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welcome to Pod Save the People and welcome to

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2025, we are pumped to be back And

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this year, year has started a with

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People. year it's Family. Happy New

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back I am back. I

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am can find me

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on Ballinger. You can find me on I'm

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You can you can find

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me on Instagram at Fero Rapture.

1:51

And this is DeRay at DIY

1:53

is Dore at the Iowa

1:55

on Twitter. Well,

1:57

we're off too. Yeah,

2:00

I'm just going to need these

2:02

years to settle on down. I

2:05

feel like it is January 6th,

2:07

so obviously much to talk about

2:09

of the four-year anniversary of the

2:11

insurrection of January 6th. Donald Trump

2:14

will be inaugurated on January 20th,

2:16

and one of the first things

2:18

he says that he wants to

2:21

do his pardon, all the the

2:23

January 6thers. I think he calls

2:25

them hostages now, actually. Yeah, he

2:28

does. The folks that are in

2:30

DC jail and that it was

2:32

a day of love and that

2:35

he wants to get all these

2:37

folks out. Anywho, so that's a

2:39

thing. I think something very near

2:41

and dear and so profoundly tragic

2:44

was what happened on New Year's

2:46

Eve in New Orleans. A place

2:48

where you all know I spend

2:51

a lot of time and have

2:53

a lot of love for. And

2:57

I'm sure everyone has seen

2:59

sort of the details of

3:01

this story, but what we're

3:04

left with is sort of

3:06

the how we got here

3:08

and why. I believe 10

3:11

people died, including a young

3:13

man who was a football

3:15

player at Princeton that played

3:18

with my brother-in-law. So it

3:20

really, it's wild, absolutely wild.

3:23

So that happened. A

3:25

host of other things, but I mean, those

3:27

are certainly top of mine for me this

3:29

morning. How are you all doing? First of

3:32

all, happy, we're over the holidays. Is it

3:34

still Quanta? I hope so. January 6th, New

3:36

Orleans. Oh, and then with New Orleans, they're

3:38

also, and they're trying to figure out if

3:41

they're connected, but the explosion. The cyber truck.

3:43

And it was at like, it was at

3:45

a Trump hotel. Trump casino. in Vegas. I

3:47

I don't know how

3:50

connected they are, but

3:52

I was just telling

3:54

I 'all offline and I

3:56

want to mention it.

3:59

and Her name is to

4:01

mention it. Her name is the knitting cult

4:03

she is fascinating she

4:05

was in a cult

4:08

in her younger age

4:10

and then she went

4:12

on to go on

4:14

the United States States what

4:17

she called another type

4:19

of cult. type she

4:21

makes some fascinating arguments

4:23

about how about how A, some of the

4:26

some of the institutions that we are

4:28

used to to already very cult -like, but

4:30

we're just used to them, so we

4:32

don't see them to them so we don't see them

4:34

for that they are, and that

4:36

also these institutions prime the mind

4:38

and the spirit to be able

4:41

to do some of the things

4:43

we're seeing being done. to So you

4:45

don't just we're seeing being done. So you don't just

4:47

become okay with dying for

4:49

something or killing for the

4:51

sake of something like like

4:53

your nation like that nation, like

4:55

that, whatever. Neuro pathways that are open

4:58

to make one be able to

5:00

conceive of that. They don't just

5:02

close off You know, They don't is

5:04

something that is always able to

5:06

be manipulated is something that is to be

5:08

able to be to be able to

5:10

do whatever you think is right to

5:12

be reasoned with to see that a

5:14

lot of these you think is right. So

5:16

people in the military, to see that

5:18

a lot know, a lot of

5:20

these people have military background. background. And

5:22

think, again, I just think

5:24

that everybody should listen to her

5:26

to her and asking some tougher questions

5:28

about the culture that we

5:30

live in you know, I hate to say You

5:33

know, I hate to say it because it

5:35

is January 6th anniversary. I'm like, this, this

5:37

ain't even is obviously just the just

5:39

the beginning. I'm interested, you know, so much

5:41

I think I'm interested, you know, so

5:43

much of what drives people to vote

5:45

or not not think about politics or not

5:47

think about politics or it's certainly what

5:49

consumes the news the news. is violence in communities.

5:51

It is like the ever present thing. Somebody,

5:53

it's it's like these never ending stories

5:55

of sort of sort of violence happening in

5:57

communities. And I have been so interested about

6:00

that at the beginning of the

6:02

year of the year way the media

6:04

covers the violence. the violence that that

6:06

happens around the state is just

6:08

so different. what strikes me about

6:10

New Orleans is is what

6:12

strikes me about Vegas is ex

6:15

-military. and you know you

6:17

saw people talking about the amount

6:19

of amount happened on these

6:21

military that happened on these military

6:23

bases that got swept under the

6:25

rug. you know one one person reported, a reporter

6:27

reported. something about Fort

6:29

Bragg and it was just like

6:31

voluminous amounts amounts of just crimes and

6:33

assaults and those those sort of things that he

6:36

wanted to write about. he was like, well,

6:38

nobody would pick it up. And it like not

6:40

lost on me pick it up and the

6:42

first attacks of the year, in these

6:44

are people trained by the United States

6:46

people this conversation about States

6:48

government and this that the

6:50

state supports that the state

6:53

supports and trains I think is

6:55

actually really is a big

6:57

deal. a big deal. That struck me New

6:59

New Orleans is a reminder

7:01

of like importance of just being of

7:03

just being able to run a city and

7:05

this is no knock to the mayor. I

7:07

like the mayor. But when I but when I

7:09

learned that there were barricades to

7:11

stop somebody from driving down the

7:13

street. street, but but they were removed from maintenance.

7:16

and nobody replaced them with anything. them with

7:18

anything, is just a failure of the

7:20

bureaucracy, it just is. is. is, that

7:22

know, you know, I'm sure she didn't

7:25

personally. say that, that, but

7:27

there are you know, I you know,

7:29

I think about all the cities we've been

7:31

in where been in where there are know, there are a

7:33

lot of ways to block it, but somebody

7:35

knew that this could happen, which is why

7:37

they had those metal rods that come up

7:39

to stop you. had And the sidewalk, come up

7:41

don't know if you've ever seen the sidewalk

7:43

things that they put up know people, but the

7:45

they were renovating and just didn't put anything.

7:48

And you're like, there is why the government matters.

7:50

It's like these small things that people don't

7:52

pay attention to you're, all it takes is one

7:54

day for it to be gone. And I

7:56

don't know if you saw, but the the guy

7:58

did the Orleans stuff. stuff They have

8:00

all his ray band, he like

8:02

had scoped off the scene and

8:05

like with his ray band, medic

8:07

glasses, they have all his videos

8:10

and that is just, it was

8:12

a wild way to start the

8:14

new year. Yeah, I think hindsight

8:17

is probably always like 2020. I

8:19

think there's probably so many practical

8:21

things we can think about that

8:24

could have made everything better or

8:26

tried to make things better, but

8:28

I just think the matter of

8:31

the fact is that he was

8:33

gonna do that. And I think

8:35

the more disturbing thing, like he

8:38

would have walked, like he, like

8:40

even when they went to his

8:42

apartment, all the bomb, the, the,

8:45

the, just the things that he

8:47

had, yeah, just everything that he

8:50

had, he was just gonna do

8:52

that. And I think the thing

8:54

that I'm most paranoid about and

8:57

I'm sure everybody else is, is

8:59

that if there's one person thinking

9:01

about doing that, then there's. a

9:04

lot more people thinking about doing

9:06

that and the permissions that certain

9:08

presidents and certain leadership give to

9:11

the culture to participate in certain

9:13

things. So having people exonerated, I

9:15

don't know what to call it,

9:18

to have people not like have

9:20

to go to jail for January

9:22

6th as these things are happening.

9:25

I don't know, I just see

9:27

it as like a permission as

9:30

a permission slip. I don't, do

9:32

y'all feel that way at all?

9:34

I do. I just think this

9:37

underlying issue of mental health and

9:39

wellness is just becoming more and

9:41

more central to our, like every

9:44

aspect of American life, particularly when

9:46

it comes to politics. And, you

9:48

know, I have a military family

9:51

and my uncle's been deployed. I

9:53

think six times over his career

9:55

to either Iraq or Afghanistan. I

9:58

have a cousin. who is.

10:00

is currently, you know,

10:02

you know ready getting ready

10:04

to deploy, wild what we ask

10:07

of people to do. And pretty

10:09

wild what we home people to

10:11

do. no support then they come home.

10:13

or no support system

10:15

or structure. whatsoever. And so Miles,

10:17

I'm really And so, Myles,

10:20

I'm really interested in listening to

10:22

that woman's podcast just sort of

10:24

tying these pieces together. pieces

10:26

together. And

10:28

I I think, yes, like I think, Miles, to

10:30

your point, think there's sort of I think there's

10:32

sort of like a loosening of our

10:35

rule of law. in this this

10:37

country. And I think that and I think

10:39

is most susceptible to

10:41

people who are is most susceptible to

10:43

people who are the most vulnerable. I

10:45

consider who folks to be people who

10:47

are struggling with their mental health. And

10:50

then on top of that, it's just

10:52

it's just... hard as a out there for folks

10:54

right now. It just is. Things are

10:56

more expensive than they ever been. It's... We

10:59

have our ever income gap between, you know,

11:01

the rich and the poor at this

11:03

point. Where is the middle class? I have

11:05

no idea. at So. Where is just

11:07

sort of I of these.

11:10

So it's just sort of all of

11:12

these of these conditions that are

11:14

just ripening are just and

11:16

making us susceptible. us to

11:18

people acting out in the most people,

11:20

the most. hurt of those

11:22

people acting acting out. Yeah, that is

11:25

wild. Oh, I wanted to That is

11:27

wild. Oh, I wanted to ask, did y 'all see

11:29

Switching topics. topics. No, I

11:31

didn't even know No, I didn't

11:33

even know Tennis was happening. Yes, she

11:35

was she was it. it. she played on what

11:38

it's she played on what is

11:40

called Cup. It's the one where

11:42

the team plays. plays. Like the, it's

11:44

like four of them it's like four the

11:46

them represent the united states the

11:48

united The United Cup. And Coco, you know, it's a

11:50

know it's a team but koko

11:52

was killing it so if y 'all

11:54

go look at the highlights Coco

11:56

swept the floor the girl wouldn't

11:58

even like shake her hand right right?

12:00

But Coco is a class

12:02

act. And you know, Naomi

12:04

had to pull out the

12:07

last thing she was in

12:09

because she has like some

12:11

back issues, which made me

12:14

sad. But that is a

12:16

small tennis highlight from our

12:19

wonderful Coco and Naomi. Shout

12:21

out to tennis. Shout out

12:23

to the girls who sweat.

12:27

This go around I know we're talking about

12:29

loot through which I'm excited about I think

12:31

I am excited about having two black women

12:33

in the Senate so that though they got

12:36

confirmed over the last couple weeks, which is

12:38

exciting My Johnson, too. Oh God My Johnson,

12:40

yeah, did y'all see that? He's about the

12:43

US Virgin Islands that stood up and said

12:45

why weren't US Virgin Islands DC? Puerto Rico

12:47

called in for the boat. That was pretty

12:49

amazing. Did you see that miles? I didn't

12:52

see it. I don't like these rhetorical questions.

12:54

Was this a Negro asking this question? We

12:56

know why. We know what. Puerto Rico knows

12:59

why. We are tired of these rhetorical questions.

13:01

They are electing Ku Klux Klan members. Why

13:03

are they not? I wonder why they're not

13:05

doing this because your black ass shouldn't be

13:08

in the boat invalid. They don't want us.

13:10

Because we're colonies. Which is nuts. So disillusion

13:12

with these kind of like. I like to

13:15

know because I just feel like we have

13:17

to be their hat and also to you

13:19

know to the young folks as we you

13:21

know no no shade to the young folks

13:24

it's not their fault but since I know

13:26

in New York City they're not requiring kids

13:28

to read books you know it's good to

13:31

have these this imagery around so folks can

13:33

be like oh just let me give gives

13:35

me something to think about But I think

13:37

we, I think we, I think my big

13:40

thing with those kind of comments is that

13:42

we've thought about it, we've talked about it.

13:44

Right. They've been years and years of these

13:47

kind of gotchas and I wonder why this

13:49

don't happen or how come we're not part

13:51

of this? I'm like. because they

13:53

have codified your oppression

13:56

and they don't want

13:58

you to do it.

14:00

to Now, Now, are we

14:02

are we about it? it? I

14:05

I think we're long

14:07

past the time where

14:09

you can can got you where

14:12

you can got for

14:14

being racist being racist

14:16

or xenophobic that they're okay

14:18

with with it. They're okay with it. That's

14:20

right. up I wanted to bring

14:22

up too, since we're talking about about I

14:24

don't know if you saw know if you saw

14:27

Kay She She... is a a who missing

14:29

for six missing for six months. for

14:31

She did not vote for six months

14:33

and they found her living in

14:35

a retirement home. home. She didn't run

14:37

for for So that is good, but

14:39

the six months. the six she's

14:42

a Texas she's a Texas She

14:44

just was, she was missing And

14:46

she was still You know, she

14:48

was still tweeting, her team was tweeting stuff on

14:50

her behalf. her behalf. She was gone, and

14:52

the news is reporting that that she.

14:54

is in a memory care

14:57

unit at the retirement home.

14:59

And then And then Virginia Fox,

15:01

another Republican. fell down

15:03

fell down the stairs she's

15:05

from North She's from the

15:07

and she is she out the stairs and

15:09

81 on the stairs I just

15:12

bring this old I just bring

15:14

this up because we will have to

15:16

have a serious conversation about about. the

15:18

age of the age of the people running the

15:20

country. It is really, it's a thing. I Even I think

15:22

about Jerry Conley, who beat AOC, and he he just did the

15:24

interview that was like, I never got to

15:26

chair a committee. You're like, well, that's not, I

15:28

don't know if that's the best argument for

15:31

you to be. that's not, I don't know if of

15:33

the best AOC is that you just never got

15:35

to do it in all your years in over like

15:37

that feels sort of wild, but I wanted to

15:39

bring them here to talk about. all your years in

15:41

really, I've been that feels about this

15:43

and it's like, I do I want to

15:45

enter 2025? to talk about. Do Do I wanna

15:48

mind my business? my and keep my

15:50

peace. my peace? Or I? just

15:52

really say what I Just really

15:54

say what I feel, even though I know there'll

15:56

be. repercussions to that. to that?

15:59

you. And I think where

16:01

I'm leaning, since yesterday I was

16:03

in the gym, and OJ's backstabbers

16:05

came on. Is that maybe? That

16:08

one's so left, I was like,

16:10

what? OJ's, who? How do you

16:12

know everybody in the hour? Mile

16:14

in your step? Backstabbers? They're trying

16:16

to take your place. Okay. Maybe

16:18

we need, maybe I need to

16:21

let people know. And with that,

16:23

I just, I really, these folks,

16:25

outrageous, they're two articles, so there's

16:27

one of this woman that's missing,

16:29

and then there's another one, a

16:31

Congresswoman, Virginia Fox, who fell down

16:34

the stairs in Congress, she's okay.

16:36

And then Nancy Pelosi and O'Connell

16:38

also took a tumble in December

16:40

down these stairs. Am I ageist?

16:42

I also conceptually don't understand how

16:44

you, I just, I can't wait

16:47

to retire. If I could, somebody

16:49

said, today's your last day working,

16:51

I would say, thank God, now

16:53

I can do more with campaign

16:55

zero. I just don't know why

16:57

these folks keep, keep on keeping

17:00

on and obviously it's like this

17:02

posture around power. And especially for

17:04

Nancy Pelosi who, what good she's

17:06

done us in the last couple

17:08

years, I don't know. So I

17:10

think part of it, yes, there

17:13

is a concern, I have a

17:15

concern about their age. I also

17:17

have a concern of like, was

17:19

the last time any of these

17:21

people have pumped their own gas

17:23

or gone to a grocery store

17:26

or cooked their own meals or,

17:28

I don't know, do anything that

17:30

most of us have to do

17:32

every single day. So I think

17:34

it's the age, but it's also

17:37

how long you've been in Congress

17:39

and how long you've been disconnected

17:41

from actually how people are living.

17:43

Because what you get when you're

17:45

in Congress, and also keep in

17:47

mind, these folks can get these,

17:50

where else are they going to

17:52

work now at this point?

17:54

I guess guess

17:56

they, if they're

17:58

not in Congress,

18:00

they're lobbying. I'm

18:03

over it and I

18:08

don't know know. what I can

18:10

do to be more helpful in terms of

18:12

getting more people into Congress. Maybe that's first

18:14

step. but these folks have gotta go.

18:16

I'm sorry, this is it. all of

18:18

them, Republicans, Democrats in between. if

18:21

you've fallen down the stairs every week. either

18:23

take an elevator or stay at home. Yeah,

18:27

it seems right on the money for

18:29

Republicans. know, it just doesn't really

18:31

seem like it matters. Who's a you

18:33

know, who's a part of the

18:35

Republican team? So I kind of, the

18:38

age argument kind of falls flat

18:40

for me when it comes to Republicans

18:42

because the whole party is built

18:44

off of like these antiquated thought forms

18:46

and ideas. So it doesn't matter

18:48

if it's somebody who's 21 or 81

18:50

saying them that, So

18:53

in that way, it's who

18:55

cares. It's more disappointing when

18:57

it comes to, for me,

18:59

when it comes to the

19:01

Democratic Party, because there is

19:03

such new ideas and new

19:05

energy available. And there is

19:07

just this weird cult -like

19:09

allegiance uh, allegiance

19:11

to the pageantry

19:13

and. in the

19:15

ways that things need to happen.

19:17

And And I don't, it's like

19:20

these like old, weird messages from

19:22

like. the the

19:24

British or something. I'm like, who cares?

19:26

You didn't get to do that before.

19:29

I'm like, this is not kindergarten and

19:31

like you were line leader yesterday so

19:33

you get to be line leader. Or

19:35

you can't, so you can't be line

19:37

leader today. Like it's not like that.

19:39

is American politics and it should be

19:41

new. So that's just point thing, but

19:43

be you know. You know,

19:45

hopefully I don't wish harm on

19:48

anybody, but you know. Let

19:50

gravity be our justice, and

19:52

if you got take a tumble

19:54

to leave, take a tumble. Let

19:56

be our justice, Miles. Let's...

19:59

It's not, and it's also

20:02

just like miles and it's also just

20:04

like miles to your point. Sheila

20:06

Jackson rest in peace, May

20:08

she rest in peace. serving was a long

20:10

-serving member of Congress. a deal. back for

20:12

her. but her daughter is now serving in

20:14

her seat. daughter is now serving in

20:16

her seat. Yeah, it's just, it's

20:19

just, it's like, it is It

20:21

is almost like a monarchy some

20:23

some respects. Not almost,

20:25

not, not almost like,

20:28

like, If you look at

20:30

at the clittens, the bushes, just

20:32

just is, it is, it's

20:35

almost as though if

20:37

we aren't relentless about

20:39

being critical around turning

20:41

into a monarchy, that

20:43

we will just kind

20:46

of turn into one.

20:48

as though almost as though.

20:50

oriented is oriented towards and and

20:52

you have to do to do some. actual

20:55

steering other way because if you

20:57

just ship do what it wants

20:59

to do wants to do it's gonna find

21:01

a white sheet sheet and it's

21:03

gonna tell you that the know race

21:05

is Aryan race is superior. just

21:08

just, that's, that's just. we're

21:10

on the culture we're on. there

21:12

was something that you said earlier to

21:14

that reminded me of this me of

21:16

of the tension I always feel

21:18

tension I with. specifically with Just who

21:20

I'm friends with, what I see.

21:22

and I always think about in this

21:25

weird Aquarius moon away how we

21:27

are always having brunch on top

21:29

of the native graveyard. We're We're always

21:31

trying to do something celebratory

21:33

or do something on top of

21:35

the and it seems as it seems

21:38

as though the we're in a

21:40

place where the violence can't be,

21:42

not a there's not a tablecloth

21:44

long or thick enough to put put

21:46

over the violence that we're

21:49

trying to celebrate on celebrate you

21:51

can't, you can't, you can't you

21:53

stench of what suppress the stench of

21:55

what living on top of. living

21:57

on top of and to me me, politics

21:59

is just... one of those symptoms.

22:02

I guess we'll go into

22:04

brighter and happier news, which

22:06

is my news was just

22:08

to let you know that

22:10

homelessness is on the rise

22:12

and on the expansion. That's

22:15

right. Backlight

22:18

cook crack is homelessness. Hey, you're listening

22:20

to Potsy of the People. Stay tuned,

22:23

there's more to come. This

22:25

show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Now,

22:28

2024 is gone. The question is,

22:30

what do you want the story of

22:32

your 2025 to be? Now, every

22:34

January is a chance to start fresh,

22:36

to think about new commitments to

22:38

yourself, to the world, to your work,

22:41

to the people in your life. When

22:44

I went through the process for

22:46

this year, I'm happy that I didn't

22:48

go through it alone. That my

22:50

therapist was actually a partner with me.

22:52

And I think about therapists as

22:54

a editorial partner of sorts, helping me

22:57

to think about what the story

22:59

is I want to write for the

23:01

new year. And I want to

23:03

make sure this year that my resolutions

23:05

don't fade by February, for instance.

23:07

I'm also trying to be a little

23:10

more intentional. And one of the

23:12

best things about therapy for me is

23:14

talking to somebody who is not

23:16

in my day -to -day life and also

23:18

hearing myself process the world week

23:20

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23:46

-E -L -P,.com,/people. Let's

23:49

face it, this election proved we're

23:52

living on two different internets, which has

23:54

resulted in two different realities. Algorithms

23:56

have trapped us in our own information

23:58

bubbles and as if things couldn't

24:00

get weirder. Elon Musk is basically running the

24:02

American government, not ideal. I'm hosted

24:04

the host of the offline podcast with

24:06

Max Fisher, and despite the name of

24:09

the show, of the show, it's clear that none

24:11

of us are are offline, definitely not me

24:13

and Max. Every week, we're week of breaking out

24:15

of our digital echo chambers to better

24:17

understand the right -wing media machine and

24:19

grabbing our shovels to rescue our fellow

24:21

Americans our fallen down the rabbit hole that

24:23

Elon Musk helped dig. helped We cover

24:25

everything from the rise of the rise of the

24:27

the media to the our feeds and our

24:29

election. our feeds a deep dive into the

24:31

internet, but without the trolls and the

24:33

pop -up ads the trolls that sound nice? ads.

24:36

Search offline wherever you get your wherever you

24:38

on our podcast and on our YouTube channel now. So

24:53

In all seriousness, I wanted to bring

24:55

this story, and I've seen this

24:57

story in different iterations, story in I wanted

24:59

to bring this up because what

25:01

I thought was the most, most, most

25:04

interesting because people were talking about

25:06

the economy late last year was that

25:08

so many people inside late

25:10

last year, was that so many inside

25:12

of certain bubbles, we're talking about

25:14

how great the economy was. about how

25:16

this was. And this

25:18

article, In the the article that

25:20

I found around around the rising, the homelessness of

25:22

that a lot of these people who

25:24

are experiencing homelessness now are fully

25:27

employed people. now are fully are people

25:29

who have multiple jobs. have There

25:31

are people who have are people who

25:33

have... cars, there are are people who

25:35

are going to their good jobs

25:37

their good jobs know. there are people

25:39

who are at these jobs and

25:42

other people tips these jobs how to

25:44

survive and be homeless. I

25:46

went on a rabbit hole on

25:48

YouTube on a rabbit hole on YouTube because

25:50

I odds with my mental health my there

25:53

are and of videos

25:55

of videos people giving

25:57

other people advice on how

26:00

how to be homeless. And they're

26:02

not people who is whatever your

26:04

stereotype of what homelessness looks like.

26:06

These are average everyday, working people

26:08

who look like me with button-ups

26:10

and sweaters over there, button-ups, looking

26:12

preppy like me. If you can't

26:14

see me, it's a shame. But

26:16

that's the people who are telling

26:18

other people how to be homeless

26:20

and telling people how to survive

26:22

these things. It feels different and

26:24

it also feels embarrassing to, not

26:26

embarrassing to me personally, but it

26:28

should be embarrassing to us as

26:30

Americans that there are people who

26:32

are doing this. It's laughable of

26:34

us trying to kind of announce

26:36

our national or. global authority in

26:38

leadership, and we have people who

26:41

are living third world realities in

26:43

our very country. You know, I

26:45

feel like we forget about that.

26:47

The other component of this is

26:49

that the median rent price is

26:51

just rising. So you have people

26:53

who are in New York, and

26:55

I don't know if I said

26:57

this before on this podcast, but

26:59

I'll kind of repeat it shortly

27:01

again. You have people who are

27:03

maybe living somewhere in the Bronx,

27:05

right? And you got, and you

27:07

lived in the Bronx and you

27:09

were in the Bronx when your

27:11

apartment is just for even number

27:13

$1,000, and now 10 years later,

27:15

how many years later, has incrementally

27:17

gotten up to $2,500, which you

27:19

cannot afford because you're the price

27:22

of. what your income has not

27:24

shifted like that. Now you're kind

27:26

of great locked from moving, right?

27:28

Because in order to move, that's

27:30

gonna cost you $10,000 that you

27:32

do not absolutely, you absolutely do

27:34

not have. But in order to

27:36

stay, it's costing you everything and

27:38

it kind of keeps people in

27:40

these prisons where they have to

27:42

wait for some kind of like

27:44

financial calamity to happen to get

27:46

freedom. And once that freedom from

27:48

that particular housing happens, it's not

27:50

like we have a comprehensive. place

27:52

for you to fall. You

27:54

fall on the

27:56

streets and more

27:58

and more people

28:00

are falling on

28:02

the streets. I

28:05

wanted to bring this to the

28:07

podcast because just for for obvious

28:09

reasons, but also because of this

28:11

Martin Luther King quote, I found

28:13

I was reading a lot of

28:16

Martin Luther King towards the last

28:18

year of Barack Obama's presidency. And

28:20

I was asked to write about

28:22

Barack Obama and Hope and all

28:24

this other bullshit that he

28:26

was saying. And And I felt

28:28

that that language in that kind

28:30

of like millennial, you know, that

28:32

kind of like millennial core

28:34

2000s language was so dead and

28:37

empty. And I never understood why.

28:39

And it was in King's words

28:41

who, If I'm

28:43

being honest with you, I found King's words

28:45

dead and empty, the ones that were in

28:47

commercials, the more I was reading him, the

28:49

more I was kind of illuminated where I

28:51

was like, oh, I don't know the actual

28:53

Dr. King. I don't really know his words,

28:55

but I wanted to share these quotes. Um,

28:58

this is from the drum major

29:00

instinct on sermon called the Drum major

29:02

instinct on February 4th, 1968. He

29:04

stated if America does not use her

29:06

vast resources of wealth to end

29:08

poverty and make it possible for all

29:10

of God's children to have the

29:12

basic necessities of life, she too will

29:14

go to hell. King

29:17

also said, and

29:19

beyond Vietnam, time to

29:21

break silence, which was delivered on

29:23

April 4th, 1967, a nation

29:25

that continues year after year to

29:27

spend more money on military

29:30

defense than on programs of social

29:32

uplift is approaching spiritual death.

29:34

So these things were said in

29:36

1967 and 1968. Like

29:39

I said in that essay, and like

29:41

I'll say now, I think the real project

29:43

is to contend with that we're dealing,

29:45

when we're talking about America, we're dealing inside

29:47

of a dead thing. We're dealing inside

29:49

of a culture of death. We're dealing inside

29:51

of a culture that is, that is

29:53

rotting. And these are the symptoms of living

29:55

in something that's rotting, but it feels

29:57

as though certain people are still trying to

29:59

make garbage. on a corpse because they're

30:01

in denial in there's other people who

30:03

are like other need to totally

30:05

let this thing go because this can't

30:07

breathe I can't do this I

30:09

can't live inside of this live

30:12

I just of just and I just I just

30:14

That is speaking of what we're

30:16

facing in 2025 and the and

30:18

we're facing. that we're being January it

30:20

being January 6th it just feels like

30:22

that is the truth to

30:24

recognize to that, you know, that the

30:27

know dead is a. is a

30:29

fiction, but but there's something to

30:31

the idea that the culture of America that

30:33

we're walking. of America

30:36

is a zombie culture, is a

30:38

culture that is culture, is a

30:40

off of. is

30:42

feeding off of the of America's

30:44

ancestors. I think that is

30:46

what we're looking at. When

30:48

I look at everything that's

30:51

happening from the terrorist attacks

30:53

to the homeless, the homeless

30:55

population population raising and exploitation, everything

30:57

that's going on with. going

30:59

on with and all

31:01

this other stuff this other That

31:03

is the culture that we're,

31:05

that we're carmerically drinking up up right

31:07

now, and I want us to be real

31:09

about that and not pretending that it's lemongrass soup

31:11

when it's not. grass soup when

31:14

it's not. Yeah, Maas,

31:16

I think. all that is right. All

31:18

that is right. And over the holidays,

31:20

I went to Montgomery. where my uncle

31:22

my aunt and uncle was in My uncle

31:24

was in the Air Force. The last

31:26

place he was stationed was at Maxwell

31:28

Air Force Air Force Base. know know, big part

31:31

part of my family's from Minnesota, so when it was

31:33

like... So when it was like, Auntie

31:35

and Uncle Troy are moving to

31:37

Alabama. We all were like, Alabama,

31:39

we Alabama. what? Alabama. But anyway,

31:41

17 years later. We're now,

31:43

we go we go there all the time, spend lots of

31:46

time there. of time there. And I and

31:48

I did a long run. and I

31:50

was like, was like I'm just

31:52

gonna do the sites all the the

31:54

historic sites in Montgomery And I

31:56

started I started with where Rosa

31:58

Parks did not get off. the bus and

32:01

then went to the Baptist

32:03

Church, Dexter Baptist Church, where

32:05

Dr. King was a pastor

32:07

at one point where they

32:09

organized a lot of the

32:11

civil rights activity down there.

32:13

But the thing that I

32:15

was sort of most impacted

32:17

by, right, it's because there's

32:19

been so much work, particularly

32:21

by Brian Stevenson and EJI,

32:23

to demarcate the truth of

32:25

American history. Right, so there's

32:27

EJI and if y'all if

32:29

y'all have not been to

32:31

Montgomery you have to go

32:33

because now the Legacy Museum

32:36

is an expanded space It's

32:38

even bigger and more compelling

32:40

and more dropping to your

32:42

knees and then there's also

32:44

the freedom sculpture park, which

32:46

is a sculpture park that

32:48

is incredible. So Samonely Hank

32:50

Willis Thomas Wangecci Mutu like

32:52

all these folks have massive

32:54

scaled sculptures in this park

32:56

and then they're also these

32:58

replicas of cabins were enslaved

33:00

people would have lived their

33:02

lives. But it's all very

33:04

compelling, right? So you have

33:06

all of this, all of

33:08

this, and there's also a

33:11

great deal of sort of

33:13

reverence and storytelling around indigenous

33:15

people who were first there

33:17

in Alabama, obviously, and then.

33:19

forced to leave, trail of tears,

33:21

all these things. And then that's

33:24

when it started, sort of, that's

33:26

when the cotton production started, and

33:28

then Montgomery became sort of the

33:30

hub of the selling of African

33:32

bodies, like the hub, like a

33:35

train was brought in, boom, there,

33:37

right there, and all of this

33:39

is there, in Montgomery, right? Like

33:41

it is all there for you

33:43

to see and feel. But the

33:45

overlay of that is the placards.

33:48

that exists that the white

33:50

folks don't put around town.

33:52

Right? So it tells this

33:54

sort of mystical, fairy tale

33:56

version of what happened in

33:58

Montgomery, Alabama,

34:01

from the founding

34:03

of the founding

34:05

of the city, from the

34:07

founding of production to

34:09

cotton production starting, to these

34:11

early settlers. forget

34:13

what the exact I forget

34:15

what the exact language was about

34:17

how they got. from all

34:19

the acres from indigenous people,

34:21

you know, know, but it's

34:23

very like transition happened. happened. And

34:26

Miles, think to your point, like

34:28

there is this very live

34:30

tension happening in America where it

34:32

is America where it is, there's the

34:35

the truth of what happens and then

34:37

there's what others want us to believe

34:39

is happening and that's what we see

34:41

around. and that's what we see books

34:43

and CRT and all these other

34:45

things. other things. And it's a And

34:47

it's a real tension, I tell, I I say

34:49

all of that sort of lay the groundwork, I

34:51

was on a plane. on a plane

34:53

somewhere. And I I was, next to the

34:56

loveliest white man, and he was with

34:58

his daughter. he was with his we got,

35:00

we talked the whole time. I think it was going

35:02

to Houston. time. I whole, I was going to Houston

35:04

cause I also saw we talked the whole, I the break. to

35:06

Houston because I also hot

35:08

boys holiday over the break. but

35:10

he, his perspective. So, but he,

35:13

his perspective was start talking

35:15

about schools about where his daughter was

35:17

at school, where I had gone to

35:19

school in D where I had and how

35:21

he said, how he said. He

35:24

He said in so, in a way, in a

35:26

a way, and in a way, if we

35:28

keep teaching this If

35:31

we keep teaching this

35:33

history, we're gonna continue. divided. to

35:35

be divided. like, wow, like this

35:37

lovely, I was like, wow. Like

35:40

this lovely, regular, the white man on

35:42

the plane I'm with. actually,

35:45

actually believes that

35:47

a actually believes that a

35:49

reckoning wouldn't make us better. better. it

35:51

it would would us. further apart.

35:53

apart. But Miles to your miles to your

35:55

point think think I think that I I think

35:58

that's oh he was saying okay. Wait,

36:00

let me, let me follow, let

36:02

me follow, let me follow, because

36:04

I'm sure if I'm confused, maybe

36:06

the listeners might be confused. But

36:08

just to be clear, this is

36:11

a lovely white man, Mr. Rogers,

36:13

you would never expect anything. He

36:15

would have voted for Obama three

36:17

times if he could. But when

36:19

it comes to the teaching of

36:21

American history, black American history, or

36:24

critical or. critical race theories, but

36:26

some people want to, whatever that

36:28

means, that, that, he doesn't believe

36:30

in the teaching of that. Got

36:32

it, got it, got it, got

36:34

it, got it, got it. Yeah,

36:36

but that, that is white people.

36:39

That's whiteness. Whiteness is this, is

36:41

this surrendering into this great big

36:43

nothing. That's what Irish people have

36:45

done. That is what Italian people

36:47

have done. That is what Italian

36:49

people have done. That is what,

36:52

um, many Jewish people have done.

36:54

It is about surrendering, whatever makes

36:56

you identifiable. Get, get. Privileged and

36:58

black people and black people who

37:00

fight against that get get demonized

37:02

that is what it's all about

37:05

and you can't have that and

37:07

still remember history. You can't have

37:09

that and still remember what's happening.

37:11

So there is this kind of

37:13

desire for a cultural dementia from

37:15

white people and whiteness because that

37:17

means you don't have to talk

37:20

about what you did 60 years

37:22

ago because we don't even remember

37:24

it. But my mom does because

37:26

she was born in 1940. That

37:28

is just the fact of it.

37:30

But it makes sense that somebody

37:33

can still be extremely pleasant, great

37:35

person to interact. with and talk

37:37

to, but they've been taught to

37:39

be white. And we've all been

37:41

taught to be white. It's a

37:43

miracle that there's anybody in this

37:46

nation who thinks otherwise, because we're

37:48

all taught to leave in the

37:50

past, don't talk about it, oh

37:52

my goodness, you know, stop bringing

37:54

up old stuff, we have to

37:56

move beyond. Be together

37:58

it's like like no

38:01

can't move beyond beyond

38:03

because the past is literally sitting

38:05

down and eating breakfast with us with

38:07

blowing up cyber up in front of

38:09

staff. in The past is here and

38:11

talking and shooting. and shooting Did you not see you know,

38:14

you not see, you know, I

38:16

wasn't gonna bring this up up and propose

38:18

this for next week, but David this

38:20

for next week, but David from in the In he

38:22

wrote an article that just came

38:24

out. just came out yesterday on the

38:26

fifth that is called called Guilty

38:28

History. history And he makes

38:30

this argument that you are

38:32

saying, you are that like... D.R., One

38:35

of the lines one of no

38:37

country has a... is like, no

38:39

country has clean clean

38:41

past, and this this idea

38:43

of rehashing it over and over.

38:46

just isn't very just

38:48

isn't very helpful. That's sort of

38:50

like of like what his... thing is so

38:52

he's like he's like settler colonial is not intended purely or even

38:54

not intended purely or even primarily

38:56

as a description of a particular

38:58

path of social development. it is intended

39:00

as a condemnation of the new

39:02

societies that have been created by

39:04

that path of development. and something

39:06

very peculiar about this critique of

39:08

Canada and elsewhere in the new

39:10

world. in the new critique is always

39:12

based on an implied moral alternative. He goes

39:14

on, but I was like, but I this

39:17

is in the Atlantic. the This idea that

39:19

like... that like settler colonial

39:21

is like is saying that is a

39:23

bad thing or saying that as a

39:25

bad thing or having some moral sense

39:27

that like we probably all these all these

39:29

countries he later he makes the argument that

39:31

that some point somebody was going to

39:33

discover the new world. discover the new Like it

39:35

was inevitable. was mean, you're like,

39:38

well, that is really, really. really

39:40

interesting doing all of that

39:42

analysis all of that analysis to avoid the the

39:44

truth of the matter. I It's just, I

39:46

think, your to your point, like that is

39:48

the whiteness, whiting because it's just just like Just

39:50

come to terms with it. it.

39:52

That's that's the big thing

39:54

about and then we can move

39:57

on move on it it, just

39:59

just the the aggressiveness to what we're

40:01

seeing people push back on the truth

40:03

of the matter. And luckily, we have

40:05

someone like a Brian Stevenson, who actually

40:08

has been doing the deep work of

40:10

understanding how many black people were lynched,

40:12

how many black people actually arrived here.

40:14

Also, there's so many stories at EJI

40:17

just of like stories from enslaved people

40:19

and people once they were free trying

40:21

to find their families. Like we don't

40:23

even have an accounting of what has

40:25

happened to our people. So it's not

40:28

only do you not want us to

40:30

understand what we know, you don't want

40:32

us to continue to try to understand

40:34

what more can be told about the

40:37

possibility of this place, which is what

40:39

I thought this place was all about.

40:41

And that's what happens with this whole

40:43

thing. It's a whole big flattening of

40:46

the past, you know, where it's like

40:48

the terrorism that... happened in the deep

40:50

south in the 1900s, is separate from

40:52

the, it's connected to, but separate from

40:54

child slavery, which is separate from the

40:57

discovering of this, but if everything's just

40:59

the past, so everything that has happened

41:01

prior to the year 2001, didn't happen,

41:03

then it just looks like all of

41:06

this is just one big globbing. That

41:08

is what happens too. And then the

41:10

other thing that that that story or

41:12

the race summarizing of the story made

41:14

me think of too, is how sometimes

41:17

because we're on the internet and we're

41:19

passing around so many text and language,

41:21

we think that the language is the

41:23

primary point where the language, the reason

41:26

why we are, the point of reminding

41:28

somebody that we're in a settler colonial

41:30

state, the point of reminding people about

41:32

racism is because we're trying to Let

41:34

the public cultural know that something happened

41:37

wrong and there's debts owed. Those things.

41:39

Things are not

41:41

just being talked about

41:43

just because they're

41:46

fun to discuss. It's

41:48

because we're trying

41:50

to get reparations. It's

41:52

because we're trying

41:55

to get It's people

41:57

to have adequate housing.

41:59

We're trying to

42:01

connect the wrongs that

42:03

we're experiencing today

42:06

to today to historical why

42:08

we're doing it. We're

42:10

not just doing

42:12

it it. We're we love

42:15

because we love a label. We're

42:17

We're trying to show

42:19

people right and

42:21

wrong and get us

42:23

to do the

42:26

right thing in the

42:28

to correct our... are thing in

42:30

we can manifest a better future.

42:32

Like I'm like, I'm our wrong

42:35

so we people not know

42:37

that or are people not

42:40

knowing that on purpose? Because

42:42

once you get to the Atlantic, does I'm prone

42:44

to think that you don't know it on

42:46

purpose. know don't care and another thing not

42:49

We gotta go to Montgomery. Another thing that EJI

42:52

has set up up there is can

42:54

click on on a state

42:56

go search last names

42:59

and names. relatives.

43:01

You know why people how

43:04

y'all have You know white

43:06

people how y 'all have don't We don't have it. We

43:08

don't have it. of Now And

43:10

do. and just like

43:13

Understanding what that does for

43:15

your identity? And

43:17

under, like, it is, it is, it's miraculous. so

43:19

And so I think, Miles,

43:21

yes, it's to tracing. and,

43:24

and, and, and being able able to

43:26

point to is this is happening

43:28

because of this. this, but also

43:30

from a very, very, spiritual,

43:32

emotional self-preservation

43:35

perspective, it is for black folks to have a

43:37

place to go to to say. to to

43:39

say, I am standing am standing here

43:41

because so -and -so. But anyway. I I I want

43:44

to read the, dear, you brought this, I have I do

43:46

have something to say about homelessness, but since

43:48

you brought up since you I'm like, we are. I'm

43:50

like, here we are. I'm I'm going to read the

43:52

way that David ends it, because it directly

43:54

ties to what both of you have been

43:56

saying. you have He ends it by saying, it are

43:58

passages of guilt to remember to remember in XVA. History should

44:00

always be told in full, but we don't

44:03

correct past wrongs committed in a liberal democracy

44:05

by defaming the ideal itself. Like Americans, Australians,

44:07

and New Zealanders, modern-day Canadians live in a

44:09

good and just society. They owe honor to

44:12

those who built and secured that good and

44:14

just society for posterity, to the soldiers and

44:16

sailors and airmen who fought the wars that

44:19

kept those societies free. to the navies and

44:21

laborers who built their roads, laid their rail,

44:23

dug their seaways, to the authors of their

44:25

laws and the framers of their constitutions, and

44:28

yes, to the settlers and colonialists and colonists

44:30

who set everything in motion. In the Atlantic.

44:32

Also, who you think built the roads? Over

44:34

there David. What are you talking about? That's

44:37

why it's so hard to even engage with

44:39

this as an actual because what this sounds

44:41

like is somebody who has white supremacist ideals

44:44

who has these racist ideals who's there who

44:46

has got sophisticated enough to wrap this kind

44:48

of imperialist white supremacist reframing of America and

44:50

did such a good job that has landed

44:53

into the Atlantic. So when you're able to,

44:55

and that goes both ways, you know, when

44:57

you read certain things by Bell Hooks, you're

44:59

like, oh, Bell Hooks really went there, but

45:02

she knew how to wrap her language. Now

45:04

of course, that's something. that I find righteous

45:06

and good, but the same thing can happen

45:09

when it comes to white supremacy and evil.

45:11

Like you can learn how to wrap your

45:13

language around saying, we don't, we want everybody

45:15

in America who's an American to believe in

45:18

this story. And just like you could look

45:20

at your grandpa and still have Thanksgiving dinner

45:22

with him, we want you to look at

45:24

George Washington like that or Christopher Columbus like

45:27

that. That is what the request is. And

45:29

most people are saying, no, I don't want

45:31

to do that. And it's obvious. Even the

45:34

comparisons, it doesn't even make any sense. There's

45:36

obviously something wrong with America. Look at, things

45:38

are blowing up, things are getting shot, people

45:40

are homeless. Like it's obvious that the culture

45:43

in America is not good, so we.

45:45

need to excavate the

45:47

guilty and dark stuff

45:49

because if we were

45:52

living in this kind

45:54

of kind of and the

45:56

only thing we had

45:59

to care about is had

46:01

to care kangaroos and big

46:03

spiders, big we we would

46:05

be different, you know? And

46:08

not to mention there's

46:10

a whole indigenous population

46:12

of Australia who is

46:15

silenced. That's how you

46:17

don't hear any critical things about

46:19

Australia, because the whole indigenous population because

46:21

the whole indigenous silence of what we're

46:23

seeing. That's what what does too, right?

46:25

what Israel seeing seeing a pattern and America and

46:27

America is unique in the fact

46:29

that the people who are the

46:31

most exploited are not the most silenced,

46:33

or or we have figured out

46:35

ways to not make ourselves the

46:37

most silenced through culture, silenced through culture, through,

46:39

know, we know black history. That's right. That's right.

46:41

was going to say that I think part

46:43

of it part of it also, Miles, is that... He also

46:45

has to defend a

46:47

meritocracy where where his mediocre perspectives

46:50

perspectives and writing. give

46:53

can actually. livelihood, right? So him

46:55

his livelihood, right? So I think that's the

46:57

other thing that they're holding on to on to is

46:59

that want this marriage. this merit,

47:01

seemingly meritocracy you know, we

47:03

do all the things do we

47:05

work things and we they want that

47:07

they to continue. system to

47:09

continue. you have otherwise you

47:11

have people who have been living

47:13

through genocide. chattel slavery,

47:16

Jim Crow, et Crow, et

47:18

cetera, who somehow have somehow...

47:20

how to thrive figured out how to thrive

47:22

and be better than you. what what

47:25

you're really scared of. scared of. We're

47:27

coming. So to Montgomery,

47:29

Montgomery, I know, I went to during the

47:31

protest, the protest to Yara and one

47:33

of the most interesting facts I think

47:35

about Montgomery, Miles have you been facts

47:38

I think about Montgomery.

47:40

Miles, have you been? So, you know,

47:42

that Dexter, Dexter know that is very close to the

47:44

is very close to the that is the only

47:47

reason why I say that that is the

47:49

only reason why I was not

47:51

blown up would is that to blow

47:53

it up would necessarily mean that you

47:55

probably blow up some of the the the

47:57

Supreme Court, which is also is street. on that street.

47:59

So they, they talk about that as like sort of

48:01

the unintended insurance policy with that church that like

48:03

it kept it safe during the craziest parts of

48:06

the civil movement just because it happened to be

48:08

so close and I asked them why was it

48:10

built there and they were like because back then

48:12

black and white people couldn't go to the same

48:15

church so diagonally across the street from a Dexter

48:17

is a white church so that's where the white

48:19

people go they would drop their slaves off or

48:21

like and then they would go to church right

48:23

there so and then Diard you go to the

48:26

White House of the Confederacy which is behind the

48:28

capital? I refuse. When the

48:30

centerpieces are cotton, that was crazy.

48:32

And then there's a picture book

48:34

about Jefferson Davis' family and there's

48:36

a little black boy in it.

48:38

And I'm like, I'm asking a

48:40

tour guy, like, who's this little

48:42

black boy in the family? It's

48:44

like a picture book about the

48:46

family. And they're like, oh, that's

48:48

their adopted son. They adopted a

48:50

black child. I'm like, y'all, give

48:52

me out of here. This lie.

48:54

They did not adopted. Y'all are

48:56

lying in here. To the ground,

48:58

okay? It was a mess. Let's

49:00

not say nothing like that. And

49:02

for years, and for just a

49:04

thing, because I've been going to

49:06

Montgomery for a while now, when

49:08

you would come off that highway,

49:10

that'd be the only sign you

49:12

see. White House of the Confederacy,

49:14

keep in mind, I mean, like

49:16

the historical, the civil rights trail

49:18

that goes through Montgomery, Alabama. There

49:20

are endless sites, and you know

49:22

what else is there too, and

49:24

we actually reported on it, and

49:26

I saw it in person, was

49:28

the mothers of gynecology. That's there,

49:30

that is incredible. Incredible sculptures. Oh

49:32

my God. But that's, but it's

49:34

like, it's. We got to we

49:36

got can we have like positive

49:38

the field trips because people people

49:40

want people people want third spaces

49:42

people want places that are not

49:44

Starbucks to meet into talk into

49:46

do things I think people are

49:48

thirsting but but want to be

49:50

together but the world is scary

49:52

and I think we should do

49:55

positive the field trip for for

49:57

for learners of of

49:59

all ages and

50:01

sizes. I love it. I love

50:03

it. I have what I have to

50:05

say about homelessness. homelessness. So a blog

50:07

done by a societal analysis by societal

50:09

the blogger is a there, and he there.

50:11

a And he talked about a

50:13

lunch and he went to the

50:15

Columbus Metropolitan Council, a club a asked

50:18

how much would it cost to

50:20

solve homelessness. As you know, you

50:22

about a little bit over 600 ,000 people

50:24

who are people who are homeless.

50:26

And the And the median

50:28

rent in January 2024

50:30

was a a little

50:32

bit under $1 ,400. means that

50:34

it That means that it would cost,

50:37

it's about 650 ,000 people are experiencing

50:39

homelessness, sorry, it would

50:41

cost around $11 billion. around

50:43

$11 billion to house all those

50:45

people? people. Just as a Just as

50:47

a reminder, we have spent over

50:49

over $60 billion in the Ukraine. It's

50:52

It's actually I say this because say

50:54

this because for the cost of incarceration

50:56

all these services do all these things we

50:58

do that is not providing homelessness, it would

51:00

be far cheaper if people actually cared

51:02

about the fiscal policy. But I say

51:05

this also because the fiscal narrative the fiscal narrative

51:07

actually like I think the lie that

51:09

people say in public, the I think

51:11

truly underneath it, people think that people

51:13

deserve to be homeless. like you made

51:15

a mistake, you didn't work hard enough,

51:17

you didn't. mistake, you didn't like

51:19

something. you did did something wrong

51:21

and therefore you're homeless but to help

51:23

you help be giving you an unfair

51:25

advantage, a a help out, a a handout, actually

51:28

think that that is what's that that

51:30

way people. the way the

51:32

issue of homelessness. that's like, I want

51:34

to say that here. like, I you have

51:36

to say. And the second is going

51:38

back to the bureaucracy problem of homelessness. back

51:40

to So in New York City, for

51:42

instance, So in New York City,

51:44

for the city they, the city

51:46

tracked people. people. who applied

51:48

and got approved for

51:50

homeless, for homeless for spots

51:52

and tracked, did did

51:54

they actually make it into the spot? it into

51:57

the the Of the people.

52:00

only 18% ever made it into

52:02

the spot. There are 4,000 homeless

52:04

units or units in shelters in

52:06

New York City that are sitting

52:08

vacant today because the city has

52:10

not figured out the matching. Some

52:12

people died before they got to

52:14

the housing. Some people never got

52:16

a call back. They're homeless, so

52:18

the city hasn't figured out how

52:20

to find them again after they

52:22

approved them. Because they might not

52:24

have an address. But there is

52:26

a real bureaucratic issue happening, because

52:29

even in New York City, which

52:31

famously has a right to shelter

52:33

law, if you're homeless, you have

52:35

the right to a room, the

52:37

city can't actually match the people.

52:39

And that is just a huge

52:41

indictment of the city infrastructure that's

52:43

supposed to help people. And you

52:45

know, Eric Adams is a nightmare,

52:47

so there's that. And we see

52:49

all these damn drones. So if

52:51

you wanted to go ahead and

52:53

find somebody. We know that you

52:55

could, it's just not a, it's

52:58

just not a, it's just really

53:00

just not a priority. And what

53:02

you were saying earlier about homeless

53:04

people, just like around that like

53:06

people not wanting people to be.

53:08

To find housing, I do think

53:10

that's right. And I know I

53:12

was supposed to wait until next

53:14

week to maybe talk about this.

53:16

I just want, but I didn't

53:18

want to maybe interject this really

53:20

quickly about the reason why I

53:22

wanted to alert people to Mary

53:24

and Williamson is because she's talked

53:26

in multiple platforms. So. earnestly and

53:29

in just really really well, like

53:31

there's just no other way to

53:33

put it. She talked really really

53:35

well about these type of things.

53:37

That was the first politician to

53:39

say something that I've said before

53:41

on this podcast as far as

53:43

you shouldn't have to be. She

53:45

said verbatim, well not, that's really

53:47

verbatim, but very very close.

53:49

shouldn't have to

53:51

be talented have work

53:53

hard or any

53:55

of these things

53:57

in order to

54:00

live these things in

54:02

to live well a

54:04

house or to

54:06

have food in

54:08

America. to have food in America.

54:10

me, was just,

54:12

me, was just a. baffling to

54:14

hear somebody say. say, I saw the

54:16

comments and the reactions to people,

54:18

her saying that she talked about

54:20

how there's blood there's blood plasm the

54:22

poorest of countries of up. And that's

54:24

because people can't pay their rent.

54:26

So they're selling their blood regularly

54:29

in order to pay rent, selling

54:31

these different things that I just in

54:33

order to pay rent. say. And I'm like,

54:35

yeah, that's what we're facing. We're

54:37

not facing stocks. say, and We're not

54:39

facing, you know, facing. We're need $25

54:41

,000 down for a house. know, know.

54:43

a That's a privileged problem.

54:45

We're really facing, facing, I'm,

54:47

I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm selling my

54:49

blood selling my blood for both

54:52

groceries and to pay my rent. my

54:54

rent and. Yeah, yeah, I Auto

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insurance can all seem the same, same

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it comes time to use it. it.

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55:27

I And I know we've talked about this for a long time,

55:29

so I will move on because I know my news is next, know

55:31

but. news is next, but Miles, to that

55:33

point, to that point, it is really

55:35

interesting that the lies lies about so much

55:37

of what happens with the subsidies and

55:40

helping people out, and that becomes an

55:42

people remember the child tax credit? a I

55:44

don't know if you remember, but one

55:46

of the biggest reasons the Republicans have

55:48

had against the child tax credit is

55:50

that they were like the biggest parents the

55:52

child tax credit to buy drugs in

55:54

2021. child That's why they have they were like...

55:57

Let it lapse into the in

55:59

there. is a new study out

56:01

that shows that people did not

56:03

use a child tax credit. It

56:05

just came out on January 3rd

56:08

that people did not use a

56:10

child tax credit to buy drugs.

56:12

And I say this because, A,

56:14

just think about all the smart

56:16

people that had to stop whatever

56:18

they were doing to prove this

56:20

wrong, which is just ridiculous. And

56:22

they use these racist narratives. to

56:25

stop substantive change happen for people

56:27

and it just becomes a nightmare.

56:29

That makes so much sense. I

56:31

think, oh sorry, I thought I

56:33

was responding to you. No, go

56:35

ahead, you can, and then I'm

56:37

gonna talk about the militia. Okay,

56:40

no, that makes so much sense

56:42

to me. Any time I hear

56:44

stories like that, I also think

56:46

about the data from those elections

56:48

though, and I think about how

56:50

many people who would vote Democrat

56:52

were. Just who just who

56:55

just who just didn't vote, you know,

56:57

so I do know that the Republicans

56:59

lie and the people who are already

57:01

oriented to believe their lies are gonna

57:03

are gonna believe it But I'm I'm

57:05

very concerned about so many people just

57:07

totally sitting them out and these is

57:09

where black people are in voting for

57:12

Trump. Most black people are just not

57:14

voting. So when that is the circumstance,

57:16

I'm thinking Well, we don't need to

57:18

convince those people that that's not happening

57:20

with the child tax credit because Republicans

57:22

are lying. We need to be able

57:24

to convince people who are not voting

57:26

that you're you going out and vote

57:29

actually matters. And it's hard to convince

57:31

when you're like, yeah. Your reality hasn't

57:33

changed if you're a black person living

57:35

in the rural South or if you're

57:37

a black person who is living in

57:39

poverty in certain places, your reality hasn't

57:41

changed from Trump to Biden into Obama.

57:43

So what's the difference? And to me,

57:46

that's where at least my focus and

57:48

my ideas tend to go towards because

57:50

the other thing feels so helpless. Because

57:52

I feel like the people

57:54

are believing things for

57:56

reasons that are

57:58

not just data. for

58:00

It is because they

58:03

have a underlying data.

58:05

to believe in. a

58:07

underlying desire to believe in,

58:10

to believe that black people

58:12

are doing bad things with

58:14

free government money. money. that

58:16

they wanna believe. that they want

58:18

to believe. So yeah. So with

58:20

with news, it's a a very

58:22

comprehensive article by by -publica about

58:24

a guy who guy who

58:27

infiltrated. a militia at

58:29

the highest levels then got then

58:31

got out and gave all

58:33

the information to. at the

58:35

the Republica. There's a lot a lot to

58:37

read there, so I will do the

58:39

highlights for me. me. One is, and

58:41

he was in Utah. Utah, one is that

58:44

he's like, a lot of people of

58:46

people involved, every walk of life,

58:48

doctors, police officers, you name it.

58:50

and the and the common denominators that

58:52

they were heavily armed. armed.

58:54

That is is one thing the second

58:57

is what I didn't what I did not

58:59

realize is that he was like these militia

59:01

the membership of these militant organizations is much

59:03

more he's like, than people think. back and forth through

59:05

they sort of go back and forth through

59:07

them like square dancing in analogy that they

59:10

say in the article. is So where the guy starts,

59:12

he is where the guy starts, he leaves

59:14

there and goes to the you know, the common thing

59:16

And there's like, you know, the common

59:18

thing they have is like sort of believe in

59:20

the government and sort of this, this

59:22

veil of white supremacy and stuff like that.

59:24

But. the allegiance allegiance is not

59:26

actually to one group, it's to

59:28

the idea, and that that the people sort

59:30

of switched groups often, which I

59:32

thought was interesting and that wasn't what

59:34

I and anticipated. what I had The role of

59:37

the police in this is something I

59:39

did anticipate I one of

59:41

the leaders that he leaders that under

59:43

under and lives with, which

59:45

I thought was crazy, thought was

59:47

was a former Las

59:49

Vegas Metro officer who had

59:51

worked for over 23 years

59:53

in the in the force. eventually

59:55

was assigned to the Squad

59:57

in Las Vegas Metro

59:59

PD. You might wonder what is the

1:00:02

black squad? The black squad, according

1:00:04

to court documents, was tasked with

1:00:06

investigating crimes where the suspect was

1:00:09

black. The Las Vegas Metro Police

1:00:11

Department has now said they no

1:00:13

longer divide the squads by race.

1:00:16

I just had to say that

1:00:18

I love because when I read

1:00:20

it, I thought that was nuckin'

1:00:23

futs. He eventually is. His career.

1:00:25

goes on a downturn because on

1:00:27

Facebook he writes that he would

1:00:29

quote welcome a race war and

1:00:32

he said bring it quote I'm

1:00:34

about as fed up as a

1:00:36

man American Christian white heterosexual can

1:00:39

get He then goes to say

1:00:41

that you know he just had

1:00:43

an exegron and he was having

1:00:46

a bad day in 2016 he

1:00:48

turned in his badge and before

1:00:50

it broke. So I thought that

1:00:53

was interesting with that guy The

1:00:56

last things I'll say is he turned over a ton

1:00:58

of stuff like signal chats and all this other

1:01:00

stuff. There was a sheriff who was involved that he

1:01:02

gets all these members to brag about the law enforcement

1:01:04

officers that they have connections to which is why he

1:01:06

goes to reporter and not law enforcement because he's like

1:01:09

law enforcement is in bed with all of these people

1:01:11

which I thought was interesting. And then at one point.

1:01:13

He tells the reporter that they are about 40,000 former

1:01:15

members that they have email addresses and contact information for.

1:01:18

And at the very end, it ends with this really

1:01:20

sophisticated doxing system they have for reporters who are critical

1:01:22

of either issues they like. or critical of them. So

1:01:24

like, you know, they have this one reporter's whole family,

1:01:26

they have information about them, all this stuff, and it's

1:01:29

just like a routine part of it. And I thought

1:01:31

that was really interesting. My personal connection to this is

1:01:33

that I will never forget in Ferguson, the oathkeepers

1:01:35

came. We never heard of the oathkeepers. They just sort

1:01:37

of showed up. They were. white men with

1:01:40

guns. and they And they sort

1:01:42

of like suggested that they

1:01:44

were on our side. But

1:01:46

I remember meeting them and

1:01:48

being like, like mmm some might write with

1:01:51

with these people like this sort

1:01:53

of weird. of And it

1:01:55

was actually the first real

1:01:57

fight we had with other people

1:02:00

I remember people being like,

1:02:02

because I was critical of

1:02:04

them on Twitter, like, I'm

1:02:06

not going to a meeting

1:02:08

with them. And other protesters were like,

1:02:10

hooray, these people like, you're just these

1:02:13

people are fine. You're just like,

1:02:15

I'm by I remember being like,

1:02:17

we realized these without white And then

1:02:19

later yeah, I'm super crazy. like I'm like,

1:02:22

with and people guns just crazy. the

1:02:24

like, just popped up in with these

1:02:26

white men with popped popped

1:02:28

up in the Ferguson, that, that, that, that,

1:02:30

that, that feels, that feels. Not real. real. They

1:02:32

are trying to wreck havoc. And they

1:02:34

do talk about even in the article,

1:02:36

I it was interesting to see the

1:02:38

way the police the stuff came up

1:02:40

came that one of the turning points

1:02:42

for him was points being killed by

1:02:44

the Memphis PD. being And the PD and

1:02:46

the ensued that that in Utah Even in Utah and

1:02:48

in the how the white were planning to

1:02:50

infiltrate those protests across the country. protests across

1:02:53

I brought it here because I was interested it

1:02:55

here because I was takes on in your takes

1:02:57

on this expose a the the vast network of

1:02:59

the militia. And the last thing I'll say about

1:03:01

language is that if this was black people, black

1:03:04

would be called a would be called a gang. just

1:03:06

the language would be different. be We

1:03:08

wouldn't say they're heavily armed black. There

1:03:10

would be like gangs black. America are

1:03:13

planning America or It wouldn't get militia,

1:03:15

which sounds just like a little more

1:03:17

neutral and less overtly violent to

1:03:19

a lot of people. These would be

1:03:21

called gangs. These would be I was

1:03:23

interested in how the language

1:03:26

of white people organizing violence

1:03:28

is just different. different.

1:03:30

That's That's interesting

1:03:32

that militia hits you less

1:03:34

violent because it in my ears

1:03:37

in my ears me as me as

1:03:39

more I think because think because of

1:03:41

the hip hop culture and because

1:03:43

of the the overuse of gangs,

1:03:45

have kind of like of like, not and

1:03:48

thugs have kind of like kind of like lessens

1:03:50

their I don't know they just feel like

1:03:52

empty words to me a little bit

1:03:54

sometimes And militia actually sounds a little scarier

1:03:56

to me and I remember that language

1:03:59

being used a lot in... when it comes

1:04:01

like Middle East, like things

1:04:03

happening in the Middle East

1:04:05

and stuff like that. So

1:04:07

that's interesting to the thing

1:04:09

that made me the most

1:04:12

concerned, or not even concerned,

1:04:14

but the thing that just

1:04:16

struck me is the synergy.

1:04:18

It's always the synergy. It's

1:04:20

the fact that this type

1:04:22

of radicalism has such a

1:04:25

synergy with institutions that we're

1:04:27

supposed to be able to

1:04:29

trust. And you have to

1:04:31

look at why. is, you

1:04:33

know, why do police officers

1:04:36

and these militias, why do

1:04:38

they go hand in hand?

1:04:40

Why do certain occupations, certain

1:04:42

races, certain places of empowerment

1:04:44

and disempowerment go so hand

1:04:46

in hand with this type

1:04:49

of domestic terrorism planning? To

1:04:51

me, that's what this, that's

1:04:53

what this detailed and Yeah,

1:04:56

you know, it's a boring old story, but

1:04:58

we know how come police officers exist. We

1:05:00

know that they were people who looked over

1:05:02

slaves, and I think that we're still living

1:05:05

in the aftermath of that, and I think

1:05:07

that that's how comes so much of the

1:05:09

white supremacist terrorism and the, and these other

1:05:11

institutions go so hand in hand in Two,

1:05:14

which I've always been scared about, is what's

1:05:16

gonna happen when these militias and stuff like

1:05:18

that get a hold of and understand AI

1:05:21

and Dark Web and all these other stuff

1:05:23

even deeper. So not just about how to

1:05:25

make things, but problem solve certain things. Like

1:05:27

I'm just, I think we should have a

1:05:30

healthy awareness around that as, as, as. Our

1:05:32

technologies evolve, so do, does evils? So that's

1:05:34

what this made me think of too, because

1:05:36

if they're already planning to infiltrate and do

1:05:39

these different things, then of course they're gonna

1:05:41

integrate different technologies. is to

1:05:43

help them do those

1:05:46

things. those And that's how

1:05:48

And that's how come, I I

1:05:50

think, one of of y 'all

1:05:52

black folks who I'm

1:05:55

talking about, about, Darae, Dara,

1:05:57

anybody who's listening to

1:05:59

me, I don't think

1:06:01

me, of y 'all should

1:06:04

be telling where your

1:06:06

address is. I think

1:06:08

that your address is. I paranoia

1:06:11

is good right now

1:06:13

is good right now because I. I

1:06:15

that we're we're in a, in a,

1:06:17

in a, been in a

1:06:20

weird time, but now

1:06:22

we're in an even

1:06:24

weirder times. I'm

1:06:26

trying to say it

1:06:29

without being it without being alarmist, but

1:06:31

y'all get what I'm putting

1:06:33

down. It's I it's interesting

1:06:35

what's happening to my

1:06:37

body to in this conversation conversation,

1:06:40

as someone who who has studied

1:06:42

and and supported

1:06:44

movements in my lifetime. And I think.

1:06:47

I You know. you know. learning

1:06:50

about. aggressive and and

1:06:52

violent. you know, sort

1:06:55

of the try know, sort of.

1:06:57

of the Black dismantling of the Black

1:06:59

Panther part. how how there are

1:07:01

folks who are still. Kamal Sadiki,

1:07:04

Joseph Bowen, Ashadash of

1:07:06

Joseph. on the FBI most the

1:07:08

FBI most list, so would George

1:07:10

Wright. Wright. And

1:07:13

And also like children of these

1:07:15

people, right? So like children

1:07:17

of of black revolutionaries who. have

1:07:19

had to deal with. to deal with, you know,

1:07:21

know, the violence against their parents,

1:07:23

the murder against their parents,

1:07:25

the aggressive use of the United

1:07:27

States legal system to crush

1:07:29

their family members. their family members.

1:07:32

And then you look then how these you

1:07:34

look at how these militias are

1:07:36

treated. just seen as how it's just seen

1:07:38

as folks trying to protect their Second

1:07:40

Amendment rights. rights. and how how most of

1:07:42

them are actually former law enforcement or former

1:07:44

military. or I

1:07:46

think it speaks to... I think it

1:07:48

speaks to racism in this

1:07:50

in this country in terms of of how

1:07:52

how that impacts. how folks are

1:07:55

portrayed, folks are portrayed, media

1:07:57

perception, et cetera, et cetera. So

1:08:00

this is something that really

1:08:02

makes me angry, I guess,

1:08:05

is how I'm feeling right

1:08:07

now, because it is, to

1:08:10

really understand and to hold

1:08:12

the continued assault against our

1:08:14

people. It's just, it's a

1:08:17

little overwhelming sometimes, I think.

1:08:19

It really is. And it's

1:08:22

like it's people's lives. You

1:08:24

know, it's people's lives in

1:08:27

terms of like what systemic

1:08:29

oppression and the legacy of

1:08:31

chattel slavery have met in

1:08:34

this country. But it's also

1:08:36

just like the people who

1:08:39

are fighting and protesting and

1:08:41

laying their bodies on the

1:08:44

line and all of that

1:08:46

like the happenings to these

1:08:48

other fools, these January six

1:08:51

riders who Donald Trump, I'm

1:08:53

sure, will absolve when when

1:08:56

he gets into office. It

1:08:58

just, obviously it makes all

1:09:01

the sense and the sort

1:09:03

of enigma that is the

1:09:05

United States. But from a

1:09:08

hard place, it's a hard

1:09:10

thing to make sense of.

1:09:13

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Turn house into into

1:11:41

a home. Turn can we

1:11:43

have any love? it's never

1:11:45

too much It's never too much.

1:11:48

My news is about Luther

1:11:50

Vandross. about Luther

1:11:52

whoop. Okay, I, my mom

1:11:54

and I watched the and I

1:11:57

watched the documentary. on on

1:11:59

CNN. And I just, I

1:12:01

mean, my first, I'm

1:12:04

just so happy

1:12:06

to I mean, my black. I I'm

1:12:08

just so happy to be know, I just

1:12:10

don't. so I'm

1:12:13

just so exuberant about it.

1:12:15

I mean, mean, thank, thank honestly,

1:12:17

that had a part in me

1:12:19

being Black in America had a part

1:12:22

in I am so proud of

1:12:24

Luther in Like so, so proud of

1:12:26

him. And I think I would

1:12:28

go on so far to say. so far

1:12:30

to say that he is the most

1:12:33

talented vocalist most

1:12:36

talented vocalist. planet

1:12:38

Okay. lived on

1:12:40

the vocalist. I mean, oh. So,

1:12:42

male and this there are things

1:12:44

that like I didn't really

1:12:47

know about Luther. I You know, there

1:12:49

are things that he didn't really know about Luther. I didn't know

1:12:51

that he was like straight. up from New

1:12:53

York City. City, like born, like like, started

1:12:55

his life on the Lower East East Side,

1:12:57

went up to the Bronx, grew up

1:12:59

between the Bronx and the like a

1:13:01

New York City kid. City so

1:13:03

much that like in his singing his singing,

1:13:06

in the the first group he was

1:13:08

in, that I'm forgetting the name,

1:13:10

but they were fabulous, but they ended Jim

1:13:12

he put them on Sesame Street, put them

1:13:14

on Sesame Cause they were like New York

1:13:16

kids singing about, you know, we're going

1:13:18

to make like, New York kids singing about, you know,

1:13:20

we're he ended up

1:13:23

singing A, B, for cute. Bowie,

1:13:25

Beth Midler, like, and then the

1:13:27

And then I other thing I didn't know

1:13:29

about him is he is like a song,

1:13:31

he wrote all the songs. wrote all the

1:13:34

songs to just name somebody,

1:13:37

Pat, just all of them. all of

1:13:39

them. And so there's

1:13:41

just There's just this

1:13:43

incredible, endless talent that

1:13:45

came. came out of of

1:13:48

him that we should all be so

1:13:50

appreciative of. of. then

1:13:52

then. There's the other side of

1:13:54

this. of this, which again, we need

1:13:56

to again, we need to do, we need

1:13:59

to come together a... black family and figure

1:14:01

out. figure out why we're responsible

1:14:03

for killing this man? Cause we did

1:14:05

this people. We did. we did black

1:14:07

people. We did. We did. We did.

1:14:09

We did. And there's so many

1:14:11

things that were that were in this

1:14:13

documentary. this and it was and

1:14:15

interesting Don

1:14:18

Porter, who is is a

1:14:20

renowned documentarian. She

1:14:22

and she also worked on Good Trouble. That's

1:14:24

maybe where her her name is familiar to

1:14:26

most folks to most folks.

1:14:29

but there wasn't a ton

1:14:31

on the on the personal it. it. And

1:14:33

Luther Luther himself never

1:14:35

came out. And what came out.

1:14:38

interesting, there wasn't

1:14:40

very was also interesting, there wasn't

1:14:42

very much perspective from his family. Now,

1:14:44

the person that came up

1:14:46

for person that came up for me

1:14:48

some really had some alarms go off.

1:14:51

spoken I've spoken about

1:14:53

before is that Sissy Houston. Houston.

1:14:55

So Sissy was was very much around

1:14:57

and we know how she felt.

1:14:59

felt. No. I'm, I'm sitting talking to

1:15:01

he talking to Oprah. I would not have I

1:15:03

would not have liked it. like I do

1:15:05

not like do not like I do not like

1:15:07

girl on girl on on boy. and Eve. And,

1:15:09

you Eve. didn't sign the

1:15:11

waiver, which is know, Patty not in it. which

1:15:14

is why she's not in it. with There's

1:15:16

a whole thing with I, of course, I course,

1:15:18

I last last night because I'm like,

1:15:20

that's such a short such a short clip it, clip

1:15:22

of, clip of Patty. And. There's

1:15:24

a a beef happening right now now feels like

1:15:27

the way she was portrayed in it made

1:15:29

her feel sort of like a bully. sort

1:15:31

was the only one to speak about. only one

1:15:33

to speak his sexuality. Um, and she,

1:15:35

she, she had a cut a cut to

1:15:37

bunch to be included in the, in

1:15:39

the documentary, but wanted to have

1:15:41

a a take a look at. the final the

1:15:43

final was gonna be. wasn't given that

1:15:45

wasn't given that privilege. Now I'll tell you something. Kerry

1:15:48

Carey was in this and you know who I

1:15:50

I you, got to see it before it came

1:15:52

out. came out? Is the Mariah

1:15:54

Carey. I know that

1:15:56

1 ,000 1,000 a really sent

1:15:58

1,000 I know my But but

1:16:00

Mariah, light stuff, I love

1:16:02

I love she's green but she's green

1:16:04

based off off of what side

1:16:07

you're showing, not based off of

1:16:09

what the off of what the content was. So?

1:16:11

So? So? But she you, but because

1:16:13

that Miles, because that is, exactly. that

1:16:15

last look. that anyway, look. But

1:16:17

so that so that, okay, so that that,

1:16:19

but it is, they also

1:16:21

it is, of, you know, showed sort

1:16:23

of, was Eddie Murphy whether it was

1:16:25

Eddie about. or Cedt. Luther's

1:16:28

weight over the years and the the of

1:16:30

the weight and what I never really put

1:16:32

together. First of all, Luther Vandross was

1:16:34

54 years old when he died. Vandross was 54

1:16:36

I didn't know that when he died

1:16:38

was like, didn't know that he was young.

1:16:41

like oh my god he was young 54

1:16:43

he had diabetes and then then

1:16:45

the weight yo and he

1:16:47

had a stroke and I feel like

1:16:49

it's And I feel like it's the

1:16:51

same people people you obviously, I just said

1:16:53

how how much being me and

1:16:55

me and me But why are we so

1:16:57

mean to each other? same the same

1:16:59

thing that happened with Whitney Whitney, remember when

1:17:01

Whitney got. I'm really, really, really, really Whitney

1:17:03

got really, really, and how everybody talked about

1:17:05

it like a dog. talked about it like

1:17:08

a dog. So I just, I I

1:17:10

think that's... been listening to I've

1:17:12

been listening to Luther and I'm just I'm

1:17:14

just so proud and so overjoyed

1:17:16

and so all these things like, because when

1:17:18

you think of him, you really do think of love, like

1:17:20

you do. of do, like just was. do.

1:17:22

Like he just was a like. We

1:17:25

don't, we didn't deserve didn't

1:17:28

but the other side of

1:17:30

this is the other side of this

1:17:32

is be kinder to each other. got

1:17:34

to be and I don't know how we can

1:17:36

figure out how to do that at scale, but

1:17:39

we really, really do. And maybe that is

1:17:41

part of us. how to all going

1:17:43

to Montgomery as a people. But we

1:17:45

really really do and maybe

1:17:47

that is part of us all going to

1:17:49

No, Doreen has such a

1:17:51

a Wait, no, I'm done.

1:17:53

I'm done. done. Let me

1:17:55

go miles because Miles is

1:17:57

way smarter than me the

1:17:59

culture So me get my little two

1:18:01

words in before two words in before Miles

1:18:03

your singing voice. smart. I was going to

1:18:06

you know, look at my

1:18:08

cousin. your singing voice. Oh, you know, look at

1:18:10

he was that young. Didn't realize he

1:18:12

was the headlines articles, the

1:18:14

headlines back then? I'm like

1:18:16

the stuff they

1:18:18

printed as just like

1:18:20

printed as headlines news article headlines,

1:18:22

crazy. It makes me It makes me

1:18:24

sad that a generation will never know Oprah.

1:18:26

Oprah. Like I remember being young, being

1:18:28

like, I wanna do something important enough

1:18:30

to get on the Oprah to get on

1:18:33

the you know, the last interview he

1:18:35

ever did was with Oprah and

1:18:37

to see him struggle to speak. struggle to

1:18:39

speak like oh my that broke

1:18:41

my heart like we not only let

1:18:43

this Let this happen to you, but we

1:18:45

let you go. like you were they they threw you

1:18:47

out, you know? was in the transition to hip

1:18:49

to hip pop Luther Van draws did like and I

1:18:52

forgot that that with my father was

1:18:54

so late in his, like I

1:18:56

forgot that was like like song, you

1:18:58

know? was like the swan song, you know. So was interesting

1:19:00

to me. I think me.

1:19:02

also I also was obviously sad that

1:19:04

he that he wasn't able to

1:19:06

come out like to find love, But but

1:19:08

even the little stories, like the

1:19:10

fact that his assistant had to

1:19:13

break in the house. the house to find

1:19:15

him find him on the floor after having

1:19:17

the stroke? I'm I'm like. You're a

1:19:19

Luther Van Dross. You know what I mean?

1:19:21

I'm like, Like we really, like what what happened? And

1:19:23

then, you know, And then, you know, what

1:19:25

I of his of all of his

1:19:27

musical accomplishments and just the ear he

1:19:29

had and. he is just the gift. You know, so

1:19:32

the gift. know, so few people can walk

1:19:34

on the stage and just sing. He'll need.

1:19:36

he'll need, on the fluff is

1:19:38

cool he he appreciates the

1:19:40

the pageantry and grew up grew up

1:19:42

listening to all those other and all those

1:19:44

other people I like, I appreciate the artistry,

1:19:46

but. but. If if you just gave him a

1:19:48

microphone and a stage. a stage, he could

1:19:50

tear tear it down every time,

1:19:52

and I I respect that. That is,

1:19:55

the kids ain't got that today. that

1:19:57

What I also I also love is though

1:19:59

is that his, he friends from school. and

1:20:01

middle middle school. rocked that

1:20:04

rocked with him and were there in

1:20:06

the hospital on the last day. the Like

1:20:08

I do appreciate that he, that

1:20:10

he, that those friends stay with

1:20:12

him. Like, I love that. Like

1:20:14

I love that, him the that other

1:20:17

guy, they in the hospital room,

1:20:19

that other guy, was really beautiful. hospital room,

1:20:21

like that was really

1:20:23

beautiful to watch. Yeah. Like, to

1:20:25

your point, your point, Dara. Luther Keith

1:20:28

in kind of a stratosphere that,

1:20:30

to me, reminds me of me

1:20:32

reminds me of like And when I

1:20:34

think about a lot of I think

1:20:36

about a lot of the maybe like it comes

1:20:38

to writing Billy Strayhorn, comes when

1:20:40

I think about Strayhorn when I think

1:20:43

about that he he positioned

1:20:45

himself, and I think about

1:20:47

Tony Bennett and Frank

1:20:49

Sinatra, he really took that,

1:20:52

Sinatra, really Franklin did, but

1:20:54

he was just he was but

1:20:56

he just had like a

1:20:58

bigger voice and a voice

1:21:00

that had inside of the

1:21:02

church a voice that was baked inside of the church

1:21:04

and it had It's 9 a .m.

1:21:06

His voice was like am. His

1:21:08

voice was like rubber. Okay. And it was

1:21:10

able to stretch to different

1:21:12

places. And I think that was

1:21:14

really, And I just amazing to look

1:21:16

at. just you know me, to

1:21:19

look at. But critical of

1:21:21

all critical exceptionalism propaganda. And

1:21:23

it is something about

1:21:25

the fact that we have

1:21:28

so many stories around

1:21:30

black people who have been

1:21:32

blessed with black gifts

1:21:34

and black genius black gifts and black

1:21:37

this this pinnacle of fame of

1:21:39

fame and celebrity and money

1:21:41

and power power because you

1:21:43

know, we are living in a living in

1:21:45

a society that says, if it's know, if

1:21:47

it's homeless, your your fault so of course you're

1:21:49

gonna exploit your gift in order to your

1:21:51

gift in order it order whatever. it so whatever But who

1:21:54

chooses that path seems

1:21:56

to have such miserable, miserable

1:21:59

lives. lives and And part of

1:22:01

me is happy that we're at

1:22:03

the phase of culture, eating

1:22:05

itself, where culture I think the incentive to

1:22:07

participate in that think the incentive

1:22:09

to participate in that is just me happy

1:22:11

And that kind of makes me

1:22:14

happy because there's so many people who

1:22:16

have sacrificed their sanity and their lives

1:22:18

we think about Whitney, when we

1:22:20

think about when we think about I mean, it's

1:22:22

just just so many people to people to

1:22:24

And to me, Luther is in

1:22:26

that in that because because of being

1:22:28

closeted, because of the ways that ways

1:22:31

that being closeted and not being

1:22:33

able to be yourself and and

1:22:35

manifest in other the other different ways

1:22:37

and that relationship manifesting bad relationships

1:22:39

with food. Like all those things

1:22:42

are interconnected as a queer

1:22:44

person interconnected as a queer person with who has... diet

1:22:46

and body, all those all those issues, those

1:22:48

things are just so intimately connected.

1:22:50

the And the last thing I'll

1:22:53

say is it's also interesting also

1:22:55

interesting speaking of culture, you know,

1:22:57

American culture, of being at this

1:22:59

phase of eating itself. It's just

1:23:01

that. phase of eating itself, it's

1:23:04

80s 70s-80s thing happening again.

1:23:06

again. You have a slew of

1:23:08

people who were so influenced

1:23:10

by um, so if you weren't directly So if

1:23:12

you weren't directly influenced by

1:23:14

jazz, you were influenced by other

1:23:16

people. So was a Diana Ross

1:23:18

Ross, uh, a queen. So, but Diana Ross is a Billy

1:23:20

Diana Ross is a Billie

1:23:22

Holiday queen, then know? And then

1:23:24

you are Aretha Franklin, but Aretha

1:23:26

Franklin is a Diana Washington Diana

1:23:28

And there is such a, is

1:23:30

such a, In jazz there's such a

1:23:32

big thing around experimentation. but

1:23:35

also but also So, not only do you need to

1:23:37

be able to listen to everything that's going on

1:23:39

around you as a vocalist and as a musician

1:23:41

and create something new on the spot, but it

1:23:43

also needs to be excellent because we're also out

1:23:45

doing these white boys. and

1:23:47

And that... new on the spot,

1:23:49

but it You know, I got

1:23:51

to rock my hips faster, move my

1:23:54

feet faster, so I got to

1:23:56

be James Brown. white boys. tension really really

1:23:58

some. some... crazy

1:24:00

talent you know, and we're know not we're

1:24:02

just not there anymore think I

1:24:04

think for reasons, not there anymore

1:24:06

because I can see a I can

1:24:08

see a having a happier

1:24:10

career happier if she's never

1:24:12

she's never becomes the pinnacle

1:24:14

of the universe, like Aretha was

1:24:16

at one point. was at one point. But it

1:24:18

also makes me think about about,

1:24:20

damn. Luther than Anita. Like even the

1:24:23

people he's beefing with, like with, oh,

1:24:25

he's being mean to oh, And

1:24:27

I'm like, mean because Envogue is hot

1:24:29

and I'm like, you know, it's just

1:24:31

now is hot too. Like, you know, it's, it's,

1:24:33

it's, know, we're just in a

1:24:35

different era and a different

1:24:38

moment era in pressure cooker of jazz

1:24:40

that pressure cooker of jazz scrutiny really birthed

1:24:42

some miraculous music, even if

1:24:44

the price were music, even if the price were

1:24:46

real souls and that make any

1:24:48

of that even worth living in

1:24:50

the first place. So

1:24:52

those are my kind of mixed feelings on it, but. of

1:24:55

that love big worth I love small

1:24:57

Luther. the first place. So those are my I

1:24:59

love all the Luther. I love all of Luther,

1:25:01

but and I hope Luther is in heaven. Love

1:25:03

it all of himself. Luther. Well, and the other thing,

1:25:05

the last thing? is crazy. this is,

1:25:07

and Duray, this is for this is for

1:25:09

you there that there really wasn't a

1:25:11

theatrical release of this documentary. And

1:25:13

I think it's interesting with It's

1:25:15

interesting with the DEI stuff and the

1:25:17

Donald Trump and all this, this, gonna happen

1:25:19

to content over the next four years the

1:25:21

the things that will be made. things that not

1:25:24

be made. and not be made and given

1:25:26

theatrical releases and not. not.

1:25:28

It's it's wild this did not have

1:25:30

a theatrical release and it's also

1:25:32

wild that it's like it's on CNN. we're

1:25:34

also in an the where we can

1:25:36

take back theatrical releases it like we

1:25:38

can't like nobody like us anything us anything

1:25:40

anymore. enough people with enough money where that

1:25:42

can happen. I hope happen I hope that

1:25:44

this gap it makes it happen because

1:25:46

certain things are just certain are just

1:25:48

so corny corny you can feel feel the

1:25:50

the on them. I'm like, this is Jamie Fox's

1:25:52

company I was like, that's why he

1:25:54

was in it. he was in it. But, you know,

1:25:57

I watch it on watch it on I

1:25:59

had to like like. Yeah, but the

1:26:01

distributor the distributor is usually it

1:26:03

gets bought and then the distributor is who

1:26:05

does who does the et cetera, et cetera. it's

1:26:07

not, So the producers just get it made.

1:26:10

just get it made Well, that's it. that's it. tuning much for

1:26:12

tuning of the People THE PEOPLE this week. Don't

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