0:00

We all have a moment that splits

0:02

us wide open. On my new podcast,

0:04

Wide Open with Ashland Harris,

0:06

I'll sit down with trailblazers

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toughest moments in the incredible

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comebacks that followed. Listen to

0:18

wide open with Ashland Harris,

0:20

an I-Hart Women Sports production

0:22

on the I-Hart Radio app,

0:24

Apple Podcast, or wherever you

0:27

get your podcast. Hey

0:29

y'all, it's your girl Cheekies, and I'm

0:32

back with a brand new season

0:34

of your favorite podcast Cheekies and

0:36

Chew I'll be sharing even more

0:38

personal stories with you guys and

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as always you'll get my exclusive

0:42

take on topics like love personal

0:44

growth health family ties and more

0:46

And don't forget, I'll also be

0:48

dishing out my best advice to

0:50

you on episodes of Dear Cheekies.

0:52

It's going to be an exciting

0:54

year, and I hope that you

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can join me. Listen to Cheekies

0:58

and Chill, season 4 on the

1:00

I-Hart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or

1:02

wherever you get your podcasts. I'm

1:04

Emiolia, host of the podcast Crumbs.

1:06

For years, I had to rely

1:09

on other people to tell me

1:11

my story. And what I heard

1:13

wasn't good. Wasn't good. I was trapped

1:15

in addiction. You had to grab

1:17

the left and smash it against

1:19

the walls. And then, I decided

1:22

I wanted to tell my own

1:24

story. Listen to Crohn's on the

1:26

I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast,

1:28

or wherever you get your podcast.

1:30

Hey everyone, it's Jay Sheddi, and

1:33

I'm thrilled to announce my podcast

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2:09

Head to jayshadi.org/tour and get yours

2:11

today. I wasn't happy and I

2:14

was burnt and I just felt

2:16

like a punching bag and I

2:18

also was getting really bad performance

2:20

anxiety. Right before I did my

2:23

first ever stand-up set, I thought,

2:25

oh no, I'm gonna start getting

2:27

those feelings I would get before

2:29

a match of just like dread

2:31

and shame. And stand-up, I went

2:34

on stage and I felt a

2:36

calmness I hadn't felt before. It's

2:38

kind of like why I try

2:40

to fit into something that isn't

2:43

right. So I urge people to

2:45

find their calm. The number one

2:47

health and wellness podcast. Jay She

2:49

won! Hey

2:53

everyone, welcome back to On Purpose. I

2:56

am so excited for today's guest. I

2:58

was a guest on her show probably

3:00

just over a year ago We had

3:03

the best time and if you haven't

3:05

listened to it I hope you will

3:07

after this episode Today's guest is someone

3:09

that is known for being hilariously funny

3:12

Extremely witty someone who's got the ability

3:14

to make you think laugh and all

3:16

of the same at the same time

3:19

her name is Hannah burner one of

3:21

the most influential rising comedians of this

3:23

generation She has two hit podcast as

3:26

if one wasn't good enough. Giggly squad

3:28

and Bernafone which have garnered over 100

3:30

million combined downloads. Hannah's video series, Han

3:33

on the street, has earned over 350

3:35

million views and Hannah was named one

3:37

of variety's top... 10 comics to watch

3:39

in 2023. She also just finished touring

3:42

her solo stand-up routine to sold-out theatres

3:44

across North America and Europe, and will

3:46

embark on a club giggly national tour

3:49

with co-host, Paige DeSorbo. The duo will

3:51

release their book, How to Giggle, a

3:53

guide to taking life less seriously, via

3:56

Simon and Schuster, on April 15, 2025.

3:58

Let's look forward to. And most recently,

4:00

Hannah debuted her first Netflix comedy special,

4:02

We Ride at Dawn, which premiered at

4:05

number two on the platform and is

4:07

streaming now. Welcome to the show, Hannah,

4:09

Bernard. I think people got everything. I

4:12

have nothing left to say. That's it.

4:14

That's it. You've lived. No, thank you

4:16

for that. I appreciate it. It's amazing.

4:19

It's so fun. Like when we met

4:21

last year. I was learning so, all

4:23

of my team are huge fans, like

4:25

huge fans, and I was learning so

4:28

much about you through them and they

4:30

were just like, this is, this is,

4:32

this is amazing, you know, and just

4:35

to see the incredible journey you've been

4:37

on over the last 18 months is

4:39

amazing. Thank you. And I was going

4:42

to start up asking you, like, have

4:44

you always was like bored without having

4:46

like a dream? Like at like seven

4:48

years old, I wanted to be a

4:51

professional tennis player and someone told my

4:53

parents like, she's too late to start.

4:55

My parents told me like, you can't

4:58

be a professional tennis player, someone told

5:00

us that. And apparently I cried all

5:02

day. Like what kind of passionate little

5:05

seven year old was like, how dare

5:07

they tell me I can't do that?

5:09

And then I just was like, that's

5:12

my dream. I just always wanted to,

5:14

I wanted to be. like different and

5:16

great in some capacity which could be

5:18

very ego now that I'm looking back

5:21

but like I just wanted to challenge

5:23

myself and chase something. Had you ever

5:25

played tennis before? I still haven't played

5:27

tennis as I know. I was like,

5:30

I was not a kid and I

5:32

think like, I was the Serena generation,

5:34

like seeing Serena, I was like, why

5:36

can't that be me? It was always

5:38

kind of like, yeah, why can't I

5:40

do that? I don't know if it

5:43

was intrinsically like, my dad definitely instilled

5:45

a lot of belief in me and

5:47

I just always was like, why can't

5:49

me? Especially in like spaces that I

5:51

felt like I didn't. places that I

5:53

didn't think easily I could get in.

5:56

My dad has a story that we

5:58

were ice skating once when I was

6:00

like six and all the girls were

6:02

in the middle doing the jumps and

6:04

then everyone else is like scared holding

6:07

the rink on the outside and I

6:09

was like, I want to go to

6:11

the middle and he was like, you've

6:13

never ice skated before and I'm like,

6:15

put me in the middle coach. So

6:17

I just always had that attitude and

6:20

it's hard to always be chasing like

6:22

lofty goals, but I think that's like

6:24

the high that I like. Yeah, that's

6:26

true. I mean, that's such a great

6:28

mindset. I mean, you reminded me of

6:30

me ice skating when I was young.

6:33

I was, I was like, I could

6:35

skate then and I couldn't stop. Like,

6:37

I didn't know how to slow down,

6:39

so I would just fall when I

6:41

had to stop and I had to

6:44

stop when I had to stop. And

6:46

now it's like, I'm the guy holding

6:48

the side going, like, I don't need

6:50

that to happen at this age. But

6:52

it seems like you've channeled that into

6:54

your career, right? Like that energy, it's

6:57

not like it got lost somewhere. But

6:59

before we get to that, I wanted

7:01

to ask you a few more things

7:03

because when I was looking into parts

7:05

of your journey and what you've talked

7:07

about what you haven't. There's a lot

7:10

of lives and like a cat. Yeah,

7:12

you've lived so many lives, but I

7:14

feel you've been amazing at pivoting and

7:16

you've been like... What I like to

7:18

think of like an expert in quitting.

7:21

Like you've been good at knowing. You

7:23

can say firing. You can say firing.

7:25

You don't have to sugar coat it.

7:27

No, it's funny, I recently was like

7:29

DMing an astrologer as you do. And

7:31

she was like, you're really about like

7:34

rebirth. And you're all about like things

7:36

falling apart and then coming up like

7:38

a Phoenix. And I was like, why

7:40

couldn't I have something easier? Be my

7:42

purpose? But I've, yeah, I am. When

7:44

I outgrow something or don't feel right,

7:47

like I get out of it and

7:49

sometimes people get out of it for

7:51

me when I don't have the balls

7:53

to be like, this isn't my space

7:55

anymore. But yeah, I've been, I had

7:58

to quit, I quit 10. So I

8:00

felt like a loser even though I

8:02

spent my whole life pursuing it

8:04

and I played number one for

8:06

the University of Wisconsin full scholarship

8:08

like externally people were like she's

8:10

successful Where in my head I'm

8:12

like I'm a loser failure because

8:14

I didn't win build in And

8:16

then I'm like why did I

8:18

do all that? And then I

8:20

got into eventually got into video

8:22

production and I got fired from

8:25

that and I got fired from

8:27

that And now I have a

8:29

Netflix special, but it really, where

8:31

some people might be like, oh, like

8:33

you're getting fired. I really

8:35

was, like, I was finding myself

8:37

every time, and the more you

8:39

are connected to yourself, the more

8:41

an honest you are with yourself, and

8:44

in tune with yourself, the more spaces

8:46

might not be right for you. I've

8:48

never been good at just like blindly

8:51

following. I don't like being fake.

8:53

I can't pretend to be

8:55

happy. Like my body will reject. situation.

8:57

The same with like relationships. Like I

8:59

can't, the second I'm like, this is

9:01

not right for me. I like blurred it

9:04

out like, like it needs to come out. How

9:06

will your body tell you that? Like what's the

9:08

anxiety? And it's funny, at first I was like,

9:10

oh no, do I bad anxiety? And I've

9:12

talked to people and they're like, no,

9:15

your intuition is actually really good. You

9:17

just have to listen to listen to

9:19

it. Like I've been in places where I'm

9:21

like, I'm myself sabotaging, but my body's just

9:23

like, this isn't for you. That's so powerful.

9:26

I love that you said that because I think

9:28

we don't connect those two things. We see it

9:30

as, oh, I'm having anxious feelings, I

9:32

feel nervous, I'm overwhelmed. The body's protecting

9:34

you. Yeah, totally, but it is signaling

9:36

something, it's telling you something. Yeah, because

9:39

I feel like we can lie to ourselves

9:41

a lot, especially when you're like mentally strong.

9:43

And in tennis, you have to really

9:45

suppress your minds. You have to be

9:47

like, I'm not nervous, I'm not tired,

9:49

I'm so ready for this match, and

9:51

you have to like numb your inner

9:53

thoughts. And as I got older, I

9:55

realized, wait, I have to start listening

9:57

to my inner thoughts because they're actually...

10:00

right? And with tennis, I realize looking

10:02

back, all the success I have now

10:04

is because of the tennis training I

10:06

had. It really was part of who

10:08

I am now. Like, just because you

10:10

lost a dream doesn't mean that's not

10:12

going to make you better at something

10:15

else. It's not like, oh, that was

10:17

a waste, which I love to tell

10:19

people. But also, like, I love divorce.

10:21

leaving places that aren't right for you.

10:23

And I feel like so many times

10:25

you think you have to stay. I

10:27

think the coolest part about life is

10:30

tomorrow, I could wake up and say,

10:32

I don't want to do this anymore.

10:34

And there's such a beauty in that.

10:36

Yeah, why do you think we project

10:38

that expectation onto a dream? Like if

10:40

you think about it, when you think

10:42

you're going to become a tennis player,

10:45

today you're a comedian, you've lived a

10:47

million lives in between, I'm sure you'll

10:49

keep evolving, but... A lot of us,

10:51

like you said, we just stayed glued

10:53

to I could have been, I should

10:55

have been, if only I would have

10:58

been, and that way we never shift

11:00

our lens. What allows you to be

11:02

so positive about going, let me trust

11:04

that that isn't for me and I

11:06

don't fit in here. If people are

11:08

listening and watching and they're thinking, their

11:10

first dream, or they failed at their

11:13

first dream, how do you start believing

11:15

in a second dream? It's so funny

11:17

because everything is perspective, like even me

11:19

joking, like, I did that, that was

11:21

a waste and I didn't win Wimbledon

11:23

and you laughed. Like, it's funny, but

11:25

then it's also like, cut me up.

11:28

But I was like, when I was,

11:30

I was like, the fact you didn't

11:32

win Wimbledon, you're a piece of shit,

11:34

because that was 20 years of putting

11:36

your heart and soul into this dream.

11:38

But when I, when I started doing

11:40

comedy, my career, like, ascended like abnormally

11:43

fast and it's I tell people I'm

11:45

like it's because I had a career

11:47

before this to prepare me and I

11:49

approach comedy the way I approach tennis

11:51

but like healthier tennis I was very

11:53

hard on myself the way I wish

11:56

I was spoken to in my past

11:58

career. I was very negative self-talk. And

12:00

with comedy, I'm now like recoaching myself

12:02

in a new way. So I'm like,

12:04

when you go on stage, you're going

12:06

to be positive. You're not a loser

12:08

when you mess up. And I get

12:11

to speak to myself the way I

12:13

wish I was spoken to in my

12:15

past career. And I see so many

12:17

people who are like sad because they're

12:19

ending something. And I'm like, you're going

12:21

to be so good at the next

12:23

thing. And also, there's a lot of

12:26

shame that comes with like when you

12:28

didn't accomplish something you wanted to, but

12:30

these are all just your own games

12:32

you're playing in your head of what

12:34

you should be. Because if I look

12:36

back, I actually, my first love was

12:39

like acting and being goofy, like I

12:41

love drama class, I love painting, I

12:43

loved creating, but I happen to be

12:45

super athletic, and that was where I

12:47

was kind of pushed towards. And looking

12:49

back, I'm like, wait, I didn't think

12:51

you can make money doing what you

12:54

love. I thought you had to be

12:56

like a tortured athlete who was just

12:58

like on the grind. And for anyone

13:00

who's feeling kind of not having a

13:02

purpose right now, think back to what

13:04

you loved when you were a kid.

13:06

And I know it sounds crazy, but

13:09

like you can still be that kid

13:11

and have that joy before society told

13:13

you all these things that you should

13:15

do to be successful. And I kind

13:17

of realized tennis, there were too many

13:19

rules and I like don't enjoy playing

13:21

by the rules. Like I don't like

13:24

staying in the box and tennis was

13:26

all about like hitting in the lines.

13:28

Yeah. And stand up I think I

13:30

love because like I go on stage

13:32

and no one can tell me what

13:34

to do. And it turns out that's

13:37

where I can be my most myself.

13:39

I love that. You would have been

13:41

that player smashing the racket. I've broken

13:43

rack. I've definitely, you know. had like

13:45

coaches that wanted me to change stuff

13:47

about my game that I would try

13:49

but I didn't really believe it. It

13:52

was a lot of like just trust

13:54

your coach and and Don't listen to

13:56

yourself. And it really, it made me

13:58

who I am. And I actually couldn't

14:00

watch tennis for years after. I was

14:02

very like, it was like an ex-boyfriend.

14:04

Wow. Because it was the longest relationship

14:07

I ever had. So, but now I

14:09

like love tennis. Like I have it

14:11

on all the time. I played a

14:13

lot this summer to get fit and

14:15

I was like, wait, it's a part

14:17

of me and it makes me who

14:20

I am. And me calling myself a

14:22

loser is just, that's a perspective you

14:24

can take. Or you can be like,

14:26

by the way, actually, was really good

14:28

at tennis back in the day, isn't

14:30

that cool? I can relate to you

14:32

in so many ways. My life's so

14:35

different, but as you're speaking, I feel

14:37

exactly the same way. I think even

14:39

when we sat on your show, I

14:41

was talking about how leaving being a

14:43

monk felt like a divorce at the

14:45

time. Yes. because I felt like I

14:47

was getting married, it was a commitment,

14:50

it was something I was really excited

14:52

about, and then now it's been 11

14:54

years since I've left, the monastery, and

14:56

I'm so happy I left, and I

14:58

couldn't agree with you more that I

15:00

too have lived, I too have lived,

15:02

that I too have lived so many

15:05

lives in between that and this, I

15:07

went back into the corporate world, I

15:09

worked in a massive corporation with 500,000

15:11

employees, and all of what that... I've

15:13

just constantly tried to move closer to

15:15

who I really am and aligned with

15:18

how I want to express myself, who

15:20

I want to be. And you can't

15:22

just know it. You can't know it.

15:24

You have to go through those trials

15:26

and tribulations. I tried entertainment in so

15:28

many different ways. I worked at a

15:30

company. I did a lot of things

15:33

that I did it and I was

15:35

like, those are really feel right, but

15:37

I do like parts of it. So

15:39

then you grow and you just take

15:41

what you learn. That's why anyone who's

15:43

having a tough time in their 20s.

15:45

You're supposed to have a tough time.

15:48

Like, the 20s, everyone's flailing, and you

15:50

take that time, so by the time

15:52

you get to 30, you're like, oh,

15:54

first of all, I'm tired. I'm too

15:56

tired to be like upset about things,

15:58

and two, I kind of know what

16:01

I like and what I don't like.

16:03

Yeah, is it true that I've, I

16:05

heard some. Very briefly that you were

16:07

hit by a car. Is that is

16:09

that like I because I couldn't really

16:11

I was trying to I don't like

16:13

say it that much because I don't

16:16

want people to think I stopped tennis

16:18

because I got hit by a car.

16:20

But my last year at University of

16:22

Wisconsin I was playing number one for

16:24

the team and I kind of had

16:26

this idea that if I had a

16:28

great season I would then go pro.

16:31

And this season, it was going pretty

16:33

well. And then right before, like the

16:35

Big Ten tournament, I got hit by

16:37

a car going to practice. And it

16:39

was like 7 a.m. University of Wisconsin,

16:41

it was like zero degrees. I had

16:43

a big park on and a guy

16:46

hit me for a car. And I'm

16:48

lying on the ground. And the first

16:50

thing I thought about was like, tell

16:52

my coach I'm going to be late

16:54

because I'm going to be in trouble.

16:56

Because like, he's going to be like,

16:59

why is she not here? It's almost

17:01

cultish. You're like, you're just so obsessed

17:03

with this team and doing your best

17:05

and winning. And I recovered after a

17:07

couple months, but I wasn't like my

17:09

sharpest. And I lost, this is very

17:11

sports talk, but I lost five matches

17:14

in third set tiebreakers. So it basically

17:16

means like, like, one or two points

17:18

were the difference in five matches. And

17:20

if I had won those five matches,

17:22

I would have like won all these

17:24

awards. I would have probably gone pro.

17:26

And for whatever reason, like these are

17:29

really just these minuscule moments, I didn't

17:31

win those matches and I remember being

17:33

like, I think the universe, like a

17:35

person can only take so much. And

17:37

I, but the thing is, I could

17:39

have kept playing tennis and I would

17:42

have been fine, but I knew there

17:44

was more happiness in life that I

17:46

just wasn't living and I wasn't happy

17:48

and I was burnt. and I just

17:50

felt like a punching bag. And I

17:52

also was getting really bad performance anxiety.

17:54

And what's cool about the performance anxiety

17:57

is that I... I thought I would

17:59

have it in comedy too, and I

18:01

didn't. Like right before I did my

18:03

first ever stand-up set, I thought, oh

18:05

no, I'm gonna start getting those feelings

18:07

I would get before a match of

18:09

just like dread and shame and like

18:12

judgment day, like whatever happens is gonna,

18:14

there's a lot weighing on it. And

18:16

stand up I went on stage and

18:18

I felt a calmness I hadn't felt

18:20

before. So I urged people. to find

18:22

their calm. It's kind of like why

18:24

I try to fit into something that

18:27

isn't right. And I do think I

18:29

was playing for other people besides myself.

18:31

I wanted my parents to be proud

18:33

of me. I wanted my peers to

18:35

think I was cool. And that's all

18:37

you know when you're younger. Yeah. Yeah,

18:40

I like that idea of moving toward

18:42

your calm. I mean, it's the same

18:44

in relationships. I feel like I had,

18:46

uh, you're so right. One of my

18:48

friends, she's going to hate me for

18:50

putting it out. One of my friends

18:52

messes me the other day and she

18:55

was just like, just went out this

18:57

guy who's perfect, we had the same

18:59

values, he'd be an amazing dad, but

19:01

I just didn't feel it. And I

19:03

was like, dude, did you feel peace,

19:05

did you feel calm? And she felt

19:07

so peaceful, felt so calm, felt so

19:10

calm. I was like, felt so calm.

19:12

I was like. You should at least

19:14

give it a second date or a

19:16

third date, like you don't just write

19:18

it off and it was so interesting

19:20

to me how we're so averse to

19:22

things feeling aligned. Like we have this

19:25

kind of allergic reaction when something feels

19:27

aligned and something actually feels like we

19:29

connect. You almost feel guilty when something

19:31

comes easy. You're like, that's not how

19:33

it's supposed to be. The dating stuff

19:35

is so funny because I have a

19:38

friend who like loves dating like drum

19:40

drumers who were in jail. projects to

19:42

take on. And she recently met this

19:44

guy and she was like, I love

19:46

him, but like, I feel like he

19:48

needs like a neck tattoo or something.

19:50

And I was like, let's just take

19:53

a breather. Keep seeing him because yeah,

19:55

there is this addiction to tennis that

19:57

almost wasn't that healthy. Like I was

19:59

addicted. to the drama and the, the,

20:01

just like the anxiety, it was provoking

20:03

in the highs. And I was actually

20:05

still able to find those highs in

20:08

comedy that was just like less torturous

20:10

to me. Yeah, I really like that

20:12

comparison between the two because obviously you

20:14

were brilliant at both and. It's hard

20:16

to decipher. I meet a lot of

20:18

people who are like, Jay, I could

20:21

do this or I could do this,

20:23

which one should I do? It's like

20:25

a very common question that I get.

20:27

I'm passionate about this and I'm passionate

20:29

about this. And what I hear, what

20:31

you're saying to kind of decipher and

20:33

divide the two is, well, maybe you're

20:36

addicted to this and maybe you have

20:38

a lot of affection for this over

20:40

here and go with the thing that

20:42

feels less overtly stressful, less dramatic. less,

20:44

like the high is really high and

20:46

the low is really low. Yes, right?

20:48

Yes, I mean, I'm kind of obsessed

20:51

with and by obsessed with, I mean,

20:53

I heard about it once and I

20:55

like it, stoicism, because that was not

20:57

my life. It's like, especially as an

20:59

athlete, as a tennis player, you're like

21:01

losing all the time, or you're like,

21:03

I'm the greatest that ever did this,

21:06

or you're like, so good, I need

21:08

to quit. And I think what I

21:10

realize, the competition. But I thought that

21:12

was just a problem that I had

21:14

to overcome. I was like, you're just

21:16

not doing it right. But all the

21:19

girls around me would be like, I

21:21

actually hate practice, but like I love

21:23

the competition. And the competition is literally

21:25

what it means to be a professional

21:27

athlete. When it came to comedy, some

21:29

people will be like, I hate going

21:31

on stage. I live for the stage.

21:34

Like I'm more uncomfortable at like a

21:36

group dinner, but if you give, because

21:38

I'm like, when do I talk, do

21:40

any less, or do more, but when

21:42

I have a mic on stage, when

21:44

I have a mic on stage, I

21:46

know exactly what to do. And it's

21:49

corny to say, but like, go towards

21:51

your purpose and go to, and the

21:53

calmness is where it's like, oh, this

21:55

is where you're supposed to be. like

21:57

with friend groups like you know when

21:59

you're with people and you just feel

22:02

like I'm saying everything wrong I'm awkward

22:04

oh my god I hate myself I'm

22:06

so embarrassed you could say those same

22:08

things with the right people and you

22:10

would feel like comfortable so I feel

22:12

like that with careers so going back

22:14

to your question of which one should

22:17

I do I literally did not like

22:19

competing but I was so comfortable the

22:21

idea of being a tennis player and

22:23

overcoming this this performs anxiety and getting

22:25

to the next level. And it's like,

22:27

if you're going to do something for

22:29

a long time and be good at

22:32

it and want to be successful, you

22:34

have to like it. I know that

22:36

sounds so simple. People come to me

22:38

that like, I want to start a

22:40

podcast, what should I do? And I'm

22:42

like, do something that you would do

22:44

for free and talk about for years.

22:47

You can't just do it because you're

22:49

like, oh, I want to see my

22:51

face on a chart. I was going

22:53

through a hard time with reality TV

22:55

actually and I started doing stand-up and

22:57

I would tell people what I'm going

23:00

through and the stand-ups were just like

23:02

making fun of me and seeing it

23:04

through their lens I suddenly felt safe

23:06

I felt calm and I started to

23:08

relate to them I'm like wait I

23:10

think like these people finding community is

23:12

a huge part of my happiness where

23:15

tennis is very lonely yeah everyone was

23:17

my competition and comedies lonely too but

23:19

I was able to find a community

23:21

within it. It's interesting, I'm like figuring

23:23

this out right now as I'm speaking

23:25

because people will say like it's not

23:27

about money, it's not about fame, it's

23:30

about community. But I'm a pretty like,

23:32

I don't love partying, socializing, but comedy

23:34

I almost accidentally found people who accepted

23:36

me, which I think has overall helped

23:38

my day-to-day like happiness. You've reminded me

23:40

of this. great book that I read

23:43

a long time ago called Flow State.

23:45

It's all about flow and it talks

23:47

about this idea that comedians, speakers, musicians,

23:49

athletes experience flow state. Flow state is

23:51

defined as when you're... skills meet the

23:53

challenge. So when your skills and challenge

23:55

are perfectly aligned, you experience flow. Well,

23:58

most of us experience are the opposite.

24:00

So we experience our skills being above

24:02

our challenge. So we feel bored and

24:04

frustrated and kind of lethargic. Or you

24:06

experience where your challenge is way above

24:08

your skills. And then you feel depressed

24:10

and you feel annoyed and you feel

24:13

angry, out of control. And so we've

24:15

got to constantly find a space or

24:17

find the thing where your challenges and

24:19

your skills meet. And I've always liked

24:21

that idea. And how does competition look

24:23

like as a comedian? To me, it

24:25

was like arts and crafts. I was

24:28

like, we're all just painting, and like,

24:30

I like your painting, you like mine.

24:32

And I think some comics get really

24:34

into the comparison game, because it's easy

24:36

to be like, why did they get

24:38

picked for that or they get picked

24:41

for that? And I think I don't

24:43

have an ego with comedy, because I

24:45

have an ego with tennis. Tennis was

24:47

my everything. So comedy to me was

24:49

something I... No one even anticipated me

24:51

to be in. So I have a

24:53

lot of gratitude. And it's almost like

24:56

because of my failure with tennis, I'm

24:58

able to have such a nice outlook

25:00

in the comedy space. Every now and

25:02

then, you know, I do have that

25:04

like tennis voice that comes in. I

25:06

remember before I shot my Netflix special,

25:08

it started to hit me the result

25:11

voice that I hope that with tennis,

25:13

which was like, oh, your whole career

25:15

is riding on this. And comedy I

25:17

consider myself. I consider myself. Oh, in

25:19

a flow state because I'm not trying

25:21

to be perfect on stage. It's about

25:23

my energy. It's vibes. I always say,

25:26

people don't remember the joke you said,

25:28

they remember how you made them feel.

25:30

Yes. But then for the Netflix special,

25:32

I felt like, oh my God, this

25:34

is like a final, like I have

25:36

to get every word right and the

25:39

perfectionist like tennis player started coming back.

25:41

I like called my therapist. I was

25:43

like. getting a beta blocker like I

25:45

was I started to get this crazy

25:47

anxiety and I feel like it was

25:49

almost like if you want to get

25:51

to the next level you have to

25:54

face those demons that you thought you

25:56

could just like leave by going to

25:58

another career. I'm still the same person

26:00

who was having trouble with tennis. So

26:02

I was able to kind of battle

26:04

some demons. I remember a quote that

26:06

I loved that was like, what if

26:09

you let your dreams come true? And

26:11

I remember being like, I think you're

26:13

not the same girl actually, you've grown,

26:15

you've matured, you're safer mentally. And right

26:17

before I went on, I was like,

26:19

you're in control. And your skills are

26:22

ready for the moment. And I felt

26:24

the same with Fallon, where I was

26:26

like, you could go up and fumble

26:28

all your words and blank out. Because

26:30

that was what I would do on

26:32

the court. Anything I was scared if

26:34

I would do, like, oh no, I

26:37

hope I don't double fault. I double

26:39

fault. Like it was so frustrating. And

26:41

comedy has been a way for me

26:43

to like... Just like a new avenue

26:45

for me to express myself in a

26:47

much more like safer positive place Yeah,

26:49

but I have the same like drive

26:52

and work ethic I think I had

26:54

with tennis I really love the way

26:56

you've analyzed both and I think anyone

26:58

who's listening right now Would gain so

27:00

much from it because I think so

27:02

many people are doing this mental exercise

27:04

in their head Yeah, like the pros

27:07

and cons of like if I stay

27:09

in this job. What's it gonna feel

27:11

like if I quit my job? If

27:13

I start a podcast, as the example

27:15

you gave, or if I do this,

27:17

what's he going to feel like? And

27:20

the truth is, this is what you've

27:22

got to move towards. And I also

27:24

think we're told a lot, like, keep

27:26

chasing your dreams, push through, don't quit.

27:28

So I'm not telling everyone to quit,

27:30

but I actually think that you know

27:32

when you're supposed to get out of

27:35

something. And I think I knew it

27:37

with tennis when the wins, I was

27:39

feeling nothing. It was like a drug

27:41

where if I lost I'd feel horrible

27:43

and then the winds I wasn't even

27:45

getting the highs anymore. So in my

27:47

head it's like, why am I doing

27:50

this if I'm not even getting a

27:52

high anymore? And I think that's when

27:54

I knew like, we're not even chasing

27:56

anything anymore. We're just trying to stay

27:58

afloat. And that's when you know like,

28:00

oh, the love is gone. And I

28:03

also tell people when they're confused about

28:05

jobs, relationships, I'm like, and if you've

28:07

made the wrong decision, go back. Then

28:09

no one's like, there's no police that

28:11

are policing your decisions of being like,

28:13

oops, I messed up. And sometimes when

28:15

you give people the freedom to be

28:18

like, you can go back, they leave.

28:20

I started to live a double

28:22

life when I was a teenager.

28:24

Responsible and driven and wild and

28:26

out of control. My head is pounding.

28:28

I'm confused. I don't know why I'm

28:30

in jail. It's hard to understand

28:32

what hope is when you're trapped

28:35

in a cycle of addiction. Addiction

28:37

took me to the darkest places.

28:39

At an AK-47 point at my

28:41

head. But one night, a new

28:44

door opened, and I made it

28:46

into the rooms of recovery.

28:48

The path would have roadblocks

28:50

and detours, stalls, and relapses.

28:52

But when I was feeling

28:54

the most lost, I found

28:56

hope with community. and I made my

28:58

way back. This season, join me

29:01

on my journey through addiction and

29:03

recovery. A story told in 12 steps.

29:05

Listen to Krams as part of the

29:07

Michaeluda Podcast Network. Available on

29:09

the I Heart Radio app,

29:11

Apple Podcast, or wherever you

29:14

get your podcast. Hi, I'm

29:16

Bob Pittman, Chairman and CEO of

29:18

I Heart Media. I'm excited to

29:20

share my podcast with you, Math

29:22

and Magic, stories from the Frontiers

29:25

of the Frontiers of Marketing. Make

29:27

sure to check out my recent

29:29

episode with legendary musician and philanthropist

29:31

Jewell. I didn't want a million

29:34

dollars, I wanted a career. I wanted

29:36

a way to figure out how to

29:38

do something that I loved for the

29:40

rest of my life. Join me as

29:42

we uncover innovations in data and analytics,

29:44

the math, and the ever-important creative spark,

29:47

the magic. Listen to math and magic,

29:49

stories from the frontiers of marketing on

29:51

the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcast, or

29:53

wherever you get your podcast. I'm so

29:55

sick of hearing men talk about

29:57

women's basketball. If only there were

29:59

a... W&B A player with her

30:02

own podcast I could listen to.

30:04

You rang? Hey, this is Lexi

30:06

Brown, W&B player, and professional yapper.

30:08

And this is Mariah Rose, you

30:10

may know me from Spilling the

30:13

Tea on Hoops for Hotties on

30:15

Tic-Tock. And we've got a new

30:17

podcast, full circle. Every Wednesday, we're

30:19

catching you up on what's going

30:21

on in women's basketball. And not

30:23

just in the W-N-B-A, but with

30:26

Athletes Unlimited Unlimited, and a little

30:28

bit of T. I know you

30:30

guys have seen a lot of former and

30:32

current basketball players telling their stories from their

30:34

point of view and I just think it's

30:37

time for the girlies to tap in. We

30:39

want to share all of the women's basketball

30:41

stories that you won't see anywhere else. Tune

30:44

in a full circle in I Heart Women's

30:46

Sports Production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports

30:48

and Entertainment. You can find us on the

30:50

I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever

30:53

you get your podcast. Yeah, what's really great

30:55

is that it sounds like you evaluate

30:57

things. as how you feel about them. And

30:59

so I wonder what's your relationship like

31:01

with wanting to be liked. I'm a

31:03

people-pleaser. I mean, I think to be

31:06

a comedian like you want everyone to

31:08

have like the best time ever and

31:10

that brings me joy. I think I

31:12

have to thank reality TV because my

31:14

reality TV, my biggest fear was to

31:16

be perceived. Not who I was. But when

31:18

you're 26, you don't know who you are.

31:21

Like I remember I'd go into social situations

31:23

and I put a lot of pressure on

31:25

myself to be like, I want everyone

31:27

to think I'm really funny and I'm really

31:30

nice and I'm and I care about

31:32

them and I'm smart and it's like putting

31:34

so much pressure on myself every time

31:36

I'd interact. I wanted to be control of

31:38

everything. I was like a type A

31:40

student and achiever and reality TV. You

31:42

give up control. My first two seasons

31:44

were good, my third season I

31:46

experienced what people like tell you

31:49

could happen which is like you

31:51

lose the narrative and they're not

31:53

showing your perspective anymore, they're showing

31:55

it through like other lenses and

31:57

it was my biggest fear to

31:59

be misunderstood. Like there's one thing for

32:01

tennis or comedy for people to be

32:03

like, I don't like how she played,

32:05

I don't like her jokes, but to

32:08

be perceived based on like things that

32:10

didn't actually happen was very painful for

32:12

me. And I think I realized I

32:14

also didn't have... the heart for it.

32:17

Like I was too sensitive to be

32:19

in a show that was about kind

32:21

of like who's good, who's bad, who

32:23

we're rooting for like W.W.E type stuff

32:25

where I was like, it really is

32:28

like sports for women of being like,

32:30

let's who we're gonna root for this

32:32

season, who actually sucks that we didn't

32:34

know. And that energy was I was

32:36

not good with it and I got

32:39

fired. up your chance and also I

32:41

was confused because I was like I

32:43

was engaging with everything I was responding

32:45

to everything I did everything everyone wanted

32:48

me to do so the math wasn't

32:50

math thing my like tennis mind of

32:52

like I worked hard I'm doing well

32:54

and I got fired if I didn't

32:56

get fired I wouldn't have a Netflix

32:59

special and I also would probably not

33:01

feel like myself so if also when

33:03

I got fired I laugh but um

33:05

Ooh, I got a fire in me.

33:07

And I think it goes back to

33:10

that rebirth thing. I realize the one

33:12

thing I can control that I'm so

33:14

proud of myself is that I can

33:16

handle adversity. The stuff I went through

33:19

with tennis, I went through some bad

33:21

stuff like yips, like Simone Biles type

33:23

stuff, not to that level obviously, but

33:25

I will bounce back. And I don't

33:27

care what people try to do to

33:30

me or what happens to me. The

33:32

cream will rise, like I'm kind of

33:34

annoying where like I'm all about justice

33:36

and I want everything to be in

33:38

the right place and for everyone be

33:41

treated right. That's not life, but you're

33:43

not a victim. You have to again

33:45

have the perspective of like, just because

33:47

I failed, just because I got fired.

33:50

That doesn't have to define you. So

33:52

I kind of got this. silly idea

33:54

where I was like, okay, I fired

33:56

from reality TV show and didn't feel

33:58

like I was shown to be who

34:01

I was authentically. What if I became

34:03

like the biggest comedian I could be?

34:05

Which again, not a normal thought someone

34:07

should have, but that's I always think

34:09

big. Like that's how I've always thought.

34:12

I really like put the head down

34:14

and was so motivated by the firing.

34:16

Like I wouldn't be here if I

34:18

wasn't fired. these people it was like

34:21

I hear you I see you let's

34:23

find a new outlet even I remember

34:25

after tennis when I just discovered comedy

34:27

I felt like a horse that was

34:29

like walking around lost and then finally

34:32

they put me in my lane and

34:34

I was like I found my lane

34:36

so I just wanted to find my

34:38

lane and then I could go yeah

34:40

and finding your lane is is very

34:43

fun because you're just like self- exploratory

34:45

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the code on purpose. I think it

35:54

was kind of like, you're not coming

35:56

back. And I think it's hard because

35:58

with a lot of people, your whole

36:00

thing is about your story, which is

36:02

like the ebbs and flows of evolving

36:05

and Bravo is very like, we'll break

36:07

you down, we'll build you back up.

36:09

So they kind of were like, and

36:11

this is the end for you. So

36:14

then it was like really in my

36:16

court to be no pun intended, but

36:18

to be like, where do fun stuff.

36:20

and will help me do fun stuff

36:22

later in my career. Wow, yeah. And

36:25

how many people on this zoom? I

36:27

think it was me and two people.

36:29

Okay, yeah, yeah. So it's quite intimate.

36:31

Yeah, yeah, it was, and it's also,

36:33

you're getting fired for like, being you.

36:36

So it was pretty hurt. Did you

36:38

cry? Yeah, yeah, for sure. And also

36:40

you felt like you lost all the

36:42

friends who. the show was about. It

36:45

basically was like, no one wants to

36:47

be friends with you anymore. Looking back,

36:49

it was such a blessing. And people

36:51

kept telling that to me. They were

36:53

like, you're so lucky. This is for

36:56

a reason. And don't you hate that

36:58

when you're going through it? It's the

37:00

worst when you're in there. Yes, this

37:02

is for a reason. And I'm not

37:04

you hate that when you're going through

37:07

it. It's the worst when you're in

37:09

there. Yes, this is for a reason.

37:11

And I need for a reason. This

37:13

is for a reason. This is for

37:16

a reason. really like pivotal moment of

37:18

like I had to love myself and

37:20

believe in myself because like no one

37:22

was going to fix it. Yeah. What's

37:24

the difference between self-confidence? and self-worth. And

37:27

how did you work on the latter?

37:29

I think I realized that my power

37:31

is how I deal with adversity. It's

37:33

not avoiding adversity. And I think for

37:35

people who deal with that in relationships,

37:38

I realize like when you marry someone,

37:40

you're dating someone, you're dealing with their

37:42

life, which is full of ups and

37:44

downs. So when someone's with you, it's

37:47

not about... being perfect and easygoing and

37:49

cool girl like that's what I wanted

37:51

to be but like realistically I just

37:53

got fired and you're finding someone who's

37:55

gonna be with you through the highs

37:58

and lows and no one's life is

38:00

perfect and no one's relationship's gonna be

38:02

perfect who's gonna be in the trenches

38:04

with you and like I found my

38:06

person to be in the trenches with

38:09

me. How did you stop yourself from

38:11

letting any bitterness or revenge mindset? creep

38:13

in. I do want to say I

38:15

fully do have a revenge mindset. But

38:18

my revenge is never to hurt people.

38:20

They're already hurt. They're hurting you. Obviously

38:22

they're hurt if they try to hurt

38:24

you. It's like the classic quote, but

38:26

like you being mad at them is

38:29

just like you adding venom to yourself.

38:31

And they clearly don't give a fuck

38:33

about you because they hurt you. I

38:35

realize that people's hate towards me was

38:37

because they saw something in me. And

38:40

I almost took it as a compliment.

38:42

Honestly, gang fired is there's some star

38:44

power to it. Like there's a, and

38:46

I'm not telling everyone, you know, get

38:49

fired because you'll find your purpose, but

38:51

it's like, I listened. I wasn't like

38:53

trying to undo the past. I was

38:55

like, I can't change what happened. I

38:57

can only change going forward. And I

39:00

think great athletes are like that. Like

39:02

you make a mistake, and instead of

39:04

harping on the mistake, that's not going

39:06

to help you in this next point.

39:08

Yeah. And I dealt with a lot

39:11

of depression. you know, questioning why, why,

39:13

why me. I wasn't just like completely,

39:15

you know, strong out of it, but

39:17

I do think I have a lot

39:20

of gratitude now. I even... I went

39:22

to some like hotel recently and someone

39:24

was complaining about like how the hotel

39:26

sucked or whatever or something happened and

39:28

I was like I remember when no

39:31

one would have even booked me to

39:33

be able to stay at this hotel

39:35

to perform. Absolutely. So the lows actually

39:37

have given me the mindset for success.

39:39

But also the right. seeds planted in

39:42

those loads. Because in one sense, that's

39:44

what I was getting at, that if

39:46

you had planted it out of this

39:48

bitterness, I'm gonna show you, you know,

39:51

you'll realize how great I am when

39:53

you do it from that perspective, which

39:55

is natural by the way, I'm not

39:57

even judging anyone who has that intention,

39:59

it's just that if that's the seed

40:02

you plant, then even if you make

40:04

it to that hotel or make it

40:06

to that podium or a Netflix special,

40:08

you will never... like you, they're not

40:10

going to like you. Like everyone's dealing

40:13

with their shit, but I do have

40:15

to say I don't forgive people. I'm

40:17

not going to be friends. Like I

40:19

learned from situations, but I also feel

40:22

like my particular situation, like I was

40:24

on a show about friends getting drunk

40:26

and starting fights with each other, and

40:28

I wasn't fitting in, and people kind

40:30

of turned on me, like I found

40:33

the most smart. powerful, inspiring people like,

40:35

Ali Reizman, has she been on this

40:37

pot? You have to have her on.

40:39

She's incredible gymnast, who was like the

40:42

captain of the Olympic team, was like,

40:44

hey, I love your special. I'd love

40:46

to get coffee. And I was sitting

40:48

there talking to this girl, feeling so

40:50

lucky that I can even like understand

40:53

how her brain works and be connecting

40:55

with her. Again, you go back and

40:57

you're like, thank God, I got kicked

40:59

out of where I didn't belong. commencement

41:01

speech that Fedra just gave and he

41:04

was talking about how he was talking

41:06

about how he's only won 80% of

41:08

games in his career and he's only

41:10

won just over 50% of points yes

41:13

in those games yes and so he

41:15

I was like, I have to get

41:17

so used to losing a point. I

41:19

always say as a tennis player, to

41:21

win 664, you lose 40% of the

41:24

points. Exactly. And I do think that

41:26

tennis mentality helped me, like, when something

41:28

bad would happen, I'd be like, yeah,

41:30

that's part of the ride. And I

41:32

also do love. storytelling. That's why like

41:35

this pot is so fun for me.

41:37

I love when bad things happen because

41:39

I am that person that's like, I

41:41

can't wait to go on a podcast

41:44

one day. And be like, I was

41:46

fired and sad and then I rose

41:48

from the ashes. And I do think

41:50

people connect with me because they see

41:52

like, okay, if she can do it,

41:55

I can do it. And that's what

41:57

I want people to feel because it's,

41:59

it really is just your mentality. When

42:01

you get up in the morning, you're

42:03

just like, you're just like, that past

42:06

pain defined me. When you're putting it

42:08

into comedy, where's all the content coming

42:10

from? The storytelling. Well, the funny about

42:12

comedy is I definitely never wanted to

42:15

be a stand-up comedian. And I think

42:17

it was a blessing in a way

42:19

that I very have my own distinct

42:21

voice in way I am on stage.

42:23

Like I wasn't ever trying to copy

42:26

anyone else. I didn't even think I

42:28

was going to get a Netflix special.

42:30

So when I did, I was kind

42:32

of just like... Cool. And then I've

42:34

been joking, I was like, what do

42:37

you do next? Do another Netflix special?

42:39

Like, how many Netflix specials does a

42:41

person need? But it's been a interesting

42:43

moment creatively, because with a stand-up, after

42:46

you do your hour, the materials burn,

42:48

do they call it? So unlike a

42:50

singer who can like, you write a

42:52

great hit and you could do it

42:54

forever. Like my hit is like, my

42:57

great hit. I love my gun joke

42:59

or my Queaf joke. I can't do

43:01

that anymore. Now I'm doing these new

43:03

material shows where it's basically like watching

43:05

your favorite athletes start as a beginner

43:08

So I'm literally on stage being like

43:10

Kankles are Kankles funny? Do we like

43:12

Kankles? And I've had some insecurities being

43:14

like this is difficult I went from

43:17

a tried and tested like hour that

43:19

I know every single moment what will

43:21

happen and the laughs I'll get to

43:23

being just like feeling naked on stage

43:25

and my husband's been inspiring because he's

43:28

like you don't even know like the

43:30

special's gonna be better than the last

43:32

one so I think with comedy I

43:34

like that it keeps me on my

43:36

toes it keeps me I don't feel

43:39

completely like I got this all the

43:41

time and I think it keeps me

43:43

motivated because I feel so I'm constantly

43:45

learning about myself and challenging myself last

43:48

week I even I went on stage

43:50

just with a bunch of papers, which

43:52

I've never done before, and just was

43:54

like, let's see what happens. So look,

43:56

maybe I'm sick in the head as

43:59

we're talking it out and I'm saying

44:01

it out loud, but I like to

44:03

put myself in uncomfortable positions and see

44:05

how I can get out of it.

44:07

I think that's what crowd work is,

44:10

which is something that I've... taken accustomed

44:12

to. I actually think it's the only

44:14

mindset, like if you know, if you

44:16

know what you're going to do every

44:19

month, you'll end up living the same

44:21

year again and again and again. And

44:23

part of me is jealous of those

44:25

people. I don't just say, there are

44:27

maybe some like neurotypical people that are

44:30

like, I want to just like, I

44:32

want to go to work, I want

44:34

to enjoy my friends, I want to

44:36

go home, and I'm so thankful for

44:38

this life. I think that they actually

44:41

are fulfilled and then there's people like

44:43

me who need some crazy shit to

44:45

like feel alive all the time and

44:47

I definitely am neuro divergent like I'm

44:50

realizing now like I do think I

44:52

have ADHD in like a powerful way.

44:54

Like when I'm doing a joke I

44:56

could like know what crowd work I'm

44:58

going to do next and I'm also

45:01

going to do a callback to this

45:03

joke hits but it's made me a

45:05

creative way of life. Like you know

45:07

you see a kid and you're like

45:10

this kid is happy chilling and you

45:12

see a kid that's just running around

45:14

being chaotic and you're like they're just

45:16

different vibes. Totally, totally, yeah and I

45:18

feel like everyone's needing to balance out

45:21

by doing the other. Yes. Someone who

45:23

lives. a crazy life like you can

45:25

find more joy from relationships and the

45:27

simple things and someone who's living a

45:29

more, as you called it, a neurotypical

45:32

life also needs to find new goals

45:34

and things to grow towards because both

45:36

end up feeling out of balance and

45:38

out of sync. Are you good at

45:41

vacationing? I really enjoy it. I wouldn't

45:43

say I'm good at it in the

45:45

sense of, I don't, like, I could

45:47

go years and probably did in the

45:49

beginning and then I got a bit

45:52

better at it and then probably got

45:54

bad at it again. I'm okay at

45:56

it, I'd say. I've recently, like this

45:58

summer, after the special, I was like,

46:00

take some time. And like, you wake

46:03

up and you're like, what are we

46:05

doing? it's always like when you're not

46:07

working you're just not like making money

46:09

or whatever you'll be like okay that's

46:12

relaxed and then takes you like four

46:14

days to relax then you're finally relaxed

46:16

and it's like we got to go

46:18

back home and you're like oh no

46:20

yeah I'm really lucky I can like

46:23

lock into any mode that I mean

46:25

that's good well you meditate more than

46:27

me but but finding the time to

46:29

get away that's what I was like

46:31

you have to prioritize prioritize that I'm

46:34

not I'm okay to that I start

46:36

my year off in India, back of

46:38

the monastery, taking time out, and I've

46:40

done that every year religiously for the

46:43

past seven years or whatever it is,

46:45

maybe even more now. And that to

46:47

me is, I'm good at doing that.

46:49

I heard that Doolipa always takes July

46:51

and August off. I also could have

46:54

started a rumor there, but I heard

46:56

that and I was like, Doolipa is

46:58

always like crushing it. And part of

47:00

me loved that, not mean it's like

47:02

European or something, like European or something,

47:05

but I'm realizing in this like, in

47:07

this like, like, like, like, like, No

47:09

one's going to make you take a

47:11

break and you actually have to have

47:14

the self-love Even if you think you

47:16

don't need it to be like you

47:18

do need to have balance and I'm

47:20

a workaholic and I love the highs

47:22

of it But I've also been working

47:25

on like also when you're relaxing like

47:27

don't be to yourself. Don't spend the

47:29

whole day relaxing being like you should

47:31

have gone to Pilates. So it's you,

47:33

yeah, creating the right narrative in your

47:36

head of like that you're in the

47:38

right space at the right time is

47:40

kind of what I've been working on.

47:42

Yeah, now that you've started a crazy

47:45

rumor about doing different. No, you're interested.

47:47

You're like, okay. No, it's good to

47:49

ask you. What's the craziest rumor you've

47:51

ever heard about yourself? I mean, honestly,

47:53

the biggest rumors were like stuff that

47:56

would happen on reality TV, because like

47:58

there would be scenes where the back

48:00

of my head would say something to

48:02

someone. And I was like, that was

48:04

not what the response was. So it

48:07

was like living with like moments that

48:09

just didn't happen that you had to

48:11

kind of just like own. I didn't

48:13

really own it. I would be like,

48:16

no, it didn't happen. I was like,

48:18

shut up, stupid. But I think my

48:20

support system has been really great. I

48:22

took it for granted or I just

48:24

I have very small support system so

48:27

I never thought that I was like

48:29

special in any way but now I'm

48:31

realizing like it really is quality over

48:33

quantity like I always have that one

48:35

best friend my mom and my dad

48:38

my brother and my husband maybe a

48:40

couple other friends depending on the time

48:42

and I thought like you're kind of

48:44

a lonely bitch but then these people

48:47

are so special that I can call

48:49

it any time and they get me

48:51

so well that um I'm realizing more

48:53

like, oh, they got me through that.

48:55

Like, I could not have done it

48:58

alone. Yeah. My poor mom, the calls

49:00

she has to take. That's so wonderful

49:02

to hear though. And it's interesting, isn't

49:04

it? Because I think as things grow

49:07

old, so you realize. the different values

49:09

of your community as well as you

49:11

get older you realize the value that

49:13

they play in different you go through

49:15

more you go through more and so

49:18

you rely on them for more things

49:20

like when you're a kid maybe they

49:22

helped you move to college or maybe

49:24

they you know it's things like that

49:26

whereas when you grow up you're like

49:29

no I just called you and cried

49:31

and I remember for me it was

49:33

like my mom saying something I was

49:35

going through a tough time and I

49:38

don't really call my mom for advice

49:40

I never have yeah She always been

49:42

loving and supported. It's very guy of

49:44

you. Like my brother will call my

49:46

mom like once a month and I

49:49

call it. I'm calling her, I'm like,

49:51

I'm eating chicken nuggets. Yeah, exactly. That's

49:53

my wife. Like, my wife will call

49:55

her mom like six times a day.

49:57

And I literally call my mom once

50:00

a month. And I remember my mom

50:02

just like once, like we were on

50:04

a call and I didn't tell her

50:06

things were hard. She can sense that

50:09

things were hard. This was like seven,

50:11

seven, eight years ago. Seven, eight years

50:13

ago, eight years ago. motivational things to

50:15

me ever. And she never does that.

50:17

So like I'm not used to that

50:20

from her. And it was about me

50:22

and about something in my past, I'll

50:24

tell you off camera later. And it

50:26

was just one of those things that

50:28

I was like, no way, like I

50:31

didn't even know we had that relationship.

50:33

Or you just gave me like a

50:35

really big gift in my, I was

50:37

just turning 30 maybe, like at that

50:40

time, and I couldn't believe that she

50:42

said that to me then. And so.

50:44

I would never have realized that if

50:46

I wasn't going through that point in

50:48

my life. Yes. And she didn't sense

50:51

it. So I didn't see the value

50:53

my mom could offer me. It's so

50:55

funny how heavy a mom's words could

50:57

be. So heavy. Like I remember, I

50:59

was in tennis craziness and I called

51:02

my mom and I just was like,

51:04

just dark. And my mom was like,

51:06

you're not being yourself. And I was

51:08

like, who, what do you even mean?

51:11

And she's like, you're a light-hearteded-hearted funny,

51:13

funny, funny, like, like, like, like, like,

51:15

like, I don't know who this is

51:17

right now, but I'm just, you know,

51:19

trying to figure out who I am.

51:22

It's an 18-year-old. And looking back, I'm

51:24

like, she's so right that I was,

51:26

I was turning it to someone I

51:28

wasn't because I was just forcing things.

51:30

I also think with friendships and relationships

51:33

in your 30s, you start being like...

51:35

I don't have time to force things

51:37

and also why would I force anything?

51:39

Like me and you for example, like

51:42

I feel like if I was like,

51:44

I need Jay to like me and

51:46

like was obsessed with like connecting with

51:48

you, who knows if that would have

51:50

worked? But like we naturally hit it

51:53

off and we have a friendship where

51:55

like I feel like sometimes people will

51:57

be like, if I ask them to

51:59

get coffee and I do this, I

52:01

live my... life kind of like put

52:04

your energy out there and the right

52:06

energies will come back yeah three authentic

52:08

relationships are better than thousands of people

52:10

that you're like they wouldn't be there

52:13

for me when I need to bury

52:15

a body yeah I'm still a great

52:17

trying to get you to like that

52:19

I was trying to agree with you

52:21

more there's vibes this good vibe yeah

52:23

yeah no for sure and I can

52:25

agree with you more there isn't I

52:28

think tactics and hacks and things like

52:30

that get you very, don't get you

52:32

very far with humans. Like they work

52:34

on things, they work on tools, they

52:37

work on strategy and projects and things

52:39

like that, but they don't really work

52:41

well with people. I also find with

52:44

dating, I used to be like,

52:46

if I construct the perfect text message,

52:48

he's gonna realize that I'm fucking

52:50

cool. I was so into, I get

52:52

nervous and be like, if I say

52:54

this or like I wasn't funny enough.

52:56

And looking back, you're like, like. The

52:59

emoji or not emoji did not change.

53:01

It's funny because my husband, he met

53:03

me when I was in the middle

53:05

of this like insane reality TV time,

53:07

which arguably like I was crying more

53:09

than I've ever cried before. Like that's

53:11

not what it's like being with me.

53:13

I have other issues, but crying was

53:15

not a thing. So it's talk about

53:17

like someone loving you at your worst.

53:19

It's almost like he saw me as like

53:22

an open wound and he loved me through

53:24

that. So I joke now. I'm like first

53:26

date. Get in a fight, like start crying,

53:28

tell him all your trauma and like if

53:30

he can't with it, be on to the

53:33

next one, why are we pretending to be

53:35

perfect for three years and then realizing you

53:37

hate that? I really thought that like if

53:39

I was perfect, perfect things would happen to

53:42

me and that's just not. the game so

53:44

we've talked so much about your confidence in

53:46

these spaces how we apply to your love

53:48

life like what was that like in relationship

53:50

and dating were you as analytical were you

53:52

able to make sense of stuff or in

53:54

that area where you like oh my god it's

53:56

so funny how everything so similar I was like

53:58

tennis were like even when I I was like,

54:00

could not have served. I had this

54:02

confidence that I could still win. And

54:05

I did win a lot. But like

54:07

I always, I joke, like I always

54:09

think everyone loves me. Like I'm, I'll

54:11

have friends. I'll walk into a room,

54:13

like I have reverse biomorphia, like I

54:15

think everyone's attracted to me. But I

54:18

just had this confidence that no matter

54:20

what was going on, like that I'll

54:22

fall in love and I'll have the

54:24

most amazing relationship and everyone's attracted to

54:26

me and wants to be with me.

54:28

And that was just what I put

54:31

into the world. But I also had an

54:33

ego with it where like I realized

54:35

that I would go after emotionally unavailable

54:37

guys, because I wasn't ready. I was

54:39

like no one's rejecting me. Like no one's

54:41

rejecting me. And I'd go after like really

54:43

good looking men who I didn't respect emotionally

54:46

so that if it didn't work out I'd

54:48

be like he's fucking stupid. Like obviously I

54:50

didn't like him or like they wouldn't make

54:52

me laugh or like I liked having hot

54:55

men around me. And it is kind of

54:57

I always like male dominates bases. I'm wearing

54:59

a tie right now, but I kind of

55:01

like I thought it was powerful to be

55:03

like a girl that like could date a

55:06

lot of hot guys. It's like I didn't

55:08

want to be fully seen to be fully

55:10

seen. And I finally, like, my

55:12

husband is a guy who,

55:14

very good looking, but I

55:17

really respect emotionally.

55:19

And he sees me and

55:21

he calls me out on stuff

55:23

and is okay with all the

55:25

things that come with me. And

55:27

it was, like, scary and vulnerable,

55:30

but it also felt really

55:32

safe because I think it

55:34

was with the right person.

55:36

I have been in relationships

55:38

where I felt confident like

55:40

this guy on paper is like

55:42

everything someone would want like girls probably

55:44

look and go like oh yeah he's

55:46

great but I didn't feel like myself

55:49

and I'm proud of myself I got out

55:51

of a relationship when I was younger that

55:53

like other people were like why would you

55:55

leave that guy but because when I

55:57

was alone at night I didn't feel like I

55:59

was being able to be myself with

56:01

him. And I got out of it. And

56:04

I realized your partner, if they're not an

56:06

asset, I don't mean it, like

56:08

we have to make everything great

56:10

and life happy. No, if they're

56:12

not enhancing and supporting you and

56:14

who you are, there's no reason

56:16

to be in a relationship. Yeah.

56:18

Someone said something kind of powerful

56:20

that the person you're with directly

56:22

reflects how much you love yourself.

56:24

Even though I was like dating and

56:26

confident. I wasn't like really putting

56:28

myself out there fully because I

56:31

didn't know if someone really saw

56:33

me. They would be scary if they

56:35

didn't love me. So I was

56:37

like, well, I don't love them.

56:39

I don't need them. But I

56:41

honestly think having a bad relationship

56:43

that hurts your mental health is so

56:46

nice because bear with me. You

56:48

start realizing I don't want to

56:50

be in a relationship with

56:52

being a relationship. It's too

56:54

risky. If someone... is bringing me down,

56:56

like I'd really, really rather be single

56:59

100% of the time. So once I

57:01

got in that mentality, like in my

57:03

late 20s, when the right guy finally

57:06

came, I knew it because I wasn't

57:08

just dating to date. Dr. Joy

57:10

here, you may know me from

57:13

Therapy for Black Girls, where we're

57:15

celebrating 400 episodes of the podcast.

57:17

That's a whole lot of girl, me

57:19

too moments. For years, we've

57:21

had deep, thoughtful, and inspiring

57:24

conversations about black women's mental

57:26

health. And now, we're celebrating

57:28

this milestone in a big

57:31

way. In this special episode,

57:33

Peloson Yoga, Chelsea, Chelsea, Chelsea,

57:35

Chelsea, Chelsea, Chelsea, Chelsea,

57:37

Chelsea, Chelsea, I can't control

57:40

my child. I can't control anyone

57:42

outside the way that I govern

57:44

myself in this world. And the

57:46

celebration doesn't stop there. We'll continue

57:48

this milestone with Dr. Lauren Mims,

57:50

who joins me to discuss the

57:52

powerful yet sometimes challenging transition from

57:54

girlhood to womanhood for black men's.

57:56

Together we explore how we navigate

57:58

this transformative journey. with strength and

58:01

grace. Black Girl Hood is giggling.

58:03

It's sisterhood, but it is also,

58:06

I think, focusing on learning how

58:08

to cope with really difficult things

58:10

that are happening. With insights like

58:13

these, this 400th episode celebration is

58:15

won for the books. Listen to Therapy

58:17

for Black Girls on the I-Hart

58:20

Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever

58:22

you get your podcast. You

58:26

are cordially invited to the

58:29

hottest party in professional

58:31

sports. I'm Tisha Allen, former

58:33

golf professional, and the host of

58:35

Welcome to the Party. Your newest

58:38

obsession about the wonderful world that

58:40

is women's golf. Featuring interviews with

58:42

top players on tour, like LPGA

58:45

superstar, Angelian. I really just sat

58:47

myself down at the end of

58:49

2022 and I was like, either

58:52

we make it or we quit.

58:54

expert tips to help improve your

58:56

swing, and the craziest stories to

58:59

come out of your friendly neighborhood

59:01

country club. The drinks were

59:03

flowing, they were like twirking

59:05

all over the place, vaping,

59:08

they're pissing in the middle

59:10

of the course. Women's golf

59:12

is a wild ride, full

59:14

of big personalities, remarkable athleticism,

59:16

fierce competition, and a generation

59:18

of women hell bent on

59:20

shaking that glass feeling. Welcome

59:22

to the Party with Tisha

59:25

Allen is an I-Hurt Women's

59:27

Sports Production and Partnership with

59:29

Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment.

59:31

Listen to Welcome to the Party,

59:33

that's P-A-R-T-E-E, on the I-Hurt Radio

59:36

app, Apple Podcast, or wherever

59:38

you get your podcast. I'm so sick

59:40

of hearing men talk about women's basketball.

59:42

If only there were a professional W-N-B-A

59:45

player with her own podcast I could

59:47

listen to. You rang? Hey, this is

59:49

Lexi Brown, W&B player, and professional yapper.

59:51

And this is Mariah Rose. You may

59:54

know me from Spilling the Tea on

59:56

Hoops for Hotties on TikTok. And we've

59:58

got a new pop. podcast, full circle.

1:00:01

Every Wednesday, we're catching you up on

1:00:03

what's going on in women's basketball. And

1:00:05

not just in the W&BA, but with

1:00:07

Athletes Unlimited, unrivaled, and college basketball. We've

1:00:09

got you with analysis, inside stories, and

1:00:11

a little bit of tea. I know

1:00:13

you guys have seen a lot of

1:00:16

former and current basketball players telling their

1:00:18

stories from their point of view, and

1:00:20

I just think it's time for the

1:00:22

girlies to tap in. We want to

1:00:24

share all of the women's basketball stories

1:00:26

that you won't see anywhere else. Tune

1:00:28

in a full circle, an I-heart women's

1:00:30

sports production, in partnership with Deep Blue

1:00:33

Sports and Entertainment. You can find us

1:00:35

on the I-heart radio app, Apple Podcast,

1:00:37

or wherever you get your podcast. Yeah, I feel

1:00:39

like so many of the people I know right

1:00:41

now are just struggling with dating. Like, I'm sure

1:00:44

you have loads of single friends too. Or, yeah,

1:00:46

right, you were just like, Jay, can you introduce

1:00:48

me to someone? Or I don't know how to

1:00:50

meet someone, I'm doing this, I'm doing this, I'm

1:00:52

doing that. And doing that. And it feels like.

1:00:54

And it feels like. it's just the wild wild

1:00:57

rest for people like it's so hard I know

1:00:59

at least that's how it seems my advice I

1:01:01

really do joke about it that like first

1:01:03

date if you go back to his

1:01:05

apartment like hide his remote and see

1:01:07

what his true character is like because

1:01:09

I really feel especially in LA everyone's

1:01:11

hot and I'm like I could get

1:01:14

along with a hot person for months

1:01:16

just before I like realize what's

1:01:18

going on and I think life is

1:01:20

so short it's like You can convince

1:01:22

yourself that so many people are great

1:01:24

for you, but like stop lying to

1:01:26

yourself and immediately just be like,

1:01:28

do you feel like yourself with them?

1:01:30

And is it someone that you want

1:01:32

to sit on the couch with for

1:01:34

hours? Let's stop with the Instagram bullshit.

1:01:36

Let's stop with how it looks aesthetically

1:01:38

and find someone that's good for your

1:01:40

soul. Because your relationship is like a

1:01:43

mirror where like it's a voice that...

1:01:45

you have to listen to for the rest

1:01:47

of your life. Make sure that voice is

1:01:49

someone you want to talk to and like

1:01:51

they create the vibe of your life. I

1:01:53

love quitting, I love getting out of stuff.

1:01:55

If you're not with the right person,

1:01:57

like there is a right person there.

1:01:59

Get out. Yeah. No, but I think you're so

1:02:02

right that the halo effect so strong, like we

1:02:04

can stay with someone off of like the tiniest

1:02:06

thing. Like people will stay in a relationship

1:02:08

because someone's hot, because someone makes lots of

1:02:10

money, because someone's really good at one thing.

1:02:12

Yes. And it's so easy to do that

1:02:15

because the halo effect is so powerful. You

1:02:17

are saying in a very sincere way, like,

1:02:19

do you want to listen to their voice

1:02:21

for the rest of your life? Yeah. And

1:02:23

I was just thinking of someone going to

1:02:25

me, I really like the sound of his

1:02:27

voice, but not really the content of what

1:02:30

they're saying or who they are, and what

1:02:32

you're talking about, someone's soul. And it's... It's

1:02:34

so hard for our brains to detach from

1:02:36

that which is pleasurable to that which

1:02:38

is actually meaningful. Oh my god, you're

1:02:40

so right. I loved having a crush.

1:02:42

I would make it up. He would

1:02:44

just have to show like a little

1:02:46

bit and I was like, I love

1:02:48

this. I want to wake up with

1:02:50

that hide. Like, is it going to

1:02:52

text me? And then you finally like

1:02:54

meet him and you're like, oh my

1:02:56

god. This is not it. It took

1:02:58

me a while. I would really just

1:03:00

be like, like, like, you love yourself.

1:03:03

The person you're with is showing how

1:03:05

much you love yourself. You deserve the

1:03:07

best. Also with someone who's just got

1:03:09

married, I do have to say, when

1:03:11

you're growing up, you're like, who's my

1:03:13

soulmate? Who's my soulmate? And not to

1:03:15

be a Debbie Downer, I believe there

1:03:17

are soulmates. I don't think at all

1:03:19

that there's one person. I really think

1:03:21

of marriage as like a best friend

1:03:23

in that it's very similar to

1:03:26

friendships. You know when you meet someone, like

1:03:28

I'll meet a girl? immediately, I'm like, where

1:03:30

the fuck has this bitch been all my

1:03:32

life? She's amazing, I'm obsessed with her. And

1:03:34

you'll have a couple of those kind of

1:03:36

relationships in your life, and that's how I

1:03:38

feel with men as well, romantic relationships. So

1:03:41

it's like, the person I'm with right now, he's

1:03:43

so right for me, he's amazing. I do

1:03:45

think there's other people in the world that

1:03:47

potentially I could have married and had that

1:03:49

I haven't met. So it's like you create

1:03:51

your own adventure and you find the person

1:03:53

that's right for you in that moment. People

1:03:55

will be mad like, why did I marry

1:03:57

this guy? And I'm like, maybe he was

1:03:59

right for you. in 1997, or whatever it

1:04:01

happened, he was perfect for you in

1:04:03

that time. So stop putting so much

1:04:05

pressure on this one insane thing. It's

1:04:07

like, no, it's vibes and it's like

1:04:09

finding your best friend. And you'll have a

1:04:11

lot of beautiful relationships in your life.

1:04:14

What was some of the surprising

1:04:16

challenges that came up in marriage

1:04:18

that maybe you didn't expect? I

1:04:20

do have to say. My husband has

1:04:22

a joke, he's a comedian too. He

1:04:24

actually has a really good bit about

1:04:26

mindfulness that I feel like you would

1:04:28

like. Oh, I love it. I'll send

1:04:30

it to you, but yeah. Yeah, please

1:04:32

do, yeah. It's just about how mindfulness,

1:04:34

he jokes about back then, it was

1:04:36

just like watching precipitation go down. He's

1:04:38

like, you can't even sit and take

1:04:40

a shit without like scrolling. Like mindfulness

1:04:43

used to just be existing, I but

1:04:45

it was about. marriage how he'll tell

1:04:47

people like we don't spend a lot

1:04:49

of time together because I'm on the

1:04:51

road a lot he's on the road

1:04:53

and how people like 35 and under

1:04:55

like oh that must be really hard

1:04:57

but that people 35 and over like

1:04:59

you guys are gonna make it. We

1:05:01

never get into that like roommate situation

1:05:04

where you start feeling like oh this

1:05:06

is just a roommate that I have

1:05:08

that lives with me. It stays kind

1:05:11

of exciting because we don't have that

1:05:13

routine. Our careers are very kind of

1:05:15

crazy. And we're really good at communicating.

1:05:17

I think the funny thing about

1:05:20

marriage is that dating is a

1:05:22

lot of chasing. There's a lot

1:05:24

of like, are we going to get

1:05:26

engaged? Are we going to get married?

1:05:28

What is this going to be? And

1:05:30

then you become it. It reminds me

1:05:33

of life where like if you don't love

1:05:35

the journey, there's no point to

1:05:37

it. And you realize like, oh,

1:05:39

this isn't about getting the ring.

1:05:41

Like, this is just about finding

1:05:43

someone I want to be with.

1:05:45

I'm not playing any more games. The

1:05:47

games are over. And I liked

1:05:49

kind of being like, what's going

1:05:51

to happen? And there's no game

1:05:54

playing. That's your person. Yeah, I

1:05:56

remember reading a study that talked

1:05:58

about how what we really get addicted

1:06:01

to at the beginning of a relationship

1:06:03

is stress and excitement. So the excitement

1:06:05

of, I just texted them, the stress

1:06:07

of, will they text me back? The

1:06:09

excitement of like, I just told all

1:06:11

my friends about this guy, the stress

1:06:13

of... I don't know if he's talking

1:06:15

about me to his friends. And so

1:06:17

that keeps you, it's what you're saying,

1:06:19

the game keeps you going. And then

1:06:21

all of a sudden when you actually

1:06:24

end up with someone, then it's just

1:06:26

peaceful. Yeah. And then everyone goes, wait

1:06:28

a minute, there's no excitement anymore. It's

1:06:30

like, no, no, no, no, you were

1:06:32

just addicted to stress. Like, it's not.

1:06:34

And I do have to say the

1:06:36

peacefulness of marriage has been really nice

1:06:38

for me in terms. being myself, I

1:06:40

used to like not be able to

1:06:42

enjoy friends sometimes because I'm sitting there

1:06:44

thinking about a guy. We're at dinner

1:06:46

and I'm just like, I don't really

1:06:48

care about this because like so and

1:06:50

so hasn't texted me back, where now

1:06:52

I have this like comfort of like

1:06:55

I have my person who's my sidekick

1:06:57

and there for me, and I can

1:06:59

actually be myself more, which has been

1:07:01

really nice. When I was single, I

1:07:03

was boy crazy and I was like

1:07:05

putting it on a pedestal, I've been

1:07:07

that. You just, you don't want to

1:07:09

force it? Yeah. My ultimate dating tip

1:07:11

is that... Do the things you love and

1:07:13

it'll track people who will love you Where

1:07:15

it's I tell people like I know this

1:07:18

is corny, but like if you like

1:07:20

volleyball join a volleyball league You can't

1:07:22

just like sit around hoping like be

1:07:24

you and they will come Yeah, yeah,

1:07:26

the baseball field that's that it's not

1:07:28

you know, we're two years in it's

1:07:30

early, but I found someone who keeps

1:07:33

me like excited Yeah, so that's possible.

1:07:35

It's not like oh you meet someone

1:07:37

and then you're just like Yeah, we're

1:07:39

bored. No, like I found someone who

1:07:41

he definitely is emotionally like, we say

1:07:43

like our love language is laughter. Yeah.

1:07:45

So we're making fun of each other

1:07:47

and it's like we're constantly

1:07:49

playing the game of how can we make

1:07:52

each other laugh. Absolutely. Yeah, we

1:07:54

banter all day, me and my

1:07:56

wife. It's so important. You guys

1:07:58

have a really fun dynamic. Laughter's

1:08:00

love is our love language for sure

1:08:02

too. It has to be. We always

1:08:04

feel like when we're around new people

1:08:06

or new couples, they're like, do you

1:08:08

have issues with each other? I'm like,

1:08:10

no, no, no, this is just, this

1:08:12

is who we are. Like, we're constantly

1:08:14

bantering and that's, that's our way of

1:08:17

sharing love to each other and it

1:08:19

works for us. And I can also

1:08:21

get really emotional. No, the house

1:08:23

feels different. Like it's not the

1:08:25

same because I'm so used to

1:08:28

just walking back there, seeing her,

1:08:30

giving her a hug, whatever it

1:08:32

is, even in the work then.

1:08:35

And then when she's traveling, I'm

1:08:37

like, no, where is she? But I love

1:08:39

the idea of missing her. It

1:08:42

works. Yes, yes. I was going

1:08:44

to say it makes you not

1:08:46

take for granted them being there

1:08:48

when you wake up. Yeah. It's

1:08:50

just natural. And I joke, like,

1:08:52

be with some, your relationship is a

1:08:54

conversation you have for the rest of

1:08:56

your life. Like, do you want to

1:08:58

have it? I saw, like, a random,

1:09:01

probably a tic-talk, about how the person

1:09:03

you marry is the person that's going

1:09:05

to be with you when, like, your

1:09:07

parents pass away. Like, who do you

1:09:09

want to be with you in the

1:09:11

wedding photo with you? Mike drop. Yeah.

1:09:13

That's real. No, that's so real. That's

1:09:16

the realest thing ever. I wish I

1:09:18

wish more people would internalize that because

1:09:20

that is exactly what it is and

1:09:22

having and I have a friend who

1:09:24

was with this partner through the loss of

1:09:26

her mom recently and it was the hardest

1:09:28

thing for her and he was he was

1:09:31

the best partner I think she could

1:09:33

have had during that time and she needed

1:09:35

him and I needed my husband during

1:09:37

my hard time and I also think that

1:09:39

trauma bonding is real obviously trauma bonding

1:09:42

can be bad but like I think

1:09:44

we are so much powerful of a

1:09:46

couple because early on we were dealing

1:09:49

with so much adversity that now when

1:09:51

something happens, like we're so easily able

1:09:53

to handle it. So when bad things

1:09:56

happen to you when you're in a

1:09:58

relationship, it's actually gonna. to show you

1:10:00

if you're in the right relationship, which

1:10:02

is awesome. Yeah. I wanted to pivot slightly

1:10:04

because I feel like you pointed out your

1:10:07

tie earlier, and I think this is a

1:10:09

really great outfit. We have to talk about

1:10:11

it, but you know, I feel like your

1:10:13

whole career from day one, it's been operating

1:10:15

in... a male dominant, like even, I

1:10:17

mean this article headline was, so this

1:10:19

one 15 years ago, New York Times,

1:10:22

she plays with boys and rivals don't

1:10:24

like it. Yeah, it's crazy title. It's

1:10:26

like 15 years ago, even now like

1:10:28

comedies definitely more male dominated has been.

1:10:30

Yeah. And I think it's a

1:10:33

really interesting thing because I've been

1:10:35

speaking to a lot of my male friends recently,

1:10:37

either married or... have girlfriends, long-term relationships,

1:10:39

and a lot of the women they're

1:10:42

with feel really scared about pivoting careers,

1:10:44

feel scared about changing their identity, about

1:10:46

how they're perceived in their small community

1:10:48

of friends. And these aren't people who

1:10:50

are saying, I want to be really

1:10:53

famous, or I want to be really

1:10:55

rich. It's just people thinking like, maybe

1:10:57

I don't want to be a doctor, or

1:10:59

maybe I do want to be a yoga

1:11:01

instructor, or maybe I do want to do

1:11:04

fitness, or whatever it is. It's people making

1:11:06

just genuine choices. And it's funny because when

1:11:08

I'll talk to my guy friends about it,

1:11:10

they've all done it. And it feels really

1:11:12

easy for a guy to like somewhat change

1:11:14

his perception and identity, whereas for women it

1:11:16

feels a bit harder. If you had to

1:11:18

say something to them, what would you say

1:11:21

to women who are feeling like it's hard?

1:11:23

Two things. One, I do think that women

1:11:25

do have, like, they have the biological clock

1:11:27

in their head, where they're like, okay, if

1:11:29

I switch this and then I have kids

1:11:31

at this time and then I'll be behind

1:11:33

it. Like, they're dealing with, like, that kind

1:11:35

of stuff. I do have to do a

1:11:37

shout out to my parents. I think I

1:11:39

was raised a very... I don't know if it

1:11:41

was unique, but I was raised very like

1:11:43

genderless. Like I wore whatever clothes I wanted

1:11:46

to wear. My dad really treated me. I

1:11:48

wouldn't even say like a boy, just like

1:11:50

I was never said I was pretty. It

1:11:52

was about like being hardworking and I think

1:11:54

growing up as I got older and people

1:11:56

started to be like, you're a girl, you're

1:11:58

not allowed to do. I was like, that's

1:12:01

hilarious. And I'm going to show you

1:12:03

that that's not true. And I think

1:12:05

even like wearing the tie, I joked

1:12:07

that like, it makes me feel people

1:12:09

are like listening to me more like

1:12:11

I could say things I don't know

1:12:14

about and people are like, she sounds

1:12:16

like she knows what she's talking about.

1:12:18

And I love playing with the gender

1:12:20

roles because I think they're socially constructed

1:12:22

in a way. But I also do

1:12:24

realize now that I'm I'm 33. and

1:12:26

some male comics, their careers are popping

1:12:28

off like mine, where I'm like, if I

1:12:30

want to have a kid, I have to

1:12:33

do it in the next couple of years,

1:12:35

how is that going to affect my trajectory,

1:12:37

where they cannot have, they don't give a

1:12:39

fuck about that. And I'm used to being

1:12:42

like, there's no difference between me and you.

1:12:44

But then I realize, oh shit, there is

1:12:46

differences, but I like my feminism, people get

1:12:48

confused thinking that feminists are like,

1:12:50

men and women are equal or

1:12:53

not. We're very different. We're

1:12:55

very different. in so many growing up

1:12:57

as I got older and people started

1:12:59

to be like you're a girl you're

1:13:01

not allowed to do that I was

1:13:03

like that's hilarious and I'm going to

1:13:06

show you that that's not true and I

1:13:08

think even like wearing the tie I joked

1:13:10

that like it makes me feel People are

1:13:12

like listening to me more like I could

1:13:15

say things I don't know about and people

1:13:17

are like she sounds like she knows what

1:13:19

she's talking about and I love playing with

1:13:21

the gender roles because I think they're socially

1:13:23

constructed in a way but I also do

1:13:26

realize now that I'm I'm 33 and some

1:13:28

male comics their careers are popping off like

1:13:30

mine where I'm like if I want to

1:13:32

have a kid I have to do it

1:13:34

in the next couple years how is that

1:13:37

going to affect my trajectory where they cannot

1:13:39

have they don't give off. about that. And

1:13:41

I'm used to being like, there's no difference

1:13:43

between me and you. But then I realize

1:13:45

like, oh shit, there is differences. But I

1:13:47

like to be in terms of like my

1:13:49

feminism, people get confused thinking that

1:13:51

feminists are like, men and women

1:13:53

are equal or not. We're very different

1:13:55

in so many beautiful ways. And

1:13:58

like we want equal opportunity. opportunities,

1:14:00

but we're going to go about it

1:14:02

our own way. So it's finding like

1:14:04

what is your superpower as a woman.

1:14:06

And I do think with women, this

1:14:08

is good. Women love to be over

1:14:10

prepared and overqualified for things before we

1:14:12

do it. I'm working on this new

1:14:14

bit about like, I say a lot

1:14:17

of men are pilots because no woman

1:14:19

would just wake up and be like.

1:14:21

I could fly a plane. She would

1:14:23

have to be like so good at

1:14:25

flying planes to finally be like, can

1:14:27

I fly a plane? And then I

1:14:29

joke, like if women flew planes, we'd

1:14:31

literally be lost all the time and

1:14:33

like need snacks and stuff like that.

1:14:35

But anyway, it's multifaceted. So I think

1:14:37

with women, stop waiting to be like

1:14:40

over prepared to do something. Good advice.

1:14:42

And I think so many men. Will

1:14:44

just be like a little bit confident

1:14:46

and be like I'll figure it out

1:14:48

where women like even a job interviews

1:14:50

I feel like men will be like

1:14:52

I'll figure it out where girls will

1:14:54

be have to be so over prepared

1:14:56

to even go into the interview Like

1:14:58

even when I was like a sports

1:15:01

reporter for a second I had to

1:15:03

show that I knew sports. You're not

1:15:05

qualified for I was not qualified to

1:15:07

get a Netflix special, but I did

1:15:09

it. If you looked at my resume,

1:15:11

you'd say, that girl should not have

1:15:13

a Netflix special. But I did, and

1:15:15

it was top five on Netflix. So

1:15:17

I think for the girls, don't wait

1:15:19

till you're overqualified. Challenge yourself, and you

1:15:21

gain confidence when you're able to do

1:15:24

something you didn't know you could do.

1:15:26

That's great advice. I love that. And

1:15:28

you're spot on. I remember looking at

1:15:30

the studies a few years ago, and

1:15:32

he literally said that if a guy

1:15:34

looks at an application and he can

1:15:36

do four out of ten things, he'll

1:15:38

apply. And if a girl looks at

1:15:40

it and she can do eight out

1:15:42

of ten things, she won't apply. I

1:15:44

literally have chills. I have chills, because

1:15:47

that is so true. And women are

1:15:49

so competent, but I guess they like,

1:15:51

there's... like a safety thing with it.

1:15:53

I do have to say something about

1:15:55

experience. They did a study somewhere. I

1:15:57

swear this wasn't from TikTok, but a

1:15:59

study about like doctors and how some

1:16:01

new doctors were actually better than doctors

1:16:03

who had like 40 years of experience

1:16:05

because they were actually like fresher, more

1:16:07

open-minded, more up-to-date, and just how like

1:16:10

just because someone has more experience with

1:16:12

you doesn't necessarily make them. better than

1:16:14

you had something. My advice for like

1:16:16

job interviews is I would go in

1:16:18

and be like I don't have the

1:16:20

year's experience you want but these are

1:16:22

all the ideas I have of what

1:16:24

I'm going to do. So don't wait

1:16:26

till you're overqualified like do things you're

1:16:28

under qualified for and see what you're

1:16:30

capable of. So needed that's great advice.

1:16:33

I love that. If your younger self

1:16:35

was to look at you now if

1:16:37

you would go meet her and she

1:16:39

saw you having the Netflix special doing

1:16:41

what you're doing today touring. What do

1:16:43

you think she'd say? She wouldn't imagine

1:16:45

it, but I feel like she'd be

1:16:47

like, that's awesome. I do think there

1:16:49

was a time when I was like

1:16:51

24 and I was like in sales

1:16:54

or something. And when my cousins said

1:16:56

like he was going to move to

1:16:58

LA to be an actor, and I

1:17:00

remember getting like a guttural jealousy that

1:17:02

I was like not expecting. And looking

1:17:04

back, I was like, why are you

1:17:06

jealous that your cousins move in LA

1:17:08

to do acting? That's insane, you don't

1:17:10

even want to be an actress. But

1:17:12

deep deep down I did. And I

1:17:14

like didn't admit it to myself because

1:17:17

it's like a lot to admit that

1:17:19

you want to be a performer or

1:17:21

want your dreams. It's scary to say

1:17:23

what dreams you want. For anyone who's

1:17:25

feeling like a jealousy towards something, that's

1:17:27

the universe telling you you want to

1:17:29

do it. And it's crazy that years

1:17:31

later now like I'm getting into acting

1:17:33

and I tried so hard to fight

1:17:35

it. But the universe was like, you're

1:17:37

not doing that, you're not doing that

1:17:40

until I got in this lane. I

1:17:42

like to say, even though I've never

1:17:44

surfed, it's like surfing, where like when

1:17:46

you find the right wave, it's going

1:17:48

to feel easier. going to love it.

1:17:50

It's going to be fun. So like

1:17:52

find your wave. That jealousy point is

1:17:54

so clear. I feel like we're living

1:17:56

at a time where it's so scary

1:17:58

to share your dreams with someone else

1:18:00

because you're scared it might remind them

1:18:03

that they're not chasing theirs. And you're

1:18:05

scared that they may react and tell

1:18:07

you not to chase it because they

1:18:09

don't believe in you. And the truth

1:18:11

is they never had the strength to

1:18:13

even give themselves the worth to chase

1:18:15

theirs. And then at the same time

1:18:17

you're scared of the doubt you already

1:18:19

have. in your own abilities and the

1:18:21

fears you already have and the insecurities

1:18:24

you have that it's not possible for

1:18:26

you. And it creates a really messy

1:18:28

situation in society I feel because you

1:18:30

have less people wanting to chase their

1:18:32

dreams, less people rooting for them, and

1:18:34

less people admitting what their dreams are.

1:18:36

And that feels like a really bad

1:18:38

place to live where dreams are becoming

1:18:40

buried deeper and deeper and deeper and

1:18:42

deeper and, you know, never get seen.

1:18:44

Someone's feeling that and they're feeling that

1:18:47

jealousy which you so beautifully said could

1:18:49

be a sign or a signal that

1:18:51

that's what you want to do What

1:18:53

would you say is the first three

1:18:55

steps someone should take if they think

1:18:57

they have a crazy dream? They may

1:18:59

never have done it before They don't

1:19:01

really get it, but they feel that

1:19:03

deep inside of them. It's always been

1:19:05

there I was always obsessed with successful

1:19:07

people like I'd look at like Riana

1:19:10

and I'm like what is different about

1:19:12

her than other people and it when

1:19:14

you strip it always starts with she

1:19:16

tried Like 80% of it is being

1:19:18

like, I want to be this and

1:19:20

I'm going to do it. And then

1:19:22

I like to literally sit down and

1:19:24

like say something crazy like, okay, I

1:19:26

want to get a Netflix special. Then

1:19:28

I literally go backwards of all the

1:19:30

things you have to do to get

1:19:33

there. Okay, to get a Netflix special,

1:19:35

you'd have to perform in front of

1:19:37

someone at Netflix. How do you do

1:19:39

that? You'd have to be selling out

1:19:41

theaters. How do you do that? You'd

1:19:43

have to get JFL. How do you

1:19:45

get JFL? You have to go in

1:19:47

the clubs. How do you get in

1:19:49

the clubs? You have to start writing.

1:19:51

How do you start writing by doing

1:19:54

it tomorrow? So then it's like you

1:19:56

literally have the path and it's starting.

1:19:58

so small and I think so many

1:20:00

people don't want to go through the

1:20:02

whole path. And then when you think

1:20:04

about it, it's like you just have

1:20:06

to go do it. It's actually a

1:20:08

lot less overwhelming when you think I

1:20:10

just have to write tomorrow than be

1:20:12

like, I have to get a Netflix

1:20:14

special in two years. But realistically, I

1:20:17

got a Netflix special in like five

1:20:19

years of comedy. Plus COVID, which is

1:20:21

crazy. But it's because that wasn't the

1:20:23

plan. It was just I wanted to

1:20:25

be myself and have fun doing comedy.

1:20:27

Yeah, it's so funny. Seven years ago,

1:20:29

I had a production company reach out

1:20:31

to me from LA. They'd seen my

1:20:33

first ever video that had gone viral

1:20:35

and they loved it and they'd reached

1:20:37

out and said we want to build

1:20:40

a TV show around you. And so

1:20:42

I was like, I couldn't believe it

1:20:44

because I'd. just started creating content and

1:20:46

had a viral video and I thought

1:20:48

that was cool enough as it was.

1:20:50

Anyway, I like flew to LA on

1:20:52

my own dime, I didn't have a

1:20:54

lot of money then, sat down, had

1:20:56

meetings, went back and forth, worked on

1:20:58

Creative on top of my day job,

1:21:00

came back to pitch it again on

1:21:03

my own dime, like I was trying

1:21:05

to figure out how I was going

1:21:07

to do it. We pitched it and

1:21:09

no one wanted the show, but I

1:21:11

built loads of great relationships. And so

1:21:13

I built all these great relationships that

1:21:15

streamers, production companies, became really good friends

1:21:17

with some of them, but no one

1:21:19

liked the show idea that we had.

1:21:21

And it's so funny because I always

1:21:24

look at that and I go, I'm

1:21:26

so glad that an idea that I

1:21:28

didn't fully own. that wasn't fully mine

1:21:30

got rejected because then I built this.

1:21:32

Even though at the time we probably

1:21:34

were like, I didn't make it. Yeah,

1:21:36

at the time it was just like

1:21:38

it felt like everything was going, not

1:21:40

everything was going wrong, but that that

1:21:42

was the big moment and I fumbled

1:21:44

it somehow. Yeah, yeah, I felt like

1:21:47

I fumbled. Yeah, you just felt like

1:21:49

you just dropped the ball. Yeah, you

1:21:51

were like, that was my moment and

1:21:53

that's it. When life has like so

1:21:55

many moments. What if I told you

1:21:57

the 15th video you post is going

1:21:59

to go viral? How quickly would you

1:22:01

post the next video? I kind of

1:22:03

am obsessed with the gritty work. It

1:22:05

was this concept I think like with

1:22:07

tennis people would say like, when are

1:22:10

you practicing when people aren't watching? Are

1:22:12

you practicing in the rain? Like that

1:22:14

type of like sports stuff? So I

1:22:16

feel like, yeah, people will go and

1:22:18

do the flashy stuff, but I think

1:22:20

I get ahead because I'm doing this

1:22:22

boring stuff that people don't want to

1:22:24

do. So when you realize like, oh,

1:22:26

someone got a Netflix special because they

1:22:28

did the little tedious things that are

1:22:30

actually anyone could do. It's just people

1:22:33

don't want to do it. So it's

1:22:35

like. Put your head down and like

1:22:37

you can accomplish anything. Well said, Hannah

1:22:39

has been such a joy talking to

1:22:41

you. Honestly, I like so much fun.

1:22:43

This is actually like the should I

1:22:45

love talking about. I mean, I'm like,

1:22:47

we have to do this again. I

1:22:49

feel like a motivational speaker, but just

1:22:51

through like quiff jokes, but like I

1:22:54

actually feel connected to you because I

1:22:56

love through my jokes, like inspiring people

1:22:58

to see the world differently, even though

1:23:00

it's not that serious at all. But

1:23:02

I do love. like motivating and I

1:23:04

love coaching and I love making people

1:23:06

inspired in some way. Yeah, well I

1:23:08

think everything you shared today has been

1:23:10

super powerful and I know my community

1:23:12

is going to love it. You bring

1:23:14

it out to me. Oh no, I

1:23:17

love it. You brought it. We end

1:23:19

every episode with a final five, a

1:23:21

fast five that we ask to all

1:23:23

guess. So Hannah Bernard, these are your

1:23:25

fast five. Okay. Question number one, what

1:23:27

is the best advice you ever heard

1:23:29

or received? Oh I like this quote

1:23:31

that says even when it's raining, the

1:23:33

hoop is always there. Not to give

1:23:35

like more sports quotes, but it's basically

1:23:37

like you're not seeing it, but like

1:23:40

you're actually okay and the world is

1:23:42

your oyster. You just are, there's a

1:23:44

cloud right now. Yeah, I love that.

1:23:46

Second question, what is the worst advice

1:23:48

you ever heard or received? Probably people

1:23:50

who just think they know better than

1:23:52

you about your own life and like

1:23:54

telling you based on their own experiences

1:23:56

when you're completely different to be like,

1:23:58

I wouldn't do that if I were

1:24:00

you. Well, you're not me, so. Question

1:24:03

number three, what is something you think

1:24:05

people don't know about you? People probably

1:24:07

would not be surprised they heard, but

1:24:09

I'm like really messy. Like I have

1:24:11

trouble keeping the home Okay, and I

1:24:13

but I lean into it and I'll

1:24:15

be like I'm a creative But like

1:24:17

some of my friends are so organized

1:24:19

and I'm so jealous of them But

1:24:21

like I will always go to edit

1:24:24

a video before like putting the dishes

1:24:26

away and then I will never put

1:24:28

the dishes away. So I'm kind of

1:24:30

like don't have my shit together in

1:24:32

the home I love it question number

1:24:34

way. What's also that a Virgo Moon,

1:24:36

but clearly just about work and Scorpio

1:24:38

rising. Oh wow, you know all of

1:24:40

it. Wow, all right, question number four,

1:24:42

apart from your, apart from your astrologer,

1:24:44

was it that you do? Who's the

1:24:47

last person you do? It's probably Page

1:24:49

my co-host, because after the show we

1:24:51

see all these like funny videos from

1:24:53

the shows and I'll send it to

1:24:55

her and be like, that was funny,

1:24:57

that was cute. So we're just like

1:24:59

enjoying. when we get home looking at

1:25:01

all the stories. I love that. And

1:25:03

question number five, we asked this to

1:25:05

every guest who's ever been on the

1:25:07

show. If you could create one law

1:25:10

that everyone in the world had to

1:25:12

follow, what would it be? I think

1:25:14

children should have more mental health in

1:25:16

schools. Like I think it should be

1:25:18

a law that kids should start learning

1:25:20

more about like happiness, mindfulness, meditation. Like

1:25:22

I don't know why that wouldn't be

1:25:24

in the curriculum when that's like the

1:25:26

most important thing to having a happy

1:25:28

life. Mental Health by Hannah Bernard. Yeah,

1:25:30

mental health. High school. I love it.

1:25:33

Get the kids, start them young. I

1:25:35

love it. Everyone go and watch. We

1:25:37

ride at dawn right now. And if

1:25:39

you don't follow Hannah already, make sure

1:25:41

you follow her across the Instagram, Tik

1:25:43

Talk, and all of social media. And

1:25:45

I'm so. excited for us to continue

1:25:47

our friendship. And thank you for having

1:25:49

me. Honestly, you are so much fun

1:25:51

to talk to if you ever want

1:25:54

to just... I might have to open

1:25:56

for you on one of your live.

1:25:58

Oh my gosh, I would love, oh

1:26:00

my god, I would love that. You're

1:26:02

so kind of like, okay. You're so

1:26:04

kind of, oh my gosh, that's such

1:26:06

a kind offer. That's so sweet. I'm

1:26:08

going to take you off on that.

1:26:10

We'll see if you. Your team allows

1:26:12

it. Hadn't a burner everyone as you

1:26:14

can tell not only hilariously funny got

1:26:17

so many great insights thoughts wisdom I

1:26:19

mean you can drop the mic today

1:26:21

I'm amazing amazing I really hope we

1:26:23

get to hear you do more tennis

1:26:25

commentary more sport commentary like all of

1:26:27

it yeah I'm excited yeah I'm excited

1:26:29

to see it I think I work

1:26:31

for you spian yeah I love it

1:26:33

Adam burner thank you so much thank

1:26:35

you so much thank you so grateful

1:26:37

if you love this episode you're going

1:26:40

to love my conversation with Matthew hussy

1:26:42

on how to get over your ex-

1:26:44

and find true love in your relationships.

1:26:46

People should be compassionate to themselves, but

1:26:48

extend that compassion to your future self.

1:26:50

Because truly extending your compassion to your

1:26:52

future self is doing something that gives

1:26:54

him or her a shot at a

1:26:56

happy and a peaceful life. You are

1:26:58

cordially invited to... The hottest party in

1:27:00

professional sports. I'm Tisha Allen, former golf

1:27:03

professional, and the host of Welcome to

1:27:05

the Party, your newest obsession about the

1:27:07

wonderful world that is women's golf, featuring

1:27:09

interviews with top players on tour, tips

1:27:11

to help improve your swing, and the

1:27:13

craziest stories to come out of your

1:27:15

friendly neighborhood country club. Welcome to the

1:27:17

party with Tisha Allen is an I-heart

1:27:19

women's sports production in partnership with Deep

1:27:21

Blue Sports and Entertainment.