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0:55

I'm Ash. And I'm Alayna.

0:57

And this is Morbid. This

1:11

is Morbid. That's

1:16

like Trixie and Katya's show. Yeah,

1:18

because their show and not yours. They're so

1:20

funny. I love them a lot. They make

1:22

me laugh. They're kind of like us actually.

1:24

They are. I saw, I don't know if

1:26

it's recent or not. I saw a clip

1:29

of their show the other day and I

1:31

think Katya was house sitting for Trixie and

1:33

Trixie was like a little intense and Katya

1:35

was like, I can't handle this. And I

1:37

was like, that is us. Yes. Not that

1:39

you're intense about your home, but you're just

1:41

intense period. Just intense period. Period. And

1:44

I feel like the aesthetic is very

1:47

similar. But you're

1:49

Katya in that sense. Yes, exactly.

1:51

And I'm like, Trixie. Trixie. Yeah,

1:55

I don't think, I mean, we

1:57

got some good stuff happening, but it's

1:59

in the background and will be

2:01

something you guys know about

2:03

in a little while. Yeah, like

2:05

months. But be psyched about

2:07

that. Yeah. It's pretty cool.

2:10

My water is loud. It's

2:12

loud. My water is loud. Covering

2:14

it is loud. But if I leave

2:16

it uncovered, I'll throw it. There's cool

2:18

stuff happening that we'll let you know

2:20

about. Don't worry. Soon enough. It's

2:23

like the Tobias thing. Don't

2:25

worry. You'll find out. Yeah. We'll

2:27

always tell you. TLDR. Don't

2:29

worry. Also, how cool is that? I

2:32

know that happened weeks ago. She said,

2:34

I'm just going to slide that in there.

2:36

Still very cool. The face of, how cool

2:38

was that? How cool was that? Check that

2:40

out. No, that was pretty cool. But yeah.

2:43

I'm trying to think of any other

2:45

updates that could be coming your

2:47

way. I can't think of anything now.

2:49

Anything to talk about? I

2:51

was going to apologize because I'm a little bit

2:53

sick, so my voice might be a little bit

2:55

annoying. But also, I find it kind of sultry.

2:57

I was just going to say you're sultry. Thank

3:00

you. So I'm sure everyone will agree. Thank you.

3:02

Yeah. That plane is

3:04

plowing plane landing on our house right

3:06

now. I apologize. She said, wow. She

3:09

really said, I'm flying. We're

3:11

saying, are you okay up there? Hello?

3:13

Are you all right? Yellow jackets? How's

3:16

everyone doing flying? How are you guys

3:18

doing? I'm just not, period. Still

3:21

scared. Remain scared. I remain scared. Possibly

3:23

scared. I don't know if I am. Drew

3:25

and I are going on a trip

3:27

in a couple of weeks and I will

3:29

not fly. We're driving. But how are

3:31

you guys doing? Is anybody else, anybody have

3:33

any tips, tricks, anything that's making

3:35

you feel better about it? Right now,

3:37

no. One thing I can

3:39

tell you in case anybody else shares,

3:42

which I know you do, shares my

3:44

fear of flying and this, you know,

3:46

gestures broadly at the world has made

3:48

it worse lately. Follow

3:50

some pilots on TikTok. Okay. I'll start. You

3:52

know what I'm going to do for you

3:54

guys? Because it's helped me and I want

3:57

to share the love. Wow, look at you.

3:59

I'm going to start sharing on my

4:01

story some pilots that

4:03

I follow in case

4:05

anybody needs some help getting

4:07

through it. Because Mikey's just

4:09

playing music over there. He's like, shut the

4:12

fuck up, Alina. You're fired. No,

4:15

but I'll start sharing it because they have helped

4:17

me. They kind

4:19

of bring you back to

4:21

reality for the situation because right

4:23

now it's so scary. But

4:25

they'll bring you back to a place

4:27

of at least being able to be like,

4:29

okay, someday I will step on a

4:31

plane again. It might be helpful. Right now

4:33

is obviously scary, but it's also like

4:36

being so... It's

4:38

among everything. It's so prominent right now.

4:40

And it's just among all the

4:42

chaos. So I think it's definitely... Because

4:44

it's a problem. That's for sure.

4:46

But I think it's, it can, pilots,

4:48

like actual people who do this

4:50

all the time, if you're listening and

4:52

you're a pilot, like, we're pouring one

4:55

out for you. Superhero. Shout out. Superhero.

4:57

But they can bring you to

4:59

a place of like, okay,

5:01

like this isn't, we're going to be okay.

5:03

So I'll start sharing them on my

5:05

stories if you need. You're so kind.

5:07

you need some help. Because it's helpful. It is.

5:09

That's one thing I love TikTok for is like that

5:11

kind of shit. Oh, bitch. I love TikTok.

5:13

That's the one streaming thing I keep.

5:15

Yeah. I do love a TikTok moment.

5:17

media thing. I love it for the

5:19

recipes, for the pilots that tell me

5:21

everything's going to be okay. Sourdough

5:23

queens. organizations. And

5:26

organizations. What did

5:28

you say? I said organizations.

5:30

Like organizing TikTok things. are

5:33

organizations. I got too much sleep last

5:35

night. Sometimes that is detrimental.

5:38

No, I actually believe sometimes that I

5:40

perform better on less sleep and then

5:42

I'll get more sleep and I'm like,

5:44

oh, maybe don't talk to me

5:46

today. Yeah, we actually went to bed

5:48

at a decent time upstairs to sleep

5:50

because we always just try to get

5:52

as much time. When the kids go

5:54

to sleep, we try to make the

5:56

most of the time between then and

5:59

when we have to go to get things

6:01

done that we can't get done while

6:03

the kids are awake. So it's like

6:05

it's hard because you want to like use up all that

6:07

time. Like we'll try to watch the shows we can't

6:09

watch when they're awake. You know, like all that stuff. But

6:12

it's not really great when I'm going up

6:14

to bed at like midnight every night. And then

6:17

waking up like super early. Because then you

6:19

wake up early with kids. So it's like whatever.

6:21

But we went up a little early last

6:23

night. And I have my

6:25

little watch that like tracks sleep. And it

6:27

told me I got like five and

6:29

a half hours of core sleep. Damn. Which

6:31

I think is like pretty. Fucking

6:33

rad. The competition girly in me just wants to

6:35

start wearing a watch when I sleep to

6:37

be like, I got more sleep than you. You

6:40

probably would. I would, yeah. But I'd win.

6:42

Yeah, you would. At least I win that. Would

6:44

it feel like a win? Yeah. Would it? I

6:46

feel like it wouldn't. I'll take that win. You got

6:49

to take your Ws where you can them. It's true.

6:51

Right now, especially, we got to take all the Ws.

6:53

I'll scoop that W right up. Speaking

6:55

of Ws and the opposite of

6:57

them, which is an L. Wait.

7:01

Yeah. Like a loss. The

7:08

way you looked at me like, what? I was like,

7:10

how is it an L? That's

7:12

fair. Wow. I'm

7:15

sick. Okay. She's

7:18

on that cold medicine. So

7:21

speaking of Ls. She's

7:23

scissorpin'. Like losers. We're

7:25

talking about David Kappender.

7:28

Oh. The trail side

7:30

killer here. Yikes. He's

7:32

a big L. He's a

7:34

M maniac. There you go. How about

7:36

that? There you go. Yeah, he's

7:38

definitely an M. He's an L.

7:40

He's nothing good. And when

7:42

we last talked to you about

7:44

him, he had been released on

7:46

parole. Which was crazy. Because one

7:49

thing about this case is it's

7:51

a prime example of the system

7:53

failing. On an extraordinary

7:55

level. Yikes. I mean,

7:57

failing superbly into

7:59

oblivion. I have one of those coming up

8:01

too. Yeah, several times they should have kept this guy

8:03

behind bars and they just kept letting him out, kept

8:06

giving him slaps on the wrist. For

8:08

like rape and that kind

8:10

of thing. Yeah, and he kept

8:13

escalating too. It's like, what are

8:15

you doing? And when we last

8:17

talked about this, we talked about

8:19

Etta Kane and John Kane, the

8:21

couple who were very established hikers.

8:23

Etta had gone out by herself

8:25

and she hadn't returned home. They

8:28

had eventually found Etta dead, unfortunately.

8:30

And when we last talked about

8:32

it, poor John had just kind

8:34

of like withered away after she

8:36

died. It's very,

8:39

very sad. Now, that

8:41

had happened in like early

8:43

fall. Now, a few weeks

8:45

later on September 6th, David

8:47

Carpenter was discharged from the

8:49

halfway house because remember he

8:51

had been paroled. to a

8:53

halfway house where he was being, like,

8:55

conditioned to kind of go out

8:57

back into society. It was a specific

8:59

halfway house that was for, like,

9:01

felons who were being reintroduced into society.

9:03

Yep. He never should have been

9:05

among them. He should have been kept in

9:07

jail. Yeah, no, he's not the kind of person

9:10

that can be reformed. No. So he was discharged

9:12

from the halfway house and returned to his parents'

9:14

house. Lucky I was like, ooh. His

9:16

former probation officer, Rich Wood, said, I'd gone

9:18

over to the house a number of times

9:20

before he got home from work. I talked

9:22

to the parents to see how he was

9:24

doing. And as far as anyone would say, him

9:28

moving back into the house had

9:30

really not caused any problems and

9:32

things seemed to be going well. That's

9:34

really all they could go on

9:37

at that point. A few months

9:39

later, in February 1980, David found

9:41

work in a keychain distributor and seemed

9:43

to be meeting all the requirements for his

9:45

parole. Okay. But this is

9:47

kind of what he does. Yeah, he

9:49

meets all the points that he has

9:51

to. And then something happens and he

9:53

just flips a switch. Yeah, like veers

9:55

completely off. the problem. Now, on the

9:57

morning of March 8th, 1980, Barbara Schwartz

9:59

went out for a jog on the trails of

10:01

Mount Tam. That afternoon, another

10:04

hiker on the trail spotted

10:06

23 -year -old Barbara arguing with a

10:08

man who appeared to be

10:10

in his 20s, according to this

10:12

person. Then the man

10:14

pulled a knife from his belt and

10:16

started stabbing Barbara. Oh, shit. Out of

10:18

nowhere. By the time the police

10:20

arrived to the spot, because they immediately called

10:22

the police. Yeah. By the time they got

10:24

to the spot where Barbara had been last

10:26

seen, her attacker was nowhere to be seen,

10:28

and Barbara had bled to death from multiple

10:30

stab wounds. Oh, my God. Where she was

10:32

stabbed. Yeah. Barbara Schwartz's death

10:35

was the second murder on the mountain in

10:37

a pretty short period of time. And like

10:39

we had talked about before, there had been

10:41

deaths on this mountain, of course. But as

10:43

far as they knew, there wasn't any murders

10:45

before this. But unlike

10:47

Etta Kane's murder, this time there

10:49

was evidence recovered at the scene. In

10:52

addition to finding a butcher

10:54

knife that investigators were

10:56

virtually certain was the murder

10:58

weapon. They also found a pair

11:00

of blood -stained eyeglasses. Oh, shit.

11:02

That'll tell you a lot.

11:04

is always wild when they, like,

11:07

are in such a frenzy that they leave something

11:09

that important. Now, there's no

11:11

way of knowing who these glasses

11:13

belonged to, but the prescription

11:15

was a very heavy bifocal that,

11:17

if matched to the right

11:19

person, could be a very compelling

11:22

evidence if it was in

11:24

a trial. Yeah. This is not

11:26

a regular bifocal. It's a

11:28

very thick, heavy bifocal. Now,

11:30

in their first examination of

11:32

the body, it looked like Barbara

11:34

had gone to great lengths to

11:36

fight back. Sergeant Keating

11:38

said she was repeatedly stabbed, but

11:40

she put up a hell of a

11:43

fight. Now, based on

11:45

her defensive wounds, sheriff's detectives

11:47

actually strongly suspected that Barbara's

11:49

killer had most likely, very

11:51

likely, been wounded in this

11:53

attack. Good. Yeah. Now

11:55

that night, a little past 7

11:57

p .m., David Carpenter arrived at

11:59

the emergency room. Oh, imagine that. In

12:01

Peninsula Hospital in San Mateo, about

12:03

35 miles from where Barbara Schwartz's body

12:06

had been discovered. Stupid ass. He

12:08

had a deep cut on his right

12:10

hand and his thumb. When

12:12

the attending doctor asked how he got

12:14

this injury, David said, quote,

12:16

there was an attempted robbery at

12:18

a 7 -Eleven store in Burlingame. Burlingame,

12:22

excuse me. I was attacked

12:24

and injured by the holdup man. Now,

12:27

so he's claiming I tried

12:29

to stop a holdup. I am a hero.

12:31

I'm a hero. And I got hurt there.

12:34

So the hospital policy

12:36

was that any injuries sustained during

12:38

an illegal act had to be

12:40

reported to police. That makes sense.

12:42

So the doctor did that. Despite

12:45

no report of a robbery ever having

12:47

been received in that area. The

12:49

officers that interviewed David Carpenter

12:51

just accepted his story. Are

12:54

And they allowed him to go on his way after being

12:56

stitched up. What? So they saw

12:58

that there was no reports of a

13:00

robbery there. And they just said, okie

13:02

dokes. And they were just like, eh. He said it,

13:04

though. They could have stopped him

13:07

right now. Yeah, of course. When I

13:09

tell you the failures at every single layer

13:11

here. That's also just wild. You would think that

13:13

that would hold him up for a little

13:15

while at the very would think. No, they just

13:17

let him go. He got stitched up, let

13:19

him go. And the doctor did his job. He

13:21

called them to try to figure out what was

13:23

going on. Right. You

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Mr. Bollin, the host of Mr.

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15:30

So it wasn't until the next

15:32

day that San Mateo police received the

15:35

all -points bulletin about Barbara's murder, and

15:37

by then, the interviewing officers had

15:39

completely forgotten about him. Like they

15:41

just didn't even, they didn't even put

15:43

the pieces together. Come on. So

15:45

things were relatively quiet in the months

15:47

after Barbara Schwartz's murder. Detectives

15:49

continued investigating her murder and

15:51

the murder of Etta Kane. But

15:54

without any new information or

15:56

evidence, they really weren't going to be able

15:58

to get anywhere. Then in October, the

16:00

sheriff's department got another call about

16:02

someone having gone missing at Mount

16:04

Tam. This time it was

16:07

a couple. Oh. 19

16:09

-year -old Rick Stowers and his girlfriend,

16:11

18 -year -old Cindy Moreland. Okay. So

16:13

the couple had just been, they'd

16:15

just gotten engaged. Oh. And Rick

16:17

had gotten his orders from the

16:19

Coast Guard that were going to

16:21

require him to report for his

16:23

latest position at Point Reyes, which

16:25

was a small coastal village about,

16:27

you know, an hour outside of San

16:30

Francisco. Okay. On the morning

16:32

of October 8th... Rick had

16:34

picked up Cindy, and they were headed out

16:36

to Point Reyes to kind of check out

16:38

the area. Yeah. See where they were going to

16:40

be staying. Yeah. So later that

16:42

afternoon, they were shopping in

16:44

that area, and another couple

16:46

saw them at a

16:48

bookstore in town. Then

16:50

they were seen a little bit

16:53

later than that by two hikers,

16:55

Sharon Melnick and Larry Drapkin. They

16:57

saw them on Bear Valley Trail. A

16:59

little later, Melnick and Drapkin were

17:02

hiking when they heard a succession

17:04

of loud booms. Later,

17:06

they said they sounded like noises

17:08

in rapid succession from a

17:10

backfiring motorcycle. But they

17:12

couldn't really tell where it was coming

17:14

from. They were having trouble pinpointing it.

17:16

Because sometimes when you're in an area like

17:18

that, sounds sound like they're coming from... one

17:20

place when it's a totally opposite one, or

17:23

they sound like they're coming from everywhere. Even

17:25

certain sounds, I feel like, do that. Like,

17:27

we'll be watching TV sometimes, and it's a

17:29

sound on TV that sounds like it's coming

17:31

from, like, the back of our house. Yes,

17:33

that happens to us all the time, too.

17:35

I think it's the girls, like, coming down

17:38

or, like, yelling my name or something, and

17:40

we'll always be pausing and, like, listening or

17:42

going upstairs. There's so many times where I'm

17:44

like, was that our alarm? Yeah, I'm like,

17:46

what the fuck was that? So that evening,

17:48

Rick and Cindy had plans to meet Cindy's

17:50

sister, Alice, for dinner. And when they didn't

17:52

show up, she got very worried. And around

17:55

9 p .m., she called her brother and

17:57

explained the situation. But he was like, I

17:59

don't know, don't overreact. He was like, maybe

18:01

wait until tomorrow, see if Cindy

18:03

shows up for work. Which

18:05

I was like, okay. I don't

18:07

really understand that. But Alice said, Cindy was

18:09

supposed to work at her job on

18:12

Sunday morning. I was a little overprotective, I

18:14

think, and I didn't want to worry

18:16

anyone. Which, like, I get that. But

18:18

the next day, Cindy didn't show

18:20

up to work, and she wasn't heard from

18:22

anybody. So Alice and the rest of

18:24

the family started taking everything a little more

18:26

seriously, and they reported both of them

18:28

missing. A few days later,

18:31

on October 15th, a third

18:33

body of a murdered woman

18:35

was discovered on Mount Tam. Damn.

18:37

A research scientist and

18:39

former Peace Corps consultant,

18:41

26 -year -old Ann

18:44

Alderson, So she was visiting

18:46

her parents in San Rafael over the

18:48

holiday weekend. When on October 13th, she

18:50

just decided to go for a solo

18:52

hike on Mount Tam. So

18:54

she was literally visiting. Like wouldn't

18:56

have been there otherwise. And again,

18:58

a research scientist and Peace Corps

19:00

consultant. That's crazy. Like, come on.

19:03

So she just wanted to go

19:05

out for a solo hike on Mount

19:07

Tam. And days later, a witness

19:09

named John Henry told police he'd seen

19:12

Anne sitting alone in the amphitheater.

19:14

around 5 p .m. and had considered

19:16

warning her about the recent attacks that had

19:18

occurred on the mountain. He just wanted

19:20

to be like, you should just be a

19:22

little careful here. Yeah, especially like being alone. He

19:24

said, but she was so deep in

19:26

introspection, I didn't want to bother or scare

19:28

her. Oh, man. Yeah. So Anne

19:30

was one of two people that Henry saw

19:32

on the mountain that day. He also

19:34

saw a man in the parking lot. He

19:37

later said he was just hanging around.

19:39

He was in his late 40s, early

19:41

50s, but there was something different about

19:43

him. He was simply standing there all

19:45

but motionless and wearing street clothing, slacks,

19:47

and a Hawaiian -like shirt. The

19:49

man would later be identified as David Carpenter. It

19:51

reminds you of that thing where it's like, would

19:54

you rather run into a bear in the woods

19:56

or a man? Yes, a bear. The

19:58

next day, two park rangers were out

20:00

on the mountain looking for some wild

20:02

Ridgeback hogs that had been spotted in

20:04

the area when they received an APB

20:06

about a young woman, Ann Alderson, who

20:08

had gone missing on the mountain. According

20:10

to the bulletin, Ann had told her

20:12

parents she'd be back by six that

20:14

night, but they waited until the following

20:16

day to report her missing. Search

20:19

and rescue teams, along with family and

20:21

friends, had combed the mountain that night looking

20:23

for Ann, but found no sign of

20:25

her. It wasn't until the

20:27

next day, October 15th, that Anne's

20:29

body was discovered in an area

20:31

of overgrowth, about a quarter

20:33

mile from the amphitheater where she had

20:35

last been seen by John Henry. Oh,

20:38

that's awful. Unlike the other two victims,

20:40

none of Anne's clothing or jewelry had

20:42

been taken, except for one gold

20:44

earring. Yeah. That's

20:46

so chilling. She had been sexually assaulted, and

20:48

the cause of death was a gunshot

20:50

wound to the right side of her head.

20:53

And it was from a, quote, high -powered

20:55

weapon, like a rifle. Yeah. Although

20:58

she was clothed when her

21:00

body was discovered, investigators believe

21:02

that her attacker redressed her

21:04

after, so she was undressed and redressed.

21:06

even scarier. Yeah. That

21:08

afternoon, the sheriff's department shut down

21:10

Mount Tim to the public, and

21:12

detectives searched the area for evidence

21:14

and found, among other things, a

21:16

metal fragment from the bullet jacket

21:18

and Ann's underwear. which

21:21

appeared to contain semen that the

21:23

investigators believed was likely left by

21:25

her killer. Although DNA testing was

21:27

obviously not available at the time,

21:29

this sample was analyzed by lab

21:31

technicians and determined to be, quote,

21:33

a type consistent with about 6 %

21:35

to 8 % of the general

21:37

population. Well, at least that's small.

21:39

That's a small portion. Something, but

21:41

it's like, ugh. Now, on December

21:43

2nd, 1980, about six weeks after

21:45

Ann's murder, Teams of

21:47

park rangers were searching the mountain

21:49

looking for 25 -year -old Shauna May

21:52

and 22 -year -old Diane O 'Connell, who

21:54

had been reported missing a few

21:56

days earlier. My God. So many

21:58

missing people. So they're

22:00

looking for Shauna May and Diane

22:02

O 'Connell, and they made a

22:04

horrific discovery. So O 'Connell and May

22:06

had gone out for a walk

22:08

along the National Seashore at Point

22:10

Reyes on November 28th. And when

22:13

they failed to return home that

22:15

afternoon, they were tourists. So people

22:17

were like, where the fuck would

22:19

they have gone? Right. They were

22:21

immediately reported missing. It was in

22:23

a heavily wooded and sparsely traveled

22:25

area on Mount Tam where they

22:27

were found. They

22:29

were both, unfortunately, murdered. They were

22:31

nude and had been shot in

22:33

the head, both of them. Gosh. Based

22:36

on the initial evaluation, it looked

22:38

like Diane O 'Connell had been strangled

22:40

by, quote, Something like a narrow piece

22:42

of cord of wire. And

22:44

a pair of women's underwear had

22:46

been shoved in her mouth. Oh, my.

22:49

There was no evidence to indicate

22:51

that O 'Connell had been raped. Shawna

22:54

May, on the other hand, had been

22:56

sexually assaulted before being shot. And there

22:58

were ligature marks around one of her

23:00

wrists, which indicated she'd been bound at

23:02

some point. Now, the discovery

23:04

of two more murder victims

23:06

on Mount Tam was bad

23:08

enough. But less than

23:11

an hour later, rangers discovered

23:13

the decomposed remains of Cindy

23:15

Moreland and Rick Stowers. Oh.

23:17

About 200 yards from where

23:19

they found O 'Connell and May.

23:21

Jesus. Both bodies were

23:23

found lying face down in what

23:25

appeared to be a shallow,

23:27

very crudely dug grave. Bullet wounds

23:29

were in both of the

23:31

back of their heads. They

23:34

had been in the woods for about

23:36

seven weeks at this point. Oh, wow.

23:38

they had undergone a lot of decomposition.

23:40

And Cindy's remains had to be identified

23:42

through dental records. That's always so sad.

23:44

Yeah. When they left Moreland's house on

23:46

the day they went missing, neither

23:49

Cindy nor Rick had said

23:51

anything about going hiking. That's

23:53

the problem. So when they reported missing, they

23:55

just never thought to look in the

23:57

area of Mount Tam because no one knew

23:59

they were hiking. Right. It was like

24:01

a... It was just like a spontaneous thing.

24:03

Now, the body count now is at

24:06

seven. Jesus. And the sheriff's office finally

24:08

started, you know, we're like, you know

24:10

what? I think there is one killer

24:12

that's responsible for all these victims. This

24:14

doesn't feel like just a coincidence. Right. Sheriff

24:17

Al Halwenstein told reporters the

24:19

two most recent victims may have

24:21

been slain by the killer

24:23

to draw attention to the earlier

24:26

killings. He said,

24:28

we're looking, we believe, at an individual

24:30

who has strong feelings about women.

24:32

And he also said sometimes the Slayer

24:34

can control his feelings and other

24:36

times he cannot. I

24:38

can see that. When you think of

24:41

it, like, he killed Diane O 'Connell

24:43

and Shauna Mae just to draw

24:45

attention. Because he left them right, he

24:47

did it and left them right

24:49

near where Rick and Cindy were. Right.

24:51

For him to do that just

24:53

so that they, to be like, oh,

24:55

you haven't found them yet. Right.

24:58

So I'll just take to other people's

25:00

lives? Like, that is so fucking

25:02

chilling. That line of thinking is just...

25:04

That's so chilling. Wild. And it's

25:06

very him. Yeah. So the news that

25:08

there was yet another serial killer,

25:10

because remember, we're in that time period

25:13

and in that place, that location,

25:15

where serial killers were running a fucking

25:17

muck around here. They were confusing...

25:19

The cases confusing the victims. Like, they

25:21

were overlapping. They were working in

25:23

the same kind of areas. It was

25:25

a wild time frame. I

25:27

can't imagine being in this place in

25:30

the United States at this time. Especially

25:32

as a woman. I really can't imagine

25:34

it. No. Horrifying. So, just

25:36

the news that there was yet

25:38

another one of these assholes operating

25:40

in the San Francisco area was

25:42

met with a lot of justifiable

25:44

fear and anxiety from residents. Hauenstein

25:47

said in a warning to the residents

25:49

in the area, without question, this individual

25:51

is capable of striking again, which must

25:54

have been horrifying to hear. That's very

25:56

scary. He said he commits his acts

25:58

in an effort to achieve psychological relief,

26:00

but the murders will not satisfy him

26:02

and the problem will get worse. And

26:05

in the same statement, he released

26:07

a sketch of the man they

26:09

believe was responsible. And he was

26:11

described as, quote, a clean -cut

26:13

man in his late 20s or

26:15

early 30s. dressed in hiking clothes

26:17

with a knapsack on his back.

26:19

Okay. And according to witness statements,

26:21

he's beginning to fall apart psychologically.

26:23

And so Hauenstein said, hikers

26:25

especially, remain vigilant and do not go

26:27

on solo hikes. Yeah. Like no

26:29

more solo hiking, everybody. But what's even

26:31

worse is you're not safe even

26:33

with two. Well, yeah, because look, Cindy

26:35

and Rick work together. Yeah, Cindy

26:37

and Rick and Diane and Shauna. Yeah.

26:41

You do inherently, I think, as

26:43

a woman sometimes feel a

26:45

little bit more defended when you're

26:47

with like a man. But

26:49

that didn't even matter either. Yeah,

26:51

like that's very genuinely scary.

26:53

It's horrifying. Now, investigators check the

26:55

local sex offender registry for

26:57

anyone who might match these descriptions.

26:59

But because Carpenter was still

27:01

technically a federal prisoner on probation,

27:03

he was not yet required

27:05

to sign up for the registry.

27:07

And so he hadn't. If

27:09

you're out, you should have to

27:11

sign up for that. Agreed.

27:13

Like what? Another fail. Yup. Also

27:15

at the time, this is

27:17

even worse. At the time, California's

27:19

sex offender registry program was

27:21

woefully underfunded. Really? And overworked. And

27:23

it was run by three

27:25

people. That department. What? Yeah.

27:27

It lacked even the basic

27:29

resources to operate as a department,

27:31

much less operate as like

27:34

a functional arm of law enforcement.

27:36

Damn. Three people. are

27:38

having to deal with all this. So

27:40

the fact that he fell through the

27:42

cracks in that scenario, not surprising at all.

27:44

Awful. I would have been surprised if

27:46

they actually found him on the registry. Truly.

27:48

Now, as for David Carpenter, the sheriff

27:50

was more or less kind of accurate with

27:52

what he said. He was starting to

27:55

fall apart psychologically, or, you know, he was

27:57

becoming more reckless at the very least. Everyone

28:11

has that friend who seems kind

28:14

of perfect. For Patty, that

28:16

friend was Desiré. Until one day...

28:18

I texted her and she was

28:20

not getting the text. So I

28:22

went to an Instagram and she

28:25

has no Instagram anymore. And Facebook,

28:27

no Facebook anymore. Desiré was gone.

28:29

And there was one person who

28:32

knew the answer. I am a

28:34

spiritual person, a magical person, which...

28:36

A gorgeous Brazilian influencer

28:39

called Cat Taurus. but who was

28:41

hiding a secret. From Wundery, based

28:43

on my smash hit podcast from

28:45

Brazil, comes a new series. Don't

28:47

Cross Cat. About a search that

28:49

led me to a mystery in

28:51

a Texas suburb. I'm calling to

28:54

Czech on the two missing Brazilian

28:56

girls. Maybe get some undercover

28:58

crew there. The family are freaking

29:00

out. They are long. I'm Shikofeliti. You

29:02

can listen to Don't Cross Cat

29:05

on the Wundery app or

29:07

wherever you get your podcasts. Now,

29:14

on March 29th, 1981,

29:17

20 -year -old Ellen Hanson and her

29:19

boyfriend, Stephen Hertel, were camping near

29:21

Henry Cowell Park in Santa Cruz,

29:23

not far from Point Reyes. Okay.

29:25

This was a popular area at

29:27

the time, and it had about

29:30

90 other campers on site at

29:32

the time. If Henry Cowell Park

29:34

in Santa Cruz sounds a little

29:36

familiar... Kind of did. This is

29:38

the same camping area that Herbert

29:40

Mullen took... solitary hikes

29:42

in and brutally ended up murdering

29:44

18 -year -old David Oliker, 18 -year -old

29:46

Robert Spector, 19 -year -old Brian Scott

29:48

Card, and 15 -year -old Mark Drabeldis

29:50

in their tent. Oh, wow. So

29:53

this is the same place. And

29:55

around the same time. Yep. And

29:57

this is where Ellen Hansen and

29:59

her boyfriend Stephen Hertel were camping.

30:01

Oh, man. So that morning, Hansen

30:03

and Hertel woke up early and

30:06

went for a walk along the

30:08

beach. For much of the

30:10

walk, they were alone, but eventually Steve

30:12

spotted another person on the beach. This

30:14

was a man wearing what looked to

30:16

be a backpack and very heavy bifocal

30:18

glasses. Oh, he got them replaced. And

30:21

he was walking towards them. Oh, thanks.

30:23

So as they got closer, Steve and

30:25

Ellen could hear what Steve later described

30:27

as, quote, shuffling steps and then heavy

30:29

breathing and cursing. Oh. But they thought,

30:31

like, whatever, and they just kind of

30:34

like... Because they were walking towards each

30:36

other, but like going past each other.

30:38

so you're just going to say like,

30:40

hey. So he said they nodded a

30:42

hello, and he did too, and then

30:44

they just kept walking. Now later

30:46

that afternoon, and nothing came of that.

30:48

Yeah. So they were just like, whatever. Later

30:51

that afternoon, Steve and Ellen ran into

30:53

that same man from the beach again. This

30:55

time while they were hiking Ridge Trail

30:57

on Mount Tam. When he

30:59

saw them, he said, oh, I see we

31:01

run into each other again. So

31:03

they just kind of were like, huh,

31:05

yeah, like weird. And then as

31:07

they're being like, oh, yeah, that's, like,

31:09

funny, as they're saying that, he reached

31:11

into the waistband of his pants and

31:13

produced a revolver. Can you imagine? You

31:15

just see this man again, and he's

31:17

like, oh, funny, we run into each

31:19

other again. And you're like, yeah, and

31:21

he just puts a gun in your

31:23

face. Like, what? The fear?

31:26

The fear and just, like, the

31:28

split -second change there? Yeah, because he

31:30

just pointed it right at them. My

31:32

God. Like, that would have just

31:34

destroyed me. what the fuck, the universe?

31:36

Like, why did I cross this

31:38

man's path again? Now, at the time,

31:40

Steve was fixated on the man's

31:42

hands, which he later described as extraordinarily

31:45

white and clean, which is strange.

31:47

He also noticed the strange way that

31:49

the man was holding the gun.

31:51

He said it was like very specific.

31:53

He said he had pulled back

31:55

the hammer, but had his thumb between

31:57

the hammer and the firing pin.

31:59

Because he's injured. Yeah. So if

32:02

the hammer slipped, it would hit

32:04

his thumb rather than discharging a bullet

32:06

too. Right. Like, which is strange. The

32:08

man said, if you don't want to get hurt,

32:10

do what I say. Put your hands on your head

32:13

and you won't get hurt. So

32:15

he was like, this is weird. So he's

32:17

thinking we're just being robbed. Also, him putting

32:19

his finger, his thumb between that. Probably disarmed

32:21

him a little bit. Probably made him think

32:23

like, okay, even if he pulls the trigger,

32:25

we're not being fired at. So to me,

32:27

that would probably make me be like, okay,

32:29

this guy's bluffing. Right. This is

32:31

fucked up. Let's just do what he says. And I think

32:33

that's why Steve was like, okay, I think he's just

32:36

robbing us and he's trying to threaten us with a big

32:38

thing. So Steve pushed Ellen

32:40

out of the way and thrust his

32:42

wallet at this man. But

32:44

the man was like, no. And

32:46

this is one of the most chilling

32:48

things I have ever heard. Oh,

32:50

no. He said to him, I don't

32:52

want any money. I want something

32:54

else. You know what I mean. All

32:56

I want to do is rape

32:58

her. Oh, my God. this

33:00

to her boyfriend. Steve

33:02

was probably like, what the actual

33:05

fuck? And what do you do?

33:07

And imagine Ellen being like, like,

33:09

what the fuck? Like, what do

33:11

you do in that scenario? I have

33:13

no idea. And it didn't, it's

33:15

so scary. It's like so scary. And

33:18

apparently it didn't occur to Steve

33:20

in the moment, but he later said

33:22

that the man was slowly pushing

33:24

them back off the trail and into

33:26

the woods as this was happening. And

33:29

Steve and Ellen were moving backwards and

33:31

he was just kind of like them.

33:33

Just to create space. And he's like

33:35

getting them out of the way. Now

33:37

eventually Steve and Ellen made a move

33:39

to run and things just erupted into

33:42

chaos. Steve said, I

33:44

heard two shots and then I felt

33:46

like somebody hit my neck with

33:48

a sledgehammer. I remember falling to the

33:50

ground with a buzzing sensation in

33:52

my arm and everything was slowing down.

33:54

The bullet had ripped through Steve's

33:56

neck and severed an artery in his

33:58

arm and then had settled in

34:00

his sternum. Oh my God. So he

34:02

went unconscious. I'm sure. When he

34:04

regained consciousness a few moments later, the

34:07

first thing he saw was Ellen

34:09

laying beside him. and her head was

34:11

resting in a pool of blood. The

34:14

man who had shot them both

34:16

looked like he was walking away,

34:18

and Steve knew if he didn't

34:20

stop him, they might never find

34:22

him, and he might hurt someone

34:24

else. So despite being incredibly injured,

34:27

Steve forced himself to his feet. Oh my

34:29

God. been shot in the neck and an

34:31

artery has been severed. Not only the fact

34:33

that he's gravely injured, but the fact that

34:35

he knows that this man still has a

34:37

gun and could shoot him again. Exactly. He's

34:39

still going up against him. Because he doesn't

34:41

want somebody else to get hurt. Wow. He

34:43

forces himself to his feet and slowly starts

34:45

walking after him, walking up the trail in

34:47

the direction of the observation deck. And he

34:49

hadn't made it very far before he found

34:51

a father and son hiking the trail. And

34:54

he's like hysterical and he's slipping into like

34:56

shock at this point. Yeah. And Steve did

34:58

his best to explain to them what happened,

35:00

but he wasn't making a lot of sense.

35:03

And Lee Fritz, who was one of

35:05

the guys, said he told us that

35:07

he and his girlfriend had been shot

35:09

and he thought she was dead. Oh.

35:11

Which like I can't even imagine having

35:13

to say that. No. So with the

35:15

help of some other hikers, Fritz managed

35:17

to get Steve to the observation deck

35:19

where they called the police. And later,

35:21

several witnesses on the trail that day, recalled

35:24

hearing the gunshots and passing a man in

35:26

a gold jacket as they rushed to see what

35:28

the commotion was about. It's also just so

35:30

crazy to think that, like, so many people that

35:32

day were just out for hikes. Like, that

35:34

guy that Steve ran into is just on a

35:36

hike with his son. Yeah. And, like, think

35:39

of the headspace that they're in. Like, they're like,

35:41

oh, nature, beautiful. Yeah, and this guy's fucking

35:43

everything just woke up from being shot next to

35:45

his girlfriend. And seeing his girlfriend shot next

35:47

to him. So two of the

35:49

hikers from the observation deck ventured

35:51

out into the woods and found

35:53

Ellen's body. She was dead. She

35:56

had been killed by a gunshot wound

35:58

to her head. The two men sat

36:00

with her body until the rescue team

36:02

arrived, which I'm glad they did that.

36:04

In the meantime, Steve was loaded into

36:06

Lee Fritz's camper van and they started

36:08

their way down to the hospital. So

36:10

like all these campers are like helping

36:12

each other out. When they reached the

36:14

parking lot, Fritz spotted a man driving

36:16

a Volkswagen Beetle that appeared to be

36:18

stuck in the mud. Fritz

36:21

said, something about the rearview mirror caught

36:23

my eye. It was extra large for

36:25

the car. So it was just a

36:27

very specific thing. As they passed, Lee

36:29

and the other driver made direct eye

36:31

contact with one another. And it occurred

36:33

to him that it was the same

36:35

man that he'd passed on the trail

36:37

just before he found Steve. God, can

36:39

you imagine? And he said, He said

36:41

he yelled, there goes the person I

36:43

think committed the crime. But he said,

36:45

at the moment, I had to get

36:47

Steve to a hospital. I was worried

36:49

he was going to die. Like, I

36:51

couldn't stop and try to apprehend this

36:53

man. going to do? You have to

36:56

weigh out what is more important. He's

36:58

like, so I just had to get

37:00

Steve to where he needed to go.

37:02

Now, despite the serious physical and psychological

37:04

trauma that he'd endured. Steve was able

37:06

to provide a very detailed description of

37:08

the killer. That's incredible. And he used

37:10

that description to refine the existing composite

37:12

of the sketch of the suspect. Nice.

37:14

The problem, though, was that they still

37:16

had no one to match the drawing

37:18

to. And unfortunately, it

37:20

was going to take one more

37:22

murder before this man was

37:24

finally identified as David Carpenter. Jesus

37:26

Christ. Now, with the exception

37:29

of the attack on Lois D

37:31

'Andrade... in 1960, all of David

37:33

Carpenter's victims were completely unknown

37:35

to him and were just kind

37:37

of like victims of opportunity,

37:39

unfortunately. For that reason, it's really

37:41

strange that in choosing his

37:43

last victim here, he chose someone

37:46

that he knew like pretty

37:48

well and could easily be traced

37:50

back to him with very

37:52

minimal effort. Because again, psychologically, he's

37:54

unwinding. He's unwinding. Now,

37:56

on May 2nd, 1981, just one month

37:58

after the murder of Alan Hansen

38:00

and the attempted murder of Steve Hertel,

38:03

20 -year -old Heather Skaggs was attending the

38:05

same trade school where David Carpenter was

38:07

working as a printer, and she mentioned

38:09

that she was looking to buy a

38:11

used car, since hers had finally broken

38:13

down for good. Well, as it

38:15

happened, Carpenter told her he had a friend

38:18

in Santa Cruz who had a car for

38:20

sale at a pretty good price, and he

38:22

was happy to drive her over there after

38:24

they both finished their shifts. Okay. If she

38:26

could get the car, Carpenter pointed out he

38:28

could help her get a job at the

38:30

school. Heather agreed, you know, but

38:32

there were two things she did find

38:34

unusual about this whole thing. Carpenter had

38:36

told her to bring cash and not

38:38

tell anyone when she was going. Okay,

38:41

that's strange. Yeah. So

38:43

Heather's mother, Mary Joan Skaggs, said that

38:45

Heather called her that afternoon and seemed

38:48

upset. And was like, I feel like

38:50

something's weird about this. She actually broke

38:52

into tears at one point. She said

38:54

it doesn't feel right. Yeah. So her

38:56

mother begged her, like, trust your instincts.

38:58

Don't go with this guy. But Heather

39:00

was like, I can't pass up the

39:02

opportunity for a job. Which is so

39:04

sad. I know. And so she told

39:06

her mom, don't worry, don't worry about

39:08

it, mom. Just wish that somebody else

39:10

could have given her a ride. I

39:12

know. And that was the last time

39:15

Mary Joan Skaggs talked to her daughter.

39:17

Oh, my God. Now, later that night,

39:19

when no one had heard from Heather,

39:21

some of her friends reached out to

39:23

David Carpenter for information, actually, because they

39:25

knew the two had plans that afternoon.

39:27

Because some people were there when they

39:29

made these plans. Yeah. But David claimed

39:31

that they hadn't met up as planned

39:33

because, quote, he overslept and had car

39:35

trouble. Okay. So because multiple people knew

39:37

she had plans to go look at

39:39

a car with David Carpenter, when Heather

39:41

was reported missing to police, his name

39:44

came up repeatedly. Yeah. But when investigators

39:46

interviewed him, he just said, I overslept,

39:48

and my card wouldn't work. I didn't

39:50

see her that day. You know, it's

39:52

just a coincidence that I'm a violent

39:54

criminal. And it's an easy alibi. I

39:56

overslept. I didn't see her. Now,

39:58

at the same time that investigators

40:00

were looking into his background in the

40:03

context of the Heather Skaggs case,

40:05

the composite sketch that had been updated

40:07

with the help of Steve was

40:09

finally starting to get some traction. Nice.

40:11

And the first tip came in

40:13

from a 69 -year -old woman in Ben

40:15

Lomond, California, named Roberta Patterson. She

40:17

reported recognizing the man in the sketch

40:20

as a man she'd been on

40:22

a cruise with 26 years earlier. Patterson

40:25

wouldn't have remembered someone from

40:27

that long ago, she said normally,

40:29

but she recalled being very

40:31

disturbed by Carpenter. And it was

40:33

David Carpenter. Because he was

40:35

making her teenage daughter very uncomfortable

40:37

because he wouldn't stop touching

40:39

her shoulders. Patterson

40:41

told a reporter from the San Francisco

40:43

Chronicle, I just didn't like the guy.

40:45

It turned out this was not the

40:47

first time that Patterson had reported. this

40:49

particular man to the police. Years earlier,

40:51

she called police after seeing a sketch

40:53

of the Zodiac on TV. Oh, shit.

40:56

Yeah. We're about to cover that. Now,

41:12

by the time they called him in

41:14

for an interview about the disappearance of Heather

41:16

Skaggs, investigators already suspected him

41:18

of being involved in the murders

41:20

at Mount Tam. But in person, he

41:22

was much less believable as a

41:24

threat to anyone. Detective Walt

41:26

Robinson said, when he sat down and

41:28

started talking to Carpenter, the first time

41:30

he opened his mouth, I thought, my

41:32

God, this guy can't possibly be involved

41:35

in the Santa Cruz homicide. In addition

41:37

to just appearing pretty meek, according to

41:39

them, like he just didn't seem like,

41:41

you know, judging a book by

41:43

its cover, I suppose. They were also

41:45

saying he was struggling to get a single

41:47

sentence out without stuttering. When

41:49

they asked about Heather, his response caught

41:51

their detectives off guard because he said,

41:53

I hope she hasn't been killed. I

41:55

hope she hasn't been raped. But

41:57

they said he stuttered very hard on

41:59

the words killed and raped. Oh. So that's

42:01

why it like really hit them. They

42:03

were like. First of all, why would you

42:05

say that? That's just bizarre. And second

42:07

of all, like, why are those words hitting

42:09

so hard? Yikes. The more

42:11

he talked, the more investigators

42:13

started seeing the facade of a

42:15

mild, awkward man to someone

42:17

who was clearly very more controlling,

42:20

manipulative, and cunning.

42:23

To Robinson and his partner, Carpenter's

42:25

alibi seemed way too perfect. His

42:27

descriptions were too well rehearsed. Everything

42:29

was too much. So sensing

42:31

he would need to establish some

42:33

kind of rapport with the suspect,

42:35

Robinson told Carpenter that, like David,

42:37

he had also been forced to

42:40

take dance classes as a

42:42

kid and would often get made

42:44

fun of by his peers. At

42:46

that, David calmly rose from his

42:48

chair, and for nearly 10 minutes,

42:50

he went through all the

42:52

dance positions he could remember, moving

42:54

fluidly around this little interrogation room

42:56

as the detectives just watched him

42:59

without any emotion. That.

43:03

He needs to be hospitalized. You would see

43:05

that in a movie and be like, that's

43:07

too much. be like, that's a lot. Like,

43:09

that was crazy. No, that is. It's also

43:11

like he did. Weirdly sad.

43:14

Yeah. But like, I don't feel bad

43:16

for him, but. Yeah. Like the entire

43:18

performance from, you know, the awkward, you

43:20

know, weird embarrassment and the dance routine,

43:22

it all felt very planned though to

43:24

them. Yeah. Because at first when you

43:27

hear that, you're like. Oh, like he's

43:29

just really like, he's really going out

43:31

there, you know? just trying to make

43:33

it seem like But to them, they

43:35

felt like this is part of it.

43:37

They said he was playing a game

43:39

with them. Yeah. As he

43:42

danced, David said, I know

43:44

you guys think I'm the number

43:46

one suspect as he's dancing.

43:48

Oh. And they reminded him that

43:50

they were from missing persons,

43:52

not homicide. Uh -huh. But

43:54

all David said was, hey, I'm

43:56

the number one suspect. I should

43:58

be if I'm not. What

44:01

the fuck? And the detectives concluded

44:03

their interview and took three Polaroid photos

44:05

of Carpenter then allowed him to

44:07

leave. That's so bizarre. They said it

44:09

all felt very rehearsed. It sounds

44:11

like he planned all of it. He

44:14

literally did a dance rehearsal. Yeah.

44:16

In the days after that, FBI agents

44:18

working with the Santa Cruz County

44:20

Sheriff's Office. ran a 24 -7 tale

44:22

on David Carpenter. Oh, I always love

44:24

that. And during that time, they

44:26

witnessed him attempting to sell his .38

44:29

pistol, among other things. And in

44:31

the meantime, Santa Cruz homicide detectives continued

44:33

to investigate the Hansen murder, focusing

44:35

on David Carpenter. It was

44:37

during an interview with his former

44:39

girlfriend, Candy Townsend, that the

44:41

first break came. During their

44:44

conversation, Townsend mentioned a gold jacket

44:46

of David's that had gone missing

44:48

in early April. Oh, shit. which he

44:50

told her had been stolen out

44:52

of his car. I bet. Detective

44:54

Stony Brook said, and his name is

44:56

Stony Brook. That's iconic. I just need to,

44:59

can we all just take, hold space

45:01

for that? He had to be a

45:03

detective. That's a great name. It is.

45:05

He said, up to this point, we

45:07

lacked the nexus, the connection. We had

45:09

him fitting the description, but we could

45:12

not put him at the scene with

45:14

the gun in his hand. That jacket

45:16

was it. The Nexus. I love it.

45:18

Only Detective Stoney Brooke could say it

45:20

like that. It's true. And only Detective

45:22

Stoney Brooke would say Nexus. Exactly. That's

45:24

the only thing. Only Stoney. Now,

45:26

along with the pistol and the

45:28

witness descriptions, the jacket put David

45:30

Carpenter at the scene of the

45:33

Hansen murder the previous month. That

45:35

afternoon, Brooke called the FBI surveillance

45:37

team and reported what they'd learned

45:39

on the afternoon of May 15th.

45:41

David Carpenter was arrested for the

45:43

murder of Ellen Hansen. Following his

45:46

arrest and arraignment for the murder,

45:48

seven witnesses, including Steve Hertel, identified

45:50

Carpenter as the man who they'd

45:52

seen fleeing Mount Tam on the

45:54

day Ellen Hansen was murdered. About

45:57

a week later, on

45:59

May 24th, hikers walking along

46:01

the railway at Big

46:03

Basin State Park unfortunately discovered

46:05

the nude decomposing body

46:07

of Heather Skaggs. Oh. She

46:09

had been sexually assaulted and shot

46:11

in the face with a .38 caliber

46:13

handgun. The same gun used in

46:15

the shooting of Ellen Hansen and Steve

46:17

Herodl. During the trial, one

46:20

of Carpenter's friends, Molly Purnell, testified

46:22

that she had purchased the gun

46:24

at David's request. And two other

46:26

witnesses testified to having been shown

46:28

the gun by David Carpenter at

46:30

various points in the previous year.

46:32

Yikes. During his interviews, Carpenter claimed

46:34

not to own a gun. But

46:37

one of the former halfway house residents

46:39

David lived with had turned on him

46:41

and confessed to having been given the

46:43

gun by Carpenter and asked to destroy

46:45

it. Oh, my God. Yeah. You're

46:47

just like the fact that he thought that was never

46:49

going to come back. You really think they're going to have

46:51

your back here? No. Like, come on. That

46:54

man led police to where he

46:56

had thrown it and the weapon

46:58

was recovered. Whoa. Yep.

47:00

In late July 1981, David

47:03

Carpenter was charged with five counts

47:05

of murder, rape, and attempted rape in

47:07

Santa Cruz County. Also, in his

47:09

1981 mugshot, he's wearing a fucking monogrammed

47:11

sweater. Yeah, he's terrifyingly normal. He's

47:13

wearing a straight -up monogrammed sweater. I

47:15

don't know what the monogram is because

47:17

it's not for his name. Yeah. Which

47:20

is even scarier somehow. No, it is. I

47:22

don't know why. I'm like, whose

47:24

is that? I hate it. Yeah.

47:26

Now, a trial was scheduled, but in

47:28

the months that followed, additional charges

47:30

were added for the murders in Marin

47:32

County, and that complicated the case.

47:34

Things were further complicated by multiple requests

47:36

for a change of venue after

47:38

Carpenter's lawyers argued that there had been

47:40

too much press coverage in Santa

47:42

Cruz and the jury was going to

47:44

be biased. Yeah, yeah. By the

47:46

time the case went to trial in

47:49

April 1984, it took nearly three

47:51

months to impanel a jury in Los

47:53

Angeles where the case had been

47:55

moved. Now, in July 1984, after

47:57

a three -month trial, David Carpenter

47:59

was found guilty of all charges

48:01

in the Santa Cruz cases. And

48:03

in November of that year, he

48:05

was sentenced to death. Goodbye. Two

48:07

years later, in September 1986, Carpenter

48:10

was tried for the murders committed

48:12

in Marin County, where he was

48:14

also found guilty of all charges.

48:16

And in 1988, was also sentenced

48:18

to death for those as well.

48:20

Damn, two times. You're gonna die

48:22

twice. Oof. Given the complexity of

48:24

the cases and the fact that

48:26

death penalty cases are automatically appealed,

48:29

David Carpenter appealed those convictions and

48:31

sentences to the state Supreme Court

48:33

several times. Although two of his

48:35

convictions for the Hanson and Skaggs

48:37

murders were at one point overturned

48:39

on a technicality— Oh, motherfucking technicality.

48:41

—the convictions and sentences for those

48:43

murders were reinstated upon review. David

48:46

Carpenter has always denied killing

48:49

or sexually assaulting any of the

48:51

individuals he was convicted of

48:53

killing. Yeah, yeah. Despite a wild

48:55

amount of forensic evidence linking

48:57

him to the murders. Like, there

49:00

is no question whatsoever. Yeah.

49:02

In the years since he was

49:04

incarcerated, he's been linked through

49:06

DNA to the 1979 murder of

49:08

Mary Bennett, who was killed

49:10

while jogging at Land's End. and

49:13

he remains the prime suspect in the murders

49:15

of Etta Kane and Barbara Schwartz, who they

49:17

were never able to pin him for. As

49:19

of today, he remains incarcerated at

49:22

San Quentin Prison, and he is 94

49:24

years old, and he is the

49:26

oldest resident on California's death row. That's

49:28

bullshit. That is some bullshit that

49:30

that man is allowed to live this

49:32

long. be allowed to live that

49:34

long. And I hope that death row

49:36

is just fucking awful, though. Oh,

49:39

I hope he's having the worst time.

49:41

I hope he's having the fucking time.

49:43

hope he can't dance. I hope

49:45

they don't let him dance. Oh, yeah.

49:48

I hope they just... I hope

49:50

he lives with a constant hangnail. Yeah.

49:52

And I hope he always has a

49:54

cut inside of his nose. And I

49:56

hope the faucet is always dripping. Always

49:58

dripping. And that mice are in his

50:00

cell. And I hope his eye twitches

50:02

and then it stops so he thinks

50:04

it's gone, but then it just goes

50:06

for like a week straight. Yeah, and

50:08

I hope he has a dull headache.

50:10

And then I hope he has an

50:12

abscess in his tooth. Several teeth, actually.

50:14

That's crazy. And a sore throat. Oh,

50:16

definitely can never pinpoint why. And no

50:19

cough drops in prison. Nope, except for

50:21

Mucinex, and he's one of those people

50:23

who Mucinex makes puke. Mucinex makes me

50:25

nauseous. Me too. And I hope

50:27

it makes him nauseous. And they only have

50:29

that. You heard it here first. Yeah. Wow.

50:31

That's a really sad story. And the

50:33

fact that so many of those deaths

50:36

never would have happened if the justice

50:38

system had actually prevailed. We

50:40

got to tell a story soon where the

50:42

justice system does good. Yeah, we definitely need

50:44

to find one of those because this was

50:46

not one of those situations. David

50:48

Carpenter's an asshole. Those poor people

50:50

just living their lives and they

50:52

were just victims of opportunity. It's

50:54

awful. It is. But a lot

50:56

of civilians in this case, a

50:58

lot of the detectives did a

51:00

great job on this case. And

51:02

a lot of civilians really pulled

51:04

it together in this case. I

51:06

feel like camping culture and hiking

51:08

culture, those people really stick together.

51:10

Yeah, they take care of each

51:12

other. Which is good for you

51:14

guys. Whatever people go hiking, do

51:16

the crazy hike. Pacific

51:19

Coast Highway, did you say? Well, that's

51:21

a thing. The Pacific

51:23

Coast Trail, right? Is

51:25

that it? In my head,

51:28

I was thinking like the Appalachian Trail.

51:30

Now I'm just thinking Panama. Pacific Crest Trail?

51:32

That's not in my head. But

51:34

I don't know what it's called, so

51:36

at least you had a stab at it.

51:38

The Reese Witherspoon movie where she throws

51:40

her hiking boots. It's like a whole thing.

51:42

I've never that. And they talk about

51:44

it in a... Gilmore Girls, the

51:46

new ones. I know what you're talking about, yeah.

51:48

Pacific Crest Trail. I was right. Okay. I

51:50

was like, I know I'm not totally off on

51:53

here. Anyway, she was going to do wild.

51:55

So that's what it is. It's wild. Yeah,

51:57

the Pacific, the Appalachian Trail, I think,

51:59

is part of that whole thing. Okay.

52:01

You were also correct. See, look at

52:03

us both being great. Basically, point was

52:05

just that when people do that big,

52:07

trail and they go wild or they

52:09

do wild, people take care

52:11

of them. takes care of each

52:14

other during the wild going. They do,

52:16

I think people who - It's a community.

52:18

People who hike, I think that's

52:20

just like in your bones and your blood which

52:22

which makes you pretty fucking great. I wish

52:24

I could hike, I I get Keep looking out

52:26

for each other and please be careful. And

52:28

that being said, we hope you

52:30

keep listening. And we hope you keep

52:32

weird, but not so

52:34

weird you don't do and go

52:36

wild. Wild. wild, wild, wild. If

53:42

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