0:00

Hey everyone, before we begin today we

0:02

want to thank our newest patron Miriam.

0:04

Welcome to the team. If you want to

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be awesome like Miriam and get

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access to exclusive content like our

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notes, our discord community, and our

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watch parties for the persuasion adaptations,

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check out our patron at patreon.com/pod

0:17

and prejudice. You all have been

0:19

waiting so patiently for us

0:21

to start our coverage of

0:23

the persuasion adaptations, so we

0:25

are so excited to share

0:28

at long last the first

0:30

of three episodes covering the

0:32

1995 adaptation of persuasion with

0:34

our guests, the hosts of

0:36

Fetch the Smelling Salts, Alice, and

0:39

Kim. This is Becca. This is

0:41

Molly. We're here to talk about

0:43

Jane Austin. We are here specifically

0:46

to talk about Persuasion Adaptations! Adaptations!

0:48

We finally made it to Persuasion

0:50

Adaptations! I love that you say

0:52

finally as if it's been so

0:55

long if I feel like this

0:57

book like flew by it, but

0:59

it felt like a really long

1:02

time because we took like two

1:04

months off in between to share

1:06

our live show audios and other

1:08

things So you could be out of

1:10

the country comfortably. Exactly. So we're back.

1:12

Recording new material. It's very exciting. Listeners,

1:15

if you're new here, I, Becca, have

1:17

read many Jane Austen novels through my

1:19

life. And I, Molly, am reading her

1:21

for the first time through this podcast.

1:24

If you want to hear Molly read

1:26

through Pride and Prejudice, Since and Sensibility,

1:28

or Emma for the first time, you

1:31

can listen to seasons one through three

1:33

of this podcast, but that is not

1:35

what we're doing here today. No. Today

1:37

we are talking about the 1995

1:39

adaptation of Pers. Correct? Yeah, it's

1:42

a BBC movie, I believe,

1:44

starring Kieran Hines. Famously. And

1:46

we are joined to discuss

1:48

it today by Alice and

1:50

Kim from Fetch the Smelling

1:52

Salts. Hello. Hello? Hello. So

1:54

Alice and Kim, do you

1:57

want to tell our listeners

1:59

a little bit about... what

2:01

you do and what your

2:03

podcast is about? Yes we

2:05

do. Go on, Ellis. On

2:07

Fetch the Smelling Salts, we

2:09

talk about period dramas. We

2:11

love watching period dramas. We

2:14

watch way too many movies

2:16

and TV shows. Sometimes we

2:18

also read books that have

2:20

been turned into period dramas,

2:22

but mostly it's TV, it's

2:24

movies, and they're from every

2:26

genre. everywhere around the world

2:28

every culture every era we

2:31

don't care as long as

2:33

it's set in a real

2:35

time a real place in

2:37

the past we want to

2:39

see it and we want

2:41

to talk about it and

2:43

so we watch a lot

2:45

of non-English language stuff but

2:48

we also watch a lot

2:50

of you know British people

2:52

visiting each other and maybe

2:54

kissing at the end we

2:56

love a Bollywood drama we

2:58

love a Korean drama and

3:00

We love just like period

3:03

drama butts. Mm. Yes. We

3:05

love seeing a butt on

3:07

the screen. Shouts to Emma.

3:09

2020. 2021, 2020. 2020. Oh

3:11

yeah. Right at the start.

3:13

Yeah. Yeah. Boom bam butt.

3:15

That's what we want. That's

3:17

a pretty good summer. You

3:20

can find us on I'll find

3:22

podcast platforms, etc. And I, Alice,

3:24

I'm also doing another podcast that's

3:27

coming out later this year, which

3:29

is all about Jane Austin, Jane

3:31

Austin books, and specifically Jane Austin

3:33

characters and what kind of sex

3:35

they get up to. It is

3:37

called Austin After Dark. It is

3:40

historical, literary comedy, sex podcast. Love

3:42

it. And Becca and I got

3:44

to record an episode of that

3:46

with you yesterday and we had

3:48

a blast so I can't wait

3:50

for our listeners to get to

3:53

hear that. The word blast is

3:55

not a... Donald Entendre, right? Oh,

3:57

I can't listen to this episode

3:59

then. So before we get into

4:01

the adaptation of Persuasion that came

4:03

out in 1995, we will start

4:05

by asking our guests a couple

4:08

questions about their relationship to Jane

4:10

Austin, starting with the quintessential, what

4:12

is your relationship to Jane Austin?

4:14

Wow, okay. So, as a literary

4:16

scholar, I was more of a

4:18

late 19th century person. So I

4:21

didn't read that many. Jane Austin

4:23

to books. I will say I

4:25

will I will confess at the

4:27

start. I've only read three, I've

4:29

read Emma, read Pride and Prejudice

4:31

and North Andrew Abby. Did you

4:34

just call it North Andrew Abby?

4:36

Every bloody time, not anger. See,

4:38

you see, you see, this is

4:40

why, um, incredible. Yeah, I know.

4:42

So yeah, that's all I've read.

4:44

I do love it and I

4:47

was just telling my housemate, you

4:49

know, she's never read Jane Austin

4:51

and I was telling her, you

4:53

know, she, like, it's a lovely,

4:55

it's like a warm hug, you

4:57

know, it's feel good, it makes

5:00

you happy, nothing really bad happens,

5:02

yeah. And, you know, her language

5:04

is wonderful and... Jane Austin to

5:06

me is something you know you

5:08

you need you need to read

5:10

to kind of like refresh yourself

5:13

you know just just it's like

5:15

have a cup of tea have

5:17

a Jane Austin book yeah feel

5:19

a little cozy totally that's my

5:21

relationship with Janey girl lovely I

5:23

think Alice is a more intense

5:26

one yeah but I didn't I

5:28

call myself a life on Jane

5:30

Austin fan and that's a little

5:32

bit of a lie because we

5:34

first I remember being assigned to

5:36

read Pride and Prejudice in high

5:38

school. And I famously just refused

5:41

to finish reading any book in

5:43

high school. And so... I never

5:45

finished reading it. I blagged my

5:47

way through it. But then shortly

5:49

after I couldn't help myself, I

5:51

went back to it. And I

5:54

ended up getting a giant omnibus

5:56

Jane Austin book because I didn't

5:58

realize just how big and thick

6:00

it would be. And so I

6:02

carried that around with me for

6:04

a really long time. And I

6:07

think I left it in like

6:09

a hostile in Uganda or something.

6:11

But then I just... became obsessed

6:13

and that was really one of

6:15

my entrees into I already really

6:17

love period dramas but I just

6:20

had to consume every single Jane

6:22

Austin adaptation even before I made

6:24

sure I read every single book

6:26

because an adaptation is always going

6:28

to mean more to me than

6:30

the book. This is just the

6:33

truth and this adaptation in particular

6:35

has really just stood out. as

6:37

one of my lifelong favorites. That

6:39

might lead us well into our

6:41

next question, which is, what's your

6:43

favorite Austin content? And as Alice

6:46

alluded to, it can be an

6:48

adaptation. It can be a movie,

6:50

a TV series, a modern day

6:52

retelling, a Spotify playlist, whatever really,

6:54

really grabs your attention. Well for

6:56

me it is definitely you know

6:59

calling for BBC, Pride and Prejudice.

7:01

I know it's so basic but

7:03

it means a lot to me

7:05

to the point where so what

7:07

happened was so I was in

7:09

Leeds and then when that was

7:11

when I was like doing my

7:14

master's and then I had you

7:16

know the DVD set right of

7:18

Pride and Prejudice. And then when

7:20

my parents at the end of

7:22

my degree, they came from my

7:24

graduation, and then we had like

7:27

a little holiday, and I remember

7:29

we were in Paris, and there

7:31

was like nothing else to do

7:33

like that, you know, at night,

7:35

because like, no what, we don't

7:37

understand French, we can't watch French

7:40

TV. So I was like, guys,

7:42

I. have my laptop, let's all

7:44

watch Friday Prejudice and it was

7:46

really cute. So it was like,

7:48

you know, me and my mom

7:50

and my dad in a little

7:53

hotel room. I was watching it

7:55

for like the bazillion time, right?

7:57

And then yeah, so we were

7:59

just so that's just my little

8:01

happy memory. So that will always

8:03

be my favorite. I love that

8:06

so much. It's super beautiful and

8:08

the 95 Pride and Prejudice is

8:10

basic for a reason. It's because

8:12

it's so good that it's like

8:14

sort of the centerpiece around which

8:16

all other Jane Austen adaptations rotate

8:19

for sure. Yeah, and we watched

8:21

it. We started this podcast in

8:23

2019 right before. the pandemic hit

8:25

and I moved home to be

8:27

in Syracuse with my mom and

8:29

so I watched the 1995 with

8:31

her the first time and I

8:34

remember like I watched it through

8:36

I watched each episode like three

8:38

times just to like because we

8:40

covered each episode in a different

8:42

one. She wanted to keep going.

8:44

Yeah I wanted to keep going

8:47

so I had to just keep

8:49

watching them over and over again

8:51

and my mom would actually like

8:53

sit and watch them with me

8:55

which was really cute so I

8:57

have a similar like this sweet

9:00

memory of that. Right? Yeah. Yeah

9:02

and Alice is this is this

9:04

yours? Yes yes. Yeah so this

9:06

might be my favorite adaptation although

9:08

I also really love the 2007

9:10

Northanger Abbey adaptation I of course

9:13

love the 1995 Pride and Pride

9:15

and Prejudice. Kim, you talking about

9:17

Colin Firth and holidays, made me

9:19

think, I'm actually going to say,

9:21

if we're being brought with content,

9:23

like the definition thereof, in Bath

9:26

at the Jane Austin House, at

9:28

the Jane Austin Center, there is

9:30

a statue, like a mannequin of

9:32

Colin Firth as Mr. Darcy, and

9:34

you can dress up yourself. So

9:36

you can get yourself in like

9:39

you're a period outfit with a

9:41

bonnet and you can hug him

9:43

you they do not stop you

9:45

from touching mannequin and I can't

9:47

say it's encouraged but but no

9:49

one's gonna tell you off and

9:52

you can just like you can

9:54

just rub his butt as much

9:56

as you want to are people

9:58

like kissing the statue I didn't

10:00

see it I didn't do it

10:02

but I'm gonna say yes but

10:04

a lot but I did rub

10:07

his butt a lot I did

10:09

rub his butt and yeah yeah

10:11

And I think I'm not the

10:13

only one out there listening who

10:15

has done that or aspires to

10:17

do that. There is also, but

10:20

that's not the only thing. His

10:22

portrait is also in the tea

10:24

rooms that are upstairs where you

10:26

can get like a Jane awesome,

10:28

like a bathbun and a whole

10:30

like Regency style tea and they

10:33

have a portrait of Mr. Darcy,

10:35

but it's Colin Firth. Yeah, I

10:37

have a magnet from there with

10:39

like, you know, a drawing, quote

10:41

unquote, yeah, you know, of Colin

10:43

Furf as Darcy with, you know,

10:46

like one of his famous quotes

10:48

and I was like, oh, I

10:50

love it. Wow, Becca, I think

10:52

that we need to plan a

10:54

post wedding trip to Bath. I

10:56

love the way you said that

10:59

as if it's our wedding. Well,

11:01

I just know that you get,

11:03

you're not going to be able

11:05

to. do a trip before you

11:07

get married? No, definitely not. But,

11:09

you know, listeners, spoilers for another

11:12

time. I'm sure Molly and I

11:14

will one day find a way

11:16

to do some creative, cool travel

11:18

content related to Bath, England. Okay,

11:20

so our next question for both

11:22

of you is, which Austin character

11:25

do you most relate to? This

11:27

can be from any book. But

11:29

if it's from one that I

11:31

haven't read, be vague with why.

11:33

No spoilers, but Catherine Moreland. The

11:35

protagonist in Northanger Abbey. I haven't

11:37

read Northanger Abbey is my one

11:40

book I have not read by

11:42

Jane Austin. And so we're excited

11:44

to cover it on the podcast

11:46

because we have we figured out

11:48

a system for that and it

11:50

worked quite well. But the only

11:53

thing. I know about North Korea

11:55

is that Catherine Moreland is like

11:57

kind of the precursor to the

11:59

Tumblr Girlie. No, that's offensive. What

12:01

do you mean? What do you

12:03

mean? What do you mean? What

12:06

do you mean? Well, hey, listen,

12:08

we were all Tumblr Girlies here.

12:10

Yeah, no, I mean, this is

12:12

a compliment. Wait, what's a Tumblr

12:14

girlie? Oh, okay, wait, wait, wait,

12:16

wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,

12:19

wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,

12:21

wait, a BLR, not, I thought

12:23

you were talking about the big

12:25

cup, the big Sippy Cup girl.

12:27

Oh my god. No, no, no,

12:29

no, no, not the Stanley Cup

12:32

girl, the, on the internet, in

12:34

her fan, no, yes, absolutely. She's

12:36

a Tumbler girl, she's a Tumbler

12:38

girl, she like discovered porn through

12:40

Tumblr. Yeah, yeah, she's, she's a

12:42

fanfic writer, like, like, that's, that's

12:45

the energy I get from Northanger

12:47

than Northanger Abby, I get from

12:49

Northanger Abby. You were like, like,

12:51

how dare you? She doesn't have

12:53

a Stanley club. No, that's exactly

12:55

what I was. And so that

12:58

is, that only strengthens my point

13:00

a little bit because she's, she's

13:02

a bit, like she's, she's no

13:04

Elizabeth Bennet, let's put it that

13:06

way. Oh, that gets me so

13:08

excited to read Northinger, Abby. All

13:10

right, Kim, how about you? Okay,

13:13

well, I too have no Elizabeth

13:15

Bennet, certainly. Emma

13:18

either I would say probably Anne

13:20

like Anne Elliot. Okay I'm gonna

13:22

say this because I don't think

13:24

my sister will listen to this

13:26

to this podcast episode because she

13:29

never listens to anything until I

13:31

actually explicitly send her link and

13:33

serve it to her on a

13:35

silver platter. Oh my god every

13:37

bloody time I watch like persuasion

13:40

and I kind of like you

13:42

know see Mary her sister and

13:44

her sister and her and her

13:46

whole Oh, I'm so sick. Nobody

13:48

loves me. Oh, I'm like, oh

13:51

girl, I feel you and how

13:53

are you so patient? So yeah,

13:55

so I, I, I, totally, yeah.

13:57

So Anne, and I feel you,

14:00

so that's, that's, she's my girl.

14:02

Incredible. Oh yeah, you know, 100%

14:04

I have to say I feel

14:06

a special kind of kinship with

14:08

Mary because, because I'm, because I'm,

14:11

I, but contracts, you know, yeah,

14:13

famously I'm a hypochondriac, so like

14:15

I relate a lot to Mr.

14:17

Woodhouse and I also find that

14:19

Mary. I relate to because she's

14:22

always like, like, why is not,

14:24

like as soon as I feel

14:26

the slight, lightest tickle in my

14:28

throat or my nose, I become

14:30

insufferable. I'm like, I need medicine.

14:33

the amount of times Molly will

14:35

be like hi she'll like text

14:37

me when we're doing an in-person

14:39

podcast record and be like hi

14:41

being so respectful here like I

14:44

had a tickle in my throat

14:46

three days ago it hasn't cropped

14:48

up again but just in case

14:50

you're uncomfortable recording in a person

14:53

with me I wanted to make

14:55

you aware I always I always

14:57

like to text because I worry

14:59

that you'll come and I'll go

15:01

and then you'll be like but

15:04

that's not you that's me To

15:06

be clear, I am also, I

15:08

am now equally like attuned to

15:10

Molly's boundaries with illness and do

15:12

equally put Molly on notice of

15:15

any tickle I have had in

15:17

my throat, but that is because

15:19

I know Molly is paranoid and

15:21

I want, I want to be

15:23

transparent with her. That's fair, that's

15:26

fair. And that's love. Yes. So

15:28

our final question before we get

15:30

into the movie is what is

15:32

your hottest Austin take? For us,

15:34

some examples of this might be

15:37

Lydia Bennett is a tragic character

15:39

and not a nuisance or for

15:41

example in this book that Mary

15:43

is an icon and a legend

15:46

and no notes perfect invention of

15:48

Jane Austin. This is again in

15:50

Northanger Abbey Take but I... I

15:52

have always said that Northanger Abbey

15:54

is the horniest book. Mmm, okay,

15:57

yeah. Oh, I have a hot

15:59

Jude Austin. I don't know why everybody

16:01

be drinking that water. It

16:03

really tastes like crap. Oh,

16:05

the bathwater. I know exactly

16:07

what you're talking about. It

16:09

tastes terrible. It does. I've

16:11

been above. I've tasted it.

16:13

It's not nice. That water is

16:15

foul. It tastes like a sewer. It

16:17

smells like rotten eggs, right? Yeah, it

16:19

is. It's like a fountain took a

16:21

fart. A hundred percent. So. I haven't

16:23

been to Bath, but I have been

16:25

places that have the springs in the

16:27

United States, and it's the same concept.

16:29

And I was like, oh, this is

16:32

like refreshing and healthful. I tasted it.

16:34

And I was like, oh, I didn't

16:36

know refreshing and healthful tastes like I

16:38

just swallowed somebody else's fart. Like, it's

16:40

so gross. Sorry, I could have gotten

16:42

this on my grandma's farm in Wisconsin,

16:44

because they also use well water, as well

16:46

water, you guys. Question, in this movie, when

16:48

they are in the like sort

16:50

of indoor courtyard room is that

16:52

yes yep yeah that's what they're

16:54

chugging yep they're chugging the fart

16:56

water yeah that explains why why

16:58

lady Russell downs it all in one

17:01

gulp like just like yeah I was like

17:03

what is she chugging but she probably

17:05

was holding her breath and was like

17:07

let me get this down yeah yeah

17:09

it's like a regency or a weak

17:12

rash shot it doesn't taste good you

17:14

do it for your health right that's

17:16

the that's the idea behind it? I

17:18

don't know that makes sense. And then

17:20

you walk around the room so that

17:22

no one can tell exactly who farted.

17:24

Because it is coming back out the

17:27

other end. Oh of course. Because it's

17:29

just like sulfuric water. I don't even,

17:31

I don't know man. I am not

17:33

a scientist, I am not a hydro

17:35

engineer. One of my old

17:37

roommates was a hydro engineer.

17:40

You're not a hydro engineer?

17:42

I know and I have

17:44

a Jane Austin podcast instead.

17:46

disappointing but it I that

17:49

is a hot take I

17:51

am a hundred percent on

17:53

board with that there is

17:55

like no question that is

17:58

maybe my favorite hot So

18:00

to start for our listeners, it

18:02

is a movie that is an

18:04

adaptation of Persuasion, number BBC, the

18:06

screenplay is by Nick Deere, directed

18:09

by Roger Mitchell, and starring Amanda

18:11

Wood as Anne Elliot and Kieran

18:13

Heinz, as Captain Wentworth, before Molly

18:15

starts her summary. Amanda Root? Sorry,

18:17

Amanda Wood is famously the main

18:20

character in the movie, The Holiday,

18:22

played by Cameron Diaz. I'm literally

18:24

staring at her name, and it

18:26

says Amanda Wood. Amanda Root stars

18:28

as Anne Elliot, Kieran Hein, stars

18:31

as Captain Wentworth. Before we

18:33

get into the like full

18:35

summary, last question we will

18:37

ask you is your take on the

18:39

movie, like generally. Oh, I loved it.

18:41

I loved so much. I mean, I

18:43

cried. I mean, this is like, this

18:45

is my second time I'm watching it.

18:47

And yeah, so I cried. And then

18:50

I texted Alice and I was like, I'm

18:52

baling. And she was like, it's so

18:54

good. So yeah, that's my take. loved

18:56

it. I also especially loved it

18:58

because I really did not like the, what

19:00

was it, 20, 20, 22, yeah, not a

19:02

fan. We haven't watched that one

19:04

yet and we are so excited because

19:07

of the way people talk about it.

19:09

Yeah, we've talked to one person who

19:11

loved it and I have a feeling

19:13

that I'm going to love it. I

19:15

just, I'm putting this on the record.

19:17

She told me, like, so she hasn't

19:19

watching it, but like we finished watching

19:21

this movie, maybe she goes to me,

19:24

Becca. I think I'm going to

19:26

like the 2022 persuasion adaptation and

19:28

I was like Molly that is a

19:30

dangerous thing to hope for. because of

19:32

everything we know. Well that might be

19:35

a hot take. It might be a

19:37

hot take so. That might be her

19:39

Austin hot take. Yeah we're gonna see

19:41

I'm putting another record now so people

19:43

can like either be like oh she

19:46

was right she loved it or ha

19:48

ha ha ha. No there's nothing there's

19:50

nothing our listeners love more than when

19:52

Molly is just blindly wrong for something

19:54

cheerfully for a long time and then

19:57

gets corrected by either us or Jane

19:59

Austin herself. Well we started our

20:01

podcast in, we started recording

20:04

our podcast in 2022 and

20:06

persuasion was the first movie

20:08

that we decided to talk about

20:11

because we were so moved by

20:13

hatred. Yes, incredible. So

20:15

please have a listen to

20:17

that. Oh we will. The opposite

20:19

of love is not hate, it's

20:21

indifference. That is true. Well we

20:23

were not, yeah we were not

20:25

indifferent to that. We had feelings.

20:27

Yeah. I am really glad we have to

20:30

like absolute lovers of this movie on

20:32

the podcast because I enjoyed this movie

20:34

quite a bit. It was not I

20:37

think my favorite Jane Austin adaptation because

20:39

well we get into why but I

20:41

do think it had a lot of

20:43

really good things to offer a lot

20:46

of critiques I would put out there

20:48

in sort of like the ways the

20:50

story was portrayed but I think like.

20:53

Ultimately, I think my good thoughts

20:55

about it definitely outweigh my bad thoughts

20:57

about it. But I'm really pleased because

20:59

there's nothing I like more than when we

21:01

talk about a movie and we have like

21:03

guests who slightly disagree with us on the

21:06

movie so that A, we can convince each

21:08

other of our views and B, like we

21:10

have just a diversity of opinions on the

21:12

movie just generally. Yeah, I completely agree.

21:15

And I, my overall take on the

21:17

movie is probably that by the end

21:19

of this recording. I'll be a

21:21

big fan. Like I'm easily swayed.

21:23

I really liked it and I

21:26

thought everyone's performance, I didn't think

21:28

anyone's performances were bad at all

21:30

the actors were incredible. My only

21:32

major critiques were with like the

21:34

cinematography and like the way the

21:37

scenes jumped from scene to scene and the

21:39

lack of the score, it was just kind

21:41

of like, it was a little sleepy in

21:43

that way. We are big score people with Jane

21:46

Austin movies and score is very important and

21:48

the moments of score in here are beautiful

21:50

And then the ones where they're missing I'm

21:52

like oh, I want the big swell of

21:55

the music. Yeah, I'm drum I am a

21:57

dramatic bitch. The big smell of the music

21:59

is like Yes, so we open up

22:01

on admiral Croft bringing his men

22:04

over. Well, we'll get into it,

22:06

but I think it's a good

22:08

time to start chatting about the

22:10

movie. Yes. So we open up

22:12

on admiral Croft bringing his men

22:14

over the seas in a rowboat

22:16

to a big boat because the

22:18

war is over. I have to

22:20

say, Admiral Croft, Daddy, Daddy. Okay,

22:23

thank you. I'm glad we all

22:25

agree. Yep. Yeah, no, no, definitely,

22:27

Daddy. And I think what I

22:29

liked about this as an opener

22:31

was that it's one of the

22:33

big themes of persuasion generally is

22:35

that like there is a juxtaposition

22:37

between these like sort of superficial

22:40

petty gentry men and the Navy

22:42

which is fighting these big wars

22:44

overseas and you get this juxtaposition

22:46

between the creditors of Sir Walter

22:48

and Admiral Croft coming ashore having

22:50

like neutralized Napoleon and that frames

22:52

the story and like here are

22:54

the concerns of these men who

22:56

have just come back from war

22:59

and here are the concerns of

23:01

the guys who stayed home and

23:03

worried about nothing about except spending

23:05

as much money as they possibly

23:07

could. What I love about this

23:09

scene, and this is something that

23:11

I cannot prove, but I hope

23:13

that we can circle back to

23:15

it at the end, I am

23:18

convinced that the dudes in the

23:20

rowboat are the same actors who

23:22

are in the circus at the

23:24

end. You know what? I think

23:26

you're, I think you're right. And

23:28

I think you can prove that

23:30

because I thought the circus dudes

23:32

looked familiar. And I thought one

23:35

of the circus dudes. I was

23:37

like, is that Admiral Croft? No,

23:39

there was one in particular where

23:41

I noted him. I was like,

23:43

I see you rowboat man. And

23:45

then there was the same man

23:47

playing a circus drum. And it

23:49

was like, all right. why we

23:51

all need to watch the entire

23:54

credits because we need to look

23:56

out for like that line that

23:58

says robot man number one slash

24:00

slash juggler yeah cloud well it

24:02

makes you wonder like the war

24:04

is over yeah what are you

24:06

gonna do what what are they

24:08

gonna do maybe they're chasing their

24:11

passions at long last he probably

24:13

learned drumming in the Navy that's

24:15

true so true yeah oh my

24:17

god you're so right I love

24:19

that for them So yeah, as

24:21

Becca said, it hoggles back and

24:23

forth with the creditors and they're

24:25

like chasing Mr. Shepard and Mrs.

24:27

Clay being like, Sir Walter owes

24:30

me money, Sir Walter owes me

24:32

money and they're kind of like

24:34

acting like their celebrities in the

24:36

paparazzi is after them and they're

24:38

like ducking out of the way.

24:40

And we cut to Sir William

24:42

in a room with Sir Walter.

24:44

Sir Walter. I'm gonna be honest.

24:46

every single part of my notes

24:49

to say Sir William. Is it

24:51

right? Will you control F that

24:53

shit? Yeah, actual F. Sir W.

24:55

We're gonna say Sir Walter. He's

24:57

in a room with Lady Russell

24:59

and Mrs. Clay and Mr. Shepard

25:01

and Elizabeth and he's like I

25:03

do not want to say her

25:06

as a tenant in my house

25:08

but we have to focus on

25:10

Elizabeth for a second. because we

25:12

were introduced to a character who

25:14

in my mind was going to

25:16

be this like upright very focused

25:18

on like societal norms character and

25:20

instead we have stockard Channing in

25:22

a Regent Sierra gown slouched over

25:25

a chair and like popping grapes

25:27

in her mouth and like snorting

25:29

in the corner at everything like

25:31

no decorum and I kind of

25:33

love it. What are our thoughts?

25:35

Yeah. She's at home, she is

25:37

too rich to sit up straight.

25:39

Yeah. And this is this is

25:42

something that I see in other

25:44

adaptations and I'm all for it.

25:46

And yeah, she she decided to

25:48

play this pure psychopath. Yeah, she

25:50

has such intense rage issues. Oh

25:52

my god. There's murder in her

25:54

heart. Yeah, that's that's someone like

25:56

You're glad she was born to

25:58

like this specific position in society

26:01

where she can't inflict harm on

26:03

a huge number of people because

26:05

if she had a little bit

26:07

more power Yeah, if she had

26:09

less power and access to some

26:11

more people Just imagine if she

26:13

were like a school marm or

26:15

worked at a pub havoc. Yes,

26:17

the very particular position she is

26:20

in in society means the only

26:22

person she's really making truly miserable

26:24

is Anne, which sucks for Anne,

26:26

but for everybody else, thank goodness

26:28

it's contained. I also, I think

26:30

like with Elizabeth, it's one of

26:32

the things that's sort of defined

26:34

about her in the books is

26:37

that she's so hot. that she

26:39

figures she can get away with

26:41

a lot more than she can.

26:43

And what I think is really

26:45

interesting about this performance is the

26:47

actress is very pretty, but like

26:49

the way she plays up Elizabeth

26:51

makes her so unappealing that you

26:53

almost don't notice. This is 1995,

26:56

this is famously on the cusp,

26:58

but before Britain figured out that

27:00

you could put hot people on

27:02

TV. So it's that same year.

27:04

So this is this is right

27:06

on the edge. Yeah. And and

27:08

so no one in this movie

27:10

is conventionally attractive in the way

27:13

that you would maybe expect from

27:15

a period drama now. Yeah, these

27:17

days. Yeah, these days. These days.

27:19

These days. You just couldn't cast

27:21

this way and have a famously

27:23

hot Elizabeth. Yeah, yeah, no, exactly.

27:25

Yeah. I should clarify that it's

27:27

not actually Stockard Channing. I just

27:29

think that she looks like her.

27:32

I realize that it like really

27:34

just part of the same. I

27:36

know, no. I just believed you

27:38

because I don't know anybody's name.

27:40

Stockard Channing is in Greece. Yeah,

27:42

I love Stockett Channing. I think

27:44

of her two big roles, Grace

27:46

practical magic, and now I have

27:48

to... to add the 95 Persuasion

27:51

in spirit. Which one is she

27:53

in Greece? She's Rizzo. Oh yeah,

27:55

yeah, yeah. Lucky me, I'm Sandra

27:57

Dee. Yeah. But anyway, I do

27:59

love though thinking about the fact

28:01

that like she is, the reason

28:03

she's acting like such a slob

28:05

is because she's playing up that

28:08

I'm so rich stereotype, which like,

28:10

or not stereotype, but like, she's

28:12

acting richer than she is in

28:14

the same way that. Sir Walter

28:16

is, but different, like same same

28:18

but different. So I do love

28:20

that. While Sir Walter is talking

28:22

about how ugly naval men are,

28:24

Mrs. Clay says, have some pity

28:27

on them. Not everyone is born

28:29

to be handsome and like kind

28:31

of shows her tits. Yep. They

28:33

really upplay her flirting with him.

28:35

She's out to get that bag.

28:37

You got to respect the hustle.

28:39

I do. It's a delusional hustle

28:41

as well. I can't remember if

28:43

she's meant to be hot in

28:46

the book. I think they even

28:48

talk about her having kind of

28:50

a snaggly tooth in the book.

28:52

But maybe as though that's like

28:54

a beauty mark, like she flashed

28:56

her snaggle tooth at him. I

28:58

actually think that she's perfectly cast

29:00

in terms of the level of

29:03

attraction she's supposed to have because

29:05

when Anne confronts Elizabeth about the

29:07

possibility of Mrs. Clay taking over

29:09

as you know their new stepmother

29:11

Elizabeth said oh not possible she's

29:13

not hot enough and Anne is

29:15

like okay so she's not a

29:17

perfect face but she does have

29:19

like nice hair and nice eyes

29:22

and like a good figure and

29:24

like That'd overlook the snaggletooth eventually

29:26

if she's charming enough. Like you

29:28

won't look up that much. Right.

29:30

Yeah, it's all about the boobs.

29:32

Exactly. And you know, this actress,

29:34

not to be, I don't want

29:36

to be disrespectful of this actress,

29:39

but she fills a beautiful Regency

29:41

gown, quite nice. She does. I've

29:43

already called Everybody Ugly on this

29:45

show. Which is, we'll get to

29:47

it, Henry, Hater or Ray shirt,

29:49

but like. Well, also, Mr. Shepard

29:51

is another daddy, in my mind.

29:53

So... Molly, it's so funny to

29:55

be... I like an older man.

29:58

She does. It's specifically these Jane

30:00

Austen adaptations in real life, like...

30:02

you are partnered with like your

30:04

your age appropriate like girlfriend who

30:06

looks nothing like any of these

30:08

gentlemen but in all of the

30:10

jade Austin adaptations like the person

30:12

Molly is most drawn to is

30:14

the older slightly stately father who

30:17

owns the estate so can you

30:19

imagine if you were like yeah

30:21

Mel looks like Mr. Shepard a

30:23

little bit no Melanie just simply

30:25

gives us stately energy yes she's

30:27

lovely looking human- I think, I

30:29

wanted to say that Miss, Mrs.

30:31

Clay kind of looks like Caroline

30:34

and New Girl. That was something

30:36

that both Mel and I, when

30:38

we were watching, we were like,

30:40

wait, that Caroline and New Girl,

30:42

absolutely not. It's 1995. But anyway.

30:44

You guys referenced so many non-period

30:46

dramas. It is confusing to me

30:48

and I feel attacked. Yeah. Anyway.

30:50

Lady Russell is wearing this hat

30:53

with these massive feathers coming out

30:55

the back. Her hats in general.

30:57

Becca's giving chefs kisses. I was

30:59

like, her hats and her bangs

31:01

are like an offense on society.

31:03

Alice is a lot to say

31:05

about bangs. Oh, let's hear it.

31:07

I do hate, I do hate

31:10

a bang, a period drama bang,

31:12

because nobody's maintaining that, like, you're

31:14

all just trying to not get

31:16

cholera. But Lady Russell has done

31:18

it in sort of a regency

31:20

way that I'm buying, but I

31:22

also didn't really notice because the

31:24

hats are so scrumptious. It's this,

31:26

like, it's a cross between a

31:29

turban and a, like, a hair.

31:31

on it for when you're sleeping,

31:33

but also sometimes a top hat

31:35

without a brim made of sap.

31:37

I've never seen anything like it.

31:39

It's like a cushion on it.

31:41

And it's perfect in every scenario.

31:43

I could not disagree with Molly

31:45

Moore. I love that. All of

31:48

the hats in this film. I

31:50

feel like this is part of

31:52

like the historical accuracy overall in

31:54

this film that I really really

31:56

like. attributing it to historical accuracy

31:58

because it feels like they are

32:00

hitting on a very specific fashion

32:02

moment that lasted a very short

32:05

period of time that was really

32:07

ugly and then everyone was like

32:09

oh it's fashion fashion for like

32:11

six months and then they were

32:13

like for the rest of time

32:15

and I love that we get

32:17

to see that depicted instead of

32:19

you know bonnet. Right because she's

32:21

wearing one and then later Mrs.

32:24

Croft wears one but I think...

32:26

in my opinion, wears it much

32:28

better. I think that the thing

32:30

that really threw me off about

32:32

Lady Russell's hat is the perpetual

32:34

feathers because first it's in the

32:36

back and then when she wears

32:38

a different one later, it's in

32:41

the front in such a way

32:43

that it looks like her hair

32:45

is feathered, like she's in the

32:47

90s. So that's what really threw

32:49

me off, but like, listen, I

32:51

didn't hate it. I just thought

32:53

it was bonkers. So she... says

32:55

that she has consulted with Anne

32:57

and drawn up some plans for

33:00

retrenching. And Elizabeth has this excellent

33:02

moment where she goes, Anne, why?

33:04

Why Anne? Cracked me up. And

33:06

of course, Anne enters at that

33:08

very same moment and sits in

33:10

the only chair available, which is

33:12

in the corner and not near

33:14

where anyone else is sitting. I

33:16

mean, she's probably thankful of that

33:19

though. She's like, oh great, I

33:21

don't have to sit of anybody.

33:23

I'm just gonna sit here, leave

33:25

me alone. Leave me alone. Let

33:27

me do my thing. So true.

33:29

Amanda Roots performance in this is

33:31

so dominated by like her doeys.

33:33

Like she looks like immediately like

33:36

a deer in headlights dealing with

33:38

everybody around. Yeah, I wouldn't call

33:40

them. doeys though because I feel

33:42

like that implies like a sweet

33:44

kind of almost puppy dog sad

33:46

face but hers if if you

33:48

see it's haunted it's haunted she's

33:50

haunted by the memory of this

33:52

man if this were a horror

33:55

movie anyway Elizabeth when she is

33:57

handed the plans for retrenching yeats

33:59

them she just throws them on

34:01

the ground which I think is

34:03

incredible she's like and Then we

34:05

jump to dinner where we're talking

34:07

about moving to bath. And Mrs.

34:09

Clay is like, oh, bath sounds

34:12

so lovely in the summer, and

34:14

then she kind of sips her

34:16

soup really seductively. At Sir Walter,

34:18

I was like, oh my God,

34:20

you need to tone it back,

34:22

girl. And then Sir Walter asks

34:24

who the admiral is, because we're

34:26

talking about letting the admiral come

34:28

and rent. And when nobody answers

34:31

and does, and this is the

34:33

first thing we hear her say,

34:35

and when they ask who Mrs.

34:37

Croft's brother is, because they're like,

34:39

oh yeah, doesn't she have a

34:41

brother? They say, and you recall,

34:43

don't you? And she goes, what

34:45

worth? What worth? What worth? She

34:47

like chokes on the name, and

34:50

it's so hot. I have a

34:52

random fact that I think this

34:54

is when this is when it

34:56

appears. I can't remember what it

34:58

was over dinner or was it

35:00

with breakfast. Anyway, you kind of

35:02

see all these pineapples on the

35:04

table, right? And did you know?

35:07

Well, you probably got, you of

35:09

course you know this. So yeah,

35:11

so basically pineapples were a symbol

35:13

of, you know, richness because they

35:15

were extremely expensive, right? And you

35:17

know, you could rent a pineapple.

35:19

They had this thing. Just all

35:21

of our jaws just fell to

35:23

the floor. So like if you're

35:26

really really really really rich you

35:28

will like buy a pineapple right

35:30

but if you're like not so

35:32

rich and you kind of want

35:34

to like show off that you

35:36

have a pineapple or multiple you

35:38

could rent a Pineapple so does

35:40

anybody eat the pineapple? No no

35:43

no no no you just wait

35:45

for it to rot basically I

35:47

don't know they should be like

35:49

dipping them in lacquer or something

35:51

right because I was like how

35:53

long does it last like how

35:55

you know how cost effective is

35:57

that and they had multiple pineapples

35:59

right because it was like showing

36:02

how you know look at us

36:04

we're so rich or we kind

36:06

of like you want to show

36:08

off how rich we are we

36:10

could we have like 10 pineapples.

36:12

And that's why they're in debt.

36:14

Yeah. And the fucking ice swans.

36:16

Yes, the ice swan. With the

36:18

sorbet. Yes. Yeah, the pineapples did

36:21

ring a bell for me because

36:23

of cabaret. So a pineapple for

36:25

you, for me. Yeah. And then

36:27

later on, and when, sorry, just

36:29

like fast forward, right, to when

36:31

they're in bath, we'll, we'll, will

36:33

rewind, but yeah. Even then I

36:35

noticed that when they were in

36:38

bath, they kind of like two

36:40

tiny little pineapples. people. Oh, that's

36:42

detail. You have no money. Where

36:44

you've been getting these pineapples wrong.

36:46

They're in debt. Exactly. That's what

36:48

they're travel pineapples. It's like a

36:50

great manifestation of what bath is,

36:52

which is we want to portray

36:54

luxury on a smaller scale. Yeah.

36:57

So like the smaller pineapples make

36:59

it look like they're still wealthy,

37:01

because they're in bath in a

37:03

town home. Yep. That's a that's

37:05

a wonderful little detail. I've noticed

37:07

like the whole thing is set

37:09

up to make the Elliot's look

37:11

like insanely ostentatious in their wealth

37:13

and then immediately compared to every

37:16

other like character we meet in

37:18

the story their level of wealth

37:20

like for example would get there

37:22

but the Musgroves are quite wealthy

37:24

and they're not living in the

37:26

same level of like a splendor

37:28

that the Elliot's are living in

37:30

clearly. because well it's all for

37:33

show and I think that it

37:35

it shows that it's all for

37:37

show because they're doing instead of

37:39

having like real nice things they

37:41

have many pineapples mm-hmm so it's

37:43

like oh what are you actually

37:45

spending your on. Oh you have

37:47

many pineapples that's cute. We over

37:49

here have happiness and lots of

37:52

children. Right. And a harp. Yes.

37:54

Out of really nice harp. So

37:56

Sir Walter when he is reminded

37:58

of the name Wentworth says that

38:00

oh Wentworth the curate is nothing

38:02

and Anne gets up and walks

38:04

away and he's like did I

38:06

say something and Elizabeth goes oh

38:09

father you must remember the curate's

38:11

brother and Lady Russell goes let's

38:13

not pursue it we're talking about

38:15

it like they don't talk about

38:17

it in the book right I

38:19

suppose they have to show something

38:21

they have to they have to

38:23

set him up you either need

38:25

to like show or tell and

38:28

here it's a bit of a

38:30

tell What happened? And this is

38:32

this gets to another critique like

38:34

what I want out of a

38:36

gene of persuasion adaptation is that

38:38

I want to like be shown

38:40

what happened between. Anne and Wentworth

38:42

rather than told what happened. You

38:44

want some flash obacos? Oh yeah,

38:47

some flash obacos are much needed

38:49

in a persuasion adaptation just to

38:51

establish like why we care that

38:53

Wentworth's coming back, why we care

38:55

that he's coming back, why Anne

38:57

cares that he's coming back, what

38:59

he meant to her. And like

39:01

we get that as we see

39:04

them sort of like panic as

39:06

they look at each other in

39:08

this adaptation, but I would love

39:10

to have that like have some

39:12

backing in like when she was

39:14

convinced away from him, persuaded, if

39:16

you will, if you will. and

39:18

like what that meant for her

39:20

eight years later. And I think

39:23

that obviously the book... gives that

39:25

narration, but it would be like

39:27

the benefit of film is being

39:29

able to portray the story in

39:31

a different manner. And so using

39:33

what Jane Austin has written on

39:35

the page already to tell the

39:37

story in a more compelling manner,

39:40

here it's a bit more just

39:42

like, oh, she was in love

39:44

with the curates brother, the sailor,

39:46

we all hate him. And then

39:48

it flashes to and eventually saying

39:50

to Lady Russell, I'm skipping ahead.

39:52

Oh, I know you meant well

39:54

and I don't. I don't like

39:56

blame myself for you for like

39:59

the decision to like refuse him

40:01

but all these years later blah

40:03

blah blah blah blah and I'm

40:05

like okay but then I don't

40:07

I don't get to see what

40:09

happened in the moment that you

40:11

know made you now so regretful.

40:13

I like that we don't have

40:15

that made explicit for us I

40:18

like that it's left a bit

40:20

to our imagination because I really

40:22

love the scene when she's clearing

40:24

out her stuff and she finds

40:26

tucked away in a little notebook.

40:28

the letter that you know is

40:30

from him because it's folded in

40:32

the shape of a sailboat and

40:35

just how tenderly she picks it

40:37

up and the way it looks

40:39

kind of aged and there's so

40:41

much spoken in that little scene

40:43

to me of pain so I

40:45

don't necessarily need to see exactly

40:47

how everything went down and like

40:49

the words they said to each

40:51

other right it's the longing. It's

40:54

the longing. in the little boat.

40:56

The little boat scene is beautiful.

40:58

I agree. I agree too. And

41:00

I also don't mind that we

41:02

don't see the flashbacks, but I

41:04

do mind that we're talking about

41:06

it and that everyone's talking about

41:08

it, like that the family knows

41:11

that this is why she's been

41:13

suffering for eight years and that

41:15

she and Lady Russell. are talking

41:17

about it just because so much

41:19

of what I imagine has been

41:21

wearing on her for eight years

41:23

is the fact that she doesn't

41:25

have an outlet for all of

41:27

this pent-up emotion. And I mean,

41:30

Lady Russell does perpetually say like,

41:32

let's not talk about it, let's

41:34

not talk about it, but it's

41:36

being brought up enough that I

41:38

feel like it comes up in

41:40

this movie world, whereas I think

41:42

that something I liked about the

41:44

book is that she really needs

41:46

someone to talk to about all

41:49

of this, but she can't. So

41:51

like there's pros and cons and

41:53

I also fucking love the sailboat

41:55

moment. Beautiful, beautiful moment. Yeah. And

41:57

okay, but I. we'll just we

41:59

won't talk about this when it

42:01

comes up but the sailboat she's

42:03

left it folded up like a

42:06

boat this whole time so like

42:08

she hasn't read it in like

42:10

eight years no she and I

42:12

don't know that that she's touched

42:14

it in that time or if

42:16

this is something that she because

42:18

she's going through a trunk and

42:20

so this might have just been

42:22

from you know her shit from

42:25

year six right and she's then

42:27

she's pulling it all out and

42:29

having to like tangibly confront these

42:31

memories memories again Do you think

42:33

she's ever read that letter? You

42:35

think she folded it up and

42:37

handed it to her? No, yeah,

42:39

she's read it. Okay. Yeah, I'm

42:42

sure and I'm sure he even

42:44

taught her. I mean, you know,

42:46

you know, in my mind, you

42:48

know, when they were courting and

42:50

they were just like sitting in

42:52

the field, he was like showing

42:54

her how to how to fold

42:56

it back. Yeah. Oh. So. Sir

42:58

Walter invites Mrs. Clay to come

43:01

to bath with them. And Lady

43:03

Russell is like, what about Anne?

43:05

And Elizabeth's like, oh, well, Anne's

43:07

not coming. She has to take

43:09

care of Mary. And this whole

43:11

conversation is happening right in front

43:13

of Anne, who just has to

43:15

sit there. And I think that's

43:17

a very good encapsulation of Anne's

43:20

character in this story. Then we

43:22

meet the Crofts. And of course,

43:24

we have Lady Fiona Shaw. She's

43:26

so incredible. I love that she

43:28

really can't conquer her Irish accent

43:30

throughout this film. I love that

43:32

for her and us, but she

43:34

is conquering the hell out of

43:37

that hat, as you mentioned. Yeah,

43:39

I love the way Mrs. Croft

43:41

and Admiral Croft are depicted in

43:43

this. They exude so much warmth

43:45

and the way that they're styled

43:47

makes it obvious that they are

43:49

like coming off of a life

43:51

of adventure to settle down and

43:53

it makes them feel so... aspirational

43:56

as a couple, which I think,

43:58

you know, in Anne's brain. and

44:00

they are aspirational. That's kind

44:02

of what she wants, is she

44:04

wants to be Mrs. Croft to

44:06

Admiral Croft, but for Wentworth. I

44:08

know, you must have been so painful,

44:10

she'd be like, yeah, like, you know,

44:13

that could have been me. Exactly.

44:15

Yeah. So the Elliot's go, and they

44:17

each give a goodbye to Anne that

44:19

is so indicative of their relationship

44:21

over the last lifetime. Elizabeth

44:23

is giving analyst of

44:25

instructions of instructions on

44:27

what to do. while kind of

44:30

staring dreamily into the distance and

44:32

then walks away and then Sir

44:35

Walter just kind of gives Anne

44:37

this dismissive wave like like like

44:39

she's something under his shoe which

44:41

is it made me mad but also

44:43

was kind of funny and as he

44:45

walks out all the servants are looking

44:47

at him with this just look of

44:49

utter disdain on their faces which I

44:52

also loved. Then we get the first

44:54

hint of a score in this movie

44:56

as The servants are covering up

44:58

their nice furniture with sheets and

45:00

we finally get some music coming

45:02

in in the background. We get

45:04

this little montage of Anne helping

45:06

the servants pack up all of

45:08

their things. We get the paper

45:10

boat scene, we get Anne and

45:12

Lady Russell sitting amongst a sea

45:14

of cloth covered furniture talking about

45:16

the fact that Anne is like, I know that

45:19

you didn't mean any harm by it but

45:21

I think I might have been happy if

45:23

I had. married Wentworth. She didn't

45:25

say married Wentworth, but she says

45:27

it. She's like, no, no, no, you

45:29

were 19. He didn't have any

45:31

money. He didn't have any prospects.

45:33

You made a reasonable choice. And

45:36

we've already talked about my feelings

45:38

and all of our feelings about

45:40

them talking about this, but it

45:42

is a little moment of expose

45:44

leading us into the rest of the

45:46

story. I'm glad that we get to see

45:48

her speak a little bit when she has

45:51

a bit of... freedom to be open so that

45:53

we can see her body language, we can

45:55

see the misery on her face when she

45:57

doesn't have to buck up to be there

45:59

for Mary. yet. And so we get a

46:01

sense of exactly where she is in

46:03

herself. And so then we can see

46:06

how she carries through for the rest

46:08

of the film. Yeah, totally. And

46:10

I love this little moment where

46:12

Lady Russell asks her if she's

46:14

going directly to upper cross and Anne

46:17

says, yeah, I prefer to be gone

46:19

when his sister, when Admiral and Mrs.

46:21

Croft arrived arrive. And she, like,

46:23

has to swallow down. She doesn't

46:26

want to admit how much she's

46:28

feeling this. Yeah. So as Anne drives

46:30

away, she passes farmers

46:32

on their fields burning crops,

46:34

which I thought, what I

46:37

think is happening is kind

46:39

of them preparing for the

46:41

next season and burning that

46:43

season's crops. And I thought

46:46

that was a nice like

46:48

symbolization of like. passing from one

46:50

era of life into another and

46:53

or the changing of the

46:55

seasons. I think that's what's happening.

46:57

I'm sure that some historian listeners

47:00

will be able to correct me

47:02

if that's incorrect, but I thought it

47:04

was symbolic. I have no idea what

47:06

they're burning. At some point I thought

47:08

they were burning just like piles of poo.

47:11

And it's because it's so quick, you're

47:13

just like, what is that steaming

47:15

pile? Or smoky pile. A steaming

47:17

pile of shit? Yeah, literally. Oh,

47:19

I was more concerned with the

47:21

pig and the goose or duck

47:23

or whatever, right? And she was

47:25

bringing, I was like, is that where

47:27

she's bringing to Mary? Like, here you

47:29

go, here's a pig. You know, that's

47:32

a good point. I didn't want to

47:34

bring it up when we were watching

47:36

because Molly is vegan and my fiancé

47:38

Mike is a vegetarian and that pig

47:40

was in the back and I was

47:42

like I bet she's like bringing dinner.

47:44

No she's not. Okay, so the pig

47:46

and the goose are also going to

47:48

see their sisters. Okay, okay. They're just

47:51

going to hang out. Who they've on

47:53

the grounds of up across and

47:55

so she's giving them a ride. Yes.

47:57

And that pig is a huge hypochondriac.

47:59

Yeah. you know, like comfort and

48:01

do a bunch of emotional labor

48:04

for the upper cross. But the

48:06

goose has a much better relationship

48:08

with the sister goose, actually. Oh,

48:10

thank goodness, yes. Although they do

48:13

so wish their brother had married

48:15

the other two. Okay, right, we've

48:17

cleared it up, thank you. You

48:20

know how there's a spinoff of

48:22

pride and prejudice, which is just

48:24

like the servants of Longbourn. We

48:26

also need one for the animals.

48:29

Yeah. On our podcast, we famously

48:31

do not like, and sometimes just

48:33

will refuse to cover a movie

48:36

or TV show if anything bad

48:38

happens to an animal, but if

48:40

it's a small part of it,

48:42

we're pretty good at retrofitting that

48:45

into our worldview of no animals

48:47

actually getting hurt. You're like, the

48:49

dog is fine! to this

48:52

to this day one of my

48:54

favorite moments from our podcast is

48:56

that we were halfway through reading

48:58

Pride and Prejudice the first book

49:00

we covered and Molly turns to

49:02

me and goes Becca where are

49:04

the dogs and I said to

49:06

Molly Molly there are always dogs

49:08

there are dogs there are dogs

49:10

there are dogs everywhere around and

49:12

this is canon like they just

49:15

hang out there are the lounging

49:17

dogs there are the hunting dogs

49:19

and they all hang out all

49:21

the time in the background as

49:23

part of the scenery and part

49:25

of the like joy in the

49:27

lives of these Jane Austin characters.

49:29

Oh yeah, yeah, they're living the

49:31

best, the best lives. All the

49:33

dogs are, they're good. There are

49:35

always dogs. Yeah, when Charles comes

49:37

in later in this movie and

49:40

he's like, I've come for the

49:42

dogs. I was like, of course

49:44

you have. Yeah, me too, dude.

49:46

And like again, we're getting so

49:48

tangential, but like, one of the

49:50

great moments of persuasion is when

49:52

they have to come back early

49:54

from hunting, because they brought a

49:56

puppy out to do it and

49:58

he wasn't doing a very good

50:00

job. Yeah. You can find it.

50:02

You can find it. You're going

50:05

to find it. I felt it.

50:07

I was like, so my dog

50:09

comes from a line of hunting

50:11

dogs, you know, and I'll be

50:13

like, oh, yeah, yeah, you put

50:15

body out there, he'll. just be

50:17

like, woo-hoo! Have a great time.

50:19

I don't know what I'm doing,

50:21

I'm running around. Scare all the

50:23

birds away before you can shoot

50:25

them. Yeah. So we are coming

50:27

up on Mary's house and when

50:30

Anne arrives, she sees Mary peeping

50:32

through the window and as soon

50:34

as they make eye contact Mary

50:36

ducks out of sight and when

50:38

Anne comes in she's lying under

50:40

the window like on her sick

50:42

bed. Yeah, she's like, I've been

50:44

so ill. I'm going to like

50:46

at this moment just take a

50:48

beat and say this is my

50:50

favorite from the movie. Mary is

50:52

to me one of Jane Austin's

50:54

creatures of comedic genius. Every line

50:57

she has in the book is

50:59

pure gold and like you want

51:01

someone to deliver on that. in

51:03

an adaptation, Sophie Thompson, Emma Thompson's

51:05

sister, is delivering an 800% performance

51:07

at all times in this movie

51:09

and every line delivery of hers

51:11

is pure gold. You guys have

51:13

covered the Emma adaptations. Yes, yes.

51:15

So you know what a phenomenal

51:17

mis-space she was as well. Yes,

51:19

absolutely. So good. Yeah, it's somehow

51:22

giving, it's not giving the same

51:24

energy, but it is giving the

51:26

same high, very niche level of

51:28

performance. And like the way she

51:30

is able to acutely play a

51:32

lack of self-awareness is so perfect

51:34

in every moment. Every moment she's

51:36

on the screen, I am just

51:38

thriving. Like I love, I love

51:40

this performance. Yeah, one line that

51:42

she said that really tickled me

51:44

was. I do believe if Charles

51:47

were to see me dying, he

51:49

wouldn't believe there was anything wrong

51:51

with me. Oh, I was so,

51:53

oh again, as I've already explained

51:55

at the start. Yep, yep, it's

51:57

triggering for you. So triggering, I

51:59

tell you, oh my God, no,

52:01

no, no, I will agree, like

52:03

a performance is amazing, but because

52:05

it was so bloody good, I

52:07

was like, oh no. I love

52:09

this as well, especially on this

52:12

watching, maybe more so than other

52:14

watches, because not because I am

52:16

Mary, wise inclined but I do

52:18

have an ulcer right now and

52:20

I am being very brave about

52:22

it you are and telling everyone

52:24

I know about this ulcer and

52:26

how brave I am in suffering

52:28

through my ulcer because I already

52:30

have a whole thing with my

52:32

back and now I have a

52:34

whole thing with my front as

52:37

well so it's a double-sided bravery

52:39

and so like Somehow I was

52:41

trying to be more generous to

52:43

Mary. I was like, you know

52:45

what? Maybe you have an ulcer

52:47

and no one cares. She probably

52:49

does. She's stressed herself out. This

52:51

is actually a very ongoing conversation

52:53

within our fan-nom, whether or not

52:55

Mary is just so starved for

52:57

attention that she has learned to

52:59

imagine symptoms for herself constantly or

53:02

whether or not she actually has

53:04

symptoms of some illness that everyone's

53:06

ignoring because she has ignored constantly

53:08

and... One could read her either

53:10

way. Yeah, I mean, probably not

53:12

an ulcer because of the quantity

53:14

of ham she's eating. Oh my

53:16

god, look at how much she's

53:18

eating. Okay, she's fine. But maybe

53:20

she has endometriosis. I don't know.

53:22

Maybe she's just depressed. Like, you

53:24

never know, anxiety can cause a

53:26

lot of really weird physical symptoms

53:29

in a person. Yeah. She probably

53:31

needs magnesium. She definitely needs vitamin

53:33

D. She definitely needs vitamin D.

53:35

Yeah. is complaining and complaining, and

53:37

she complains that Anne hasn't asked

53:39

her about her dinner at the

53:41

pools the night before, and Anne

53:43

is like, I assume you're going

53:45

to go, and she's like, no,

53:47

no, no, no, no, I was

53:49

perfectly fine last night. She's just

53:51

today. And then when Anne does

53:54

ask her about her dinner at

53:56

the pools, she's like, oh, well,

53:58

it was nothing remarkable. It's iconic.

54:00

Then they go to the great

54:02

house where the musgroves live and

54:04

Henrietta and Louisa have gotten a

54:06

harp. and Henrietta also is Mrs.

54:08

Forrester in the 1995 Pride of

54:10

Regitous. I love her. And without

54:12

spoiling anything, she will pop up

54:14

in other adaptations of Jane Austin's

54:16

work as well. Oh, good. They

54:19

want to induce Anne to play

54:21

the piano, not the harp, and

54:23

Mary is like. Well, I play

54:25

quite as well as Anne. Don't

54:27

you want me to play too?

54:29

The silence that follows that is

54:31

like 10 seconds one. It's really

54:33

good. Of course. Yes. Thank you,

54:35

Mary. But you know what? You

54:37

dance so much better. So just

54:39

love to see you dance. Yeah,

54:41

exactly. And also, that's the first

54:44

time we're introduced to the notion

54:46

that Anne has quite given up

54:48

dancing. They're like, well Anne doesn't

54:50

like to dance anyway and you

54:52

dance so well so let Anne

54:54

play while you dance. Then we

54:56

get the famous montage of everyone

54:58

gossiping at Anne while they sip

55:00

tea. You know I love a

55:02

montage Alice, you know I love

55:04

a montage Alice, you know I

55:06

love a montage Alice, I'm obsessed

55:09

with them. This is my favorite

55:11

scene in the movie, it's incredible,

55:13

Anne acted hanging out with her.

55:15

better sister with people who genuinely

55:17

like her as a person. Who

55:19

are nice, they're nice people. Good

55:21

nice people, wealthy good connections, and

55:23

still her life is sitting there

55:25

with a cup of tea while

55:27

they all talk shit about each

55:29

other, which... If it were me,

55:31

I'd be having a great time,

55:34

I would be living because I

55:36

enjoy a good gap. But Anne...

55:38

Give me some of that cake.

55:40

No, but the thing is, they're

55:42

not, they're not just talking shit

55:44

though, they're asking her to try

55:46

to solve things. Again, triggering for

55:48

me, because when I, when I

55:50

go back, whenever I see my

55:52

family, it's always like, oh, you

55:54

know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,

55:56

blah, can you do something about

55:59

it? The amount of emotional labor

56:01

Anne Elliot takes on shit is

56:03

honestly remarkable in her life. It's

56:05

crazy and even from these people

56:07

who like are her actually like

56:09

helping her out quite a lot

56:11

right now by like letting her

56:13

stay with them but at the

56:15

same time like The amount she

56:17

has to do at any given

56:19

moment and the way that Amanda

56:21

Root plays this across her face,

56:23

it's like she doesn't have a

56:26

line in the scene and you

56:28

know exactly what Anna's thinking. Imagine

56:30

having to manage the emotions of

56:32

your brother-in-law who also asked you

56:34

to marry him at one point.

56:36

Yeah. And like you have to

56:38

help him navigate his marriage to

56:40

your little sister. Yeah. I think

56:42

that their relationship is so interesting

56:44

because... I have to imagine that

56:46

he wasn't necessarily in love with

56:48

Anne. She was just the most

56:51

appealing of the three sisters and

56:53

her saying no, I don't imagine

56:55

that it broke his heart, but

56:57

I do imagine that there is

56:59

some awkwardness between them now, but

57:01

like the moment that he walks

57:03

in and she says you were

57:05

missed it. lunch in Charles and

57:07

he gives this long suffering eye

57:09

roll. I'm like, actually, I feel

57:11

like you're friends. Yeah, no, yeah,

57:13

and I think they would. So

57:16

one thing I know kind of

57:18

to add some kind of historical

57:20

context to this is that once

57:22

your sister for in this case

57:24

has gotten married, let's say if

57:26

Mary were to die, there is

57:28

absolutely no way kind of socially

57:30

or legally that Charles would be

57:32

able to marry Anne because in

57:34

the eyes of the law in

57:36

the eyes of society that they

57:38

are siblings now and so they

57:41

do I feel fall into that

57:43

sibling relationship and have that kind

57:45

of understanding between themselves which I

57:47

find quite sweet. And the way

57:49

that moment plays is really interesting

57:51

because it gives context to what

57:53

that relationship looks like, which in

57:55

what we've seen so far, is

57:57

very obviously these two spend a

57:59

lot of time negotiating how to

58:01

take care of Mary and that

58:03

Charles, for his faults, does try

58:06

to take care of his wife,

58:08

often fails and corrects. And like,

58:10

you can see the two of

58:12

them kind of being like, her

58:14

being like, hey, you got to

58:16

take care of Mary this way,

58:18

and him being like, oh God

58:20

again. like, oh, can't you come

58:22

take care of Mary? Like, like

58:24

that negotiation between the two of

58:26

them feels like it has history

58:28

behind it when she says, you

58:31

were missed at lunch. Go do

58:33

it. Go talk to her. Not

58:35

to harp on this too much

58:37

because we're not talking about this

58:39

book, but in that case, are

58:41

Emma and Knightley not related? No.

58:43

So that's a different story because

58:45

his brother has married her sister.

58:47

So she's legally sisters with his

58:49

brother. But not with him. Yeah,

58:51

but not with him. Yeah, but

58:53

that doesn't compute. It doesn't compute.

58:55

So Isabella is like his sister.

58:58

John is her brother, but there's

59:00

not that kind of connection with

59:02

each other. It's a loophole. The

59:04

only thing you need to know

59:06

is that when they remade this

59:08

story in the 1990s, they put

59:10

more incest in there. Yes. Oh,

59:12

yeah. So. The admiral and Mrs.

59:14

Croft come to pay their respects

59:16

to the Musgroves and the kids

59:18

love admiral Croft and it is

59:20

adorable. So cute like he's such

59:23

a nice guy. He is and

59:25

he like teaches them how to

59:27

make the little bow and that's

59:29

why I that's why I know

59:31

I know in depth of my

59:33

heart that like you know when

59:35

to have also taught me and

59:37

how to make a little boy.

59:39

Yeah which is why she's staring

59:41

at them wistfully. Oh yeah and

59:43

Yeah, again, the immediate warmth coming

59:45

off of those two characters and

59:48

also the admiral left children is

59:50

an interesting thing because they're an

59:52

older couple it's clear they're not

59:54

going to have kids and it

59:56

kind of tells you a little

59:58

bit about them as well that

1:00:00

they have they have an adoration

1:00:02

of children but no children and

1:00:04

I just Fiona Shaw's performance as

1:00:06

Mrs. Croft is like so perfect

1:00:08

for how I pictured her in

1:00:10

the book it's one of my

1:00:13

favorite things about this adaptation as

1:00:15

well. Fiona Shaw is my favorite

1:00:17

part of anything. Oh god yeah.

1:00:19

And it seems like the way

1:00:21

that she's delivering it, you would

1:00:23

think that maybe this is a

1:00:25

point of sadness or longing for

1:00:27

them, but really they only seem

1:00:29

to exude the joy that they

1:00:31

have for each other and and

1:00:33

the lives that they've shared together

1:00:35

and just the fact that they

1:00:38

don't have children is just one

1:00:40

of those things. And so they

1:00:42

love the children that they're around.

1:00:44

Totally. So while this is happening,

1:00:46

Mrs. Croft and Anne are having

1:00:48

a little conversation and Mrs. Croft

1:00:50

is like, you know, I think

1:00:52

that it was you and not

1:00:54

your sister that knew my brother

1:00:56

and Anne's eyes go huge. Like

1:00:58

you can see all the whites

1:01:00

around her irises and she tells

1:01:03

her, Miss Croft tells Anne, that

1:01:05

he is married and Anne's... panic

1:01:07

like she looks like she's gonna

1:01:09

throw up and the camera stays

1:01:11

focused on her face when Mrs.

1:01:13

Croft says oh and he has

1:01:15

a new curacy too and you

1:01:17

see her just like she's almost

1:01:19

burst into tears. Oh thank God.

1:01:21

I was just like watching this

1:01:23

I was like it's insane that

1:01:25

this girl ever thought at least

1:01:27

in the book that she was

1:01:30

being subtle with her emotions. Yeah,

1:01:32

there's so much internal panic and

1:01:34

persuasion one of the deep challenges

1:01:36

of adapting it is that you

1:01:38

want to be able to show

1:01:40

that internal panic without making it

1:01:42

obvious because if Anne is one

1:01:44

thing she's subtle like She's she's

1:01:46

very good at masking her emotions

1:01:48

and prioritizing other people's emotions to

1:01:50

a fault and in this moment

1:01:52

you it's because we get that

1:01:55

really deep cut to her face

1:01:57

like this close that we can

1:01:59

see it all play out so

1:02:01

big but like to others like

1:02:03

is Mrs. Croft sitting there and

1:02:05

watching her go and being like

1:02:07

oh weird like why does she

1:02:09

care that right it's like maybe

1:02:11

her eyes are just always that

1:02:13

big yeah and they kind of

1:02:15

are to be out but they

1:02:17

are but they do mention that

1:02:20

her other brother is coming and

1:02:22

they're like, oh you wouldn't have

1:02:24

met him, he's the sailor and

1:02:26

Mary's like, no, no, Anne, you

1:02:28

know him, right? And Anne's like,

1:02:30

I met him, I met him

1:02:32

once, once, once or twice, once,

1:02:34

later they are releasing that little

1:02:36

boat, the paper boat onto the

1:02:38

water and Henrietta runs up to

1:02:40

invite them to the great house

1:02:42

for dinner to meet Captain Wentworth.

1:02:45

And Anne is like, oh my

1:02:47

God, oh my God. when she's

1:02:49

getting ready she's like looking at

1:02:51

herself in the mirror and she's

1:02:53

like adjusting her little tendrils and

1:02:55

then she hears a scream from

1:02:57

outside and we go out we

1:02:59

see outside and little Charles is

1:03:01

limp and being carried and Mary

1:03:03

is screaming and sobbing and running

1:03:05

him back and he has of

1:03:07

course dislocated his collarbone and also

1:03:10

Knocked up his face like really

1:03:12

bad. He fell out of a

1:03:14

tree in this in the book.

1:03:16

It's off a horse Which he

1:03:18

shouldn't have been riding a horse

1:03:20

anyway because he's like four But

1:03:22

no, I think he falls off

1:03:24

like a little wall or something

1:03:26

Foreshadowing in the in the book

1:03:28

or the movie in the book.

1:03:30

Oh, I don't know why in

1:03:32

my mind he fell off a

1:03:35

horse. Yeah foreshadowing Yeah, okay. So

1:03:37

maybe it's not a horse. I

1:03:39

don't know where I came up

1:03:41

came up that no Yeah, I

1:03:43

think I mean, I think the,

1:03:45

um, the like long and the

1:03:47

short of like what you need

1:03:49

to know is that like, little

1:03:51

Charles is playing rough housing and

1:03:53

like falls of something he should

1:03:55

not have been climbing. So right.

1:03:57

And dislocates his color. Yes. Um,

1:04:00

of course, Charles. Big C decides

1:04:02

to still go to dinner and

1:04:04

Mary is pissed. And she's like,

1:04:06

what if his father can, why

1:04:08

shouldn't I? And Anne is like,

1:04:10

okay, go, I'll stay with the

1:04:12

kid. And you see her just

1:04:14

like calmly swabbing his face, but

1:04:16

you know that she's like avoiding,

1:04:18

she's like, okay, one more day,

1:04:20

I can go without seeing when

1:04:22

Earth, it's gonna be fine. She's

1:04:24

like, little Charlie. Mm-hmm. You really

1:04:27

did anti-solid on this one. Yeah.

1:04:29

Oh, yeah. This moment also translates

1:04:31

so differently in the movie, and

1:04:33

I think it has to, because

1:04:35

in the book, like, by the

1:04:37

time they're going to dinner, it's

1:04:39

like known that Little Charles is

1:04:41

going to be fine, but... in

1:04:43

this moment, like, you're looking at

1:04:45

the like bludgeoned face of a

1:04:47

little child and like his mom

1:04:49

is in front of him being

1:04:52

like, why can I go to

1:04:54

dinner? Yeah. And the mom's like,

1:04:56

oh yeah, well, that's okay. You

1:04:58

know, you're the best person for

1:05:00

this because you don't have a

1:05:02

mother's heart. So, you know, you're

1:05:04

not going to be pained looking

1:05:06

at him. Okay, bye. It is

1:05:08

a little bit iconic though, because

1:05:10

when Anne is like, you would

1:05:12

think that she would be like,

1:05:14

no, no, no, you should go.

1:05:17

But she's like, huh, that's not

1:05:19

a bad idea. And it's just

1:05:21

like kind of hilarious. It's like

1:05:23

if his father doesn't care about

1:05:25

him, why should I? Exactly. And

1:05:27

then we get a transition, like

1:05:29

a slide wipe to dinner, and

1:05:31

we see just through a window,

1:05:33

Henrietta looking at a man's body.

1:05:35

Aren't we all? We are. Henrietta

1:05:37

and then like the back of

1:05:39

a man and Henrietta is giggling

1:05:42

and like leaning in and a

1:05:44

little bit flirting and we see

1:05:46

of course this is the back

1:05:48

of Wentworth's head, which is a

1:05:50

great place to wrap up this

1:05:52

first part of the 1995 persuasion.

1:05:54

Alice and Kim, thank you so

1:05:56

much for joining us for this.

1:05:58

Thank you. Do you want to

1:06:00

tell the people where they can

1:06:02

find you? Yeah, you know what

1:06:04

just go to our Instagram, you

1:06:07

know, we've got we've got an

1:06:09

Instagram You can find us at

1:06:11

fetch smelling salts you can find

1:06:13

us on Apple iTunes and Spotify

1:06:15

and Pocket Casts and all those

1:06:17

great places and that's the same

1:06:19

for for your podcast, right Alice?

1:06:21

Oh, right now. You can also

1:06:23

find Austin after dark on Instagram

1:06:25

It's Austin after dark Incredible. Well,

1:06:27

thank you so much again and

1:06:29

we'll talk to you very soon

1:06:32

for the rest of this movie.

1:06:34

And until next time, stay proper.

1:06:36

And learn how to make a

1:06:38

little paper boat to impress your

1:06:40

lover. Yes. Our show art is

1:06:42

designed by Torrance Brown. Our show

1:06:44

is transcribed by Speech Doc's Podcast

1:06:46

Transcription. For transcripts and to learn

1:06:48

more about our team, check out

1:06:50

our website at pot and prejudice.com.

1:06:52

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