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So, that's just boys being boys. That's

19:00

just boys being boys. Now on the

19:02

rare occasion that David would make a

19:04

friend in school or in the neighborhood,

19:06

Francis, his mother, would inevitably interfere in

19:08

the relationship, not allowing any children in

19:11

the house or putting very strict time

19:13

limits on her son's socialization with other

19:15

kids. It's like, you don't want them

19:17

at home? Well, that's what I never

19:19

get with these kind of parents. It's

19:21

like... So you're abusing your kid, you

19:23

clearly don't like them, you don't like

19:25

being a parent, you don't like the

19:28

responsibility of being a parent, but then

19:30

you like won't allow that kid to

19:32

go out of your response, like let

19:34

him go away. So you're not responsible,

19:36

yeah. But instead, that to me shows

19:38

that you are a, like, you're a

19:40

monster that just likes hurting this child.

19:42

Yeah, absolutely. It's not that you are

19:45

not capable of being a, it's like,

19:47

you are just. You're getting enjoyment out

19:49

of it. You are evil. And you

19:51

just enjoy hurting something smaller than you.

19:53

And it's like, and you should be

19:55

fucking locked up. So David's friend Robert

19:57

Gorebeek said, Francis and Elwood had lained

19:59

down specific rules. It was like you

20:02

have. to make an appointment before you

20:04

could go over and see him. The

20:06

fuck. Instead, Francis would make sure to

20:08

fill David's afternoons. She signed him up

20:10

for a violin and ballet lessons, which

20:12

at this time made him a bigger

20:14

target for bullying because we're in the

20:16

50s again, and these are seen as

20:19

two very unmaskulent activities to do. Which

20:21

you almost wonder if that was like

20:23

another layer of her cruelty? Yeah. I mean,

20:25

putting him in ballet in the 50s.

20:27

Pretty cool, including your kids ballet now.

20:29

Fuck yeah, everybody's ballet. I put everybody

20:31

in ballet But back then but like

20:33

everybody had it had it It just

20:35

it we're in the 50s where masculinity

20:38

is looked out in a very different

20:40

way. Yes, and it's like that's he's

20:42

going to be targeted and you know

20:44

that and if he's not passionate about

20:46

ballet which it doesn't sound like he

20:48

was then you're really doing a detriment

20:50

here it's like if he's passionate about

20:52

ballet then yeah but otherwise for what

20:55

purpose but you're just doing this to

20:57

kind of like get him one out

20:59

of your hair but making sure he's

21:01

not doing something that fulfils or him

21:03

or makes him happy yeah yeah well he's out

21:05

of your hair yeah which is like another

21:07

layer of fucked up now these were

21:09

exacerbated by how she would dress him as well.

21:12

She would make him dress in like

21:14

very formal outfits. His friend there

21:16

said they always dressed him up like

21:18

some fancy pants and the kids on

21:20

the block were always pounding the hell

21:22

out of him. Which is so shitty because

21:25

it's like he's obviously not choosing this.

21:27

No, and it's just like fucking A,

21:29

this one has a strange pathology. No,

21:31

it's true, and it's just like God,

21:34

just not being mean to people. Now,

21:36

obviously due to a variety

21:38

of factors, David struggled to develop

21:41

positive social skills. You don't say.

21:43

And developed a reputation for now

21:45

inappropriate and cruel behavior. Because he's

21:48

also being shown cruel behavior. You

21:50

show a child cruel behavior, they

21:52

will then show others cruel behavior.

21:55

That is cause and effect. Like

21:57

that just is. Yep. And so

21:59

unable to. bond with boys his own

22:01

age, because that wasn't working. David would

22:03

socialize with the girls in the neighborhood.

22:06

They were often in the beginning very

22:08

sympathetic and like pitied him a little

22:10

bit and were like, you know what,

22:13

let's just like try to help him

22:15

out. You know, just girls being girls,

22:17

girls being like, come on, like take

22:19

care of you. But while the neighborhood

22:22

girls were definitely more patient with him.

22:24

Even their sympathy had limits, obviously. Yeah,

22:26

everybody does. One girl recalled, he usually

22:29

had my sympathy, but then he'd do

22:31

something cruel, like twisting the head off

22:33

of some girl's doll, and he'd get

22:36

that stupid smile on his face like

22:38

it was a prank. So it's like

22:40

he's doing things like that, and they're

22:42

like, dude, we're trying to help you

22:45

out, and you're like, you know, doing

22:47

some kind of prank like that. But

22:49

it's like not, because he's not been

22:52

socialized to know what is of his

22:54

age, you know, and you mean what

22:56

a typical prank of his age is?

22:58

Well, and if you're ripping the heads

23:01

off of dolls, that's like alone, that's

23:03

one thing, like that's a very annoying

23:05

boy thing to do. Yeah. But if

23:08

it goes hand in hand with you,

23:10

also pulling the wings off flies, I'm

23:12

going to be a little scared of

23:14

you. Yes, exactly. You know. His, and

23:17

it gets, and it started getting worse

23:19

because his cruel and inappropriate behavior started

23:21

getting increasingly sexual in nature. I had

23:24

a feeling that was coming. And soon

23:26

he found that the girls around him

23:28

were perfect targets. O'er and o'er. Years

23:30

later he told psychiatrist Dr. Ralph Allison,

23:33

I pulled down a little girl's pants

23:35

for the first time when I was

23:37

eight years old. Eight years old. That's

23:40

a baby. Mm-hmm. In Allison's estimation, by

23:42

the time he was 10 years old,

23:44

David had, quote, learned to take out

23:46

his anger sexually. And that was by

23:49

the time he was 10. Yeah. Which

23:51

would eventually become one of the driving

23:53

forces of his personality as an adult.

23:56

I'm sure you start that 10 years

23:58

old. And it was never addressed. Like

24:00

it's like. It was not addressed until

24:02

he saw the law for it. It

24:05

was never addressed in any kind of

24:07

like medical way. Yeah, they should have

24:09

gotten past the doors at the hospital.

24:12

Yeah, when he was a child, this

24:14

should have been taken care of. Yeah.

24:16

By the time he was 14 years

24:18

old, he had committed his first sexual

24:21

assault against one of his younger family

24:23

members. The assault resulted in him being

24:25

committed to the Napa State Hospital and

24:28

he was housed with other sex offenders

24:30

there. Upon his release, he returned to

24:32

his parents' house, but everything just kept

24:35

going downward. When he wasn't in school,

24:37

he started spending a lot of time

24:39

alone in the woods. Oh God. Before

24:41

long, he was suspected of committing burglaries

24:44

and homes in and around Santa Cruz.

24:46

The next year, when David was in

24:48

the 10th grade, he ran away from

24:51

home and hid out for a few

24:53

days in the family cabin in Redwood

24:55

Grove. And this disappearance was the last

24:57

straw, because so the school expelled him.

25:00

because he stopped going to school. Oh,

25:02

okay. Okay. Now, a year after being

25:04

kicked out of school, he was in

25:07

trouble with the law again, and this

25:09

is awful. After he committed a sexual

25:11

assault against two cousins, not his cousins,

25:13

but they were cousins. A pair of

25:16

cousins. An eight-year-old and a three-year-old. Oh,

25:18

God. He met them at Diamond Heights

25:20

Park, and according to Dr. Allison's evaluation,

25:23

he threatened the two of the knife,

25:25

which marked the first time that he

25:27

used a weapon in an assault. which

25:29

indicates a very severe escalation in violent

25:32

behavior. Yep. And this again, this was

25:34

when he was 15, maybe 15 or

25:36

16, around there. Yeah. He was quickly

25:39

arrested for the assault and sentenced to

25:41

the California Youth Authority at Preston. Do

25:43

you remember that? We covered, yeah, we

25:45

covered the Preston School, right? Preston School

25:48

of Industry. Oh. Yeah. Go back to

25:50

that episode, where he was held until

25:52

his 18th birthday. Oh, fuck. After he

25:55

turned 18, he was transferred to Napa's.

25:57

hospital for observation and after 90 days

25:59

he was determined to no longer a

26:01

threat. I don't know about that there

26:04

this this is a story of many

26:06

failures. It usually is. He could have

26:08

been stopped many times and no one

26:11

had to die. Yeah no one had

26:13

to die here at all. I don't

26:15

hate that. Now looking back his juvenile

26:18

record which contained a number of incidents

26:20

that you know if we looked at

26:22

now... in 2025, they would be the

26:24

most giant red flags. Five arrests for

26:27

sexual assault, one escape from juvenile detention,

26:29

a long history of bragging about sexual

26:31

assaults to other inmates, all of that

26:34

would now be looked at as like,

26:36

oh no, this is going to ask

26:38

like a big way. Yeah, like let's

26:40

keep him locked up. And his personal

26:43

history included several experiences and characteristics that

26:45

are now associated with antisocial personalities. and

26:47

serial murders in particular, including a history

26:50

of bedwetting and cruelty to animals. So

26:52

it's like he's got all the red

26:54

flags. He's ticking all the boxes. If

26:56

psychiatrists had known then what we know

26:59

now, they would have had every reason

27:01

to believe that David Carpenter would pose

27:03

a severe threat to those around him.

27:06

And it kills me that they didn't.

27:08

Now in 1950, so actually most of

27:10

what he was going through when he

27:12

was younger, it was in the 40s,

27:15

so I was wrong about the 50

27:17

and worse. Even worse. In 1950, when

27:19

he was 20 years old, Carpenter found

27:22

work as an office assistant and messenger

27:24

for the H.B. Thomas Company on Battery

27:26

Street in San Francisco. One day in

27:28

mid-summer, he ended up picking up a

27:31

girl he knew who was hitchhiking to

27:33

a friend's house, and he offered to

27:35

drive her the rest of the way.

27:38

So he knew this girl. As they

27:40

drove, he said, do you actually mind

27:42

if I make a quick stop at

27:44

my house? Yes, I do. And she

27:47

was like, yeah, totally. Yeah, why would

27:49

she take anything of that? Once inside

27:51

the house, though, he started to become

27:54

sexually aggressive with her. And she was

27:56

like, no. And then she was like,

27:58

I want to leave. But

28:01

he said no, you're not going

28:03

to leave the girl only managed

28:05

to escape after fighting him off

28:07

and locking herself in the bathroom

28:09

and Climbing through a very small

28:11

window that left outside That's literally

28:14

what nightmares are made and she

28:16

had to run somewhere and contact

28:18

the police Now he was quickly

28:20

picked up on a charge that

28:22

he quote willfully and feloniously made

28:25

an assault upon a female under

28:27

the age of 18 Would the

28:29

intent to have and accomplish the

28:31

act of sexual intercourse upon said

28:33

female? He pled not guilty. It

28:36

was taken to trial where he

28:38

was acquitted. What the fuck? Hello

28:40

1950s for real. Hello now. Ralph

28:42

Allison's notes though indicate that David

28:44

quote made no attempt to deny

28:47

the allegations against him and had

28:49

been quite per cooperative and asked

28:51

only that he be placed in

28:53

a facility where he could receive

28:55

help. So he even asked for

28:57

help with 1950s. They were like

29:00

nah you're good. Just get on

29:02

it. Get on out of here.

29:04

Yeah in 1955 David ended up

29:06

dating and then marrying a 19

29:08

year old woman named Ellen Ellen

29:11

heatle I believe it is the

29:13

peer the pair met at in

29:15

Daily City a few years earlier

29:17

and when David when they met

29:19

David was briefly dating her sister

29:22

Willimina Oh, low. Yeah. When she

29:24

broke off their relationship after only

29:26

a few dates, he turned his

29:28

attention to Ellen, and within a

29:30

few months, they were married. That

29:33

is not Girl Code. No. That

29:35

is not Sister Code. No. Sister

29:37

Code goes above Girl Code. It

29:39

certainly does. And they were married

29:41

at San Francisco City Hall. Less

29:43

than a year later, Ellen gave

29:46

birth to their first child, Michael.

29:48

and the family moved to a

29:50

small house in West Lake, and

29:52

David found a steady job as

29:54

a shipping clerk there. Two years

29:57

later, Ellen gave birth to their

29:59

second child, Gabrielle, who was... in

30:01

1960 by their third child, Cersey.

30:03

By this point in his life,

30:05

his attitude towards women was pretty

30:08

fucking clear. He, without fail, portrayed

30:10

himself as the victim of women.

30:12

Like, women were to blame. His

30:14

mother was to blame. Therefore, women

30:16

were to blame. He basically said

30:19

everything he did, it was going

30:21

to fall upon women, not him.

30:23

He was never to be placed

30:25

blame upon, it wasn't him. And

30:27

it's like, fuck you, dude. You're

30:29

your own person. Plenty of people.

30:32

I'm not saying he had a

30:34

great, he had a terrible life.

30:36

No, but you can't make excuses

30:38

for your behavior once you become

30:40

an adult. No, it's like, based

30:43

on your childhood. I'm sorry, you

30:45

got to look at people who

30:47

make that, and again, he's in

30:49

a different like time. how you

30:51

were raised on how you act

30:54

as an adult. Like you can't,

30:56

but if you're, you can't hurt

30:58

people. Like that's not, it just,

31:00

it drives me crazy. And it's

31:02

like so many of these guys

31:05

will be like, well, I kill

31:07

women because of my mom. Get,

31:09

get over it. Like really, you're

31:11

going to kill women because of

31:13

your mom. Not all women are

31:15

your mom, and you should be

31:18

able to make that different differentiation.

31:20

were very poorly understood in 1950,

31:22

so they weren't exactly like analyzing

31:24

David's symptoms. Right. Instead, like his

31:26

psychiatrist Ralph Allison, who we've cited

31:29

here before, he was focusing more

31:31

on like finding effective treatment. Yeah.

31:33

Which, yeah, that's good. But like

31:35

you also need to figure out

31:37

what the fuck is going on

31:40

here. Well, and also there's just

31:42

not treatment for people like this,

31:44

really. No. And... From Allison's perspective,

31:46

Dr. Allison, he said he thought

31:48

it came down to David's stutter.

31:51

He said, a lot more than

31:53

that. If he could get proper

31:55

therapy for the stammer, we might

31:57

be able to prevent further catastrophes

31:59

of this sort. I think that's

32:01

a wild point of view. Yeah.

32:04

I also think that is a

32:06

very wild point of view. I

32:08

think that's absolutely bonkers. I think

32:10

that's the most 1950s point of

32:12

view I have ever seen in

32:15

my life. A psychiatrist might be.

32:17

I think if you could just

32:19

speak clear. that you wouldn't want

32:21

to kill people. It's like, no,

32:23

I don't think that's the driving

32:26

force. I think that's part of

32:28

his struggles. Sure. And especially that

32:30

that was not taken as something

32:32

that like they worked through with

32:34

him or made him accept and

32:37

be able to, you know, work

32:39

through. Right. It was treated as

32:41

like. We're ashamed of you, like

32:43

that's awful. Of course that's going

32:45

to affect somebody. Not to this

32:47

extent. I think there's other things

32:50

here at play and I think

32:52

we should maybe look at them.

32:54

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your first little spoon order. Between

35:56

the responsibilities of his new job

35:58

and now his growing... family, he

36:00

was feeling like he was under

36:02

a lot of pressure, which left

36:04

him with a lot of rage.

36:06

Oh, good. Because this is not

36:08

a man who can handle even

36:11

the slightest inconvenience in his life.

36:13

The only thing that seemed to

36:15

keep his anger in check, according

36:17

to Ellen, his wife at the

36:19

time, was his need to have

36:21

sex at least three times per

36:23

night. Oh, honey. Yeah, that's I

36:25

was like, whoa, that's wild. And

36:27

it's like, fucking, poor Ellen, she's

36:29

three children has three children and

36:32

she's dealing with this fucking manchild

36:34

who is like abusive, uncontrollably angry.

36:36

And I, I just like wonder

36:38

what what he presented to her.

36:40

I know, you know, to get

36:42

like to get him to marry

36:44

her, you know, I mean, like

36:46

it is so weird how We

36:48

hear about these men who have

36:50

these awful childhoods and they have

36:52

a lot of issues with girls

36:55

and women. And then they find

36:57

one woman who they are able

36:59

to woo. Yeah. You know. And

37:01

I think it's because they see

37:03

that there's an end result where

37:05

they can have the control they

37:07

want. So they're cunning enough to

37:09

know that they have to put

37:11

some effort in in the beginning

37:13

to, you know, like the means

37:16

justify the end kind of thing.

37:18

Yeah. So I think it's like,

37:20

look, the mask falls. That feels

37:22

like it was probably the scenario.

37:24

And I, and I feel so

37:26

badly for Ellen, because like it

37:28

sounds like she was just completely

37:30

entrapped in this. Well, and remember,

37:32

this wasn't a time where she

37:34

could even seek a divorce. Exactly.

37:36

That's the other thing. Keep it

37:39

in mind. And she's got three

37:41

kids. Yeah. But there were times

37:43

that even that wasn't enough for

37:45

him. And he would come explosively

37:47

violent with her. And then he

37:49

would claim to have no recollection

37:51

of it. So he's like blocking

37:53

out. Or he's just lying about

37:55

it and being like... I don't

37:57

want to take responsibility for that,

37:59

so I'm going to pretend it

38:02

didn't happen. I'm sure probably, like

38:04

I'm sure like that counts for

38:06

some instances, but I do believe

38:08

that some people are so scary

38:10

that they do blackout. Oh, I'm

38:12

sure, yeah. But I don't think

38:14

it accounts for every instance. No.

38:16

Now in mid-July 1960, he ran

38:18

into an old friend, Lois Dandradi.

38:20

Lisa Renna. You guys, like, you

38:23

know, she's been a soap opera

38:25

actress forever. Days of our lives.

38:27

She's on the Real Housewives of

38:29

Barily Hills. She was. I haven't

38:31

watched it in forever. But she

38:33

was on it. She dances on

38:35

TikTok. You might remember her mother

38:37

Lois. You passed away recently, I

38:39

think. Yeah, a couple years ago.

38:41

She was adorable. Lois was the

38:43

cutest. And they'd seemed like they

38:46

were. They were super wildly close.

38:48

Wild. Yeah. Yes, Lois did go

38:50

through a lot because um you

38:52

might be saying I'm sorry back

38:54

it up Why are we mentioning

38:56

Lois in this story? Yeah, and

38:58

why are we mentioning her as

39:00

an old friend? She was they

39:02

worked together I think right? Yeah,

39:04

so they had met through mutual

39:06

acquaintances a few years earlier and

39:09

again they had like and they

39:11

had gone to coffee Together a

39:13

couple times in the past like

39:15

you know, they just knew each

39:17

other like their friends. Yeah, it

39:19

was whatever Lois had been on

39:21

her way to work one morning

39:23

when David offered her a ride.

39:25

That's what it is. Again, they're

39:27

friends. Cool, David's offering me a

39:30

ride. Yes, she's no reason not

39:32

to accept it. Why the fuck

39:34

would I care? As he'd done

39:36

a few years earlier, David asked

39:38

whether Lois would mind if they

39:40

made a quick stop. But this

39:42

time, he said, hey Lois, I

39:44

gotta pick up my wife Ellen

39:46

and my new baby. Disarming. So

39:48

of course Lois is like, of

39:50

course you can, that sounds lovely.

39:53

I'd love to see the babe.

39:55

But the more they drove, the

39:57

more Lois began to wonder whether

39:59

they were actually going to pick

40:01

up his wife and baby. Finally,

40:03

David pulled over on a side

40:05

street and Lois immediately knew something

40:07

wasn't right. She later said, by

40:09

then I was really nervous, so

40:11

I started to get out of

40:14

the right-hand side of the car

40:16

and I started to run. Wow.

40:18

Carpenter managed to reach Lois before

40:20

she had gone far and he

40:22

dragged her back to the car.

40:24

Oh my God. And she's unable

40:26

to move, and he pulled out

40:28

rope and a knife from the

40:30

glove compartment and threatened her to

40:32

keep quiet. And later she said,

40:34

he told me to be quiet.

40:37

Now if I was quiet, he

40:39

wouldn't kill me. But if I

40:41

made any noise, he would. Now

40:43

the entire scene was fucking terrifying

40:45

and completely confusing to Lois, who'd

40:47

known Carpenter for years. And she

40:49

was like, I'd never seen him

40:51

behave violently. Right. His violent shit

40:53

was contained to his home. Right.

40:55

Behind closed doors. Just going to

40:57

say. Everyone else saw this pretty

41:00

normal. Like. God. Yeah. Like they're

41:02

just David. Like what? So I

41:04

can't imagine knowing someone for years.

41:06

Yeah. And then having them snap

41:08

on you like this? That must

41:10

be. And like it would be

41:12

paralyzing. Yeah. And she said it

41:14

was. She was like, I literally

41:16

didn't know what to do. I

41:18

was like, what are you talking

41:21

about? You'll kill me? Like what?

41:23

So she later said perhaps David

41:25

went crazy. That's a quote. I

41:27

was so terrified. I don't think

41:29

I moved after that. And although

41:31

she wasn't planning on moving at

41:33

that point because she was terrified,

41:35

she was looking around and scanning

41:37

her surroundings, trying to look for

41:39

anything that could help her get

41:41

out of this situation. So she's

41:44

desperately searching for a sign of

41:46

anyone around her, and David reached

41:48

into the back seat and grabbed

41:50

a hammer. At the same time

41:52

that he was doing that lowest

41:54

spotted a car a few dozen

41:56

yards away, and without thinking she

41:58

threw her hand out and slammed

42:00

down on the car horn. Just

42:02

did that's the only thing she

42:05

can make. But carpenter immediately slashed

42:07

at her with. knife he had

42:09

slicing into her hand. He ended

42:11

up lacerating tendons in two of

42:13

her fingers. Now despite that injury,

42:15

which is a pretty fucking massive

42:17

injury, Lois managed to get the

42:19

door open and she tumbled out

42:21

and hit the ground running. David

42:23

Carpenter got out and fucking chased

42:25

her at full speed. Oh my

42:28

god. This must have been horrifying.

42:30

Absolutely. He did, he caught up

42:32

with her and he raised, he's

42:34

right behind her running after her

42:36

and he raised the hammer to

42:38

hit her in the head, but

42:40

just as he came down with

42:42

it, she threw her hands up

42:44

to deflect the blow from the

42:46

hammer and the hammer struck a

42:48

watch she was wearing and shattered

42:51

it. But... There was only a

42:53

brief moment of luck because he

42:55

raised the hammer again and brought

42:57

it right down on her head

42:59

and it made contact So she

43:01

knocked it right to the ground

43:03

and he struck her Five more

43:05

times in the head with the

43:07

hammer. I didn't realize that. Oh,

43:09

yeah. I thought she's got out

43:12

of this like unharmed. Oh, no,

43:14

she got Ruthlessly beaten in the

43:16

head with this hammer. Holy shit

43:18

barely conscious She managed to scream

43:20

for help which caught the attention

43:22

of a military police officer, Jewell

43:24

Wayne Hicks, who happened to be

43:26

driving down the narrow street at

43:28

the time. Whoa, what are the

43:30

odds. And also a military police

43:32

officer caught this man doing this,

43:35

but we have eight stories of

43:37

murder to tell. Yeah. Huh. That

43:39

should be your first. Not like

43:41

knowledge of how many times this

43:43

is a failure to keep an

43:45

absolute animal. Locked up ticking box

43:47

number one. Yeah. Whoa. So Hicks,

43:49

the military police officer, slammed on

43:51

his brakes, got out and ran

43:53

in the direction of the car

43:56

in the screams, and he was

43:58

holding a riot baton in one

44:00

hand and a 45 pistol in

44:02

the other. And that's the way

44:04

we got out of the car

44:06

folks. That's how we get out

44:08

of the car for one of

44:10

these scenes. At first, he couldn't

44:12

see the two people on the

44:14

ground since there was a car

44:16

door in the way. Right, right.

44:19

But he could hear the sounds

44:21

and he said he immediately knew

44:23

what was happening. By the time

44:25

he made it to the car,

44:27

Carpenter was on top of Lois

44:29

still hitting her with the hammer.

44:31

Jesus. And Hicks said, even when

44:33

he saw me coming down the

44:35

hill, he kept hitting her. So

44:37

he saw this man and just

44:39

kept hitting Lois. So that makes

44:42

you like, like, honestly, question, if

44:44

he isn't a blind range at

44:46

this. Yeah. It's so scary. Because

44:48

that is, and I think, I

44:50

mean, I think it's how you

44:52

define a blind rage. Like I

44:54

still think he knows what he's

44:56

doing is wrong. But like, you're

44:58

looking at the police officer and

45:00

you're not stopping? I think he

45:03

is singularly focused on his rage.

45:05

He's an animal. And the focus

45:07

of his rage. Yeah. And it

45:09

just doesn't matter. But that's so

45:11

wild to think of somebody's thought

45:13

process. Because then Officer Hicks shouted

45:15

for him to stop, obviously, and

45:17

that caused David to jump up

45:19

and run. But he ran at

45:21

Hicks, swinging the hammer at him.

45:23

He's a madman. And he said

45:26

he was, quote, screaming in rage.

45:28

Oh, that's horrifying. So he's just

45:30

an animal. Yep. And when the

45:32

officer finally managed to successfully fend

45:34

off the hammer with his baton,

45:36

Carpenter pulled out a quote, fountain

45:38

pen tear gas gun and fired

45:40

it and hicks his face. Bitch

45:42

what? So he came fully prepared

45:44

to incapacitate someone. I had no

45:46

idea that this was this. That's

45:49

the thing. I also didn't know

45:51

that. They briefly discussed this out

45:53

of dinner on housewives. Briefly. Over

45:55

sushi, I believe. Holy fuck. The

45:57

gun produced a large plume of

45:59

smoke, which confused Hicks momentarily, but

46:01

he wasn't quite sure what happened.

46:03

He just got hit in the

46:05

face with this tear gas pen,

46:07

which is nothing new for a

46:10

military police officer. No, and he

46:12

said he recognized the sound of

46:14

a gunshot. And instinctively raised his

46:16

pistol and fired in the direction

46:18

of where Carpenter was. And Hicks

46:20

didn't know where he was at

46:22

the time, but he still managed

46:24

to hit Carpenter twice, once in

46:26

the abdomen and once in the

46:28

leg, which knocked him off his

46:30

feet and caused him to shout

46:33

that he surrendered. So when you

46:35

guys hear this, and he was

46:37

on top of this woman. Hitting

46:39

her with a hammer repeatedly. What

46:41

would you say is the end

46:43

result that he was probably looking

46:45

for by doing that either rape

46:47

or murder? Both I would say

46:49

you don't hit someone five times

46:51

in the head with a hammer

46:54

not assume that they're gonna die.

46:56

Yep. He was trying to murder

46:58

her. Yep. 100% Yeah, definitely murder.

47:00

I was just questioning. He was

47:02

sure he was also gonna do

47:04

that, but this is a murder.

47:06

that he failed to commit. And

47:08

you guys know how we feel

47:10

about attempted murder. So with Carpenter

47:12

incapacitated, Hicks went back to his

47:14

car and radioed for backup, which

47:17

arrived very quickly. Lois was taken

47:19

to the hospital. She was treated

47:21

for a fractured skull, which was

47:23

broken in two places. Her skull

47:25

was shattered in two places. It's

47:27

remarkable that she survived this. Yeah.

47:29

And she also had severe lacerations

47:31

on her hands and face. After

47:33

multiple surgeries, during which metal plates

47:35

were placed in her skull, and

47:37

tendons were grafted in two fingers,

47:40

and nearly two months of hospitalization,

47:42

she recovered. Unreal. But she never

47:44

regained full use of those fingers.

47:46

In her statement of police, Lois

47:48

detailed what happened from the moment

47:50

Carpenter picked her up, including that

47:52

he had told her, quote, I

47:54

have a sex quirk. Just moments

47:56

before attacking her. A quirk? A

47:58

quirk. That's not a kink. Like

48:01

a quirk? David Carpenter was taken

48:03

to Letterman General Hospital. where surgeons

48:05

removed the two bullets from his

48:07

body before, I know unfortunately, before

48:09

he was cuffed to a bed

48:11

and he recovered there before being

48:13

transferred to San Quentin like a

48:15

little over a week later I

48:17

think it was to await his

48:19

hearing. Okay. This it turned out

48:21

would take much longer than expected

48:24

because due to his injuries and

48:26

his claims of mental illness. It

48:28

was going to go a lot

48:30

longer than just like chart 10,

48:32

let's go. In the two months

48:34

that followed, he was evaluated twice

48:36

by psychiatrists before finally being indicted

48:38

on September 22nd, where a grand

48:40

jury returned four counts of assault,

48:42

that if convicted would have put

48:45

him in jail for 30 years.

48:47

Which like cool, cool 30 years,

48:49

but like where's the attempted murder?

48:51

Yeah, where's the attempted murder charge?

48:53

Right. Like are we really pretending

48:55

that he wasn't trying to kill

48:57

her? He fractured her skull in

48:59

two places and hit her over

49:01

five times with a hammer. And

49:03

sliced her hands open. Like he

49:05

attacked her with a knife and

49:08

a hammer. Yeah. Are we all

49:10

okay? At his arraignment in October,

49:12

Carpenter pled not guilty and his

49:14

lawyer indicated their intent to plead

49:16

insanity as a defense. But you

49:18

already got evaluated. Yeah. Instead, just

49:20

as they were preparing to go

49:22

to trial. He accepted a plea

49:24

deal from the prosecution and pled

49:26

guilty to one count of assault

49:28

with a deadly weapon. Um, I'll

49:31

say, I understand plea deals for

49:33

certain things. They pissed me off,

49:35

but I got them. This? Yeah,

49:37

I don't see this one. I

49:39

feel like they would have got

49:41

him on all those four counts.

49:43

Well, and Judge Oliver Carter wasn't

49:45

certain he would accept the deal.

49:47

And instead, he ordered Carpenter to

49:49

a 90 day hold in federal

49:52

prison where he was going to

49:54

be examined thoroughly by psychiatrists. And

49:56

on March 9th, 1961, Carpenter was

49:58

back in front of a judge

50:00

after having been evaluated many times

50:02

at San Quentin and after reading

50:04

the report. reports, which diagnosed Carpenter

50:06

as a sociopathic personality, the judge

50:08

deems David a quote personality who

50:10

should be locked away in the

50:12

interests of society. That's completely correct.

50:15

Thank you, sir. Given the brutality

50:17

of the attack and his past

50:19

offenses, he sentenced him to 14

50:21

years in federal prison. Okay, like

50:23

I wish it was the full

50:25

30 though? Yeah. But... Then for

50:27

some reason the judge kind of

50:29

like softened somewhat after announcing the

50:31

ruling all over recommended the parole

50:33

board conduct routine evaluations and release

50:35

carpenter quote at any time he

50:38

is considered rehabilitated Oliver like I'm

50:40

sorry what the fuck you literally

50:42

said he's a threat to society

50:44

and yeah like hey pearl board

50:46

like keep it keeps on that

50:48

check it out if you feel

50:50

like it's cool that day just

50:52

let him out yeah Be cool

50:54

man. Don't be all cool. He

50:56

was diagnosed as a sociopathic personality.

50:59

Yep. And tried to kill this

51:01

woman. Yeah, and this officer. Tried

51:03

to kill Lois and this officer.

51:05

Yep. So after the sentence was

51:07

cast, Ellen filed for divorce. Oh,

51:09

good. Listing their separation as July

51:11

12th, 1960, the night of the

51:13

attack on Lois. Wow. Good for

51:15

her. That is women supporting women.

51:17

Hell yeah. And she cited extreme

51:19

cruelty. as a reason and wrongfully

51:22

inflicting upon her grievous mental suffering.

51:24

Oh, so she, I guess you

51:26

could file for divorce back then

51:28

as a woman. The divorce was

51:30

finalized on August 27th 1962 and

51:32

Carpenter was ordered to pay $1

51:34

per month in child support and

51:36

$1 per month in alimony. She

51:38

got three kids. Yeah, she was

51:40

awarded the couple's assets, including the

51:43

house. That's good. And granted her

51:45

request, they granted her request for

51:47

restraining order to prevent David from,

51:49

quote, annoying or molesting the children.

51:51

Oh, God. Yeah. I don't know

51:53

if that means what that word

51:55

means. There's terms, legal terms that

51:57

that can mean like. Bothering, which

51:59

is weird. I know, but I'm

52:01

not sure where how that one

52:03

was used. But I think is

52:06

what I'm talking about. Okay, but

52:08

he is also he has like

52:10

pedophilic tendencies. So it's like I

52:12

that who knows right, but I

52:14

am not positive. Yeah. Bombas

52:25

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52:27

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52:29

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52:31

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52:38

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52:40

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wondering at checkout. Now

53:00

in the meantime, David was sent

53:02

to McNeil Island's correctional facility and

53:04

began serving his sentence on April

53:06

12th, 1961. Now, he applied for

53:08

parole in 1964, but it was

53:10

unanimously rejected. Good. In April 1969,

53:12

however, he came up for parole

53:14

a second time, and his petition

53:16

was granted. Bad. On the grounds

53:19

that he'd served the minimum nine-year

53:21

sentence. What about the maximum though?

53:23

We don't want to talk about

53:25

that today. And also like, okay,

53:27

we're not gonna like so he

53:29

just served his minimum sentence You're

53:31

gonna let him out. So it's

53:33

all good regardless of what kind

53:35

of person he is So now

53:37

he's a free man Christ. And

53:39

he moved in with his stepbrother

53:42

William and began taking welding classes

53:44

at the local vocational school. I

53:46

feel as though we shouldn't offer

53:48

people like that welding classes. Let's

53:50

not give him tools. I don't

53:52

think. Yeah, in his free time

53:54

he started attending group therapy on

53:56

the recommendation of his parole officer

53:58

and it was there that he

54:00

met Helen. Bad question Mark? David

54:03

and Helen began dating that spring.

54:05

And on August 8th, 1969, they

54:07

were married at City Hall. He

54:09

gets that woman to marry him

54:11

quickly. Yeah. William Carpenter, his stepbrother,

54:13

was the witness to the marriage.

54:15

It appears little is known about

54:17

this period of his life. He

54:19

remained in regular contact with his

54:21

probation officer at this point, and

54:23

he was meeting all the conditions

54:26

of his parole for a while.

54:28

So he's probably laying low at

54:30

this point. Yeah. Then rather suddenly,

54:32

he cut off all communication with

54:34

the probation officer and the parole

54:36

board that December. Huh. And he

54:38

had like years left on his

54:40

probation, so there's no reason for

54:42

this. And around the same time,

54:44

Helen, having been driven to what

54:46

author Robert Grace Smith referred to

54:49

as quote, the edge of a

54:51

nervous breakdown, left California on a

54:53

long trip to Hawaii and just

54:55

left her husband behind. Damn. Yeah.

54:57

Who knows what that poor woman

54:59

endured? What was going on? The

55:01

fact that she left the entire

55:03

state of California tells us everything

55:05

we need to know. Yeah. Now

55:07

without anyone watching over him it

55:10

didn't take long before David Carpenter

55:12

began losing control of his rage.

55:14

On the evening of January 27th

55:16

1970 he went out for a

55:18

drive on highway 280 towards Santa

55:20

Cruz and at some point the

55:22

driver of a passing car who

55:24

was a young blonde woman caught

55:26

his attention and for no explicable

55:28

reason she became the focus of

55:30

his fucking rage. Oh no. Without

55:33

any warning to this driver. David

55:35

sped up beside her and forced

55:37

her car off the road. Oh,

55:39

that's so scary. She's just driving.

55:41

That is so scary. Terrified, she

55:43

jumped out of the car and

55:45

ran into the underbrush, quickly losing

55:47

him, and he stood at the

55:49

side of the road and called

55:51

out to her and threatening voices.

55:53

What the fuck? But when he

55:56

heard no sounds, he got back

55:58

in his Volkswagen beetle and steered

56:00

the car back onto the highway.

56:02

That poor girl. I just can't

56:04

imagine later in life being like

56:06

that wouldn't happen ended Did she

56:08

ever even realize that it was

56:10

him? I don't know. You know?

56:12

Yeah, that's the thing. It's like,

56:14

that's why. Imagine thinking back to

56:16

that being like, oh my God.

56:19

Like, and you just read this

56:21

and you're like, holy fuck. A

56:23

short time later, a little past

56:25

10 p.m. He found himself driving

56:27

on Highway 9 towards Boulder Creek,

56:29

where the only other car on

56:31

the road easily caught his attention

56:33

again, because he's pissed. who was

56:35

19-year-old Cheryl Lynn Smith. Thinking the

56:37

man was drunk, she shouted at

56:40

him. She was like, fuck you,

56:42

dude. But Carpenter ignored her, and

56:44

they pulled over to the side

56:46

of the road, and he started

56:48

like, a quote-unquote, evaluating the damage.

56:50

Oh my God. So Smith got

56:52

out of her car and was

56:54

looking over the damage as well,

56:56

and then Carpenter's hand shot out

56:58

and grabbed her by the neck.

57:00

I'll have to kill you if

57:03

you don't come with me. Oh,

57:05

God! Like, what the fuck? So,

57:07

and this is, like, graphic, I

57:09

apologize. Carpenter dragged her into the

57:11

brush where he literally tore off

57:13

her clothing and violently sexually assaulted

57:15

her. As Cheryl tried to get

57:17

out of his grasp, he sliced

57:19

her arm with his knife partially

57:21

severing the muscles and rendering it

57:23

temporarily useless. Oh my God, the...

57:26

The force that would take, yeah.

57:28

And she said, so she's trying

57:30

to get away from him. He

57:32

does this. And then she said

57:34

she finally was like, I'm just

57:36

gonna look at him because she

57:38

wasn't looking at him. And she

57:40

said she looked at him and

57:42

she said she was stunned because

57:44

she said, all I had seen

57:47

up till that point was this

57:49

like violent scary man. And she

57:51

was like, suddenly he looked totally

57:53

different. What? Suddenly she said his

57:55

features had softened and he spoke

57:57

to her. with a pronounced stutter

57:59

suddenly, which he didn't have before.

58:01

Uh-huh. And she said to her,

58:03

Wilderman, he looked at her and

58:05

said, look, you're hurt and bleeding.

58:07

Let me follow you home and

58:10

I'll bandage you up and I'll

58:12

promise not to, if you promise

58:14

not to call the police. That's,

58:16

and like said it in like,

58:18

look, you're hurt and bleeding. Like,

58:20

not like, oh my God, I

58:22

hurt you. It was like, oh

58:24

my God, like, how did that

58:26

happen? But it softened into like,

58:28

oh no, I'm good. Like it's

58:30

good. And then she managed to

58:33

get back to her own car

58:35

and drove away. And he just

58:37

let her. Oh, that poor girl.

58:39

19 years old. But as she's

58:41

driving home, she notices that he's

58:43

driving behind her. Oh no. And

58:45

he was keeping distance, but he

58:47

was behind her. And so she

58:49

saw a large hotel in the

58:51

distance. So she drove in the

58:53

direction of what she was hoping

58:56

would be help. and he was

58:58

driving behind her the entire way.

59:00

So she gets into the very

59:02

well-lit parking lot and he sped

59:04

off. So he was planning on

59:06

following her right to her house.

59:08

But she managed to write down

59:10

his license plate. Smart! She immediately

59:12

reported the attack to police and

59:14

gave them the license plate number

59:17

and she described her attacker as

59:19

white, 30 to 35 years of

59:21

age, 5 feet 10 inches, 160

59:23

pounds and brown hair. That same

59:25

night an anonymous caller reported witnessing

59:27

what appeared to be a fender-bender

59:29

accident on Highway 9, which is

59:31

that. So later it was discovered

59:33

that Cheryl was the second woman

59:35

that he had attacked that day.

59:37

The first was a woman named

59:40

Wilma Joyce. Now this isn't the

59:42

blonde woman who ran away from

59:44

him. This is another one. Oh,

59:46

so they think it's two. Really,

59:48

it was three. Yeah. So far.

59:50

That afternoon Joyce had returned home

59:52

from a shopping trip. to find

59:54

Carpenter waiting in her house with

59:56

a shotgun. Nope! Nope! Yeah. Walked

59:58

in from shotgun. to him sitting

1:00:00

in her home with a shocker. Do

1:00:03

you know that's one of my biggest

1:00:05

fears? That is the scariest thing I've

1:00:07

ever heard. That's all, fuck. That's

1:00:09

literally horror movie shit. That is

1:00:11

horror movie shit. And he forced her

1:00:13

to leave with him in her car

1:00:16

and the two drove for a short

1:00:18

time before he sexually assaulted her and

1:00:20

then let her out of the car. What?

1:00:22

This is awful too. In the days after

1:00:24

that, he kidnapped and assaulted two

1:00:26

other women. One of whom had

1:00:29

a toddler in the car with her.

1:00:31

Oh. And stole a car from a

1:00:33

third woman. Why? Was he not

1:00:35

stopped? This is crazy. When they

1:00:37

were interviewed by police, all the

1:00:39

women identified David Carpenter as their

1:00:41

attacker. Like they knew his name?

1:00:43

Unanimously, they were able to identify

1:00:45

him. Oh, okay. Now, Carpenter was

1:00:47

arrested at a motel in Modesto

1:00:49

on February 3rd, 1970, after a

1:00:51

week-long man, Hunt, conducted by the

1:00:53

Santa Cruz County Sheriff's Department. And

1:00:55

this is when he should be

1:00:57

put away forever. Because he has

1:00:59

a violent past that he's now

1:01:01

continuing. He has just assaulted numerous.

1:01:03

women. Numerous women after

1:01:05

assaulting Lois to a police

1:01:08

officer and just dodging parole.

1:01:10

Yep. So at the time of his arrest

1:01:12

the district attorneys in

1:01:14

Santa Cruz County and

1:01:16

nearby Calaveras County filed

1:01:18

charges against him for

1:01:20

attempted rape, rape, kidnapping,

1:01:22

and assault. And because

1:01:24

he had been on parole at the

1:01:27

time with four years left on his

1:01:29

sentence, he was placed in Calaveras County

1:01:31

Jail pending a transfer to a prison

1:01:33

where he could serve out the rest

1:01:35

of his sentence. So he has now

1:01:38

also violated parole. These are all

1:01:40

huge charges. Massive. David was held

1:01:42

at Calaveras County Jail for

1:01:44

two months until he managed to

1:01:46

escape on the night of April 26th. According

1:01:48

to the press, he was being held

1:01:50

in a cell with four other men. and

1:01:52

they managed to cut through the bars

1:01:54

and all five of them escaped out of

1:01:57

a skylight. And that's why we don't let

1:01:59

prisoners just... hang out together in their

1:02:01

cells. Also, they were unsure how

1:02:03

they cut through the bars, but

1:02:05

a spokesperson for the sheriff's office

1:02:08

said they may have used a

1:02:10

hack saw blade. I'm sorry, where

1:02:12

the fuck did they get a

1:02:14

hack saw blade? My question exactly.

1:02:16

These violent prisoners. Yeah, had access

1:02:18

to a... Hacksaw blade. Just oops,

1:02:20

we forgot the Hacksaw blade was

1:02:22

in there. I'm a normal bitch.

1:02:24

I don't have access to a

1:02:26

Hacksaw blade. Yeah. I've never committed

1:02:29

a violent crime the fuck. And

1:02:31

how would they, one, have a

1:02:33

Hacksaw blade and to have enough

1:02:35

time to Hacksaw through bars? Like

1:02:37

that's gonna also make some noise.

1:02:39

No one was looking at them?

1:02:41

No one was checking? I wonder

1:02:43

if they like bribed to guard

1:02:45

or something. Yeah. Now, the good

1:02:47

news is all five of them

1:02:50

were rounded up the following day.

1:02:52

And while the other four were

1:02:54

returned to jail to await their

1:02:56

trials, David Carpenter was transferred to

1:02:58

Soledad prison. On July 17th, a

1:03:00

grand jury in Santa Cruz indicted

1:03:02

Carpenter for rape, attempted rape, kidnapping,

1:03:04

and assault. District Attorney Peter Chang

1:03:06

told the press, right now Carpenter

1:03:08

is serving a minimum five-year sentence.

1:03:11

If we can make the aggravated

1:03:13

kidnapping charge stick, the term will

1:03:15

be increased to life. Let's go.

1:03:17

Already serving a sentence of one

1:03:19

to 25 years for the charges

1:03:21

in Calaveras County on October 8th,

1:03:23

Carpenter pleaded guilty to one count

1:03:25

of rape and one count of

1:03:27

armed robbery, and in exchange he

1:03:29

was given a sentence of five

1:03:32

years. That's bullshit. They should be

1:03:34

ashamed of this. Absolutely they should.

1:03:36

All these deaths are on their

1:03:38

hands. 100% Now, despite Peter Chang,

1:03:40

thinking that he would be able

1:03:42

to lock him up for life,

1:03:44

David would only spend nine years

1:03:46

at Soledadad Prison, until being paroled

1:03:48

to a halfway house in late

1:03:51

May 1979. You guys did this

1:03:53

before, though. Yeah, you did it

1:03:55

before, and it didn't work out.

1:03:57

He just failed. What? And just

1:03:59

like the last time he was

1:04:01

released down on parole, way too

1:04:03

soon, it didn't take long before

1:04:05

he returned right back to his

1:04:07

old habits. Yeah, I bet. Yep.

1:04:09

Now on May 21st, 1979, he

1:04:12

was released on parole, and by

1:04:14

that time Helen had divorced him.

1:04:16

And he was to remain on

1:04:18

probation until 1982. So he was

1:04:20

sent to live at Reality House

1:04:22

West, which was a halfway house

1:04:24

for federal prisoners. transitioning back into

1:04:26

society, which is not something he

1:04:28

should have been. No. As part

1:04:30

of his parole conditions, he was

1:04:33

required to find a job. So

1:04:35

he started taking classes at the

1:04:37

vocational center and eventually began participating

1:04:39

in courses in computer repair. Okay.

1:04:41

Around this time, he also took

1:04:43

up hiking around Santa Cruz. No.

1:04:45

And developed a particular fondness for

1:04:47

the trails on Mount Tam. For

1:04:49

sure. Oh, I've heard of Montana.

1:04:51

Yeah. Yeah. It's a popular hiking

1:04:54

spot in Marin County, about 10

1:04:56

miles outside San Francisco. At the

1:04:58

foot of the mountain was a

1:05:00

small community of renters, including John

1:05:02

and Eda Kane. Now, in the

1:05:04

morning of August 19th, 1979, Eda

1:05:06

Kane was preparing for a four-hour

1:05:08

hike that the couple had planned

1:05:10

to take together that afternoon. Unfortunately,

1:05:12

John's arthritis was acting up that

1:05:15

morning, so he was unable to

1:05:17

take the hike with Edda. She

1:05:19

was a very experienced hiker, so

1:05:21

she just decided to go alone.

1:05:23

Yeah. Several hours passed and Edda

1:05:25

had still not returned home. This

1:05:27

caused John to be very anxious.

1:05:29

His wife was very skilled, but

1:05:31

it was getting dark. So he

1:05:33

called the Sheriff's Department and reported

1:05:36

it, and deputies were sent out

1:05:38

immediately to look for Edda. Now,

1:05:40

Sheriff's deputies, along with a search

1:05:42

and rescue team and packs of

1:05:44

dogs, combed the mountain all night.

1:05:46

but by dawn they still hadn't

1:05:48

found Edda. And her car was

1:05:50

still in the parking lot where

1:05:52

it had been all night. That's

1:05:54

chilling. The only other car that

1:05:57

John noticed in the parking lot

1:05:59

that morning, other than the members

1:06:01

of the search team, was a...

1:06:03

Volkswagen Beatle that had been there

1:06:05

for previous evening. Always a Volkswagen

1:06:07

Beatle. Yep, and he drives one

1:06:09

around 1.30 that afternoon, one of

1:06:11

the dogs discovered at his body.

1:06:13

It was a short distance off

1:06:15

Rock Springs Trail. It's very chilling.

1:06:18

She was in a kneeling position

1:06:20

and her body had fallen forward,

1:06:22

face down with a large bullet

1:06:24

hole in the back of her

1:06:26

head. Oh. Sergeant Rich Keaton said,

1:06:28

when we finally came across Miss

1:06:30

Kane's body, all items of personal

1:06:32

nature of hers had been removed

1:06:34

with the exception of one sock.

1:06:36

Oh. So she is nude, except

1:06:39

for one sock in a kneeling

1:06:41

position with her face down. That's

1:06:43

awful. The discovery was shocking for

1:06:45

about a million reasons, not the

1:06:47

least of which was the fact

1:06:49

that while Sheriff's deputies had found

1:06:51

many bodies on Mount Tam to...

1:06:53

To their knowledge, Edda was the

1:06:55

first person to be murdered on

1:06:58

the mountain. Right. That alone made

1:07:00

the press immediately take notice and

1:07:02

start reporting the story. Now, in

1:07:04

interviews with those who'd been at

1:07:06

the mountain that day, that Edda

1:07:08

went missing, several people reported seeing

1:07:10

a single man hiking around the

1:07:12

same time Edda was. Lieutenant Robert

1:07:14

Godini told reporters, we are by

1:07:16

no means certain the man murdered

1:07:19

at a cane. But investigators were

1:07:21

just trying to come up with

1:07:23

a composite sketch of this man

1:07:25

from the witness's descriptions. Otherwise, there

1:07:27

was very little evidence that could

1:07:29

point investigators towards any suspect. There

1:07:31

were rumors, and there were rumors,

1:07:33

that Edda had been having an

1:07:35

affair with a younger man. So

1:07:37

detectives did wonder whether he might

1:07:40

have been involved or whether John

1:07:42

might have killed her out of

1:07:44

jealousy. That was like their initial

1:07:46

thoughts. They got to go to

1:07:48

like that. Yeah, they have to.

1:07:50

John Kane was quickly ruled out.

1:07:52

That's good. But police shifted their

1:07:54

attention to the younger man that

1:07:56

Edda had allegedly been seeing. Although

1:07:58

he denied seeing Edda that day,

1:08:01

the man still couldn't account for

1:08:03

his whereabouts. So detectives couldn't rule

1:08:05

him out. A sergeant working the

1:08:07

case later said, after at his

1:08:09

death, John Kane just withered away

1:08:11

without her and eventually died. Oh,

1:08:13

that's so sad. As for the

1:08:15

young man, he killed himself while

1:08:17

we were investigating him. Oh, wow.

1:08:19

That must have been so strange.

1:08:22

Yeah, that's bizarre. Yeah. So that

1:08:24

is where we're going to leave

1:08:26

you in part one. All right.

1:08:28

But yeah, it's a lot and

1:08:30

it. It's going to keep going.

1:08:32

That's a crazy lead-up. Yeah. And

1:08:34

he, he, this is only the

1:08:36

first murder. I was just, that's

1:08:38

what I mean. We have seven

1:08:40

more. We had a full part

1:08:43

one with one murder. Yeah, but

1:08:45

his assaults are enough to... They're

1:08:47

gnarly. His assaults are basically attempted

1:08:49

murder. Yeah, they are. All of

1:08:51

them. But yeah, he's a horrible,

1:08:53

horrible human being. Like very horrible.

1:08:55

He really is. And he somehow

1:08:57

gets worse. Well with that being

1:08:59

said we hope keep listening and

1:09:01

we hope you keep it weird.

1:09:04

That's weird. You don't tune into

1:09:06

part two. If

1:10:00

you like morbid, you

1:10:02

can listen early and

1:10:04

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on Apple Podcasts. Prime

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on Amazon Music. Before

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you go, tell us

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about yourself by filling

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at wondery.com/survey. In

1:10:29

the early hours of December 4th,

1:10:31

2024, CEO Brian Thompson stepped out

1:10:34

onto the streets of Midtown Manhattan.

1:10:36

This assailant pulls out a weapon

1:10:38

and starts firing at him. We're

1:10:40

talking about the CEO of the

1:10:43

biggest private health insurance corporation in

1:10:45

the world. And the suspect, he

1:10:47

has been identified as Luigi Nicholas

1:10:49

Mangioni, became one of the most

1:10:51

divisive figures in modern criminal history.

1:10:54

I was targeted, premeditated, and meant

1:10:56

to so terror. I'm Jesse Weber,

1:10:58

host of Luigi, produced by Law

1:11:00

and Crime and Twist. This is

1:11:03

more than a true crime investigation.

1:11:05

We explore a uniquely American moment

1:11:07

that could change the country forever.

1:11:09

He's awoken the people to a

1:11:11

true issue. Finally, maybe this would

1:11:14

lead rich and powerful people to

1:11:16

acknowledge the barbaric nature of our

1:11:18

health care system. Listen to Law

1:11:20

and Crimes Luigi exclusively on Wondery

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Plus. You can join Wondery Plus

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