0:00

Welcome to let's Talk Cabling

0:03

, the award-winning

0:05

podcast where knowledge is power

0:08

and the low-voltage industry

0:10

connects . Hosted by Chuck

0:12

Bowser , rcdd . We're

0:14

here to empower installers , designers

0:17

and industry pros with the tips

0:19

, stories and best practices

0:22

you need to stay ahead . From

0:24

copper to fiber , standards to

0:26

innovation , this is the show

0:28

that keeps you plugged into success

0:30

. So grab your tools , turn

0:32

up the volume and let's talk

0:34

cabling .

0:36

Wednesday night , 6

0:39

pm , eastern

0:42

Standard Time . That can

0:44

only mean one thing Live after

0:46

hours with your favorite RCDD

0:49

. You know that's me , your

0:52

favorite RCDD , don't even try to pretend like I'm not

0:54

. So tonight's show

0:56

I got something a little different

0:58

. So tonight's show was actually a suggestion

1:00

from somebody on one of my platforms , was actually a suggestion from

1:02

somebody on one of my platforms . They

1:05

asked me to do a show on how to

1:07

evaluate a 1099 contractor

1:10

. So that's what tonight's show is about

1:12

. So I'm not doing any questions

1:15

tonight . Although , put your questions

1:17

in the chat boxes and I'll save them and

1:20

I'll use them for the next

1:22

show . What are you drinking ? What are you drinking

1:24

? Earl Grey tea , earl

1:28

Grey tea with honey and an essential oil . Throat

1:31

lozenge yes , taught

1:34

a class today . Ooh , that's hot . Taught

1:37

a class today , so I got a bit of a sore throat . It

1:41

always happens when I teach

1:43

a class full-time like that , especially

1:45

an all-day class . Now let's also

1:47

acronym challenge . I'm going to do something different for the acronym

1:49

challenge . You know I was meeting with I did

1:51

a meetup down in Tampa last

1:54

week and somebody

1:56

said , chuck , how come you never , never , say anything

1:58

about the , the Big C ICT field

2:01

practice guidelines ? I mean , there's a great books . I've

2:03

sure thought you would like them . I'm like

2:05

hello

2:08

, hello , they're in every

2:10

single episode . I use these things all

2:12

the time , all the time

2:14

. So I'm going to do the acronym

2:17

challenge from this today . I'm just going

2:19

to pick one out of here Do , do , do , do . And

2:21

then I want you to put in the chat box below

2:23

what do you think that

2:25

acronym means ? Alrighty

2:32

, so let me find an acronym real quick

2:34

. Here we go . Acronym

2:38

you ready ? Let's see here

2:40

GFCI

2:43

, gfci . What does that acronym mean ? Go

2:45

ahead and put it in the chat box . Go ahead and put it in the comments

2:47

. See if you know what that means . Chat

2:50

box open that up . Dr Shotsy's in the house with Dr

2:52

Pepper . Dr Pepper

2:55

, of course , always , always , we

2:57

miss you . We kicked off the next study group

2:59

. It's kind of not the same without having you there

3:01

. Shotzi Again

3:04

, drinking Earl Grey tea with honey and some throat

3:06

lozenges . Gfci , all

3:09

right . So TJ Pates in the house . He says

3:11

ground fault , circuit interrupter

3:13

and 10,000

3:16

points to TJ . You got it , my friend

3:19

. You got it . So again

3:21

, like I said , tonight's show is all about 1099s

3:24

. What

3:26

is a 1099

3:29

contractor and how do you vet one ? So

3:34

let's talk about , first off , what is a 1099 contractor ? Wire

3:36

for excellence is in the house . Good to see

3:38

you , my friend . So

3:42

what is a 1099 independent contractor ? They are not

3:44

a full-time employee . They're not a full-time

3:47

employee . They typically work

3:49

on a project-by-project basis or

3:51

maybe even just fill in for hours

3:53

somewhere else . A 1099

3:56

contractor does not receive

3:58

health benefits , retirement

4:01

benefits , they don't get paid

4:04

holiday , vacation time . The 1099

4:07

contractor is someone that they

4:09

have to file their own taxes , right

4:12

. So you'll give them a 1099 form . They

4:14

got to pay their own taxes and typically they got to provide

4:17

their own tools , their own equipment

4:19

and their own transportation

4:21

. But when

4:23

it comes to the tools , though , it

4:26

depends on the tool . You say there's a 1099

4:28

contractor in our world . Is

4:30

um hand

4:33

tools ? Yeah , they're gonna need punch tool and screwdrivers

4:36

and stuff like that , but are they really gonna be expected

4:38

to carry a certifier or

4:40

a hammer drill ? It kind of depends

4:42

. That's something you need to work out with the contractor

4:44

ahead of time . So

4:47

JG says is it worth staying

4:50

in the telecommunications world ? Yes , it

4:52

is . Tj already answered it for me yes

4:54

. So what are some of the benefits

4:56

of hiring a 1099

4:59

contractor ? It doesn't matter

5:01

if you're a big company or a small company . It doesn't matter if you're

5:03

a big company or a small company . Hiring a 1099 contractor

5:06

can help you quickly ramp up

5:08

or ramp down on project

5:10

needs . Let's say you're a small little shop and you

5:12

only have like five technicians and you all

5:14

of a sudden win a project that's going to need oh

5:17

, it's been this over . There we go and

5:20

you win a project that's going to need 20

5:22

employees . See , a lot of people

5:24

don't realize . You

5:26

know , when you see an employee get hired , they're

5:29

like they don't realize the cost associated

5:31

. There's recruiting costs . You've got to

5:33

bring the person on , there's onboarding , and

5:36

then they're not really up to speed for a while and

5:38

you just started a project that you need to gear up now

5:40

. There's a lot

5:42

of money with that . So there's some advantages to doing that

5:44

and hiring

5:47

a 1099 contract . Another great thing , too

5:49

, is you avoid those long-term

5:51

financial commitments by hiring a full-time

5:53

employee . So if that project winds down

5:56

, you can easily say okay , we're done . There's

5:59

no workman's comp , there's

6:02

no unemployment , anything like that . Also

6:06

, having a 1099 as a company

6:08

, you're going to save

6:10

a good bit on overhead expenses as well too , because you don't

6:12

have to pay for those benefits , like I said , the

6:15

unemployment tax , the payroll taxes , and

6:17

also you only really need to pay for

6:19

the work that they completed , which could also

6:22

help reduce labor costs . We'll talk about whether

6:24

you should pay hourly or you should pay piecework

6:27

here in a little bit . This

6:29

also gives you using 1099 , also gives

6:31

you the access to

6:33

bring in somebody who's got high specialized

6:36

skills , like , let's say , for example , let's

6:38

say that I win a project and I got to do some OPGW

6:41

OPGW there's an

6:43

acronym for you . Well , I

6:45

might do a 1099 with TJ who's

6:47

in the TikTok feed because he's

6:49

got the experience with that . So

6:52

a lot of small companies . They

6:54

might be really good with copper but they may not be good

6:56

with fiber , so you

6:58

might do that . Or you might have somebody who's doing AV

7:00

or somebody who's doing door

7:03

locks or security . That might not be

7:05

your forte , but you win a project that's got some

7:07

of that in it and instead of

7:09

pushing your way through it and messing

7:11

it up and making the customer mad , you might bring

7:14

a 1099 contractor on board to

7:16

do that . Now , a good thing

7:18

is somebody

7:20

said he took my . When did you take the class ? That's

7:23

cool . Somebody in the tech deck said they took my class

7:26

. So you

7:28

having the expertise again

7:30

, faster onboarding for niche projects , because

7:32

you don't have to really teach them the ins

7:34

and outs of how to fill out timesheets . You don't have to teach them

7:36

how to do , you know all those other

7:39

requirements , you

7:41

can put them right to work and it's less of

7:43

a burden as well , because you have

7:45

less paperwork than when you're hiring full time

7:47

, because there's a lot of paperwork you got to fill out for the

7:49

federal government and you avoid those

7:52

issues with PTO . But

7:54

here's the thing yes , they can be

7:56

a great resource , they can be a great add-in , but

7:58

you've got to be able to evaluate

8:00

, you've got to be able to vet

8:02

that contractor , right

8:04

. So I'm going to break this down into a couple different

8:07

sections . So the first section is going to be define

8:10

your needs , right . The second section

8:12

is going to be verify their

8:14

credentials or experience . The

8:16

third section is going to be assess

8:18

their work quality and

8:21

reputation , and then the fourth section is going

8:23

to be legal and compliance

8:26

. Okay , so I got four sections to get through

8:28

in the next 23

8:30

minutes . So

8:32

I already covered what is a 10-9-9 contractor . So first

8:34

you've got to define your needs . What

8:38

are the skill sets that you need that

8:41

you don't have in-house ? You've got

8:43

to identify those . Do you

8:45

need somebody who has fiber optic skills ? Is

8:47

it going to be fiber optic skills

8:49

for , like , cable TV , or fiber optic skills

8:51

for just regular

8:54

backbone ? Is it going to be installing AV

8:56

equipment ? You got to think about what

8:58

kind of skills they need . So that way , when you reach out to people

9:00

because they're going to want to know what

9:02

exactly is it that you need , and

9:05

make sure that they're familiar with all

9:07

of the industry standards , like maybe

9:10

NYSET certified for security

9:12

, maybe BICSI for copper

9:15

and fiber construction , maybe the ANSI standards

9:17

, obviously you're going to want them familiar with the code . So

9:21

once you know what kind of skill sets that that person

9:23

is going to need , what

9:26

is the project timeline

9:28

and what is the workload that you expect

9:30

them to do , because you're going to want to put this all down in a contract

9:33

, so that way you put it there in writing

9:35

, have them sign off , so

9:42

there's no surprises

9:44

. So let's say , for example

9:46

, let's say it's only going to take two weeks

9:48

, well , let them know there's going to be a two-week gig

9:50

. Or if it's a six-month gig , let them know it's going

9:52

to be a six-month gig Because that

9:55

way , if they have other commitments , they can either

9:57

say yes or no or move things around because

9:59

maybe they might want to work with you . Also

10:02

, avoid overcommitting

10:04

to

10:07

a contract that's already stretched too thin . So if

10:09

it's 1099 , you know this contractor

10:11

and you know that he's already doing another

10:13

large project and you know there are similar-sized

10:15

companies . You and they said yes , they'll

10:17

send you somebody . One

10:21

of the worst things we do as an industry is we want

10:23

a project and then we'll say okay

10:25

, we'll be there Monday , and

10:28

then we're not there Monday because the

10:30

crew didn't finish the previous

10:32

project on the Friday before . So

10:34

watch out . You may want to

10:37

ask them how is their pipeline ? Look

10:39

, what kind of projects are they working on now ? Do

10:41

they have spare capacity to give

10:43

you somebody or people ? And

10:46

when you bring them on , are we going

10:48

to be paying you hourly

10:50

or are we going to be paying you piecework

10:52

? So a lot of people

10:55

shy away from piecework . Piecework is not that bad as

10:57

long as you identify everything

10:59

up front , define those payment structures

11:01

first . You don't want to do

11:03

that afterwards , say , okay , we're going to pay you hourly

11:06

, here's the rate . Who

11:09

has the ability to say I need you to work overtime ? What is ? Who has the ability to say I need you to

11:12

work overtime ? What is the cost for overtime

11:14

? There's all kinds of things you need to know

11:16

for somebody that you're going to be bringing on and

11:18

then hopefully you can be picking somebody that has

11:20

credentials . Credentials

11:23

and we get . We have this conversation with people all the

11:25

time . You know I don't want

11:27

, I don't think credentials aren't worth it . I've

11:29

been in the . It

11:36

does not necessarily mean you're better than somebody without a credential

11:39

, but having a credential validates

11:41

, it ensures that

11:44

you have industry compliance , that you have industry

11:46

knowledge right and

11:49

there's going to be higher certifications

11:52

often indicate greater expertise . So if

11:54

somebody is a Bixie tech , they're

11:56

going to have greater expertise , greater skills

11:58

than somebody who's an installer copper . Somebody

12:01

who's got a CFOT will

12:03

be better than somebody who has an

12:05

A-plus certification . Make sure

12:07

that those certifications match with the

12:10

skills and stuff that you are asking them to do

12:12

and make sure not

12:14

only that they don't

12:16

have to let them say , yeah , I've got a certification

12:19

. Make sure you say provide

12:21

me a copy of that certification , verify

12:24

that certification . And

12:26

then you want to ask them okay , because there's a lot

12:28

of people like me . I was in the industry for 20

12:30

years before I got my

12:32

Bixie Technician certification . So

12:35

I got 20 years as a Bixie Tech , but

12:38

I got over 40 years of experience

12:40

in this industry . So ask them

12:42

that , this potential 1099 candidate

12:44

how many years of experience do you

12:46

have ? What size projects

12:49

have you worked on ? What size

12:51

timelines ? What type of customers

12:53

? Was it government ? Was it commercial ? Was

12:56

it retail ? Was it schools

12:58

? There's a big difference between doing a project

13:00

that's in a school as opposed to a

13:02

project that's in a commercial office building . So

13:05

if they've got the experience but it's not in

13:07

the right vertical , that might not

13:09

be a good fit . You know , with schools

13:11

you're going to have problems like access to closets

13:14

and doors , working around timeframes

13:18

that don't impact

13:20

the kids' schedules and stuff like that . They

13:22

also have inspectors that inspect their own stuff . There's

13:24

a lot of stuff that you've got to go through in schools

13:27

that are an additional layer that you don't have

13:29

with commercial projects . So

13:32

ask them if they've got the years of experience

13:34

in the type of vertical that you're

13:36

going to be placing them in . You're

13:45

going to be placing them in , and don't be afraid to ask them hey , do you have any

13:47

pictures of the jobs that you've done before ? Do you have any contacts , do you have

13:49

any references from customers that can call you up

13:51

? Make sure you speak to them and say , look , I

13:53

want your honest feedback . Don't be afraid to call

13:55

up on references and don't be

13:57

afraid to look at job photos . You know a lot of people . I see

13:59

this a lot of time on social media . People post

14:02

pictures of their jobs all the time on

14:04

social media and they think it's great stuff

14:06

. And I look at them and go , yeah , that's

14:09

a C at best , not even a B

14:11

, it's a C . I don't tell them

14:13

that , but I don't want to . You know , harm

14:16

people's feelings . But you know , have them show

14:18

you pictures of job photos that they've done , especially

14:21

in the vertical that you're looking for . Then

14:23

what you might want to do is , now that you

14:26

have references for customers , maybe

14:28

ask for references from previous

14:31

employers , because they may not have been a 1099

14:33

the whole entire time in communications . So

14:36

find out who they worked for before . Call

14:38

them up and do them Ask

14:40

them , those people you're talking , to ask

14:42

them about their job performance . Ask them how were

14:44

they at problem

14:47

solving ? Were they dependable ? Did they show

14:49

up every day ? If they said they were going to do something

14:51

, did they do that ? There's

14:54

a lot of things that you can do , and

14:57

another thing that you can look at too when you're trying to vet that 1099

15:00

is go look at their

15:02

social media platforms . Go

15:04

look at their social media , especially LinkedIn . Linkedin's

15:07

a professional site , so

15:12

go there and you know , is their LinkedIn profile

15:14

very basic ? You

15:17

know , no banner . They just got

15:19

one job and a date and maybe a picture

15:21

that looked like they took on a job site . Or is it well-maintained

15:24

? Because if they're taking the time

15:26

to build

15:28

out their Leviton profile , chances are they're going to do

15:30

the same thing with their

15:32

jobs and

15:39

look to see . Did anybody recommend them

15:41

? Did anybody give them testimonials ? That

15:43

can also help you reveal reputations

15:46

and trends . And then

15:48

what you might want to do and you're probably going to have to pay for

15:50

this have them come in and

15:53

assign them a small task

15:55

to do or a small job or trial run

15:57

, like if you've got a really large job that's going to be

15:59

three weeks , four weeks a month , two

16:01

months , three months . Maybe bring

16:03

them in as a 1099 on a job that's only a

16:05

couple , two , three days , and let

16:07

them run with that and see how

16:09

they do with that . Assign them the tasks

16:11

. Who was it that said it ? Trust

16:14

but verify ? It's always to me

16:16

. I always see it credited to Colin Powell . Jimmy , I always see it credited

16:18

to Colin Powell , but I don't know if he was the one who actually said it Trust but

16:20

verify , verify , trust but verify . So

16:22

yeah , give them the project , let them run with it , go out and do

16:24

the QA inspection and see how they

16:26

did . Did they do it per the code ? Did they do it per the

16:29

standard ? Did they do it per the way

16:31

that your

16:33

company likes to see the work done ? Everybody

16:41

views quality a little bit differently . What might be quality

16:43

installed for somebody may not be quality for your company . And

16:45

then also think

16:48

about when you gave them that small little test

16:50

project to do , how did they handle

16:52

the communications ? Did they turn in

16:55

their stuff daily , their

16:57

paperwork daily ? Did they get the

16:59

project done on the deadline that they say they were going to

17:01

get it done on ? Did they fill out any other

17:03

project paperwork that you asked them

17:05

to do , and do it in a timely manner ? Was

17:07

it legible ? Was it readable

17:09

. So

17:12

, again , it's better to figure this out on a small

17:14

project before you put them

17:16

out on a big project

17:18

. Big project , let's

17:20

talk about some legal

17:22

and some compliance

17:25

considerations , right ? So when

17:27

you bring on somebody who's a 1099

17:29

, make sure that they have the proper

17:32

insurance , make sure they have general

17:34

liability , make sure , if applicable

17:36

, make sure they have their own workman's comp

17:38

, because that's going to protect against potential

17:41

legal issues and financial disputes

17:43

if something goes wrong . Trust me , something

17:45

goes wrong on every single

17:48

project . Something always

17:50

goes wrong . Even the best

17:52

, well-laid-out , best-planned

17:55

project . Something goes wrong

17:57

. And don't just

17:59

ask of it . Make sure they provide you proof

18:01

of coverage before hiring . Before

18:04

hiring , verify that their business

18:06

has been registered with the state . Make sure they're

18:09

an

18:11

LLC or sole proprietor . Make sure

18:13

they've got all that paperwork in line with the state

18:15

and the county that they're working with . Make

18:17

sure they're performing as a legitimate business

18:20

entity . That way you don't run into any

18:22

problems on the backside . And

18:25

then what you're going to want to do is you're going to want to create some

18:28

type of scope

18:30

of work , some type of payment terms , some

18:33

type of liability cause . You

18:40

would basically just create a project plan

18:42

for them and put it in

18:44

writing and be as detailed

18:46

as you can . When you're

18:48

detailed like that , that's going to avoid mishaps

18:51

. I'm dealing with one

18:53

right now where somebody asked

18:55

us to do something . We did it . They

18:57

did the letter where we said we were going to do it and

19:00

they were expecting something a little bit else . That

19:03

wasn't written in the contract . Right , make

19:05

sure that you clearly outline the

19:08

work that you're expecting them to do , the

19:10

deadlines you expect them to meet and

19:13

if there's any penalties , is

19:15

there any penalties associated with that ? You

19:18

know , the thing people don't really think about , too , is when

19:20

you're trying to evaluate a 1099

19:23

contractor coming on board . You know , a 1099

19:25

contractor coming on board could potentially end up becoming

19:29

a full-time employee , so

19:32

keep that in mind . So , with that in mind

19:34

, how does this 1099

19:36

contractor fit within your

19:38

company , with the culture

19:40

of your company and the professional of your company

19:43

? Again , I've seen technicians

19:45

that would literally show up for work in jeans

19:48

that had stains on them and holes

19:50

in them and just

19:52

looking unprofessional . But

19:55

if your company has uniforms

19:57

and they expect that next

19:59

layer up of professionalism , then

20:01

maybe that person might not be a fit for you . Now

20:03

, there's nothing wrong with wearing jeans , especially

20:05

on a construction site . They're

20:07

going to get tore up , but you still don't want

20:10

to make sure you have jeans that maybe don't have holes

20:12

in the knees and stuff like that . You don't protect

20:14

your knees too . Wear the right kind of shoes , did

20:18

that person ? When

20:20

you're talking about how

20:22

they fit in with the company , did

20:25

they ? Again ? Communications that's

20:27

pro tip number two on my list communicate , communicate , communicate

20:30

. Right , did they communicate

20:32

? You know well

20:35

when you gave them this job , were they punctual and reliable

20:37

or were they consistently late

20:39

or did they do things that disrupt the

20:41

project

20:55

schedule episode .

20:57

Don't forget to subscribe . Leave a review

20:59

and share it with your crew . Got

21:01

questions or ideas for the show ? Chuck

21:04

wants to hear from you . Stay connected

21:06

, stay informed and always aim

21:08

for excellence . Until next time

21:10

, keep those cables clean , your

21:13

standards high and your future

21:15

bright . Let's talk cabling

21:18

empowering the industry , one

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connection at a time .