0:12

friends and welcome back to your

0:14

weekly Linux talk show. My name

0:16

is Chris. My name is Liz

0:18

and my name is Brent. Hello

0:20

gentlemen, we're coming up on the

0:22

show today as we prepare physically,

0:24

mentally, and emotionally for episode 600.

0:26

We're going to introduce you to

0:28

what might be our next challenge

0:30

if the boys can convince me

0:32

in this episode and there might

0:34

be a way you can join too. Then we're

0:36

going to round it out with a killer pick,

0:39

some great boost and a bunch more.

0:41

It's a banger of an episode. Let's

0:43

make this one really good, so that

0:45

way we can slack off for

0:47

600. And let's start by

0:49

saying time appropriate greetings to

0:51

that virtual log. Hello, Mumble

0:54

Room. Hello. Hi Chris. I'm

0:56

listening. Hello, hello, guys. Hello.

0:58

Hello. Shout out there to

1:00

the quiet listening. Hello. Hello.

1:02

Shout out there to the

1:04

quiet listening. Join. You're

1:06

always welcome. Just grab

1:08

Mumble. Also, I want to say good

1:10

morning to Tailscale. tailscale.com/unplugged.

1:12

Go there, support

1:15

the show, and get it for

1:17

free for up to 100 devices

1:19

and three users. Tailscale is the

1:21

easiest way to connect devices and

1:23

services to each other wherever they

1:25

are, secured by a mesh network,

1:27

protected by Wargaw. Yeah. This is

1:30

the ultimate realization of what wire

1:32

guard is capable of. It's just secure.

1:34

It's remote access to whatever you might

1:36

have. Your production systems, your databases, all

1:38

on a mesh network, and it's really

1:41

fast. It's intuitive to set up, but it's

1:43

also very flexible. It's programable. You

1:45

have like a programmable private

1:47

network for a business or for an

1:49

individual. I started with my personal plan

1:51

100 devices, I still use that, but now

1:53

we've also expanded to have a JB business plan

1:56

because there's so much we can use it for

1:58

the back end of JB as well. it

2:00

makes all other VPNs seem really

2:02

old. Like when I hear people

2:05

are using like no disrespect, but

2:07

when they're using things like open

2:09

VPN and other proprietary point-to-point VPNs,

2:11

I feel bad for them. It

2:14

doesn't have to be that way.

2:16

Tail scale is so much better.

2:18

Try it for free on 100

2:20

devices and up to three users

2:23

and support the show. Right now,

2:25

just go to tailscale.com/unplugged. We're

2:29

going to keep the housekeeping short

2:31

this week because we've got a

2:33

lot of news to dig into

2:35

But I do want to mention

2:38

that we have a lot of

2:40

details for LUP 600 meet-up parties

2:42

and whatnot So be sure you

2:44

stay tuned to after the news

2:46

so that way we can cover

2:48

all that because there's details and

2:50

logistics and things like that we

2:53

don't want you to miss But

2:55

let's start with something that is

2:57

a tantalizing idea a dream a

2:59

passion of the Linux community that

3:01

seems to Never die. And that

3:03

is a full Linux smartphone. It's

3:05

called the Librics. And they're promising

3:07

privacy, security, and freedom. And this

3:10

is landing, the announcement at least,

3:12

right around the pine phone, the

3:14

original pine phone, celebrating its fifth

3:16

birthday. So we've got a handful

3:18

of these devices out there, boys.

3:20

You know, like you got the

3:22

pine phones, you got the Librum

3:25

5. Right. I mean,

3:27

it's like you could count them

3:29

on one hand how many true

3:31

Linux smartphone devices they are. And

3:33

the Librix Next is a new

3:35

smartphone that uses Librix OS, which

3:37

is based on Debbie and 13.

3:39

And it's got some, I don't

3:41

know, are you looking, look at

3:43

the pictures there, I'm curious to

3:45

know what you think of the

3:47

design, it's got an interesting design,

3:49

I wonder if you notice. What

3:51

kind of jumps out at the

3:53

top of the phone if you

3:55

did it? Yeah, it doesn't look

3:57

especially modern or sleek, but it

3:59

doesn't look bad No, kind of

4:01

like an older iPhone. I imagine

4:03

these are pre-production designs as well,

4:05

right, but it's got All kinds

4:07

of togles on the top for

4:09

Wi-Fi, for LTE probably, probably other

4:11

things. Yeah, Mike and Camera definitely

4:13

on there. I saw Bluetooth on

4:15

there. It's got an arcade 3588

4:17

S-S-O-C. So that's a pocket cord.

4:19

Yep. Two hundred and fifty-six gigabytes

4:22

of E-MMC storage built-in, then expandable

4:24

with an SD card. It has

4:26

a 6.34-4-4-4-4-4-4-4-4-O LED screen. 2018 resolution

4:28

with a fingerprint sensor on the

4:30

back and Corning Gorilla glass for

4:32

the screen and it has a

4:34

removable Whoa? Yeah removable. I'm gonna

4:36

say it again a removable 5,300

4:38

amp hour battery 32 megapixel rear

4:40

camera. It also has a legitimate

4:42

LTE modem. They're saying it's at

4:44

least one that I think is

4:46

pretty considered pretty good. The Snapchat,

4:48

X32, which supports 5G, Wi-Fi, and

4:50

blue teeth, and the Harvard switches.

4:52

Brent. Could this be, if it's

4:54

true, if it's real? Could this

4:56

be a Brent phone? Well, I've

4:58

been looking for a phone like

5:00

this for, I was going to

5:02

say five years, but I think

5:04

it's been more like 10 years.

5:06

I feel like many of us

5:08

have. but nothing that's come out

5:10

has been up to snuff. Now

5:12

this sounds very promising. It is

5:14

of course a bunch of promises

5:16

at this point. So we haven't

5:18

seen any development devices. Nobody's gotten

5:21

their hands on it and it

5:23

is a crowd funder and I

5:25

know you. have a really good

5:27

experience with how these go. So

5:29

a lot of this makes me

5:31

pause a little bit, although I

5:33

gotta say something in me as

5:35

tinkling, because yeah, I would love

5:37

a phone like this. If it

5:39

was, I'm usually typically fine with

5:41

giving up a few. popular features

5:43

to lean a little closer to

5:45

my ideals, as you guys know.

5:47

So I would totally go this

5:49

way. If this got into production,

5:51

yeah, you've got me hooked. I

5:53

think the one question I have,

5:55

okay, so you make a great

5:57

point that you're willing to forego

5:59

a lot of conveniences and sort

6:01

of quality of life stuff. But

6:03

my question is, isn't there still

6:05

a set of Android or iOS

6:07

apps that are? Almost at the

6:09

essential layer. Maybe not, maybe you

6:11

can kind of not, but I'm

6:13

just thinking like. Maps. Well, maps,

6:15

or I don't know, there's, is

6:18

there like a, you know, an

6:20

app you need to register if

6:22

you're like coming into another country

6:24

or instead of having to fill

6:26

out a paper form? Or boy,

6:28

you're right, I have to go

6:30

apps blunking like when I'm traveling

6:32

quite a bit. That would work.

6:34

So Wes, for you, I got

6:36

a question. Imagine this thing, it

6:38

kind of lives up to what

6:40

they say here, right? We have

6:42

to be kind of skeptical here

6:44

at this point, but let's just

6:46

go with this for a second.

6:48

It's using posh, I believe, that

6:50

Ganom-Gtikk stuff, the PIRES have worked

6:52

on, the adaptive GT, that stuff's

6:54

in a pretty good place. It

6:56

doesn't, you know, look bad. Abs

6:58

that you're going on this thing

7:00

if you wanted to. Battery life

7:02

though, four hours. Is that a

7:04

deal breaker for you when it's

7:06

removable? Huh. By the way, that's

7:08

not their estimate. I'm just thinking,

7:10

when you've got this RK3588 SOC,

7:12

and you've got a Snapchat X32

7:15

modem, and you've got a Linux

7:17

OS, and a 6.34 inch oled

7:19

screen, all of those things are

7:21

on the higher end of power

7:23

use. So I think we would

7:25

have to, you know, especially if

7:27

you're on 5G. I think you'd

7:29

have to set your expectations. to

7:31

kind of mid for battery life.

7:33

Yeah, I suppose, I wonder if

7:35

they were going to have good

7:37

OS level options for like battery

7:39

saver mode or other sort of

7:41

power profiles. Because you know, if

7:43

I could put it into like

7:45

background mode for a lot of

7:47

the day and just like, hey,

7:49

every couple minutes wake up for

7:51

notifications and otherwise kind of sleep.

7:53

Yeah, it doesn't need to be

7:55

constantly receiving. Yeah, you're right. Especially

7:57

if I could choose the granularity

7:59

or switch the mode pretty. Frickin'

8:01

great OS. It's just like so

8:03

rare that I need to know

8:05

right now. Yeah, very true. Yeah,

8:07

that's yeah, I think the the

8:09

removable battery is such a nice

8:11

return. Especially if you could get

8:14

a couple of yes, keep some

8:16

charge at your bag. Imagine a

8:18

trap like going back to your

8:20

point about a travel day like

8:22

yes, maybe you couldn't get some

8:24

of the apps, but you could

8:26

bring three of the batteries with

8:28

you and this could be your

8:30

entire entertainment device, your immediate information,

8:32

you know, like everything. And you

8:34

could even install. jellyfin on this.

8:36

You might feel better about, well,

8:38

maybe not from iOS, but you

8:40

might feel better about some of

8:42

the security risks of traveling too

8:44

if you're using a Linux powered

8:46

phone. Yeah. Perhaps. You've had, you

8:48

know, multiple devices in your life

8:50

for a little while. You were

8:52

doing the dual phone thing for

8:54

a bit there. Do you see

8:56

this being an option in that

8:58

respect? Like having certain apps on

9:00

the everyday, always on phone and

9:02

having, I don't know, most of

9:04

your private life on this guy?

9:06

Right, like, especially if you could

9:08

keep like an older couple gen

9:11

out pixel that you just kind

9:13

of have for like if you

9:15

need it for. Well, maybe you

9:17

take that one when you travel

9:19

or. Yeah, like something that has

9:21

an argument to the other. I

9:23

wouldn't need to bring it with

9:25

me if I'm going over my

9:27

friend's house for the night, right?

9:29

Yeah, it doesn't maybe have all

9:31

your passwords, doesn't have all your

9:33

notes, doesn't have all your pictures.

9:35

All your history. Right. You know

9:37

what I was thinking actually is...

9:39

Especially because I already own several

9:41

old pixels. True. You know, like

9:43

I wouldn't have to like get

9:45

a new phone to be my

9:47

second phone. I feel like I

9:49

still haven't landed on the sweet

9:51

spot for... I'm going to a

9:53

relatives' house, I'm going to a

9:55

hotel, I'm going to an Airbnb,

9:57

and I want to take USBC

9:59

to HDMI, and I want to

10:01

put something up on the TV.

10:03

And, because I just, I had

10:05

my 10-year anniversary with the wife

10:07

a few weeks ago, and we

10:10

went to a little Airbnb nearby,

10:12

and I get in there, and

10:14

of course, I didn't bring anything

10:16

to take control of the TV,

10:18

it didn't even cross my mind.

10:20

And a little portable portable phone

10:22

that maybe I had to HDMI

10:24

you know, run Cody on or

10:26

a jellyfin front end would be

10:28

really nice. And I've tried to

10:30

kind of replicate this with the

10:32

fire stick to not really much

10:34

success. I don't know, maybe that

10:36

idea. Maybe the audience has a

10:38

device out there that's already perfect

10:40

for this that they could boost

10:42

it and tell me about. But

10:44

I could see the phone doing

10:46

this, but this is probably going

10:48

to be, you know, somewhere near

10:50

a thousand dollars. There's got to

10:52

be a cheaper way to accomplish

10:54

what I'm looking to do. If

10:56

it was one of many things

10:58

that provided for me, I could

11:00

see getting this, even if it

11:02

wasn't my daily driver phone. Potentially.

11:04

Crowdfunding is the red flag here.

11:07

We have to kind of see

11:09

how this goes. They haven't actually

11:11

built anything as far as we

11:13

know yet. Maybe prototypes. We don't

11:15

have any information on battery life

11:17

or price. We don't even really

11:19

know when the crowd's funder is

11:21

going to fully kick off. Like

11:23

they haven't even said that yet.

11:25

You can't even go crowdfunding at

11:27

this point. You know, I don't

11:29

know if I've tried HMI, but

11:31

the pixels and those USBC little

11:33

docks that have, you know, USB

11:35

and HDMI on them have been

11:37

fairly well compatible. Yeah. So if

11:39

you had the Jellyfin client on

11:41

your phone connected to your server,

11:43

maybe I'll do it that way.

11:45

Hmm. I don't know if you

11:47

want to, but... You know, also

11:49

in the space is the Lebrick's

11:51

next seem... reasonable and totally achievable

11:53

because this is in a whole

11:55

other level of what they're trying

11:57

to do. It's a modular Linux.

11:59

handheld, and it's extensible by slapping

12:01

on different modules. We've seen these

12:03

ideas over the past, but my

12:06

goodness, if this isn't the most

12:08

slick, elegant version, and the dang

12:10

thing has two USBA ports in

12:12

the side of it, as well

12:14

as a small Ethernet port. I

12:16

don't know why, but suddenly I

12:18

love the idea of a phone

12:20

with a USBA port. Heck yeah.

12:22

And it has these ideas of

12:24

modules that magnetically snap on and

12:26

then interface with the device over

12:28

USB. So they show up to

12:30

the Linux OS as USB. And

12:32

they demonstrated this actually functioning at

12:34

CES. So it's kind of like

12:36

what framework does, but just remove

12:38

the connector? Yes. And so an

12:40

example of this is you could

12:42

where you might have a keyboard,

12:44

you could slap off the magnetic

12:46

keyboard and slap on a controller

12:48

pad for maybe a Game Boy

12:50

emulator. or maybe a data cable

12:52

to connect to an external disk.

12:54

They have right now a GPIO,

12:56

I guess, accessory. You could call

12:58

it a game pad accessory and

13:00

a keyboard accessory. But it's just

13:03

general GPIO stuff. It's all USB,

13:05

pretty basic, open source, how they

13:07

make it work. So it's nothing

13:09

really particularly secretive about it. Anybody

13:11

could really, probably, wire up something.

13:13

It is a Linux OS. They

13:15

call it, the mechanics OS. It's

13:17

based on Debbieian. They say, the

13:19

perk to that is that there's,

13:21

quote, 60,000 packages in the Debbie

13:23

and repo that work out of

13:25

the box. The Meccanek Shell is

13:27

built in Rust and supports GPU

13:29

rendering on Wayland. Oh, yeah. Built

13:31

with the tools you already know,

13:33

and they list Chromium, Go Cute,

13:35

Rust, obviously, node, and others. It

13:37

is also a... It's a it's

13:39

a Kickstarter. It's a crowdfunding. It's

13:41

a Kickstarter specifically and it's in

13:43

the pre-launch mode It has not

13:45

technically launched either They seem to

13:47

have prototypes Because I watched coverage

13:49

at CES of like a whole

13:51

booth of them actually functioning and

13:53

snapping pads on and whatnot and

13:55

they have now videos of that

13:57

up on their website as well

14:00

So this one's way out there boys.

14:03

They seem busy they've got a get

14:05

hub link and you know those repos

14:07

are active. This might be better for

14:09

what I'm thinking of my kind of

14:12

device you know a portable media server

14:14

because you could you could see snapping

14:16

on a disk. Well yeah this is

14:18

opens it up to a whole other

14:21

conception than a traditional phone. They do

14:23

have some use cases here Chris that

14:25

I think will buy you over to

14:27

if you need. One of them called

14:30

the car whisper. You can add a

14:32

can or ODB port to the common

14:34

and start talking to your car or

14:36

RFP. The other one here they suggest

14:39

is build your own tricorder. Well I

14:41

was thinking a portable recorder. You know

14:43

if you could have a little USB

14:45

interface that you could snap on to

14:48

this thing. Because again it's just USB

14:50

with power pins and whatnot, it's pretty

14:52

straightforward. That could, you know, for events

14:54

with the recording, like audacity running on

14:57

the little screen. Right? You just use,

14:59

or reaper even? You could even use

15:01

reaper because it's available on arm. So

15:03

this is way out there. I invite

15:06

you guys to go to the show

15:08

notes at linuxownplug.com/529 and check out the

15:10

link to this thing because it's the

15:12

coolest implementation I've ever seen of this

15:15

idea. of this kind of like Lego

15:17

kit phone. It's not as modular as

15:19

like the Motorola stuff we've seen in

15:21

the past. It's just really that front

15:24

end spot where a keyboard would go.

15:26

There is a magnetic mount where things

15:28

connect. And so you just can swap

15:30

different stuff on there. And then it's

15:32

got USBC on the bottom of the

15:35

phone. It's got. I mean in the

15:37

versions they show on their website it's

15:39

got USBA on the side and the

15:41

Ethernet port. Seems like you could sell

15:44

some to just anyone who worked in

15:46

like a data center or support environment

15:48

just with the, you know, USBA on

15:50

the Ethernet right there on the side

15:53

and having a nice keyboard, physical keyboard?

15:55

Or like what about Amazon, right? So

15:57

you buy these as a standard device

15:59

and then you build a custom snap-on

16:02

module that's particular to the work case

16:04

or something like that. I don't know,

16:06

man, man, I could see it. I

16:08

could see it. pricing, it's a crowd

16:11

funder, but these are really interesting ideas,

16:13

notable too that I think that both

16:15

of them are running on Debbie. I

16:17

would love to have you boost in

16:20

and tell us if you're interested in

16:22

devices like these still or have you

16:24

soured on the idea of a Linux

16:26

device and are you willing to go

16:29

far enough to actually put your money

16:31

on the line and crowd fund one

16:33

of these? Boost! Boost in and tell

16:35

us because I'm really interested in the

16:38

audience's temperature on this. Before we move

16:40

on, just a couple of quick stories

16:42

to wrap up on, I thought it

16:44

was noteworthy that the Linux Foundation has

16:47

launched the supporters of chromium-based browsers, quote,

16:49

the supporters of chromium-based browsers provide the

16:51

neutral space where industry leaders, academia, developers,

16:53

and broader open-source communities can work together

16:56

to support projects within the chromium ecosystem.

16:58

We've seen some, uh... I'd say... confusion

17:00

or maybe some anger in some of

17:02

the Linux and open source community over

17:05

this? I think Brent you had a

17:07

take I kind of liked. Well I

17:09

have heard a lot of people think

17:11

well what's the deal with Firefox? Like

17:13

why are we supporting and supporting the

17:16

chromium base stuff when we've had Firefox

17:18

all along? And that's a good question

17:20

to answer. I don't know who's going

17:22

to answer it but it seems like

17:25

we need one. Well the argument I've

17:27

heard as well it has a foundation

17:29

already. It's Mozilla. Right I think you

17:31

said this you that you know the

17:34

only foundation in a way was sort

17:36

of dealing with the solving for a

17:38

Future where maybe we don't have a

17:40

Firefox or you know we need a

17:43

healthy chromium ecosystem because it's going to

17:45

be here whether we like it or

17:47

not But wouldn't the way to solve

17:49

for that be to support Firefox more?

17:52

Not if it's not if it's doomed.

17:54

Then it's just a waste of money.

17:56

Oh my god. That's dark. I hope

17:58

I'm using a Firefox right now and

18:01

I'm clear but I'm the only one

18:03

that just Is cooking a little conspiracy

18:05

bacon on this one? To me this

18:07

seems like fried up. This seems like

18:10

a hedge that the Justice Department might

18:12

go through with their threats. of separating

18:14

chromium off from Google. Oh, okay, I

18:16

like that. And then they're positioning themselves

18:19

to be ready for when that happens.

18:21

That makes sense. Yes. I'm gonna, I'm

18:23

gonna go with that bacon with you.

18:25

Wow, that's, that's rare for Brent. All

18:28

right, thank you. I like that. What

18:30

do you think? What do you think?

18:32

You think it could be like them

18:34

laying the cards out or I guess

18:37

maybe another metaphor would be like preparing

18:39

the deck to the seats? Yeah, I

18:41

think, I mean, I don't know if

18:43

that's the only reason or it's a

18:45

direct response, but I think that and

18:48

sort of the wider concerns around that,

18:50

especially as we've seen, you know, more

18:52

and more in Microsoft, you know, there's

18:54

just like a lot of companies now

18:57

tied to this code base and a

18:59

lot of, it's some instead the real

19:01

economy that relies on it functioning functioning

19:03

functioning functioning functioning. I think that probably

19:06

plays a factor, yeah. Short-dom in the

19:08

live chat also points out, electrons a

19:10

factor here. True, yeah. You know, even

19:12

if, uh, even if a chromium never

19:15

got separated out, like, the electron's such

19:17

a huge thing now. You'd want to

19:19

have at least some, maybe they're hoping

19:21

to get input or develop or influence

19:24

and build influence over time. I'd love

19:26

to know. I do think, you know,

19:28

you know, I mean, the Linux Foundation,

19:30

for all of its faults, it's false.

19:33

you know dispatcher whatever for open source

19:35

projects sometimes so I feel like I'm

19:37

missing a wider play well Chris I

19:39

see a big old join now button

19:42

on their website here maybe we should

19:44

yeah I'm inside reporting maybe the maybe

19:46

the unplug show should become a supporter

19:48

of chromian-based browsers what if we make

19:51

a browser And you can just only

19:53

go to the show page. That'd be

19:55

great. That'd be so good. And then

19:57

I just wanted to wrap up as

20:00

far as news goes with a shout

20:02

out to Wine 10.0. Now with native

20:04

Whalen support and better high DPI support.

20:06

And I just think this is incredible

20:09

because the Wine project was started in

20:11

1993. Whoa. They just keep going and

20:13

going and going. And it is so

20:15

respectable. 2008, which we covered on the

20:17

show I think, every at least one

20:20

of our shows, Wine reached 1.0 and

20:22

that felt like such a huge deal.

20:24

You know, and now here we are,

20:26

10.0 is out. And I think this

20:29

is also going to make one of

20:31

my predictions about Proton correct in Linux

20:33

Unplug, but we'll see. It's also like

20:35

maybe remind ourselves. The promise of what

20:38

Warren advertises that it can do seems

20:40

kind of impossible in practice. You know

20:42

what I mean? Like, oh yeah, you

20:44

could write a paper about how you

20:47

could do that. Sure. Right. But you're

20:49

going to keep up with the changes

20:51

and make real-world complicated applications work? Sure,

20:53

sure. Like a game? Yeah. Turns out,

20:56

yeah. And I mean always without exception,

20:58

work on company-owned devices and IT-approved apps.

21:00

I don't think so. I don't think

21:02

it's possible. So I think the next

21:05

natural question is, how do you keep

21:07

your company's data safe when it's sitting

21:09

all those unmanaged apps and devices? Well,

21:11

one password has the answer to this

21:14

question. It's extended access management. It helps

21:16

you secure every sign-in for every app.

21:18

on every device. Because it solves problems,

21:20

the traditional IMs and MDMs just can't

21:23

touch. And it's also bundling one password.

21:25

You know one password. We've all had

21:27

those situations where we've seen the passwords

21:29

under the keyboard, we're stuck to the

21:32

monitor, or somebody uses the same password

21:34

everywhere. You think, God, if they just

21:36

had a great password manager that would

21:38

solve all of this. Well, one password

21:41

award-winning password managers trusted by millions of

21:43

users. 150, thousand plus businesses from IBM

21:45

to Slack. And now they're doing more

21:47

than just securing passwords. Now with extended

21:50

access management, they're taking to the next

21:52

level. Plus one password is ISO 2

21:54

701 certified. And they have regular third-party

21:56

audits, and they have a large... bug

21:58

bounty out there. They just exceed the

22:01

standards set by everybody else. Secure every

22:03

app and every identity. Even the unmanaged

22:05

ones. Go to one password.com/unplugged. That's all

22:07

lower case. Again, support the show. Check

22:10

it out and try it out. It's

22:12

one password.com/unplugged. And that includes all of

22:14

the awesome look and meetups that the

22:16

community has set up. Oh yeah, I'm

22:19

going to go to calling events.com right

22:21

now. Let's go check them out. Okay,

22:23

and something that became clear, and thank

22:25

you to everyone pointing this out, recently,

22:28

we've been experimenting with an earlier lifetime

22:30

by two hours. But we started doing

22:32

that just because it kind of was

22:34

working a little better for a variety

22:37

of boring reasons. But we already... planned

22:39

and set up schedules for the Lup

22:41

600 event with you know the expectations

22:43

of the show would be at the

22:46

time that it's been for years for

22:48

years and years and years yeah so

22:50

just to be clear Lup 600 we

22:52

will be live at the normal time

22:55

which was it was 12 p.m. Pacific

22:57

here in the Pacific Northwest 3 p.m.

22:59

Eastern so that way you can join

23:01

the mumba room and listen along and

23:04

pop in the on air and give

23:06

a little shout I would recommend showing

23:08

up early so that way we can

23:10

sort out mumble issues and audio issues

23:13

which we'll no doubt have. And then

23:15

for the Pacific Northwest Meetup, we're not

23:17

having the meetup at the studio because

23:19

we realize we couldn't really have a

23:22

party and do the show at the

23:24

show at the same time. As awesome

23:26

as that would be if that were

23:28

a thing that we could do, that

23:30

would make for a horrible podcast. So

23:33

what we're gonna do is record the

23:35

show and then immediately after we're gonna

23:37

head over to the point. at our

23:39

local time and we have all the

23:42

details at colony events.com but that also

23:44

means we can accommodate more people since

23:46

we're not having it at the studio.

23:48

So more of the merrier, everybody is

23:51

welcome to join us next week in

23:53

person right here in the Pacific Northwest

23:55

in Smoky Point, come to the point

23:57

at 3 p.m. All the details are

24:00

at Colony events.com. There is like a

24:02

whole bunch of events on there now.

24:04

It's really awesome to see and ours

24:06

for the details is just the one

24:09

that's listed as the Pacific Northwest Meetup.

24:11

We'll put a link to it in

24:13

the show notes as well, but all

24:15

of them are listed over Colony at

24:18

Colony Events. There's a couple new meetups

24:20

here. I think I want to do

24:22

a shadow too. There's a Fostom meetup

24:24

that popped up because Fostom's happening at

24:27

the exact same time. So I think

24:29

that's pretty exciting. And also, maybe this

24:31

is more of a PSA. There's one

24:33

in Melbourne that's happening, which is pretty

24:36

awesome, but it seems to be happening

24:38

March 6th, which I don't know, my

24:40

time math is pretty good, but I

24:42

think that's a little too late to

24:45

join to join Lup 600. make sure

24:47

you're on the right day. Yeah, although

24:49

everybody is welcome to continue to use

24:51

the Colony events.com service to schedule meetups

24:54

forever. Just if you want to meet

24:56

up with other JB listeners in there

24:58

and then you could always boost in

25:00

or write us and have us give

25:03

us a shout out so people know

25:05

to go sign up. We are happy

25:07

to do that. Every time we go

25:09

to a meetup, literally 100%, I'm not

25:11

saying 99.5, 100% of the time, we

25:14

do meetups. The people there say, oh,

25:16

we should do more of this. Even

25:18

if the guys can't come, we should

25:20

do more of this. And then we

25:23

leave, and sometimes they do it, but

25:25

most of the time, they just sort

25:27

of drift apart, because we don't leave

25:29

them with any tooling. But if they

25:32

said it, and we gave them like,

25:34

you know, here, go right here, go

25:36

set up a meetup, I think it

25:38

would actually continue to create some momentum.

25:41

So I invite everybody out there, continue

25:43

to use Colony, and scale and planet

25:45

Knicks. If you want to make some

25:47

plans around there, that could be really

25:50

nice. People could just go there and

25:52

see what's going on. What are people?

25:54

doing, I say take and run with

25:56

it. And we're sorry if there's been

25:59

any confusion around the timing and all

26:01

of this, especially because for a bit

26:03

we were thinking about having our meet

26:05

up here at the studio, but now

26:08

we've decided to have it at the

26:10

pub nearby. Oh, and kids are welcome

26:12

at our meetup. It is a family-friendly

26:14

venue as well. Okay, boys. You have

26:17

been slowly trying to convince me that

26:19

we should do. a free BSD challenge

26:21

on this show. That's right. And you've

26:23

recently provided some documentation to indicate that

26:26

now may be the time. So make

26:28

your case. I will admit I'm on

26:30

the fence. I think you too are

26:32

a little bit more pro than I

26:35

am. I don't know. I think my

26:37

hesitation is I've been down this path.

26:39

I've run free BSD in production. You

26:41

know, I've tried it. It has been

26:43

a bit, but I've tried it. But

26:46

I've tried it. But I've tried it.

26:48

This is like something I've done and

26:50

you guys are like, let's go do

26:52

this. I'm like, yeah, okay, but I've

26:55

tried that and it's all right, you

26:57

know, it's all right, but that's one

26:59

of the reasons I'm over here, you

27:01

know, it's because I tried that. So

27:04

you're saying prospector Chris has been there

27:06

done that and... Prospector Chris knows. Back

27:08

in his day, you know, you love

27:10

seeing... community-driven open source and fundamentally that's...

27:13

Coming in hot and hard. That is

27:15

what Freebie is and I think a

27:17

lot of... Immediately going for the soft

27:19

spot. Immediately. And a lot of other

27:22

people have seen that recently because 2024

27:24

was like a standout year I think

27:26

in terms of like there's just been

27:28

good investments and donations and for Freebie.

27:31

Yeah. Oh. Following AMD and Freebie Foundation

27:33

and Freebie Foundation. Quantum Leap Research have

27:35

announced a $750,000 US. the commitment to

27:37

improve laptop support. That's one news item,

27:40

for instance. And specifically, it looks like

27:42

AMD laptops. Dell, AMD, and framework. Okay,

27:44

okay, okay, okay. So I think, okay,

27:46

maybe we don't have to try it

27:49

immediately. That's maybe a separate case, but

27:51

just in general, I think there is

27:53

more and more reason to think that

27:55

a couple of years ago FreeBSD take

27:58

is outdated. And for that reason alone,

28:00

we might want to make sure that's

28:02

your best argument. Yeah, I do agree.

28:04

They're also working on improving their audio

28:07

stack and maybe creating a graphical installer.

28:09

Those are big changes. They haven't done

28:11

that yet. Well, I mean, it's just

28:13

server rows. I guess it could be

28:15

fun to not have a graph. That

28:18

could be fun. Ghost BSD continues to

28:20

be developed as well as like a,

28:22

you know, desktop focus. That's what I

28:24

was going to ask you is, how

28:27

much, like, is this like, do we

28:29

do free BSD, because that could be

28:31

a fun comparison? Yeah, or maybe you

28:33

could do a mix. You know, I

28:36

think, you know, I think running maybe

28:38

free BSD on a desktop or a

28:40

server will be fine. And then you

28:42

could do ghost BSD as the desktop

28:45

component if you wanted to. That's an

28:47

interesting idea. But I think it's worth

28:49

trying to make sure you use it

28:51

in ways that will test, you know,

28:54

the areas that are being developed and

28:56

improvements. Okay. Plus they've been like they're

28:58

making a bunch of investments in their

29:00

build system and security Investments and doing

29:03

audits and They're working on zero trust

29:05

builds now Look at them go, huh?

29:07

Also reproducible builds. They've got efforts there

29:09

I think at one point at least

29:12

in 2024 they were talking about maybe

29:14

integrating rust. I don't know where that

29:16

conversation went offhand, but It'd be interesting

29:18

to see how ZFS is integrated now.

29:21

They've had it for so long Right,

29:23

yeah, they've got like very nice boot

29:25

environment support that you can get going

29:27

so we should definitely play with that.

29:30

And I have become a fan of

29:32

the centralized config file. And I know

29:34

that's, I mean, to be part of

29:36

how free BSD worked, because a lot

29:39

of that was just went into one

29:41

configuration file, which I really liked about

29:43

free BSD back then. Brent, what are

29:45

your thoughts? Oh, I'm in. Like, I've

29:48

been BSD curious. I don't know. Maybe

29:50

for even two years now. I mean,

29:52

people have been suggesting it to us

29:54

for quite a long time. Yes, we

29:56

do listen to you. Don't worry. But

29:59

also with all these new developments, it

30:01

feels like, I wouldn't we give it

30:03

a shot. Hmm. Okay. All right. So

30:05

let's think about some parameters. Got to

30:08

use it as a server. See what

30:10

it's like to host something. Like a

30:12

whole lab thing or a production thing.

30:14

Yeah. I got to try it as

30:17

a desktop on physical hardware. Ideally, I

30:19

guess. Maybe I'd like to try both,

30:21

I suppose. Yeah. Okay. What do you

30:23

think, Brian? Is there anything, any other

30:26

things that... Well, one question I have

30:28

is how long is the challenge. Hmm.

30:30

How long did we do the 32

30:32

bit? Is that a week? And I

30:35

wonder, and I wonder, and I wonder

30:37

too, should we delay it, so the

30:39

audience could participate? Like we shouldn't, probably,

30:41

we shouldn't launch it. Yeah. Well, and

30:44

also we may want to ask, if

30:46

we have experienced free BSD folks, I

30:48

bet they will have some like pointers

30:50

to things we don't want to miss

30:53

while trying to check it out, to

30:55

evaluate it? So those are the things

30:57

that we're going to need to know,

30:59

and what should we try. And are

31:02

you willing to take a challenge with

31:04

us? I guess boost in or go

31:06

to linuxunplug.com/contact and let us know. And

31:08

I think if we get some good

31:11

feedback, maybe we just launch it in

31:13

episode 600 next week. And then 600

31:15

will be the week. And then 600

31:17

will be the week we launch it.

31:20

The week we launch it. The week

31:22

we'll be the week we launch it.

31:24

And then 600 will be the week

31:26

we'll be the week. It doesn't give

31:28

us a lot of time though. We

31:31

can do an update on 6. And

31:33

we do a midpoint check in 601

31:35

and a conclusion in 602. That could

31:37

work. Yeah, that gives us a couple

31:40

of weeks to try both, you know,

31:42

make sure we have enough time to

31:44

both the server and the desktop stuff.

31:46

It is nice to see this development

31:49

happening over there, you know, it's a

31:51

really great project and it will be

31:53

interesting to look back at it now

31:55

with a Knicks lens a bit more

31:58

than I have in the past. Yeah,

32:00

previously available on BSD, right? I don't

32:02

know. I don't think so. No, but

32:04

what I'm saying is the previous times

32:07

I tried free BSD, I was coming

32:09

at it from like an abunto user's

32:11

perspective, which is totally fine, but I

32:13

think there's more similarities in the way,

32:16

you can figure Knicks in free BSD,

32:18

then there would be with free BSD

32:20

in a bunch too. So there may

32:22

be less of a culture shock this

32:25

time. I don't know. I could be

32:27

totally wrong, but that's my suspicion. That's

32:29

my suspicion. Why have you never tried

32:31

it. Well, I remember poking around at

32:34

Ghost BSD and even Hello Systems when

32:36

we did the 32-bit challenge, because those

32:38

seemed to be some of the only

32:40

ones that supported the very odd CPU

32:43

that I had in the machine that

32:45

was sort of dropped off in my

32:47

front door. But I think mostly it's

32:49

just because we've never done a challenge.

32:52

I don't really have a better excuse

32:54

than that, to be honest. Well, this

32:56

will be great. So this will be

32:58

your first time. I know you must

33:00

have run it before, West, right? Oh,

33:03

yeah. I've had a couple free BSD

33:05

servers over the years. We've probably tried

33:07

it once or twice on the show

33:09

years ago. I think we must have.

33:12

Yeah. Let's be, okay. You got me

33:14

with, I haven't used it in years

33:16

thing. It has been a really, I

33:18

mean, it's probably been, I think free

33:21

BSD on it. Just because you wanted

33:23

to or? Yeah, well, I was trying

33:25

and experimenting. I dabbled with it before

33:27

and I wanted to get like more

33:30

of a sense for, you know, really

33:32

running it. How did it work? Worked

33:34

well. Yeah, had like, I think four

33:36

disks in it. So, you know, had

33:39

ZFS going and I did eventually replace

33:41

it. I think ultimately at that time

33:43

it was in a bun too box

33:45

running LexD with a bunch of containers.

33:48

All right, well, boost in and let

33:50

us know if you're let us know

33:52

if you're in, if you're in. on

33:54

the free BSD challenge and if you

33:57

have any guidance for us as well

33:59

which we can incorporate and then we'll

34:01

officially kick it off next week so

34:03

you don't have to do anything yet

34:06

because we're gonna we're gonna incorporate everybody's

34:08

feedback set all the final parameters next

34:10

week and then officially launch it. Well

34:12

we got to do it because we

34:15

already got hybrid hybrids in. All right

34:17

so you know you want to be

34:19

cool like hybrid join us. Episode

34:24

600 is next week. Can you believe

34:26

it? It feels like a milestone. It

34:28

feels like a rare one. Not many

34:30

podcasts get this far. And if you've

34:32

been on the fence or been meaning

34:34

to boost, this is your time. We'd

34:37

love to hear from some first-time boosters

34:39

and longtime boosters to celebrate episode 600.

34:41

Maybe we'll even put it on the

34:43

charts. Wouldn't that be pretty cool? Strike

34:45

and Fountain tend to be the combo

34:47

the easiest to get started, the least

34:50

amount of friction. That's why we linked

34:52

them in the show notes. But there's

34:54

also things like Breeze. That's B-R-E-E-E-Z. It

34:56

makes it pretty simple to get going

34:58

and you don't need to switch podcast

35:00

apps. Of course, episode 600 is also

35:03

a celebration of our members, Jupiter Dot

35:05

Party to support all the shows, and

35:07

Linux unplug.com/membership to support this specific show

35:09

and get the perks. We would love

35:11

to hear from you next week. Let's

35:13

have a blowout. Episode 600 is going

35:16

to be a special milestone. It's going

35:18

to be a special milestone. Incredible to

35:20

be at $5.99 right now. It feels

35:22

surreal. And I can't wait for 600.

35:24

Well, that said, we do have some

35:26

pretty amazing boosts here. And we do

35:29

have a bawler of a bawler in

35:31

Eric the Red. Yes, Mr. Red writes

35:33

with his 100,000 sets. Thank you for

35:35

all the great shows. During the middle

35:37

of the night, I started to think

35:39

about how amazing open source software is.

35:42

Someday, we'll learn to apply these same

35:44

community-based efforts to things like energy and

35:46

investing and be more prosperous. I hope

35:48

so. I just updated two Knicks machines

35:50

that started on 2305 to 2411 with

35:52

no issues. That is nice. Also, Jess

35:55

did the same. I revived the Dead

35:57

Thaleo. Oh, nice. And went from 20305

35:59

to 2411. I had to change, I

36:01

had to comment out like the, something

36:03

in there I'd like about enabling sound.

36:05

Like you just don't have to do

36:08

that anymore? Yeah. And that was it.

36:10

And then it was after the races.

36:12

It was really awesome. He says Brent's

36:14

comment on not distrohopping since adopting Knicks

36:16

OS has been true with me as

36:18

well. Oh glad it's working well for

36:21

you. Yeah I know and that's why

36:23

that that that that take that we

36:25

covered where it was like even even

36:27

experienced Linux users shouldn't use it on

36:29

the desktop just felt like I really

36:31

missed it really missed it. Yeah there

36:34

are a lot of things that it

36:36

got right but and you know what

36:38

like I also for many years was

36:40

very happy with arch and fodor and

36:42

up into as my desktops and so

36:44

it really it just depends on what

36:47

gear works for you. And thank you

36:49

very much for being our bawler user,

36:51

Eric the Red, we really appreciate you.

36:53

And you got in before we clicked

36:55

over to 600. Thank you very much.

36:57

Turned Ferguson, Busan, with 88,222 cents. Turned

37:00

Ferguson! I was going to write a

37:02

blog post about how Windows isn't running

37:04

for the desktop, but no one would

37:06

read it. Oh, coming in hot. I

37:08

hate building PCs. Well our dear producer

37:10

Jeff boosted in two boosts for a

37:12

total of 28,888 satosias. That's right everybody

37:15

it's that time of year again. Happy

37:17

birthday. He says I find it hard

37:19

to recommend any particular destroy to people

37:21

these days. It really depends on their

37:23

backgrounds. Wait, Chris it's your birthday. Happy

37:25

birthday Chris he says in his second

37:28

boost here. He says I wish I

37:30

could join live today but I'm busy

37:32

earning that Fiat S coin. Have you

37:34

heard of S coin so I can

37:36

buy more Sats? There you go, you

37:38

got a mind that somehow, right? Either

37:41

directly or in the Fiat minds. Thank

37:43

you, producer Jeff, and I agree. Every...

37:45

Distro is it's like yeah a personal

37:47

recommendation based on their work and what

37:49

they're doing know what their expectations are

37:51

on a computer and how they're going

37:54

to use it right it's a personal

37:56

thing these days I know it's weird

37:58

to say that because Windows and Mac

38:00

OS are supposed to be one-size-fits-all but

38:02

I mean right people have preferred tool

38:04

brands so is it that surprised oh

38:07

you're right there's so many different like

38:09

electric drills and what not that's that's

38:11

a great perspective Wes Hybrid Sarcasm comes

38:13

in with 27,500 sets. He's a good

38:15

guy. He's a real good guy. No,

38:17

he's a great guy. Yeah, he is.

38:20

Who's ready for Lup 600? The Central

38:22

Florida Orlando Listening Party has secured a

38:24

location. Nice. Well done. All the deeds

38:26

are at Colony events.com. Even Mike from

38:28

Cota Radio has RSVP. Wow! Isn't that

38:30

great? And that is so great. I

38:33

think hybrid has more pull than we

38:35

do. All you want is the remote

38:37

meetups to be able to join on

38:39

AirMumble via LEP 600. Quick shout out

38:41

to the check-in or something like that.

38:43

Oh, oh, he wants us to give

38:46

what? Yeah, hybrid's trying it today too.

38:48

So ideally you go to Jupiter broadcasting.com/mumble.

38:50

You get the mumble app installed and

38:52

then you get a microphone and you

38:54

get headphones on and you get headphones.

38:56

And you get in the quiet listening.

38:59

or there's like a joint cue actually,

39:01

and we'll kind of go through and

39:03

make sure your mic's working and then

39:05

we'll bring it in. So I think

39:07

what you're saying, Chris, is for LUP

39:09

600 we'd love to hear from a

39:12

variety of the listening parties happening? Just

39:14

a little quick report on what the

39:16

scene looks like and who's there? And

39:18

in that case, you know, maybe it's

39:20

a USB microphone and a pair of

39:22

headphones if possible, and then, you know,

39:25

people can come by or maybe headphones

39:27

aren't possible. I don't possible, I don't

39:29

know. I don't know. Thank you hybrid.

39:31

It's always great to hear from you.

39:33

Why is Papa John boosted with 22,222

39:35

cents? Things are looking up for all

39:38

my duck! Plus one for the tuxies,

39:40

I'm ashamed to admit that... I didn't

39:42

vote in 2024. I was away from

39:44

podcast for a few months and I'm

39:46

just getting caught up. The Tuxes finally

39:48

convinced me to set up image though.

39:51

What do you guys use for monitoring

39:53

server stats like CPU and hard drive

39:55

temps? Unraid has temps in its GY,

39:57

but I'd love to pipe that data

39:59

into somewhere that I'll actually see it.

40:01

Thanks for all the great work. I

40:04

plan on messing around with Cashy OS

40:06

and Cashy OS and maybe. Even a

40:08

little bit of Nick's OS sometimes here.

40:10

Oh, why is Papa John? We would

40:12

love to hear your thoughts on that.

40:14

And don't ever worry about falling behind

40:17

and boosting on an old topic. A.

40:19

It is good signal for us to

40:21

know where the audience is at in

40:23

the listening backlog. So when people boost

40:25

from an old episode, it's good for

40:27

us to know where people are at,

40:29

just from like a content release schedule,

40:32

so we know what our expectations are.

40:34

But two, a good topics always we're

40:36

talking about. So don't ever feel bad

40:38

about coming in on something from a

40:40

something from a previous episode from a

40:42

previous episode. And I would love to

40:45

hear your thoughts if you do try

40:47

Kashi or Nick's OS. The tuxies I

40:49

often hear have been how people like

40:51

to finally decide I'm going to go

40:53

try that thing. So we are working

40:55

on something and I'm liking what's cooking.

40:58

We don't have a full recipe yet

41:00

for next year's tuxes, but if it

41:02

does, if we pull it off, it's

41:04

going to be different, but hopefully better

41:06

and at a whole new level. I

41:08

think, right? Yeah. Set a second boost

41:11

just to let me know that my

41:13

split failed so just thank you for

41:15

the info and uh sorry about that

41:17

I will rejuckle some witty after I

41:19

got a chill come on what I

41:21

want I'm motivated to fix that all

41:24

right well distro stew was motivated sent

41:26

in five booths for a total of

41:28

twenty three hundred and one sets you're

41:30

doing a good job per year-end prediction

41:32

about a major platform rolling out a

41:34

declarative system I think it's coming I've

41:37

been playing with some small but interesting

41:39

projects around this. For example, there's a

41:41

meta pack. There is also Deck Man

41:43

and... comp manager. I'll have different takes

41:45

on the solution, but I like where

41:47

they're going. So I'm just checking out

41:50

meta pack here. It looks like it's

41:52

a declarative package manager, multi-backend declarative package

41:54

manager, hence the name. So it allows

41:56

you to maintain a consistent packages across

41:58

multiple machines, setting up a new system

42:00

with preferred package managers. Makes it much

42:03

easier. So it sounds almost like a

42:05

meta package manager, which seems quite... quite

42:07

qualifies but I'm inclined to want it

42:09

to so I'm definitely going to look

42:11

into it you know so it is

42:13

active it's been yeah there's people doing

42:16

stuff right around there and it looks

42:18

like it's been around for at least

42:20

two years and quick follow-up to our

42:22

previous boost because we totally forgot to

42:24

actually answer what do we use to

42:26

monitor things like CPU and hard drives

42:29

and temperatures we did well yeah net

42:31

data for a long time although there's

42:33

been some troubling developments there recently Oh,

42:35

you guys on self-hosted talked about a

42:37

great little option that's relatively new with

42:39

Bezel, right? Yep. I would say the

42:42

last episode and the episode before that,

42:44

really the episode before that we get

42:46

into it, and then we have a

42:48

brief follow-up at the top of the

42:50

most recent episode of self-host. It's the

42:52

last two episodes kind of get into

42:55

this topic. Net data is still probably

42:57

my favorite, but you know, Bezel is

42:59

a little bit lighter, a little bit

43:01

more limited, but also just totally free

43:03

and open and open, it isn't trying

43:05

to go for like you know like

43:08

a cloud monetization strategy. Depending on like

43:10

retention needs and scale you know you

43:12

can do like a cloud native thing

43:14

with the Prometheus agent and Prometheus and

43:16

Grafana or something like that or influx

43:18

TB is totally fine too. This is

43:21

an area I would love to also

43:23

take in input from the audience if

43:25

there's other cool tools out there some

43:27

real cool tools that do this that

43:29

I don't know about that kind of

43:31

do the net data thing. There's a

43:34

lot of options. Yeah I know but

43:36

there's going to be some good ones.

43:38

I am sure the audience has some

43:40

killer picks in this killer picks in

43:42

this in this area. Gene Bean comes

43:44

in with a row of Knicks. I

43:46

don't get not touching your Knicks config.

43:49

I'm always... using new tools and doing

43:51

new stuff. And therefore, I mess with

43:53

my config a lot. Additionally, I keep

43:55

most things in Knicks because my system

43:57

isn't reproducible. Otherwise, as a result, I

43:59

forget to document something otherwise. Yeah, that's

44:02

true. That's a good point. That is

44:04

the nice self-documented. If I set up

44:06

via my flag, I won't forget about

44:08

it. You can check out github.com/Gene Beans

44:10

slash dots for my commit history, for

44:12

example. That's cool, Gene. Thank you. Thank

44:15

you. checked my configs. Well I think

44:17

I was thinking about this because I

44:19

saw the boost come in and I

44:21

think to some extent we were almost

44:23

saying you know like Gene isn't running

44:25

into the problems that some other folks

44:28

are seemingly so we were kind of

44:30

addressing problems maybe the gene isn't having

44:32

to the same extent and I do

44:34

touch my config but it's mostly like

44:36

a creative in terms of adding a

44:38

few packages or tweaking an option on

44:41

which felt maybe qualitatively different than what

44:43

like the article we were talking and

44:45

fighting with their configs you know like

44:47

actually like i'm i'm debugging or something

44:49

which is very different than just like

44:51

adding a package i agree like when

44:54

i was when i was getting a

44:56

thaleo going again and i just like

44:58

commented out the sound stuff enable sound

45:00

like versus like writing a new helper

45:02

function to set up config for multi-machine

45:04

or something but in the last episode

45:07

when we talked about when we last

45:09

touched our configs i was literally using

45:11

the last modified date which is December

45:13

for me and i just think i

45:15

get to a point And then anything

45:17

that I add, I either do via

45:20

Nickshell just to try it out or

45:22

a flat pack. Yeah, and you are,

45:24

you do use Nickshell, and I was

45:26

going to say, from seeing some of

45:28

your Nickshells, I would say, you have

45:30

already accumulated a lot. Like you probably

45:33

have 95% of the tools you're going

45:35

to use at all? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah,

45:37

I really do. You know, that's the

45:39

one thing about using it every day

45:41

for so many years. You're going with

45:43

like the six gig, everything installed, version

45:46

of a bunch of things. It's minimal

45:48

in my own way. But that's also

45:50

been the promise of an ex-confic was

45:52

that the things you... solved would just

45:54

pay dividends in the future. So yeah,

45:56

you put a bunch of upfront time,

45:59

but then it gets less and less

46:01

and less as time moves on. And

46:03

I've seen that at least to be

46:05

true in my particular use case. Yeah,

46:07

I wonder though, perhaps, I mean, I'm

46:09

looking at Gene's setup here. You know,

46:12

he, I mean, I think he's just

46:14

learning. And as he learns, he's kind

46:16

of refactoring and building it better. And

46:18

so that's why he's touching it more

46:20

frequently. It's working. Yeah, that makes sense

46:22

too. You can be kind of, there's

46:25

different modes that you end up in.

46:27

Yeah. And if you're actively developing. Thank

46:29

you, Gene. I will say, too, something

46:31

that works okay for me is if

46:33

I'm going to, like, make a tradeoff

46:35

between, like, I was gonna try to

46:38

manage the Knicks, but right now I'm

46:40

going to just not, is sometimes I'll

46:42

just leave comments in my, somewhere in

46:44

my Knicks, so that they're documented there,

46:46

of, hey, I'm managing this elsewhere. Right?

46:48

Morning. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I caught

46:51

my brother with his Knicks config, like

46:53

he was making a few changes, and

46:55

I was just looking over his shoulder.

46:57

And there's a bunch of to-do items

46:59

in his Knicks configs, like, fair this

47:01

out later. So I think that's a

47:03

really nice approach, too. Shapiro, eh? What

47:06

do you guys like? Shapiro may boost

47:08

in with 4,321 sets. Well be dipped.

47:10

Hello. Talking about Nixon. Have you guys

47:12

checked? Replet. It's an online development platform

47:14

that gives you a virtual machine with

47:16

pre- installed Knicks packages, depending on what

47:19

language you want. And it's basically an

47:21

in-browser IDE. Most of their code base

47:23

is MIT licensed. I've been using it

47:25

for some years now, and it's a

47:27

really nice way to dip your toes

47:29

into Knicks. You know, I've tried it

47:32

a little while ago. I've used it

47:34

a few times, but I actually thought

47:36

about using it with Knicks. That's great.

47:38

Yeah. Thank you for the tip. Okay,

47:40

here's a fun question. Okay, follow-up boost.

47:42

All right. So about the old to-do

47:45

list. Yeah. Do you ever have moments

47:47

when you're in the shower? Yes. Some

47:49

situation where you just can't get to

47:51

your phone or a notepad? Yes. And

47:53

you remember something you have to do?

47:55

an idea you really want to capture.

47:58

Yes. Do you have a solution for

48:00

that? Shower Linux, please. You know, I've

48:02

thought about this so many times. So

48:04

I do sometimes bring my phone into

48:06

the shower now and I have kind

48:08

of above the shower, I put a

48:11

magnetic mount and then I just slap

48:13

the phone up there and it doesn't

48:15

really get wet. And then if I

48:17

have to, I can document it. And

48:19

that's just because I've really lost some

48:21

good ones. I've lost some real good

48:24

idea babies, and I do not want

48:26

to lose any more idea babies. So

48:28

I do that, but I have thought

48:30

about the whiteboard thing. I know that's

48:32

another route. People go. Brent, how do

48:34

you capture your best shower thoughts? Well,

48:37

I would say the shower is definitely

48:39

like my sacred think tank, but I've

48:41

gone full psychopath mode and I got

48:43

a permanent waterproof marker and I just

48:45

write stuff on the walls. And so

48:47

if you saw my washroom, just... Oh

48:50

my god, are you serious? Do you

48:52

take a picture? No, I'm not serious.

48:54

Oh my god, that's good, I love

48:56

that visual. But I have certainly thought

48:58

of it because, like, really, if I'm

49:00

in this, like, deep thinking mode, which

49:03

happens for me all the time in

49:05

the shower, I want the simplest solution

49:07

possible. So even the fact of, like,

49:09

picking up my phone and having to

49:11

unlock it with wet hands and then

49:13

finding the app and then creating a

49:16

new note that is... That's too much

49:18

friction. So I would love something simple.

49:20

I've heard of people having just like

49:22

a stick-on waterproof notepad that they can

49:24

have in the shower just like to

49:26

temporarily document it there and then once

49:29

you've, I don't know, dry off, you

49:31

can figure out where else to put

49:33

it. But I would love to hear

49:35

some solutions to this because yeah, they're

49:37

all just vanishing thoughts unless I can

49:39

somehow hold on to them, which never

49:42

happens. It is a real shame. Again,

49:44

I don't have a great system for

49:46

that. I can sometimes capture on the

49:48

phone. Yeah, sometimes Do you have a

49:50

way to capture great shower thoughts? No,

49:52

I've been thinking about this in the

49:55

car. I think the car one gets

49:57

me more often. Yeah, I can imagine

49:59

you driving up to the studio. You

50:01

got like an hour. You're like, somehow

50:03

the shower, I have a little, it's

50:05

like I can, I can, if I'm

50:08

willing to stop the thread, I can

50:10

kind of keep the, you know, insight.

50:12

Yeah. I definitely have when like rushed

50:14

the shower a little bit, finished up

50:16

and then like dried off quickly, got

50:18

down, just wrote it down and got

50:20

back to finishing up to, you know,

50:23

the whole shower routine. Too much information,

50:25

but I would love to know how

50:27

people are encountering that. I'm taking a

50:29

lot of different sacrifices. Nothing's working. Can

50:31

you do like whiteboard paint on your

50:33

shower wall? I like that. Brett was

50:36

thinking permanent marker, which I think are

50:38

good idea. But I also don't want

50:40

it to be permanent. I don't know.

50:42

Somewhat Justin came in with 4,000 and

50:44

4 sets. Fun will now commence. It

50:46

says he just wanted to say, thank

50:49

you for your mention of Bazzite. I

50:51

picked up an ACES RIG rally. Oh,

50:53

that's the, that's the machine my son

50:55

has. On sale, and thanks to the

50:57

show, I already knew I needed some

50:59

Linux and Bazzite was a great option.

51:02

What a perfect match for that laptop.

51:04

Those things are really meant for gaming.

51:06

Good call. The install was fairly easy

51:08

according to the benchmarks. It seems to

51:10

perform better than the default OS, which

51:12

was Windows. That's great. These handhelds are

51:15

so fun. Excited for the coverage of

51:17

SteamOS. Oh man, I'm so excited to

51:19

see where SteamOS goes too. When it

51:21

starts getting distributed, which they've kind of

51:23

been hinting at, we're going to be

51:25

all over that. Maybe we can use

51:28

it to wrote a server. Of course

51:30

we're going to try. A web geek

51:32

boosted with 644 sets. Why you gotta

51:34

put numbers and letters together? Why can't

51:36

you just go for yourself? Hey guys,

51:38

when I hear tuxies, I always think

51:41

of the Oscars. So I'd like to

51:43

suggest aligning the annual tuxies to occur

51:45

on the same day as the Oscars.

51:47

Put our tuxes on and everything? Like

51:49

we don't already. Right. This moves maybe

51:51

away from the holiday season, but it

51:54

keeps it a night of celebration and

51:56

fanfare. Paring the two adds a layer

51:58

of fun, spotlighting open source achievements alongside,

52:00

you know, in stream culture, plus it

52:02

taps into the shared excitement of award

52:05

season. You know, the only flaw here

52:07

is, it actually almost be kind

52:09

of fun in a way to do it. To do

52:11

it the old way one last time?

52:13

Because the Oscars are on March 2nd.

52:16

Oh. Yeah. But if we could get, because all

52:18

we'd have to do, I wonder, could we

52:20

rejigger the survey a little bit and just

52:22

do it one last time for fun? Now

52:24

I almost want to do it. Isn't that

52:27

weird? What is wrong with me? I want

52:29

to kill it, and then like, now I

52:31

want to do it again for fun. Well,

52:33

because the stakes are different. You're right. You're

52:35

right. I'd almost be willing to do

52:38

it if people are interested. just

52:40

like ironically almost like the like the

52:42

spring tuxies well boosted for 600 a

52:44

week at the yeah we'll figure it

52:46

out let us know if you're interested

52:49

because otherwise maybe I'm just being

52:51

a jackass it really is a stupid idea

52:53

but if it is right it's the dumbest

52:55

idea I've had in weeks isn't it

52:58

don't you think I think it is

53:00

go check the notes you've had a

53:02

lot of ideas this week both of

53:04

bad week apparently Amazing! Amazing! Outy me

53:06

right now on this show! Thank you

53:09

everybody who boosted in. We really appreciate

53:11

it. Also thank you everybody

53:13

who streamed Sats as you

53:15

listen. 38 of you streamed

53:17

those Sats and collectively y'all

53:19

stacks 56,429 Sats. And then when

53:22

you combine that with our boosters,

53:24

we had 47 people participate

53:26

in the value for value

53:29

process for episode 599. And

53:31

collectively... We stacked 363,195 stats for

53:33

the show. Thank you everybody

53:35

very much. We have Links to

53:37

Strike and Fountain. Fountain is a

53:40

new podcast app. You can also

53:42

listen to our live stream. You

53:44

can see our pending episodes in

53:46

there. And there's more features coming

53:49

to the show soon that will

53:51

be available to podcasting 2.0 apps.

53:53

So there'll be even more reasons

53:56

to listen to Linux unplugged in

53:58

a new podcast app. podcast.com for

54:00

all of them. And thank you everybody,

54:02

including our members, who supported episode 599.

54:05

All right, so for our pick segment

54:07

this week, we have two picks. We

54:09

have two picks. We've been really just

54:11

coming in with the picks hot and

54:14

heavy recently. There's just so many good

54:16

apps. It's mostly a pick-based show, and

54:18

then we do some other segments on

54:20

the site. I think if anybody skips

54:23

this, they're missing out, especially the last

54:25

few weeks. And I think one of

54:27

you found Olive Tin this week. No,

54:29

no, it came from a booster last

54:32

week. Oh, oh, oh, oh. And we

54:34

just, right. And we wanted to make

54:36

sure we kind of brought it forward

54:38

again. So Olive Tin is a safe

54:41

and simple access to predefined shell commands

54:43

from a web interface. And so picture

54:45

a interface that would work with big

54:47

buttons on a mobile device or on

54:50

your desktop. and you have just things

54:52

like ping the internet or check demesage

54:54

logs delete old backups restart a docker

54:56

container just buttons to do stuff you

54:59

combine that with a mesh network and

55:01

bam yeah or you know I could

55:03

see on my tablets there could be

55:05

like a little like hey wife I

55:08

need you to take care of stuff

55:10

screen and it brings this up and

55:12

there's buttons where she hits a button

55:14

and it restart and it restarts the

55:17

server yeah I like that could be

55:19

paired with your stream deck for instance

55:21

could totes probably do that hmm hmm

55:23

I would like physical buttons, so that

55:26

could be kind of nice. All right,

55:28

and then this next pick is Open

55:30

TV. And I have really been enjoying

55:32

Ursats TV, which lets me have a

55:35

television network inside my home. You create

55:37

custom live channels using your own local

55:39

media, and they show up as IPTV

55:41

streams, and you can have different IPTV

55:44

players that can pull in like the

55:46

scheduling data, Ursats also generate scheduling data.

55:48

So I can see when Seinfeld's playing

55:50

and Star Trek The Next Generation, Roseanne,

55:53

and I've got the 1980s. battle star

55:55

Galactica on there because it's just great

55:57

in retro like it's it is like

55:59

having your own cable TV network inside

56:02

your own home we've talked about it

56:04

before and we haven't really mentioned a

56:06

great way to enjoy this on your

56:09

desktop but I don't want to set

56:11

up jellyfin just to enjoy that is

56:13

yeah or like maybe you could tune

56:15

VLC into one of the particular streams

56:18

if you're a maniac open TV has

56:20

been recently rewritten and there are also

56:22

They're making a plea for contributions via

56:24

GitHub, Patreon, PayPal, or crypto. But it

56:27

is a desktop app that runs on

56:29

the various desktop operating systems. It gives

56:31

you a front end to any IP

56:33

TV system. Doesn't have to be ERSAT's

56:36

TV, but that's what I'm using it

56:38

for. Yeah, this looks pretty sleek. And

56:40

it is a DVR as well. So

56:42

it'll import the M3U file and the

56:45

metadata for the playlist. It'll record while

56:47

you're watching. It can record multiple streams

56:49

at once. They have crazy optimize it

56:51

for super low RAM usage with really

56:54

fast UI. Okay, well now I want

56:56

to try this for me to like

56:58

record my favorite hits from your Ursat

57:00

stream. Yeah, yeah. And you know, there's

57:03

also a surprising amount of public IPTV

57:05

streams. Yeah, that's true. Especially like Europe

57:07

News. Like there's a lot of European

57:09

news stations that just make an IPTV

57:12

stream of their station. There's not as

57:14

many in the states, but there are

57:16

a couple. And it's kind of, and

57:18

there's a couple of public broadcast stations

57:21

that do it as well. So you

57:23

don't even have to have any service

57:25

in particular. But if you have our

57:27

Sats TV and you want something to

57:30

watch it and DVD on your desktop,

57:32

you can use open TV to sit

57:34

in front of that. And it's just

57:36

a really nice app that just plugs

57:39

in to that whole ecosystem, the M3U

57:41

file, the XML playlist, as well as

57:43

then also the back-end recording. And then

57:45

they've optimized to be super fast and

57:48

responsive. And responsive. So it's open dash

57:50

TV. So it's open dash TV. and

57:52

we'll have links in the show notes

57:54

over at linuxunplug.com/599.com while we're here license

57:57

check what are our pick licenses today?

57:59

Oh you're right! Thank you. I've been,

58:01

you know what, I've been really trying

58:03

to, we're trying to, but we're trying.

58:06

I've been trying to add them to

58:08

the notes. I did not add them

58:10

to the notes this week. Well, I

58:12

can report on all of 10 here.

58:15

Looks like we've got a, all of

58:17

10 is a GPL 3.0. Very, very

58:19

nice. And Open TV is GPL 2.

58:21

So we've got some very, very fossi

58:24

picks for you this week. Very, we

58:26

should have to the template. Yeah, that

58:28

is a great idea. I will do

58:30

that. Well, it looks like your Ursats

58:33

TV here is a license. I'm not

58:35

sure about Z-lib license. Have you heard

58:37

of this one before? Better check the

58:39

FSF list. I mean, I know Z-lib.

58:42

I like Z-lib a lot. It's extremely

58:44

simple. It's four paragraphs, not even. Really?

58:46

Yeah worth looking at I don't know

58:48

if this applies but I don't know

58:51

if the SFF would approve. Yeah, see

58:53

this is paying dividends already Remember we

58:55

want to hear your thoughts on if

58:57

you would be willing to crowd fund

59:00

either the Mecca comet or the Librux

59:02

next Have you been sufficiently burned or

59:04

is the dream of a Linux phone

59:07

still alive in your heart? I genuinely

59:09

would like to know And then ultimately

59:11

we need your guidance on the free

59:13

BSD challenge. Are you willing to participate?

59:16

What requirements or rules should we follow

59:18

that we haven't mentioned in the show

59:20

already? And any kind of notes or

59:22

details that we should know, already, and

59:25

any kind of notes or details that

59:27

we should know is Linux guys that

59:29

are going to be using free BSD

59:31

for the first time, or in Brent's

59:34

case, the very first time? I feel

59:36

like that's a big thing to bite

59:38

off. So please let us know. See

59:40

you next week same bad time same

59:43

bad station technically we're going back to

59:45

the original time noon Pacific 3 p.m.

59:47

Eastern so we'll be live at our

59:49

regular time and of course if you're

59:52

in a podcasting 2.0 app it'll be

59:54

in your stream and well before the

59:56

show starts we always open up mumble

59:58

will help you troubleshoot your audio issues,

1:00:01

you know, making sure everything's working and

1:00:03

you get to listen it on the

1:00:05

stream too. Plus, I don't know, you

1:00:07

know, maybe you can't make every live

1:00:10

stream. I bet 600's gonna be especially

1:00:12

fun. Yeah. Thank you so much for

1:00:14

listening to this week's episode. Even if

1:00:16

it's not 600, we still had a

1:00:19

good time. We hope you did too.

1:00:21

And of course, links to what we

1:00:23

talked about there at slash 599. They're

1:00:25

at slash 599. Thank you. Some

1:01:11

breaking news, that was a news eagle.

1:01:13

Yeah, this month Deepen 25 came out,

1:01:15

which is the district, we don't really

1:01:17

follow that closely, but they are implementing

1:01:20

some big steps, for its immutability, powered

1:01:22

by OS trees. No! And then their

1:01:24

own system, they're calling solid. Deepens going

1:01:26

immutable? Yeah, and it's crazy. I gotta

1:01:28

look this up. Where is this? You

1:01:30

should be able to, it's in the

1:01:33

release notes for 25? But yeah, they're

1:01:35

mounting the core directories, read only, that's

1:01:37

just powered by OSTRI, and then they're

1:01:39

doing the like, you know, atomic style

1:01:41

reboot into the new system approach. I

1:01:43

don't know if it's like for everything,

1:01:45

but they're at least starting to adopt

1:01:48

it. The solid, the deep and immutable

1:01:50

system, focuses on the stability and security

1:01:52

of the system. It provides users with

1:01:54

a stable, reliable, and easy to maintain

1:01:56

experience through the technology such as read

1:01:58

only protection, atomic updates. and management.

1:02:01

Yeah, and also got got you know, if it

1:02:03

fails to boot, it automatically roll back to

1:02:05

the previous version. to the previous It's happening, folks.

1:02:07

folks. It's happening. I mean, I just a

1:02:09

better way to compute. way to Come on. Come on.