somebody

28:22

comes forward and says this thing. I

28:25

believe we all should kind of be skeptical

28:28

at first. But I

28:31

mean they weren't necessarily looking for

28:34

to sell a movie. They weren't like they

28:36

were just.

28:37

They sold books they got Okay.

28:40

Charlie had actually Charlie

28:42

had a book in like the eighties, and

28:44

Calvin Parker's book was published

28:46

by Philip Mantle, the guy that I interviewed. Oh

28:49

right, yeah, but it was much later in

28:51

life for Calvin, Like Calvin only

28:54

came forward really in

28:56

a big way in the two thousands. Okay,

28:59

yeah, but.

29:00

I mean he came forward initially and then

29:03

went away and then came back in

29:05

the two thousands.

29:06

Yep. So he

29:08

tried to hide, like every time he started

29:10

a new job, he was being

29:13

harassed by the media that found out

29:15

he was in that area. And like

29:19

the reason why he got fired from the shipyard

29:21

the very first time was because

29:23

the media showed up the next day after the

29:26

encounter, because somebody at the

29:28

police station leaked that it

29:30

had happened to the press, and

29:33

there were just so many people trying to

29:35

find out about it. And the

29:38

foreman just said, you know, I'll

29:40

put you on like some temporary

29:43

leave, Charlie, because you've been here for

29:45

a while. But Calvin, sorry, you gotta.

29:47

Go mm because he was the new guy,

29:50

the new guy, and you.

29:51

Know, just not worth the

29:54

foreman's time to keep

29:56

him around if there's always going to be press

29:58

kind of interrupting their day lea business at

30:00

the shipyards.

30:01

So that's what's so weird

30:03

when sometimes in my research I'll

30:05

look back at past generations

30:08

of newspapers and

30:11

they'll be like Calvin, who

30:13

lives at blah blah blah address, Like

30:15

they'll like include that.

30:16

Stuff real stories.

30:18

That's kind of doxing today, right,

30:20

yeah, doc, people get super doxing.

30:23

Yeah, not docking. That's something

30:26

else.

30:26

I hear about it on Twitter in the community

30:29

probably about ten times

30:31

a week, just because everybody's so paranoid

30:33

that their identities will

30:36

be fully like, their locations will

30:38

be revealed. There's a lot of paranoia there.

30:39

There's a lot of that.

30:41

That's why I kind of put

30:43

one pinky toe

30:45

in the UFO world because

30:48

this just a little just a little

30:50

funky over there.

30:51

Yeah it does.

30:56

Yeah, I was thinking when

30:59

you were talking about like

31:01

if that was a real

31:04

like assuming that this is all real.

31:07

I feel so bad for

31:10

those two men that not

31:12

only did they have the initial experience, but

31:15

then it's like you

31:17

can't go anywhere without people thinking

31:20

you are insane. There's

31:22

probably so few people that they could

31:24

turn to that had ever experienced

31:27

something similar. Who

31:29

knows if those people would be telling the truth. It's

31:32

just like it's nice that

31:34

they had each other stigma.

31:36

There's definitely stigma surrounding

31:40

experiencers even today. You know people

31:43

that have just seen an authentic

31:45

UOFO. Something

31:47

about that case, which is interesting. Share

31:50

Fred Diamond, who's the

31:52

guy that ran the station that initially

31:55

interviewed them the night that they were abducted.

31:58

Yes, he proclaimed

32:00

that he to the newspaper that he

32:03

saw the UFOs in

32:05

question, like during that week

32:09

and the same night that those men

32:11

were supposedly taken, their

32:14

phone at the police station was ringing off the

32:16

hook. They had like over fifty calls

32:19

on different residents of the area

32:21

reporting UFOs in the sky. Okay

32:24

so, and then in the

32:27

docu series we cover multiple

32:29

witnesses that you

32:31

know, Philip had to go after these people.

32:34

Some people back in the day showed up

32:36

on like Walter Cronkite, other police

32:38

officers and Larry

32:42

Booth and other residents that actually

32:44

saw an object that night. They spoke

32:47

to the press back in the day, but other

32:49

people had to be tracked down years

32:53

later and Philip Mantle went after them

32:55

and they finally said yes, like

32:58

I saw the object you know, fly over

33:01

my car that night and stuff like that. So elements

33:04

like that make the case more

33:07

authentic to me. And there

33:11

was definitely a UFO flap going on, like

33:14

a UFO that was intercepted

33:17

by the coast Guard on the river.

33:19

We have documents from that event,

33:22

the coast Guard papers where they reported

33:25

chasing this blue object that was in

33:28

the water and they were poking

33:30

it with like a stick and stuff like that.

33:32

What.

33:32

Yeah, at what point before

33:35

after this would have been the same.

33:38

I think it was I want

33:40

to say the month after. Wow, So there

33:42

was there was activity happening

33:45

all around that area that fit

33:47

the same sort of description of what those

33:50

guys were seeing and other

33:52

people the same night.

33:54

Wow.

33:55

Yeah.

33:56

I think that the most compelling

33:59

piece of evidence is the recording.

34:02

Oh, the secret recording, the secret recording

34:05

these two guys. It's kind

34:07

of like what we call a hot Mike moment

34:11

these days. It was when they first

34:13

went to the police station, right, yeah,

34:16

and the recorder was still running,

34:19

but the two guys did

34:21

not know that, and they are just authentically

34:24

talking.

34:25

Yeah.

34:26

So Sheriffred Diamond and Glenn,

34:30

the other police officer that was attending these

34:32

guys, they were interviewing

34:34

them, they planted a recorder in

34:37

the room before the guys could know and

34:40

started it and they asked

34:42

like, you know, have you been on drugs tonight? Have you had

34:44

anything to drink?

34:45

No?

34:45

No, no, sir, you know, nothing like that.

34:48

And then they're like, okay, do you want

34:50

like a drink coffee or something? No, no, no, And

34:52

like they're

34:55

pretty panicked in their voices those

34:57

officers leave the room and then it's

34:59

just the tw men pretty much rambling

35:02

back and forth to each other in

35:04

a panic state, you know. And

35:07

if you had made this up, or if you watch like

35:10

JSC psychology YouTube videos

35:12

of like killers that are being interviewed and stuff

35:14

like that, they're usually just silent when

35:17

a police officer leaves the room, and these

35:19

guys were traumatized continuing

35:21

to discuss their experience.

35:24

And you know, being

35:26

you would think they would be like, should

35:30

we lie, should we tell them about this thing, or should

35:32

we make up? You know, I don't know, you would think there

35:34

would be a little bit more yeah,

35:37

something, especially because in the seventies

35:40

it's not like it is today, where there's always

35:42

something recording something everywhere.

35:45

And like if I was in

35:47

a police questioning room right

35:49

now and they're like, we're not recording, I'd

35:51

be like, yeah, someone's recording

35:53

something in here.

35:54

There's a camera in the corner of the room.

35:56

There's got to be one somewhere

35:58

something.

35:59

Yeah.

36:00

So I don't know that to be very

36:03

authentic.

36:04

I think it's an interesting

36:06

part of the story for sure.

36:07

Would you say that you believe

36:11

that, I mean, I believe.

36:14

People that recall being

36:16

taken beyond their will should

36:19

be taken seriously.

36:20

I think that.

36:23

This case has elements of truth

36:26

to it. Other experiencers

36:28

like Betty and Barney Hill, Terry

36:31

Lovelace is a military man that said

36:33

this happened to him on an army a military

36:36

base. There's

36:38

elements of that in a recent

36:42

you know, experiencer named Mario Woods,

36:44

also a military man that recalled

36:46

this, and you know, there's probably tons

36:49

of data there. But

36:52

yeah, Travis Walton is a really

36:55

interesting case because years

36:57

later the same area where the wooded

37:00

area outside of Snowflake, Arizona,

37:03

in the you know, mountain side where

37:05

these men were logging, like cutting

37:08

trees down and stuff, and four

37:11

of them saw this object. There's

37:14

still weird radiation that

37:17

lingered in the area, made the trees grow

37:20

in a regular way, like in

37:22

in in a regular way. So I

37:24

think there's something to

37:27

abduction. And if you

37:29

know, there's three thousand cases, for example,

37:32

of these non human intelligence

37:34

cases that were compiled by the Edgar

37:37

Mitchell Institute, if just.

37:39

One of those is real, that's

37:42

crazy.

37:43

We're not alone and we're

37:45

not you know, the highest thing

37:47

on the food chain in this existence.

37:50

My one thing with like all of this

37:52

stuff is are you a

37:54

ghost person at all? Uh?

37:57

Not really, I'm not really. I feel like ghosts

37:59

are kind of like a religious thing. I'm more like

38:01

a nuts and bolts person. But

38:03

yeah, I mean, I mean even

38:06

in the study that I was talking about,

38:08

the Free Foundation for Research

38:10

of Extraterrestrial and Extraordinary

38:13

Claims that covers near

38:16

death experience encounters

38:19

as well, which goes into you

38:21

know, is there something after

38:24

we pass away? And that goes into ghosts? So right,

38:26

right right, I'm open to it.

38:29

When I research stories to talk about

38:31

on this podcast, it's so

38:33

often stories up

38:36

until the two thousands,

38:39

like stories of people that lived in this crazy

38:42

haunted house where stuff happening on stuff,

38:44

or alien abductees, Like I

38:47

feel like you don't hear about them as much.

38:50

And I wonder is it because people

38:52

can fake things so easily now so none

38:55

none of us would believe you anyway? Is

38:57

it?

38:57

Like? I just don't know, Do you have any idea?

39:00

Do you have any thoughts on that I think.

39:03

There are ghost cases? And like

39:05

to me just to further explain

39:08

that, unpack that what I think a

39:10

ghost could be. It's just something

39:13

we don't. I mean, a ghost is an old

39:15

way of describing, old world

39:18

way of describing, with religious

39:20

connotations attached to it. Something

39:24

that we can't perceive with our eyes and

39:26

our brains regularly. It's something that's

39:29

like here that exists

39:31

that we're trying to explain with like

39:34

old world terminology. So

39:37

I think if somebody sees something after

39:39

they pass away, or something

39:42

is here existing in

39:45

a like non physical way, but somehow

39:48

comes into our view or I

39:50

don't know, bumps into us, or

39:53

is it heard over a recording, you know, like

39:55

these what do you AVPs

39:57

and stuff like that, I feel like that's

40:00

just like a bleed through moment from

40:02

another plane of existence

40:05

that we don't regularly

40:08

get to interact with. And I

40:12

feel like science could maybe one

40:14

day catch up to whatever

40:17

that is and we can properly identify

40:19

it with some kind

40:21

of you know, better terminology.

40:24

But I think there are videos

40:27

I've seen some pretty interesting videos

40:29

like that came from the

40:31

two thousands, for example, of a famous

40:35

all boys school in the

40:37

UK, where the security

40:39

cameras like literally show

40:42

at night papers

40:44

being thrown in the hallway and locker

40:46

doors being slammed and like

40:50

chair being thrown across the hallway and stuff,

40:52

and it's like, what is that?

40:54

You know?

40:55

That is that seems credible to

40:57

me unless somebody at the school made

41:00

the best invisible hoax video

41:03

you could, right, No one's debunked

41:05

that, right, So for me, that's

41:08

some kind of entity that we can't see with

41:10

our human perception, but

41:13

the camera has picked up a moment that you

41:15

know it existed in our realm.

41:17

Because that's the thing with these abductees too. It's

41:19

like, so you mean to tell me that

41:22

two of the best improv actors

41:25

ever were living in Pasca Goola

41:28

and they were able to just commit

41:30

to the bit and they decided to do that

41:33

for however many decades, like come

41:36

on, yeah, I mean.

41:38

It's it seems to

41:40

me like that's not really how

41:43

it went down. I feel like something happened

41:45

that night. And I mean, UFOs

41:48

are real. We've got videos, pictures

41:51

of all qualities and cases

41:55

throughout the decades, and

41:58

just thousands of people this time around

42:01

the world who've experienced

42:03

them, not just crazy Americans.

42:07

And to think that somebody

42:09

has been on board one and

42:12

you know they've experienced the occupants

42:14

who are maybe not human the

42:17

other interesting thing you could relate

42:19

to the Pasca Goula case is

42:22

have you ever heard of like Michael p Masters No,

42:25

W's that PhD professor

42:28

at I want to say, Montana

42:30

Tech, which is kind of like Montana's

42:35

version of I don't

42:37

know, like a really it's a good university,

42:39

good technical uni. And

42:44

he's an professor of anthropology

42:46

there who's posed the idea. He

42:48

actually wrote a paper recently with a Harvard

42:51

professor that's

42:53

called the x ray Tempestree

42:57

model and Crypto dustrial

43:00

theory. The idea with this is

43:03

that people that are experiencing

43:05

these UFOs and the occupants

43:08

sometimes are possibly

43:11

encountering a time machine,

43:14

and the occupants might be related

43:17

to us, but from the future. I

43:20

like that.

43:21

I think that's a fun way to look at it.

43:23

Yeah, I mean he gets into

43:25

the weeds about like the Grays for example,

43:28

and kind of says, well, you know, there's

43:31

signs that we are evolving

43:33

towards like that. If

43:36

you know, the singularity happens and

43:38

technology melds

43:40

with our biology and we become

43:44

you know, more obsessed with brain

43:47

power and less obsessed

43:49

with sex and the other carnal

43:51

pleasures of being a man. Or a woman. You

43:55

know, those things don't really Some people

43:57

say that they don't have like sexual organs, they don't

43:59

have toilets on board, they don't have like

44:02

a kitchen.

44:03

Oh.

44:04

Interesting, So they're more like this

44:07

forced evolution synthesized

44:11

being that maybe we created to carry

44:13

out scientific experiments in the past

44:16

on board a time machine, which is like the UFO.

44:20

That's where he kind of goes with it, or he kind of says,

44:22

maybe we go as far as

44:24

evolving ourselves that way, and the

44:27

chin, you know, is getting really small

44:29

and the head's getting bigger to house

44:31

a more like efficient brain, and blah

44:34

blah blah. I mean, I'm

44:36

totally butchering this theory right now. I'm

44:38

dumbing it down. But he's

44:40

looked at the Pasca Goula case, and he

44:43

also looks at other reported contact

44:46

tee cases where people say they

44:48

actually did see human like

44:50

beings or human beings that were

44:52

on board the craft. And so Calvin talks

44:55

about this woman. Right, there's

44:58

other people that have talked about seeing

45:01

a woman and a man. Travis Walton,

45:03

for example, saw some like sexy

45:06

blue jumpsuit woman and man

45:09

on board his craft after he saw

45:11

the more gray looking beings

45:13

at the starting of his encounter, and

45:16

he apparently got gassed and then lost

45:19

sight of them. But Michael

45:21

P. Master's theory on that is

45:23

that maybe that is us from

45:26

the future coming back in a time machine,

45:29

and other encounters

45:31

are further down the evolutionary

45:34

path, you know,

45:36

maybe thousands of years, where they're coming

45:38

back and observing us on the timeline, taking

45:40

a specimen, you know, taking

45:43

a bit of material, messing around with us, examining

45:46

further, and then putting us back. And

45:48

it's something humans do already, we do with

45:50

animals.

45:50

We do it right, right, so it doesn't it's usually

45:53

not like ten out of ten sexy

45:56

knockouts.

45:57

Yeah, so that's like part of the job.

45:59

You have to be a smoke show

46:02

and a scientist and

46:05

willing to possibly get freaky deekey

46:07

with these people.

46:09

Yeah, that would be I mean, I don't

46:11

know if that's a mission requirement. But what

46:13

if we get to a point where, you

46:16

know, the ones that have the best technology

46:18

in the future are the ones that are

46:21

also the most attractive and the

46:23

smartest.

46:26

Fascinating.

46:27

Who knows.

46:28

You've given me a lot to think about here today.

46:31

Good, so we

46:33

know that UFOs are real. We don't

46:36

fully know what these things

46:39

are.

46:40

Mm hm.

46:41

I mean, do you do you think about

46:43

who knows the truth? Do you think there's people

46:46

that know the truth? I think.

46:49

If you follow you know

46:52

the history of this phenomenon

46:54

in euphology and all

46:57

of the documents that have come out

46:59

from like supposed

47:01

military communications, like

47:03

the Air Force, the Navy, CIA,

47:07

So we're talking about defense and

47:10

intelligence agencies that

47:12

are surrounding this subject

47:15

over the decades. It points to them

47:18

knowing more about the subject,

47:20

but then telling the public they don't

47:22

know anything and there's nothing to see here.

47:25

So that would be what initially

47:27

was called the cover up. Some people

47:29

call it a truth embargo, and

47:32

I think post twenty seventeen, since

47:35

like Louise Elizondo, former

47:39

Pentagon worker that worked

47:41

for the DoD on a parent

47:44

Advanced Aerial Threat Identification

47:46

program looking

47:49

at UFO videos that were coming in

47:51

from different sources and TIC tech

47:53

video, Yeah, that type of stuff which

47:55

he got declassified. With Christopher

47:59

mellon the Go Fast and

48:01

the Gimbal UFO videos all

48:03

FLEAR captured by

48:06

F eighteen fighter pilots. We're scrambled

48:08

to intercept these things usually over the

48:10

ocean that's

48:13

apparently just the tip of the iceberg,

48:16

you know, and the Pentagon sits

48:18

on a treasure trove of this data. Now

48:21

skeptics and debunkers say, oh,

48:23

that's all just like BS

48:26

or whatever. But if it's true, and

48:29

this subject has been so tightly held

48:31

by the intelligence and defense community

48:34

for so long, we're

48:36

kind of living in this moment in

48:38

time post twenty seventeen

48:41

when that New York Times paper got released

48:43

by Ralph Blumenthal and Leslie Keene,

48:46

you know, talking about those videos and

48:48

Louise Ela Zondo and Christopher Mellen

48:51

breaking this information, you

48:53

know, whistleblowing kind of we're

48:57

kind of in this like post disclosure

48:59

era where more

49:01

and more people are coming forward to talk

49:04

about the truth of this and the cover

49:07

up, the suppression and secrecy.

49:10

I don't think, in my opinion,

49:13

the intelligence or

49:15

defense community would ever

49:18

really want this to fully come forward,

49:20

because if it's true that people

49:23

have been hurt, killed, or seriously

49:26

threatened to suppress this information

49:28

over the years, why would they ever want

49:30

that to fully come out, right, because then they have

49:33

to admit to

49:36

you know.

49:37

Who's the one famous guy that like allegedly

49:41

worked at Area fifty one.

49:44

Bob Blazar.

49:45

Bob Blazar, isn't he one

49:47

of those ones that like has had a lot

49:49

of drama with that.

49:51

Yeah, so he's he came

49:53

out in the eighties through

49:55

George Knapp, famous Nevada

49:59

based Las Los Angeles reporter

50:02

journalist for KLAS

50:05

and now eight

50:07

News. Now he's been on TMZ

50:10

documentaries and stuff with Jeremy Corbel

50:12

and stuff. So

50:15

Bob Lazaar's story is that he worked

50:17

at Area fifty one and he

50:19

was hired to work on this like reverse

50:22

engineering program for supposed

50:24

alien craft that he called the sports

50:26

Model that

50:29

the American military had captured

50:31

at one point in time in the past. And

50:35

you know Louise el Zondo. David

50:39

Grush is like another one of these whistleblowers

50:41

that's come forward and testified before Congress

50:44

in the past couple of years. There's

50:47

only been three UAP

50:50

congressional hearings to date so

50:52

far. I've been physically in one of

50:54

them. Really, yeah, it was pretty

50:57

cool as a Canadian. But

51:01

David Grush came forward. He was working on

51:03

a program called the UAP

51:05

Task Force. I've heard of that, and

51:08

he was, you know, a dog hot

51:10

on a trail sniffing out the secrecy

51:12

of all this stuff and being pointed

51:15

in the right direction by people

51:17

that knew about these reverse

51:20

engineering special access

51:22

programs within the DoD and

51:24

intelligence community. And

51:27

he was an intelligence officer, so he had

51:29

like the security clearances to supposedly

51:32

get read into this type of stuff, but

51:34

they wouldn't let him get direct

51:37

access because the

51:39

age old saying with regards

51:42

to the secrecy of these actual programs

51:44

is that it's need to know only right

51:47

right. And then he became a whistleblower

51:49

because he he got exposed

51:51

to documentation and apparently saw

51:54

videos and all that kind of proof that maybe

51:56

Louise Elizondo was also being

51:58

first hand, you know, experiencing

52:01

when he worked for the Pentagon on a

52:03

special access program but

52:06

he couldn't get really fully

52:08

ready in, but he interviewed people that were part

52:10

of those programs that you know, we're

52:13

saying this is bad, should

52:15

be more out there to the public, and we should

52:17

be changing the way that this is

52:19

working.

52:21

God, I will never be hired

52:23

by the government because I would spill

52:26

to everyone. Yeah, I would

52:28

be like, girl, you're not gonna believe

52:31

what kind of aliens they got. So

52:34

you'll even hear these stories that they they

52:36

have aliens like you know,

52:39

whether alive or dead, that they.

52:43

Some craft that they captured because

52:45

apparently this has been like decades long

52:47

programs they call them like legacy programs

52:50

if it's like Roswell nineteen forty

52:52

seven style, and then like there's

52:55

new unacknowledged special access

52:58

programs that are still going on today. And

53:00

actually was a I don't know if you watched News

53:03

Nation, which is like a CBE

53:05

I think it's a CBS news

53:08

network, But they released

53:10

a story with journalist Ross

53:13

coltheart recently,

53:15

just last week, and a new whistleblower

53:18

came forward named Jake Barber.

53:22

Ross's Australian.

53:23

It calls him Jake Baba

53:26

Love the Baba Baba.

53:28

And Jake said that

53:31

he was part of one of these programs retrieving

53:33

crashed craft or UAPs.

53:37

So is there's not like a lifetime NDA

53:40

like don't yeah.

53:42

I think I think that's the point is

53:44

that people that have experienced this

53:47

or you know, been a part of this, are

53:49

tired of that secrecy that

53:52

they know that the greater implication is

53:55

that we're not alone. That

53:59

you know, the things should be explored

54:01

more in the public and should be better

54:03

known by the public, you know, people

54:06

should be better informed, and it would

54:08

also kind of change public

54:10

consciousness. And probably

54:14

if we knew more about these technologies,

54:16

it would be an exciting and you

54:19

know, scientific

54:22

exploration progress

54:25

in our time.

54:26

I think it'd be fun to meet our neighbors,

54:29

Like, I've had enough of humans,

54:32

let's make some friends. I would love an alien

54:35

pen pale. But I think

54:37

we ultimately when anytime

54:39

people panic or it's the

54:42

conversations of like, yeah, if

54:44

they revealed all this stuff.

54:46

Everyone would freak out.

54:48

The one good thing about it is like, it

54:50

can't be that much of a threat because

54:53

like it seems like it's been contained

54:56

for a long time.

54:57

If it is, yeah, I think we

55:00

don't know all the nuance

55:04

to that. Yeah, you

55:06

know, we're not necessarily very

55:09

good to every animal on the planet, and

55:12

all animals are kind of there's

55:15

evidence that you know, animals

55:18

can prey on each other, you

55:20

know, so all the way up the food chains. So we

55:23

don't know for a fact that

55:25

there isn't something out there that's

55:28

non human, that's higher

55:31

intelligence or equivalent that

55:34

may want to prey on us, and

55:36

there could be elements of that truth. There could

55:38

also be benevolent intelligence

55:41

out there that want to help us

55:43

or want us to change, to become

55:45

like a better citizen

55:47

of the universe. You never know.

55:49

That's what I always I'm

55:51

one hundred percent convinced. I'm sure

55:53

again, there's probably some assholes that

55:56

have these UFOs, but I think that

55:58

they are ultimately good and they

56:00

want to help us. I think there's so much smarterer than

56:03

us. They could absolutely take us out if they

56:05

needed to, but they haven't, and

56:07

I think that they are sick of looking at

56:10

our ugly ass planet and they

56:12

want to help.

56:14

Yeah, we got a beautiful planet though, That's

56:16

the thing, and that might be why they're

56:19

attracted to our planet because

56:21

it's this blue. I mean, if you look at space

56:24

footage and tails from

56:26

astronauts that have been outside

56:28

the atmosphere, we're just like people

56:30

that have been on a Jeff Bezos

56:33

flight, you know, with blue origin. They're

56:38

in awe because Earth is such

56:41

a beautiful marvel to behold,

56:43

and yeah, there's opportunity

56:46

for maybe exploiting

56:49

that. There's also opportunity to protect

56:53

that beauty and stuff, right, So I

56:55

think there's there possibly could be

56:58

all kinds of reasons or

57:00

motives for this phenomenon

57:03

and possible interactions

57:05

with non human intelligence if they're

57:07

truly here, and I think one of

57:09

those cases is real. They're here.

57:12

Do you think that they're in the water.

57:14

Yeah, that's a thing that's come up a lot

57:18

before this Last year, I released

57:20

a doc called trans Medium, and

57:23

it's about I interviewed

57:26

former Navy Admiral Tim

57:29

Galladett, who also testified

57:31

at one of the recent congressional hearings.

57:34

I was actually at that one November

57:37

thirteenth, twenty twenty four. And

57:42

there's there's like, for example,

57:44

those three UAP videos

57:46

that were declassified and released

57:48

of the public that was all ocean based phenomenon,

57:52

And it seems like our

57:55

navy and fighter pilots

57:57

are engaging with this phenomenon and

58:00

seeing evidence that it's emanating

58:02

from the oceans or going

58:04

into the oceans.

58:06

And.

58:08

What better place. I mean, you're

58:10

kind of our limitations

58:12

with the oceans is that we don't

58:15

have the technology to circumvent

58:18

friction and the ocean depth

58:20

pressures and so on and so forth. So

58:23

if you do have that technology

58:25

that can allow you to navigate that other

58:29

medium. Right, the

58:32

ocean liquid water which

58:34

is noncompressible, and you know,

58:37

submarines I think can only

58:39

travel at about like forty knots tops

58:41

because of drag and all

58:44

that. If you have technology

58:46

and you can circumvent that, then

58:49

you're basically saying cyinara to a

58:51

fighter jet that's chasing you, because what

58:53

are they going to do? Yeah, they're stuck

58:55

in the atmosphere.

58:57

So fine, Yeah,

59:00

it would be so cool if

59:02

they were down there and like like

59:05

all the sharks and everyone already knows that they're

59:08

down there, like that they can go down

59:10

there, Like I don't. I just think it's I think that's

59:12

fun to be because the ocean is just hasn't

59:15

been explored.

59:16

And yeah, it makes a lot of sense. I mean

59:18

both both up or you know, up

59:20

in the sky or space or

59:23

weight ocean.

59:25

Wait, no, no, it's a mystery, and I think, frankly,

59:28

I'm of the camp where I think it's all

59:30

fun as a mystery. But of course

59:32

I'm nosy and I want all the answers, but

59:35

I feel like I don't know if I had all

59:37

the answers, then what are we going

59:39

to talk about?

59:40

There's always something new to explore

59:43

right the world's changing and the way

59:45

that we think of it. And I think this is

59:47

one of those subjects that I actually

59:50

started into it back in two thousand and nine,

59:52

Like the very first documentary I ever made

59:55

was released on YouTube

59:57

in twenty twelve, and my

1:00:01

views have changed quite a bit since

1:00:03

then. I know that there's a lot of riff

1:00:05

raft. There is a lot of like bs

1:00:08

and culty type behavior and

1:00:10

stuff that happens in eupology, but

1:00:13

there's real stuff too, and I'm

1:00:16

you know, sort of aligning myself with that

1:00:18

more so and trying

1:00:21

to, you know, correct whatever

1:00:24

record I can. But

1:00:27

this is like, you know, a

1:00:29

place that when I first started

1:00:31

researching it, I thought I was completely

1:00:34

alone, a total like

1:00:36

loser, you

1:00:39

know, psycho outcast.

1:00:42

And now you've got rear

1:00:45

admirals testifying

1:00:48

in front of Congress saying this is real, former

1:00:51

intelligence and military officials.

1:00:54

You've got congressmen and congress women

1:00:57

reaching across the aisle. It's a bipartisan

1:01:00

issue, one of the only ones

1:01:02

that's crazy saying there's something

1:01:04

here. There really is some kind of secrecy

1:01:07

happening, and we need to unveil

1:01:09

a bit more to the public. We should know more

1:01:11

about where all our military budgets

1:01:13

are going towards this subject and

1:01:15

stuff like that. So it's it's wild.

1:01:18

It's really kind of breaking open and becoming a

1:01:20

mainstream topic now, and

1:01:22

I never thought it would go that way.

1:01:24

Talking to people NonStop, I

1:01:27

would be so curious to see a

1:01:30

survey of before and

1:01:32

after the past few years on people's

1:01:34

beliefs and if this stuff is

1:01:36

real, because I encounter constantly

1:01:39

people being like, well, that's real now, like

1:01:41

we know that that's a thing. Yeah,

1:01:44

Like it has given it the credibility

1:01:47

that it never had.

1:01:48

It's fascinating, yeah, And I mean there's

1:01:52

exact evidence that proves that

1:01:54

this was relegated to superstition,

1:01:57

myth and considered

1:02:00

a ridiculous joke before, Like the

1:02:02

Air Force made that happen

1:02:05

with Project Blue Book. They had a

1:02:08

head scientist Jay Allen Heinek

1:02:12

working on behalf of their

1:02:14

organization, intercepting any

1:02:16

credible cases and explaining to the public

1:02:18

that it was swamp gas or

1:02:21

prosaic explanations. When whole

1:02:24

towns or communities were

1:02:26

seeing objects land,

1:02:28

you know, fly around in the sky over their

1:02:31

farms and stuff like that, people some

1:02:33

people reported being abducted back then.

1:02:36

The Betty and Barney Hill case was, you know,

1:02:38

part of the Project Blue Book Days and the Air Force

1:02:40

got involved.

1:02:42

That that's an iconic one. Yeah,

1:02:44

the Betty and Barney Hill one. But we

1:02:47

should probably wrap it up. I just realized how long we've

1:02:49

been talking. This is so fun. I love hearing all

1:02:51

this.

1:02:51

Yeah, thanks for having me.

1:02:52

Ross. Tell everyone where they can find

1:02:55

your work.

1:02:56

Yeah, they can check

1:02:58

out my website, journeys

1:03:01

is ocult journeys dot com is my studio

1:03:03

site. They can see like all my past

1:03:05

film catalog plus this one. And

1:03:09

they can search my name on Amazon Prime

1:03:11

too, BTV, Roku. I'm

1:03:14

on Apple TV, like a bunch of different streaming

1:03:17

sites.

1:03:18

And Pascagoula seventy three is on all of those

1:03:20

as well.

1:03:21

Pasca Goula is just on

1:03:23

Amazon right now, okay, but

1:03:26

it's opening up to other platforms as we

1:03:28

speak. Eventually it'll be on TV

1:03:31

and stuff like that. Yeah, and

1:03:34

they can find my socials like Instagram,

1:03:37

Darcyweir Films or at

1:03:40

Ocult Journeys on Twitter. I'm

1:03:42

on Facebook too, just darcywear amazing.

1:03:45

Thank you so much.

1:03:46

Yeah, thanks, thank

1:03:50

you so much to Darcy

1:03:53

go check out Pasca Googla seventy

1:03:55

three. If you haven't yet, google

1:03:57

image this young man Kelvin.

1:04:01

Just type in Kelvinpasca Goula.

1:04:03

You're welcome anyway.

1:04:06

Yeah, let me know what you think of these kinds

1:04:09

of episodes. If you want more, if you want

1:04:11

less, you know, no harm either

1:04:13

way. Just trying to just trying

1:04:15

to make everyone happy over here, trying

1:04:18

to have a good time while talking about the paranormal.

1:04:22

I love you all, both

1:04:24

living and dead. But if I didn't ask

1:04:26

you to haunt me, don't haunt me.

1:04:29

Came by.

1:04:37

This has been an exactly right production.

1:04:39

Want to share your paranormal experience

1:04:42

on the podcast. I read stories

1:04:44

out loud and sometimes I'll

1:04:46

even call you, so email me at

1:04:48

ghosted by Roz at gmail

1:04:50

dot com. You can send a DM or

1:04:53

voice message to the show's Instagram

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at ghosted by Roz. Give us

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and Twitter at It's Roz Hernandez.

1:05:07

My senior producer is the startling

1:05:10

Jiha Lee. Associate producer

1:05:13

is the alarming Christina

1:05:15

Chamberlain. This episode

1:05:17

was mixed and sound designed by the eerie

1:05:20

Edson Choi. My guest booker

1:05:23

is the petrifying Patrick Kottner.

1:05:26

Additional production support from the hair

1:05:28

raising Hannah Kyle Crichton.

1:05:31

My theme music is by the spine

1:05:33

chilling Brendan Lynch Salomon.

1:05:36

Artwork by the Spooky Vanessa

1:05:40

Lilac, Photography by

1:05:42

the terrifying Elizabeth

1:05:44

Karen. Executive produced

1:05:46

by the chilling Karen Kilgareff,

1:05:49

the Spooky Georgia

1:05:51

hard Stark, and the frightening

1:05:54

Danielle Kramer.