0:00

I added one more podcast

0:03

to the giant podcast bin

0:05

Now you have plucked that

0:07

podcast out and started listening

0:09

I took my microphone and

0:11

found some human folk Then

0:15

I recorded all the noises while

0:17

we spoke My

0:20

name is Adam Buxton I'm a

0:22

man I

0:25

want you to enjoy this, that's the

0:27

plan The

0:43

beautiful bucolic sound of the wood

0:46

pigeon That

0:48

is what woke me up this morning at 7.30am

0:53

It's a Saturday so

0:55

I wouldn't have minded sleeping a little while

0:57

longer It

1:00

would have been fine if the wood pigeon

1:03

wasn't quite so close to the bedroom window

1:06

But I suppose there's worse sounds to be woken

1:08

by Even

1:12

though it is grey and

1:14

cloudy now that I'm out here on my

1:16

walk with Rose Dog Who's

1:19

doing fine aren't you doglegs? It's

1:22

not quite as windy or as rainy as it

1:24

has been recently So all in all I'm

1:27

gonna say winning! Charlie

1:31

Sheen called back there, I wish we heard more

1:33

from Charlie Sheen He

1:35

should run for president Hey

1:37

how you doing podcast, it's Adam Buxton

1:40

here Okay let me tell you

1:42

a bit about podcast number 220 Which

1:45

features a rambling conversation

1:48

with American actor, comedian,

1:50

voice artist, screenwriter, producer

1:53

and musician Fred

1:55

Armisen Here's a few

1:58

bullet points from Fred Vax sheet.

2:02

Ferreydun Robert Armisen was born

2:04

in Hattiesburg, Mississippi in 1966,

2:06

the son of

2:09

a Venezuelan mother and a

2:11

father of mixed German and South

2:14

Korean heritage. In the late

2:16

1980s, after attending the School

2:19

of Visual Arts in Manhattan for

2:21

a while, Fred moved to Chicago,

2:23

where he served as the drummer

2:25

of a punk band named Trenchmouth,

2:27

with who he played and toured

2:29

for nearly a decade. During the

2:31

90s, Fred's focus shifted from music

2:33

towards acting and comedy, and after

2:35

a handful of TV appearances in

2:37

the early 2000s, Fred

2:40

became a cast member of the

2:42

American comedy show Saturday Night Live,

2:44

or SNL, where he

2:47

remained for 11 seasons between

2:49

2002 and 2013. SNL was where Fred formed

2:51

his friendship with

2:55

comedian and former podcast guest,

2:57

more importantly, Bill Hader. Bill,

3:00

Fred and former SNL cast

3:02

member Seth Meyers started the

3:04

documentary spoof series, Documentary Now,

3:07

in 2015. They've made

3:10

four seasons so far. And

3:12

then there's Portlandia, the sketch show

3:14

set in the town of Portland,

3:17

Oregon that Fred created in 2010

3:19

with his friend Carrie Brownstein of

3:22

the seminal indie rockers, Sleater Kinney, who

3:24

are still going strong. Along

3:26

with Fred and Carrie, Portlandia, which

3:29

first aired in early 2011, features

3:31

a cast of comedy performers, including

3:33

another former podcast guest, Matt Berry,

3:36

as well as cameos from dozens

3:38

of left field musicians who popped

3:40

up in sketches that, over eight

3:42

seasons, lovingly took the piss out

3:44

of the preciousness and pretensions of

3:46

the community Fred and Carrie knew

3:48

best. Artists, musicians and

3:51

creative types in general. In

3:54

addition to all of that, Fred

3:56

has appeared in films including Anchorman,

3:58

EuroTrip, Tenacious D, and The and

4:00

the pick of Destiny and Zoolander 2,

4:03

and TV shows that include 30 Rock,

4:05

Modern Family, Parks and Recreation,

4:08

Tim and Eric's Awesome Show,

4:10

What We Do in the Shadows, and

4:12

the series Moonbase 8, which Fred

4:15

wrote along with co-stars Tim Heidecker

4:17

of Tim and Eric and John

4:19

C. Riley. Fred also

4:21

does live comedy, and my

4:23

conversation with him was recorded the

4:25

morning after I'd seen his show

4:28

Comedy for Musicians, but everyone is

4:30

welcome at the Earth

4:32

venue in Hackney, East London, back

4:34

in late November of last year,

4:36

2023. That show featured Fred on

4:38

stage with guitar, keyboards and drums,

4:40

all of which he played in

4:42

the course of doing a stream

4:44

of jokes about music, filled

4:46

with observations, parodies, deconstructions

4:49

and impressions of some

4:51

of the artists and genres closest to

4:53

Fred's heart, with British punk

4:55

and pop, featuring heavily.

4:58

The day after the show, I met Fred

5:00

face-to-face for the first time, and it wasn't

5:02

long before we got into the subject of

5:04

music, with conversation turning

5:06

Bowie-shaped after a mention

5:09

of Bowie's producer Tony Visconti and

5:11

his friendship with Matt Berry. Incidentally,

5:13

at that point in the conversation,

5:16

we mentioned the Japanese vocalist who

5:19

features on the first track of Bowie's album

5:21

Scary Monsters, and I

5:23

failed to recall her name while we were

5:25

speaking. She's called Michi Hirota. She

5:28

was a member of Japan's Red Buddha Theatre,

5:31

and she is also, fun fact, one of

5:33

the two women on the

5:35

cover of the Sparks album, Kimono My

5:37

House. Michi Hirota is the one

5:39

holding a fan, and

5:42

it is her who declaims

5:44

so impressively at the

5:46

very start of Scary Monsters. As

5:49

well as other music chat, including times

5:51

when Fred met his heroes David Byrne

5:53

of Talking Heads and Paul McCartney of

5:55

Beatles, I talked to Fred a little

5:57

bit about how he came up with

5:59

the song. to be on Saturday Night

6:01

Live and why he wasn't nervous

6:03

for his audition and he told

6:05

me about the Portlandia sketches that he felt

6:07

summed up the show best. But

6:10

we began with me setting up mics

6:12

and Fred admiring the strips of

6:14

black and pink gaffer tape, artfully

6:17

arranged, on the back of my

6:19

laptop, back at the end for a bit more waffle,

6:22

but right now with Fred and

6:55

Fred, I'm

6:57

going to show you how to make a video.

7:06

Look at your laptop. Wow. You

7:08

got some... I want to tell you, you

7:11

may be able to relate to this. It's

7:13

from doing shows and staying in hotels

7:16

and realizing that there's a

7:18

very bright light on the

7:20

smoke alarm and you turn the

7:23

light off and suddenly the whole room is

7:25

sort of in a pool of jade green

7:27

light and you can't get to sleep and

7:30

I always think like, shit, I wish I had

7:32

some tape with me. And so rather than carry

7:34

a roll of tape around, I have these strips

7:36

of gaffer on the

7:38

laptop. So there's always enough tape to

7:40

do some sort of job without actually

7:42

carrying the whole roll around. But it

7:44

looks like an art piece too. Yeah,

7:46

thanks. That's one of

7:49

my very few life hacks. That's

7:52

a good one. Someone taught me a life

7:54

hack of closing the curtains at a hotel using

7:57

a hanger, like the hanger for

7:59

your jackets and stuff. There's clips.

8:02

Oh yes. For pants or

8:04

trousers. You use those clips

8:06

on the curtain to really...beep beep.

8:09

Shut up the light coming in in the morning. Yeah.

8:12

That is a good hack. That's a good one. I

8:14

was at your show last night. Oh

8:16

thanks for going. That was fantastic. Thank you. I

8:18

loved it. That was a good venue. I saw

8:20

Tim Heidecker at that same venue a while

8:23

ago. As I said on stage

8:25

a million times, I love England. I love

8:27

being in England and just being

8:29

at that venue was like to

8:31

think that anyone from England would

8:33

show up. You know, just

8:35

because I've been such

8:38

a fan of everything from here. It still blows

8:40

my mind. There was a lot of love for

8:43

you in that room. I hope so. It was

8:47

cool man. It was a really

8:49

packed house. Very attractive crowd I

8:51

noticed. Oh good. As a creepy

8:53

54 year old man walking through

8:55

and thinking, oh look at this

8:57

attractive young crowd. Wow. I was

9:00

jealous of your audience. I couldn't, you know,

9:02

I can't really see from the stage. Yeah.

9:04

Because of lights and stuff

9:06

but they sounded great. Yeah

9:08

they were good. But

9:10

I will say about Tim

9:13

Heidecker, he's, you

9:15

know, he's one of the funniest people

9:17

I've ever met. And about

9:19

his music thing, I sometimes think of him as

9:21

like a Matt Berry type. Even

9:24

though I always wanted to be

9:26

a Matt Berry type, I feel like Tim really

9:28

is just because of the way he

9:30

does music. He approaches it

9:32

in a more serious way.

9:34

What is a Matt Berry

9:36

type then? You know, like

9:38

a Matt Berry. An insane

9:40

guy who's talented at music

9:42

as well. It's so hard

9:45

to describe without sounding like someone who

9:47

writes for, you

9:49

know, a publication or something. But like that

9:52

approach to music which is like he

9:54

clearly loves it but he's not a show off about

9:56

it. Yeah, yeah. He's not like, oh

9:59

look how much I can do. do. It's

10:01

more like I'm obsessed with recording. Yeah. He

10:03

is a massive nerd. He

10:05

tracked down Tony Visconti at some point

10:08

and chewed his ear off for hours

10:10

about all the gear that Visconti used

10:12

on Lo and things

10:14

like that. And Visconti was delighted to

10:16

furnish him with all the info. So

10:20

Matt constructed a sort

10:22

of hybrid

10:25

version of a Lo song like from

10:27

Bowie's album Lo, using

10:29

a lot of the same gear that Tony Visconti used

10:32

to try and get the same really

10:34

drum sound with the even tied harmonizer and

10:36

all this kind of stuff. Wow.

10:58

He's so into it. But did he have Tony

11:00

like produce it or anything? I don't think so.

11:02

I think he enjoyed the challenge of doing it

11:04

himself. I might be wrong about that. Have you

11:07

met Tony Visconti? I did

11:09

a Zoom call with him, a Zoom

11:12

interview during the pandemic. And

11:14

I was nervous about doing it because

11:16

I have a sketch that I did

11:19

that's on YouTube. And it's

11:21

actually it was animated by the animator. I've seen

11:23

that one. Yeah. Yeah. Who did his voice? I

11:26

did. I did get all the voices on there.

11:28

Yeah. But is that mean? No,

11:30

it's not. The joke was that it was

11:33

Tony Visconti complaining that everyone thought

11:35

Brian Eno produced the Berlin trilogy

11:37

when actually he was at the

11:40

very least the co-producer. And

11:42

he keeps saying, Tony

11:44

Visconti doing more than people think on

11:46

this record. But then I got an

11:48

email from Brian Eno, who

11:50

I'd never met at that point. Somehow

11:52

he got my email address and he

11:54

said, I loved your Tony Visconti in

11:56

the studio sketch. It's

11:59

very accurate. he said, and

12:01

it's one of the funniest things I've seen on YouTube,

12:03

it's incredibly flat out, and he said, however, I keep

12:06

bumping into people who think that that's what

12:08

it was actually like with us in the

12:11

studio, and that Tony was always complaining about

12:13

not getting enough credit, actually that's not what

12:15

it was like at all, and we couldn't

12:17

have made the album without him, and he's

12:20

one of the funniest, nicest people I know,

12:22

so I feel a bit bad for him.

12:25

So then I was nervous about doing

12:28

the interview with this, but he was totally fine. Did

12:31

you address it? Did you bring up? I think we did,

12:33

yeah. I think I sort of glossed over, I didn't

12:35

want to make him feel like he was on the spot, but

12:38

it was totally fine. I

12:41

met him once, and I went

12:43

to his studio in New York, and he's got

12:45

that sort of half American,

12:48

half English accent, but he

12:51

played tracks from Scary Monsters,

12:54

isolated. Oh, wow. So

12:57

just a vocal track, and

12:59

it's incredible hearing

13:01

how strong, I can't

13:03

believe I'm saying, I'm pitching that David Boy's

13:06

voice is strong, but it is really like,

13:08

it's so heavy and loud, it

13:11

was so, so great to hear it, that

13:14

I thought Tony Bisconti should go on tour,

13:16

and just have tracks, and just have

13:18

people listen to, you know, you could raise your hand

13:20

and say, can I just hear the bass? I do

13:22

feel like nerds would show up for it. Oh, definitely.

13:24

I would go. You must have

13:27

seen that clip on YouTube where

13:29

he's isolating tracks from

13:31

Heroes. Yes. Which is great.

13:33

The synthesizer, like, there's that

13:35

weird synthesizer patch that's, he

13:38

describes it as cheesy, or corny

13:40

or something, but it's totally

13:42

necessary for the song. Of course. Yeah.

13:46

I love all that stuff. And

13:48

Bowie in 1980, like when they did Scary

13:51

Monsters, which would have been recorded

13:53

in 79 or 80. His

13:56

voice was at his best. Oh, man. I

13:58

think. So, so. He

14:00

was really good. I agree. I was

14:02

in art class at school and the teacher

14:04

put it on the stereo Put like a

14:06

record on the actual. That's a good teacher

14:08

Yeah, really good teacher and I remember hearing

14:11

it's no game coming on and all the

14:13

clunky And

14:16

then it just blows up into

14:18

this mad For the

14:20

punk squall of Shao-chan. Yeah. Yeah. Oh,

14:23

it's perfect Honey

14:31

described that the Japanese

14:33

you hear in the beginning was a filler

14:36

she was It's I

14:38

think she was Narrating what you're

14:41

supposed to what you should be saying

14:43

in Japanese. Uh-huh So

14:45

that they could translate it or that someone else can

14:47

do it But then they liked her take I by

14:49

the way, I could be getting this totally wrong This

14:51

is just what I remember. I think that's right. She

14:53

is saying silhouettes and shadows, isn't she? Oh, I can't

14:56

yeah Can you think how do

14:58

we both not speak Japanese? Can

15:01

you do like in my mind I can hear

15:03

what she is saying Yeah, even though I don't

15:05

know what the words me or again. She's got

15:07

a shimmy the salary. Oh, that's so good No,

15:09

I can't do it verbatim. But it's pro. I

15:12

mean, I'm sure I'm way. It's like so Dramatic

15:15

the way she's doing because she puts like drama

15:17

into it. Yeah, I just looked

15:19

over in in the room that

15:21

we're in I see you have a haircut 100 record.

15:23

Yeah. Did you like them? Yeah, they're great. Oh Yeah,

15:26

have you ever met him he's very funny Nick Howard

15:29

and I think Liverpool No,

15:31

where are they from? I would imagine they're

15:34

sort of home counties guys Or

15:38

just Londoners maybe But

15:40

he's really why I thought that he's very

15:42

funny Nick Hayward. He's got quite an eccentric

15:44

sense of humor Haircut

15:48

100 That

15:51

is one of my favorite albums. It's great.

15:53

Pelican West. It's funny that Whatever they were

15:55

a part of doesn't have a name You're

15:58

not 100, you know Well, I

16:01

mean they started out quite punky. There's

16:03

a demo of Fantastic Day That's

16:05

like a straightforward punk song really

16:13

They're from Beckenham in London haircut

16:16

100. Ah, and I just

16:18

said Liverpool and now Haircut

16:20

100 are gonna be offended and mad and then

16:23

you're also you're gonna see me as not knowing

16:25

anything about the British I'm sure you know way

16:27

more than I do. I don't know. I certainly

16:29

I got that city wrong haircut 100 a canceling

16:31

you But

16:35

going back to Matt Berry, yeah, obviously

16:37

he's amazing But he

16:39

sort of just does his thing

16:42

That's he is more or less stays

16:44

himself and the world around him changes and

16:47

he adapts to whichever Comedic

16:49

environment he's in but he's basically just

16:51

Matt Berry. Yep and

16:54

every time I see him or Talk

16:56

to him or whatever. I'm like, that's the way to be.

16:58

Yeah, he seems like he's one of

17:00

those people like figured out how to live, you

17:02

know, mmm Whereas you

17:04

are something of a chameleon Yeah,

17:08

I guess I mean you obviously you're able

17:10

to do every accident under the Sun and

17:12

you do characters in a way that You

17:15

know Matt obviously does characters in plays roles.

17:17

Yeah, there is some acting going on there,

17:19

but He doesn't

17:21

really do like madly different acts.

17:23

I guess not. Yeah It's

17:26

like a different he sounds more like him. Yeah

17:28

all the way through. Yeah. Yeah, and

17:31

were you like what's your Forgive

17:33

me if I'm asking you stuff that you've been asked a million times

17:36

before But how did you get I

17:38

could never be mad about that? Can you imagine if I was

17:40

in a place in my life where I was like, listen,

17:42

I can't get asset anymore But

17:46

that's what musicians are like, aren't they though they

17:49

don't like being asked about the past very much

17:51

have you found that yes it's

17:54

really weak summer into it and Some

17:57

have a little bit of a chip on the shoulder about it And

18:00

I'm thinking of two exact there's some people who are like love

18:02

talking about it They're into it, but there's

18:05

one I won't say who there's one guy I

18:07

met and I was talking about his band and

18:10

then I'd seen his band and I can

18:12

tell This wasn't even an interview

18:16

He did not want to talk about it. I

18:18

guess he did this thing where he became a

18:22

stranger in in his own conversation Meaning

18:26

he just turned into a person who it

18:29

looked like I was telling us like someone

18:31

who'd never heard of the band Oh really?

18:33

Oh This is

18:35

like who are you talking about? Oh

18:37

that band and he put such a

18:39

distance piece But I you know, I

18:42

read the room and I was like, oh he does not

18:44

want to talk about that's fine by me my theory is

18:46

that Music journalism is

18:48

so terrible that they become

18:50

traumatized. Yes. No disrespect to their music

18:52

journalists Let's me love you music journal.

18:55

Some of them are amazing. Yes. Some

18:57

of them are great I just can't

19:00

get over the fact that there's such a thing as

19:02

a bad music review because

19:05

Just over the years now that time has gone.

19:07

I think back to music reviews. I'm like why

19:11

Did you criticize this person who's dead now?

19:13

Mm-hmm. Why did you in

19:16

that month just create? I don't

19:18

know Just a bummer Unless

19:21

you've written a bad review about a band. Oh,

19:23

you know what? I did. I used to be

19:25

a real little twat Not

19:28

anymore. I'm great now. But when

19:30

I was at University for

19:32

all of one term, I Wrote

19:36

for the student magazine and

19:38

I wrote a review of a band called

19:40

Hugh and cry I remember Hugh and cry.

19:42

Yeah, I think there was Scottish. I think

19:45

you're right and They

19:47

had a single I think it was called looking for

19:49

Linda or something like that. I can't remember Anyway,

19:53

it wasn't my sort of thing at all.

19:55

I thought it was too drippy. Mm-hmm. And

19:57

so I just wrote this really snarky horrible

20:00

sarcastic review and

20:03

I thought that maybe they were I didn't like

20:05

the lyrics I thought they were too pretentious and

20:08

I just went for it and

20:11

it was awful but you can forgive yourself

20:13

and that you were just young I suppose

20:15

so yeah you just that's when you imagine

20:17

being 20 in your 20s making everything

20:20

that comes everything that comes out of your

20:22

mouth is just it's just dumb I know

20:24

it fancy 20 or I'm just saying for

20:27

me when I was in my 20s the stuff

20:29

I would just say you know that band

20:31

sucks yes exactly or whatever yeah

20:34

because music is important and when you care

20:36

about music you feel very

20:38

passionate about it you're very partisan yes

20:41

if your bet if your favorite band

20:43

lets you down or God forbid sells

20:45

out oh my god what

20:48

a crime were you one of those

20:50

people massive snob come on the obviously

20:52

the 90s was all about and there

20:55

was such a thing of if

20:58

you're on a major label if you if

21:00

your song is in a commercial it

21:02

was just like death death

21:05

to that band you were like you

21:07

were so offended that they would do something like that

21:10

what were you like as a 20 year

21:12

old apart from being a music snob well

21:14

well actually when I turned 20 I was

21:16

here I was

21:19

traveling through I had midway

21:21

through college or the university I

21:24

just wanted to go traveling and so I

21:27

got like a work visa for England and

21:30

ended up in Scotland for a while and I

21:32

was there for like six months but it seems like

21:34

a much longer time but I was in Edinburgh and

21:37

yeah this is where I wanted to be I

21:40

love it you know I just love it here

21:42

and you came because you were already a fan

21:44

of British music and things like that yeah yeah

21:46

it was like it really was like someone going

21:49

to Hollywood or something I was like I'm gonna

21:52

go to England and then Scotland for

21:54

a done is that your real

21:56

name that's my real name or that's the name I was

21:58

born with because my that was my dad dad's name or

22:00

is you know but we both changed their name

22:03

because everyone was calling us Fred right

22:05

what was your dad up to he worked

22:07

for IBM oh and we should

22:10

plug IBM while we're out of

22:12

course yeah so IBM international business

22:14

machines there

22:17

for all your business needs what

22:19

did you want dad do for them he

22:23

did like internal auditing towards the end of

22:25

his run there but other than that

22:28

I have no idea you know

22:30

business man this is a briefcase yeah go

22:32

to the you know he wasn't writing code and

22:35

no no I asked

22:37

him man I was like dad are

22:39

you writing code and

22:42

he's like no

22:44

I was like all right let me know if you're

22:46

writing code he wasn't someone

22:50

that you sort of thought oh I want to do

22:52

what dad does a little bit and

22:54

then he traveled all the time right so

22:57

he was always traveling and there's something about it

22:59

that I was like oh that seems pretty great

23:01

and I remember him being like no it's not

23:03

great it's just hotels but

23:05

then I thought I love hotels which I do

23:07

yeah and when did you join a band high

23:10

school and I

23:13

was in a hardcore punk band called

23:15

the KGB the KGB yeah which gives

23:17

you an idea as to like what

23:20

you know this is 1983 or something

23:23

so that's quite good name but

23:26

it's very of the time though

23:28

you know yeah like that's around

23:30

the time that red dawn came

23:32

out one the one where Russian

23:34

paratroopers land in a high school

23:36

and execute the teachers yeah in

23:38

Alaska yeah yeah so

23:41

you're in the KGB yeah age

23:44

16 yep and what were

23:46

your songs like were you writing songs

23:49

kind of imitation fast

23:52

so there's bands who really played fast but we tried

23:54

to play faster you know we're too young to really

23:56

master it but one

23:59

of the songs was called fight bird. That was like, that

24:01

gives you an idea. And sort of

24:03

this tempo, like, you know,

24:07

it was fun. Kind of

24:09

like, at the time we thought it sounded aggressive.

24:11

Now when I hear it, I'm like, it was pretty regular.

24:14

Yeah. Were you singing then? Nope.

24:17

My friend Kenny was singing. And

24:20

he loved God, he was so into

24:22

hardcore. And he introduced me to

24:24

all, in fact, you know, so many

24:26

British bands. Like who? Well,

24:29

we opened for a band called GBH. That was like

24:31

the sort of second wave of punk. Yeah. I then

24:33

must have been like the third wave of punk. They

24:35

were quite big. Yeah, they were great.

24:39

And by he was so cool that the

24:42

clash was already passé to him. He was

24:44

already like advanced into gang

24:46

of four and all that stuff. Right. Okay.

24:48

But I was, I loved the

24:50

clash. I got to see them. Yeah.

24:52

Well, you're Ian Rubbish character on the

24:55

internet. It sort of says Ian Rubbish. Oh,

24:57

it's a parody of John Lydon. But to

25:00

me, it's the vocal mannerisms are much more

25:02

Joe Strummer. Definitely. Yeah. Living in the gutter.

25:04

You remember that one? A

25:12

mix, you know, but it's mostly Joe Strummer.

25:15

But, but he does say be decent,

25:18

which is like a John Lydon thing. He

25:20

talks about humanity. Yeah. He

25:23

a man. It's a last

25:26

night you played the Maggie

25:29

Thatcher song by in rubbish. Yeah. That

25:32

really made me laugh. Oh, thanks. You

25:34

know, as much as

25:37

I love punk and love all that,

25:40

that sketch was written by Seth Meyers.

25:42

Oh, yeah. It was his idea

25:44

to do a punk. The only punk who was a

25:46

fan of Maggie Thatcher. Yeah. He came

25:48

up with the lyrics and I just came up with the chords

25:50

for it. Well,

25:53

some of the lyrics, can you remind me? Hey,

25:55

Maggie Thatcher, you're right. Thanks to

25:57

you. I sleep at night. Right.

26:01

You keep England safe.

26:04

Your father was a grocer.

26:11

Did you imagine that you would be a musician

26:13

at that point, a professional musician, or did you

26:15

have another career path in mind? No, no. I

26:18

was like, the fantasy I had,

26:20

the ambition, is exactly what I'm

26:22

doing. Somewhere between like

26:25

Devo and David Byrne

26:27

and Keith Moon and

26:29

The Clash, somewhere in there I was like, there's got to

26:31

be a version. It's because I

26:33

saw bands on TV. That's where I saw

26:35

the specials on TV. Whatever

26:38

that world is, that's where I

26:40

wanted it to be visual. I

26:43

am a massive Talking Heads fan as well.

26:46

And yeah, I agree with you. They're

26:49

the ultimate proposition as a fun thing to

26:51

do because there's no way

26:53

someone like me was ever, well, I was never in

26:55

a band anyway, but don't say that.

26:57

Yes, you were. The

27:02

bands I liked seemed to have that

27:05

punk aesthetic, the DIY thing, but

27:07

they were also interested in the

27:10

presentation and the lyrics were

27:12

important and the album covers were important.

27:14

Yes. It was a whole art

27:16

project. Absolutely. Did you ever make

27:18

David Byrne? Oh yeah. We

27:21

hung out a bunch of times. Oh really? Oh

27:23

yeah. And kind of recently too. Wow. Yeah.

27:27

Well, we did a parody for

27:30

documentary now. Yeah. Of

27:32

Talking Heads and then he

27:34

was aware of it and we've talked about

27:36

it and stuff. Oh, he's great. He's

27:39

quite comfortable talking about the old days, right?

27:41

Yeah. And I asked him

27:43

a really good question. He

27:46

had a really great answer. There's

27:49

the restored version of Stop Making

27:51

Sense, the film. In

27:53

the film, I saw

27:56

those tours. Did you? Oh

27:59

yeah. have been 83 I think for

28:02

speaking in times and he

28:04

comes out and he puts down a boombox

28:06

and he presses the boombox and you hear

28:08

the drum machine yeah so

28:11

I cokela yeah so

28:14

watching the restored film I

28:16

see that he puts down the boombox he plays it and

28:19

then I felt foolish because I was like oh I

28:21

thought that was real clearly

28:23

there's no cable connected to it so

28:26

how was it going through the PA system so

28:29

I felt like oh show business they fooled me

28:32

and I told him this and he said no we

28:35

did play it it's there's a transistor in

28:37

the back that was a

28:39

real cassette I was so excited

28:43

for him to tell me that you're a massive

28:46

nerd I was so excited that

28:48

he remembered yeah you know how some people are

28:50

like oh I don't remember he like I

28:52

love that he was like no that was real and we

28:55

had a transistor in the back what

28:58

a great answer yeah I didn't feel

29:00

foolish anymore no

29:02

he obviously cared about every single aspect of

29:05

of the shows and costumes yeah their

29:08

choreography and all that stuff did you

29:10

see any of the interviews that Talking

29:12

Heads did to promote stop no yeah

29:14

on chat shows and stuff yep yeah

29:16

and I went to this one they

29:19

did a few sort of screenings and

29:21

premieres I went to one in Los

29:24

Angeles and it was wild

29:26

to see them together yeah very odd I thought

29:28

like watching I don't know them obviously and I

29:30

haven't met them but I

29:32

am aware that there's tension within that

29:34

and I read Chris Francis book and

29:37

there's quite a lot of bitterness in that

29:40

book I thought yeah about their relationship with

29:42

David Byrne as well as a lot of

29:44

love and appreciation for him but there were

29:46

certainly stories about the tensions between him and

29:49

Tina Weymouth and and Chris

29:52

France you know about the usual sort

29:54

of things yeah credit for who wrote

29:56

what and bands you

29:58

know it I feel like the

30:00

majority of them, there's just always issues.

30:03

It's so heavy. The fact that they

30:05

break up while they're successful is amazing

30:07

to me. Like, there must be some

30:10

serious tension. Yeah, because

30:12

you think, come on guys, totally get

30:14

it together, you can still do some

30:17

good music. I'm like, I don't know,

30:19

figure it out, but just show

30:22

up on stage. We love you. Yeah,

30:24

I mean that is true. On the other

30:26

hand, it was weird looking at

30:29

talking heads all sat there, trying

30:32

to be nice. And

30:36

I noticed that for every interview they did,

30:39

the configuration on the sofa was

30:41

the same. With Tina

30:43

Wayman closest to the interviewer on one

30:45

side, and then her husband, Chris France,

30:48

next to her. Yeah. And

30:50

then there's Jerry to separate the

30:52

two camps. And then there's

30:55

David Byrne on the other end. And

30:57

Tina would never look at David Byrne, like

30:59

she would always just look at the host.

31:03

She wouldn't turn her head to acknowledge anything

31:05

that David Byrne would say. That's

31:07

amazing. I mean, they turned

31:09

up. There is that version where

31:12

some people refuse. Yeah,

31:17

so I'm glad at least that they're... What would

31:19

you do if you, I mean, what if you had all four

31:21

of them here? I

31:24

mean, it would be so weird, wouldn't

31:26

it? Because I would just find it

31:28

incredibly uncomfortable. I'd

31:30

want to acknowledge the tension. I would want to

31:33

broker a piece and say, come on guys,

31:35

let's talk about this. I

31:38

would just play dumb so

31:41

that it would bring the niceness out of them. If

31:43

I was like, okay, so what? I

31:45

don't know anything about your band. What's

31:48

the name of the kind of music you play? Did

31:51

you ever put out records? So this

31:53

way it's simplified. So they'd be like, they'd

31:55

actually get along maybe with... They'd rediscover what

31:57

unified them in the first place. Yeah. I

32:00

always feel like I want David

32:02

Byrne to acknowledge, I

32:04

want someone to acknowledge the tension in

32:06

the room. I want David Byrne to

32:09

say, listen, I

32:11

understand that Tina

32:14

may have been annoyed with me in the past, she

32:16

may have felt that I didn't give

32:18

her enough credit, that I broke up the band

32:20

in the wrong way without letting everybody know the

32:22

way I should have done, and I'm sorry

32:24

about that. Oh, I like

32:26

your version. That

32:29

was so well put. You should send that to him

32:31

and say that. Yeah, that's the quote he said, put

32:33

out. That's really good. Is

32:35

the comedy world like that? Was

32:37

SNL like that? Were there tensions? With

32:40

us, the group that I was with was fantastic

32:43

and supportive. And

32:47

there's not the same sort of ownership of

32:50

sketches, because we have writers with us,

32:52

so that we write

32:54

with other writers. And

32:56

it's just all one show, as opposed to song

33:00

credits. So because of that, I think there's less

33:03

of that kind of thing. You

33:05

don't have to, years later

33:07

go, I wrote that, you know, there's none of that.

33:09

It's all like, it's just a show. And

33:13

the group that I was with were still

33:15

friends. So who were they for people who

33:18

don't know? Well,

33:20

if people don't know out there, then you shouldn't

33:22

be listening to it. This is for

33:24

SNL fans. Bill Hader,

33:27

Jason Sudeikis, Kristen Wiig, Keenan

33:30

Thompson, Andy Samberg,

33:34

Amy Poehler was there for part of

33:36

that, Maya Rudolph, Will Forte.

33:41

It was just that, you know, Darryl Hammond was there

33:43

throughout. And it was just

33:45

a great, great group. And

33:47

that is a mad collection, I'm sorry.

33:49

It's insane. And

33:51

I just remember how I felt

33:54

when I was there. Because like, when I think about

33:56

people supporting each other, it's a common thing

33:58

to say like, oh, we're, everyone is a group. great family

34:00

but like I do remember when

34:03

someone else had a sketch

34:06

going at the I'm gesturing

34:08

like there's a table because we would read it

34:10

as a table you know read like there'd be

34:12

like we'd act it out

34:14

or whatever yes I saw the James Franco

34:16

Saturday night perfect that's it's on YouTube yeah

34:18

that's a perfect example and has a lot

34:21

of those table reads in it yeah and

34:23

I remember my feeling when the sketch

34:25

was going well that I had nothing to do with I

34:27

remember feeling great like oh that's so great I

34:30

hope this makes it on the air Andy

34:32

is so funny in this or whoever and

34:36

that's how I know

34:38

like that we were supportive of each other that feeling

34:40

I feel like it was mutual it

34:42

looks fun in that documentary in fact

34:45

it was someone at your show last night

34:47

as I was walking out who said oh

34:49

I like the podcast and I said oh I'm gonna

34:52

talk to Fred tomorrow oh and the guy said oh

34:54

you should have you seen the Saturday

34:56

night documentary it's on YouTube so I watched it last

34:58

night when oh great how did you have time oh

35:01

I just went to bed late I

35:04

got home I was around staying I was

35:07

so I was exhausted yeah well you were

35:09

performing a show I was just watching it

35:12

but that's an active thing to be doing

35:14

yes it is my brain was engaged yeah

35:16

but I was lying on the sofa had

35:19

some Pringles and watched the Saturday

35:22

night doc and it did look

35:24

fun it was a good counterpoint

35:27

to so many stories I've heard many

35:29

of them on Mark Maron's podcast yeah

35:31

of the what

35:33

seemed like a really stressful environment

35:35

that Saturday Night Live could be

35:37

for some people and

35:40

I loved every second of it yeah I mean

35:42

the documentary was great but also as a side note

35:45

I can't believe I was there

35:48

so you didn't have you didn't experience those

35:50

moments of extreme

35:54

mental anguish at the unfairness

35:57

of certain decisions that were made I guess

35:59

you were You and

36:01

Bill carved out a pretty good

36:03

little scene there

36:05

and it seemed like a

36:07

very productive journey. Yeah,

36:10

and anything that didn't end up in the air,

36:12

now that I look back, I'm like, oh, rightly

36:15

so. There's no reason that I... The

36:18

stuff that didn't work just didn't work. And

36:20

then we had the next week to come up with

36:22

something else anyway. We're

36:25

halfway through the pot-pot, I

36:27

think it's going really great.

36:32

The conversation's flowing like it

36:34

would between Aqeza and

36:36

his mate. Hello,

36:38

Aqeza, good to see you. There's

36:40

so much chemistry, it's like a

36:42

science lab of talking. I'm interested

36:45

in what you said. There's

36:47

been chat and there's been chat, there's been

36:49

chat, there's been chat, there's been chat

36:51

and there's been... ...Aqeza has been kind of, like, even hawking. Did

36:57

Carrie Branstein act before Portlandia then, because obviously

36:59

she was- Maybe a few bits and pieces

37:01

here and there, but I

37:04

don't think with that kind

37:06

of intensity, intensity

37:10

meaning schedule, she was never working on a TV show,

37:12

but she had done a couple of

37:14

things here and there. And

37:16

how did you know her? I

37:20

was friends with

37:23

her drummer Janet, the drummer for

37:25

Slater Kinney. Then

37:27

Carrie and I met and then right

37:30

away we were, like, best friends, you

37:32

know? We just knew we were going

37:34

to be friends and then it turned out that way.

37:37

Was she living in Portland? Oh yeah, she

37:39

still does. So

37:42

describe Portland to people from the

37:44

UK. I

37:46

think in many ways it's similar to the

37:48

UK in that it's, like, cloudy.

37:54

But it's- Where is Oregon? Just

37:56

picture the West Coast. It's California.

37:59

And Then as you go- Go towards Washington State.

38:01

Fighting between his Oregon. Such.

38:03

As picture pine trees socket. Kind.

38:05

Of Stormy in. Really?

38:07

Beautiful that very dense said very

38:10

green. Seattle's like the bigger city

38:12

to the north of it. Are

38:14

just picture like a lot of coffee. And

38:18

bicycles? yes at that time.

38:20

Yeah, yeah, yeah, very nice.

38:22

He started doing it, went

38:24

twenty ten. that's right now

38:26

here. And do you remember

38:28

any of the initial spas

38:30

for. The. Idea like cat

38:32

seeing something and guy are we

38:34

should do a video about this.

38:36

You mean for Portland? Yeah yeah.

38:38

General on. Have. So many

38:41

will the face for stats. That.

38:43

To carry came up with. Was.

38:46

Put a bird On it and she really just

38:48

simply said like. And. I buy

38:50

something this like now is like little birds

38:52

on Things today where an ego aside Mississippi

38:55

average something efforts on it but you know

38:57

we're going to do whatever far as on

38:59

thing. That made it pretty think.

39:01

He'll. Bring

39:03

umbrellas to find. That

39:06

it's flying all over the beach and. A

39:08

sad that us her back I know

39:10

that appeared on you see the status

39:12

or I didn't know A fair says

39:14

it's fine it's three assists. And.

39:16

Men are. Big.

39:19

Also going to a restaurant you know like

39:21

there was this thing and so happens where

39:23

they tell you so much about with the

39:25

food is from yeah we you know that

39:27

now if we all accept it as like

39:29

part of being into restaurants but I think

39:31

if the time it was kind of newer.

39:34

You. Know we've locally sourced there's and this

39:36

is local on that's local and. So.

39:39

That definitely if you have any questions. About

39:41

the menu, please let me. I guess

39:43

I do have a question it's not

39:46

the chickens just toss a little bit

39:48

more about at Or the chicken is

39:50

a heritage breed woodland raised chickens that's

39:52

been said, a diet of see snow

39:54

soy and hazelnuts. Cancer Mrs Local.

39:59

Emergency Just. and it's local. It

40:01

is. Is that USDA organic

40:03

or Oregon organic or Portland organic? It's

40:05

just all across the board, organic. Hazelnut,

40:08

is it local? There's one that we

40:10

did, whenever people ask me about Portlandia,

40:13

there's this one sketch we did about recycling, which

40:16

was like there were so many colored bins. This

40:19

is for bottles, this is, and

40:21

we just made it more and more ridiculous. That,

40:24

that to me is like the

40:26

example of like what the show was about more than

40:28

anything. Like this sort of,

40:30

we're trying to do something good, but

40:33

then you just chip over yourself

40:35

doing it. I'm Marcus Harris. And

40:37

I'm Madeline Harris, and we're here to tell you

40:39

Portland about all the new recycling bins. Guess

40:41

what? We're twins. You

40:44

should say twins together. Sorry, I know you're right. Sorry about that. Coffee

40:47

cups, please. Orange. Thirsty.

40:50

Brown. Cups. Periwinkle.

40:54

Lit. Fuchsia. Ooh,

40:56

wait. Some

40:58

lipstick on it, see? Oh. Lipstickless.

41:01

Rose. We did it.

41:04

Once it's all sorted, everything is recycled into

41:06

one of three categories. Clean

41:09

air. Fresh water. Or

41:12

good vibes. The other

41:14

97% of the trash is dented to the ocean. What

41:18

is this, sea Atlantic? You got to

41:20

work with a lot of your

41:23

musical heroes in Portlandia, and

41:25

with these people that you knew already just

41:27

through the music scene, I'm thinking specifically of

41:29

the sketch you did with Henry

41:32

Rollins. Oh, yeah. Karen

41:34

and I have both known him for a little while.

41:37

Yeah, he was great. No, we had everybody

41:41

on the Jellibee Afra, Gwen

41:44

Danzig. That

41:46

was one of my favorites. Yeah, we really

41:48

got to work with a lot of heroes on

41:51

that show. Yeah. Your band supported

41:53

Fugazi at one point, right? Yep. So

41:56

you had a member of Fugazi at that point? Yeah, yeah. That's

41:58

a real, you know. That's someone I

42:01

feel like that was an easy

42:03

sort of friend to say do you

42:05

want to come out to Portland? And yeah and

42:08

do this trench-mouthed where you called. Yeah.

42:10

Yeah, so this was your proper sitter

42:12

serious band back before in the 90s

42:14

Yeah, how long were you together then?

42:17

Let's see. I don't know six

42:19

years or something Six years

42:21

seems about right Were you

42:23

doing stand-up at any point? Nope? Not

42:26

then not when I was in a band. I

42:29

just did a video where

42:31

I was interviewing Bands

42:34

like different characters and stuff and then after

42:36

that I started doing stand-up and by stand-up

42:38

I mean like I would do different characters

42:40

on stage. Yeah, what was

42:43

your transition then into making a living out

42:45

of comedy? I made

42:48

this video of interviewing bands and then

42:52

Showed this VHS tape at a club

42:54

in Chicago where I was living and

42:56

then people turned out for it and

43:00

then I did it

43:02

again and then would Show

43:04

the video in New York and LA and

43:06

stuff and right away there's a sort of

43:08

I don't know like a new

43:11

interest in what I was doing and

43:13

then HBO I think there

43:15

were actors that a version of HBO

43:17

called HBO zone Asked

43:19

me to do little videos for

43:21

them and that first paycheck

43:24

was like Where I

43:26

was doing comedy for a living and

43:28

then I moved to LA. I really wanted to live

43:31

in LA did

43:33

more stuff on stage and Bob

43:36

Odenkirk had a sketch show

43:38

a pilot he was making and he put me in

43:40

that pilot and That sort of

43:42

really got things going where I had I

43:45

could audition for more shows and I

43:47

auditioned from for SNL from There were

43:49

you crapping your pants? No

43:53

Because I had already been

43:55

through so much like with

43:57

the band that

44:00

But it wasn't in my sights,

44:03

you know what I mean? I wasn't like, someday

44:05

I'll be a cast member of SNL. I loved SNL,

44:07

I always did, but it was

44:10

so insane that

44:12

I couldn't be nervous for it because it was

44:14

like, this is crazy that I

44:16

was just playing drums and that I'm

44:18

here at NBC Studios doing an audition.

44:21

This is already beyond

44:23

my wildest dreams. So I

44:25

really felt like I had nothing

44:28

to lose. I didn't feel

44:30

like, oh, please

44:32

let this be the moment. I

44:34

was like, I cannot believe I'm getting to meet Laura

44:37

Michaels. And you aced it. I

44:40

did okay. Do you like those documentaries

44:42

about the comedy world? Do you ever

44:44

watch those, the Comedy Store documentaries? I

44:46

haven't seen it. I

44:48

was thinking, I wonder if you guys

44:50

would ever do one of those, or is it too close

44:52

to home on documentary now? Oh, that's

44:55

a good idea, actually. As you

44:57

were telling me that, I was thinking, because

45:00

people have ideas all the time and now

45:02

that you say it, I'm like, that actually

45:04

would be pretty great because they're so full of

45:07

it. Stand up, comedian. Oh yeah. Especially

45:09

when they talk about comedy.

45:11

There's nothing worse. Yeah. Breaking

45:15

down what works and what doesn't work. I

45:17

can't handle it.

45:20

Oh, it's too much. As

45:23

I wrote down a line from a trailer

45:25

I was watching. Oh

45:28

my God, I can't. It's just too much.

45:30

When Rogan is up and he's destroying and

45:32

you're after him, it's hard to put yourself

45:34

out there and take a risk. I

45:37

can't. First of all, I don't wanna know who said

45:39

that. But

45:42

those words are just like, it's just

45:45

hell. Oh

45:48

my God, it's the worst. As

45:52

if you're going into battle. Yes,

45:55

exactly. It's that thing, that willingness

45:57

to take comedy so seriously.

45:59

Yeah. when the whole point

46:01

is to take the piss. Yeah,

46:04

and also that goal of like when you're

46:06

destroying, yeah, who cares? What does that mean?

46:10

Oh, the whole room was really laughing. So

46:12

what? Cause there's an argument to be

46:14

made too, just, I can't, can't,

46:16

this is just like, when you're

46:19

destroying, it's just like, ugh. Yeah.

46:23

I'm watching comedy

46:25

and sometimes if it's not that funny,

46:27

it's great anyway. Yeah.

46:46

How did you like the new Beatles song?

46:48

The last ever Beatles song now and then?

46:50

I loved it because it kept

46:53

us all active in the Beatles. So

46:56

I liked that. I liked the sort of like, you

47:00

know, active listening. Everyone was really

47:02

like tuned in. Yeah. And that

47:04

melody is great. And Ringo's

47:06

drums sound like Ringo's drums. It

47:10

was great. But I liked that original

47:12

recording too. Yeah. Like that's really

47:14

cool. And you must've watched Get Back presumably. Oh,

47:16

I couldn't get enough of it. I

47:19

watched every second. Like

47:21

I really soaked it in. It was

47:23

very intense, wasn't it? Because especially coming

47:25

out of the pandemic, I

47:27

mean, the pandemic was still going on really when

47:29

Get Back came out. Yeah. Yeah.

47:32

But that was one of the

47:34

reasons it felt like such an intense. Yes.

47:36

Oh, I didn't think about that. I

47:39

guess that would have been part of the psyche

47:41

behind it. I think so. Just

47:44

that, I mean, just by chance, but still. Or maybe they designed

47:46

it that way. They're like, let's wait till there's a pandemic. Well,

47:50

they had time, I suppose, to pull all

47:52

the stuff together. But

47:55

yeah. Yeah. And pay attention to

47:57

it. Yeah. But God, I loved it.

47:59

I loved it. I was just

48:01

seeing Ringo, like, just

48:04

be reminded that he's like a drummer. He

48:06

was listening all the time. He was just listening

48:08

and so patient. What

48:12

a great drummer. So you never had any time

48:14

for that whole thing of, he wasn't even the

48:16

best drummer in the Beatles. No. And

48:19

I think I

48:21

have an opinion that it is a myth

48:24

that people don't think he's a great drummer.

48:27

I think that it's its own made

48:29

up thing that he's

48:31

ever criticized. I think that drummers,

48:34

when they speak privately, you know, like

48:36

with comedians, they speak privately, I

48:38

don't think so and so is very good. In

48:43

silence or whatever, in private moments, every

48:45

drummer is like, that guy is the

48:48

best. He's

48:50

so musical and we all know

48:52

those drum parts. You

48:54

can picture them in your mind that

48:56

I think everyone agrees that he is

48:58

great. The fact

49:00

that they were so good on the rooftop.

49:03

Oh, man. I got a little

49:05

emotional. I got very emotional.

49:08

I've not experienced

49:10

that very much, you know, just because they

49:12

were so tight. And

49:14

I mean, it was amazingly beautifully

49:17

well recorded. Yeah. Glyn Johns down

49:19

there with... Yeah.

49:22

And also, like, you felt like

49:24

you knew them better and that it really

49:26

was a victory to like actually get somewhere

49:28

and actually play. It was a very satisfying

49:31

journey. Yeah, but it was a

49:33

satisfying journey. And

49:35

it made sense because it's that

49:38

part where they're talking about, let's go play in a

49:40

boat somewhere and George is like, who's paying for that?

49:42

Yeah. I like the idea

49:44

that they're not so trippy that they're like, yeah,

49:46

whatever. That someone was like, no, that's

49:48

something too expensive to do. But

49:51

if you look at the footage from

49:53

the rooftop, something I didn't notice

49:55

before is that they had built... Someone

49:57

took the time to build a stage on there.

50:00

You know, there's like new wood. So

50:03

when you're a kid, you think let it be, they just went

50:05

up there with guitars. And I like

50:07

seeing the sort of show business part of it,

50:09

of like someone actually took the time to like

50:12

make it a proper stage. Yeah, to

50:14

reinforce it, make sure the Beatles didn't just

50:16

fall through the wood. Yeah, they're like, let's

50:18

take this seriously and make it look last

50:21

minute, but there's some planning. It would be a shame

50:23

if one of them died. Yes. How

50:26

do you feel about the technical

50:29

trickery though, the

50:31

extent to which from now on,

50:34

there's no such thing as the

50:36

past anymore that you'll be able

50:38

to revive anything and tweak anything.

50:40

I know. That's just, we

50:43

have to accept it. Yeah. You know,

50:46

maybe they'll do that with this podcast, with

50:48

this interview, they do it, you know, and,

50:51

I mean, could you imagine what it's gonna be like and what

50:53

they'll be able to do in 20 years? It's

50:56

wild. It'll be possible to have sampled your

50:58

voice and all the impressions that you've ever

51:00

done. Yeah. And then just

51:02

write new sketches. Yep. And

51:04

get that voice to perform them, whether you've signed

51:06

a waiver or not. They can also maybe improve

51:09

some impressions. Maybe they could take some of, some

51:12

accents I've done and just make, tweak them a

51:14

little. You know, I wish I could do every

51:17

British accent. I wish I could do

51:19

all of that stuff. Well, you have a bit in your

51:21

show, the live show, where you go through

51:23

the whole of the American.

51:26

Yeah. But I wish I could do

51:28

Britain. You know, I watch videos of it.

51:30

Yeah. And there are people who can do

51:32

it and it's amazing. Yeah, it's brilliant. Birmingham,

51:36

Liverpool, Wales,

51:38

oh my God. Do you have an

51:40

accent at the moment that you particularly

51:42

enjoy doing? Oh, I really

51:45

like breaking down New York City, but I

51:47

like doing even like smaller

51:49

parts of it, of

51:52

New York City and Manhattan and stuff. But

51:55

New York, because that's where I grew up. So it's like a

51:57

little bit like I can, you

51:59

know. I like breaking that down. Yeah. Can

52:01

I put you on the spot and ask you to take

52:03

a little New York tour? Let's

52:06

see. When I do New York, I usually

52:08

do Brooklyn. Brooklyn, I

52:10

think of is in here, you know,

52:12

kind of it's tough, but

52:15

then the Bronx is more from the

52:17

lungs. There's more pride

52:19

in the Bronx and

52:22

Manhattan. I think

52:24

of people who are in

52:26

the medical community. I

52:28

had a procedure done. Queens

52:33

is more high-pitched. Nobody

52:37

told me. Queens.

52:42

Sometimes if I took college village, I think

52:44

of people in the college village or

52:46

people who lived there a long time. I mean, speaking

52:50

of this volume. And then

52:52

when I think of long, I grew

52:54

up in Long Island. So Long Island,

52:58

I think is the

53:00

most New York of all the

53:02

accents, you know, they stall for

53:04

time. That's

53:07

where I grew up. Valley Stream.

53:10

And then as you leave New Jersey,

53:12

you start to lose the accent a

53:14

little bit, but is this

53:17

still a little buzzing? And

53:20

yeah, that's just some of them. That's great,

53:22

man. Thank you. So where are you off

53:24

to next? That was the first night of

53:26

your tour. Yeah, Birmingham. We play there tomorrow.

53:30

The one thing I had to do today was this. And

53:33

they really had to push me. They were like, you got to do

53:35

it. To be honest, a friend

53:39

of mine from Australia told me

53:41

about this Saya. She

53:44

was like, she really, this is like during

53:47

the pandemic. Just

53:49

really into you and into this

53:51

and you know, that you're so funny. And

53:54

I was like, great. And then so

53:56

I started listening and then by

53:59

luck or whatever. You know, I guess

54:01

it was maybe a year ago, then you

54:03

interviewed Paul McCartney. Yes. Gosh, you

54:05

did a great job. Thanks, man. I

54:07

was absolutely- Was that here? Breaking it.

54:10

No, that was on Zoom. Okay. Yeah,

54:12

because that was in the pandemic. That

54:15

was at the end of 2020. It

54:18

was? Yeah. I feel like it's more

54:20

recent. I think you're wrong. No, I think it's 2020. He

54:24

just released McCartney 3. Oh, that's

54:27

already that. Wow, that's right. Everything

54:30

goes so fast. Have you met him? Yep.

54:34

How was that? Oh, a dream.

54:37

It was awesome. A bunch of times

54:39

because of SNL. Right. His friends are

54:41

born Michaels. And

54:43

he hangs out. He

54:45

likes people's company. He's

54:47

funny. He just

54:49

likes talking. Oh, it's

54:51

the best. It's the best. And were

54:53

you able to ask him nerdy Beatles

54:56

questions over you playing it cool? I

54:59

played it cool by not bombarding him

55:01

with only

55:03

I think you're great. Or I know this song or

55:05

that song. I asked him about Harry

55:09

Nelson. And then I asked

55:11

him about his bass because he uses that

55:13

Hofner. And he was just saying that wood

55:16

just becomes so much more resonant as it

55:18

gets older. So it felt

55:21

more like a conversation as opposed to just, I

55:23

think you're great. Yeah. And,

55:28

oh man, it's the best. He's just

55:30

like, I think also

55:33

because of SNL, I think he

55:35

likes the environment of comedians. So.

55:38

Well, there is that mutual appreciation society

55:40

between musicians and comedians. Yeah.

55:43

They envy something that the other one

55:45

has. Always. And I love it. I

55:47

love seeing old pictures of the

55:50

Beatles of Peter Sellers or whatever. Yeah. But

55:54

yeah. It was, he's

55:56

the best. Great. Wow.

56:00

must have been an amazing moment. Who are you

56:02

listening to at the moment? There's

56:04

a band called Deaf Rain,

56:07

who I love, D-E-F-R-A-I-N. A

56:11

band called Real Estate. Oh yeah. Are

56:13

they still putting stuff out? Yeah. Right.

56:17

They're great. Kurt Weil.

56:19

Yeah, he's fantastic. He's great. Courtney

56:22

Barnett. Have you done albums

56:24

of your own stuff the way that Tim Heidecker

56:26

has? Nope. I don't think I

56:28

have the

56:31

capacity. I don't have that

56:34

urge. I don't have the want to

56:37

make, that's not in me. But

56:40

if it's a parody of something, if I am

56:43

asked to do a parody or if I want, that

56:45

flows so easily that I

56:47

just, I'm like, that's where

56:49

I should be. That's what I can do. Yeah. Because

56:52

of the ease of that. Do you enjoy doing

56:54

that? I love it. Yeah.

56:56

I love it. Like Talking Heads parody.

56:59

Yeah. I think I want to

57:01

work on a sound effects record next. Like

57:05

you know how the sound effects records we used to have when

57:07

you were a kid? Or even for like

57:10

production, there used to be sound effects records. Like a

57:12

bottle breaking and stuff like that. I

57:14

want to do one of those. But

57:17

that I did it, that I break the glass or whatever.

57:22

No disrespect. But how is Fred Armisen

57:24

breaking a glass going to sound different

57:26

to someone else breaking a glass?

57:28

That's like saying, how does George Harrison playing

57:34

a guitar sound different than someone else playing a

57:36

guitar? Or

57:38

Johnny Marr playing a guitar? And

57:41

that's what that was disrespectful. Okay. Yeah.

57:46

Well, that's great, man. That sounds

57:48

really exciting. That was more supportive, thank

57:50

you. Yeah. And what other sound

57:52

effects would you have on that? I think I do

57:54

want to do like crowds.

57:56

So like an

57:59

audience. of you know eight people

58:02

at an open mic so I could

58:04

overdub like whoo you know like different

58:10

Or like you know a bigger crowd

58:12

or Is

58:14

this you playing every member of the crowd? Yeah,

58:16

I would just overdub it so it's like multi-tracked

58:20

Have you got do you do stuff on

58:22

logic or on other yeah logic? Yeah, it's

58:24

not easy I

58:37

Really excited about this record yeah Yeah,

58:43

cuz you got a double up all that you got to

58:45

create a new track yeah, and make

58:48

it sound convincing and good yeah, yeah There's

58:54

a guitar over there Fred you don't fancy is

58:56

that a gift You

59:01

could have it that

59:03

stickers Yeah,

59:06

it's you did case you

59:08

fancy playing something What

59:13

would you like to hear what is there I mean

59:18

How about something? What

59:20

I'll do is I'm gonna since you said like

59:22

do you you know give her place serious music

59:24

I said no Mm-hmm

59:28

So why don't I come up with like an

59:31

earnest earnest song? And

59:33

I'll we'll do I will do no tones That

59:36

sound jokey uh-huh like

59:38

I'm gonna really just

59:40

for a verse Try

59:43

my best to write a serious song with

59:46

serious lyrics serious

59:49

lyrics You

1:00:02

There's a man, speaking

1:00:07

on his cell

1:00:09

phone again. It

1:00:13

sounds if we can. That was good. It's impossible to

1:00:15

do that.

1:00:19

It's impossible not to do it yourself. You

1:00:21

set yourself. Yeah, an impossible

1:00:23

challenge for, this is the challenge that I've

1:00:25

had. I've been making an album and

1:00:28

it wasn't supposed

1:00:30

to be a comedy album. They just said do

1:00:32

an album. And so

1:00:34

I was like, shit, I love music. So

1:00:36

I've got an opportunity to write some actual

1:00:39

sincere music. So I tried.

1:00:42

And it was really, really hard. I

1:00:45

was beaten by it in the end. Really? Yeah.

1:00:48

I had to just go stupid again. See? It's

1:00:51

like you're just falling

1:00:53

into a groove of some kind. What

1:00:56

is it though? It's a fear of

1:00:58

being judged, isn't it?

1:01:02

It's a fear of... I don't think it's fear.

1:01:04

I think it's just like... Oh, I think it is. Oh,

1:01:06

I'll debate you on this. I love a good

1:01:08

debate. Yeah, no, I

1:01:10

don't think it's fear. I think it's

1:01:12

just like not being able

1:01:15

to paint something in

1:01:18

a certain way. And it's just like, oh,

1:01:21

this doesn't come naturally to me. That

1:01:23

is what I think. I

1:01:26

think that it's... You don't seem like you

1:01:28

have fear. You're not like, I'm

1:01:30

worried. You don't seem like a worried person. You

1:01:33

get it together to do this. You haven't

1:01:35

listened to enough episodes before. Well, I

1:01:39

don't know. I think it's just like you either

1:01:41

want to do something or you don't. I'm

1:01:44

just going to play rock and roll stuff. I'm

1:01:49

going to

1:01:52

play rock and roll stuff. Hey

1:02:24

welcome back podcast, that was Fred Armisen

1:02:26

talking to me there. I have stuffed the

1:02:29

description of today's podcast with a load of links

1:02:31

related to some of what we were talking about.

1:02:46

You've got, well obviously I've got to

1:02:48

put my Bowie and Eno

1:02:50

and Tony Visconti sketch

1:02:53

in there with animation by the Brothers

1:02:55

MacLeod. Just in case

1:02:57

you haven't seen that one. I've

1:02:59

also put the video of

1:03:02

Tony Visconti and Eren

1:03:04

Tonkon talking

1:03:06

about recording Heroes with David Bowie.

1:03:09

That's a clip from a BBC

1:03:11

show called Music Moguls, Masters

1:03:14

of Pop from 2016. But

1:03:17

it's very similar in form

1:03:19

to an episode of classic

1:03:22

albums, which for me is

1:03:24

just about as good as it gets for

1:03:27

visual comfort food. I've

1:03:30

also linked to the

1:03:32

show that I got

1:03:34

that Matt Berry clip from, the clip

1:03:36

of Matt Berry doing

1:03:38

a pastiche of a track

1:03:40

from Low by David Bowie. It comes

1:03:43

from a show he made for Radio 4 called

1:03:46

Matt Berry Interviews Brian Eno. I think

1:03:48

it was 2018 that he made that.

1:03:51

And it is one of those shows in which the host has

1:03:55

inserted themselves into interviews that

1:03:57

they've chopped up. and

1:04:00

reworked. Quite good because there

1:04:02

are some funny jokes in there as

1:04:06

well as some genuinely interesting bits of

1:04:08

interview with Brian Eno and

1:04:10

then Matt does a few musical spoofs.

1:04:13

You will also find links to

1:04:15

the videos of those Portlandia sketches that

1:04:17

I played short clips of. There's

1:04:21

a link to the History of

1:04:23

Punk sketch with Ian

1:04:25

Rubbish from SNL and

1:04:27

there's also a couple of other SNL clips

1:04:30

of Fred with Kristen Wiig

1:04:32

doing their Garth and Cat

1:04:35

improvised song sketches which I

1:04:37

really love. There's a link

1:04:39

to Canadian, cranky

1:04:42

journalist, Nardwar interviewing

1:04:45

Fred back in 2013. Are

1:04:49

you familiar with Nardwar? I think he's

1:04:51

Canadian. He wears a Tamashanta and

1:04:55

he's a bit like a cross between Dennis Penison,

1:04:57

a music journalist, although that makes him sound prankier

1:05:00

than he actually is. He's

1:05:02

definitely a huge music fan with

1:05:04

deep level knowledge that he wields

1:05:07

in his interviews, but I think

1:05:09

sometimes it's a quite extreme

1:05:12

style that he has

1:05:14

and it's hard to tell if he's winding

1:05:16

people up or if he's just playing an

1:05:18

extreme version of himself. And

1:05:20

there's a few clips on YouTube of some of

1:05:23

his interviewees getting quite annoyed with him. He

1:05:26

has a good chat with Fred Armisen. I've

1:05:29

also included a link to

1:05:31

a book by someone I met towards the

1:05:33

end of last year, a

1:05:36

London based ICU doctor called Jim

1:05:38

Down. If

1:05:40

you listen to the rest is politics, then

1:05:44

you might sometimes hear Alistair

1:05:46

Campbell mentioning Jim Down. I

1:05:48

think they go swimming together in

1:05:50

the Lido up in North London. And

1:05:54

actually I think they met there when

1:05:57

Jim was coming out of a period of...

1:06:00

depression following

1:06:02

the pandemic when

1:06:05

for various reasons he found himself pushed

1:06:08

to the brink like so many others especially

1:06:11

in the NHS. Anyway Jim

1:06:13

has written a book called Life in the

1:06:15

Balance. It's not just about that although he

1:06:17

does talk about that part of his life

1:06:19

in there but

1:06:22

their stories from his life in

1:06:24

ICU so far. I'm

1:06:26

quoting now from the blurb with

1:06:28

honesty and a dark streak of

1:06:30

humor. Dr. Downe describes the quietly

1:06:32

heroic work of doctors and nurses

1:06:35

on the ICU, a place which

1:06:37

sits at the cutting edge of

1:06:39

medical technology and where a split-second

1:06:41

decision can make the

1:06:43

difference between life and death. From

1:06:46

headline-grabbing cases like that of Alexander

1:06:48

Litvinenko, poisoned by Russian

1:06:50

agents and admitted to Downe's ward

1:06:52

to the appalling aftermath of a

1:06:54

train crash, Life in the

1:06:56

Balance offers an inside glimpse

1:06:58

of intensive care medicine, its immense

1:07:01

challenges to the teariest effects

1:07:03

on doctors mental health and enormous

1:07:06

rewards. I really

1:07:08

recommend it. Jim writes very well and it's

1:07:11

interesting that for someone so

1:07:14

accomplished and skilled he

1:07:16

still struggles with such a lot of doubt

1:07:19

in his life and he writes about that

1:07:21

brilliantly too. I met him towards the end

1:07:23

of last year when

1:07:25

I went to see a play, Accidental

1:07:28

Death of an Anarchist, which had

1:07:30

been adapted by Tom Baskin who

1:07:32

I hope will come on the podcast one day. Anyway

1:07:35

Jim Downe was there and introduced himself

1:07:39

and I read his book and I thought it was

1:07:41

really good. It's out in paperback towards

1:07:43

the end of this month February 2024. Link

1:07:46

in the description.

1:07:50

Alright, podcast, that's it for this week. I'm

1:07:52

hoping to put out another episode

1:07:55

within just a few days. I thought it

1:07:58

would be a good double-header because Last

1:08:01

year I also recorded a conversation with

1:08:03

Tim Heidecker of Tim and Eric

1:08:06

and Tim was mentioned a

1:08:09

couple of times in my conversation with

1:08:11

Fred. I've described Tim and Eric

1:08:13

before as a bit like Vic

1:08:15

and Bob but it's

1:08:17

a very different sensibility whereas

1:08:19

Vic and Bob I think

1:08:21

are quite sort of end-of-the-peer

1:08:23

and music haulish. Tim

1:08:26

and Eric are a bit more kind of art

1:08:28

schooly or film schooly they went to

1:08:30

film school and they

1:08:32

never really used to give kind of straight interviews

1:08:34

they were always quite arch

1:08:37

and in character and

1:08:39

weird. My conversation

1:08:41

with Tim was him more or less being himself

1:08:43

I think and

1:08:46

again it was recorded the day after I saw

1:08:48

him do a show which I mentioned to Fred

1:08:50

there. Anyway I was able

1:08:52

to grab him for a brief ramble so that

1:08:54

is coming up next on

1:08:57

the podcast. Thank you

1:08:59

very much indeed to Seamus

1:09:01

Murphy Mitchell for his production

1:09:03

support conversation editing etc on

1:09:05

this episode much appreciated

1:09:07

Seamus. Thanks to everybody

1:09:09

at ACAST for their

1:09:12

continued sponsorship liaison

1:09:14

assistance. Thank you

1:09:17

to Helen Green she does the beautiful artwork

1:09:19

of my great face which probably needs to

1:09:21

be updated at some point but

1:09:23

thanks most of all to you

1:09:26

for coming back for listening to

1:09:28

the end again. Ah you're

1:09:31

just terrific come here come

1:09:33

on hey everything that you're

1:09:36

doing at the moment is working and keep

1:09:39

doing it not that stuff no you should

1:09:41

stop that but the other stuff the good

1:09:43

bit. Alright take care I love you. Bye!