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54:00

elected anyway with all that, especially with

54:02

Nixon. There was so much discord

54:04

in the Democratic Party back then. And

54:08

the way that politics works,

54:10

it's likely Nixon would have become

54:12

president in 68. And

54:16

Carter, after the disastrous try

54:18

to rescue them, you didn't even need

54:20

that arms thing at all with the

54:22

House just coming back. I think

54:24

Reagan probably would have won in 1980. Now,

54:27

the Bush and Trump thing feels different

54:29

to me. But that's the irony of

54:31

those, is that these huge things were

54:34

done, especially Watergate when you think about

54:36

it. Watergate

54:38

to me is like Nixon was about

54:40

to win in a landslide, Reagan, a

54:43

historic landslide. You talk about

54:46

doing something for nothing at

54:49

the instrument of their own demise is

54:51

just crazy. And now Trump, on the

54:54

other hand, is he like an unwitting

54:57

type of asset,

55:00

let's say? Yeah, this

55:02

goes to another book I wrote, I

55:04

mean, American Opera just before this. And

55:08

also, I wrote another book called House

55:11

of Trump, House of Putin. I

55:13

think they start cultivating them actually in 1980, oddly enough,

55:16

where this came here. This

55:19

was Trump's first

55:22

and perhaps his only real success

55:25

as a real estate developer was

55:27

the Ant Hyatt in New York.

55:30

And it was his first hotel.

55:33

And any hotel needs television sets,

55:35

lots of them, right? And

55:37

he got them from

55:41

a place called a tiny

55:43

place in Manhattan that happened to be

55:46

a KGB cover front. And

55:50

the guy who fell around was a

55:53

guy named Samyim Kislan. And

55:55

after he bought hundreds of TV sets

55:57

from them, and

56:00

kept flattering him and said, gosh, what

56:02

are you doing? This Trump Tower is

56:04

so remarkable. Why do we do Trump

56:06

Tower in Moscow? Now think for a

56:08

minute. If you remember the Cold War,

56:12

do they want a monument to American

56:14

capitalism in the West where? I

56:16

don't think so. They don't even want Stalin

56:19

Tower at that point. Exactly, exactly. They want

56:21

your gun. Trump fell for it. He made

56:23

his first trip in 1987. Wow.

56:27

They cultivated him slowly over the

56:29

years and intelligence asset

56:31

is can be unwitting. And

56:34

I do you a favor. You do me

56:36

a favor. It's not a formal relationship like

56:39

an agent, but once

56:41

you've made a few hundred million dollars, you're very

56:43

friendly. Trump

56:45

was also using his real estate to

56:48

launder money for the Russian mafia.

56:52

And I found, I think it was 13 members

56:54

of the Russian mafia who owned or

56:56

lived in Trump Tower or other properties.

57:00

It's just breathtaking. I mean, the idea that

57:03

he is the biggest security risk in

57:05

the world. I agree. You know, you talk

57:07

about kind of a inverted

57:10

Manchurian candidate in some ways.

57:13

You know, it's

57:15

like, it's so bizarre. You

57:17

know, I agree with that in so

57:19

many ways. Like I don't think it's

57:21

Machiavellian from Trump standpoint. I think it's

57:23

the other way around, you know, he's

57:26

an easy mark, you know, if you will. Yeah.

57:29

I mean, I talked a lot

57:31

with former KGB agents and they

57:34

said, dude, perfect target

57:38

is someone who is vain, a

57:40

narcissist, who falls for

57:42

flattery and can be

57:44

seduced by women. This sounds

57:46

a little like Donald Trump.

57:51

Oh, well, good news right before

57:53

the election. Well,

57:56

Craig, thanks so much for

57:58

being with me. It's a fascinating book. But of course, I'm

58:00

a nerd for this kind of stuff, but it's just there's

58:03

so many threads in this. How this

58:05

has to be a movie. I don't know if you're talking to people about

58:07

it or whatever. But I know

58:09

Ben Affleck did a movie kind of about

58:12

the hostages and everything. But there's so this,

58:14

this is the timeframe of this is

58:16

a little more is wider and the

58:18

timeframe is just fascinating. But when you

58:20

read it, I still can't believe it

58:23

when even though I should, you know,

58:25

I think so many things that happen

58:28

clandestine, they're

58:30

so fantastical that they do seem hard

58:32

to believe in yet they happen right

58:35

under our noses. Right. I

58:37

mean, I love the image of Reagan

58:39

taking the oath of office and you

58:41

actually did split screen on various

58:44

TV sets on the front

58:46

page of the New York Times said it

58:48

all the two events were happening simultaneously. And

58:51

there was it was like a magic trick

58:54

and Bill Casey did it.

58:56

Unbelievable. Well, congratulations,

58:58

Bill Casey. You

59:02

got away with it. They don't always get

59:04

caught. They don't always suffer the consequences. We

59:07

found out about it. Yes, we

59:09

found out. Now people have to believe it. Den

59:12

of spies. Reagan Carter in the secret history

59:14

of the treason. That's right. Treason that stole

59:16

the White House. Thanks so much for being

59:18

with me, Craig. It was an honor speaking

59:21

with you. Thank you, Larry.

59:23

I appreciate it. Oh, my pleasure.