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2:16

Hello, and welcome to how I built

2:18

this lab. I'm Guy Raz. So

2:21

it's hard to know how many Americans are

2:23

vegans, estimated its range from

2:25

two to six percent of the population.

2:28

And this means that if you're a vegan restaurant,

2:31

you have to figure out a way to bring in

2:33

non vegans if you wanna build a sustainable

2:36

business. Now imagine you start

2:38

a vegan restaurant and you call it,

2:40

say, vegan delight

2:42

or plant based heaven, it

2:44

is not likely you're gonna get a wide

2:46

range of customers through the door.

2:49

So in twenty eighteen, Pinky Cole

2:51

came up with a different idea. She wanted

2:54

to open a greasy fast

2:56

food joint with all the HIBT, sloppy

2:59

cheesesteaks, double bacon cheeseburgers,

3:01

smudge third french fries except

3:04

entirely vegan, totally

3:07

plant based. But to get lots

3:09

of people into the door, vegan,

3:11

vegetarians, carnivores, flexitarians,

3:14

etcetera. Pika decided to

3:16

start with a name that would attract,

3:19

well, a lot of attention.

3:21

And the name of a restaurant is

3:24

slutty vegan. Slutty

3:26

vegan. The company now has

3:28

nine locations mainly in and around

3:30

Atlanta, but also in Brooklyn and

3:32

soon in Washington DC. And

3:34

her plan quite simply is to become

3:37

the McDonald's of vegan food.

3:40

Hinkie actually grew up in Vault's or

3:42

her parents immigrated from Jamaica where

3:44

they practiced Rustafarianism. And

3:47

her mother, a strict vegetarian

3:50

diet.

3:52

You know, I tell a funny story about

3:54

how I marinated in the womb

3:56

of a vegetarian. Like,

3:59

I've never seen my mother wear earrings. I've

4:01

never seen a wear makeup. She's a very holistic

4:04

natural woman. Yeah. So I grew

4:06

up under the wing of that kind of woman. So

4:08

you could only imagine the traits

4:10

that I got from my mother growing up. Yeah.

4:12

She was like earth's mother. She

4:14

was like the earth's mother mother has

4:16

hair that touches the ground, and she's

4:18

about, like, my mom is five

4:20

nine, and her hairdroer eggs on the ground. She's

4:22

been growing her hair for almost, what, fifty

4:24

years now. So she has a lack of

4:26

love. Yeah.

4:27

Alright. So

4:29

you were born in in Baltimore. Right?

4:32

Yeah. And your

4:34

dad went to was incarcerated

4:37

from from the day you were basically born.

4:39

So, I guess, did

4:42

you get to know him by by visiting him

4:45

in prison?

4:45

You know,

4:47

that's an interesting question. So

4:49

when I was a kid, I can remember

4:52

going

4:52

to Hagerstown in Jessup, Maryland

4:55

-- Yeah.

4:55

-- to see my father. And then when you enter

4:57

a room, you BITP around a six

4:59

inch table and you get to talk to your loved

5:01

one. Like, I grew up doing that. Yeah.

5:03

So did my father do a good

5:05

job at like doing the best that he could?

5:08

By raising us, by way

5:10

of the prison system. Yeah. Like, he

5:12

would call me. He would tell me to read

5:15

so many books, rich dad poor

5:17

dad. Mhmm. He was teaching me about stocks.

5:20

He was telling me that, like, I'm going to be an

5:22

entrepreneur and things that I could do to set

5:24

my life Like, he was doing that from jail.

5:26

Wow. So it was definitely

5:28

a life that was a

5:31

roller coaster ride to say the least. BITP

5:34

I realized that I learned about resilience

5:37

to my dad. Yeah. And even in the midst

5:39

of his circumstance, he still said, you know what?

5:41

Like, I'm gonna make sure that I pass this down

5:43

to my child.

5:44

So, you know, he taught

5:46

me life from behind bars. Well,

5:49

And your dad, I

5:51

mean, before he he went to prison,

5:53

I mean, he was an entrepreneur.

5:54

He ran nightclubs in Baltimore.

5:56

Yeah. Now, obviously, I wasn't

5:58

born to see but, like, I had so

6:00

many great stories of my father. He

6:03

tells me all of these stories of how he was, like, a

6:05

top shot at it. I'm like So

6:08

I I get submitting to know that

6:10

my father had this

6:12

level of energy and confidence as

6:15

I'm the man. Like like

6:17

that level of confidence I admire

6:19

because I know where I get it from. You know what

6:21

I mean? Wondery was just

6:23

a businessman. Was it always legal? No.

6:25

But at the time, you know, I don't

6:28

know what his psyche was when he made decisions

6:30

to do what he did to take care of the family. BITP

6:32

I respect him for who he is as a man.

6:35

Yeah.

6:35

Tell

6:37

me about how your mom supported

6:39

four kids when your dad was you

6:42

know, incarcerated what she do.

6:45

So all I recognize, my

6:47

mother for it, mostly for it is

6:50

hard work and being consistent

6:53

with hard work. Like, I have never

6:56

seen my mother be lazy. Like, she

6:58

works hard when she's at home. She works

7:00

hard in the world. She's a lead singer of

7:02

a reggae band and has always been since

7:04

I was a kid. So she would do, like, all the

7:06

weddings, all the local events. So my mom became,

7:08

like, a a local celebrity. Right?

7:12

And I watch her do all of these things with so

7:14

much grace. So one time she worked at McDonald's,

7:17

then she worked at the bank, and then she worked at

7:19

another bank. And currently, she's been at the same

7:21

company for about forty years. Wow.

7:23

So I watch my mom commit

7:25

to causes that she cares about. Yeah.

7:28

I read

7:30

that, like, as a little kids,

7:32

like, you started started

7:35

basically businesses and you started, you

7:37

know, you would sell sandwiches,

7:40

school, and then started to organize parties

7:43

like local parties and charge admission

7:46

when you were like fourteen

7:47

fifteen. Tell me about that. What

7:49

would you do? So so

7:51

my mother was a musician. Right. So

7:54

she would always play throughout the city. So

7:56

she had a lot of friends. And she would rehearse

7:58

in the basement. So, like, we always had,

8:00

like, people over. Like, we were just the house that

8:02

had everybody coming over. Like, it was through

8:04

house. For the right reasons, obviously.

8:08

So I had a couple parties as a

8:10

kid, and I'm like, you know what, I'm gonna have

8:12

a recreation party and I'm gonna

8:14

charge people to get

8:15

in. Mhmm. And I'm gonna sell

8:17

bottled waters for a dollar. And

8:19

this is

8:20

at your house that you'd or you'd just do it like a

8:22

rec center? I did it at a wrecking in my first

8:24

one, but let me tell you what I did was

8:26

I would call the local recreation

8:29

centers and I would pretend I was an

8:31

adult. So I would say, this is

8:33

miss pinky cold. Like, I'm fourteen years

8:35

old calling myself miss pinky cold. So,

8:38

like, when I tell you, like, the hustle

8:40

was in me, since

8:42

my early teenage years. And

8:44

I would have these parties and

8:46

the whole entire city would come out to my parties.

8:48

I was the youngest party promoter. And

8:51

I You would have sorry. I'm just curious.

8:53

You so you would you would have a party at

8:55

a rec center, and you would

8:57

basically, what, advertise

8:59

it on flyers? Yeah. This was

9:01

before Facebook and

9:03

Instagram. This was like

9:05

you print out some flyers and you have

9:07

them cut. I would go to the place in Baltimore.

9:10

That printed obituaries. So

9:12

we would send them the design and they would put it

9:14

together and make us flyers. And then

9:16

after school, every time a school let

9:18

out, we would literally post up at the school

9:20

and pass out flyers. Wow. It was

9:22

a DJ. It was people dancing

9:24

having a good time and bottled water.

9:26

That's it. No decorations, no

9:28

freels, just to

9:29

DJ in the front. Yes. Bottled the water

9:31

for dollar and, like, five bucks to get in or

9:34

something. Exactly. Wow. And

9:36

so these rec centers, would you be packed with,

9:38

like, middle school and and maybe high school kids?

9:40

Yeah. We would have between, like, eight

9:43

to a thousand every party. Wow. They would

9:45

stand for hours just to get into my party.

9:47

You go pinky parties? Oh, pinky parties

9:49

be lit. Like, let's go to pinky parties. Like,

9:51

and I had everybody coming and I'm

9:53

like, I built a movement. I

9:56

know how to bring people together. Yeah.

9:58

I mean, if you had, like, you know,

10:00

up to a thousand kids and charging them

10:02

between five and ten bucks. You were

10:04

clearing, like, seven thousand,

10:06

eight thousand dollars sometimes. Yes, sir.

10:09

Do you hear what I'm saying to you yet? Yeah.

10:11

I remember one time specifically, me

10:13

and my mother were in the living room in the house

10:15

that I grew up on, count and money.

10:17

It was more than her paychecks, sitting

10:20

on a float count and money in a shoe box. Wow.

10:22

Yeah. When

10:25

you were when you graduated

10:27

high school, you went on to Clark Atlanta University.

10:30

And I mean, you had gone to

10:32

college with some considerable, like,

10:35

experience under your belt. As a music

10:37

promoter and and a party organizer

10:39

and an entrepreneur. Was that your goal

10:41

was that, like, your intention? I'm gonna go to college.

10:44

I'm gonna get business degree or something like that and

10:46

I'm gonna go start a

10:47

business. Was that what you were thinking? So

10:49

I don't know what I was thinking at the time, I'll be

10:51

honest. You know -- Yeah. -- it's interesting because

10:54

this is part of the story that I don't often

10:56

tell, but I got kicked out of high school.

10:58

And after I got kicked out of high school,

11:01

I was expelled from all Baltimore City

11:03

public schools. What what happened?

11:06

I got into a fight. And

11:09

I was the aggressor in the fight.

11:11

And I feel like I'm having therapy. But

11:14

but I was the aggressor in the fight, so I got put

11:16

out, but I wrote the superintendent. And

11:18

they gave me another chance. Like,

11:20

I literally got a second chance at life.

11:22

Yeah. And when I got to college,

11:25

literally was a transfer of skill set.

11:28

So that character, the

11:30

organization, the Slutty, I

11:32

just put that in my books. And I put

11:34

that in the experience on campus. Yeah.

11:36

When

11:39

you finished, you left,

11:42

moved to LA and decided

11:44

to maybe try your hand

11:47

at acting or getting at a TV or something.

11:49

He he's a research guy.

11:53

I love it. Yeah. I've

11:55

always been a big dreamer. Mhmm.

11:58

And I was laughing just now.

12:00

I get so excited about this and I'm like,

12:02

let me tell you, like, how

12:04

life was for me. Yeah. So I packed up

12:06

my bags. A duffle bag, a suitcase,

12:09

and a bible. And I moved

12:11

to Los Angeles, California. So

12:14

when I was in LA, my sorority sister,

12:17

she told me that, like, hey, I got an opportunity

12:19

for you. You need some money. I'm gonna help you out.

12:21

And I'm like, okay. Cool. She was like, I'm gonna

12:23

get you the job as a production assistant. Now

12:26

I have never gotten an internship before.

12:29

Right? Yeah. I have never worked in

12:31

TV before, like, TV, what? I

12:33

don't know anything else about TV at this time.

12:35

BITP that's how it happened. Mhmm.

12:36

And and and this

12:38

would, I guess, basically, start a

12:40

period of several years where you worked in TV

12:42

as a producer. And and eventually, TV

12:46

brought you out to to New York. And

12:48

I guess while you were there, you you were

12:50

working on a show called the Jeremy Kyle

12:52

show, and and

12:54

what you decided to,

12:55

like like,

12:57

sock away almost all the money that you were earning

12:59

at at the time? Yeah. So

13:02

when I was working at Jeremy Kyle, I

13:04

used to always do these things. I've I've always

13:06

been like this super conscious thinker.

13:09

Right? So I said that was

13:11

going to to do a savings

13:13

challenge. Don't ask me why. Now that I think

13:15

about it, it's not a little bit Raz, but what

13:17

I used to do is I used to

13:20

live off five dollars a day.

13:22

Like, was that, like, disciplined. But

13:25

now that I think about it, I'm like, oh, that was a little

13:27

extreme. BITP I was learning discipline.

13:29

It wasn't just about saving money. I was,

13:31

like, discipline was the name of the exercise.

13:34

Mhmm. It's almost like somebody that goes to work

13:36

out. Right? Like, you go to workout

13:38

and that that muscle memory gotta come

13:40

in. Like, you gotta keep that. So you gotta workout,

13:42

you gotta do the same thing over and over again, even

13:44

in the moments when it don't feel good.

13:46

Yeah. I mean, that I mean,

13:48

and that's what a lot of these business

13:51

books that, like, your dad was talking to you about,

13:53

tell you, like, live very frugally

13:56

and put as much Raz as you can --

13:58

Yeah. -- because ultimately that will help you build, you

14:01

know, AAA life where you can live

14:03

off what's left. Absolutely, and

14:05

and retire early. Yeah. One

14:08

of the things that that enabled you to do was to

14:10

open your first restaurant in two thousand

14:12

fourteen, which was a Jamaican restaurant, pinkies.

14:15

Tell me about that idea. I mean, you grew

14:17

up, you know, in a home where

14:19

food was central and important, but the

14:21

restaurant business is hard. Very. As

14:23

you know, tell me about

14:25

this idea to open up a restaurant in

14:28

New York and Harlem in two thousand

14:29

fourteen. So working

14:32

as a television producer is very

14:34

eventful. Yeah. But while I was working

14:36

on the show, a good friend

14:38

of mine who had a restaurant in Harlem

14:41

told me about a property that was available

14:43

for lease. I could take over somebody else's

14:45

lease. And I'm like, okay, I don't know

14:47

the first thing about restaurants, but

14:49

I like to

14:50

eat. So, like, this is a recipe

14:52

for success. And and it

14:54

was restaurant already. It was

14:56

a restaurant already. Yeah. was a

14:57

head all the gear in there. It had all the cooking

15:00

stuff. And I, like, sixty five percent of

15:02

the gear. I had to, like, upgrade and do all of this

15:04

stuff. Right? And I got

15:06

in that space. And what

15:08

I realized is I

15:10

don't know about business, but I would try to stay

15:12

out.

15:12

That was, like, practice. That was, like, pictures

15:15

practice. Yeah.

15:15

And

15:16

when I opened it, guess what I had.

15:19

I lined down the block. Well, this

15:21

was this restaurant she mentioned, this is

15:23

Jamaican food. And you

15:26

were not the cook. Right? And and this was not necessarily

15:29

food that you knew how to cook well, I think.

15:31

Right? So how did you did you, like, hire

15:33

somebody and find somebody to make the food or teach

15:35

you how to make the food?

15:36

So it's a funny story. Not

15:38

only was I not the cook. I was

15:40

vegetarian at the

15:41

time, and I was telling Oxtells

15:43

who were eating the food. I wasn't eating

15:45

the food, like so I

15:47

was selling something that I wouldn't even consume.

15:50

But when I had

15:52

the restaurant, I had people coming

15:54

and supporting BITP it wasn't just for

15:56

the food. I believe it was also

15:59

for the experience. Like, it felt like you weren't

16:01

Jamaica when you came to my spot. Like, I

16:03

had the Jamaican music booming. It

16:05

was colorful and it felt tropical and

16:07

light and airy. And I had

16:09

a Jamaican at the cash register. You

16:12

know, like, it it was that.

16:14

So it I thought it was successful at

16:16

the time. I made money, you

16:18

know, I I was just learning how to be

16:20

run tour and a business person legitimately. You

16:23

ran this restaurant. It was doing

16:25

well and two

16:28

years in, BITP fire

16:30

destroyed the restaurant, and you weren't there at

16:32

the time. Right? No. I

16:35

worked that night and I closed

16:37

at, like, nine o'clock. And

16:39

I went home with my friend at the time.

16:41

And we were sitting in the house, and

16:43

I got a call from the fire department. Telling

16:46

me that my restaurant was on fire. And I'm like,

16:48

oh, on fire, I just left. And when I

16:50

got there, the fire had been out at this

16:52

point, but all it was was smoke.

16:54

The windows are busted. So, like, smoke was coming

16:56

out the windows. Everything was blank on the inside.

16:59

And I'm like, holy shit. Like

17:02

everything that I worked for is

17:05

literally gone up in flames.

17:06

We're

17:09

gonna take a quick break, but when we come

17:11

back, how pinky reevaluates everything

17:14

after the fire and gets back

17:16

into the food business and then entirely

17:19

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17:21

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17:23

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go to n y times dot com slash

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all Access. Welcome

19:30

back to how I built this lab. I'm Guy Raz,

19:32

and my guest today is Picky Cole, the

19:34

founder Slutty vegan. So

19:37

pinky, you pour your heart and

19:39

soul into this restaurant, pinky's

19:41

Jamaican for two years.

19:44

And then in an instant,

19:46

it it literally all goes up in

19:48

flames. I I can't even imagine

19:50

how how horrible that must have

19:52

been. But of course, you are

19:54

the owner of this restaurant. You can't, like,

19:56

close your eyes and make it all the way. So

19:59

So what happened Wondery fire was at, what did

20:01

you do? So there were things at

20:03

the front that were salvageable, but

20:06

majority of the items in it, the roof had came

20:08

in like it was not salvageable. Mhmm.

20:10

So I'm like, okay. Cool. Like,

20:12

fire insurance is gonna take care of this.

20:14

So I called my insurance agent And

20:17

they were like, no. You don't have fire insurance.

20:19

Mhmm. And I'm like, what? Like, you

20:21

just have regular basic business insurance.

20:24

And if you wanna be able to,

20:26

you know, get the things that you got

20:28

back, like, we aren't responsible. Like, we don't

20:30

have a policy for that. Yeah. So

20:33

that's literally blood

20:35

sweat and tears down the drain. And

20:37

I don't wish that all my worst enemy. You

20:40

lost everything. I lost everything.

20:43

And I make a joke about like, almost

20:45

lost my mind, but I really almost lost my

20:47

mind.

20:47

You gotta imagine what I told you

20:49

so far is -- Yeah.

20:50

-- I used to throw parties I

20:53

was the get girl on campus. I

20:56

got this job working in TV. Like,

20:58

everything that I've done have always

21:00

been successful. Right? Like, anything

21:02

I touched her and I go. Pinkie Cole got

21:04

the Midas touch, but I didn't have

21:06

the Midas touch on this one. And

21:09

I felt like the biggest failure at

21:11

the time. Mhmm. It didn't feel good

21:13

to me at all because my pride and my ego

21:15

wouldn't allow me to be that vulnerable. So

21:18

when it happened, it really humbled me

21:21

in a way that it's never happened in my life,

21:22

but I needed that level of humility guy.

21:25

Yeah. I mean, going into

21:27

the as you know, going into the restaurant business

21:29

is so complicated and the margins are so

21:31

thin and it's so challenging because

21:34

I mean, it's a crash course in

21:36

running a really complicated business,

21:38

which, you know, I've never done it,

21:40

but I've just seen people do it.

21:44

His heart yeah. Tell

21:46

me about what you learned doing

21:48

that. I wish I could

21:50

come here and, like, tell you, like, it's all

21:52

rainbows and lilies and, like,

21:54

that's not. Like, it's

21:57

really not. I walked in so

21:59

blind. And when I

22:01

say blind, I didn't have anybody

22:03

that has done it before to ax those

22:05

kind of questions. Yeah. So I was in the lake

22:07

all by myself. Mhmm. But being in the

22:09

lake, like, I really stuck myself out there

22:11

to, like, do the research. So I'd be

22:13

on Google all night. I'd be on YouTube.

22:16

Like, I would I would go to different restaurants

22:18

and just look around and like BITP a lot

22:20

of trial and error. Yeah.

22:21

Hell,

22:22

it still lives trial and error.

22:26

But when I when I realized is

22:29

that creating it the way that

22:31

it was created gave me the opportunity

22:33

to learn every side of the business.

22:34

Yeah.

22:35

Like, I had no choice but to learn

22:38

accountant. I had no choice but to

22:40

learn how to, like, cook burgers and

22:42

fries, and I didn't grow up eating burgers

22:44

and fries. Like, I had no choice but to

22:46

be customer service.

22:49

So you lost your restaurant. So

22:51

that's like not not a good place to

22:54

be I can imagine you

22:56

were depressed. Like, I mean,

22:59

what else can you be? I mean Yeah.

23:01

Right? I mean, but within week or so,

23:03

you get this call. I think it was from a

23:06

show that's on the Open Network. Right? Own? Yeah.

23:08

Mhmm. And and they offered you a job

23:10

and you went and you took that job. Yeah.

23:13

I

23:13

took that job. And don't

23:15

know why I'm having all these revelations while I'm talking

23:17

to you guy. But

23:19

you you haven't been in a situation where you, like,

23:22

Okay. It's time to move on. Okay.

23:24

This is not working. Yeah.

23:25

Has

23:25

that ever happened to you before?

23:27

Yeah. Totally. Yeah. So

23:30

that was the moment that I was in when

23:32

I had the restaurant right before the fire.

23:35

And was so many things happening at that

23:37

time. And when it happened,

23:39

I didn't understand it then. But

23:41

then I got the opportunity to go

23:43

on a show, and I'm like, I haven't got nothing

23:46

to lose at this point. Like I might as

23:48

well go and be great and fly and start

23:50

over because one thing about me is I was never

23:52

free to start over. Mhmm. And

23:54

when I got to a later work on the show,

23:56

it was the best thing that could have happened to

23:58

me because it was actually like a healing

24:01

therapy show I'm like go figure -- Yeah.

24:03

-- healing therapy, like, I'm coming

24:05

from depressed space, like, great. But

24:07

I needed it -- Yeah. -- because

24:09

it allowed me the opportunity to

24:11

get the therapy that I needed to heal. Yeah,

24:13

the

24:13

show's call fixed my life, and it was conversations

24:15

about struggles and challenges.

24:18

Right? And Exactly. And in this show,

24:20

they would kinda try to resolve these challenges

24:23

or just just talk through them.

24:24

Yeah. Yeah. It was like a therapy

24:26

show. It was like a therapy show. BITP

24:29

I liked about the show is that I got

24:31

the opportunity to connect with people who

24:33

are also going through it. Yeah. So

24:36

you're working for the show in LA -- Mhmm.

24:38

-- back in LA. Right? Mhmm. Yeah.

24:41

And

24:42

and while you are working on the show,

24:46

you decide because

24:48

you are a little bit of a masochist

24:50

that you go back into the restaurant business.

24:52

Because I'm

24:52

crazy. That's why I hate it. And

24:55

you come up with this idea for,

24:58

like, a vegan fast

25:00

food place.

25:00

Tell me about how you came

25:02

up with with this concept at first.

25:04

So again, I told you that, like,

25:08

I got a couple screws loose, but it's

25:10

okay. So right before I started

25:12

a Slutty vegan, something just went

25:14

over me. I don't know what it is. BITP

25:17

that I look at, like, the holistic picture, I'm like,

25:19

it happened on purpose. So when we

25:21

were on hiatus,

25:21

you know, when you have hiatus on a show, you

25:23

gotta find ways supplement your income. Right?

25:25

Because usually there's a season you work. It's like

25:28

four to six months and then you've got

25:30

four or five months off.

25:31

Yeah.

25:31

So, like, you can have a whole lot of Wondery,

25:33

and then you could be trying to figure out, like, how you're gonna

25:35

pay the next bill. Yeah.

25:36

Like, that's

25:36

how it works. Nobody really talks about their work.

25:38

What is the dream?

25:39

Because TV work is project based. They

25:41

don't sound like a salary. You get paid for

25:43

the project and you're done. Yeah. And then you gotta

25:45

figure it out while you're done until it comes back.

25:47

So I'm like, okay. Alright. Let me do door to ish. So

25:51

while I was doing DoorDash, I'm like, alright. Let

25:53

me start working out. Let me start reading

25:55

a book every day. And I did that. I read a book every

25:57

day. was Royal Vegan. I did DoorDash. And

26:00

I ran five miles a day consistently. Like,

26:03

I did that because I was practicing discipline.

26:06

This can I just pause for this is just

26:08

five and a half years ago we're talking about that you

26:10

were doing

26:11

this? It's it's it's it's coming up on five

26:13

years. I mean and because what we're gonna

26:15

talk about where you you are today, which is incredible.

26:18

This is five years ago, you're like, okay,

26:20

I'm gonna figure out. I'm just gonna There

26:22

was no end goal. You were

26:24

just I just wanna be disciplined. I wanna run

26:26

every day and read a book. It wasn't like and then that

26:28

will lead me to this.

26:29

It was just, I'm gonna do this

26:31

in because it's gonna focus

26:34

me. Well, you know what my thought process

26:36

was now that I think about BITP?

26:39

gonna do this because discipline

26:41

breeds rewards. Mhmm.

26:43

Yep. I know that if I'm disciplined on

26:45

something, there will be like

26:47

a cosmic. Effect that happens

26:50

when I display that level of discipline. And

26:54

I did that. And now that I'm thinking about

26:56

it, I did it all of my life. There were certain levels

26:58

of discipline and some of it probably was a little

27:00

bit more extreme than others. Yeah. But

27:02

that level of discipline really,

27:05

like, opened up my mindset to be able receive

27:07

what it is that the assignment was and

27:09

the assignment was to open up Slutty

27:11

vegan and build a multimillion dollar brain.

27:14

By the way, I hope my mom is listening to this in because

27:16

you sound exactly like them all.

27:19

That's good thing to say to me when I was a kid

27:21

about discipline and the connection between

27:23

discipline and rewards. And

27:26

my mom always used to say the busier you are, the

27:28

more time you have because you have to be efficient.

27:30

Mhmm. Alright. So you are being

27:33

disciplined? And how

27:35

does this this idea of a vegan

27:37

fast

27:38

food, like comfort food kind of, you

27:40

know, fast casual restaurant come your mind.

27:42

Okay. So when I

27:44

was the casting director because I

27:46

had gotten promoted within that time -- Yeah.

27:49

-- they asked me to move to Atlanta temporarily

27:51

early to do the show. Mhmm. So

27:53

while I was living in Atlanta, was

27:55

in my two bedroom apartment, and god, I

27:57

can only be turning experienced. I'm a tell you to miss

27:59

Ruth. I don't smoke. Right? I'm not

28:01

a I'm not a weed smoker. But

28:03

on this night, I smoked.

28:06

Mhmm. And after

28:08

I smoked, slightly vegan literally like

28:10

hit me like a lightbulb. And I gotta

28:12

be transparent about that story because

28:15

literally don't know if I was super relaxed

28:17

conscious was open. I I'm still trying to figure

28:20

it out. Mhmm. But when I Wondery I came up

28:22

with slutty vegan, it was literally

28:24

like the universe just put it in my hand,

28:27

like, okay, run, fly, and be free. Yeah.

28:29

And I called up my best friends. And I

28:31

asked someone

28:31

like, which y'all think about this idea? And they're like,

28:33

oh, pick it. That's good. Like, you need to do that. I'm like,

28:36

alright. Cool.

28:36

You had the idea and the name all

28:39

on that night. Yes.

28:39

All all in night time, literally,

28:41

it was gonna be called slutty

28:44

vegan, which is I mean, it's

28:46

it's not pinkies vegan.

28:48

No. It's not vegan fast

28:50

food or, you know, vegan burgers,

28:53

it was I mean,

28:54

you picked a provocative name. Listen,

28:56

because Slutty and vegan ain't supposed to go

28:58

together. Right? Like, right? Well,

29:00

you think that's like how peanut butter and jelly

29:02

goes together. Like, and vegan don't

29:04

go together. But what I

29:06

did is it really was the biggest

29:09

oxymoron. So I'm like, if Mhmm.

29:11

We all know veganism to be, like,

29:13

very rich and wealthy and like,

29:15

clean and, like, the person who's vegan works out

29:17

all the time. Know to say that. But

29:20

it literally really, like,

29:22

took all the politics out of

29:25

what PMBG. Was. So came

29:27

up with the name, literally started to do

29:29

the work. Like, I got all my permits. I did everything

29:31

that I could all them own. And

29:33

I got the shared kitchen

29:35

and I asked them. I said, hey,

29:38

can III saw something in LA when

29:40

I was working for DoorDash. And basically it's

29:42

a cloud kitchen.

29:43

So can I do a cloud kitchen here?

29:45

This was before cloud kitchen's got popular

29:47

guy. Yeah. This was one of those, like,

29:49

right, these well, a lot of people

29:51

who have, like, farmer's market

29:52

stands, they'll use these their their commercial kitchens,

29:55

their shared kitchens.

29:55

Exactly.

29:57

And and that that's what it was. You rented

29:59

space in in one of these kitchens. Yep.

30:01

And so they allowed me to do it.

30:03

So hired two employees and

30:06

we were making burgers and

30:08

fries. And I came up with

30:10

the recipe for the

30:11

sauce. It's like similar to, like, what

30:13

a McDonald's also be, but not.

30:15

Yeah.

30:15

Right? So But the So

30:18

the whole egg in the mayonnaise and Yeah.

30:19

Right. So

30:20

mind you, I'm not

30:22

a chef guy. So I came up with a recipe,

30:24

like, I was just tasting and putting my finger in, like, okay,

30:26

this is good. Yeah. And came

30:29

up with that came up with a fry seasoning

30:31

and I was just like doing as I go and like

30:33

everything was tastein' really good. So we

30:35

started selling How online

30:38

through DoorDash, Postmates,

30:41

Grubhub, and

30:43

Uber Eats. You started literally

30:46

a ghost kitchen called slutty vegan.

30:48

Yeah. Slutty Vegan was a ghost kitchen before

30:50

was anything else.

30:51

Wow. Yeah. This

30:53

is this is so interesting.

30:55

There's this famous book by Seth Godin,

30:57

where he talks about the purple cow. The purple

31:00

cow theory is, like, if you're gonna start a business,

31:02

you wanna think about purple cow business.

31:04

Because, like, if you're driving through, you know, the

31:07

countryside and you just see a cow in a field, you're

31:09

just gonna keep driving. But if it was a

31:11

purple cow in the field. You would jump out your

31:13

car and hop in front of that cow and take

31:15

a selfie with that cow and then put on Instagram.

31:17

Say, look, I found purple cow. That was

31:19

slutty vegan. Yeah. It's a purple cow.

31:21

Because people are gonna say,

31:22

what a weird name?

31:25

I have to know more about this thing. It's so

31:27

weird. Yes. And guess what it did?

31:30

I love the purple cow theory, by the way. Purple is

31:32

my favorite color, so just works all the way around. You

31:34

gotta grab that book. But what

31:36

I realized is This

31:39

concept came at

31:41

a time where people

31:43

wanted something new and in wanting something

31:45

new, If I can make them uncomfortable and

31:48

ask questions at the same time, laugh,

31:51

or chuckle, or be surprised --

31:53

Yeah. -- then I know that I have their attention.

31:55

And when I have their attention, I can teach

31:57

and educate them on whatever it is that

32:00

I want to. So I took the approach

32:02

to educate people on how veganism

32:04

can be cool and be fun and not be stuffy

32:07

and

32:07

uptight, but you can have a good time and we'll

32:09

meet you where you are. Yeah.

32:13

So when you started out, right, in

32:15

in a ghost kitchen, which is true, like, if you go to

32:17

DoorDash or Uber Eats today, like a lot of the and

32:19

I do all the time I order up and like, oh, this looks pretty

32:21

good. I don't even know if it's a restaurant. I

32:23

just I'm ordering I don't know where it's coming from, and

32:25

it is often coming from on these

32:28

ghost kitchens. You were doing this in twenty

32:30

eighteen. And were you just buying like

32:32

garden burgers and and buns just

32:34

off the shelf initially at the

32:36

beginning? Just from the grocery store? No.

32:38

You know what I did? There was like a

32:40

procurement director. Mhmm. And

32:43

she was showing me some new products that they had.

32:45

Like, there's this newer company called Impossible

32:48

And I'm like, oh, let

32:50

me taste it. Yeah. And and

32:52

I tasted And I'm like, well, this is good.

32:55

And I'm like, I want it. So

32:57

she got me a delivery of the Impossible

33:00

Slutty, and I started from

33:01

there. And I had in my little razzled to the

33:03

already dazzled. Wow. And I

33:06

started growing and building. Those

33:08

were hard to get. I mean, restaurants could get them. But

33:11

now, of course, the impossible meat is available everywhere,

33:13

but you were basically turn those into patties.

33:16

And getting vegan cheese again.

33:18

Yeah. And basically packaging

33:21

them up and then some

33:23

driver would pick them up and then that was

33:25

Well, that's how it started. Yeah.

33:28

How how it ended is that I got kicked

33:31

out of the facility. And I

33:33

appreciate them for that because they pushed

33:35

me to get uncomfortable. Why? Because I

33:37

had too many people coming. Like, people started talking

33:39

about the brand so much. That customers

33:41

started Instagraming us, sending us private messages,

33:44

saying, hey, can I order the

33:46

one nice day with the fries, catch up one side

33:48

and I'm like, okay, I'm not going to not take the order?

33:51

So I would take the order from

33:54

Instagram while taking orders from

33:56

these online platforms. Wow. And

33:58

it got out of hand guy when

34:01

I tell you, like, people from everywhere

34:03

were

34:03

coming. Literally, it was like three hundred people standing

34:05

outside to get their food. From I

34:07

mean, you're on DoorDash, but if

34:09

you type in vegan, it'll show you bunch of restaurants.

34:12

And usually, you know, they're you know,

34:14

I live in the Bay Area. So I'm not I'm there's some

34:16

great ones, but nothing Slutty vegan.

34:17

No. If you see that, you're gonna be like,

34:19

what is this? Yes.

34:21

BITP people didn't come for the food.

34:23

The food was good. That was like the sharing on top.

34:25

Yeah. But to

34:25

say that you are a part of this experience

34:28

that felt cryptic and you could only get

34:30

it at certain time.

34:30

People love the art of scarcity.

34:33

Yeah.

34:33

You know, like the art of scarcity

34:35

makes you want it more. So

34:38

I would only open up for like three hours

34:40

at a time. And once I close the block, that's Nobody

34:42

else can So, like, I I put people

34:44

on a time frame on when you can get the food,

34:47

and they complied. And I'm like, wow, people

34:49

really wanna be part of this movement just to say that

34:51

they got it. And when I

34:53

got put out, they told me that I

34:55

could use the parking lot. Like,

34:56

hey, you should get a food truck, and you could do it out

34:58

of the parking lot, but you can't do it in here because it's

35:00

disrupt and the other tenants.

35:02

Because people were so many delivery

35:04

drivers were coming to pick up orders there.

35:06

Yes.

35:06

And it was disrupting the

35:08

business of the other tenants. Everybody

35:10

was like, what's she doing that I'm doing

35:12

wrong? How's she getting all this business?

35:15

Yeah. So BITP was

35:17

Raz. Man, listen. When

35:19

I got that food truck, I went

35:21

to this place called mister

35:23

Vies in Atlanta. So I went inside

35:25

and they told me that the food truck could be forty five

35:27

thousand dollars. Wow. So I'm like,

35:30

alright. Well, I'm making a lot of money, BITP, like, I don't

35:32

have forty five thousand dollars, like, in my hand

35:34

right now. But what I could do is I

35:36

can pay you ten thousand dollars a week for the

35:38

next four

35:39

weeks. So it was it was like ten thousand, I

35:41

think. And this

35:42

was the cash flow from your

35:44

business

35:45

and maybe also

35:45

some savings you had from that that TV

35:47

show. I never

35:48

had to tap into my savings. It's

35:50

wow. This was just the cash flow

35:52

from the Ghost Kitchen business.

35:54

Yes. Wow. So when

35:56

I got the food truck, the owner allowed

35:58

me to pay every single week. And I

36:00

would go on a east side and a west side

36:02

and I would post up three hours before

36:05

and say, hey, the Slutty vegan food truck will be

36:07

here from four to seven. Those are my hours,

36:09

like, four to seven or four to nine. I will post

36:11

on Instagram. Yeah. And every time I

36:13

post on Instagram, I literally had

36:16

between three to five hundred people

36:18

that would stand

36:19

outside. Waiting. Yes. Yes.

36:21

For a burger. Wow. And I realized,

36:23

but it wasn't about the food. People

36:26

wanted to be part of the experience.

36:28

You're like you're like McDonald's in Moscow

36:30

in nineteen eighty nine. Just like lines

36:32

of thousands of people. Mhmm.

36:34

So so you have this food

36:37

truck and obviously, you're

36:39

I mean, you started this. I

36:41

read that within six months of starting

36:44

the ghost kitchen, your revenue

36:46

is four million dollars. It's

36:48

incredible. I mean, and and and

36:51

this was based on burgers and

36:53

fries.

36:53

Yeah. Burgers and fries.

36:55

And literally, hold on. Let me not even just burgers

36:58

and fries. I didn't sell drinks. I

37:01

literally only sold burgers and fries.

37:03

I didn't sell desserts, so you were

37:05

literally coming for some french

37:07

fries in a sandwich. But

37:09

guess what what else you got? You got

37:11

the cultural capital of being able

37:14

to have the currency of food and take

37:16

a picture with and people get excited because

37:18

they wanna hear about your experience. To

37:20

brand. It's a brand. Yeah. And

37:22

do you know my business is almost five

37:24

years old and I still got lines down the

37:27

block? It's incredible. People

37:29

still come and support me. But

37:31

I realized I am the

37:33

slutty vegan. I'm

37:35

law and the tongue plus I'm educated,

37:37

you know, I move with intention and

37:40

I'm intellectual Plus, I like

37:42

to have a good time. And I'm

37:44

real. Like, I meet you where you are and

37:46

I'm just a five. Slutty vegan is

37:48

a five. And as long as that

37:50

happens,

37:50

my business will continue

37:53

to be successful. We're

37:55

gonna take another quick break when we

37:57

come back or from peaky cold about

37:59

her work to build one of the first major

38:01

vegan fast food restaurant chains in

38:03

the US. Stay with us. The guy

38:06

really thing to how I build this lab.

38:13

Hey. I'm Mike Corey, the host

38:15

of Wondery podcast against the odds.

38:18

Each week, we share thrilling true

38:20

stories of survival. And

38:22

put you in the shoes of the heroes

38:24

who live to tell the tale. In our next

38:26

season, we take you to a remote

38:29

corner of Alaska that's home to one

38:31

of the densest brown bear populations in

38:33

the world. But in recent years,

38:35

the change in climate has caused a shortage

38:38

of the bears natural food sources. More

38:40

and more bears are venturing into the town

38:42

of Haines, Alaska, in search of

38:44

food, putting residents on edge.

38:47

Then everyone's worst fears

38:49

are realized three experienced

38:51

backcountry skiers, unknowingly ski

38:54

over a den, and awaken a mother

38:56

bear, and her cub. She

38:58

attacks. And one of the men

39:00

is left fighting for his life while

39:02

his friends desperately wait for

39:04

help to

39:05

arrive. Follow against the

39:07

odds wherever you get your podcast. You

39:09

can

39:09

listen ad free on the Amazon

39:11

Music or Wondery app.

39:13

Hi. I'm Lindsey Graham, the host of Wondery

39:15

podcast American scandal. We bring

39:17

to life some of the biggest controversies in

39:19

US HIBT, presidential lies, environmental

39:22

disasters, corporate fraud. In our

39:24

newest series, we look at the story of the

39:26

Oklahoma City bombing, the deadliest

39:28

act of domestic terrorism in United

39:30

States history. On April nineteenth nineteen

39:33

ninety five, a moving truck packed with

39:35

forty eight hundred pounds of explosives was

39:37

detonated in downtown Oklahoma City.

39:39

When the bomb went off, it killed one hundred

39:42

sixty eight people and injured over six hundred

39:44

more. At first, both the American

39:46

public and law enforcement believed international

39:49

terrorists were behind the attack, but the

39:51

evidence led investigators toward an unexpected

39:53

and chilling conclusion. The Oklahoma BITP

39:56

bombing appeared to be the work of domestic

39:58

criminals. In a plot bound together with

40:00

political extremism, conspiracy theories,

40:02

and a goal to strike back against

40:04

the United States government.

40:05

Follow American ScanL

40:07

wherever you get your podcasts. You can

40:09

listen ad free on the Amazon Music

40:11

or Wondery app. Welcome

40:26

back. You're listening to how I built this lab. And

40:28

my guest today is Pinky Cole, the founder

40:30

of Atlanta based vegan food chain,

40:33

slutty vegan. You

40:35

opened the first brick and mortar in Atlanta

40:38

in January of twenty nineteen. And

40:41

initially, the people

40:43

in neighborhood were not supportive say

40:47

the least. They did not want a

40:49

restaurant called slutty vegan on

40:51

the block. Right? And this was this

40:53

so serious. Like, they battled it out in, like,

40:55

the city against this permit.

40:58

Yeah.

40:58

Yeah. You know, you're not

41:00

allowed to be because it

41:02

didn't feel good when it was happening. Yeah.

41:05

But what I learned about, like, failure

41:08

like, really rising above that and

41:10

realizing that this too always fast.

41:13

Like, that literally is the motivation

41:15

that keeps me going. So let

41:17

me tell you about that first location on

41:20

Route David Abernethy Boulevard. My grand opened

41:22

and I had twelve hundred people standing outside Wow.

41:25

So I came in as a disruption. So

41:29

I get Like, you know, bigger picture. Now

41:31

understand I was upset about it at

41:32

first. But like -- Yeah.

41:33

-- I'm literally bringing so

41:35

many people to a neighborhood that

41:37

often some of the people in the neighborhood felt

41:40

like, you know, it was it turned the neighborhood

41:42

and, like, making it worse. But

41:44

what they didn't realize is that I was bringing

41:46

more value to the community. Mhmm.

41:48

People wanted to be a part of that area

41:50

more. The real estate increased. And

41:54

I went to court, and

41:56

I had to literally fight for my brand.

41:59

Yeah.

41:59

And at that moment, I'm like, yeah, this

42:01

is my child because I don't

42:03

play about my child. And my child a

42:05

HIBT hurt nobody. We just wanna have a good time

42:07

for everybody. And

42:10

I end up staying. I'm still at that location

42:12

now. When

42:14

you opened that first location

42:16

in Atlanta, did you have the

42:18

menu you now have, because you have a lot of

42:21

different burgers. And

42:24

I don't know if I can

42:25

say, do you know by the way, pinky? I also

42:27

It's your

42:27

show. You could say it. I also

42:29

host a Children's Science Show and

42:32

sometimes those kids listen to how

42:34

I built this too. So if you're listening, please

42:36

forgive me. I'm just gonna say the names of

42:38

some of the burgers. There's There's

42:43

the Hollywood hooker, there's the

42:45

menager toa, there's

42:47

the super there's

42:49

the whole boy. Anyway, a

42:51

lot lot of different kinds of burgers. Some of them

42:54

are plant based chicken, some of them are plant

42:56

based burgers, some of them have, you

42:59

know, jalapenos come only some of them

43:01

are vegan shrimp. So,

43:05

yeah, did you initially was it

43:07

just the burger that you had or or did you

43:09

already have this big expansive venue?

43:11

No.

43:11

It was just burgers and fries. That's

43:13

it. Yeah. Like, I didn't know how to build

43:16

a venue. I didn't know how to do P

43:18

and Ls. Like, I didn't know Like, it was literally

43:20

just, okay, burgundy and fries. Let me throw this and

43:22

and see if it works. And I threw it on the wall in

43:24

the

43:24

stock. Yeah. And

43:25

people loved and

43:28

they love it because of my sauce.

43:30

So my secret sauce I made from scratch. So

43:32

people come from around the world to taste this

43:34

sauce because it's so overwhelmingly

43:37

good. What's the name of the sauce?

43:39

It's called Slutty sauce. Yes.

43:45

It's called slutty sauce, which you guys are

43:47

so a little of my concept, god, like, it has nothing

43:49

to do with sex. Right. The names are just

43:51

a draw -- Yeah. -- to pull you in -- Yeah. --

43:53

to understand that, like, vegan as a HIBT is it

43:55

can be cool when you can reimagine food in a

43:57

way that you've never seen it before. Yeah.

43:59

But when you do

44:01

that, you have to deliver. The food

44:03

has to be great. Otherwise, people are gonna say,

44:05

oh, this is just a gimmick. So you also

44:07

had to make sure that the food was great. Absolutely.

44:10

I mean, you know, I'm fighting two battles.

44:13

I gotta make sure that the food is good just because it's

44:15

good. And I gotta make sure that the food is good because

44:17

it's vegan food and historically people don't feel

44:19

like vegan food tastes good. Right. So, like,

44:21

I'm at war with two things at the same

44:24

time. So I make sure that

44:27

all of the output is just as good.

44:29

Tell me about the vegan side of this, right, for

44:31

a moment, which is, you know,

44:34

this is not necessarily, like, better for

44:36

you, is not like, lower in calories, but

44:38

it is vegan. You know, animals

44:41

died to produce this food. And so

44:43

just part of you or maybe not just part of

44:45

a big part of you

44:47

want to encourage more people to

44:49

stop eating meat? Yes.

44:51

What is this to fold? So

44:53

my agenda has always been I'm

44:56

gonna meet you where you at. Yeah. Right? Like, if

44:58

you don't wanna be vegan, just incorporate some

45:00

vegan options. A little bit of vegan ain't gonna go here

45:02

nobody. And because

45:05

I've had that messaging, like, I'm

45:07

not gonna hate you if I see you eat and eat, but

45:09

I'm also gonna encourage you that, like, This tastes

45:11

just as good if not better. Yeah. I know animals

45:13

were compromised. So people

45:15

feel comfortable trying new options

45:18

because they don't feel like the pressure was put on

45:20

them.

45:20

Yeah. And we know I mean,

45:23

I say this as a meat eater. I do eat meat,

45:25

and I'm

45:27

friends with some cattle ranchers in

45:29

Northern California who of the show. So forgive me when

45:31

I say this, but we know that in general,

45:33

the livestock industry obviously causes

45:36

a lot of carbon emissions, not like,

45:38

you know, small grass

45:41

fed farms, but I'm talking about mass

45:43

industrialized, you know, beef

45:45

and pork and chicken production. So

45:48

So the idea is to get people to also

45:50

think about the planet a little bit too.

45:52

Mhmm. Yeah. Climate

45:54

change is real. Like,

45:57

it's real. So, you

45:59

know, you know how they say it's levels

46:01

to this. Yeah. Like, the first level

46:03

is getting people to understand that, like,

46:05

vegan isn't gross. And it can

46:07

be delicious. So we're going to start

46:10

with the thing that universally everybody

46:12

is familiar with. And that's burgers and

46:14

fries. Yeah. And now we got you locked

46:16

in. Now we're gonna go on to the next thing.

46:18

After I opened up Slutty vegan, I opened up a bar

46:21

called Bar vegan. That sells vegan

46:23

bar food. So now, not

46:25

only can you have burgers and fries over Slutty vegan,

46:27

now you can have chili and rice,

46:30

Now you can have more chicken

46:32

sandwiches. Now you can have a salad. So I'm

46:34

literally growing with people who wanna

46:36

learn about

46:37

veganism. Which is why my book is

46:39

called Eat Plants Bitch -- Yeah.

46:40

-- because it's a in your face approach

46:42

to get you to understand that, like, we just

46:44

wish you to like good food. Yeah. And that's

46:46

it. And then you realize that it's vegan,

46:48

and then you realize certain foods are really good

46:50

for you and so on and so forth.

46:52

And you really, like, caught

46:54

this perfect wave of, like, all

46:56

of a sudden, Beyond Meat and Impossible

46:59

Foods just blew up and they were everywhere.

47:01

And it was like this wave that just kinda

47:03

really began with with

47:05

with where you started in in twenty

47:07

nineteen. I mean, it really started around

47:09

that time. Yeah. So, you know,

47:12

I like to call myself the guinea pig.

47:14

Yeah. BITP

47:17

it's interesting because not

47:19

a lot of people were doing it. There

47:21

are some great vegan restaurants in Atlanta.

47:24

BITP I'm like, okay. I want vegan food on the late

47:26

night. I don't wanna just eat a side salad and fries.

47:28

Do you wanna, like, after the after you go to a club,

47:30

I wanna have a greasy vegan breakfast.

47:33

At

47:33

two in the morning. Exactly. And

47:36

I knew that that was a market that did not

47:38

exist because me

47:40

a vegan myself that was the food

47:42

that I wanted certain times or the night sometimes,

47:44

and I couldn't find it. So coming

47:47

up with this concept, it really

47:49

gave people an opportunity to see that

47:51

there is a need for vegan food

47:53

on menus and restaurants across the

47:55

world. Yeah. And putting

47:57

it on my menu. Now I realize other big

47:59

companies now have impossible this

48:02

and chicken that. And, you know, there's

48:04

one side of me. This is like, wait a minute. Like,

48:07

I know I'm at the head of this movement. BITP

48:09

then the other side of me was like, you know what? The

48:11

idea that more people wanna eat this way tells

48:13

us that we're doing the right

48:15

thing. And there's a market for it. Pinkie,

48:17

given the long line, so all these

48:19

people who were just, you know, just,

48:21

like, showing up to and your revenue

48:23

and, like, it was profitable really quickly.

48:26

I have to imagine that, like, Already in

48:28

twenty nineteen, you had all

48:31

kinds of people who were coming up to you saying,

48:33

you know,

48:35

you gotta do this or gotta do that or you're doing this

48:37

wrong or you know, you gotta focus on this. Like,

48:39

were you getting all this endless input

48:42

from people that sometimes wasn't helpful?

48:44

So much. You

48:46

know, growing slutty vegan, you know, everybody

48:49

has an opinion. Right? So, like, people who know

48:51

you, colleagues, everybody's like, well, you need to do it this

48:53

way. Do it this way. But I decided to do it

48:55

my own way because I was clear. And

48:58

there were a lot of people like, well, you know, there

49:00

are people talking about your vegan burgers, and,

49:02

you know, there's other vegan burgers

49:04

that said, but but I'm like, I wasn't listening

49:06

to the noise because I've never

49:08

seen anybody do it in this capacity. Bootstrap

49:11

in a business and turning it into

49:13

a multimillion dollar business before

49:15

any injection of anybody's capital. So

49:18

to have to be able to do this, before,

49:21

you know, all of those things. I'm like,

49:22

okay, I gotta figure this out in trial and

49:24

error. I mean, you were

49:26

growing this restaurant purely

49:28

through cash flow. Because it was doing

49:30

so well. And you resisted

49:33

taking in its investments for a

49:35

while, but last year in twenty twenty

49:37

two, you did raise around

49:39

twenty five million dollars and that that was

49:41

led by Danny Meyer who was on

49:43

high built this many years go obviously

49:45

known for Shake Shack and there

49:47

obviously it's a great partner, huge restaurant

49:50

tours. Was that the

49:52

reason why you want to partner with them? Because they had

49:54

all this experience and they could help you scale this?

49:56

So

49:56

interestingly enough, Rishi

49:59

Lou Dennis is my lead, and and

50:01

Danny is my

50:02

both collectively leads.

50:04

Or Rishi Lou Dennis, he was he's a beauty

50:06

entrepreneur. Yes. Right. Yeah. So

50:09

Ritchie Lou was a great guy, and my

50:12

relationship started with him first. And

50:15

we knew that we needed to have

50:17

someone who was strategic in this space

50:19

-- Mhmm. -- in order to get to where we wanna

50:21

be. When you talk about, like, growing startup companies,

50:24

first of all, as hard as hell. Secondly,

50:26

you gotta be able to rub shoulders with the right people

50:28

so that you can have the right resources to do the things

50:30

that you need to do to scale this company. So

50:33

when we realized we had a scalable and sustainable

50:35

Raz, we were like, okay. Alright. We need to bring

50:37

the big dogs on our team when

50:40

it comes to restaurants. And

50:42

had conversation with Danny first on Zoom, and it was

50:44

a great conversation. And he was such

50:46

a five. He was so cool.

50:48

And I'm very intentional about who I like to do

50:50

business. With. And he was

50:52

on my wish list because I'm like, I really like his

50:54

energy. He's very calm and

50:56

pure in his approach to how he communicates. And

50:59

I like that about him. So

51:01

then I get an email a couple months later

51:03

saying that Danny came to the restaurant at

51:06

our Edgewood location, and he came a little

51:08

after midnight. And it was him

51:10

and like twelve other people. And he

51:12

had a blast. So we reconnected. And

51:14

that reconnection turned into than

51:17

being one of our investors

51:20

as Vegan. And I'll

51:22

be honest, a lot of people don't talk about this,

51:24

right, when they're growing companies. When

51:26

the conversation started for me to get

51:28

an injection of capital, it gave me anxiety.

51:30

Yeah. It gave me anxiety because I'm like,

51:33

okay, this business is not minds anymore. Like,

51:35

if get all this then I'm a sellout, and it

51:37

doesn't work. And I'm like, wait, wait, wait, wait.

51:39

No. I'm scaling a company

51:41

and I need people to come on board with

51:43

me who had the expertise that I don't

51:46

to help me make it better.

51:47

And and obviously, what's so cool

51:49

about Shake Shack is, it's like it's

51:52

massive. It's like in and out burger shake check,

51:55

you know, Chick fil A, like, those are the,

51:57

you know, the kind of the eight hundred pound gorillas

51:59

in that

52:00

world. They're so successful. Right.

52:02

So why wouldn't I wanna be a right of the eight

52:04

pound gorilla? Like, I I want

52:06

to be affiliated with

52:08

minds who have created something so special.

52:10

Just on the business side because I wanna be clear,

52:12

I don't eat meat, so I don't eat Shake Shack. But

52:15

I like what they represent when it comes to community.

52:17

Yeah. And because Slutty Vegan is a community

52:19

driven business. I'm like, okay, there's some alignment

52:22

here. Yeah.

52:22

Tell me about

52:24

the branding because the branding is

52:26

really, really really good. I mean, it's

52:28

the colors that you picked, you know, the yellow,

52:31

and and even like the cups,

52:34

I can't I can't repeat what what it says in the

52:36

cups, maybe you can because

52:38

I just can't. But it's What

52:41

what does BITP? What does it say on the side of the cup?

52:44

Oh, on

52:44

the cup, it says drink the

52:46

fur cup.

52:47

Yep. Got it. But

52:50

but but the psychology again,

52:52

right, like, again, when I tell you I'm in thinking about

52:54

the marketing. Yeah.

52:55

It's like two meanings. Right? But it's whatever

52:57

you think it means. Yeah. It's really

52:59

I mean, just things like that, you know, like, on the

53:01

side of the up. Right? Or the colors

53:04

or the names of burgers or the

53:07

the way that you branded this whole

53:10

business. Right? I mean, that's

53:13

that's a huge part of its success because

53:15

if it was just

53:15

like, I don't know, boring branding and,

53:17

you know, boring colors, it might have the

53:20

same impact. Yeah. I

53:22

am very wrong in my approach to

53:25

everything that I do. So

53:28

when I was thinking about the branding, I

53:30

said that I wanted to resonate in a way

53:32

where I didn't have to pay for marketing

53:34

because the people were gonna market

53:36

the business because it was so ranting in your

53:39

face. But everything has two

53:41

meanings to it. Right? And

53:43

and while it may sound like sex and sound

53:46

greasy like it's not that at all. Yeah. So

53:48

when we talk about making

53:50

the colors bright and the messaging and

53:52

how we talk. It's tongue

53:54

and cheek. Right? We want people to have

53:56

a good time and not feel dirty when you say

53:58

the word slutty. We're really redefining the

54:01

term, and we've done that through the

54:03

experience when you walk through the door. When you

54:05

come to Slutty vegan, We are yelling

54:08

at you before COVID. We were hugging

54:10

you dancing with you. Yeah. But

54:12

the music is booming through the speakers.

54:14

And the employees are just screaming

54:17

through the

54:17

microphone. There's a microphone at my cash

54:19

register guy. Right. And and

54:21

tell me some of the things that are said into the

54:23

microphone. Right? Because I from what I understand, one

54:26

of the objections originally from neighbors on

54:28

that street on on Abercathy Street was that,

54:30

like, I guess, through the loud speaker,

54:32

they say, I don't know,

54:35

what do they say?

54:36

And we gotta Slutty in the building.

54:38

We gotta slut in the building. Okay. Yeah.

54:40

But listen, you know, slut

54:42

is a person who

54:45

is being slutified for the first time.

54:47

Right. You've redefined

54:49

that you complete There's a new

54:52

dictionary

54:52

definition for that word. It doesn't mean

54:54

what people think it means anymore. It's

54:57

a new word. It's a new time, which

54:59

is so cool because there's so much power in

55:01

the tongue. Yeah. So we've created something

55:03

that initially you think is uncomfortable with it, but

55:05

it really is no uncomfortability to it at all.

55:07

So we'd be on the loudspeaker saying,

55:09

like, we got a slot in the building

55:12

and you would hear it in the neighborhood. But

55:14

people got excited to be called a slut.

55:18

You understand what I'm saying? Like, people get

55:20

excited to be called a slut,

55:22

but a slut is not what it used to mean. Yeah.

55:24

A slut is somebody that's experience in this for the first

55:26

time. And when they eat the food, they're like,

55:29

I've been solidified. And it's a movement.

55:31

And this is that same thing like having

55:33

the parties back in the day where people bought the

55:35

water, just we're excited to be there.

55:37

This is that all over again. Yeah.

55:40

Alright. So you're you're now in think

55:42

nine locations and mainly in Georgia,

55:45

but also you've got stores in

55:47

New York and in Alabama and soon you're gonna

55:49

have locations in Baltimore and then

55:51

in DC, in Washington DC. Tell

55:54

me about your ambitions. Like, tell me

55:56

about what your vision is.

55:57

Where where is this gonna be in

55:59

ten years? In ten years, Slutty,

56:02

will continue to be a household name, not

56:04

just for restaurants, but

56:07

for the lifestyle side of the brand.

56:09

I want Slutty vegan to embody all

56:11

parts of the vegan lifestyle, not

56:14

just food because

56:16

we are helping people to reimagine everything

56:18

at this point. Right? But we start with food.

56:21

So, slutty vegan locations

56:23

everywhere. Slutty productions

56:25

will be at the top

56:28

of the food chain when it comes to entertainment

56:30

and TV. We probably get

56:33

a egot of all of the

56:35

movies and documentaries that we push out under

56:37

the Bloody Vegan brand. We

56:39

will continue our CPG model and

56:41

put products in stores everywhere. So

56:44

when you ask me, where do I see the

56:46

Raz? The brand is going

56:48

to be what Pepsi is to America,

56:51

what Coca Cola is to America. They're

56:53

not selling products. What they're selling

56:55

is an

56:56

experience. And however that experience

56:58

comes is what Slutty Vegan is going to do.

57:00

So

57:00

you're not talking about just being, like,

57:03

five guy No. Or Shake Shack.

57:05

No. Shake about being PepsiCo.

57:08

Yes. That's exactly what it

57:10

is. You know why? Because I am multidimensional.

57:13

Right? I am the person that, you

57:16

know, as a kid, they would tell me, like,

57:18

pinky, like, you got all these things going

57:20

on and, like, you need to focus on one of So

57:22

I've always loved to do multiple things at

57:24

the same time, but I realize I

57:26

can use the umbrella of my business

57:29

to do all the things that I've ever dreamed about

57:31

in my life. And that is

57:33

how you build empireers. So I'm building

57:35

an empire in real time. Amazing.

57:38

Picky Cole, thank you so much. It was a

57:40

pleasure. Thank you so much. Guy,

57:44

can I say something to the people? Of course.

57:47

I want whoever is listening to this

57:49

to see me and know that how

57:51

you show up and everything that you do

57:53

through your business show up in the most authentic

57:56

form possible. Guy, a part of

57:58

the reason why I believe that I've gotten so my

58:00

successes because I'm always myself. Like,

58:04

always me, I'm loud, I'm raw,

58:06

but I'm passionate, and I'm real. And

58:08

as a result of that confidence, it's

58:10

allowed me to get into every single

58:12

room that I'm not going.

58:13

Now I'm building my own doors.

58:16

I love it. It's awesome. And now

58:19

now I'm gonna go eat a

58:21

Hollywood hooker. Hey,

58:26

thanks so much for listening to how I built this

58:29

lab. Please do follow us on your

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podcast app so you always have the

58:33

latest episode downloaded. If you wanna

58:35

follow us on Twitter, our account is at how

58:37

I built this in line. This is at guy

58:39

Raz, and on Instagram, I'm at

58:41

guy dot Raz. If you wanna contact

58:44

the team, our email address is HIVT

58:47

at I d dot Wondery dot

58:49

com. This episode was produced

58:51

by Carla Estebes with editing by

58:53

John Isabella. Our music was composed

58:56

by Routine era blue. Our audio

58:58

engineer was Neil Rauch. Our

59:00

production team at How I built this includes

59:02

Alex Chung, Casey Herman, Chris

59:04

Messini, Elaine Coats, Casey How our

59:06

Sam Paulson, Carrie Thompson, and

59:09

Kiera Joaquin. Nevakarant is

59:11

our supervising editor Beth Donovan

59:13

is our executive producer. I'm

59:15

Guy Raz, and you've been listening to

59:17

how I built this.

59:25

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