0:00

We need at our table of

0:02

awareness, the logician, but equally we

0:04

need the intuitive, we need the

0:06

mystic. I was allowed to go to

0:09

the very precipice of death, of life

0:11

and death, and look over the edge.

0:13

And I was allowed to behold what

0:15

was there and allowed to come back.

0:17

Most people aren't. When we talk

0:19

about being aligned with our self

0:22

or being aligned with our soul

0:24

or hearing our higher self, that's

0:26

really what we're talking about is

0:28

being connected to that divine part

0:30

of ourselves, that light filled part

0:32

of us that is connected to

0:35

God energy, that is connected to

0:37

everybody here and every experience we've

0:39

ever had. If more doctors, more

0:41

professionals can open up to use

0:43

intuitive gifts in their work. That's

0:46

really important. Hi, I'm Dr. Amy

0:48

Robbins and welcome to

0:50

Life, Death, and The

0:53

Space Between. I'm a

0:55

licensed clinical psychologist and

0:58

medium. And here we

1:00

explore life, death, mediumship,

1:04

near-death experiences,

1:07

consciousness, and what

1:09

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2:49

You know I love to bring

2:51

you a different bent on everything

2:54

I do. I try never to

2:56

repeat the same podcast topic for

2:59

you. And if I have a

3:01

guest on that's talking about something

3:03

similar, I try to switch things

3:06

up to get to a nuanced

3:08

piece of the work that they're

3:10

talking about so that it gives

3:13

you a different view on things.

3:15

And today is no different. Today's

3:18

episode with Francesca Simma is all

3:20

about... breathwork, but not breathwork in

3:22

the traditional way you might be

3:25

thinking of breathwork. It's hypno breathwork.

3:27

Francesca is the CEO of mastery

3:29

and creator of hypno breathwork. It

3:32

is a breathwork and visualization that

3:34

comes together with hypnosis to transmute

3:37

whatever it is you're experiencing into

3:39

feelings of deeper love, connection, and

3:41

peace. It allows you to to

3:44

combine and process heavy, heavy emotions

3:46

with compassion and through mindful breathing,

3:49

release whatever tension it is your

3:51

feeling in your body. I have

3:53

tried some of her work myself.

3:56

transformative. I'm a huge proponent of

3:58

breathwork. I love breathwork is a

4:00

way to move through emotions without

4:03

needing to talk through emotions and

4:05

as a therapist to hear me

4:08

say that is you know as

4:10

a talk therapist means something. So

4:12

I hope that you will get

4:15

as much out of today's episode

4:17

as I did and dive into

4:19

what I think is the transformative

4:22

power of not just breathwork but

4:24

hip no breathwork. With that here's

4:27

today's episode. Welcome Francesca to

4:29

Life, Death, and The Space

4:31

Between. I'm so excited to

4:34

chat with you. So I

4:36

got so excited before we

4:38

even before I pushed record

4:40

and I paused myself because

4:42

I am a huge proponent

4:45

of breathwork. I think it

4:47

is... incredibly transformative. I

4:49

think it can get you

4:51

to the same states you

4:53

can get to in a

4:55

plant medicine without the plant

4:57

medicine, without the after effects,

4:59

the side effects that the

5:01

medicine can have on you.

5:03

But let's start for you with

5:05

how you found yourself in this

5:07

place of discovering

5:09

breathwork and a

5:12

breathwork transforming you. Yeah,

5:14

I think it's just the typical story

5:17

of chasing the external success and

5:19

maybe checking off the boxes that

5:21

I thought would make me happy

5:23

in getting to the top of

5:25

that mountain and just feeling empty,

5:28

feeling really unfulfilled. And it took

5:30

a few promotions and a few

5:32

of those business-class trips around the

5:34

world to... find the pattern that

5:36

it wasn't going to be the

5:38

next thing. It was something that

5:41

was broken in my value system

5:43

and I needed to get into

5:45

alignment. So I think a lot of people

5:47

have experienced that where they're chasing the goals

5:49

and then they finally get there and it's

5:52

not what they expected and it forces them

5:54

to maybe go inward. And that's when I

5:56

started learning how to listen to my body,

5:58

listen to my intuition. and that was

6:00

very loud and clear that I needed

6:03

to go to Bali, book that one-way

6:05

ticket, and go to this seven-day breathwork

6:07

retreat, and I really had no idea

6:09

at the time what breathwork was, and

6:12

I assumed it was gonna be like

6:14

a yoga or a meditation, and it

6:16

definitely was not that. It was much

6:18

more intense than that, and it just

6:21

broke through. you know, like you

6:23

said, it's extremely transformative, it's so

6:25

cathartic, it's so healing, but it's

6:27

also extremely efficient, and I really

6:29

value that, and I just didn't

6:31

feel like the same person after

6:33

seven days, I was completely fascinated

6:35

by it, and I've now dedicated

6:37

my life to it. Yeah, so

6:39

I want to talk, so you

6:41

have your new book out on

6:43

Block Your Purpose, which is such

6:45

a great, both a memoir in

6:47

many ways, and also a how-to,

6:49

but talk. Talk me through,

6:51

I've had one other person

6:53

on the show talk about

6:55

breathwork I think a couple

6:58

years ago. Talk me through

7:00

kind of the difference between

7:02

the more traditional holotropic holotropic

7:05

breathwork that is comes out

7:07

of the Stanloff's graph psychedelic.

7:09

experiences when psychedelics were shut

7:12

down and he started exploring

7:14

other ways of reaching these

7:16

expansive non-ordinary states of consciousness

7:18

and how you've kind of

7:20

well first kind of talked me through

7:23

different types of breathwork and

7:25

what those might look like

7:27

and then I want to

7:29

hear about how you've transformed

7:31

even that. Yeah, so there's,

7:33

you know, breathwork has really become

7:35

an umbrella term. There's a lot

7:37

of different styles. I think Pranayama,

7:39

breathwork, really started by being more

7:41

calming and sometimes more energizing if

7:43

you're doing like breath of fire

7:45

or cundellini. And then Stan Groff

7:48

and Leonard Orr were really the

7:50

pioneers of the psychosp spiritual practice

7:52

where they found that if we

7:54

do this very specific breathwork technique,

7:56

this circular motion, we play maybe

7:58

more shamanonic music to it. altered

8:00

states of consciousness, heal childhood trauma,

8:02

access those memories, and really release

8:04

emotion. And that was a very

8:06

profound experience for me, but I

8:08

found that, you know, 60 to

8:10

90 minute sessions were rather long

8:12

for people. If, you know, I

8:14

was going to bring this to

8:16

New York City and people in

8:18

finance and they weren't really going

8:21

to dedicate that much time to

8:23

their personal development. And I just

8:25

found that there was poignant ways

8:27

to make the sessions more intentional

8:29

and more clear. So after my seven

8:31

day breathwork retreat, I really studied the

8:33

practice. I went to every workshop I

8:35

could find in Thailand, in India, in

8:37

Bali, I went to, you know, the

8:40

East Bay, and I just experimented with

8:42

all of these sessions and I saw

8:44

that people were having profound releases. They

8:46

were crying, they were shaking, they felt

8:48

lighter, but they couldn't really make sense

8:50

of the behavior pattern or the psychological

8:53

habit that they were trying to break.

8:55

And so I found this opportunity. to

8:57

merge in hypnosis or hypnotherapy, which is

8:59

really just vocal cues so people can

9:01

start to reprogram subconscious blocks, and

9:03

then end the sessions with visioning

9:06

or visualization so they can start

9:08

to mentally rehearse who they want

9:10

to become. So I just started

9:12

playing with the modalities that I found

9:14

to be the most effective and the

9:16

most results driven and got it down

9:18

to 20 minutes when I was playing

9:20

with an EEG headband and seeing how

9:22

quickly we could drop into deep data

9:24

states using the breath. And then I

9:26

began to bring it to coaches and

9:28

clients and entrepreneurs and executives

9:31

and it just really took

9:33

off because it was just

9:36

poignant and efficient and

9:38

like you said, extremely

9:40

transformative. So you're taking it

9:42

from because it's breath work, it's

9:44

hard work. Breathing like this is

9:47

not, at least in my experience,

9:49

until you kind of hit that

9:51

cycle where the breath is sort

9:53

of breathing itself, initially it can

9:55

feel really challenging to stay with

9:57

your breath in a different way.

10:00

So how, what happens in that

10:02

initial process? Can you kind

10:04

of walk me through the

10:07

three steps you're talking about?

10:09

Like what happens in that

10:12

initial process of breathing? What

10:14

happens to the oxygen levels

10:17

in our brain? Why can

10:19

we experience those expanded states,

10:22

those releases? I've screamed in

10:24

breathwork sessions where it just

10:26

feels like this complete

10:28

like energy. release. I don't know.

10:31

There's nothing to stop. There's nothing

10:33

I could do to stop it.

10:35

I mean, I could probably if

10:37

I allowed myself, but I really

10:40

want to get to that place

10:42

of release because it just feels

10:44

so therapeutic. So I'm curious first

10:46

about that. Yeah, so let's, you

10:48

know, walk through a session. So

10:50

essentially in our style, it's really

10:52

important that everybody lays down and

10:54

we encourage you to put a

10:56

blindfold on because that really allows

10:58

you to tune in to yourself

11:00

and tune out all the other

11:02

senses. And then we begin with

11:04

this circular pattern of breath to

11:06

inhales, one exhale. For the first

11:08

four minutes, we're really queuing you

11:10

to just drop into your breath.

11:12

And our music is very thematic

11:15

when it comes to hypno breath

11:17

work. exactly what they're moving through

11:19

in that session, how to integrate,

11:21

and what behavior change they're making.

11:23

So we play the first song,

11:25

you're starting to get into the

11:27

breath cadence. Once we move into

11:29

the second song, I'll start to

11:31

give you vocal cues or hypnotic

11:33

suggestions. So it might be something,

11:35

I'll start to give you vocal

11:37

cues or hypnotic suggestions. So it

11:39

might be something like, you know,

11:41

if we're working on your business

11:43

goals for 2025, you start to

11:45

explore that. in your subconscious. We

11:47

breathe out that emotion. Next song, we

11:49

start to play with, what would it look

11:52

like for you to accomplish that goal? And

11:54

then we go into what's your next action

11:56

step to accomplish that goal? What would it

11:58

feel like when you have? that next level.

12:00

And what's happening is we're changing

12:02

the balance of oxygen and carbon

12:04

dioxide in your body. And what

12:07

that does is it shuts down

12:09

the prefrontal cortex. So that's your

12:11

analytical and your logical mind. So

12:13

all of your linear thinking or

12:15

your past ways of knowing how

12:17

to do something start to quiet

12:19

and we begin to stimulate different

12:21

areas of the brain. Now we're accessing

12:23

the subconscious, which is really the

12:25

storehouse. That's the memory rank of

12:27

infinite intelligence, all of the information

12:29

and knowledge and podcasts and books

12:31

that you've come by, and we

12:33

start to make new creative connections.

12:35

So maybe what you linearly thought was

12:37

going to happen for your 2025 goals

12:39

in getting that promotion, you know, the

12:41

small bump or the increase and going

12:43

to HR and having that discussion, it

12:45

might be, oh, be proactive in this

12:47

project and build a relationship with this

12:49

other department or send this email to

12:51

my former boss. There's all of these

12:53

other solutions that come up when we

12:55

can activate different regions of the

12:57

brain. So after that process, the last

12:59

vocal cue in every single hypno breathwork

13:02

session is, what is your one next

13:04

action step? towards that goal or

13:06

towards that higher version of yourself. So

13:08

now we take it out of just

13:11

being this really beautiful internal cathartic experience,

13:13

but you have very clear guidance and

13:15

a roadmap to start to create

13:17

what it is that you want. So

13:19

you know, the first few sessions, you

13:22

know, especially if people are blocked and...

13:24

they're used to sort of numbing or

13:26

suppressing emotion, then it's going to be

13:28

highly physical. You're going to feel really

13:30

intense tingling in your hands and around

13:32

your face. You're going to feel stress

13:34

releasing from your body. Those physical sensations

13:37

can be really overwhelming for people. And

13:39

like you're saying, it can feel like

13:41

hard work. But after about three sessions,

13:43

that really starts to dissipate. You can

13:45

significantly slow down your breathing. It can

13:47

actually start to feel quite good. You

13:50

can go rather slow and you'll get

13:52

those deep emotional. sites, those visions, those

13:54

downloads, and those next action steps.

13:56

So what's happening? So we are

13:59

basically shutting. down the prefrontal cortex.

14:01

So the part of our brain

14:03

that's responsible for executive functioning, planning,

14:05

all the things that we want

14:07

typically, right? Like people who have

14:09

like ADHD typically don't have those

14:11

skills as intact. They struggle with

14:14

those a little bit more. Here

14:16

we're turning that off. It sounds

14:18

like so the volume on, would

14:20

you say maybe, I mean, you

14:22

don't say it in this way,

14:24

but like what your soul is

14:26

really calling for? Yeah,

14:28

I love I love how you

14:31

put that actually because I always

14:33

say you know in manifestation sessions

14:35

People go in with an intention

14:37

of what they think they want

14:39

and then I say but what

14:42

let's shut off your ego And

14:44

let's start to tap into what

14:46

your soul wants and I have

14:48

a really funny example of that

14:50

when I transitioned into becoming a

14:53

breathwork coach, I was manifesting how

14:55

I could be successful at this

14:57

new career endeavor, and I was

14:59

like, okay, I'm going to be

15:01

in goop. I'm going to do

15:04

breathwork sessions for Gweneth Paltrow and

15:06

Reese Witherspoon, but then I would

15:08

go into breathwork sessions and I

15:10

would see myself on a book

15:12

tour. And it was like, oh,

15:15

interesting. That was my ego showing

15:17

me what success could look like

15:19

in this new path, but my

15:21

soul was showing me that I'm

15:23

a writer, and I'm a writer,

15:26

and I'm an author, and I'm

15:28

going to impact people. So you're

15:30

really getting the ego out of

15:32

the way, which is so hard

15:34

to do. And frankly, what they

15:37

do in psychedelic sessions. Yeah, it's

15:39

really quite similar. I just find,

15:41

you know, I did Iowaska in

15:43

Peru, like in the Amazon, went

15:45

full throttle for the real experience,

15:48

and it was really intense. I

15:50

mean, it was a pretty brutal

15:52

experience for me, and I would

15:54

say it took me about six

15:56

months to integrate that. And with

15:58

breath work, I can get to

16:01

similar insights, and it's much more

16:03

palpable, and I can actually be

16:05

very clear on what I'm supposed

16:07

to do next. So, you know.

16:09

Whatever people feel called to, I

16:12

always encourage them. to explore their

16:14

intuition, but for me, breathwork has

16:16

been the most efficient and accessible

16:18

practice in personal development. So you

16:20

talk about these different blocks. You

16:23

talk about mom blocks. You talk

16:25

about dad blocks. I'm always thinking

16:27

about this, you talk about inner

16:29

child work, shadow work. abundance, manifesting,

16:31

and I'm always thinking about this

16:34

too in terms of the psychological

16:36

and where this could fit in.

16:38

I mean it is very psychological,

16:40

everything you're talking about, but where

16:42

this could fit in. And if

16:45

someone is struggling with their relationship

16:47

with their mother, how would breath

16:49

work and the process that you

16:51

take them through, help them through

16:53

that? And what is the now

16:56

what piece? They discover in this

16:58

session that they have a lot

17:00

of unresolved anger because their mom

17:02

worked, even though it was to

17:04

put food on the table, it

17:07

meant that they had to come

17:09

home on their own and their

17:11

experience was their parent was never

17:13

there for them. So what does

17:15

a breathwork session look like around

17:18

that, perhaps? It's

17:20

intense. I think that the awareness that

17:22

comes up to your relationship with your

17:24

parents is always very illuminating. And in

17:27

my experience, it's always pretty heavy. And

17:29

it will give you a lot of

17:31

context into your identity, into your personality,

17:33

into your coping mechanisms. You know, I

17:36

share a really personal story about my

17:38

first breathwork session on my mother and

17:40

I'm someone who thought I was very

17:42

self-aware. I had been in therapy. I

17:44

thought I had a great relationship with

17:47

my mom. Externally, I felt very grateful

17:49

for her. I always thought she was

17:51

a saint, I thought she was an

17:53

angel. And when I went into breathwork,

17:56

I realized how much I had taken

17:58

her for granted, how much I was

18:00

very selfish and never... truly recognized her

18:02

sacrifices and that awareness and actually having

18:05

compassion for her life and feeling the

18:07

emotions of what she has been through

18:09

changed my whole trajectory. That was the

18:11

session where I was like, oh, this

18:14

isn't like a really cool, you know,

18:16

personal development practice. This is

18:18

actually a mission. And I

18:20

feel called to give other

18:22

people this experience so they

18:24

can recognize the truth of

18:26

their relationships and how they've

18:28

impacted those people. A lot of people,

18:30

what they'll discover is they might have

18:33

resentment from their mom for leaving them

18:35

alone, but then they'll also see that

18:37

maybe their mom's mom wasn't always there and

18:39

she didn't have the resources or the knowledge

18:42

to know how to care for them in

18:44

a way that they needed. And the most

18:46

common thing I see from a session with

18:48

moms is a compassion release for your mom's

18:51

humanity. You know, we think that our parents

18:53

are superheroes and they're just humans.

18:55

They're just people just like us

18:57

and they need mistakes. Trying to

18:59

do the best that they that

19:02

they can and usually they think they

19:04

are. I always say too, I'm like,

19:06

when I'm working with my patients and

19:08

they're, you know, talking about their kids

19:10

and they did this and they said

19:12

that I'm like, look, you're gonna say

19:15

and do the wrong things over the

19:17

course of your parenting. And it's the,

19:19

it's. You think that this is the

19:21

worst thing that you ever said. Your

19:23

child will be in my office in

19:25

20 years and they'll talk about something

19:27

totally different that was not this. You

19:30

thought you killed it at, they thought

19:32

you totally bombed it at. So I

19:34

mean that's just the nature of this

19:36

is that you can't know what's going

19:38

to impact one person in one

19:40

way, one child in one way

19:42

and another child totally differently in

19:44

the same family. Yeah, and I

19:46

think what happens when you become an

19:49

adult and you on an experiential level,

19:51

not an intellectual level, but on an

19:53

experiential level, you see your parents and

19:55

you see life through their eyes, it

19:57

honestly allows you to take your power

19:59

back. You don't personalize maybe some

20:01

of the mistakes that they made

20:03

or the ways that you didn't

20:05

feel they were present or maybe

20:08

emotionally available for you and you

20:10

can start to repair yourself. You

20:12

can start to heal yourself. You

20:14

can start to validate yourself. You

20:16

can start to love yourself. And

20:18

when you start to give yourself

20:20

those resources, you just show up

20:22

differently in the world. You feel

20:24

more... joy. You're able to give

20:26

and receive more. You show up

20:28

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20:39

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20:41

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20:47

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20:49

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21:53

Moving forward. Exactly, personal accountability and

21:55

responsibility, love that. So in the

21:57

session, people are breathing and then

21:59

you're taking them through these hypnotic

22:02

suggestions, particularly, like, let's just say

22:04

me, for example, one of my

22:06

goals in 2025 is I really

22:08

want to uplevel kind of this

22:10

other side of my business, my

22:12

podcast, my online courses, teaching clinicians

22:14

to be more spiritually informed. How

22:16

would a breath session? work with

22:18

all of that? Yeah, so what

22:20

I would do with you is,

22:22

you know, for the first 10,

22:24

15 minutes before we actually go

22:26

into breathwork, we would brainstorm. So

22:29

this is how we get into

22:31

creative flow states where we're using

22:33

optimal consciousness, we're making new creative

22:35

connections, we have more clarity, more

22:37

focus, better retention, problem solving, things

22:39

that sharpen our cognition. So we

22:41

would say, okay, if you want

22:43

to scale your business, what might

22:45

that look like? What are the

22:47

opportunities here? Is it social media?

22:49

Is it PR? Is it marketing?

22:51

Is it partnerships, collaborations? We would

22:53

start to fill your subconscious mind

22:55

with solutions and with solutions and

22:58

with solutions and with information. And

23:00

then when we went into the

23:02

breath, you know, the first song,

23:04

we're going to drop into your

23:06

breath, just get used to the

23:08

cadence, get really comfortable in the

23:10

circular circulars, And what's going to

23:12

happen then is you might get

23:14

some nervousness in your body as

23:16

you start to imagine this next

23:18

level and that's going to reveal

23:20

the block. And the block might

23:22

be... fear of visibility, it might

23:25

be fear of criticism. When you

23:27

start to get that big, it

23:29

might be fear of failure, fear

23:31

of success. Whatever is subconsciously blocking

23:33

that next level, we want to

23:35

clear that out first. So we'll

23:37

start to breathe that out of

23:39

your body. And then I'll ask

23:41

you to once again visualize it

23:43

and feel it like you already

23:45

have it. And then I'll say,

23:47

and what's the next solution? And

23:49

it's really interesting process, you know,

23:51

when we are mentally trying to

23:54

plan our business and we are

23:56

just strategically using brain force. We'll

23:58

do things in a way that

24:00

we already have seen in the

24:02

past, maybe an expander or the

24:04

competitive landscape is doing it. And

24:06

then we'll go into breath and

24:08

it's like, oh, I'm actually supposed to

24:10

reach out to that guest. I'm actually supposed

24:13

to throw an event. Like, oh, I guess

24:15

I'm doing a retreat in Costa Rica next

24:17

year. And you'll start to get these really

24:19

expansive ideas that feel good in your soul.

24:22

And those will be the next intuitive steps

24:24

on your path to grow. Gotcha. So

24:26

that could also, because I find that

24:28

that can happen to me in a

24:31

meditation as well, where once my mind

24:33

sort of settles, I've re-up to my

24:35

TM practice. So I'm very in tune

24:38

right now with that. It's like, it

24:40

feels like the creative energy is just

24:42

bursting out of me sometimes. Like I

24:44

can finish a session and I'm like,

24:47

I need to do this, I need

24:49

to do that. Like everything seems crystal

24:51

clear. Yeah. And then I start moving

24:53

in my day and I'm like. What

24:56

happened? What happened five

24:58

minutes ago when I was really,

25:00

really clear on all of this?

25:02

So how do you stay clear

25:05

and keep moving forward with these

25:07

practices? The consistency really comes

25:09

in. You know, I'm an avid

25:11

meditator. I also meditate every single

25:14

day, but breathwork and meditation have

25:16

two very different functions for me.

25:18

for me, extremely productive. So I'm

25:21

like, how do I scale my

25:23

business? What's the next level look

25:25

like? Who do I need to

25:27

reach out to? What's, you know,

25:30

2.0? And then for me, meditation

25:32

is usually calming my internal

25:34

state. It's keeping me, it's

25:36

giving me perspective. It's grounding

25:38

me and making me more

25:40

present. I definitely have had

25:42

bursts of massive creativity and

25:44

phases in the same way

25:46

you experience it's more

25:48

consistent. productive almost every single time unless

25:50

I'm severely blocked on something and then

25:53

I'll need to do a session that's

25:55

more healing of my inner child of

25:57

why I can't get to that next

25:59

level. But with the breathwork, it's

26:01

so focused, you know. Like on

26:03

mastery app, I have an app

26:06

called mastery and we have 80

26:08

different sessions and topics across what

26:10

anybody could need on any given

26:12

day. And it's truly the resource

26:14

I needed as an entrepreneur because

26:16

so many things come up. You

26:18

can have the best day and

26:20

the worst day at the exact

26:22

same time and you need this

26:25

to keep at an equilibrium. So

26:27

if it's procrastination, we have a

26:29

session on that. If it's perfectionism,

26:31

we have a session on that.

26:33

If it's decision making, we have

26:35

a decision making on that. are

26:37

a game changer in business to

26:39

complement your meditation practice. But it's

26:42

not just for business. No. It

26:44

could be for anything, right? Relationships,

26:46

parenting, health, health. Yeah. And we

26:48

have all those topics on the

26:50

app too, and I have to

26:52

say, you know, for me, business

26:54

is a little bit more innate.

26:56

I have a lot of entrepreneurial

26:58

kind of skills and drive by

27:01

nature, but in relationships, I don't.

27:03

That is, you know, I have

27:05

like an infancy brain when it

27:07

comes to how to manage relationships,

27:09

and I am now in a.

27:11

unbelievably beautiful, healthy, conscious relationship for

27:13

over five years and the breathwork

27:15

has saved me time and time

27:18

again because it's allowed me to

27:20

get out of my ego, out

27:22

of my defensiveness, out of my

27:24

trust issues, see the other person's

27:26

perspective and communicate and handle conflict

27:28

in a much more calm and

27:30

graceful way. Now it sounds like

27:32

this is something that people can

27:34

do on their own. I've never

27:37

had much success doing it on

27:39

my own because I feel like

27:41

I like... being one I like

27:43

doing it in in connection with

27:45

another person and then really coaching

27:47

me through and encouraging me to

27:49

like keep releasing keep letting go

27:51

whatever it is. people do it

27:54

on their own. It's been a

27:56

while since I've talked to you

27:58

about what I'm up to. I

28:00

want to first start by thinking

28:02

so many of my supporters who

28:04

have supported me on Patreon and

28:06

in my circle community. What's so

28:08

exciting now is we have my

28:10

new circle community up and running

28:13

where if you want to contribute

28:15

to supporting the podcast you can

28:17

do so at different levels. different

28:19

values. So head on over to

28:21

my circle group. You can actually

28:23

find the link in the show

28:25

notes below and there's opportunities to

28:27

continue to support the podcast. And

28:30

I have to say your support

28:32

of the podcast is frankly what

28:34

has kept this podcast going over

28:36

time. I have been funding the

28:38

podcast solely by myself. I get

28:40

a little bit of money in

28:42

advertising dollars, but not a lot.

28:44

anything that you can give if

28:46

you have found value in this

28:49

podcast. And it's not just giving

28:51

without anything back. I will give

28:53

back to you. You will be

28:55

a part of this community with

28:57

opportunities for discounts and conversations and

28:59

asking me anything, but it's a

29:01

great opportunity for you to support

29:03

what hopefully has helped you over

29:06

the many, many years. Also, there's

29:08

so many other ways now that

29:10

you can work with me. I

29:12

am offering a group course called

29:14

Live Your Life Backwards, which is

29:16

finishing its first cohort this winter

29:18

and has been absolutely incredible. There's

29:20

retreats coming up. There's workshops. There's

29:22

one-on-one sessions with me. So many

29:25

options that we can work together.

29:27

So make sure you're subscribed to

29:29

my YouTube channel. Make sure you're

29:31

subscribed to my podcast and make

29:33

sure you're subscribed to my newsletter.

29:35

workbook to help you dig deeper

29:37

into the virtues that you want

29:39

to be living in this lifetime.

29:42

We all need so much more

29:44

spirituality now. We are in a

29:46

spiritual crisis and I'm giving you

29:48

so many tools to tap into

29:50

your own spirituality. So check out

29:52

and don't forget to subscribe to

29:54

Life. death and

29:56

the space between,

29:58

so you never

30:01

miss an episode. You

30:04

know, I think that a chronological

30:06

order is really nice when you're evolving

30:08

your breathwork practice. So in the

30:10

beginning, it's really great for you to

30:12

have a facilitator to hold space

30:14

for you, especially because you'll be moving

30:16

through the heavier sessions. They're the

30:18

first ones. So all the suppressed stress,

30:20

you know, the stagnation, the trauma

30:22

might be building up in your body.

30:24

And so those first ones are

30:26

really cathartic to have somebody hold the

30:28

space for you. But then as

30:31

you're starting to use it more specifically

30:33

for business and projects or presentations

30:35

and just the affordability of it or

30:37

the accessibility of it, I love

30:39

having these sessions next to me on

30:41

my phone, on an app that

30:43

I can drop into every single morning.

30:45

And I like to do that

30:47

by myself. When I need community, I

30:49

want to sign up for a

30:51

group. I want to call up one

30:53

of my coaches when I need

30:55

to go deeper into my blocks. But

30:57

I think that having a range

30:59

of options, whether it's through, you know,

31:01

a guided video course, or it's

31:03

through one -on -one in person or it's

31:05

through a live event with a

31:07

thousand people, you know, everyone's kind of

31:10

kind of be at a different

31:12

level, and they're going to be able

31:14

to drop in at different paces

31:16

based on how much they do meditate

31:18

in the past or how much

31:20

they believe in the practice. So it's

31:22

really personal preference, but my dream

31:24

is that everybody wakes up every morning,

31:26

does a 20 minute breathwork session,

31:28

gets connected to the highest version of

31:30

themselves, takes fierce action on their

31:32

intuition. And for that to become a

31:34

reality, I think it needs to

31:36

be very accessible. I think that people

31:38

need to build up to being

31:40

able to do it on their own

31:42

and feel comfortable doing that. And

31:44

that's why I built Mastery. I love

31:47

that you're talking about, I mean,

31:49

I think you talk about it in

31:51

a very grounded way, but what

31:53

you're talking about is often a lot

31:55

of what I talk about, which

31:57

is connecting to this soul, this higher

31:59

self, which is really difficult to

32:01

do when your ego steps in and

32:03

does everything to maybe protect you from what might be more

32:05

difficult, challenging decisions that you have to make, but they're still

32:07

the right ones for your soul. Yeah,

32:10

I love that you put it that

32:12

way, and you actually gave me full-body

32:14

chills when you said that, you know,

32:16

I think it just depends on what

32:18

you've experienced in your life. I'm not

32:21

wired to be a naturally positive

32:23

person. I'm just not. I wish

32:25

I was, but I'm just not,

32:27

you know, like, like, I perceive

32:29

threat, I have fears. I have

32:31

insecurities, you know, my mom was

32:33

a Vietnamese refugee, so there's a

32:35

lot of that conditioning that comes

32:37

up when things go good. I

32:39

think the shoe's about to drop

32:41

any second, so I have. to

32:43

be very intentional and very consistent

32:45

in reprogramming and rewiring my brain

32:47

to be grateful and to see

32:49

the positive in situations and to,

32:52

you know, celebrate my wins. Like that's

32:54

a very active practice for me so

32:56

that I'm not living in fight or

32:58

flight so that I'm not immediately thinking

33:01

things are going to go wrong when

33:03

I should be happy. So that's why

33:05

it's been really important for

33:07

me to connect to my highest self,

33:09

see life. that can be safe and

33:12

beautiful and take action from that

33:14

place instead of from an energy

33:16

of fear and scarcity. Well, and

33:18

what's so important about what you're

33:20

saying right now is that this

33:22

is not, this is always been

33:24

my problem with like just do

33:27

a gratitude journal, just be grateful,

33:29

is that if you aren't wired

33:31

in that way and it feels

33:33

forced, one, it doesn't have the

33:35

vibrational frequency that it needs to

33:37

have to really be transformative, and

33:40

two. It's not always easy for everybody just

33:42

to find things to be great. I mean,

33:44

you can say it, but if you don't

33:46

feel it, then it's just words and it

33:48

feels empty. I want to give an example

33:50

that I think people might relate to

33:53

about that because I completely agree

33:55

with you and I think that's

33:57

why positive affirmations didn't always stick

33:59

for me. unless I did the

34:01

breath first. And it was, you

34:03

know, I was in therapy when

34:05

I was in New York and

34:07

I was in a very toxic

34:09

relationship and I remember my therapist,

34:11

I truly loved this woman and

34:13

I found her to be so

34:15

insightful and so helpful, but she

34:17

would just say, you're chasing emotional

34:19

intimacy, you're feeling a void of

34:21

your father, and I'd be like,

34:23

you're totally right. You know, like,

34:25

this is a bad boy, this

34:27

is bad for me, this is

34:29

so unhealthy for me. I cognitively,

34:31

mentally, intellectually, I understood all of

34:33

these things, but my nervous system

34:35

was so addicted to the feeling

34:38

of chaos that I would leave

34:40

her office and I would immediately

34:42

go see him. So I needed...

34:44

to go deeper. I needed to

34:46

release the pattern. I needed to

34:48

feel through the emotion. I needed

34:50

to heal. And I think that's

34:52

one of the reasons breathwork has

34:54

been such a powerful practice for

34:56

me because all of the things

34:58

that I fought the current against,

35:00

you know, I knew I shouldn't

35:02

see my new in my mind.

35:04

I knew I should be happy.

35:06

I know I should be grateful.

35:08

And then I would shame myself

35:10

or not feeling grateful and I

35:12

would judge myself for not being

35:14

happier because I have all these

35:16

things. But when you go into

35:18

breath, it just expands your mind,

35:20

it expands your perspective, it releases

35:22

the anxiety, it releases the stress,

35:24

and it just, it gives you

35:26

a new way of seeing things

35:28

that actually sticks. When you talk

35:30

about flow state and breath work,

35:33

what does that look like to

35:35

you? What does that, or more

35:37

importantly, what does that feel like?

35:39

Freedom. Flowstate feels like freedom, it

35:41

feels like mental peace, it feels

35:43

like, you know, clarity and focus

35:45

and alignment. I always say that

35:47

flowstate is when productivity meets alignment.

35:49

And it's interesting because when you're

35:51

unblocked, which means you've healed some

35:53

of those big subconscious barriers, then

35:55

flowstate can actually be extremely accessible

35:57

and you can hack it on

35:59

demand when you play maybe. by

36:01

neural beats and you focus your

36:03

brain and you concentrate on a

36:05

task or a project or a

36:07

presentation. So for me when I

36:09

discovered flow state I was really

36:11

trying to figure out how I

36:13

was going to make this transition

36:15

into entrepreneurship and I was used

36:17

to a very cushy lifestyle as

36:19

an ad exact and I wanted

36:21

to figure out how I was

36:23

going to monetize. this practice and

36:25

I treated it like I did

36:27

in advertising, I created a war

36:30

room in my bedroom, I had

36:32

psychological benefits, spiritual, physiological benefits, partnership

36:34

strategy, collaborations, collaborations, collaborations, collaborations, collaborations,

36:36

collaborations, I had all these white

36:38

papers on a board in my

36:40

apartment, and then I would breathe.

36:42

And it was like a mental

36:44

mind map of connections would start

36:46

to happen and with feeling this

36:48

contact, with this workshop, with this

36:50

audience, and this is the video,

36:52

and this is the video, And

36:54

I started doing that every single

36:56

day. And next thing I know,

36:58

my first year as a breathwork

37:00

coach, I made back my marketing

37:02

director salary. And my next year,

37:04

I more than doubled it. Because

37:06

flow state is so accessible, you

37:08

just need to know how to

37:10

access it. And breath is the

37:12

catalyst. Sign me up. I want

37:14

to do that and I want

37:16

to do that and I want

37:18

to do that and I want

37:20

to do it all. So do

37:22

you have then a meditation practice

37:25

and a breathwork practice? Yeah, I

37:27

do. It's the most important 40

37:29

minutes of my morning. You know,

37:31

I will play a session on

37:33

mastery, whatever it is I need

37:35

for that day knowing. my to

37:37

do list and knowing my priorities

37:39

and then I'll play a Dr.

37:41

Joe to spend a meditation right

37:43

after that and 40 minutes crystal

37:45

clear start taking action boom boom

37:47

and I'm in the highest frequency

37:49

the highest energy in the morning

37:51

usually by around 3 p.m. you

37:53

know the bitchy New Yorker comes

37:55

back out. The mean girl I

37:57

love in the book you talk

37:59

about how you were a mean

38:01

a girl. Yes, yeah that's about

38:03

the time where some of those

38:05

default patterns in the conditioning creeps

38:07

back in and we've got to

38:09

go again. So what happens? What

38:11

do you think happens neurologically that

38:13

around like it gets you halfway

38:15

through your day a little bit

38:17

more than halfway? And then it

38:19

sounds like you go back into

38:22

that like default mode network programming.

38:24

There's just so much conditioning, you

38:26

know, there's so much conditioning like

38:28

if you really think about it

38:30

I've gone over three decades of

38:32

my life sort of being programmed

38:34

a certain way and having Tough

38:36

exterior and having really intense defense

38:38

mechanisms and now I'm five years

38:40

in on a journey of trying

38:42

to change and trying to rewire

38:44

and be a better version of

38:46

myself and and reprogram a lot

38:48

of beliefs that have protected me

38:50

and have kept me safe and

38:52

have given me a level of

38:54

success, you know, to some extent.

38:56

So. We're kind of fighting that

38:58

sometimes. You know, when I do

39:00

the breathwork in the morning, I'm

39:02

at ease. My body is in

39:04

flow. I feel very relaxed. I

39:06

feel calm. I feel at peace.

39:08

And then someone sends me an

39:10

email that really pisses me off.

39:12

You know, I'm like, it can

39:14

trigger a state or it can

39:17

trigger some memories. And then it's

39:19

just another layer that needs to

39:21

be cleared. But it starts to

39:23

get easier in some ways because

39:25

you're kind of cleaning the slate

39:27

and you're clearing out events of

39:29

the past, but the journey never

39:31

really ends. And as you continue

39:33

doing it, you reach new levels.

39:35

You reach new levels of success

39:37

and then that triggers, you know,

39:39

different fears and different events of

39:41

the past. And so it's an

39:43

ongoing journey, which is why I'm

39:45

really committed to breathing and meditating

39:47

every single day. And so if

39:49

it's a relationship that you're dealing

39:51

with and you're working the breathwork

39:53

through that, you might come up

39:55

against another relationship trigger, like some

39:57

sort of block that's impacting your

39:59

relationship. And then you breathe through

40:01

that to get clarity on that.

40:03

You're like, I need to understand

40:05

why I keep pulling away.

40:08

And then that would be. Yeah, the

40:10

relationship work has been. profound for

40:12

me. And it was actually just,

40:14

you know, two months ago. So

40:16

say I've been, I've been breathing

40:18

every morning for five years. I've

40:20

made significant changes in who I've

40:22

attracted in my life and my

40:24

partner is amazing. And just two

40:26

months ago when the book had

40:28

launched, I remember, I think I

40:30

was on like 30 flights in

40:32

three months and I was absolutely

40:34

exhausted. And I came home one

40:36

week after like a seven city

40:38

tour and I was like, you're

40:40

not giving me any. passionate empathy. Like, I

40:42

need you to, can you just make dinner?

40:44

Like, can you just help me out here?

40:46

And I remember thinking, like, God, he's really

40:48

wrong. You know, like, he's so wrong. And

40:50

I went to breathwork and it was like,

40:52

no, you've completely prioritized a book launch

40:54

and you haven't prioritized your relationship

40:57

at all. And now you're asking

40:59

someone else to prioritize it. And

41:01

I was like, whoa. So the

41:03

self-awareness it gives me on a

41:05

daily basis is crazy. It just

41:07

gets me out of my own

41:09

way and my own like self-absorption

41:11

and I'm extremely lucky to have

41:13

a partner who does the breathwork

41:15

with me so that we can

41:17

be communicating from a place of

41:20

not our defenses, but actually trying

41:22

to see the other person's

41:24

perspective and that dissolves

41:26

it in seconds versus what would be a

41:28

fight for days. you know, we'll just drop

41:30

into a session, be like, okay, I see

41:33

your point of view, I was wrong here,

41:35

I'm sorry, let's do better and

41:37

end it. While you're in the

41:39

breathwork, you're having these conversations? No,

41:41

we'll be doing the 20 minutes next to

41:43

each other, but it's so interesting, you know,

41:46

we'll go into breathwork and we'll be pissed.

41:48

Like, we'll be like, I can't even look

41:50

at you right now, like, you're so annoying.

41:53

you just inch your hand over a little

41:55

bit closer and then by the end of

41:57

the 20 minutes we're like in a full

42:00

cuddle and we're like hugging and we're

42:02

repairing. It's just wild how much it

42:04

softens the defensiveness and it opens the

42:06

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43:16

I mean, I'm a huge proponent.

43:18

I I if I could figure

43:20

out a way to do breathwork

43:22

every day I feel like I

43:24

just I know they say if

43:26

you don't have time you should

43:28

I just re-up to like I

43:30

said my meditation practice and that

43:32

has been game-changing like to commit

43:34

to the morning before Before I

43:36

don't even go near my phone

43:38

because One day so far it's

43:40

January 13th. So I've been consistent

43:42

for 13 days One day I

43:44

mistakenly grabbed my phone by accident

43:47

Or not by accident on purpose.

43:49

I didn't just didn't jump into

43:51

my hand But I was like

43:53

let me just check something real

43:55

quick and It blew like off

43:57

every like it's up everything. I

43:59

couldn't get, I then was 20

44:01

minutes into my phone, then the

44:03

day took off, then I had

44:05

to like carve out more time

44:07

for meditation, and then it felt

44:09

like I couldn't really settle in

44:11

because I was already thinking about

44:13

everything that I had just read,

44:15

the emails I needed to return.

44:17

And so I just think it

44:19

speaks to how important it is

44:21

to have some sort of practice.

44:23

Yeah. Even though it can be

44:25

really, really hard to resist. All

44:27

this noise. I have to say

44:29

that doing the breathwork consistently every

44:31

morning has cut all of my

44:33

tasks in half, probably more than

44:35

that. When I remember my first

44:37

website. I did breathwork and I

44:40

just immediately I saw the layout,

44:42

I saw the fonts, I saw

44:44

the colors to use, I saw

44:46

the type, the words, and it

44:48

took me four hours to build.

44:50

I could have outsourced that, it

44:52

could have been weeks to get

44:54

done, but I had so much

44:56

clarity. And the same thing happens

44:58

with emails. I never sit. an

45:00

indecision because my intuition is so

45:02

clear and my breathwork gives me

45:04

the words and I feel like

45:06

I'm a vessel a lot of

45:08

the time for what people need

45:10

to hear or how to communicate

45:12

something and how it's going to

45:14

be received. So I think when

45:16

people are too busy during their

45:18

day, I really encourage them to

45:20

look at it like it's going

45:22

to cut everything else in half.

45:24

How long it takes you to

45:26

write that proposal, how long it

45:28

takes you to send out the

45:30

emails to create the deck to

45:33

rehearse the pitch. Like all of

45:35

that's going to be cut in

45:37

half when you. your cognition is

45:39

so much sharper and clearer and

45:41

you can access those flow states.

45:43

So the 20 minutes that you

45:45

sacrifice in the morning, you will

45:47

more than make up for it

45:49

during the day. What do you

45:51

think you're tapping into in those

45:53

flow states? Do you believe it's

45:55

like this higher collective consciousness? Do

45:57

you think it's our own soul?

45:59

Do you think it's just the

46:01

clutter cleared out of our mind

46:03

so we can really access whatever

46:05

in there? I think it's a

46:07

combination of... reducing the clutter so

46:09

that you can access the subconscious.

46:11

and I think the subconscious, again,

46:13

it's the storehouse of everything that

46:15

you've ever walked by read, been

46:17

inspired by, had a conversation about

46:19

it all exists within you. And

46:21

when you breathe, what you're doing

46:23

is you're accessing the intuition. And

46:26

intuition isn't this woo-w concept. It's

46:28

actually. Rapid information processing. It is

46:30

pattern recognition. So you're just able

46:32

to do it at this heightened

46:34

speed and you just have this

46:36

inner knowing. And when you learn

46:38

how to trust that and you

46:40

have conviction in that and you're

46:42

unapologetically fiercely listening to that intuition

46:44

and acting on it immediately, everything

46:46

around you starts to flow. You're

46:48

no longer pushing and forcing, but

46:50

you're attracting. The opportunity is magnetizing

46:52

itself to you. All of the

46:54

things that you thought would take

46:56

a really long time to get

46:58

there, all of a sudden, it's

47:00

just effortlessly flowing. You're skipping steps

47:02

sometimes. It's unpredictable. Things are working

47:04

out better than you could have

47:06

imagined, but it really requires the

47:08

trust. in that intuition and the

47:10

buildup and it's a practice. We

47:12

all have intuition. Most of us

47:14

have diluted it. Most of us

47:16

are outlogicking. You know, we're depending

47:19

on our logical and protective and

47:21

analytical minds, but I'm telling you

47:23

if I had a PSA, the

47:25

one thing I would tell everyone

47:27

is to act on your intuition.

47:29

It will completely change the trajectory

47:31

of your life. That is a

47:33

perfect place to end. Act on

47:35

your intuition. Love it. So if

47:37

people want to learn more about

47:39

you, tell us where they can

47:41

find you, this is very, whatever,

47:43

backlit with the white cover and

47:45

the white cover and the white

47:47

cover and the white background. So

47:49

you can pick up my book,

47:51

Unblock Your Purpose on Amazon. You

47:53

can download mastery on the Google

47:55

Play or Apple Store, and then

47:57

you can find me on Instagram

47:59

at Francesca-Cissitma or my website, Francesca-Citma.com.

48:01

Thank you so much Francesca for

48:03

your time. today and want to

48:05

hear more wondering what comes next.

48:07

I love what you're making it

48:09

so accessible to people and not

48:12

the scary foreign thing, but something

48:14

that people can do in their

48:16

homes on an app. I think

48:18

it's fantastic. So thank you for

48:20

bringing that to the masses and

48:22

certainly to my listeners. Thank you

48:24

so much for having me. It's

48:26

been an honor. Like what you

48:28

heard today and want to hear

48:30

more, wondering what comes next. and

48:32

what it all means, head over

48:34

to Apple Podcast, Spotify, Stitcher, Google

48:36

Play, or anywhere you get your

48:38

podcast and hit subscribe. Also, if

48:40

you could take a minute to

48:42

rate and review my podcast, I

48:44

would really appreciate it. Stay tuned

48:46

as we continue to explore life,

48:48

death, and the space between. Hey,

48:54

this is Naomiik Paragon, co-host

48:56

of the podcast Couples Therapy.

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