0:13

Coming to the tree,

0:15

where they strung up

0:18

a man who they

0:20

say he murdered three.

0:22

Strange things have happened

0:24

there. No stranger would

0:26

it be if we

0:29

met at midnight in

0:31

the hanging tree. Welcome to the

0:33

show. to the show. I'm

0:35

your host Chris James Once

0:38

I Once I I I

0:41

discovered my coffee break. was

0:43

all day long. I make the

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make the most out

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of this time by

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drinking only the best

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coffee in the coffee in the

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universe. Organic Man Man Coffee Organic

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in here in Laredo. Or Organic

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1:08

campaign to try getting

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at least one month at

1:13

least one month renamed

1:15

I'm not too sure one.

1:17

too sure which one. Maybe

1:20

October. Also being

1:23

retired, There's no such

1:25

thing as a day off. off.

1:28

Instead, I have to work

1:30

really hard once in a while, in

1:32

so I remember what it is

1:34

I'm supposed to do when not working.

1:36

do when not working. I

1:39

was watching Dan

1:41

Acroyd, Unbelievable, and was

1:44

talking about a weird lake

1:46

in India. in The

1:48

name is is Rupkund Lake, but

1:50

folks are now calling

1:52

it... it Skeleton

1:54

Lake. The name change

1:56

took place around 1942. 1942. when

1:58

the area was experiencing

2:00

a bit of a drought

2:03

bit of the water level

2:05

was down. level was down.

2:07

A forest ranger was out

2:09

doing his job in

2:11

the Himalayan Himalayan he spotted

2:13

some bones along the edge

2:15

of a lake. the edge

2:18

of a of bones of

2:20

if Vlad tepish

2:22

might have been here

2:24

recently recently. of the bones

2:26

still had flesh attached. It

2:29

It looked like a serial

2:31

killer had been busy. been busy. This

2:33

was a was a remote

2:35

area, a five -day walk

2:38

from anywhere. Few people people

2:40

ever came here It

2:42

was above sea above sea

2:44

level and well away

2:46

from any villages or

2:48

roadways. site was site was

2:50

too remote for an

2:53

investigation at the time. It

2:55

would have to wait until

2:57

until spring. As as

2:59

the weather improved. an

3:02

An investigation team was sent

3:04

to the lake. They They

3:06

discovered as the snow

3:08

was melting, there were

3:11

more bones being exposed. exposed.

3:14

were entire skeletons. The

3:17

bottom of the lake

3:19

was the ripe with dead

3:21

folks. with dead folks. Lots of

3:23

bones with now unsk-

3:26

understanding with no

3:28

understanding on where they

3:30

all came from. having

3:32

a moment. The first thought

3:35

was The first thought was

3:37

a there had been a battle

3:39

take place near the lake.

3:41

However, some of the skeletons were

3:43

very small, like little kids. kids.

3:46

Too young young to have

3:48

gone into battle, even

3:50

under Vlad's standards. Vlad

3:53

Tepish anyone, under

3:55

his rule, his

3:57

or female. between

4:00

12 and 70 years of

4:03

age to be soldiers in

4:05

his army. Next time

4:07

time you buy Girl Scout

4:09

cookies from a real Girl

4:11

Scout and not from their

4:13

parents Look at

4:15

these kids these kids and

4:17

would have had them

4:20

impaling people right and

4:22

left. people right about left.

4:24

upbringing. a weird upbringing.

4:26

Back at the lake. World

4:29

War II in progress and

4:31

the British were running India

4:33

were running India. began

4:35

to suspect maybe the

4:37

Japanese had mounted a

4:39

sneak attack by marching

4:42

through the mountains. This

4:44

was a ways from the the

4:47

parts of China held by

4:49

the Japanese. Somebody

4:51

was desperate to put answers

4:53

to this mystery. As

4:55

the the skeletons were being

4:58

examined and it was determined

5:00

many were children, were the new

5:02

theory was the Japanese had

5:04

attacked some village and marched

5:06

the inhabitants out to the

5:08

middle of out to the middle of kill

5:10

them. to kill them. This sounds

5:12

like a lot of trouble

5:14

just to kill these folks. folks. Some

5:18

of the skulls had damaged to

5:20

them which looked as if someone

5:22

had pummeled and pounded on them

5:24

with a blunt weapon. with a was

5:26

determined to be the

5:29

cause of death. of death. Now

5:31

the the mystery was even

5:33

deeper. deeper. There was a war on and

5:35

was a war dead a bunch

5:37

of dead civilians didn't amount

5:39

to any kind of a

5:41

tactical or strategic maneuvers, so

5:44

the mystery was shelved. Any

5:46

investigation would have to wait until

5:48

the war was over. war was

5:50

over. Once Japan was no no

5:52

longer trying to conquer the

5:54

world, India had time

5:56

to look into the dead

5:59

bodies at Rupkhan. lake. Just as

6:01

soon as soon as all

6:03

the other problems were ironed

6:05

out. thought it would British

6:07

thought it would ease

6:09

tensions between the Hindus

6:11

and the Muslims by

6:13

splitting India into two

6:15

separate countries. Britain was Britain was

6:17

about to grant India its

6:19

independence, but first first they to

6:21

want to screw things up

6:24

just a bit more. a bit

6:26

more. A line line was sketched

6:28

on the map, guesstimating

6:30

where most Muslims lived as

6:32

opposed to most of

6:34

the Hindus. of the As if

6:36

by magic a new

6:38

country was formed in

6:41

formed and everybody living, was

6:43

going to live happily ever after. happily

6:46

not even close. even close.

6:48

sectarian violence

6:50

left left some one

6:52

people dead. dead.

6:55

Hindus, now finding

6:57

themselves in an a -Muslim

6:59

country, had to flee. flee

7:01

and try not get killed as

7:03

they made their way back

7:05

to India. Meanwhile, the the

7:08

living on on the wrong

7:10

side of the border were pretty

7:12

much much finding themselves in

7:14

the same situation. situation. India

7:18

and and Pakistan have

7:20

settled of of the

7:22

boundary issues left

7:24

unresolved by the British,

7:26

but has has continued

7:29

in some areas, especially

7:31

the Kashmir area. Rupkund Lake

7:33

is nowhere near is nowhere

7:35

near the border, but

7:38

resources needed to investigate the

7:40

bodies had to be relocated

7:42

to the border disputes. 1956,

7:46

an anthropological survey of

7:48

survey of India

7:50

in Calcutta several

7:52

expeditions to the lake

7:55

see if any

7:57

answers could be found.

7:59

found. A snowstorm forced the

8:01

first expedition to turn

8:03

back, but two months

8:05

later another expedition made it

8:07

and returned to Calcutta with some

8:09

of the remains with some of could

8:11

be studied. so they could be carbon

8:14

dating, still an

8:16

unreliable innovation, indicated

8:18

that the bones were

8:20

between bones were between five and eight

8:23

years old. old. Indian

8:25

scientists were intensely

8:28

interested in Rupakand mystery.

8:30

in The lake, some

8:32

thought, was a place

8:34

where a men went

8:37

to commit ritual suicide suicide

8:39

by smashing themselves in

8:41

the head. the head. This would

8:44

place those small kids in

8:46

a whole new mystery. Now

8:48

I know know there are some

8:50

monasteries that do have do young

8:52

members, but it just doesn't

8:54

sound like what anybody would do.

8:56

what anybody would do. Or maybe

8:59

the dead were a

9:01

detachment of soldiers from the

9:03

from the 13th century army by the

9:05

of Delhi Delhi an ill

9:08

-fated attempt to invade Tibet,

9:10

which still didn't explain

9:12

the kids, the or why

9:14

the skulls were all smashed

9:17

in. in. Plus, There were no

9:19

weapons found anywhere in the area.

9:21

in the area. Perhaps a

9:23

a group of Tibet bound lost

9:25

their way traveling from point

9:27

A to point B, to

9:30

and they wound up dying

9:32

near the dying near the lake.

9:34

Still still didn't up.

9:36

Perhaps this was was some

9:38

kind of a a ground and

9:40

an open -air cemetery or

9:42

a place where victims of

9:44

an epidemic were dumped

9:47

to prevent contagion. If,

9:49

and this is a really

9:51

big big if, the bodies were

9:53

dropped from a wagon and

9:56

landed on their heads. their heads,

9:58

might explain the damage. damage. Sort

10:00

of. It

10:02

seemed to me, the folks doing

10:04

the investigation, were stopping random folks

10:07

out in the hallway and asking

10:09

them to come up with possible

10:11

explanations for what had been found

10:13

at the lake. Just

10:16

take a guess and let's see

10:18

what you can think. People

10:22

in the village below Rupkund

10:24

had their own explanation,

10:26

passed down in folk songs

10:28

and stories. The

10:30

villagers are on the route

10:32

of a pilgrimage to honor

10:34

Nanda Devi. manifestation

10:37

of Parvati, a

10:39

supreme goddess in

10:41

Hinduism. The

10:43

pilgrimage winds up up

10:45

through the foothills of

10:47

the Trisul Massif where

10:49

locals believe that the

10:51

goddess lives with her

10:53

husband, Shiva. I

10:55

hope I got those names right. It

10:58

may be the longest

11:00

and most dangerous pilgrimage

11:02

in India, and particularly, perilous

11:04

section, the Jai... Jai

11:07

Jayumra Gali, or

11:09

path of death, runs

11:11

along a ridge high above

11:13

Rupkund. I have lots

11:15

of listeners in India and

11:18

well, I try my best, but

11:20

I I a hard enough time speaking

11:22

English. As

11:24

the villagers tell it,

11:26

long ago Nanda Devi left

11:29

her home to visit

11:31

a distant kingdom where she

11:33

was treated discuriously

11:35

by the king and queen. Nanda

11:39

Devi cursed the kingdom,

11:41

unleashing drought and disaster,

11:43

and infesting their milk

11:45

and rice with maggots.

11:48

You know, baby flies. In

11:50

order to appease the

11:53

goddess, the royal couple embarked

11:55

on a pilgrimage. The

11:57

king, who liked his entertainment,

11:59

took along a bevy

12:01

of dancing courtesans

12:03

and musicians in violation

12:05

of the ascetic

12:07

traditions of the

12:10

pilgrimage. Nanda Devi Devi

12:12

was furious at the

12:14

display of of pleasures and

12:16

she shoved the dancing

12:18

girls down into the

12:20

the underworld. There are pits into

12:22

which they say you can

12:24

still see along the edge

12:26

of the mountainside. According

12:28

to the legend, she sent

12:30

down a blizzard of hail

12:32

and whirlwind, which swept all

12:34

the pilgrims on the path

12:36

of death on the the lake.

12:38

death into skeletons are a

12:41

warning to those

12:43

who would disrespect the

12:45

would disrespect the story

12:47

is retold in

12:49

a book called a

12:51

book called Mountain a

12:53

1991 book by anthropologist

12:55

William Sachs. a a

12:57

professor from Heidelberg

12:59

University. University. had been doing his

13:01

undergraduate studies and he found

13:03

a reference to a lake filled

13:06

with bodies. to a He took

13:08

notes, and once he was

13:10

a full -blown professor, once he

13:12

wanted to do more research

13:14

on this he wanted to a fellow

13:16

researcher on this lake. He

13:19

and a fellow much want

13:21

to call. much want to

13:23

call, violins, This will

13:25

become clear in a

13:27

few minutes. minutes. They to

13:29

to Juan, the closest

13:31

settlement to to Rupkund.

13:34

They that hired a local

13:36

man to guide them up

13:38

to the pilgrimage trail

13:40

that that passed the lake. The trail The

13:42

trail climbs through deep

13:44

forest, emerging above the

13:46

tree line. To the the is a

13:48

a vast wall of the

13:51

Himalayan peaks. peaks. The pilgrim

13:53

route follows steep ridge lines

13:55

and leads past an

13:57

ancient stone shrine. shrine.

14:00

covered with bronze bells

14:02

and tridents. There is

14:04

a statue of the

14:06

deity Ganesha. For those

14:08

of you unfamiliar with Ganesha,

14:10

he has the head of

14:12

an elephant. A Shiva decapitated

14:14

Ganesha in a fit of

14:17

rage and then replaced his

14:19

top portions with an elephant

14:21

head in order to bring

14:23

him back to life. This

14:26

was at the behest

14:28

of Parvati, Ganesha's mother.

14:32

Some folks go with the

14:34

idea, when Ganesha was

14:36

born, his original head was

14:38

burned to ashes by

14:40

the evil eye of the

14:42

God Shani and Vashnu

14:44

replaced it with an elephant's

14:46

head. At At

14:49

15 ,000 feet, the the

14:51

Trail goes over a pass

14:53

and up a series

14:55

of switchbacks through Scree to

14:57

Rupkund. The lake

14:59

is about 130 feet across

15:01

and 10 feet deep. As

15:04

soon as Sax and his

15:06

companions arrived, they were engulfed

15:08

in a blizzard. The

15:10

storm seemed to come up out of

15:12

nowhere. None of the

15:15

locals had expected anything like

15:17

it. The

15:19

men hadn't even set up camp

15:21

yet, so there was absolutely no

15:23

shelter to be had. The

15:25

folks had to stumble about

15:27

in white conditions on the

15:29

side of a mountain and

15:31

do their best to escape.

15:35

Sax and violins

15:37

running around the

15:40

lake. That's why

15:42

I wanted that name, Violins.

15:45

Thus the name. In white

15:47

conditions, you can't differentiate

15:49

between the ground and the

15:51

sky. A cliff

15:53

looks just like the trail

15:55

that you're trying to follow.

15:57

The expedition was not prepared

15:59

- this of weather. They had

16:01

to turn and make haste. Run

16:04

away, as as King Arthur

16:06

would say, to to

16:08

get back to Exhausted and

16:10

feverish, the Exhausted and feverish,

16:12

the expedition barely made it back

16:15

to town. and his and

16:17

his companion spent the next

16:19

10 days recovering in the

16:21

the home. home. His His

16:23

passion for the place

16:25

was undimmed. He went on

16:27

to write a a thesis

16:29

about the local traditions surrounding

16:32

surrounding Nanda Divi.

16:34

Devi. Nanda Devi. In the 80s,

16:36

the went on went on

16:38

a pilgrimage by himself.

16:40

Well went on on a

16:43

pilgrimage with other folks from

16:45

India. He was the

16:47

first Westerner, as far as

16:49

anybody knew. knew, to do such

16:51

a thing. a thing. He published

16:53

the book Mountain thereafter.

16:56

thereafter. The book describes

16:59

how the the Himalayas, associated

17:02

thousands of years in

17:04

Indian Indian famous pilgrimage

17:06

places and powerful

17:08

and powerful became

17:10

the setting for followers

17:13

to show devotion to

17:15

the goddess to giving by

17:17

to their bodies. bodies. In

17:21

2005, featured was featured in

17:23

a National Geographic documentary

17:25

about the lake. lake. The

17:28

Indian Indian media company

17:30

that made the film

17:32

assembled a team of

17:34

archaeologists, anthropologists, geneticists, and

17:36

technicians from research laboratories

17:39

all over India and

17:41

the and the collect and

17:43

study the bones. the bones.

17:46

In the the decades since

17:48

Saks first visited the

17:50

lake, people have read his

17:52

books and articles about

17:54

about Skeleton Lake. The had

17:57

become a popular destination

17:59

in the... wrecking community, and

18:01

the site was being visited

18:03

by lots of folks, some

18:06

of some of whom

18:08

wanted souvenirs. considered

18:11

themselves artists and they

18:13

went about decorating the lake

18:15

using the bones. the

18:18

place was quickly being

18:20

ruined. was quickly being

18:22

ruined. I was I

18:24

was wondering, is the is

18:26

the difference between hiking and

18:28

trekking? Hiking

18:31

involves a long energetic

18:33

walk in a natural

18:35

environment on hiking trails

18:37

or or footpaths. A

18:39

trekking involves a

18:41

long long hike in

18:43

in wild natural for

18:45

many days. many days. You You

18:47

can trek on a hiking trail,

18:49

but you can't hike on a

18:51

trekking trail. Well, no

18:53

trail no trail, so therefore you do

18:56

it. do it. A

18:58

lot lot of bones had been

19:00

taken. Others had been rearranged in

19:02

in fanciful patterns or

19:04

piled up in a

19:06

car. none of the Almost none

19:09

of the skeletons were

19:11

intact, and it was

19:13

impossible to tell which bones belonged or

19:15

where they had where they had

19:17

originally Nature had added to

19:19

the confusion had added

19:21

to the confusion, churning and fracturing

19:23

the bones with rock slides

19:25

and avalanches. A

19:28

recent landslide exposed

19:30

a catch of fresh bones

19:32

fresh bones and artifacts. a slab of

19:35

a slab of rocks the

19:37

team found the remains of

19:39

a woman was bent bent over

19:41

The body was body was intact

19:43

and still had skin on

19:45

the bones. The

19:47

scientists removed tissue samples for

19:50

testing. shot They shot videos

19:52

and they collected bones and

19:54

artifacts. The The team

19:56

estimated that the area

19:58

contained the remains of between

20:00

between three to seven people.

20:03

When does grave does

20:06

grave robbing become I'm

20:08

asking asking for

20:11

a friend. scientists and

20:13

analysts swiftly poop-hooed most

20:15

of most of

20:17

the prevailing theories. These

20:20

were were not the remains

20:22

of a lost army. Only

20:24

one weapon was ever found.

20:26

found. The bones were both

20:28

men, women and children.

20:30

children. There were no traces of

20:33

any horses or any beasts

20:35

of burden of burden. The

20:37

bones no evidence of

20:39

battle, ritual suicide, murder, or

20:42

epidemic disease. disease.

20:46

Rupkund was not a not

20:48

a cemetery most most of the

20:50

bodies were still in place,

20:52

were healthy 18 and 35

20:54

and 35 years of

20:56

age. analysis geographic

20:58

analysis laid the rest of

21:00

the idea of have that might

21:02

have been lost in the

21:05

mountains, establishing that there

21:07

were no trade routes between

21:09

India and Tibet ever in

21:11

this area. area. The

21:13

Tibetan border is only 35

21:15

miles north of of The

21:18

mountains form an impossible

21:20

barrier. There were

21:22

no trade goods found with the

21:24

bodies. with the bodies. retrieved

21:26

included dozens of

21:29

leather dozens of leather pieces

21:31

of parasols from bamboo

21:33

and birch bark, bark,

21:36

and bangles made from

21:38

from and glass. glass. devotees

21:41

of Devi carry parasols and

21:43

and they were

21:45

bangles in the

21:48

pilgrimage. pilgrimage. The it

21:50

seemed, was most likely

21:52

a group of of pilgrims.

21:54

DNA analysis showed

21:56

all showed all the victims

21:58

appeared to have a a

22:00

genetic makeup of South Asia.

22:03

Asia. Bone and and

22:05

tissue samples were sent to Oxford

22:07

University for carbon dating. for

22:10

carbon dates, The new more

22:12

accurate than the ones

22:14

from 1956, ones formed

22:16

a formed a tight in

22:18

the ninth century. This led

22:20

to the conclusion the

22:22

victims had perished in

22:24

a single event and

22:26

had died instantaneously within

22:29

hours of one another.

22:31

one another. A team team of

22:35

and and paleopathologists noted

22:37

the presence of

22:39

two distinct groups. There

22:42

There were rugged with

22:44

long people with long

22:46

heads height also some

22:48

median height, lightly

22:50

who headed people who

22:52

displayed a curious forehead

22:54

of the across the

22:57

forehead of the that

22:59

the dead scientists concluded that

23:01

the dead represented

23:04

two distinct populations. A

23:06

group of tall the plains

23:09

from the Plains of

23:11

India and a company of

23:13

shorter local porters skulls were

23:15

marked by years of

23:17

carrying heavy loads with

23:19

a tump line looped over

23:21

the forehead. Who invented

23:24

that as a invented that

23:26

as a way of carrying anything? got

23:28

be bad for the the neck. The

23:32

The investigations also revealed

23:34

that that or possibly four

23:36

skulls had compression fractures

23:38

on the crown the

23:40

had that had occurred at

23:42

the time of death. of

23:45

death. is not a weapon

23:47

injury, the the noted,

23:49

but came from a from

23:51

a a blunt, heavy,

23:53

round object. object. This stretch

23:55

stretch of the Himalayas

23:57

is notorious for hailstorms.

24:00

which destroy crops

24:02

and damage property.

24:04

team concluded that around the

24:06

year of our the year of

24:08

our Lord 800, or Anno

24:11

Dumani, 800 AD, a bunch

24:13

bunch of pilgrims were

24:15

caught in in the

24:18

open during a hailstorm and

24:20

died. died. The

24:22

world's biggest hailstone was

24:24

inches across.

24:26

across. and very big when

24:29

looking at a handful of ice until

24:31

you drop it from a few miles

24:33

up it from a few miles up. A

24:35

one inch hail fall at

24:37

about at about 25 an hour.

24:39

hour. Bigger stones can can

24:41

be coming at you around 100

24:43

miles an hour Add to this,

24:45

to this, hail might be coming

24:48

in massive quantities. Some of Some

24:50

of the most frequent hail occurs

24:52

in areas

24:54

due to the the... orographic

24:56

lift that allows to

24:59

become stronger. stronger. It

25:01

is very common and hail can

25:03

be quite large in in

25:06

northern and parts

25:08

of China. China. Hail storms

25:10

can also occur frequently across

25:12

most of Europe. most

25:14

of Europe. We used to

25:16

have a TV show, it

25:18

was called The Eyes The Texas. Texas.

25:21

The of of Texas

25:23

was a regional television

25:25

series which aired from

25:27

1969 from 1999. 1999. The The

25:30

program focused on unique

25:32

people, events and places throughout

25:34

the state of Texas. state

25:37

of was produced and

25:39

syndicated by KPRC out

25:41

of Houston. out

25:43

of Houston. One involved

25:45

a woman a with

25:47

a a frying pan. pan.

25:50

It could stop a hailstorm.

25:53

The crew The crew went

25:55

to see her and ask

25:57

about her weird weird cookware. As they

25:59

were... interviewing the woman a

26:01

a commenced. Kind

26:04

of of convenient, but maybe the

26:06

weather guys had given them

26:08

a heads a heads up. Today is the

26:10

day you want to talk to the

26:12

woman with the frying pan. a magic frying pan.

26:14

The hail The hail began

26:16

to pound backyard and the woman

26:18

ran and grabbed her blessed

26:21

blessed pan. She opened the back

26:23

door and threw the pan

26:25

into the yard and soon

26:27

after the pan hit the

26:29

ground hit the The hail stopped. The

26:31

guy doing the The guy doing

26:33

the interview was amazed. was He

26:35

was speechless. He had he had

26:37

witnessed a of of

26:40

sorts. he heard the rest of

26:42

heard An rest of the

26:44

story. in this An average

26:46

hail storm in this particular

26:48

neighborhood usually only lasted a

26:50

minute or two. long enough

26:53

long enough to grab any

26:55

fry pan and chuck it out the

26:57

back back door. A A

26:59

usual herald will last

27:01

about five minutes. Some

27:03

can last as long

27:06

as 15. Three to seven hundred

27:08

was the guesstimate

27:10

was the best of of the

27:12

number of people. five Let's

27:14

go with the that's

27:16

the middle. hundred people people walking

27:18

through the mountains get hit

27:21

by a a and all

27:23

wind all in the lake. the lake.

27:25

If 500 people were all

27:27

killed at once by

27:29

frozen things falling from above,

27:32

shouldn't there have been a few been

27:34

survivors? survivors? would

27:36

not be walking in one

27:39

huge in cluster. tight They would

27:41

have been spread out spread

27:43

out over several miles. several miles.

27:46

did the bodies all wind

27:48

up in the same the same location?

27:50

Let's see, maybe the survivors

27:52

carried the dead and

27:54

the dying to the lake.

27:56

the lake. I doubt it.

27:59

The survivor... would have taken steps,

28:01

many quick steps, get to

28:03

get away from what

28:05

looked to be cursed land.

28:07

There I go, There I go thinking

28:09

again with letters The

28:11

folks with letters behind their

28:13

names there was there was nothing weird

28:16

going on. go Time to go

28:18

back to watching TV and

28:20

stop asking all these

28:22

questions. The The

28:24

legend about Nanda Devi,

28:26

showering pilgrims with with

28:29

was based on an

28:31

actual but natural

28:33

event. event. Darn it, somebody didn't

28:35

didn't get the

28:37

memo. Another group of group

28:39

of researchers embarked on a

28:42

study of the skeletons and they

28:44

came away with a far

28:46

more bizarre conclusion. 16

28:52

research institutions, spread out

28:54

over three different

28:56

continents, looked at the

28:58

skeletons at they came up

29:00

with a and they came up point.

29:03

The bodies of quite

29:05

a few, like about

29:08

100 to 200, 100 came

29:10

from the the Mediterranean area.

29:12

Most of these were from

29:14

Crete, while others were from

29:17

all over southern Europe. To

29:20

to add to the confusing story, the

29:23

Mediterranean group group

29:25

died two or three hundred years

29:27

after the group

29:29

from India. More research

29:32

was carried out and more weird

29:34

findings came to light. to light.

29:37

weren't two distinct groups, but

29:39

maybe three or more. or

29:41

The first one was

29:43

around a thousand years ago.

29:45

ago. Doxy

29:49

robin nucleic acid.

29:51

A better known A better

29:53

known and easier to say, I

29:56

don't want to don't

29:58

want to read another article. about

30:00

DNA for a long

30:02

time. I got

30:04

sidetracked and I wound up going

30:06

into way too much research and

30:08

how it was done. Let's

30:10

just say the boys in

30:12

the white lab coats did a

30:14

bunch of sciency stuff and

30:16

they found out that some interesting

30:18

things had been missed The

30:22

folks in charge get a bunch

30:24

of students to do all the

30:26

grunt work, allowing the folks in

30:28

the White time to run around

30:30

doing lectures, telling other folks in

30:32

White Lab goats how smart they

30:35

are. Should one

30:37

of the students find

30:39

something extraordinary, said student gets

30:41

a passing grade and

30:43

the white -coated person publishes

30:45

a paper under their own

30:48

name minus the name of the

30:50

student Grants get handed

30:52

around to study the dating

30:54

habits of cockroaches and our

30:56

taxes go up while

30:59

the military tried to

31:01

weaponize everything. Now

31:03

that's my take on how science

31:05

is done today. What

31:07

was found to show the

31:09

skeletons from Rupkin Lake were

31:11

divided into three groups. The

31:15

first group were all from India, none

31:17

of them were related to each other

31:19

as far as they could tell, but

31:21

they were traveling in a group. The

31:24

research could find no

31:26

reason for these folks moving

31:28

together other than it being

31:30

a pilgrimage. The

31:33

date of death was

31:35

found to be around

31:37

7 to 950 AD.

31:39

about 1200 years ago. The

31:42

second bunch were mostly made

31:45

up of people from South

31:47

Asia. Once more, no idea

31:49

why they were on the

31:51

mountain in India what had

31:53

killed them. They died in

31:55

the early 1400s. The

31:57

last group were tracked back...

32:00

back to Greece, especially the

32:02

island of Crete. What

32:04

they were doing on the side

32:06

of a mountain in India, nobody can

32:08

even hazard a guess. The

32:11

scientists think there may have

32:13

been about a hundred Greek

32:15

citizens traveling through India when

32:18

they all died suddenly. on

32:20

the side of a mountain. in

32:22

the middle of nowhere. The

32:25

date of death was found

32:27

to be in the

32:29

1700s. The

32:31

scientists did rule out

32:33

battle since no weapons

32:35

were found. Disease was

32:37

also taken into consideration

32:39

by the DNA results.

32:42

No nasty person killing

32:44

bugs would have left

32:46

behind a telltale signs

32:48

of their nastiness, so

32:50

it wasn't disease that

32:52

killed everyone. The

32:54

folks in the white lab

32:57

coats, some of them were girls,

32:59

were uneasy about publishing the

33:01

18th century date, so they had

33:03

a few other colleagues put

33:05

their eyes on the samples. Lo

33:08

and behold, the recent date

33:10

held up to scrutiny. The

33:13

research was published bringing

33:15

on a firestorm from the

33:17

archaeologists who didn't believe

33:19

the dates could be right,

33:21

so therefore they weren't. Researchers

33:24

began sniping at each other

33:26

saying those people don't know

33:29

what the heck they're doing.

33:33

The almighty dollar decides what

33:35

is true and what

33:37

gets delivered into the round

33:39

file. Institutions

33:41

tend to believe what

33:43

their supporters want them

33:46

to believe. Anytime

33:48

there's a possibility of

33:50

funding being withdrawn, scientific

33:53

study will be not

33:55

so scientific. Evidence

33:57

will turn up to support just

34:00

about anything, as long

34:02

as it makes the folks

34:05

holding the purse strings

34:07

happy. The researchers with the

34:09

1700 date of death

34:11

hoped other researchers would come

34:14

forward to add their

34:16

voices to the argument. This

34:18

only brought on more nastiness

34:21

from the archaeology and

34:23

the history departments. When

34:26

William Sachs learned of the

34:29

results, he was incredulous. He

34:31

had spent years in the

34:34

mountain village below the lake

34:36

among the Devoteys of Nanda

34:39

Devi. The women considered themselves

34:41

to be the keepers of

34:43

the goddess's memory, and Sachs

34:46

had recorded and translated many

34:48

of their songs and stories

34:51

of the pilgrimage. He feels

34:53

certain that if a large

34:56

party of travelers, especially foreign

34:58

travelers, had died at Roopkund

35:01

in recent centuries, there would

35:03

have been some kind of

35:06

a record in the folklore.

35:08

It all sounds Greek to

35:11

me. 300 years isn't all

35:13

that long ago for people

35:16

to have been telling stories.

35:18

There should have been some

35:21

survivors who staggered back home

35:23

and wrote down their bizarre

35:26

trip through the mountains. Add

35:28

to this the idea of

35:31

a group of 18th century

35:33

Greeks on a Hindu pilgrimage

35:36

seemed far-fetched. A simpler explanation

35:38

would be that the Roopcund

35:41

bones somehow got mixed up

35:43

while sitting in storage. It

35:46

is quite possible that these

35:48

bones were contaminated, Sachs said,

35:50

and the researchers were simply

35:53

taking their provenance on trust.

35:55

Many anthropologists

35:58

and archaeologists are

36:00

uneasy about

36:03

the incursion of

36:05

genomics. into

36:08

their domain, and they're

36:10

suspicious of its findings no

36:12

matter what evidence is shown.

36:14

what evidence is thought

36:16

process is, archaeologists

36:18

and historians own our past

36:20

past and nobody is

36:22

allowed to stick their

36:24

noses in where they

36:26

don't belong. belong. People

36:29

get uneasy when

36:31

others begin talking about

36:33

genetics. genetics. brings up

36:35

ideas ideas like eugenics.

36:37

Eugenics is a is

36:39

a set of beliefs

36:41

and practices that that

36:44

to improve the genetic

36:46

quality of human population. Historically,

36:49

eugenics have attempted

36:51

to alter the

36:53

frequencies of various

36:55

human phenotypes by

36:57

inhibiting the fertility

36:59

of people and

37:01

groups of people and inferior.

37:03

considered inferior, or that

37:05

of those considered

37:08

superior. superior. Does this sound

37:10

this sound a little bit

37:12

like Nazi Germany in the

37:14

in the 1930s? The

37:16

The contemporary history of

37:18

eugenics began in

37:21

the began in the 19th a

37:23

popular eugenics movement

37:25

emerged movement emerged in

37:27

Kingdom, and then

37:29

spread to many countries to

37:32

the United States, Canada,

37:34

and Australia. States, Canada,

37:36

these countries began taking

37:38

steps to improve

37:41

their populace, some folks

37:43

in Europe some the

37:45

Germans, began to

37:47

take notice. notice. with

37:49

unwanted traits such

37:51

as as really dark

37:53

skin. skin or mental

37:56

issues, birth defects,

37:58

there there were

38:00

being... sterilized so they

38:02

they could no longer

38:04

spread their nasty deformed

38:06

gene. genes. The The Nazis got

38:08

some of their ideas

38:10

from the folks in the

38:12

United States. United States. began

38:15

to dig deeper looking

38:17

for a reason for for a

38:19

to be found at Skeleton

38:21

Lake. to be found at

38:24

Skeleton Lake. B .C.

38:26

BC. Skylax of

38:28

Crayonda, Greece journeyed through through

38:31

parts of India and

38:33

sailed down the

38:35

river Indus. his In

38:37

his Skyliss called

38:39

the river Indus, from which

38:41

the from which the

38:44

English name for the

38:46

subcontinent derives. After After storming

38:48

through Afghanistan and most

38:50

of the Middle East,

38:52

Middle East, Great invaded India

38:55

in invaded B .C. His

38:57

armies traversed the Indus

38:59

plains reached far far

39:01

as the B .S.

39:04

River before stopping. There

39:06

was lasting was lasting

39:08

Hellenic influence in the region

39:10

for centuries, although

39:13

the eventual decline of

39:15

Greek civilization largely

39:17

brought direct contact with

39:19

direct greased to an end. with Greece

39:21

to an end. Soldiers march

39:24

on their stomachs. but

39:26

they also want to relax

39:29

and enjoy their days off. days

39:31

off. There were were of

39:34

of negotiable affections to

39:36

be found throughout the

39:38

region. the region. Birth control

39:41

was iffy. There was

39:43

was bound to be

39:45

some kids, maybe a

39:48

lot of kids brought to

39:50

to this world as

39:52

a result of these negotiations.

39:56

This This could explain the

39:58

skeletons in the lake. lake. showing

40:00

Greek ancestry. It

40:02

should have been It should

40:04

have been DNA folks said DNA

40:07

folks said the bodies

40:09

were from Greece, markers.

40:11

Greek markers. The

40:13

historians to to allow this idea

40:15

to answer any questions. More

40:18

arguing ensued. Perhaps

40:23

the Roopkend thought there might

40:25

be a tribe or a

40:27

group in India in India

40:29

from Greeks. from Alexander

40:31

left behind commanders and soldiers

40:33

and some of the territories

40:36

that he conquered, many

40:38

of whom decided to stay. of

40:40

whom members of

40:42

the Members of the Kalash tribe

40:45

in Pakistan, say

40:47

that they are

40:49

descendants of Alexander's soldiers.

40:51

soldiers. The Kalash are a

40:54

distinct group of people

40:56

with their own

40:58

language and an ancient,

41:00

ancient and metaphysical belief

41:02

which focuses on

41:04

the on the supernatural universe.

41:07

research suggests that the

41:09

the have a a

41:11

European origin origin and

41:13

one disputed study

41:16

did find Greek heritage.

41:18

heritage. This was a

41:20

good answer until looked too close.

41:22

too close. The folks living in

41:24

the the area had had DNA,

41:26

DNA, but it did not

41:28

line up with the DNA

41:31

found at the at the skeleton lake.

41:33

again, the and the geneticists

41:35

began arguing about their

41:38

proof. about their proof.

41:40

By By carefully examining the

41:42

bones, bones, the of the dead,

41:44

that sounds like a horror

41:46

movie. movie. The The diet of

41:48

the folks who died at

41:50

the lake could be deciphered. It

41:52

It turned out that the

41:55

bodies from Greece had consumed food

41:57

typically found in the Mediterranean

41:59

area. and in the Indus

42:01

Valley. Valley. The folks in

42:03

white began, try that again,

42:05

the Try that again. The folks

42:07

in white, even though they disagreed on just

42:10

about everything, all all

42:12

the idea of everybody

42:14

at Skeleton Lake

42:16

being killed by killed by

42:18

hailstones. Over a thousand year

42:20

period of time, several groups

42:22

of people arrived at

42:24

the lake lake. only to

42:26

be pounded to death by

42:29

huge ice formations falling from

42:31

above. from above.

42:33

Mushriff Tripathi. I

42:35

hope I got that name right.

42:37

His I hope I got that name

42:39

are going to His relatives are going

42:42

to send me nasty notes. Mushriff Tripathi,

42:45

who was also part was

42:47

also part of the

42:49

2019 investigation, did not agree

42:51

with these findings. He looked

42:54

at the skeletons, especially the

42:56

ones with the skulls bashed in

42:58

and said in, and said, a

43:00

few show signs of what might

43:02

have been hail damage. He He

43:04

said that only five or

43:06

six skulls looked like they had

43:08

been hit by had been hit by

43:11

hailstones. The Stuart a

43:13

retired archaeologist, came up

43:15

with a new and interesting

43:17

theory. His

43:19

research focused. focused... on the

43:22

the migration of Paleo -Americans

43:24

in the New World

43:26

from Asia. said it said

43:29

it makes zero sense

43:31

that a party of

43:33

male and female Greek islanders

43:35

would be participating in

43:37

a Hindu a Hindu pilgrimage around 17

43:40

or 1800s. because, for

43:42

one, there is no

43:44

documented presence of any substantial

43:46

Greek communities in Northern

43:49

India at that time. that time,

43:51

and two, there is no

43:53

record of Europeans converting to

43:55

Hinduism or Buddhism in

43:58

this period. To

44:00

him the DNA evidence looked

44:02

more like the dead had

44:04

come from Armenia Historically,

44:08

the Armenians travel all throughout the

44:10

Indus Valley and they traded

44:12

goods all over Asia and Europe.

44:15

Several large Indian cities

44:17

have Armenian communities

44:19

that go back centuries.

44:21

As As for

44:23

the hillstone theory, he didn't much

44:26

care for that either. Fidel

44:28

said that he thought the cause

44:30

of death was a run -in with

44:33

the thuggies. a

44:36

thuggy translated from

44:38

Hindu as swindler or

44:40

deceiver. It is

44:42

related with the verb

44:44

tugda which means to deceive

44:47

from Sanskrit. This

44:49

term described the murder

44:51

and robbery of travelers, which

44:53

was popular in the

44:55

Northern part of Indian subcontinent,

44:58

especially the Northern and

45:00

Eastern regions of India. The

45:02

English word thug

45:04

is derived from the

45:07

term thuggy. The

45:10

thuggy operated as

45:12

gangs of highwaymen who

45:14

tricked and murdered

45:16

their victims, usually by

45:18

strangulation. To

45:20

take advantage of their victims,

45:22

the thugs would join

45:24

travelers, or pilgrims, and gain

45:26

their confidence, which would

45:28

allow them to surprise and

45:30

murder the travelers. One

45:33

of the thuggy would

45:35

befriend their potential targets, sometimes

45:37

even going as far

45:39

as converting to their religion

45:42

and accompanying them on

45:44

their journey to assess their

45:46

potential wealth. When

45:49

the time was right, one

45:51

thug would distract their victims

45:53

by engaging them in conversation.

45:57

the other members would slip up

45:59

from behind end, strangle them.

46:02

The killer would have a silk

46:04

cord or a sash with a

46:06

weight sewn into one end. Sometimes

46:08

this would be a coin. The

46:11

piece of cloth was swung

46:13

out and around the intended

46:15

victim's neck and then pulled

46:17

tight. One

46:19

theory on why the Thuggies

46:22

preferred to use strangulation was

46:24

that it took advantage of

46:26

a loophole in civil law

46:28

which persisted from the times

46:30

of the Mughal For

46:34

a murderer to be sentenced

46:36

to death he or she

46:38

must have shed the bloods

46:40

of their victims Those

46:43

who murdered, but did

46:45

not shed blood, might face

46:47

imprisonment, hard labor, or

46:49

just pay a penalty. but

46:52

they would not risk execution.

46:55

Another theory says that the

46:57

thuggies considered themselves to

46:59

be the children of Kali,

47:02

having been created from

47:04

her sweat. Ooh,

47:07

sounds nasty The

47:09

British ruling India generally

47:11

took the view that the

47:13

Thuggy was a type

47:15

of ritual murderer a by

47:17

worshippers of Kali. After

47:23

the murder, they sometimes

47:25

mutilated the corpse to

47:27

hide the evidence and

47:29

buried the remains or

47:32

dump them in a lake or a river. There

47:35

was no one group of

47:37

thuggies. The different groups were formed

47:39

in their home villages and

47:41

towns, and then they moved from

47:44

place to place as a

47:46

group looking for victims and staying

47:48

away from the authorities. One

47:51

theory says the Thuggy

47:53

were formed sometime around

47:55

1760. This would put

47:57

them outside the timeline

47:59

of... two-thirds of the

48:02

bodies at Skeleton Lake. Others have

48:04

found evidence of the origin

48:06

of the Thuggy dating back to

48:08

the second half of the the

48:10

second half of the A general consensus

48:12

among them was that

48:14

they originated in Delhi. they originated

48:17

in named named

48:19

Golam Hasan was caught

48:22

in early 1800s, stating that that

48:24

his accomplices that that

48:26

thugs had existed since

48:28

the time of Alexander. the

48:31

great. Another Another tradition

48:34

among who lived in the

48:36

early early 1800s, stated that

48:38

they had lived in Delhi

48:40

in Delhi the time of time

48:42

of consisted of seven great

48:44

Muslim clans, although they

48:47

all had Hindu names. names. After

48:50

one of them killed the the

48:52

slave of Akbar, of they left

48:54

Delhi for other regions to avoid

48:56

being targeted by the emperor. by

48:59

the idea would encompass

49:01

all of the skeletons. of

49:03

the skeletons. Although was

49:06

their preferred method of

49:08

murder, they sometimes used

49:10

knives, swords, or even

49:12

or even poison. Travel was

49:14

a was a relatively dangerous

49:17

activity. Most folks

49:19

going long distances were known to carry

49:21

gold or silver or pay for all

49:23

the things that they were unable

49:25

to bring with them to When

49:27

supplies were needed, the were would

49:29

head to a town or a

49:32

village to buy what they needed. to

49:34

buy what another If another

49:36

traveler were, if other were

49:39

in town and heading the

49:41

same direction, it it was

49:43

common to join up

49:45

and travel together. together. safety

49:47

in numbers. Well, at Well, at least that's

49:49

what they would think. Thuggies

49:51

would spot any would spot

49:54

any group of strangers in

49:56

town and pretend to be

49:58

like -minded people who just - happen

50:00

to be going the same direction. the

50:02

same direction. face it, most

50:04

people are not paranoid. not

50:06

They see the good in

50:08

others. others. Sometimes to their

50:10

own detriment. Over the the

50:13

course of the next few

50:15

days, days, the would figure out who

50:17

was in charge, was in who

50:19

was possibly a fighter, a who

50:21

needed to be taken out first.

50:23

out first? When it was time

50:25

to act, the gang would

50:27

work in in take down everybody

50:29

who might be a potential problem.

50:32

The rest The be dealt with

50:34

later. with later. member of

50:36

the caravan or pilgrimage was

50:39

taken out to do away with

50:41

any possible witnesses. with any possible

50:43

witnesses. prevents

50:45

poor performance. and

50:48

the and did a

50:50

lot of prior planning planning.

50:53

A Thuggies were more of a religion

50:55

than a cult. than a

50:57

a third of them were of

50:59

them while the rest were

51:01

Hindu the rest were Hindu or This

51:04

can be seen as

51:06

odd This can are monotheistic.

51:08

are They only believe in

51:10

one They only believe in one

51:13

Well, just one

51:15

one God. Or, seeing seeing

51:17

as the British did most of

51:19

the writing of the the thuggies, we

51:21

are now reading we

51:23

a lot of their history

51:25

is shrouded in what was

51:27

perceived at the time. in what

51:29

was were more

51:31

economically influenced than religious.

51:34

were more economically

51:36

influenced than

51:38

1932. this. Sicily,

51:41

1932. Uh, way back in the

51:43

late the late 900s. A a group

51:45

of folks had become become They

51:48

lived somewhere

51:50

around Roopkin Lake, and maybe

51:52

or six days' travel. days travel.

51:55

As as pilgrims

51:57

come through town lookouts

51:59

would check them out to

52:01

see who might be financially

52:03

well well-heeled. If there was

52:05

a band of of on their

52:07

way to pay homage to homage to

52:09

Nanda Devi, the might have put on

52:12

their traveling clothes and said, clothes

52:14

a coincidence! what a We're heading

52:16

to the same place. to the

52:18

same place! Once at the this this

52:20

would have seemed like a

52:22

good place to camp. camp.

52:24

This may have been the the...

52:27

-designated place to murder everybody

52:29

and steal what they could. what

52:31

they could. would explain the

52:33

lack of any visible

52:35

visible, valuables found in

52:37

or around the a skeleton

52:40

lake. This could also explain

52:42

some of the skulls having been

52:44

bashed in. been The in. may

52:46

have had to use extreme measures

52:48

on a few folks. measures on

52:50

a few folks. goes by, and...

52:52

of years later, another group

52:54

of pilgrims of to the

52:57

same mountain pass same the

52:59

same village or even another

53:01

village another village not now occupied

53:03

by the descendants of the

53:06

Thuggies, on this trip

53:08

the piles of skeletons might

53:10

have given away the murder

53:12

plans given away the murder it was

53:14

explained away as being the away

53:16

as being the cemetery. authorities

53:18

tell us tell us the

53:21

thuggies taken care of. They were rounded

53:23

up and dealt with. dealt

53:25

with, or they they simply

53:27

cease to be. kind of of

53:29

like how murder has ceased

53:31

to be. folks The folks

53:34

from the might have might have

53:36

encountered a criminal band who

53:38

used methods similar to

53:40

the to the only they

53:42

have far better murder techniques. murder

53:46

I still see more questions

53:48

than answers. answers. I

53:51

I don't like coincidences. Life

53:54

is anything orderly.

53:56

I've seen seen too many

53:58

good folks encountered. many

54:00

bad things. things. seen

54:02

too many criminals get

54:04

away scot get away

54:06

Scott I had to look that one up. to

54:08

look that one up. Scott

54:11

an old word. an old

54:13

one word, one word derives

54:16

from the from

54:18

the old English Scott Free,

54:20

which in became

54:23

English became shot free.

54:25

The Scott or Shot in

54:27

the Old farm the

54:29

old old denoted a

54:31

royal tax tax. So

54:34

someone who was

54:36

declared scot-free or shot-free was

54:38

exempt from having

54:41

to pay taxes. Life

54:44

is not is not

54:46

orderly. out the you walk out

54:48

the door in the morning, is a

54:50

a real possibility that you

54:52

might not walk back in later

54:54

that day. day. Coincidences

54:56

would suggest things

54:59

happen for some reason.

55:01

reason. Some kind kind of

55:03

unknown reason that things

55:05

happen. At least three At

55:08

least three distinct groups of

55:10

people from different parts of

55:12

the planet, traveled to the

55:14

Himalayan mountains, spread out

55:17

over over a year period

55:19

of time, of all encountered

55:21

the same form of mass

55:23

destruction. in the

55:25

same place. Whatever killed

55:27

these these folks was

55:29

powerful enough nobody survived

55:31

to tell what happened This

55:34

is one of those is one

55:36

of those stories we may never have

55:38

answers for. of the many

55:40

of the skeletons were removed, with or

55:42

with, or even added to, the

55:44

the boys in the white

55:46

lab coats will never get to

55:48

the bottom of things. things. They

55:51

can't even say for

55:53

sure if there were were

55:55

or 700 skeletons They don't don't

55:57

know what killed them, so they

55:59

can't... say for sure that the

56:01

killing has stopped. stopped. To

56:03

make make matters even

56:05

worse, the the Indian government

56:08

wants to develop the area

56:10

around the the area around a

56:12

tourist attraction. as a tourist

56:15

attraction. Bring kids,

56:17

swim in Take

56:19

back some back

56:21

memories. memories. More folks folks

56:24

cramping around the area. more

56:26

folks carrying off body

56:28

parts. parts. You know the

56:30

folks living nearby will want

56:33

to set up food stands

56:35

food sell souvenirs. T

56:37

-shirts from Skeleton Lake?

56:40

I want one. one. a

56:42

plastic Maybe a plastic arm

56:44

bone for the kids. spending

56:46

their hard-earned their

56:48

hard earned cash to see the lake

56:50

are not going to want to sleep in

56:53

tents, so hotels will need

56:55

to be built. along

56:57

with easily airstrip.

56:59

This leads me to This leads

57:01

me to wonder. caused the

57:03

death of around 500 people, all

57:05

caused the death of

57:07

around 500 people, all in

57:09

the same small area,

57:11

is something that is going

57:14

to happen again. to Mount

57:16

sometime soon to be killed in

57:18

of like all those folks keep going up

57:21

to Mount Everest, only to

57:23

be killed in avalanches and blizzards.

57:25

Things happen. Life is is

57:28

not orderly. A friend of

57:30

mine contacted me friend of

57:32

mine contacted me I about the

57:35

book I was writing with Bigfoot

57:37

encounter in it. it. I I

57:39

told him the book was out.

57:41

to only to realize that I

57:44

hadn't finished it yet, and

57:46

and not even close. close. I

57:48

I got one book confused

57:50

with another. another. I'm still

57:52

looking for stories to put out

57:54

for your reading pleasures. your reading

57:56

pleasures. If you, like

57:59

nonfiction, I'm working on working

58:01

on it. say that Let me

58:03

say that again, that sounded bad. like

58:05

If you like I'm working on it. Any

58:07

I'm working on it. stories

58:09

that good, bad, or otherwise

58:11

sure you might have, can

58:13

as long as you're sure

58:16

that can be stories your can be

58:18

a welcome addition. you about These

58:20

can be stories your grandparents

58:22

told you your their encounter

58:24

with a monster or the

58:26

time your uncle was abducted

58:28

by aliens. aliens the one is from outer

58:30

space. space. Send them to

58:33

them to me and I'll work

58:35

them into a readable paragraph or

58:37

two and I'll send you the

58:39

draft so you can say yes

58:41

or no. That's how it went. That's

58:43

how it If you like the

58:45

way I tell your story, let

58:47

me know and I'll hopefully get

58:50

my next book out before 2026. book

58:52

out before If you have a

58:54

you have a story, send it

58:56

it to... Strange Things

58:58

at arcanasa

59:01

.com next

59:03

Till next Saturday, this

59:05

is Chris James

59:07

for for Strange Things. to

59:28

the tree where they strung

59:30

up a man who they

59:33

say he murdered three strange

59:35

things have happened there no

59:38

stranger would it be if

59:40

we met at midnight in

59:43

the hanging tree