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all at chemist's warehouse stores today. Hey,

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I'm Indi Clinton and this is

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Sleep Deprived, a podcast where I

0:21

dive into all the unspoken parts

0:23

of life, including relationships, friendships, beauty

0:25

and motherhood. This is Life Unfiltered,

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Sleep Deprived and Running Off caffeine.

0:49

Hello and welcome to Sleep Deprived.

0:52

I am here today with the

0:54

amazing John from MAPS. Welcome, John.

0:57

It is very good to be here. Welcome,

0:59

John. Well, John is a, I

1:01

want to say you're a relationship expert, am

1:03

I right? That's the one. So I've been doing

1:05

this for about 30 years, close to, and generally

1:09

speaking, I see singles and couples and

1:12

I'm looking to teach

1:14

them what they're doing wrong and then

1:16

how to put it right. You know the

1:18

field David, I'm sorry, I didn't even introduce

1:21

you, Benjamin. I'm also here with my husband.

1:23

I did find that interesting that she forgot about it.

1:25

Oh my God. We'll get into that later, right? No,

1:28

I'm so sorry. I'm here with

1:30

my beautiful husband as well, but I

1:32

was obviously introducing John from MAPS first

1:34

because he is going to be the

1:36

one that picks apart our relationship. Not

1:38

really. I actually want to get into

1:41

talking to you today kind of about

1:43

relationships and how they change when you

1:45

have kids. My first

1:47

question to you today is though, this one

1:49

could be a tough one. What should come

1:51

first, your marriage with your husband or your

1:53

relationship with your kids? I

1:56

would say marriage with your husband. You

1:59

need to really. prioritize what's going on

2:01

between you and Ben, because if

2:04

that is going well, then

2:06

that generalizes to the kids. You

2:09

know, kids catch stress. So

2:12

if you guys are arguing

2:14

or there's tension or you're

2:16

incredibly anxious, that really filters

2:18

on down to your little

2:20

ones. So what

2:23

I say to couples, once they've had

2:25

kids is you must prioritize your marriage

2:27

or your relationship ahead of the kids

2:30

so that you keep your bond, you keep that sense

2:32

of connection and the

2:35

kids benefit from that. It's probably the

2:37

harder thing to do, right? It might

2:39

be an easier excuse to be preoccupied with

2:41

the kids and spend all the time with

2:43

the kids and not have

2:46

the attention with the couple. And

2:48

I think that's generally what happens. People just,

2:50

you know, and, you know, when you have

2:52

your first child, it's like an explosion goes

2:54

off in the relationship and all your focus

2:56

goes on this, this little,

2:58

you know, being and you

3:02

forget about one another. And because it's a new

3:04

experience, you're kind of a novice. You don't know

3:06

how to do it right. So that even kind

3:09

of forces you to put more focus into the

3:12

child. But that can

3:14

be a real problem for your

3:16

marriage. Yeah. And it's easy to

3:18

be aware of it. But how do you

3:20

think you can take those steps to, I

3:23

guess, border your marriage

3:25

or your relationship with your partner?

3:27

Because I feel like with us,

3:29

we're very aware that we lack

3:32

intimacy, lack sex, lack love.

3:34

But then I guess we're trying to love intimacy.

3:36

You know what I mean? Like we kiss in

3:38

the morning, we say I love you. But how

3:41

do you really show that and make each other

3:43

feel loved? Do you believe in love languages? I

3:46

mean, that's a very well known sort

3:49

of format when you're thinking

3:51

about relationships,

3:54

what your love language is, you

3:56

know, is it, you know, gifts,

3:58

is it words of affirmation, is

4:02

it physical touch? And so

4:04

it's not a bad theory

4:07

to look at, you know, because often

4:09

you'll have different love languages and you've

4:11

got to know what your partner really

4:13

responds to and then hit that mark

4:15

if you're going to increase that connection.

4:18

I don't mind that at all. People talk to

4:21

me about love languages, you know,

4:23

a lot, but at the end of the

4:25

day, what you've got to do is think

4:28

about making your

4:30

relationship really intentional.

4:33

So every day you've got to be doing

4:35

little things often to

4:37

bring each other close. And

4:41

if you do that, and I'm not

4:43

talking flowers once a month, I'm talking

4:45

little things. We'll go into this, you

4:50

know, through the podcast. But ultimately,

4:52

you want to be doing these little

4:54

things that bring your partner close on

4:57

a daily basis. And

4:59

I say to people, look, you know, good

5:02

sex, you know, comes

5:04

from goodwill. So you've got to create a

5:06

lot of goodwill outside of the bedroom. You're

5:09

not thinking about techniques and

5:11

toys, you know, under the covers. You

5:13

want to be thinking about, okay, what

5:15

can I do outside of the bedroom

5:18

that's going to bring my

5:20

partner close? Little things. So

5:22

what's a little thing? Because

5:24

it's hard when the partner goes to work, right? So

5:26

you only have a small window to, I guess,

5:29

do those little things when you've got kids

5:31

to worry about. So what's something little? Well,

5:33

there's loads of little things that can bring each

5:35

other close. But one thing I'll kick off with

5:37

is the idea that at the end

5:39

of the day, you got

5:42

to sit down when the kids have gone to bed,

5:45

put the phones down, close the

5:47

computers, stop

5:49

watching maths, and pour

5:53

a glass of wine and

5:56

debrief about the day. But

5:58

the way you debrief about it, just for 20 minutes, 10 minutes each, it's

6:01

fine. But

6:03

the way you do it is so important. Indie

6:05

kicks it off. She's gonna tell you about all

6:07

the stresses in her day, from

6:09

running late to what the kids

6:11

did, to something at work or

6:13

some troll came at her on

6:15

social media. And

6:19

what you do Ben is you listen, but

6:21

you don't fix. You

6:24

side with her, you empathize

6:26

with her. So you might say

6:28

something like, oh, that's been

6:30

a tough day. I get that, that's tough.

6:33

But you never give her a solution, you never

6:35

give her advice, and you

6:37

certainly don't side with the

6:40

person outside of her. And

6:43

then when you've done that, you

6:45

flip it. It's hard not to fix, right? It's

6:47

really hard not to fix. And ask guys Ben,

6:49

let's be honest. You guys are fixes. We tend to

6:51

love to fix. I'm like, what happened? Okay, well fuck

6:54

that person up. Or whatever it is, like how

6:56

do we fix this? It's

6:59

in our DNA. And

7:01

imagine me as a relationship expert, during

7:04

the day I go home to see my wife

7:06

and she's venting about all the things in a

7:08

day. My tendency is to jump in

7:10

and fix, but I can't do

7:12

that. I've got to empathize, I've got to side

7:14

with her and

7:18

never give her a solution. So if I sit

7:20

there and I say, yes,

7:22

that sounds okay. Yeah, I

7:25

get it, that's tough. I

7:27

don't feel from my perspective that I'm

7:30

really buying into that. But I

7:33

get it, right? By me trying to fix, I

7:35

feel like I'm buying in and I'm helping and

7:37

I'm in it with you and I'm getting that

7:39

across to you. But it's quite the opposite, right?

7:42

It's actually sabotages it. And Indi, what

7:44

if I said to you, what's the problem with him

7:46

trying to fix, you know, you venting about your day?

7:50

I don't want, I just want someone to listen. I

7:52

don't. Because I

7:54

can fucking fix it. I'm an independent woman. I can fix,

7:56

I'm not coming to you for me. Yeah, girl. Yeah,

7:59

girl, I'm more coming. to you just

8:01

to listen and be all ears because I've had kids

8:03

around me all day, I've had no one listening and

8:06

so I just want you to listen. Will you

8:08

say that regularly to me? You're like, I just

8:10

want to have an adult conversation with someone. You

8:12

can always say, hey, this is a listening conversation,

8:14

not a fixing conversation. You're listening ears. But

8:17

let me tell you, you then also

8:19

got to give Ben the opportunity to

8:21

vent about his day and you can't

8:24

dish out solutions either. Oh, I don't

8:26

because often your problems are really big in an industry

8:28

that I don't know about. So you

8:30

tell me I'm like, oh, but I usually don't want to

8:32

go there. Like she'll go, what happened to work today? And

8:34

I'm like, I don't want to

8:36

relive it or you'll find it boring. So

8:39

I just don't. Okay, you need to. And

8:42

the reason you need to is because the

8:44

second thing that you can do to bring

8:46

people close is by asking

8:48

questions about their day, not just

8:51

a surface level, but going deep. So

8:53

she needs to know who you met

8:55

at that meeting. When you went

8:57

to that lunch, what did you order? Oh, the

8:59

lunch. What sort of wine did you have with

9:01

the lunch? How long did it go for? Who

9:04

really, you know, annoyed you over that meeting? If

9:06

I talk about my lunch, she gets really jealous

9:09

that she's not at lunch with me. And then

9:11

you can you can deal with that at another

9:13

time. What she needs to know and what you

9:15

need to know when you're asking her questions is

9:17

you need to deep dive about all the little

9:19

details. Because too

9:22

often what couples do when they have kids is

9:24

how's your day fine? You go fine and that's

9:26

it. You're off and that's no good.

9:28

You disconnect then. So little questions,

9:30

but lots of specifics need to come

9:32

out. Rather than people

9:34

feeling like this is boring. What they're going to do

9:37

is they're going to go, oh, I feel closer to

9:39

being. Oh, I didn't know that

9:41

he really likes, you know, that sort of wine

9:43

or I'd love to go to a restaurant like

9:45

that one with him on my own. I think

9:47

so. All of that is basically

9:50

a glue and you understand

9:52

each other's inner world. The more you understand

9:54

it, the closer you get. It's

9:56

interesting you say that because I actually feel like I'm

9:58

really good at asking you questions. to the

10:00

point where you think I'm

10:03

interrogating. So I

10:05

say, where did you go for lunch? What did you

10:07

eat? Who did you go with? And then you think,

10:10

why are you asking me these questions? And I'm like,

10:13

because I just ate my kids' fucking

10:15

scraps off their sandwiches for lunch.

10:17

Is that his trauma? Does he have trauma or

10:20

something? No, no, it's not about trauma. He's just

10:22

saying, and I've heard this many times, I

10:25

don't wanna talk about that stuff, because it's boring. She's not

10:27

gonna really be into it. Or

10:29

it's not important. I don't wanna

10:31

sort of burden her with

10:36

dissecting a two hour meeting with

10:39

some guys that were really boring. But

10:43

you've gotta do it, because information

10:45

creates that sense of knowing what's

10:47

going on. Let's go here. Like

10:49

we do have date night. Oh,

10:52

we do. Most Fridays. And

10:54

then we get to the table and I start asking

10:56

about work. And he's like, I don't wanna talk about

10:58

work. And I'm like, okay. She

11:01

says, I don't know about your work. Do you wanna talk about your

11:03

work this week? And I'm like, no, not really. And

11:05

then we're like, okay, so what are we talking

11:07

about? No, we do find things to talk about.

11:09

But it is, I find at the end of

11:11

the week when it's just me and him, the

11:14

last thing I wanna talk about is work and

11:17

what's going on and who's in my email. Cause I'm like,

11:19

I've just clocked out for the week at six PM on

11:21

a Friday. Let's not talk about work. So

11:24

then, okay, let's not talk about kids. Let's not talk

11:26

about work. What are we gonna talk about? So,

11:29

I mean, this is something

11:32

that you've gotta be doing every

11:35

day, not just once

11:38

a week. And these

11:40

little conversations that you're having at the end of

11:42

the day, debrief, that will really

11:44

flow into that date night. So

11:46

there'll be that sense of connection. Cause what you really

11:49

want as a couple is

11:51

to be able to say, look, regardless

11:53

how bad my days

11:56

been, I can bring that

11:59

to Ben. and he's got my

12:01

back. He's not gonna try and fix it. He's

12:03

gonna be in my corner. And

12:05

that is going to be that sense of,

12:08

you know, security and safety that I want.

12:10

And that'll just flow over into your conversations.

12:13

And you'll be asking little questions and that will

12:15

then make that date night very different for you.

12:17

Yeah. Yeah, interesting. Yeah, I can

12:19

say that. Another thing that you need to

12:22

be really careful on is

12:24

technology, you know, because this

12:26

is something that couples, you know, it's meant to connect

12:28

you. But actually the more

12:30

I've watched couples, technology can

12:33

disconnect them. So

12:35

the phone is a big one, obviously. And

12:38

one of the things that you two need to

12:40

realize is that when someone makes a bid for

12:42

attention, it might

12:44

be that Ben gets up and says,

12:47

"'Indy, where do I leave my keys?'"

12:49

Okay, that's classic, you know, bid for

12:51

connection. If you're on

12:53

the phone, what you don't wanna do is

12:56

ignore that because he starts

12:59

to feel, I don't matter. You

13:02

know, I'm feeling rejected here

13:04

and it erodes the bond. What

13:07

you gotta do with technology is when anyone ever

13:09

speaks to you, you wanna respond

13:12

back. You wanna put

13:14

the phone down, so what was that?

13:16

Yes, the keys, they're just over there

13:18

and then get back to it. So

13:20

you're constantly managing technology rather than letting

13:22

technology manage you. And

13:25

in your world, which you're living in, technology

13:27

is a big part of your life. So

13:30

if you're on the computer and someone says something

13:32

to you, stop what you're

13:34

doing, respond back all

13:37

the time. Yeah. And

13:39

you'd particularly see it in cafes, don't you?

13:42

Or restaurants. You'll have two couples and

13:44

their heads are down and the phones. We

13:47

actually notice that on date night and we're like, thank God,

13:49

we're not that couple. And then someone will say something

13:51

and the other person's like... And

13:55

they've literally rejected that bid for connection.

14:00

It's very important. Yeah, so true.

14:02

Yeah. But it's one that

14:04

people, I think nowadays, are finding very, very hard

14:07

to manage. Yeah. And

14:09

I think that definitely trickles down into your relationship

14:11

with your kids, always on your phone. You know,

14:13

like if you're playing with your kids or you

14:15

think you're being present with your kids, but then

14:18

you're constantly checking your phone. Yeah, that's right. Are

14:20

you really that present? I remember seeing

14:22

something, I was down at a park, you know, because

14:24

you take your kids to parks all the time. You're

14:26

just desperate to find something to do with them. And

14:29

I remember seeing a guy on his phone and

14:31

he was pushing his little girl on a swing

14:35

and she's trying to get his attention. He's just looking at his

14:37

phone the whole time, you know, and I thought, well, that's a

14:39

really clear example

14:42

of being disconnected with your kids.

14:45

And when they get a bit older, like my kids

14:47

are 14 and 12, they'll tell you, like,

14:49

if you're on the phone, they'll go, dad, hey, put

14:51

the phone down. What? Well, Navy

14:53

does that. Yeah. Sometimes.

14:56

He's like, dad, dad, put your phone down. Yeah. And

14:58

he feels so guilty for the rest of the day.

15:00

You're like, oh, my gosh. Another thing that you

15:02

guys need to do is catch each other when you're really good. So

15:05

what that means is I'm sure India does

15:07

lots of great things during the day. Amazing.

15:11

You'll see them, but you may not think

15:13

to point that out. So

15:16

it might be, I really love what you're doing

15:18

with this year or thanks so much for going

15:20

to that effort to do that today. Or

15:23

I love it as a mum, how you do this with the kids. And

15:26

praising her and praising her and

15:28

vice versa. You to Ben. Very

15:31

important because it's sort of just

15:33

it sort of fills up the

15:36

cup. Yeah. But what

15:38

you tend to do, if you're not spending

15:40

a lot of time together, you're not having

15:42

little conversations, technology is getting in the road.

15:45

You're not debriefing. Then

15:48

you catch each other when you're doing things

15:50

wrong. Yes. And you point

15:52

that out. You have this sort of

15:54

filter of, oh, India, why

15:56

couldn't you have done that? Why? Why

15:59

haven't you cleaned up today? or whatever it is.

16:01

Why did you say that on the

16:03

podcast? So you end up looking at it in

16:05

a very different lens. So

16:07

you've got to really force yourself to catch each

16:09

other when you're good and say it. But

16:12

not only that, what do you like at taking compliments,

16:14

Cindy? I love compliments,

16:16

I think. Do you say thank you? Or do

16:18

you downplay them and minimise them? I say

16:20

thank you. Good, and what do you like

16:22

at it? I mean, you don't compliment me much, but

16:25

when you do, I think I'm very appreciative. No,

16:27

you are. Because that's the other

16:29

thing I like. No, you are. You are appreciative. That

16:31

a lot of people- Not so much on, like, if

16:33

I say you look amazing today or something, you, yes.

16:35

But if it's like, thanks for

16:38

doing that, you're like, you don't

16:40

really acknowledge it. But

16:42

I think you think that's your service maybe, and you're like,

16:44

it's not, you know what I'm saying?

16:46

What's been like the compliments? I'm

16:49

really bad. He's responses, oh, you're just saying that.

16:52

I'm like, I have plenty of other

16:54

things I could say. Why would I just say that?

16:56

Okay, okay, yeah, yeah, so what that- Do I say

16:58

that? The reason why I bring that up is

17:00

because you don't wanna just

17:02

be complimenting someone and they are just dismissing it.

17:06

So if you hear something, you absorb it, and

17:08

you say, thank you. Don't

17:11

downplay it, don't minimize it. It's

17:13

interesting you say you don't wanna

17:15

focus on the bad all the time, the negative,

17:17

because I feel like in relationships,

17:19

you kinda have to treat them like a child,

17:21

because that's how I treat, you know how I

17:23

came to you and I said, let's stop focusing

17:25

on the bad things Naomi's doing, because it's just

17:27

reinforcing that in his head. Let's just praise

17:30

everybody does good things. And I feel

17:32

like that's how we should treat our relationship. No

17:34

more for it. I mean, I won't speak

17:36

to you like I speak to maybe, but- You

17:39

do some talk. I think a relationship after you

17:41

have kids is really important, because I mean, for

17:43

us especially, we've had three kids in the space

17:45

of four years. My hormones have been all over

17:47

the place for so many years. We're

17:50

coming back, but now it's kinda, we're living

17:52

in the house mate phase still, because we're

17:54

not sleeping in the same beds, because

17:57

we're sleep training one, so I'm in another bed,

17:59

I've got kids. that we really have no

18:01

time for connection, unless

18:03

it's once we put the kids

18:05

to bed, but then we're exhausted.

18:07

Literally exhausted. Like we're going to

18:09

bed at 8.39 o'clock late night.

18:11

That's why your skin looks so good. Yes, mate. No,

18:14

at 9 o'clock, we're like, I'm

18:17

not that tired, but I know I need to get into

18:19

bed because when the baby wakes up at 5

18:21

or 5.30 or if it sleeps

18:23

into six, I'm still gonna be extremely tired. So,

18:25

babe, let's go to bed. And

18:27

we give each other a kiss and we walk to the bed.

18:29

So what you're learning here is that, wow, we've got to use that

18:32

window in a really

18:35

important way. May not be

18:37

a long or large window, but

18:40

you've got to be doing things during that time

18:42

when the kids go to bed that really nourishes

18:45

your relationship, rather than

18:47

just giving each other a peck on the

18:49

cheek and going your separate ways. And

18:52

that's something that you probably weren't aware of, how

18:54

important that time is. The

18:56

other thing... We do do it. I

19:00

mean, I think we've got to be more conscious

19:02

of it and set it and religiously do it,

19:04

because it makes sense. But last night

19:06

we did it. Like, you

19:08

came, I was watching some Netflix

19:10

show about aliens or something. And then I paused

19:12

it and we had it, India

19:15

was brushing her hair and we just had a chat about

19:17

the day, which was amazing, right? It was really good. we

19:21

sit up at the bench and we chat and we... It's

19:23

just not every day. It's got to

19:25

be every day. Even if we're tired,

19:27

make the effort. Yeah, okay. The other thing, which

19:29

is really important for couples to know, but particularly

19:31

when you've had kids, is how

19:33

you bring up issues

19:36

is really important, how you communicate. So,

19:41

you know, on our show, Merritt, at first sight,

19:43

what you'll see is very

19:46

quickly, when we match our couples and they

19:48

get into the experiment, they aren't

19:50

very good communicators and they have very

19:53

toxic fight styles. So

19:55

when they have an issue, they bring it up with

19:57

a sledgehammer. You know, you always,

19:59

you never... their tone

20:01

is harsh and

20:03

it gets very toxic very quickly. But

20:07

as a couple, what you've got to realise, does

20:10

this sound familiar? She's a sledgehammer. Yeah. And

20:13

what you've got to realise is- I don't know, what's bigger than a sledgehammer,

20:15

I don't know, that's what she is. A bulldozer,

20:17

if she comes. A bulldozer, yeah. Hard. I'm

20:20

like a little piece of grass, like just

20:22

trying to grow and the bulldozer just. Yeah,

20:25

so what you've got to realise is how

20:27

you bring up an issue is really the

20:29

key. Not so much the content of it,

20:32

but it's more how you bring it up and

20:34

how you fight that's really important and you need

20:36

to do it gently. The

20:39

way you start is generally how it's going to go. So

20:42

if you come in with a sledgehammer and

20:45

go, Ben, you always run

20:48

late and you don't text me

20:50

and I can't believe that you've done it again. Now

20:53

he's not going to go, oh, that's lovely feedback. He's

20:57

going to get on the defensive and he's going to go at you.

21:01

And he's going to say, well, you always, and away you go. And

21:03

you get into this point scoring. I'm

21:05

right, you're wrong. You see that on our show all

21:07

the time. What

21:10

you want to be doing is when you've got an issue to bring up, you

21:12

want to think, okay, how am I going to bring this up? Because I've got

21:14

to stay gentle here. So you might

21:16

say something like, let's

21:18

say Ben's always on his phone. You

21:20

might say, hey, Ben, look, darling, I'm

21:23

feeling a little bit disconnected with

21:25

you. Because when we go to a

21:27

cafe, you're looking at your phone a lot. I

21:30

would love it if when we go

21:32

to the cafes that we could just put the phones

21:35

down and we can connect. And

21:38

he can hear that. Whereas

21:42

coming in hard and going, I can't believe

21:44

we went to that cafe again. You

21:47

forever looking at your phone,

21:50

I obviously don't mean anything to you. I've

21:52

got kids, you don't care about me. And

21:56

I'm just over you. He's

21:58

not going to hear that. So. how

22:00

you bring it up is so important. And

22:03

if you can do that and think, okay, if I bring it up

22:05

gently, it's gonna

22:08

go well. Good listening comes from good

22:10

speaking. Oh,

22:12

interesting. They're right for that. Yeah, wow.

22:15

Yeah, so if someone's not listening, it's probably because

22:17

someone's got a sledgehammer out and is going really

22:19

hard at them. Probably transfer

22:21

that to kids as well, right? That's right,

22:23

yeah, that's right, yeah. There's so much that,

22:26

and kids are a great little mirror, because

22:28

when we raise our voices, they're like, oh,

22:30

this is no good, I'm gonna withdraw from

22:32

this. Well, that tends to what happens with

22:34

couples. So

22:37

you need to remember that, that's very important. And

22:39

when you think about all these little, these

22:43

little, I guess,

22:45

tools or tips that I'm talking about today,

22:47

none of them are earth shattering, are they?

22:49

No. No. None of them

22:51

take a lot of effort. Yeah,

22:54

you're right. But what you have to remember is,

22:56

I've got to be doing these little things all

22:58

the time. I can't just

23:00

take Indy out for a

23:02

date night on a Friday. Other

23:05

way round, I take him out. Can't do that,

23:07

because think about all the little things I've mentioned that

23:09

haven't gone on during the week, and

23:11

now you're sitting across from each other, and

23:14

you resent the fact that we're not connected. So

23:16

you used to be disciplined, right? And what, it's

23:18

half an hour, right? I mean, do you guys go to the gym?

23:21

We do, but it's not that long. He makes me work out at home.

23:23

Well, that's okay. You guys saw really sad delicious, but you go to the

23:26

gym most days, because

23:28

you want to stay in shape, and you want to stay fit. And

23:31

now- Oh, but for this as well. Yeah,

23:33

absolutely. I'm the same. But

23:37

are you going to get that sort of benefit out

23:39

of it if you go to the gym

23:41

once a week? Yeah. It's

23:44

just not going to happen. You're not going to

23:46

get the shredded body that

23:48

he's got results. You're

23:52

not going to get that if you go once a week, and

23:56

you're going to go to the gym and eat burgers. Yeah, that's so true. So

23:58

you've got to think about your relationship intentional.

24:01

Now you guys have been together for how long? 2018, five

24:04

years. Nice.

24:07

Six years. Nice. Wait six

24:09

years? What? We've

24:12

been married how many? No no we got married in

24:14

2020. Yeah. But yeah we'll

24:16

together. Yeah 18. And

24:19

if you look at us right so obvious there's

24:21

an age gap between us. Yeah

24:23

no I didn't know that. I didn't know Ben's younger

24:25

than you. I'm

24:27

actually in my 40s. Would

24:31

you I mean I get a lot of questions

24:33

in my DMs about age gap relationships

24:36

and whether I would recommend them. But

24:38

it's quite hard for me to I guess speak

24:41

on that topic or respond back because to

24:43

me I don't really see age so when someone asks

24:45

me that I'm like I don't know what I'm recommending

24:48

like if you're in love you're in love it was

24:50

never a big deal to me but I guess other

24:52

people around us probably we get a lot of looks

24:54

on the street when we're just. Do we? I

24:56

don't notice. Don't bullshit you literally say to

24:59

me these people keep staring at us. That's because

25:01

they're looking at you. But

25:03

like I just think when we've got three

25:05

kids out and about people obviously like well

25:07

what's the dynamics here? I mean look I've

25:09

seen couples over you know the

25:12

years with bigger age gaps than that

25:15

it can work there's no problems with it. It's

25:17

just yeah it's just that the two of you

25:20

have to be on the same page. So

25:23

for instance it might you know you you

25:26

might have a different group of friends you

25:28

might have traveled more you might come into

25:30

the relationship with a different financial situation if

25:32

you're the older person. You

25:36

may have been in a relationship

25:38

when you were younger where you were married and now

25:41

you're not. So

25:43

there's all sorts of things that you know an older

25:45

person might bring in the younger person might bring in

25:48

you know a different set of friends

25:50

and different ideas and they haven't traveled

25:52

as much or they might have traveled

25:54

you know to places or are doing

25:56

things into hobbies and interests that are

25:58

very different to these. older person,

26:00

that's all great stuff. What

26:03

you just have to do is you just have to be on

26:05

the same page about kind of,

26:07

you know, how you manage it and,

26:10

you know, how you work

26:12

in with different sets of friends, your

26:15

different hobbies and interests, where you want to

26:17

travel, how you want to run your financial,

26:19

you know, sort of

26:21

management in the relationship. But

26:24

if you're all on the same page

26:27

with that and also your relationship expectations

26:29

around commitment and parenting and, you

26:31

know, your goals, one

26:33

year, five years, ten years, that's

26:36

all great. Suken

26:40

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26:42

with aromatic botanicals and oils to

26:44

gently cleanse and purify the body

26:46

without drying. Available at chemist warehouse

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stores nationwide. Well,

26:53

I think we were on the same page,

26:55

irrespective of age. We are, sorry. When we

26:57

got together, when I say were, when we

26:59

got together and decided to get married and

27:01

have a child, we were on

27:03

the same page, irrespective of the age gap.

27:05

Yeah. And I mean, India is

27:08

very mature for her age. I mean,

27:10

she's wise beyond her years. And

27:12

I mean, she's done a lot. I mean,

27:15

you had to grow up. She took that compliment just there, didn't she?

27:18

Yeah, thank you. I mean, you had to grow up very,

27:20

very quickly. And you're in the social

27:22

aisle from a very young age. So

27:25

I don't see the age. I mean,

27:27

it was always a topic when we

27:29

first got together amongst family and friends

27:31

and everyone, I guess. But now

27:34

I feel like it's non-existent.

27:36

No, no, but it's not.

27:38

It's not existent to us. I mean,

27:40

sorry. Yes. Which is what you want. And

27:42

that's, that's most important, right? I don't care

27:45

what everyone else is saying. That's right. That

27:47

doesn't affect us, which I think is, I think

27:50

that's most important for our relationship

27:52

to grow. I mean, I'm always

27:54

said, it's not now.

27:56

It's amazing. But it's when you're older,

27:58

when he's older, like. let's say you're 70

28:00

and I'm 50 something and I want to keep going

28:03

out to dinners and you're like no I just want

28:05

to stay at home that's when you'll notice it.

28:07

But he may not do that. No I reckon

28:09

you're gonna be like um who's that? He may

28:11

be young at heart. Who's that really hot old

28:13

guy on a boat that always always wears like

28:15

speedos and he has white hair really tan he's like

28:17

German and does dances. Yeah I

28:20

know that he can come across my

28:22

reel on occasions. Yes I reckon that's

28:24

gonna be him. I'd

28:27

love to be that. That's hot. I would

28:29

love you to be that. Yeah and

28:31

the fact that you've talked about it and that you

28:33

feel like well we're actually really on the same page

28:36

other people might have a problem or see it as

28:38

a difference but we don't that's

28:40

gold. That's where you want to be. Yeah.

28:43

So um do you think I'm not conscious

28:45

of the age gap and being

28:47

that old guy that doesn't want to go out that's

28:49

why I'm so conscious of like. No I

28:51

think you're very but sometimes I feel like you're overly

28:53

conscious of the age gap. You

28:55

know I just think something I have to bring

28:57

you back down to earth. I'm like just chill

29:00

who cares just let it nice just let it

29:02

just go. You know I did this thing called

29:04

what was it called someone told me on TikTok

29:06

what it was called where it's kind of like

29:08

therapy exposure therapy right. Okay so

29:10

I wasn't so much age but yeah well

29:12

it was because anyone in their 40s

29:16

would not wind down their windows and rap

29:18

and sing going through busy streets but because

29:20

I'm in my 20s I'm like you're doing

29:22

it and you're not going to feel awkward

29:24

about it so. There's more exercise in

29:26

not giving a fuck what other people

29:28

think. Yeah no I get that. And I

29:30

didn't know it was exposure therapy until I posted

29:33

a video and him doing it and I so

29:35

I would. So Ben did it. With me and I

29:37

think two of the kids. What was the song? What was

29:39

the song? It was cringy. It was like

29:41

girls just wanna have fun or

29:43

something like that. That wasn't my vibe.

29:45

That's coming in the right. So we're driving

29:47

around and all the windows are down and

29:49

we've got two of the kids in the

29:51

back. I'm pretty sure I was pregnant and

29:53

I was busy summer's day in Australia and

29:55

we're driving through and there'd be couples and

29:58

people and families walking and we would. like

30:01

we knew them. I would honk. So you

30:03

were attracting attention to yourself. Attracting attention. And

30:05

I would say, see it then. I

30:09

think it was a really great moment for you because

30:11

not only was it very liberating, it also kind

30:13

of taught you just to have fun and be in

30:16

the moment, which I think as you get older, you're

30:18

kind of rewired to be like,

30:20

I need to be more mature, I can't

30:22

do this, but because I'm younger and just

30:24

fun, I kind of bring

30:26

out the fun side in you. And that is one

30:28

of the great things about having an age gap.

30:32

There's plenty of great things about it. And

30:35

Ben may have some experiences because he's

30:38

older that you may not have come

30:40

across. And so it's like, oh, okay. And

30:43

a perspective on things that

30:45

can be really attractive. Yeah,

30:49

there's loads of good stuff. So I mean,

30:51

I'm excited. I don't

30:53

see that as an issue at all. What

30:56

I find a bigger issue is

30:58

if a couple is sitting in front of

31:00

me and they're not on the same page. Yeah. Yeah.

31:04

We had, I mean, for me, I've

31:06

been brought... Not so much

31:08

you've been brought into my world, which

31:11

you have, but I've been brought into her world

31:13

as well. So I was always very private.

31:17

And now... Oh, that's gone. No,

31:20

it's gone, right? So that's been

31:22

an adaptation that's happened over years now.

31:24

And I think I've... I'll

31:27

be guided by you, but I've finally kind of

31:30

given that away or given up worrying. Like, I

31:32

used to worry what clients would

31:34

think, what colleagues would think, you

31:36

know, because they have this window

31:38

into my life that

31:41

it's not usual, right? Not many other

31:43

people in my situation have this

31:46

or have these windows into their lives. So this

31:48

has been... A little unusual. Yeah, it's been kind

31:50

of hard. Not only is there an age gap,

31:52

there's also... Is it an entire life? Well,

31:54

there's a spotlight on the two of you that

31:57

most couples won't have. Yeah. And

31:59

I've certainly... found that as I've gone along

32:01

on the show is that now, you

32:04

know, my life is very public and

32:06

my kids are very aware of it.

32:09

So is my wife. So it's, it's, it is

32:11

something that you have to adjust to. What's

32:14

important, and this is another little thing that,

32:16

that will help you as a couple is that

32:19

you, it's really important to let your partner influence

32:21

you. Okay.

32:23

So when you're

32:26

doing that in the car and

32:29

in his, and he's encouraging you

32:31

to essentially, you know, sing a, you

32:34

know, a song that's going to make most people

32:36

cringe and get attention to yourself and just sort

32:38

of give yourself over the

32:41

moment, you're letting

32:43

her influence you. She's saying, I want you to

32:45

be young and I want you to be

32:48

present. And you're saying, now,

32:51

likewise, it's important that you let him

32:53

influence you, whatever

32:55

it might be. One of the things we

32:58

find on the show and

33:00

we get our couples to do this sometimes, someone

33:02

will be such an alpha and

33:05

so controlling that they will

33:08

be the decision maker in every aspect

33:10

of the relationship once we've matched them.

33:13

And so what we'll do is we'll say, okay, we, we're

33:15

going to flip this on its head. And

33:17

for the next week, what

33:20

I would say is let's say, Indy's the controlling

33:22

one. I'd say, Indy, you are going

33:24

to give over all decisions to Ben

33:28

and you are going to simply say yes.

33:30

Oh my God. That would for one week and

33:34

Ben from, from restaurants to

33:37

what time you go to bed to

33:39

what you wear to who you

33:41

socialize with this week, whatever

33:44

what you wear, that would be fun. He's going to

33:46

give you essentially the

33:51

the decision and you're going to surrender

33:54

and say yes. And

33:56

when you're in that, in that position

33:58

of control. and leadership and

34:01

then you have to give that over, it

34:03

can be very frightening, particularly if you're very

34:06

controlling. But then what you realize, what

34:08

do you think happens as you do that? Throughout

34:12

the week. I think

34:14

you start relaxing. Like

34:16

everything just relaxes because you've just given away your

34:19

control and you've kind of seen that it can

34:21

work if you're not in control. That's right,

34:23

that's right. And so you actually realize, oh

34:25

wow, I don't have to carry this

34:27

load all the time. I don't have to make every decision. This

34:30

can be really healthy. And then what you do, you can flip it

34:32

the next week if you want. And then

34:35

Ben says yes to everything that you say. And

34:37

that's fine. But it's

34:39

just, it's really exaggerating. I do that

34:41

anyway. The idea. But

34:44

you're exaggerating the idea that, the

34:47

world actually works really well

34:49

when we both share decisions rather than

34:51

one person. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So

34:54

that's something that, roles can

34:56

be a big issue in relationships where

34:59

particularly after you have kids, you can get

35:01

stuck in certain roles. And it's very important

35:03

to share leadership, decision-making,

35:07

and just allowing people to kind of feel

35:09

like, well, they've still got some sense of

35:12

influence here. And

35:14

do you find in relationships, is

35:17

it true that someone will

35:19

always wear the pants or can you

35:22

evenly divide that? I think you can

35:24

evenly divide it. But what you

35:26

might find is in certain areas, some

35:28

people may be really good. So

35:31

my wife is trained

35:34

in interior design and she's

35:37

amazing when it comes to, you

35:39

know, rejuvenating a house

35:43

or an apartment or small spaces.

35:45

She's just fantastic. I

35:47

have zero skill in that area. And

35:50

so if we buy a

35:52

house, I

35:56

will say it's yours. You just do whatever

35:58

it is with your magic. skill and

36:01

it's a blank landscape for you and

36:04

I don't get into that. But

36:06

then it might be for me, I

36:10

might have, you

36:12

know, if I'm thinking about say

36:16

music, I love music and different sorts of music

36:19

and I play guitar and I've been in

36:21

a band so you know she

36:23

might say to me well you know you

36:26

look after the music or can you put on some music for

36:28

us. So you'll find with couples

36:31

that they just naturally fall into areas

36:33

where they're really knowledgeable or have a

36:35

passion for and that's fine

36:37

but you want it to generally balance out

36:39

so that one person isn't doing too much

36:41

of something. Yeah what

36:43

am I good at? You just tell me

36:45

I'm not very good at cooking or cleaning. I

36:48

don't cook, I don't clean. I mean

36:50

no it's really okay. She does everything.

36:53

No she does and I don't expect I don't expect

36:55

to be good at cooking. No I know but yes

36:57

say tell John how good my bolognese

37:00

was last night. It was amazing. I just

37:03

love the bolognese. It was her best bolognese today. And he,

37:05

every other meal I ever cook he's like it tastes like tomato

37:07

soup. Yeah she tries to do curry but

37:09

she really goes. Can be tricky. Yeah but

37:11

really like lean on the spices so it

37:13

just tastes like tomato soup. He says I'm

37:15

a messy cook he thinks I'm horrible at

37:18

cleaning. He thinks I'm like how can you be bad

37:20

at cleaning but apparently I'm not very

37:22

good so can you tell me what I'm good

37:24

at? So I'm just making sure. The age gap thing

37:26

there right is was hard because I

37:30

mean because I was older I'm kind of set in

37:32

my ways I think and it's probably a male trade

37:34

as well. So then letting

37:36

the messy non-cooker into the house and having

37:38

to was. Well here's another way of saying

37:41

you know what are you what

37:43

are some things that you admire about? There's

37:46

so much homework about it. Oh stop

37:49

it. No but honestly I do like

37:51

I love it. I love that she

37:53

actually dances to the beat of her

37:55

own drum like she doesn't care what anyone thinks

37:57

and that from the day I met her

37:59

like us being together, us getting

38:01

married, the age difference, all those things.

38:03

I mean, her

38:06

career, I mean, it's

38:08

an unusual career, I guess, from what the typical

38:11

career is, but she's a genius at it and

38:13

she's amazing at it. She

38:17

is an amazing mother to

38:20

our children. Like the kids come

38:22

first. No, I don't mean like that, but I

38:24

mean, she's looking out for the kids every

38:26

single day. What's she amazing at as a mother? What

38:29

is she amazing at? I think it's the

38:31

support and the nurturing that she gives the

38:33

kids. Oh yeah, that's good. So

38:35

the nurturing... What does that look like? Can

38:38

look for... It's a lot of

38:40

different things. I mean, she's a hard mother.

38:43

Like she knows she has boundaries that they

38:45

can't step outside, but then within

38:47

those boundaries, I mean, the love

38:49

and respect that she gives, Navy

38:54

and Bambi and Soul's Only a Baby,

38:56

but fostering them and

38:58

their development from pulling out arts

39:00

and crafts and doing all these

39:02

different realm of things with them

39:04

on a daily basis is amazing.

39:06

Like, yeah. Is amazing. Like

39:09

specifics. Yeah. Like little

39:11

things like that. Language, manners.

39:13

Like even this morning, Navy was like, he's

39:16

just lost his eye contact in some of

39:18

his manners and she's

39:20

on it straight away. What do

39:22

you admire about Ben? Just a couple of

39:24

things. I admire that he can be... He

39:28

can go to work all day. He can wake

39:30

up at 5am, take the kids to Brekke. He

39:32

tells me to go for a walk or do

39:34

a workout, but I'm like, I can't, I just

39:37

want to help you. Otherwise you'll be frazzled, Azzol.

39:39

So let me just help. And he'll insist on

39:41

me. Like I had a 7am class this morning, but

39:45

I can't that because I wanted to help him, but he'll insist

39:47

for me to have time for myself. He

39:49

had all the lunch boxes ready out to do them

39:51

himself, as well as feed three kids, get them ready.

39:54

Then he'll go to work all day. And

39:56

as soon as he walks through the door,

39:58

he'll get changed within... and then half a minute

40:00

and then beyond until bedtime, until

40:03

seven. I don't know how

40:05

you do that for your mental, for

40:07

your clarity. You always

40:09

put us first. You always put me first.

40:11

Cause I think you realize that I'm at

40:13

home a lot of the time.

40:15

So I had something on this weekend, but it coincided

40:17

with one of your plans and then we're like, one

40:19

of us had to give and you're like, no, no,

40:21

you go with maybe and you do this. So

40:24

you always put me or the

40:26

kids before him in every

40:28

aspect. It's really nice. Thank

40:30

you. I love that your

40:33

music is being influenced by me a little

40:35

bit. His music. I like that too. I

40:37

have a very diverse music sense now, which

40:39

is amazing. He used to just like jazz. So what

40:42

was he before? Like Bee Gees or Robbie Williams? What

40:44

was he? I didn't hate it. No, it was still

40:46

mix. It's jazz. Oh, it's

40:48

not jazz. I've never listened to jazz in my life.

40:50

What is it now? Central

40:52

Sea, Bancle Band. I've

40:55

been getting here in Central Sea. I don't know what you're

40:57

talking about. It's UK rap. It's

40:59

more like modern rap. It's UK

41:02

rapper and I've really been getting him.

41:04

It's really cool because we really can

41:06

influence each other. Play me some

41:08

Central Sea the other day. How good is he? He's

41:10

so good. He's so good. And

41:12

I love being able to, I

41:14

guess, be on each other's

41:16

level with those things because typically in an

41:18

age gap relationship, they will have their interests.

41:20

You'll have yours and you either meet in

41:22

the middle or you don't. Whereas we're very

41:24

good at meeting in the middle, even with

41:26

music. So we'll be playing heavy hardcore UK

41:28

rap, not that hardcore, at 7 a.m. in

41:31

the morning. You know, I dropped a

41:33

Central Sea because I like some young people that work

41:35

for me at work and I dropped a Central Sea

41:37

verse at work yesterday and it came back. That

41:39

was it. They responded. One of them

41:41

over. No, they responded with the next verse. Oh,

41:43

I fancy it. So this is great. This

41:47

is great. But just what you're doing

41:49

there in terms of admiration, that's a

41:51

nice way of actually tapping into, you

41:55

know, what you think about one another. See, we don't

41:57

do that often. Well, this is why. This

42:00

is why I'm here. Cause

42:02

you're going to go away going, okay, there's a lot of

42:04

little things we can do here to really

42:06

shore up our bond and our connection,

42:09

which remember is

42:12

going to lead to a better sex life. Cause

42:18

you talked about intimacy and lack of, which

42:21

of course everybody is going to have when you have kids.

42:26

So if you're thinking, well, you

42:28

know, what goes on in the bedroom really

42:31

is dependent upon what's going on outside of it.

42:34

Now you're thinking, okay, we've got a bit of a roadmap

42:36

here. We've got some guidelines

42:38

about what needs to be going on for

42:40

that then to flow through into the bedroom.

42:43

Interesting. So it's just as deeper

42:45

than like, oh, we just, it's

42:47

easy to make excuses. Oh, we don't have sex. Cause

42:49

it's busy. We're busy. We're tired. It's

42:51

like, no, no. But just on that, like

42:53

when, when, when you're talking about sex, you,

42:55

you do need to think about, you know,

42:57

particularly when you've got kids, you,

43:00

you may have to schedule it

43:02

in, which doesn't sound particularly

43:04

sexy at all. No. But

43:08

you're essentially saying, all

43:10

right, we are going to make sure that

43:12

we connect in this way on a regular

43:14

basis versus just

43:16

saying, oh, we're going to wait till the

43:19

mood gets us. Cause the

43:21

mood may not get you for a year. But

43:23

I think on that, I think, That's

43:26

so sad. Because that's okay. Because that's

43:28

quite, that's quite normal. Do you see it in a lot

43:30

of, oh yeah. But I think, sorry, I got something to

43:33

say here. It's okay, you're excited. It's fine. I think. It's

43:35

got my finger pointing. Sorry. We're listening.

43:38

You don't want to say mother hand. I think

43:40

by doing those little bits of homework every day,

43:43

afternoon, that that will just, it absolutely

43:45

does. Cause you've got this goodwill going

43:47

on. And so you, you will get

43:49

that urge, but it doesn't hurt

43:52

to be saying, well, we're going to

43:54

circle our Sunday mornings or whatever

43:56

it is. So just,

43:59

just. Just keep that in mind that

44:01

yes, there are things outside of the bedroom

44:03

that are very important. But

44:05

you also, particularly when you've

44:08

got so many things going on with

44:10

young kids, you might have to just

44:12

accept because I think everyone will

44:14

admit to this that once you

44:16

start having sex,

44:19

you're kind of like, oh, this is actually pretty good.

44:23

But if you're waiting for that urge, you

44:25

know, in the busy life that

44:27

you've got, that may not

44:30

come along for some time. Would

44:32

you recommend for couples out there who have just

44:34

had kids in this rut and they're waiting for

44:36

that feeling, would you recommend like a 30-day sex

44:38

challenge? No. Oh.

44:41

No, I wouldn't, because that's essentially

44:43

really putting, I think,

44:46

too much pressure on the couple. Oh, OK. And

44:49

also... Why is this wanting you to say yes? Yeah, I know, I know. But

44:52

no, I would much prefer you just

44:54

to sit down and go, OK, well, let's focus on

44:56

everything that's going on outside of the bedroom. We're

44:59

doing these little things on a daily basis. And

45:02

then maybe let's just start with once a week. And

45:06

then see what happens, because what you might find is

45:08

this flows into two or three times a week, whatever,

45:12

rather than just going, right, we're going hard at it every day

45:14

for 30 days. And

45:16

you've got nothing going on outside of

45:18

the bedroom. There's no goodwill. There's no

45:21

little, you know, compliments

45:23

or working as a

45:25

team or connecting at the end of

45:27

the day. And you're not going to do

45:29

that, but you're just saying, let's do sex. Yeah. Not

45:31

going to have an impact. Yeah. OK. I

45:34

think you should do it the other way. Makes sense. What

45:36

I would say, though, also in terms of just

45:38

creating some novelty in

45:40

the relationship, it's quite good to

45:44

do things differently together. So

45:49

if you've got a favorite cafe that you go

45:51

to on a Sunday, don't

45:54

do that. Go to a different one

45:56

that neither one of you have been to and

45:59

try it out. Is this with or without the

46:01

kids? Can be both. Okay.

46:04

But what I'm saying is,

46:07

it's very good for your relationship to

46:10

be sharing something for the first time together. Oh

46:12

yes. So if you go to the, I don't know,

46:14

if you go to a movies and you're always going

46:16

to the same one as

46:19

in the same movie complex, what you would do is

46:21

say, we're going to try a different one. Or

46:23

we always go to this restaurant, you

46:25

try a completely different one. It doesn't

46:28

matter if the waiter was terrible, the

46:30

service was awful, the food was undercooked.

46:32

That doesn't matter. The fact is

46:34

you're doing something novel together for

46:36

the first time. And it's very good

46:39

for your relationship. Interesting. Like our road

46:41

trip to the Gold Coast. Yeah.

46:44

And I bet. And that was great food. That was

46:46

amazing. We had so much fun. I bet.

46:49

You had a great time. We're

46:51

stopping at, you know, this little cafe. Let's

46:54

try this restaurant. We've never been here before.

46:56

Different type of parenting as well. Exactly. And different

46:58

type of travelling. You had to unload the suitcases

47:00

every stop. But then I had to, we

47:03

had to look for parks for the kids. And

47:05

it was actually, that's a really good idea. Because

47:07

I think it's easy to fall into. I'm definitely

47:09

a creature of habit. That's right. And me doing

47:11

the same things in the same places makes me

47:13

feel content. Absolutely. Whereas you're always like, let's try

47:15

someone new. Let's go to the Afghan restaurant. And

47:17

I'm like, no. That's it.

47:19

This does not sound good. So now

47:21

the answer is yes. Yeah. And then if

47:24

you might choose the Afghan restaurant one time

47:26

and then you might choose the, you know,

47:29

the new Indian restaurant that opened up down

47:31

the road. Neither of them have you

47:33

been to. But you're just

47:35

injecting your relationship with this novelty that you

47:37

haven't had before. Again, it starts

47:39

to really flow on from there. We don't have

47:42

a lot of choice where we live. No, we

47:44

don't. But I guess maybe stepping out and not

47:46

just choosing the restaurant down the road, driving 15, 20 minutes

47:48

to try something new. I

47:51

think that's great. It probably reminds you of the old

47:53

days before you had kids when you were first dating

47:55

and you'd have sex 10

47:57

times a night. That's right. just

48:00

floating along and everything is great

48:02

and your mind's just like, this

48:04

person you're obsessing about them and

48:06

everything they do is fantastic. So,

48:09

you know, that is something that- What are you

48:12

looking at? I'm just saying, I'm admiring you. No,

48:14

I'm just looking at you. Wow. Take the compliment.

48:16

Well look, John has really done some work on

48:18

you today. Look at you giving me those eyes. It's

48:21

been a while since you've seen those eyes. Yeah, it has been.

48:24

That's why I'm like, if I said something- No,

48:26

your compliments, I'm still like. Yeah,

48:29

so what you find out hopefully

48:31

now is that- We

48:33

don't hate each other. No,

48:35

no, you're on the same page about a lot

48:37

of things. But there

48:40

are little tips, tools,

48:42

interventions that

48:45

you can use on a daily basis

48:48

that really work. And that's one of the

48:50

reasons why I liked working in this field

48:53

is because I don't have a whole lot of patience. And

48:56

you see that on the show. You know, if someone's doing

48:58

something, making poor choices

49:00

or poor behavior, I call them

49:03

out. And I'm not gonna

49:05

take excuses or minimization. I just will

49:08

hold the mirror up and say, do better. This

49:11

is what needs to happen. Now, let's

49:15

see it this week. And I

49:17

think that is

49:20

one of the reasons why I moved into

49:22

relationships is because you can get a lot

49:24

of change very quickly by doing little things

49:26

differently. And they're all practical.

49:29

And they work, you know, because I

49:31

do these things on my day to day with

49:33

my wife. What I would say

49:35

though, is that I'm not a therapist with her. She's

49:38

always said, I want a husband, not

49:40

a therapist. So, you know, I won't

49:43

be coming in trying to dissect things.

49:48

I just, and I make plenty of mistakes along the

49:50

way. But these little things

49:52

actually work and really couples,

49:56

you know, they just really don't know that they're out

49:58

there and that they can be so powerful. And that's

50:01

why this is fun to do. Yeah. And we've

50:03

learned so much. Well, we have

50:05

a few questions for you. Usually

50:08

people call in and ask me the

50:10

questions, but the phone line was down,

50:12

but they've sent in the questions. Fantastic.

50:15

And they just want your positivity and

50:18

they want your advice on relationships because

50:20

I think everyone suffers as

50:22

much as people want to pretend they have this perfect relationship.

50:25

I think there's always going to be a flaw or two.

50:27

Yeah. So question number one, key

50:29

points to have a healthy and sex... Fuck,

50:33

why do I keep saying sex? Wow. So for

50:35

brains. I'm sorry, I must be really horny or something.

50:37

This has really worked. Clearly I've

50:39

been deprived of it. Pretty genius,

50:42

really. No, sorry. Key points

50:44

to having a healthy and successful relationship.

50:46

What are your top three? Oh,

50:48

top three. Well, number one would be

50:50

have a daily debrief at the end

50:52

of the day where the

50:55

person vents and you listen, but

50:57

don't fix. That would be

50:59

number one. Number two would

51:01

be if you've got a problem or an

51:03

issue with your partner, bring it up gently.

51:06

Don't use a sledgehammer. And

51:09

number three would be... Whenever

51:14

someone is talking to

51:16

you, put your phone down and

51:19

respond back because they're going

51:21

to feel like they're important, that

51:25

you value them, and then it's going

51:27

to grow your bond. Wow.

51:30

They're powerful. Small, but they work.

51:32

Small and powerful. Amazing. Question

51:35

number two. Biggest issues

51:37

that you have been... Oh my

51:39

God, can I talk today? Do you

51:41

want to read out the second question? I don't actually think I can talk

51:43

today. She's too busy

51:46

thinking about what's coming up. The

51:48

biggest issues you've seen from going...

51:51

From being a couple to parents. Oh, yeah.

51:54

Biggest issue. The

51:56

couple essentially becomes

51:58

bogged down with... everything

52:00

to do with the kids. From,

52:04

you know, what they wear to

52:06

toilet training, to

52:09

food, formula, breastfeeding,

52:11

mothers groups, the

52:14

competitiveness, what schools to go to. It just goes

52:16

on and on and on. And

52:20

all that focus goes onto that. And

52:22

it moves away from the couple and

52:25

what they were doing so well before

52:28

the child arrived. And

52:30

so it's very important

52:32

to prioritize your relationship ahead

52:34

of the kids. Get

52:37

that really strong, get that

52:40

bond very tight and

52:42

the kids are gonna flourish. Kids

52:45

don't like tension, hostility, distance,

52:48

resentment, they feel all of that.

52:50

How do they show it? They feel it has,

52:52

how do they behave? Well, kids might see

52:54

that. And

52:57

what they'll do is they will, they

53:00

might be bold enough to point it out to

53:02

you. You guys aren't getting along. I don't like

53:04

it when you yell at each other. Don't be

53:06

so mean to mummy. You know, they might just

53:08

literally do that. Well, they might retreat to their

53:10

rooms a lot and try and avoid what's going

53:12

on. They might put

53:15

the old hands over the ears when you start

53:17

arguing. There's all sorts of ways

53:19

that they can try and feed that back to you.

53:22

But you don't wanna be in that position. Good,

53:25

healthy couples that are connected and happy

53:28

means the kids are happy. Yeah, absolutely.

53:31

Well, thank you so much for joining Sleep

53:33

Deprived podcast. It was very insightful and powerful.

53:35

And thank you so much for all your

53:37

tips for us to flourish

53:40

and to flower. I mean, to flower,

53:42

to water our relationship because I really

53:44

do think we have a special bond.

53:46

And of course, kids

53:48

push that apart and you become housemates,

53:50

it's kind of creating that love

53:53

and sex life again. It's

53:55

coming, there's no doubt. Tonight, people

53:57

need to not conjure. and

54:00

you can't tap them tonight. We're parties,

54:02

huh? But, yeah, just remember, you really

54:04

had two relationships, one before kids, and

54:06

now you're trying to create one

54:09

after kids. Yeah. And

54:11

you've got to stop as a couple and recalibrate and go, OK,

54:13

how are we going to do this differently so

54:16

that we are as tight and as strong and as

54:18

happy as we were before the kids? Little

54:20

things make a huge difference, but

54:22

you then have to go as a couple, right,

54:25

we're tired, but the kids have now gone

54:27

to bed, glass of

54:30

wine, right, tell me about your

54:32

day, then take your clothes

54:34

off, yeah. Or take your clothes

54:36

off, then talk about your day. Clothes off, have the

54:38

conversation. Yeah. That could be a good one. Big duos.

54:40

They fall asleep, though, that's the problem. It's because I'm

54:42

old. Oh, yeah, I know. So

54:45

maybe debrief about the day,

54:47

then take the clothes off. Amazing.

54:49

Well, thank you so much, John. Thank you, John.

54:52

John from Maths, you're amazing. It's a pleasure. Thank

54:54

you. I hope this has been helpful. And also,

54:56

I hope that people out there have been

54:59

listening and watching and have realised, well, you

55:01

know, there are very clear

55:05

and helpful things that you can do that

55:08

make a difference. And maybe they don't need a file

55:10

for that divorce. Maybe they just need to

55:12

give a few more compliments and a few more... Little

55:15

things. Touch it. No, little things, yeah.

55:18

Amazing. Well, thank you. Guys, it's been a pleasure. Thank you.

55:20

Have a beautiful day. Thank you, Big Eddie, for joining me

55:22

out of your busy day. Give me a thumbs

55:24

up. Oh, sorry. That is

55:26

so... That's not love, is it? Hold my hand.

55:28

Love's coming. Oh, that was nice to... No, that was

55:31

to the screen. That was to you. A thumbs up.

55:33

And what you make, I'm your lover. My

55:36

pleasure, lover. Thank you, John.

55:38

Thanks, guys. Have a beautiful day. Bye.