0:01

Welcome to Pure Grit with Paula McGrath. If

0:05

you search the word grit, you'd see that it means

0:07

to have courage, show strength of character,

0:10

passion, and perseverance. Throughout

0:15

the series, paul chat to guess from

0:17

all walks of life who have shown pure

0:19

grit to get to where they are now. Paula,

0:25

Paula, Yeah, look, he looks

0:27

fine. I've done the intro, so ready

0:29

for you to talk now? Yeah,

0:31

you do your talking things.

0:33

Welcome back to Pure Grit. We continue

0:36

on now with part two of Hans Gustafson.

0:39

This part of the podcast we

0:41

discuss how Han's got clean

0:44

off ice and what happened

0:46

because he ends up going to jail. Enjoy

0:49

part two. You

0:51

then you stayed on it for like two

0:53

years, but then how did you get off?

0:56

So during this process as this

0:58

few years is when I was in the drug

1:01

world, you know, I was you became

1:03

like a bit of figure down when I was just

1:06

you know, doing pretty well, and from there

1:08

it was feeding my habit and stuff. And during

1:10

that two year period was on just where everything

1:13

started like went downhill. So I had had

1:15

a number of I had great number of things. Are a

1:17

few businesses going so

1:19

forth. Then from there I just went through like one secret

1:22

of events, like a traumatic event, and

1:24

this is where things once started spiraling down for

1:26

me. And this is what I started using, started using more

1:28

and more and more of it. So given

1:31

like one example, so one event like

1:33

this is back in was a twenty

1:36

eighteen to a New Year's Eve to twenty

1:38

nineteen, and I

1:40

was at a big boake festival and from

1:43

there I was, you know, was you know, I was seeing a

1:45

girl there at the time, and I

1:47

said I had to go back just before midnight

1:49

because a day.

1:50

After I had to fight in New Zealand.

1:52

And during this process, I was driving

1:55

home and this is like thirty minutes before midnight.

1:57

I was driving and

1:59

this.

1:59

Is just before the Gonfield's

2:02

exits.

2:02

So on the highway and I went

2:04

and.

2:06

You know, at that time, as

2:09

I was driving, I see

2:11

something, you know, side of the bushes, and

2:14

the next thing I know, this person

2:16

just jumps in front of me like like

2:19

Hundrek's nour.

2:20

There, Oh my gosh.

2:22

And you know that that

2:24

process there was just I saw

2:26

it jumping can around with that smashed

2:28

and born you know what

2:31

up in that sequence, a person decided to

2:33

take his own life and and use

2:35

me as a vessel.

2:36

And and this is.

2:37

Like that's that was like one event and that's where

2:39

things went super downhill for me

2:41

where when I looked at.

2:43

It, someone jumped in front of your car.

2:45

Yes, this isn't two thous that end.

2:48

And I had

2:50

another one as well as twenty sixteen as well,

2:52

like I do on a motorbike, was on dream

2:54

driving and he came into my lane when he was

2:57

on the other side came and

2:59

these are like as where I thought,

3:01

like, it doesn't affect you, but at that time you

3:03

just sort of just go I sort of like didn't

3:06

care anymore, Like I, well, I'm

3:08

seeing that this is what life's about, and funker,

3:11

I.

3:11

Ain't give a fuck anymore.

3:12

And yes, this is where we've got a point

3:14

where I was in a relationship for like four and a

3:16

half years and split from there, I

3:19

experienced having like description

3:21

drugs with draws for the first time, and

3:24

from there having these and they went to other like

3:27

sequence of events and once

3:29

another to the point where you can say that one

3:32

of these events was like, oh, that was like

3:35

a Monday afternoon, Tuesday

3:37

night, spoaking.

3:39

Friday morning and so forth.

3:41

And this is these events where like these

3:43

events stopped so just

3:45

wide into me. And this is where I started just using

3:47

more and more and I went from

3:50

having like a lot of things and traveled

3:52

the world. I had nothing like no issues and then to

3:55

spoiled down massively went through all these

3:58

keeps to these like traumatic events to

4:00

the point where this is like it was

4:02

a twenty twenty so during that

4:05

period where I decided

4:07

to there's a four

4:09

separate occasions I decided to like take my own life

4:11

and for separate occasions and

4:14

and ya, I'm so fortunate, like something

4:17

came in the way that stopped from doing it.

4:19

And there and

4:22

this is this and this is where there interested fart began when

4:24

it came to twenty twenty one where

4:27

I get done for

4:29

for like a commercial twenty of one killer method

4:32

vitamine.

4:33

And oh so you got nicked

4:35

by the cops. Yes, and

4:38

this would have been hot potentially

4:42

what has saved you han'ts isn't

4:44

it? So?

4:46

All honestly, it was either

4:48

going to jail or either

4:51

one of those two. I agree, like that's

4:53

there's no way around it. And when

4:56

I got done, man, that really like obviously

4:58

fucking sucks.

4:59

So yeah, and I just.

5:02

Talking about I was standing this is I

5:04

was up up north of rock Campton, so this

5:07

is like very horrific.

5:08

I was just that's when you got you got, you

5:10

got caught in.

5:12

I was up north in rock Campton, yes, and

5:14

just from there

5:16

it just felt like I remember just standing in the

5:18

in the wash in just in the watchhouse.

5:20

And so you would have been making

5:22

a lot of money too, you would have been flying

5:25

high.

5:26

You see. I was on just on top of the world. Had everything

5:29

you.

5:29

Were dealing, but were you're taking.

5:33

I was, I was using you, We're

5:35

using it, okay.

5:37

And what it is interesting is where when

5:39

you start taking a point and when you're using every day,

5:41

you got the stage where the talents, you build

5:43

a talents real quick to it. I start

5:45

using law and war and just from

5:48

there just this is what the most

5:50

This is where I'm explaining how where things started

5:52

transforming for me is the fact that standing

5:55

in this in the watchhouse, just

5:59

just look the right hand

6:01

side and the cell next to me, there was there

6:03

was a guy on the floor

6:05

just just shaking, and so

6:08

he was or he was

6:10

coming off. And then in front

6:12

of me there was a cell across on the other

6:14

end where it was like the watch cell,

6:16

and on the opposing on the opposing angle

6:19

was the officer station. There

6:21

was a guy there with dreadlins

6:23

just completely off his hand, just

6:26

just running up, smashing his

6:28

head on the on the on the on the screen

6:31

and blood piercing out him,

6:33

just screaming.

6:34

You know.

6:34

And this is the first time where you.

6:36

Know, I was.

6:38

Myself.

6:39

I was like, and it hit you, I was.

6:42

I was like, and

6:45

then you were going to have to you

6:48

wouldn't you would have been happy to come down

6:50

as well.

6:50

I was coming down to it and I was like, fucking

6:53

my my body is getting with drawers and obviously

6:55

getting pinched, you know there.

6:57

I know I was gonna looking at a very long.

6:59

Time and yes, and like

7:01

this is the first time just in the watchhouse

7:03

and just sitting there, my

7:05

mind started going praise and I

7:07

I want to do I started to recollecting my like what

7:09

happened here?

7:10

You know?

7:10

I just how did I get here? Yet?

7:12

How did I get you?

7:13

Like I was you know, you know, you

7:15

know, came here in Australia. What school fitness?

7:18

Yeah got and the drugs you know, did

7:21

well and then then every

7:23

time coming down with all these traumatic events,

7:26

taking drugs and trying to take and the next thing,

7:28

I'm in jail and you know this is and you know,

7:30

my mind at that time just kind of like

7:32

fucking like this is like a typical story

7:34

you here, like what people here, They go

7:37

through this world, make a name, then

7:39

comes crashing down, losing everything and then just

7:41

in there and you.

7:43

Had to hit you had to hit rock

7:45

bottom.

7:46

I had to. Yeah, to be honest, Yeah, there was either

7:48

I said, either Dad or do you go to jail?

7:51

And that was like the

7:53

turning You just had the turning point for me.

7:55

I was the standard of Watchhouse and just

7:58

recollecting my thoughts going you.

7:59

Know, like

8:02

I'm.

8:02

Going to do something different now, you know, I said, look this if

8:04

I don't change, now, like this

8:07

is it. This is my fascination, like

8:09

the end of me and now

8:12

this is where this is, like this is something

8:14

perfect I could like it was so strange

8:16

and I didn't really ask for it.

8:18

It just it just happened.

8:19

Just from there, I started to just

8:21

recollection my thoughts of the past

8:24

or just flashbacks and now throughout

8:26

my years and when people

8:28

go through your life when you go through your life, you

8:30

have different friendship groups.

8:32

As you go through different friendship groups, you have say

8:35

the prominent people.

8:36

In those groups, they used to

8:39

pull me aside and they go heys,

8:41

you know, like they're always saying along

8:43

the same lines like you're very talented, you're

8:45

gifted, you're unique, authentic, so

8:47

forth. And from there they

8:49

said, however, you got your

8:51

insecure, you've got issues, and.

8:55

Pick some bad crowds along.

8:57

Yeah, decisions, you know.

8:59

And I was stubborn, and and at

9:01

that time I was like, I was like fuck, I was

9:03

like, why does everyone keep saying this?

9:04

You know what?

9:05

Sense I'm inside here now it's either

9:07

I changed now or it So

9:09

I've made a conscious look I

9:11

have however long I mean in jail

9:13

for I'll dedicate myself to

9:15

understand why things happen the way, reverse

9:18

engineer why things happen,

9:20

and try and fix myself because I

9:22

don't.

9:23

This is it for me?

9:23

And so how did you get through the withdrawal?

9:26

You did it? You actually did it?

9:28

So for

9:32

me personally, like what I what I went

9:34

through, and it will be a lot of people can resonate with me

9:36

or have a similar

9:38

case. So for me, the

9:41

first three months was horrendous.

9:43

This body was just sporadic highs

9:46

and lows, highs and lows. Because

9:49

once you take drugs every day for so long,

9:51

your body becomes conditioned to be

9:53

in that state and your

9:55

body is wide to be like that.

9:57

When you stop taking it, this is what you crash.

9:59

And this is why a lot of people end

10:01

up nacking themselves to like

10:05

just end up just body shutting down.

10:07

Is because when your body is one.

10:09

In a condition a certain way for taking drugs for so

10:12

long, does on straight cold turkey,

10:15

Yeah, your body just shuts like it just shuts down

10:17

and he goes crazy. And and

10:20

this is why a lot of people when

10:23

they say I just get off the drugs and get off the drugs, it

10:26

will come down to that person holding you've been taking

10:28

drugs what certain drugs, And

10:30

from there you realize and you have to actually wind them

10:32

down, like you can't. You have to win them off, and you have

10:35

there like and during this process

10:37

and this is where because I've been

10:39

through it, is when you're coming down, coming

10:41

off your mind, you're so you're so literally

10:43

so vulnerable and anything

10:45

that anyone that says to you or any remarks

10:48

or anything like that, you take it to heart.

10:49

It really hits you on another scale, seves.

10:51

So one thing I can say, when

10:53

someone's coming off the drugs or anyone doing

10:56

so, just be mindful if you

10:58

see someone do that, be careful what you say.

10:59

To or do certain things, because.

11:03

Because when they're going through that mental

11:06

decline of the depression period coming

11:08

off, they're very vulnerable.

11:10

And you're the same, your man, you're an absolute

11:12

fuck with you know, the drugs and so forth.

11:14

And I can understand both sides, but when

11:17

the person's receiving that, when they're coming off and

11:19

of the drugs, it's just it really hits

11:21

them.

11:22

And this is where you're you just just

11:24

spile down, just keep going.

11:26

Down physically physically. What

11:28

happened to your body as you were coming

11:32

off cold Turkey?

11:33

So cold turkey, So the

11:36

motions eyes the low, there

11:38

was no baseline. It was straight up high

11:41

down. This just like just spike.

11:43

Them down, up and down, up and down your

11:45

anxious.

11:46

So your mind is gone ten thousand

11:48

miles an hours, because that's how you know, during

11:50

that press, it's gets conditioned to be like that, did.

11:52

You did you eat? Did you sleep?

11:56

No?

11:56

Good?

11:56

I've had to insomnia, so I couldn't sleep for

11:58

years and oh my god thing as you mentioned,

12:00

Yeah, but I got sleep up here

12:02

as well.

12:04

So I had like breathing issues as a kid from twenty

12:06

sixteen.

12:06

I have to sleep with a sleep apparatus and

12:09

yeah, and that was the first time I should

12:11

understood what sleep was and for

12:13

me to like even with the sleep apparatus

12:16

kind of sleep, I couldn't sleep. My mind was just

12:19

why, yeah, why my body was

12:22

chancing up like yeah,

12:24

So like people think like it's easy to come

12:26

off, but you've got like a psychological

12:29

dependence where your mind wants it,

12:31

and then you've got a body where your body

12:33

physically needs it, and you know

12:35

it's gone through to draw your emotions.

12:37

Everything is going crazy and your body is craving

12:39

it. You know.

12:40

There's one where I'll give you a perfect example where that

12:43

was the first time where I got, I

12:45

mean, I got addicted to something. Was this

12:47

is during back. It was two thousand and eighteen

12:50

where I split with my partner

12:53

and I couldn't sleep, and like

12:55

the next three months, I got my hands on Xanax

12:57

and I was taking Xanax tablets knocked

13:00

out and without even realizing my

13:02

body becomes sort of becoming dependent on it.

13:04

And and

13:07

during this price, I went like I stopped and this is like

13:09

I remember this as clear as day.

13:11

Just I said I'll stop taking this.

13:13

And the next two days I just

13:15

couldn't sleep and I was just like what it was just going

13:18

nuts and made my fingers. My mind was like my

13:20

mom was tired, but it was like okay, okay,

13:22

he wasn't craving anything, but my body

13:24

was just shaving.

13:25

And I was like, the fuck's going on that ax?

13:28

And I went and told saw a doctor and

13:31

and I had explained I don't have what the fuck's going on

13:33

with me?

13:33

And you know, what did you? What have you done

13:36

that's different?

13:37

And he goes, oh, I stopped taking

13:39

xanax and.

13:41

He goes xanax. He goes yeah,

13:43

he goes, you stop telling what

13:46

just called it? Yeah?

13:48

He goes, you know that's equivalent to coming

13:50

off heroin. And I looked at him and

13:52

he goes, no, you shouldn't. I'm like, and I

13:54

went sit there and I'm like, this is this is strange.

13:57

So this is this is this is another form of addiction people

13:59

don't understand. Is like my mind,

14:01

I can look at it and not take it, but

14:03

my body was like all the withdrawals.

14:06

So this is where it comes out with drugs as well. People

14:08

don't realize like there's like two different there's like

14:10

two different addiction factors where your

14:13

mind can be addicted to something or your body or both.

14:16

And yeah, I was full

14:18

on like my body. I would say, I'll

14:20

come back to inside.

14:21

What took me? This is

14:23

realistically three months too.

14:26

In jail, it took you three months.

14:28

Sort of can't like to sort.

14:29

Of come down, calm down a

14:31

bit.

14:32

And then after that six another

14:34

three months after that, so six months to sort

14:37

of sort of stabilize a bit.

14:39

So it wasn't so jumping.

14:41

You were leveling out about There's

14:44

a long time to come off the drug,

14:46

isn't it.

14:46

So anyone that's watching this, if you're taking

14:49

like like heavy drugs for a long period of time,

14:51

it's don't be disheartened. And

14:53

also this is for the people who try not understand

14:55

that they've got friends of family and.

14:59

Don't taken heavy drugs for a long period of

15:01

time.

15:01

To just bear in mind is the fact

15:03

that when they're coming off with they're very,

15:06

very like you know, they're very

15:08

fragile and their

15:10

mind's going fucking absolutely nuts.

15:13

And this is three months so that they're going to so

15:15

that people need to understand. This is three months of them trying

15:17

to do that, and then another third three months

15:19

is sort of sales. Is six months where you get

15:22

to look after them. It's definitely tough

15:24

road. And wow, I

15:27

can understand why most people would not

15:29

don't want to borrow. Borrow you like is

15:31

because you're using and then you're coming off

15:34

and you're trying to fix yourself and you're going like this, and

15:36

you know that you've got friends and family or whoever.

15:38

I just they to support you.

15:39

But it gets really extremely

15:42

draining like for them, and it's really hard

15:44

for them attack And that's what sort.

15:45

Of people think, you know, And I think

15:48

Harns, you would be the perfect person to help

15:51

anyone who is

15:53

you know, who is saying I really

15:55

want to be off this stuff, because

15:57

you understand because a lot of

15:59

the doctors and that they

16:01

don't know what to do. They don't know what to

16:04

do with all these people addicted to

16:06

the drugs. They say, I want to get off, but they don't

16:08

know what to do and how to.

16:10

You know, there's all these.

16:12

Rehab centers and they go into rehab and then they

16:14

come out, and then they get back to

16:16

their friends, and then they get it again and

16:18

then then yes, it's

16:20

really hard to know with the system

16:22

right now, what do they do with everyone?

16:24

They're so really I agree now it's

16:26

it's definitely it's an interesting take.

16:28

So, I mean, you've done it.

16:30

You're your living proof, like you've completely

16:32

turned your life around. You look amazing,

16:35

You're so fit, you're so healthy. Is to my

16:37

listeners if you you know, when

16:39

you see this episode, you'll see a photo of hearts.

16:42

He's so fit and he's a picture of health.

16:44

But and you've been able to do it, so you can

16:46

do it. There are people that get

16:48

off ius, So anyone who's listening, you

16:51

can do it. But you're

16:53

going to need a lot of support and you're going to need

16:55

professional help. Harns, you did

16:57

it because you were locked up and you have a strong

16:59

mind and you just had no choice. Yes,

17:02

you had no choice, but you know you

17:04

hear stories hands even get drugs in

17:06

jail. But can you like

17:08

you didn't you just went you

17:11

just went right enough this stuff

17:13

I saw all your writings of Actually, everyone is

17:15

listening. I've seen incredible writings

17:18

that Hans did in jail.

17:20

He sat and he wrote, and he wrote

17:23

and he wrote and he wrote and he

17:25

wrote. So you busied your

17:27

mind that way. Incredible. I've

17:30

never seen I'm talking like books

17:33

and books and books and books. Hans just wrote,

17:35

like back at school when we used to write

17:37

lines, I must not talk in school,

17:40

Hans wrote like I'm

17:42

talking like, I've never seen anything

17:44

like it, because he was focused. It

17:46

was focused on you

17:49

know, it was was like writing lines. Wasn't it

17:51

your books that you did, Yes, yes,

17:53

find out the line like it was like you were

17:56

willing yourself to be focused

17:59

and clean and reformed.

18:01

Incredible. It's an incredible story.

18:04

And I know I

18:07

know why now, back when I think

18:09

back at school where I was sat and

18:11

made right lines, you

18:13

have to do one hundred lines. I will not talk.

18:17

You're telling your you're giving

18:19

yourself affirmations to your brain.

18:21

Yes, you're pretty much brainwashing.

18:23

Brain washing, you brainwashed yourself.

18:25

Basically, it's an incredible story.

18:28

Arms and I

18:30

you know, I don't understand.

18:32

I mean, I don't understand,

18:36

but it's it's an absolute problem.

18:39

The problem massive problem.

18:41

It's absolutely in.

18:43

What would you say to say someone

18:45

who's young and

18:48

that's listening youth and

18:50

they're they're out in the world, partying

18:53

and they see it come up

18:55

in a social situation, What wisdom

18:58

would you say to them?

19:00

What wisdom I can say to them?

19:01

All not

19:03

even try, don't even think about

19:05

it.

19:06

I'm going to try and think of a different approach because normally

19:08

people say similar line. So it's

19:12

one thing that people need to understand is the

19:14

fact that it's common knowledge.

19:16

Now, it's outdown the street. It's more than ever. Line's out

19:18

there, and it's more accessible easily.

19:20

It's all there, and it's it's even cheaper now this day

19:22

and age. And

19:25

the fact that back in my time.

19:27

Though those where there's only a small group,

19:29

and now it's like it's almost like a normal

19:31

thing now that it's like it's like a normal thing.

19:33

And what I can say if if you come

19:36

across it and you're a young child.

19:37

You know, young version, I

19:39

can I can sit here and explain, don't

19:42

do it, and so forth, but just have

19:44

a think about when you see it. You

19:47

know, if you can say, you know, that's fantastic, but just

19:49

you need to look at it, and you have to actually

19:53

very much. You can brainwash yourself to attach so

19:55

much pain to that so I

19:57

cannot do this. Reason why it is because

20:00

is I've seen my friends or family, I've

20:02

seen people on the internet and movies and

20:05

spoil down. And that's the one

20:07

thing I'd say is you have.

20:08

To actually actively massively

20:10

just not choose not to do and

20:14

knowing the fact that you have to do a bit of like you

20:16

can say like future sight visualizing.

20:18

If I do this now and within a number of years, this is

20:20

what's going to be me where you're with

20:22

no teeth in jail and

20:26

do whatever it is to what it takes.

20:27

Yes, so Hans with the

20:30

governments at the moment, it's a lot in

20:32

the breasts and stuff some

20:35

governments, you know, like going to say

20:38

festivals or whatever. Back in my

20:40

day when I lived in London or whatever, it was like

20:44

you know, ecstasy everywhere. They were like

20:46

five quid or whatever. So do

20:48

you think it's a I mean, I

20:50

actually do, But do you think it's a good

20:52

idea to have kill testing

20:54

at you know, like at

20:58

festivals and things where where out

21:01

you know, there has been lots of festivals where

21:03

people can go and get a pill tested and

21:05

check whats you're taking. Yes, I

21:08

agree with that both the youth they're going

21:11

to try some of the youth.

21:13

By one hundred percent agree even if

21:16

as far as goes in the nightlife scene, they

21:19

should have a store.

21:20

They should have okay, pill testing.

21:23

Why is because the drugs out there this day and age

21:25

is they put everything

21:27

in it now so like it's not when they sell pills,

21:30

I say it's as pills, but.

21:32

Heaps of stuff.

21:33

And one of the common ingredients people

21:35

don't realize they put ice in

21:37

pills and coke what so for

21:40

why is because a grand

21:43

if you put that one point one of a grand of

21:45

ice in a pill in

21:47

a pill, or cocaine man or

21:49

like not even that small amounts with

21:52

a pill like you obviously put a lot small

21:54

amounts of obviously the whatever they sull for

21:56

it and and it gives you that awake

21:59

and alert and so times because

22:01

when you take certain drugs, they do certain different

22:03

things. And with ice, it gives

22:05

you energy, it gives you that euphoria, gets

22:08

you moving, gets in that and that's what they

22:10

put in there.

22:11

Because people who take like you know, for instance, with cocaine.

22:13

When you have proper cocaine, it's not like it's

22:16

like a stimming You get up and go and you just feel good,

22:18

happy and just real chatty. And

22:21

with cocaine a day and age is when you take it,

22:23

you get like anxiety and you're freaking rushing

22:26

around and people start thinking this is

22:28

the cocaine.

22:29

So it's like being laced with something.

22:31

Lace, it's laced with ice, and people conception

22:34

between having So.

22:35

When people have proper cocaine,

22:38

this is this isn't okay, Well this is because I feel

22:41

good, but I just I just don't feel

22:43

like getting up and charging around well

22:45

fucking because there's no it's not been put like

22:47

lace into ice or a form of stimulant

22:50

in it.

22:51

So this is the way that's.

22:52

Good to advise. That's good advice

22:54

too. You don't really know what you're getting.

22:57

You don't know and at the end of the day, like

23:00

every single deal, everyone's all

23:02

going to say I have the best stuff.

23:06

There's nothing this is it is one hundred percent

23:08

whatever the drugs is selling and

23:11

you know from there. And the thing is with these dealers,

23:13

a lot of them they just take word

23:16

from the person they get it off.

23:17

And that's what happens.

23:18

It's just they just go down and chain or obviously

23:21

that person decides to do something dirty, fair

23:24

enough, but that this is what happens, and this is where things go down

23:26

here.

23:26

This is where od's happen.

23:29

Well, people start having bad reactions to

23:31

certain drugs, and yeah,

23:34

this is one thing I would highly recommend

23:36

is definitely a.

23:38

Form of safe testing somewhere.

23:40

YEA not love seeing vessels all

23:42

that, just because at the end of the day,

23:44

drugs is always going to be out there.

23:46

And that's good. That can

23:48

potentially save lives.

23:51

And you know, it's it's a harsh reality

23:54

where you can tie everything you want to

23:56

try and stop it, but it's going it's always

23:58

going to be there.

23:59

And are you so are you so glad

24:01

you're pasted all that now? Hans, I'm

24:03

so glad I'm pastor I'm

24:05

past that with wisdom, I know

24:08

that their youth will always want to

24:10

have a good time and try things. But are you glad

24:12

you're pasted all that now?

24:14

You know? And one thing I could say is past

24:17

it's to be I feel like it's like it's

24:19

just felt like it was a big bad dream

24:23

someone.

24:23

Else's life, but

24:25

it's not it's your life. And and

24:28

you're so honest, and it's

24:31

you're lucky to be here, Hans. Honestly, you

24:34

are. You are incredible, you

24:36

are honest, you are happy.

24:39

You're always happy to try and help someone. If you

24:41

hear that there's someone that's addicted to ICE,

24:43

feel like I can, I can talk to them, I

24:45

can get through to them. You're you know, I

24:48

think you definitely

24:50

have a bit of a life calling to help

24:53

others. I know you've

24:55

got some new things coming, which hopefully

24:57

down the track, we've going to do another podcast

24:59

on becau as I would love to reveal what's

25:02

ahead for hearts. But you

25:05

know, I already know you're helping youth. You

25:09

help as much as you can. You've got so much to

25:11

give. And I really admire

25:13

you for the hands because I don't I've

25:15

never had anyone I can ask about

25:18

ICE, but I have friends that

25:21

have family members really

25:23

in the groups of ICE and have been for a very

25:25

long time. And and it's

25:30

it's I can count

25:32

three four people on my hand now, and

25:34

that's sad that I know, you know

25:37

personally family

25:39

members that are being affected, you

25:42

know, and the people that are in

25:44

their fifties and still on it,

25:46

still on it. It's never

25:48

been able to get off it. Yeah, you

25:51

know, it's

25:53

awful. It's awful. And you

25:57

know, I see people like you know, just around

25:59

when I'm around, and I straight away recognize

26:01

it. I'm like, oh gosh, they're on ie, you

26:04

know what. Like some people probably

26:06

wouldn't recognize it, but I do because I know

26:08

the science, and you do

26:10

because you've live been there, so you

26:13

know more than anyone. Yeah,

26:15

but yeah, I think I

26:18

think you know, you

26:20

did it, so anyone

26:23

can do it. I think if they've got the total

26:25

wheel to do

26:27

it, they can get off the drug. But

26:30

as you said, it took what six months.

26:32

Of six months to

26:35

stabilize. But I would

26:37

say to fully Pully, I would

26:39

say recovered. I'm felt comfortable. I would say

26:41

eighteen months or.

26:42

Twelve you weren't recovered to

26:44

eighteen months?

26:45

Really eighteen months, so six months the way I started

26:47

to stabilizable. And then I'd

26:50

say a year and a half, so another twelve months on top of

26:52

that, whereas I felt like myself was

26:54

back to like a good baseline and I could feel

26:56

myself wow, And

26:59

that was that's like, this is the heart of real

27:01

out of anyone musing drugs, and that is

27:04

it's not simple as just coming off and off

27:06

you go like your body was being

27:08

in certain a certain kindition, certain states. So it takes

27:11

that period of time for it to calm down and come back

27:13

to a baseline.

27:14

And where would you advise if

27:17

anyone's listening, a family

27:19

is listening and they want

27:22

to hear this podcast because of their son,

27:24

daughter or whatever. Where because

27:27

it's very hard. It's so hard

27:29

for parents. I'm sure it was hard for your

27:32

mum. Where where do you

27:34

suggest The first point of call is

27:36

to go for help.

27:38

Help, So if I was in

27:40

that position, because with me, I went to jail, so

27:44

I was the first foremost you need to persons

27:47

whoever was using is to accept that

27:49

you have an issue.

27:51

I wouldn't say like the word that.

27:52

When they use the word addiction, you sound it's like a to

27:55

me person, it sounds like an ugly word

27:57

and a lot of you get little like

28:00

sort of like beginning denial about it, you know,

28:02

use it that will I have an issue where I'm using

28:05

way too much and it's affecting me to

28:07

the point where I can function I'm

28:09

doing breaking end tos or whatever you may be doing your

28:12

family, And this is where you

28:14

need to think about

28:16

going fuck. Well, for me to come off how much am I take?

28:18

I need to wind down slowly and accept

28:20

the fact that this is going to be a

28:23

very long road. And you know most

28:25

people, a lot of people here that take months

28:27

to years to recover from this. When

28:29

you know that when you wind down, and this is where

28:32

you can say, seek for professional help,

28:34

but at the same time be mindful

28:37

as well, like people will come and

28:39

help you for sure one hundred percent, but

28:41

also when you're going through the withdrawals.

28:43

And that it is very fulling and very intensive to

28:45

try your best to.

28:48

Like learn to vent and stuff, but you can't make

28:50

sure you don't go over the top because if you go over

28:52

the top, you're scared your friends and

28:55

family and all the helpers away as well. And

28:58

one thing I can say is at

29:00

the end of the day, no one is really going to say

29:02

and you You've got people that will come and support you. But

29:05

so you have to become your own

29:07

hero of your own journey.

29:08

And you do yourself in Yeah.

29:12

So, like the number one

29:14

fact is what I learned was with mine is

29:17

a couple of months, and you are going

29:19

to go through hell.

29:19

It is hell, and that's a fact. And

29:22

when you're having these each day, you'll have a good day, another

29:25

day a bad day. It's going to and vice versa. It's

29:27

going to be up and down, up and down like crazy.

29:29

Just remind yourself each day,

29:32

each even each moment, to remind

29:34

yourself that this is part of the journey. This is part of

29:36

the pain, this is part of the growing experience, This is part

29:38

of the transformation. And look

29:41

at you know whatever whatever, do things

29:44

that really gets you go and inspires

29:46

you. So for me, like

29:49

I was reading a lot of personal development, self development

29:51

books, looking at you know, inspiration.

29:53

I was watching you know, just superhero high

29:55

fashion superheroes, so I was watched superhero movies.

29:58

Going through that and

30:01

doing anything and listen.

30:02

One amazing token mechanism

30:05

for me was listening to a lot of music.

30:07

Like music was a very therapeutic to learn

30:09

then.

30:12

That also what else I use.

30:15

Going for walks, you know, just going in nature,

30:18

are connecting and this is where with

30:21

you as an individual, if you're coming off

30:23

this is the probably the hardest one of the

30:25

hardest things when you when you come when you're actually

30:28

off, is the fact that you

30:30

went from using every day feeling this

30:32

high and becomes a new baseline to

30:35

nothing completely still. So you from

30:37

being up here, you come back down here right

30:40

when you're down here. This is one thing

30:42

I had to learn was it's

30:45

the thing what you will know, it's called boredom.

30:51

Of what happens is you went from

30:53

feeling good all the time, applighs

30:55

and lows and you know, when you're in that scene, you

30:57

see drama and that becomes

30:59

you. And then when

31:01

you pull yourself, this is the fact that it's not just to

31:03

coming off when you put yourself out of that environment. So you went

31:05

from seeing doing breaking it, whatever it

31:07

is, doing this to violence,

31:10

druggle.

31:11

Whatever it is, to pour.

31:12

On yourself and your you're just sitting in your own space

31:15

and you're coming off and you get bored.

31:17

And this is the probably the hardest

31:19

thing for all people that laps is the

31:21

fact that this is what this

31:24

is reality. You're on a baseline and

31:26

when you've been using drugs for so long, it's

31:30

me personally, I said, well this this fucking

31:33

sucks, man. You

31:35

know, I'll give you an example, like for

31:38

me coming out of jail and

31:40

coming clean and stuff and just come

31:42

really adjusting back to side. It was very full on. That's

31:44

the story I can explain later on. And just I

31:47

remember walking with my friend. This

31:49

is a Sunday afternoon, Admiral lull bar,

31:51

like just just people

31:54

and this is this is a beautiful somehow afternoon like kids

31:56

and family running around like a like a

31:58

good amazing day like for normal

32:00

activities, normal people.

32:03

And I was walking with him and

32:05

I was like, fuck, I's just like is

32:08

this what? This is what? This is

32:10

what normal people do?

32:11

Normal?

32:12

There's normal. He goes because

32:15

because yeah, that was like this

32:17

is yeah, this is what everyone. I'm like, well, well

32:21

this this is fucking this, this is

32:23

this is ship. This is fucking boring man.

32:26

He turns around and goes go

32:29

boring like yeah, man, just like this is reality.

32:31

Like I said, this is reality. That's nothing wrong.

32:33

I'm just like I went from

32:36

in the drug worlds and drugs and violence,

32:38

and I was seeing one of.

32:41

In jail coming off and you

32:43

know, seeing all this all these things

32:45

and scenes and what comes with it.

32:48

Two now just

32:51

walking out here, I fund out

32:53

how to do the kids and beings running around and

32:56

this is like my conditioning and well my

32:59

body was conditioned to be in that state to see

33:01

those things.

33:01

And this is where most everyone,

33:03

this is what anyone that's used everyone

33:06

that used drugs that will all know.

33:07

This is the fact that being

33:09

that on that sort of state of mind for so period

33:11

and then come back to normality, it actually

33:14

is boring.

33:14

And this is where very

33:17

important.

33:18

Like most people don't talk about is

33:20

except the fact that this is what

33:22

happens, and you need to.

33:25

Learn to like you

33:27

do.

33:28

You have different forms that with to do a lot of meditation and

33:30

mindfulness and different things,

33:32

but you're going to retrain your mind.

33:34

So it's basically like you get up like your mind,

33:36

like you're going to train your mind again to

33:38

go this is

33:41

normality and this is awesome, Like

33:43

this is great contense. So for

33:45

me, I was like, well months,

33:47

I'm like turning my mind and you know

33:50

this is I would say, oh, honestly,

33:52

so this has been coming out of jail and nine

33:54

months to like fully adjust back to society.

33:57

Like fully integration

34:00

process is just on and just done.

34:03

Now I love this, Like me sitting here

34:05

now like talking to you, I

34:08

love it. Like my

34:11

old version of me will be like what

34:13

do you what do you fucking doing?

34:15

Man? You wouldn't not

34:17

inspiratual talk and whatever.

34:18

It is not hard

34:21

to go want and go like this is what when

34:23

you get that star in your mind, go just

34:26

just call up your dealer.

34:27

You can go to that you know drugs,

34:29

Say you've got some drugs.

34:30

Just go there and just

34:33

have a hit and chill out the mate, and then you can

34:35

do things.

34:35

And that's like, I'm.

34:40

So glad you're back to a normal

34:42

life. I love my normal life.

34:46

I couldn't actually think of anything worse,

34:49

you know, like it must be horrific

34:51

and you've done it

34:53

with so much grit and determination.

34:57

Do you have like a favorite saying

35:00

or anything, like is there a

35:02

life mantra or motto that got

35:04

you through all this? Like you've

35:07

had so many writings. Is there something

35:09

that like a little saying

35:11

that you think, Oh, that's

35:13

that's my saying that got me through.

35:15

My saying is no

35:18

one is going to save you.

35:21

You have to become your own authentic

35:24

hero.

35:25

Well, I love it, I love it. Song

35:28

What about a song? What about if

35:30

there's a song that describes harms

35:33

what would it be or if any of your friends or

35:36

would say, oh, that song is harms.

35:40

Actually I do love my I

35:43

do with me my phone one of my best

35:45

for I love enjoying

35:47

expressing myself and it's a great mechanism

35:51

through like dancing and music. So my

35:53

favorite, like my song is what I always tay that

35:55

on if I really want to pop myself up

35:58

to get some fine or really break it down,

36:00

it's Destination Calber.

36:04

It's what

36:06

is it called, Alex Guido Destination

36:08

Calbery?

36:10

What?

36:11

Sorry, it's actually Destination I

36:13

know him.

36:15

Oh that how does that go? Destination?

36:17

I know it? Oh

36:20

yeah, yeah yeah. And

36:23

it's like a dad song. Oh

36:25

my god, that is so you.

36:29

When I think of you, when I think of Hans

36:33

I see him sometimes on

36:35

some social media. When I think of Hanns,

36:37

I think everyone was come for fighting.

36:41

You should say him that cat was

36:43

fast and he's like, you

36:45

know, does sort of like kickboxing

36:47

and whatever. He's So that's

36:50

my song for you.

36:52

I know you've got your song.

36:53

I've got my song for you because you have

36:55

transformed yourself and it's

36:58

an absolute honored to have you agree, and

37:00

I would like to invite you

37:02

back because I know you've got some news

37:07

coming your new adventure

37:10

and business down the track, so I want to follow

37:13

you up arms because I think it's

37:15

a great story. You've gone

37:18

from basically junkie

37:20

drug dealer coming off

37:22

drugs, transforming yourself to basically

37:25

a fitness fitness

37:28

freak. You are looking at you,

37:30

you know, maybe

37:32

maybe for pure grit, I have to put a photo of parts

37:35

in his in his dick

37:37

toms or something.

37:38

So I'm

37:40

just joking.

37:42

Just show that you have transformed

37:44

yourself, like you look like a picture of

37:47

health, and I can imagine how

37:49

you looked as a junkie and it's not how

37:51

you look at incredible.

37:54

You'd be surprised, like just you

37:57

know, having that you become a junk you lose like

37:59

you.

37:59

Just tip whether away. And this

38:01

is one thing I do, Like I say, is anyone that's

38:04

with it a way lose a lot of weight and stuff. It's

38:06

you come on off if you can pull it off.

38:09

One of the best forms of replacing

38:12

your habit is going

38:15

to the gym and training, having eating a healthy life

38:17

size exercise. Yeah,

38:19

and that it becomes a great form of like you

38:22

see yourself physically changing. You feel

38:24

fit and healthy, active, you have a lot of energy,

38:26

and it's a great, good replacement. So

38:29

definitely one thing I'll highly advocate is going

38:31

to the gym and training or find

38:34

something that's a physical exercise. You

38:36

know, it's this is one of the tough journeys.

38:39

Once you recovered, fully

38:41

recovered, you have to actually replace with

38:44

other hobbies otherwise it will just be

38:46

just amount of time for you've.

38:47

Fallen back into its

38:50

Thank you so much for being on pure great and

38:52

I will follow you up so I

38:54

will hunt you down again. And

38:58

I thank you for all

39:00

your honesty because

39:03

it's you know, it's not easy to I

39:05

think it's fantastic you are completely recovered,

39:07

because people that aren't recovered won't

39:10

admit what where

39:12

they've been and where there you have And

39:15

I if I had a hat, I take my hat off

39:17

to your arms, and I'm

39:20

your biggest cheerleader because I'm so

39:22

proud of you, and it's it's been

39:25

great that I've got to meet you and thank

39:27

you for talking about drugs

39:29

and ice and you know, it's a

39:32

big issue and it's a topical

39:34

issue too with a lot of people, and

39:36

a lot of people don't understand and

39:39

you do, and you've got sympathy. I know you have

39:41

sympathy for people who are in the grips

39:43

of it at the moment.

39:45

Yes, I'd help the number of people and I do

39:47

what I can as well.

39:48

Thank you, Hans, Thank you for being

39:50

on Pure Grit.

39:52

Thank you so much. And I love you.

39:54

Thank you. I love your questions and everything. It's

39:57

so good. Thank you so much.

39:58

Everyone was gone fighting.

40:04

Thank you for coming on.

40:06

Maybe you know in the YouTube I do come back

40:08

on. Maybe we should have that as to intro.

40:16

Thank you Han, thanks for coming on.

40:20

Well there you go. Thanks for listening to

40:22

Pure Grit with Paula McGrath. Now the

40:24

webcoud has been a very busy boy. You

40:27

can now visit the website pure Grit dot

40:29

com dot au, search Pure Group podcast

40:31

on Facebook and Instagram for the fun behind the

40:33

scenes stuff. And I was wondering why

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paul had started wearing makeup. It turns

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out all the chats are now on YouTube as well, so

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make sure you give that a subscribe.