0:03

Welcome to Hacking Your ADHD. I'm

0:06

your host, William Kurb, and I

0:08

have ADHD. On this podcast, I

0:10

dig into the tools, tactics, and

0:12

best practices to help you work

0:14

with your ADHD brain. Hey, team,

0:16

today's episode is all about navigating

0:18

ADHD as a late-diagnosed adult, especially

0:20

for women who have spent years

0:22

pushing through life without realizing why

0:24

things were so much harder. I'm

0:27

talking with Kate Mauricef, a UK-based

0:29

ADHD coast who was diagnosed at

0:31

40, and has since made it

0:33

her mission to help women work

0:35

with their brains and not against

0:37

them. She hosts the ADHD women's

0:39

well-being podcast and her upcoming book

0:41

is the ADHD Women's Well-being Toolkit

0:44

where she dives deep into strategies

0:46

from managing ADHD well beyond just

0:48

productivity hacks. In our conversation today we

0:50

get into the realities of late diagnosis

0:52

why ADHD and women is so often

0:55

overlooked and how hormones can throw an

0:57

extra curveball into the mix. Kate shares

0:59

her personal journey of discovering ADHD through

1:01

her daughter's assessment, and we talk about

1:04

how self-compassion, nervous system regulation, and finding

1:06

the right support can make a huge

1:08

difference. There's a lot here about understanding

1:11

ADHD as a whole body experience, not

1:13

just something that affects our focus or

1:15

productivity. Also, I want to note

1:17

this is just another one of the episodes

1:19

where I had the wrong mic set up,

1:22

so apologies for that, but I'm sure you'll

1:24

still be able to understand me just fine.

1:26

If you'd like to follow along on the

1:28

shownotes page, you can find that at hacking

1:31

your adhd.com/218. All right, keep

1:33

on listening to find out

1:35

how to treat ADHD with

1:38

some self-compassion. A great place

1:40

for us to start might

1:43

be talking about your

1:45

ADHD diagnosis journey because

1:47

you've got your diagnosis

1:49

at 40, right? Yeah, I got

1:51

mine in my 20s and it's very

1:53

different to get fit when you're not

1:56

a kid. So what kind of led

1:58

you to seeking this diagnosis? So what

2:00

seems to be quite a typical pattern

2:02

for especially sort of midlife women that

2:05

they were for their children and it

2:07

was one of my I've got four

2:09

kids and it was my second eldest

2:11

daughter that I had over the past

2:13

years thought there was maybe like dyslexia

2:16

going on or dysbraxia and there was

2:18

just different things and I was like

2:20

why can I still not get to

2:22

the bottom of it where she had

2:25

lots of assessments and tests and nothing

2:27

really came back conclusive and then it

2:29

was the wonderful pandemic that was COVID

2:31

that kind of ground me to a

2:34

halt and recognise that I really needed

2:36

to get her help. and it was

2:38

through the really sort of going down

2:40

rabbit holes for her that was like

2:42

this mirror back to me sort of

2:45

this glaring mirror going that's you that's

2:47

you that's you because I'd always had

2:49

suspicions that there was something like ADHD

2:51

going on because my two brothers were

2:54

diagnosed with ADHD and they were kids

2:56

and so ADHD for me was just

2:58

like part of the family but I

3:00

only knew it and boys. I did

3:02

not know it in girls, even though

3:05

my mum has got it and now

3:07

I can see lots of other family

3:09

members have got it. I just didn't

3:11

see it to myself because I was

3:14

quiet and I was a relatively sort

3:16

of conscientious child and didn't want to

3:18

cause a bother or anything like that,

3:20

whereas I had two brothers that were

3:22

causing lots of... challenges for my parents

3:25

I would say. So it was only

3:27

through my daughter who I could really

3:29

see myself who was nine at the

3:31

time and that's when I was like

3:34

oh I need to go and look

3:36

at this because I had had lots

3:38

of issues going on for me but

3:40

because I never really thought about it

3:42

being anything apart from my personality I

3:45

just kind of got on with it,

3:47

and it was difficult, but I got

3:49

on with it, and it was getting

3:51

harder and harder, you know, 40, four

3:54

kids, pandemic, starting a business, retraining, pereminopause

3:56

was starting to sort of rear its

3:58

head, and I... I was like, you

4:00

know what, I need some help here.

4:03

And I was so so relieved when

4:05

I got the diagnosis because I kind

4:07

of went right. Now I understand what

4:09

it is, we can work with this,

4:11

we can do something. Whereas before it

4:14

was, I don't know about you, but

4:16

my ADHD is very like. Well, why?

4:18

Why? And I need answers. And if

4:20

I don't get answers, I'm like, but

4:23

what does that mean? And so I

4:25

now had an answer. Unfortunately, the answer

4:27

led to lots more questions and still

4:29

does, to be honest, but at least

4:31

I have the foundations of understanding what's

4:34

going on, which is neuro divergence, a

4:36

different type of wiring, an understanding of

4:38

my nervous system, my hormones, everything, and

4:40

I've got... kids with ADHD and so

4:43

yeah I now have gone down a

4:45

whole new chapter of my life with

4:47

ADHD especially in my career as well.

4:49

Yeah I mean it makes so much

4:51

sense too because we don't have a

4:54

good foundation of what ADHD is outside

4:56

of what we learn in pop culture

4:58

which really does only shine the light

5:00

on the very hyperactive boy that's going

5:03

crazy, or the zombie medicated kid, which

5:05

is also, you know, incredibly inaccurate. I

5:07

know so many people who, like, have

5:09

this very similar story where they're like,

5:11

oh, yeah, either my kids or someone

5:14

else in my family was diagnosed and

5:16

I heard about what ADHD actually was

5:18

for the first time and went, oh,

5:20

that's me. I also love what you're

5:23

saying about how having that diagnosis, then

5:25

means you can do something about it.

5:27

Because yeah, like, I know when I

5:29

was undi was undi was undi was

5:32

undi was undiagnosed, undiagnosed. it was so

5:34

much harder for me to do everything,

5:36

I just assumed I was bad at

5:38

doing things. So my solution was like,

5:40

oh, just try harder, which, you know,

5:43

it rarely works for me. It doesn't

5:45

work for many people just to try

5:47

harder because it's like pushing upstream the

5:49

whole time. It's literally going against the

5:52

tide. And the only way we can

5:54

try harder is if we do it

5:56

in our authentic way, or if we

5:58

do it in a way that works

6:00

with our energy or one. or mood

6:03

or hormones, like whatever that might be

6:05

for you is how it gets better.

6:07

But if you want to keep doing

6:09

the same thing in a very neurotypical

6:12

way, doing it in the way that

6:14

we've kind of been conformed to believers

6:16

right. it's always going to present itself

6:18

in a difficulty. But if we start

6:20

to kind of, you know, for me,

6:23

it was like, oh, okay, so it's

6:25

ADHD and understanding, you know, the executive

6:27

functioning and the working memory and understanding

6:29

how it presents in different ways and

6:32

when I can't do this or I

6:34

struggle to do that, there's always an

6:36

explanation and there's always a workaround. Whereas

6:38

before I understood about ADHD, I would

6:40

just keep pushing. harder and harder and

6:43

doing the same thing and getting the

6:45

same results. Insanity is when you just

6:47

keep doing the same thing, go for

6:49

an over again, expect the same results

6:52

or something. And so it kind of

6:54

felt a little bit like that, where

6:56

I was just going, why is it

6:58

not working? I'm just going to try

7:01

it again and keep trying and it's

7:03

definitely going to work this time. And

7:05

now I know, now I understand, you

7:07

know, it's not changed my ADHD. It's

7:09

not taken it away. and understanding and

7:12

in acceptance and also a much deeper

7:14

level of self-compassion at the same time

7:16

I'm not I don't want people to

7:18

think well that you're sort of like

7:21

in a victim mode it's like no

7:23

actually it's amazing for self-empowerment as well

7:25

taking self-responsibility to to grow and learn

7:27

new mindsets and skills to develop in

7:29

different ways so I actually believe it's

7:32

kind of like having a key sometimes

7:34

to unlock a part of you that

7:36

you didn't even know was there was

7:38

kind of lying dormant, but you were

7:41

just only working with one way of

7:43

living. Actually, there was a whole other

7:45

way of living that we just didn't

7:47

know because we didn't have the key

7:49

for. So that's the kind of the

7:52

way I work with clients, the way

7:54

I my ADHD, you know, that's my

7:56

mindset for it. I know it's not

7:58

the same for lots of other people,

8:01

so I really want to. validate that

8:03

because I know ADHD brings really really

8:05

extreme challenges and difficulties and fluctuate at

8:07

different times and I've seen that in

8:10

family members I've seen it in clients

8:12

and friends so I don't want to

8:14

kind of say oh it's fine once

8:16

you get a key and it's all

8:18

fine they'll just you know sail through

8:21

life that's not the case but I

8:23

think it allows you to see yourself

8:25

in a different light that you might

8:27

not have done and that is kind

8:30

of what I'm grateful for now. yeah

8:32

the idea of empowerment is so important

8:34

for ADHD I feel because especially with

8:36

late diagnosis because for so long we

8:38

feel like we are broken in some

8:41

way and having just this idea of

8:43

oh there is something I can do

8:45

about this for me that was like

8:47

one of the life-changing moments of like

8:50

I didn't really consider that when I

8:52

first got my diagnosis but there was

8:54

at one point where I was like

8:56

oh man I'm feeling so lazy and

8:58

I'm like I guess it's not really

9:01

lazy it's just that my ADHD and

9:03

that's just like oh it's not lazy

9:05

it's ADHD I can do something about

9:07

that if it's there's this hurdle here

9:10

I can do something about that hurdle

9:12

and I still have to hit that

9:14

everyone as well where I'm like walking

9:16

around thinking with this problem like why

9:18

is it so hard for me to

9:21

get this work done it's like oh

9:23

I remember the answer it's the ADHD

9:25

let's try reframe this and how to

9:27

do this problem solving yeah with ADHD

9:30

in mind it's a crazy thing the

9:32

ADHD brain in that we are so

9:34

consumed by it that we can forget

9:36

about it and then it hits us

9:39

like you know across the head again

9:41

and we're like oh okay I get

9:43

it with RSD like you think I

9:45

should really know what RSD feels like

9:47

looks like and it's kind of I

9:50

should be able to recognize when it's

9:52

about to hit me but sometimes it's

9:54

there and I've not seen it's RSD

9:56

until you know an hour later or

9:59

a day later so we still are

10:01

living in this space of the ADHD,

10:03

it can derail us and it doesn't

10:05

matter how much you know about. it

10:07

because we can be blindsided by it

10:10

and again it is that level of

10:12

compassion that we have to give ourselves

10:14

that when we get overwhelmed or when

10:16

we become reactive or when we are

10:19

so exhausted and burnt out we can't

10:21

speak or anything like that I used

10:23

to go in sort of self-judgment mode.

10:25

And now I'm just about, I'm now

10:27

able to catch myself and go, okay,

10:30

the reason why you are in that

10:32

state that you're in is there's this

10:34

reason and there's that reason, you know,

10:36

whether it's sort of, I've been working

10:39

all day and I've just been go,

10:41

go, go, go, go, and then I

10:43

finally stopped, you know, out this hyper

10:45

focus mode. And now my nervous system

10:47

is like feeling really sort of on

10:50

edge and agitated and agitated and that's

10:52

why I'm more, maybe like, or just

10:54

need to be left alone and just

10:56

have to go on a walk on

10:59

my own or go to have a

11:01

bath on my own. And I feel

11:03

that the more we understand ADHD, and

11:05

I really do believe it's our self,

11:08

our responsibility to psychoeducate ourselves because we

11:10

live with people and we can't just

11:12

be, it's our ADHD, it's our ADHD,

11:14

like we can't, we have to take

11:16

responsibility and say, okay, I now know

11:19

what's going on and yes, I need

11:21

kindness and support and compassion from other

11:23

people. But we're all humans, you know,

11:25

trying to have relationships and look after

11:28

other people and... pay other people or

11:30

work with other people or whatever that

11:32

might be. And there is a level

11:34

of responsibility, I believe, that we must

11:36

take to educate ourselves and do the

11:39

work and help ourselves in whatever capacity

11:41

that is, whether it's listening to the

11:43

podcast, reading books, getting therapy, having coaching,

11:45

seeking out nutritional help, whatever that is.

11:48

So we can thrive for ourselves, but

11:50

also. thrive for other people around us

11:52

because I've seen the other way, I've

11:54

seen how it all can go very

11:56

downhill where we don't take that responsibility

11:59

and you know life is very difficult.

12:01

So I do believe I think sometimes

12:03

a lot of people need a bit

12:05

of a leg up. They might need

12:08

that support, you know, straight after a

12:10

diagnosis with a therapist and a coach

12:12

to get them to that place medication.

12:14

But we have to make a choice

12:16

as adults to say, you know, I

12:19

want to live a better life, I

12:21

want to live a calmer, more regulated

12:23

life. And I know that with many

12:25

of us who have been diagnosed later

12:28

on in life, we'll look at generations

12:30

in our family and see how ADHD

12:32

has rid its head. Most of the

12:34

time in a negative way, you know,

12:37

there might be great examples, but unfortunately

12:39

the majority I see as sort of

12:41

maybe like a negative way it's presented

12:43

itself because it's been undiagnosed. So I

12:45

wonder if we can be this next

12:48

generation of changing the tide a little

12:50

bit and saying, yes, I'm neuro divergent,

12:52

yes, I've got autism, but I'm actually

12:54

going to make this work for me.

12:57

Now, I'm going to get the help,

12:59

I'm going to do the work, I'm

13:01

going to learn about myself and my

13:03

brain, I learn how I can live

13:05

more authentically and live in a way

13:08

that is really healthy and good for

13:10

me, but also for those around me

13:12

as well. It's a positive step forward.

13:14

Yeah, I mean, working with how our

13:17

brains work, just that makes so much

13:19

sense because what other option do we

13:21

have? We can't just constantly fight our

13:23

brain and think we're going to win.

13:25

Exactly. so many of us have fallen

13:28

down that rabbit hole of self-flagellation and

13:30

trying to beat us ourselves up over

13:32

our ADHD and I don't know anyone

13:34

that has actually been successful for you

13:37

know like it might get them to

13:39

do like the dishes one time but

13:41

in the long run it's just this

13:43

like really bad system that people hate

13:45

themselves for who they are and it

13:48

makes no progress and so working with

13:50

your brain instead. Try and be like

13:52

okay. This is hard and I cannot

13:54

do this how a neurotypical person would

13:57

do it, but how can I do

13:59

this? Because I know I can do

14:01

hard things. Yeah, and it is, it's

14:03

a mindset, it's a growth mindset, and

14:06

it's picking yourself up, even when it

14:08

feels really, really hard. It's a decision,

14:10

I would say, it's choice to change

14:12

the narrative in your brain, to... ask,

14:14

like, what else can I do here?

14:17

How can I help myself in this

14:19

situation? You know, instead of that negative,

14:21

that self-talk, that criticism, that can lead

14:23

us down, you know, a very dark

14:26

rabbit hole, and I'm not saying you

14:28

can do this on your own, like,

14:30

if you need help to do this,

14:32

it's really important to say, right, I

14:34

need someone to help me, I need

14:37

a friend, a partner, a coach, a

14:39

therapist, I need medication, I need a

14:41

doctor to be able to help me

14:43

get on this path because to change

14:46

your mindset completely in your own is

14:48

very difficult and I'm the first one

14:50

to say you know for me for

14:52

the past nearly five years of being

14:54

diagnosed I've had coaching, therapy, lots of

14:57

different modalities, you know a lot of

14:59

self-development work. It's not just happened by

15:01

me clicking my fingers and reading a

15:03

few books. Personally, I have kids and

15:06

for me I want to change the

15:08

tide a little bit and I want

15:10

to try and model to them that

15:12

life isn't perfect at all, but if

15:14

we can keep reaching for growth. and

15:17

for healing and that in a work

15:19

then we will get to places like

15:21

it's not about being a perfect human

15:23

and never like getting overwhelmed or shouting

15:26

or anything like that but it is

15:28

about making the decision to be like

15:30

am I going to get stuck in

15:32

this mode or am I going to

15:35

choose to find resources find ways out

15:37

of here so we can live a

15:39

better life and that better life is

15:41

not again, that can be very very

15:43

kind of subjective. It can be what

15:46

anyone feels like. The best life could

15:48

just be, I just want to be

15:50

able to walk my dark in the

15:52

afternoon. I just want to be able

15:55

to go to bed earlier. I want

15:57

to, you know, be off my phone

15:59

more. you know, all these little things,

16:01

it can just be whatever is good

16:03

for you that you know that is

16:06

going to just help a little bit,

16:08

turn the ship around a little bit.

16:10

Yeah, because it doesn't take doing everything

16:12

differently in your life, just a few

16:15

steps here and there, and it can

16:17

make a big difference. Yeah, and I

16:19

think people get so overwhelmed with, well,

16:21

everything's wrong, you know. My house is

16:23

a tip, my relationships are terrible, I

16:26

hate my job, I'm this, I'm that,

16:28

I'm unhealthy, I can't, you know, make

16:30

myself proper food. And then all of

16:32

a sudden, you know, especially with ADHD,

16:35

it's very much like a global, you

16:37

know, all or nothing thinking of everything's

16:39

terrible and it's all too much for

16:41

me to even deal with. But when

16:43

we can break it down and we

16:46

can have you know, a bit of

16:48

space and a bit of time. And

16:50

again, I come back to coaching for

16:52

this because I think coaching is an

16:55

amazing, amazing modalities to have that space

16:57

to be able to reflect and gain

16:59

perspective and also to allow yourself to

17:01

be introspective without it being going down

17:04

a tunnel of despair. You're able to

17:06

have that time where you can say,

17:08

well, you know, normally I go down,

17:10

you know, I think about this or

17:12

my mindset goes here, but maybe I

17:15

could choose something different, or maybe there's

17:17

an option, there's other options, but in

17:19

this very fast-paced life we all live

17:21

in with most of us, myself included,

17:24

on a phone, you know, ingesting information,

17:26

you know, constantly, there's just social media

17:28

bombarding, you know, emails, this, that, and

17:30

then all of a sudden you get

17:32

to the end of another day and

17:35

you just drained and exhausted and the

17:37

thought of changing anything is just too

17:39

overwhelming. So when you can make space

17:41

once a week or once every few

17:44

weeks to have, you know, an hour

17:46

with somebody or even just for yourself,

17:48

like just to say, right, I'm going

17:50

to sit and I'm just going to

17:52

journal, I'm just going to see what

17:55

comes out and just externalize, just the

17:57

externalizing itself is really helpful. I do

17:59

believe that. is always aware. I read

18:01

a book years and years ago by

18:04

Marie Follio and her book was Everything's

18:06

Figure Outable and she's got ADHD herself

18:08

and it was this motto of we

18:10

can always figure this out like there

18:12

is always going to be some way.

18:15

of figuring this out and that mantra

18:17

is kind of stuck in me and

18:19

you know when I have one of

18:21

my kids having a moment and they

18:24

are you know having a bit of

18:26

a meltdown and thinking like the world's

18:28

coming to an end and I try

18:30

and kind of pass that mantra onto

18:33

them of like we can figure this

18:35

out like we can do this. It

18:37

is going to be figure outable and

18:39

we can do this together and I

18:41

really do believe that someone with ADHD

18:44

When you bounce off that, you know,

18:46

someone that you could just be one

18:48

friend, one partner, one family member, if

18:50

you have that support system, it always

18:53

feels easier. And I know that's not

18:55

easy for everybody, but if you can

18:57

just find that one person that you

18:59

know, when you're having that bad time,

19:01

that you can say to them, you

19:04

know, can I just externalize? Can I

19:06

just thrash something out with you? I

19:08

do feel like it always makes things

19:10

better. And I think that's one of

19:13

the values of things like online communities

19:15

where you can find, especially like like-minded

19:17

people with like ADHD and stuff. They're

19:19

like, yeah, I've gone through something similar.

19:21

Yeah, I get that this feels impossible

19:24

in this moment, but there is another

19:26

side that you can get to. Like,

19:28

yeah, you don't need someone to be

19:30

like, this is going to be easy.

19:33

No, this is going to be hard,

19:35

but we can do hard things and

19:37

we can get through this. There's certain

19:39

people in my life that have just

19:41

been, it's just everything's been doom and

19:44

gloom, everything's been difficult and negative. If

19:46

you've had that programming, we have

19:48

to almost get to a point

19:50

where we're like, I want to

19:52

unprogram myself, like wipe the programming,

19:54

and then start reprogramming with new

19:57

beliefs and new ways of thinking

19:59

and mindset. you can't think of

20:01

my 40s, like how's that possible?

20:03

But I promise you it is

20:05

possible. And it all comes down

20:07

to self-awareness. It comes down to

20:09

that awareness of, I don't want

20:11

to be that person that is

20:13

always in this doomongering kind of

20:16

like negative spiral. What if there

20:18

was another solution? Like what if

20:20

there was a new way of

20:22

thinking or being or living? Like

20:24

what if the way I've been

20:26

living my whole life according to,

20:28

you know, other societal sort of

20:30

conformities or conditioning or anything like

20:33

that. What if that isn't right

20:35

for me, you know, stepping out

20:37

of that and making different choices?

20:39

And again, it comes to sort

20:41

of like making a bit of

20:43

space because when we're in that

20:45

rat race and we're in it

20:47

and we're doing, doing, doing, not

20:50

just having a moment to breathe,

20:52

that's when we can say, okay,

20:54

I'm ready for change, I'm ready

20:56

to do something different. And that

20:58

might just be hanging out with

21:00

different people or changing up something

21:02

or saying no more or creating

21:04

different boundaries. That's why I kind

21:06

of said there's always a way

21:09

there's always something even if we

21:11

kind of go down that that

21:13

kind of all are nothing thinking

21:15

of like nothing's gonna work. So

21:17

yeah, going back to the very

21:19

very beginning it is very empowering

21:21

to get a diagnosis and if

21:23

you can't get a diagnosis at

21:26

least have an awareness at least

21:28

have an awareness at least be

21:30

like you know what I kind

21:32

of know what's going on here.

21:34

because in England I don't know

21:36

what it's like where you are

21:38

but you know the waiting list

21:40

are huge really really long and

21:43

a lot of people can't afford

21:45

very expensive diagnoses so there's a

21:47

lot of people who are not

21:49

you know officially diagnosed but know

21:51

for sure that their neuro divergent

21:53

and I always say you don't

21:55

have to have that validation from

21:57

a doctor if you know that

21:59

there's something you know different going

22:02

on with your wiring like you

22:04

you kind of know that for

22:06

sure there is a neuro divergence

22:08

a different thinking going on you

22:10

are allowed to still ask for

22:12

help and you are still allowed

22:14

to find support and change your

22:16

life and put those boundaries up

22:19

because a lot of people think

22:21

that unless they have that official

22:23

diagnosis well I'm just going to

22:25

carry on the same and they

22:27

wait four years and they get

22:29

the diagnosis and they go right

22:31

now is the time for my

22:33

life to change but if anyone's

22:36

listened to this now and they're

22:38

thinking And you truly believe that

22:40

we can always take an empowered

22:42

step forward, like one empowered small

22:44

action, just to start the motions,

22:46

you know, in place. So yeah,

22:48

I think it's I think it's

22:50

important for people to know that

22:52

because very often no one says

22:55

to them you are still allowed

22:57

to go and get help without

22:59

having that official diagnosis. Yeah, and

23:01

you know, some days I'm like,

23:03

what if I don't have ADHD?

23:05

what if I you know like

23:07

I've just tricked all the doctors

23:09

somehow and I don't have ADHD

23:12

and I'm like it would still

23:14

be worth doing all these things

23:16

because they are helpful for me

23:18

even if it turns out you

23:20

know it's like oh it wasn't

23:22

ADHD or something completely different but

23:24

I am still doing things that

23:26

are helping be every day and

23:29

I'm like well I get that

23:31

still makes it worth doing yeah

23:33

100% I've got a book coming

23:35

out I'll name drop it's well-being

23:37

well-being toolkit and you don't have

23:39

to have ADHD to gain insights

23:41

from the book. You don't have

23:43

to specifically have ADHD but you

23:45

could relate to a lot of

23:48

the traits or you could be

23:50

waiting for an assessment and a

23:52

diagnosis and be looking for holistic

23:54

lifestyle tools and you know help

23:56

and practices that you can do

23:58

right now today. It doesn't matter

24:00

if you don't have that official

24:02

diagnosis because lifestyle well-being, tweaks and

24:05

changes that are going to help

24:07

with your mood, energy. sleep, hormonal

24:09

balance, relationships, your, you know, cultivating

24:11

more inner joy and fulfillment, anything

24:13

like that, it's only going to

24:15

be a positive thing for you,

24:17

but also your family as well,

24:19

whoever you live with, you know,

24:22

whatever that may look like, we

24:24

are this sort of ecosystem and

24:26

we're never just like a lone

24:28

person because we impact other people

24:30

and other things. So if we...

24:32

look after ourselves, we're then influencing

24:34

the energy and the mood and

24:36

the regulation of the house. And

24:38

I always truly believe that when

24:41

we do that work ourselves or

24:43

when we work on ourselves, it

24:45

always has a good, you know,

24:47

positive impacts on the people around

24:49

us as well in different capacities.

24:51

So yeah, it's kind of like

24:53

a no-brainer really. A lot of

24:55

your focus is on women's ADHD.

24:58

Do you think you could speak

25:00

a little bit on the some

25:02

of the unique challenges that women

25:04

face with ADHD? Yeah, so women

25:06

for sure we have hormonal challenges

25:08

and many of us way before

25:10

we've had the diagnosis or the

25:12

understanding of ADHD will have presented

25:15

in different ways or you know

25:17

women's health conditions and hormonal issues

25:19

and maybe we had trouble with

25:21

our cycle, we may have related

25:23

to things like PMDD, which is

25:25

a very severe form of PMS,

25:27

we may have things like endometriosis

25:29

that has been diagnosed, we may

25:31

just have really suffered hormoneally and

25:34

never been given the reason why.

25:36

And what we do know is

25:38

that We still don't know the

25:40

exact reasoning and there's still a

25:42

lot more research that needs to

25:44

be done but we do know

25:46

there's a very distinct interplay between

25:48

hormones and our mental health are

25:51

the way our ADHD shows up

25:53

and when we can balance our

25:55

hormones we notice. our ADHD symptoms

25:57

and traits aren't as extreme. So

25:59

for women, as we sort of

26:01

get closer to our period, so

26:03

towards the last sort of 10

26:05

days of our cycle, we are

26:08

going to feel more sensitive, lower

26:10

mood, you know, anxiety, irritable, all

26:12

things like that, you know, not

26:14

such great sleep. and that in

26:16

itself is going to impact our

26:18

ADHD. But we're also noticing that,

26:20

you know, women with ADHD are

26:22

suffering a lot more with anxiety,

26:24

mood challenges, depression, and so much

26:27

of it is because there's a

26:29

lot of our ADHD is internalised,

26:31

it's like internalised restlessness. So you

26:33

might not see us running around

26:35

and bouncing around, sometimes you can

26:37

for sure, it can present 100%

26:39

like that. But a lot of

26:41

the time with women, it's very

26:44

much internalised. So there will be,

26:46

you know, we will relate to

26:48

things like OCD and anxiety and

26:50

overthinking and catastropization and our brain

26:52

just never wants to stop. So

26:54

I think ADHD, this commentates across

26:56

the sexes, the genders, but I

26:58

think there's certain ways ADHD really

27:01

does show up more specifically in

27:03

women and I do believe they

27:05

are hormone related but also seeing

27:07

things like more autoimmune conditions in

27:09

neuro divergent women. We're seeing women

27:11

who really can relate to lots

27:13

of gut problems. So there's a

27:15

big new emerging conversation starting with

27:17

the whole brain body and it's

27:20

not just the brain and I

27:22

talk a huge amount about the

27:24

nervous system as well because our

27:26

nervous system dictates all of this

27:28

as well. So if we have

27:30

got a very heightened nervous system,

27:32

disregulated nervous system, that's going to

27:34

impact our hormones and it's going

27:37

to impact our health, pain, fatigue.

27:39

things like that. So even though

27:41

we're not quite sure, like, which

27:43

one do we treat first, like,

27:45

where's the best place to go,

27:47

to have an understanding of the

27:49

bigger picture, and again, you know,

27:51

I've had people on my podcast

27:54

who are like eminent doctors and

27:56

psychiatrists and researchers who are kind

27:58

of in the throes of gaining

28:00

more evidence, but there's still not

28:02

enough research to say. you know,

28:04

conclusively that this is exactly why

28:06

ADHD presents like this, or why

28:08

more women are, you know, suffering

28:10

from, say, hypermobility or, you know,

28:13

autoimmune conditions. So we're very behind

28:15

on women's research and women's health

28:17

research and that has been a

28:19

systemic long-term thing that most medical

28:21

research has been done on men

28:23

because they don't have fluctuating hormones

28:25

which mess up that mess up

28:27

medical research apparently but that in

28:30

itself is not a reason for

28:32

women to have been so underserved

28:34

medically so there's a lot of

28:36

catching up to do you know

28:38

even when I started five years

28:40

ago on this journey where I

28:42

started the podcast three years ago

28:44

it was only I remember saying,

28:47

I want to have a conversation

28:49

with somebody about hormones and ADHD.

28:51

I want to talk to somebody

28:53

who understands about pyromedopause and ADHD.

28:55

And I was literally having to

28:57

find like, I think it was

28:59

about five people in the world

29:01

who could, from a very sort

29:03

of authoritative way, talk about this

29:06

because they were a medic and

29:08

they understood it. Literally five people.

29:10

which is ridiculous in the world

29:12

that ADHD has been around very

29:14

in popular culture since sort of

29:16

what the late 70s we've known

29:18

about, you know, ADHD in Boys

29:20

and Men for sure. So back

29:23

in 2021 I started the podcast,

29:25

that was when I was literally

29:27

kind of clutching its drawers going,

29:29

can someone please tell me what's

29:31

going on with paramenopause and ADHD

29:33

and hormones and ADHD and I

29:35

spoke to an amazing one called

29:37

Jeanette Wasserstein who at the time

29:40

was the only person who could

29:42

really tell me about this and

29:44

things things have kind of thankfully

29:46

moved on in three or four

29:48

years but still you know not

29:50

fast enough we do need more

29:52

answers and we need for the

29:54

medical system from the people who

29:56

are doing the research it needs

29:59

to be rippling down much faster

30:01

and the data needs to be

30:03

there to the gatekeepers, you know,

30:05

in England we call them GPs,

30:07

you know, the physicians that people

30:09

are going to your family, doctors

30:11

who can say, oh I understand

30:13

your daughter has ADHD because she's

30:16

presenting with an eating disorder and

30:18

anxiety and she has PMDD and

30:20

instead of just prescribing her with

30:22

lots of different medication of being

30:24

able to understand why she's sensitive

30:26

to certain hormones, why she's struggling

30:28

with anxiety, why she's more prone

30:30

to disordered eating, and the doctors

30:33

being able to say she needs

30:35

an assessment for ADHD, because that

30:37

is what, you know, especially things

30:39

like friendship groups and difficulty with

30:41

academia, and we're pulling all these

30:43

dots together, we need people on

30:45

the ground to be able to

30:47

be diagnosing and assessing faster and

30:49

better, which will to be very...

30:52

bloodened save lives because we also

30:54

know that suicide is you know

30:56

much more prevalent in the neuro

30:58

divergent community as well and it

31:00

comes down to that to have

31:02

more knowledge more awareness more education

31:04

saves lives especially in the neuro

31:06

divergent community also putting in here

31:09

the all the like societal expectations

31:11

that women have too that are

31:13

different than men where adding that

31:15

on top of all these physical

31:17

differences it makes it like yeah

31:19

there are a lot of challenges

31:21

there because There are certain expectations

31:23

I know I don't have even

31:26

though I do a lot of

31:28

stuff in the house for my

31:30

kids, I know that, you know,

31:32

like, people aren't expecting me to

31:34

do it. And so if I

31:36

didn't, I could get away with

31:38

it, but I don't want to.

31:40

But yeah, it's something that's just

31:42

as important as to keep in

31:45

mind that you have ADHD is

31:47

that you have all these differences

31:49

too that need to be accounted

31:51

for, because I feel like that's

31:53

another like empowering thing to be

31:55

like, yeah, this is not just

31:57

this one thing that I'm dealing

31:59

that is. also having a big

32:02

impact and not knowing about it

32:04

doesn't help. It's not easy and

32:06

I think you know what you

32:08

touched on with from the societal

32:10

perspective for women you know if

32:12

we're talking about very kind of

32:14

traditional roles I would say you

32:16

know that are still very prevalent

32:19

that ADHD women moms really do

32:21

struggle because we're holding at families

32:23

we are probably working in some

32:25

capacity we're probably looking after family

32:27

members. We probably are trying to

32:29

do lots of other things because

32:31

we like to have our fingers

32:33

in different pies. We're probably burnt

32:35

out. We're probably exhausted. We're probably

32:38

people-pleasers. We are probably perfectionist in

32:40

some capacity. And we're putting huge

32:42

expectations on ourselves to do better

32:44

and be better friends. at the

32:46

same time we're crumbling and we're

32:48

overwhelmed. I know you don't have

32:50

to be neuro divergent to feel

32:52

this, but I think to know

32:55

when you are on neuro divergent

32:57

to feel why it feels so

32:59

heavy and so difficult. And sometimes

33:01

it feels so hard to move

33:03

past it or so hard to

33:05

cope, whereas other people can just

33:07

about cope, just about do all

33:09

of this. but then pereminopause comes

33:12

and it's kind of like a

33:14

bit of a tidal wave that

33:16

just comes and crashes and all

33:18

of a sudden the energy that

33:20

you have that could just see

33:22

through you know you might be

33:24

able to sleep five or six

33:26

hours a night, you know, four

33:28

nights a week, all of a

33:31

sudden that's not working for you

33:33

anymore. Your adrenals are sky high,

33:35

you are low in mood, you're

33:37

irritable, you're cranky, you're anxious, and

33:39

so much of it's at outdoor

33:41

control with our hormones. So it's

33:43

kind of, I always say, it's

33:45

kind of like trying to drive

33:48

a car with literally no petrol

33:50

in the tank, and you're like

33:52

revving the engine, and you're revving

33:54

the engine, and you kind of

33:56

like... query and like why is

33:58

the car not moving like why

34:00

does it keep conking out or

34:02

we then kind of replenish it

34:05

with a little bit and think

34:07

when then we expect it to

34:09

keep going and going and going

34:11

and going. So there's an expectation

34:13

that we need to drop from

34:15

ourselves and start recognizing okay just

34:17

something has to change but as

34:19

women we don't like to let

34:21

people down we don't want people

34:24

to think bad of us you

34:26

know all of these different things

34:28

and I think for women, it's

34:30

not clear-cut because we want to

34:32

make change, we want to do

34:34

the things that are good for

34:36

us, but we're going to let

34:38

people down, or we're going to

34:41

upset people, or we're not going

34:43

to be able to do the

34:45

things that we want to do.

34:47

So it's definitely not as binary,

34:49

I would say, as like, say

34:51

no, do this, put your boundaries,

34:53

stop going out, it has to

34:55

be done kind of... with ease

34:58

and compassion. And so again, we're

35:00

not like our nervous systems not

35:02

kind of like jarred by all

35:04

this, this fear, this worried fear

35:06

of upsetting people and letting people

35:08

down. I mean this myself, so

35:10

I kind of say this to

35:12

other people who are listening and

35:14

kind of think, I say this

35:17

because I understand it and I

35:19

understand how difficult it can be

35:21

different capacities, but it's not a

35:23

reason not to keep trying. Yeah,

35:25

and yeah, it was so funny

35:27

when you say things like, yeah,

35:29

you just need to make more

35:31

time for self-care. And it's like,

35:34

when do you want me to

35:36

do this? I'm going to have

35:38

to cut something out of the

35:40

light, my life, to do that.

35:42

And that's a hard balancing act

35:44

if you're doing kids. And kids

35:46

take so much time with all

35:48

the school lunches and getting them

35:51

to school and getting bedtimes and

35:53

all of those things. And you're

35:55

just like, and clues. And so

35:57

then you're like, yeah, I can't,

35:59

that's a part of my life.

36:01

I can't just put on hold.

36:03

And so everything's figure outable. But

36:05

you also need to ask for

36:07

help when you. can't just do

36:10

it yourself. Again, I'm not saying

36:12

just to ask for help. It's

36:14

a hard thing to do because

36:16

it's, I know I personally have

36:18

a lot of trouble asking for

36:20

help on things. And then I'm

36:22

so grateful when I do because

36:24

it's amazing when I'm like, oh,

36:27

I didn't have to do that.

36:29

I'm like, oh, I didn't have

36:31

to do that thing. And they're

36:33

like, yeah, I can totally help

36:35

you do that thing. And it's

36:37

like, before we go. Just to

36:39

go easy on yourself. Again, I'm

36:41

going to speak from my perspective,

36:44

but we might want to change

36:46

everything. We might want to do

36:48

everything. We might want to achieve

36:50

this and be like super productive

36:52

and do all the things and

36:54

have all the ideas, but it's

36:56

also okay to just not do

36:58

it as well. Just kind of

37:00

be like, you know what, today

37:03

I've done enough. or this week

37:05

I've done enough, or I'm doing

37:07

enough, I am enough. And we

37:09

might need to remind ourselves that

37:11

even though we might feel like

37:13

we're behind, other people are ahead

37:15

of us, or we feel like

37:17

maybe we've not had a productive

37:20

day, or we've not been able

37:22

to crack on with all the

37:24

things that we wanted to, but

37:26

that doesn't have an impact on

37:28

who we are as a person.

37:30

And I think we can very

37:32

often. equate ourselves to what we

37:34

achieve and what we produce and

37:37

what we, you know, what a

37:39

house looks like or what we've

37:41

made for dinner that night, you

37:43

know, a good mum if I've

37:45

done this, I'm not a good

37:47

mum if I've done, I've not

37:49

done that. or the house is

37:51

a mess, or the kids are

37:53

eating pizza again, like all these

37:56

different things, and it's not a

37:58

reflection on you. And to maybe

38:00

cut yourself some slack, because I

38:02

used to think that if I

38:04

didn't do all the things. I

38:06

was not a good person or

38:08

I wasn't being a good mom

38:10

and now I recognise that if

38:13

I'm just there present with my

38:15

kids, I'm present and I'm hopefully

38:17

showing them that I love them

38:19

and I want to be with

38:21

them and they're safe and things

38:23

are good, then it doesn't matter

38:25

if they're having pizza and it

38:27

doesn't matter if the couch is

38:30

full of washing or whatever that

38:32

is. So yeah, I think my

38:34

parting words would be. to just

38:36

go easy on yourself and you're

38:38

doing the best you can every

38:40

day we can make those small

38:42

small tweaks to even if it's

38:44

just that internal dialogue even if

38:46

it is you can just wake

38:49

up every single morning and just

38:51

say you're doing the best you

38:53

can you are enough no matter

38:55

what you're enough because that for

38:57

me that really does help for

38:59

me and if people want to

39:01

find out more about your podcast

39:03

and everything else that you do.

39:06

Where should they go? The podcast

39:08

is the ADHD women's well-being podcast.

39:10

They can head there, they can

39:12

look for it, and my website

39:14

is ADHD women's wellbeing.co.uk.uk. The book,

39:16

so there's a whole theme, ADHD

39:18

women's well-being toolkit, and I've got

39:20

lots of workshops on demand live

39:23

ones as well. There's lots going

39:25

to be out. in bookstores in

39:27

July, but hopefully it'll be available

39:29

to order right now. And yeah,

39:31

you can just preorder it and

39:33

it will hopefully land on your

39:35

doorstep in July. And I hope

39:37

that it is a really powerful

39:39

toolkit for every day, sort of

39:42

well-being alongside your ADHD and to

39:44

really help you reach that potential

39:46

that I know everyone has, but

39:48

sometimes our ADHD kind of blocks

39:50

it a little bit. So with

39:52

a bit of awareness, we can...

39:54

kind of, I always see it

39:56

as like we can just climb

39:59

over it, we can see it's

40:01

there, but we just have climb

40:03

over it with different kind of

40:05

scaffolding and tools. So I hope

40:07

that's what the book brings. But

40:09

thank you for having me, William.

40:11

Thank you. It's a great conversation.

40:13

I think people will get a

40:16

lot of it. I hope so.

40:18

Thank you. Thanks

40:22

again to Kate for coming on

40:24

the show and thank you for

40:26

sticking with us all the way

40:28

to the end. Be sure to

40:30

go check out Kate's podcast, the

40:32

ADHD Women's Well-being Podcast, and her

40:34

upcoming book, The ADHD Woman's Well-being

40:36

Toolcut, which comes out on July

40:38

17th. Before you go, though, let's

40:40

do a quick rundown of today's

40:42

top tips. One, especially for women,

40:44

work on understanding the role of

40:46

hormones. ADHD symptoms can intensify during

40:48

certain phases of the menstrual cycle

40:50

or peribenipots. And awareness of these

40:52

fluctuations can help with better self-regulation.

40:54

And hey, ADHD men, you also

40:56

have hormones that can fluctuate, so

40:58

don't just tune out on this

41:00

either. Two, instead of constantly pushing

41:02

yourself to meet narrow typical expectations,

41:04

recognizing that ADHD comes with different

41:06

needs can be a game changer,

41:08

avoid forcing yourself into rigid productivity

41:10

schedules, and try to recognize your

41:12

natural rhythms to make work and

41:14

life feel just a little bit

41:16

easier. 3. Finding ADHD-friendly ways to

41:18

approach tasks instead of just trying

41:20

to be more disciplined leads to

41:22

better long-term success. You don't have

41:24

to overhaul your entire life. Focus

41:26

on little shifts, like setting boundaries

41:28

or adjusting your expectations that can

41:30

create lasting improvements. All right, that's

41:32

it. Thanks for listening. I'd love

41:34

to hear what you thought of

41:36

this episode. Feel free to connect

41:38

with me over at Hacking your

41:40

adhd.com/contact. If you'd like links or

41:42

to read this episode's transcript, you

41:44

can go to the shownotes page

41:46

at hacking your adhd.com/218. If you'd

41:48

like even more hacking your ADHD,

41:50

be sure to sign up for

41:52

my newsletter, any and all distractions

41:54

which comes out every other week.

41:56

In it, I give out my

41:58

best distractions for the week. Be

42:00

there when I'm going. reading, what

42:02

I'm playing, or what I'm watching.

42:04

I also try to give a

42:06

few bits of actional advice, although

42:08

your mileage may vary there. That

42:10

sounds like something you're interested in,

42:12

head over to Hackingrad hd.com/newsletter to

42:14

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42:16

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42:18

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want to let you know about

42:22

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you can easily find that at

42:26

h.com. It's all the same. The

42:28

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42:33

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42:35

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42:37

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42:52

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42:54

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42:57

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42:59

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43:03

And now, for your moment of dad.

43:06

Oh, to avoid the sushi. I've heard

43:08

it's a little fishy.