0:00

The tax deadline is almost here

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and Tax Act has live experts

0:04

to help answer any last-minute questions

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you may have. Questions like, can

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I claim my SUV is my

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home office if I answer work

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emails in my car? If I

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adopted 12 dogs this year, can

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I list them as dependents? And,

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I doing this very, very wrong? Our

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experts have the answers to those questions

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and many others. Tax Act. Let's get

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them over with. Hey guys, Bill here,

0:30

wanted to record a couple of draft

0:33

preview episodes before I left on Paternity

0:35

Leave, and we did get those done

0:37

in mid-March. Very excited for you to

0:39

listen to them, but just please keep

0:41

in mind. that there may have been

0:43

some changes between the time we recorded

0:45

these, which is right around the beginning

0:48

of free agency, and the time you're

0:50

listening to them. Some guys may have

0:52

moved up and down the board, maybe

0:54

some team needs that we suggested at

0:56

the time, maybe don't apply now because

0:58

of moves teams have made, but hopefully

1:00

generally still get the vibe we're listening

1:02

to here. I think a couple of

1:04

really cool preview episodes, talking to some

1:06

very smart people about the players they

1:08

love from all of their film grinding

1:10

heading into the drafts. Hey

1:17

guys, welcome to the Bill Barnwell

1:19

show. I am Bill Barnwell. Today

1:21

we are previewing the NFL draft

1:24

by going through a perfect draft.

1:26

Yes, finally your team maybe

1:28

can have a perfect draft. It

1:30

just happened to be drafting

1:32

all defensive players because today we

1:35

are going to go round by

1:37

round and we are blessed to be

1:39

joined by someone who does excellent work.

1:41

covering the NFL draft. We're going to

1:43

break down what a perfect draft might

1:46

look like for defensive players at each

1:48

tier, each round of the NFL draft

1:50

joining me to do that. So when

1:52

we hit on before the year, very

1:54

excited to have him on here, he's

1:56

a very busy man as he gets

1:58

ready for the NFL draft. but so

2:00

excited to have ESPN's Jordan read with

2:02

us again. Jordan, how are you sir?

2:04

I'm good Bill. It's always a pleasure

2:06

coming on here. I love you know

2:08

everything about this podcast and just getting

2:10

the nerd out about the NFL draft

2:12

when you allow me to. So I

2:14

always love coming on here. Thanks for

2:17

having me. Yes, super excited. Really. love

2:19

talking to people about this stuff and

2:21

about their process, what they look for,

2:23

because this is such a difficult thing.

2:25

The NFL draft is such a difficult

2:27

process to go through. And I'm glad

2:29

that we're talking doing this exercise this

2:31

year as opposed to last year, because

2:33

last year, the top of the trap

2:35

was all offensive players. So it's nice

2:37

to have more of a mix this

2:39

year, a wider spread. So want to

2:41

hit on the defensive side of the

2:43

ball today, because certainly I mean the

2:45

big story. of the year in the

2:47

NFL was, you know, running back to

2:49

some extent, but we saw it happen

2:51

in the Super Bowl. Like the most

2:53

dominant thing in the Super Bowl was

2:55

a great defensive line, a great Eagles

2:57

defense that suffocated Patrick Mahomes and won

2:59

him that game. And I think that's

3:01

going to be lurking, just a tiny

3:03

bit in people's minds as we get

3:05

to the NFL draft here. And so

3:08

I guess we should start in the

3:10

first round. I mean, we'll go round

3:12

by round, talk about some of some

3:14

of these prospects, but some of these

3:16

prospects, but Jordan from your perspective. building

3:18

a perfect NFL draft, a building a

3:20

draft where you're really excited about landing

3:22

seven defensive players in the first round,

3:24

who are you taking, and why does

3:26

this player stand out to you? Well,

3:28

I'll be remiss if I didn't start

3:30

off with who I think is the

3:32

best player in the draft and that's

3:34

Travis Hunter Colorado I mean Everybody knows

3:36

about his two-way ability, but I believe

3:38

he's a corner full-time on the next

3:40

level and then I was sprinkling me

3:42

in as a wide receiver But just

3:44

sticking on the defensive side of the

3:46

ball. We're talking about somebody that has

3:48

elite zone instincts and what I like

3:50

to call a sixth sense for ball

3:52

skills as far as when the ball

3:54

is in the air. He just has

3:57

an uncanny ability to attack the ball

3:59

and then just come down with it

4:01

in those 50-50 situations. But I think

4:03

what makes Travis so special is that

4:05

he can play zone, he can play

4:07

man, and then of course the endurance.

4:09

that he has as well, there's really

4:11

no drop-off, which is something that is

4:13

very rare for a two-way player. And

4:15

the only comparison that I really could

4:17

think of, just historically, Chris Gamble was

4:19

one when he was coming out of

4:21

Ohio State that played both ways, but

4:23

I think the one that is most

4:25

comparable to him was Champ Bailey when

4:27

he was coming out of Georgia in

4:29

the late 90s. And if you remember,

4:31

Champ. was averaging over 100 snaps, I

4:33

believe over eight or nine games, sample

4:35

size. But during his final year, and

4:37

he ended up ultimately choosing the defensive

4:39

side of the ball and he's wearing

4:41

a gold jacket right now. And I

4:43

think Travis has a similar type of

4:45

upside. Not saying he's gonna have the

4:48

career that Champ had, but just as

4:50

far as a comparable player from a

4:52

sample size and then what they have

4:54

accomplished on the college level, he's very

4:56

reminiscent of Champ Bailey coming out of

4:58

Georgia. Yeah, I mean, that's a, you

5:00

know. The comparing guys to Hall of

5:02

Fame is always tough, but certainly, it's

5:04

such a, such a rare case of

5:06

a player coming out of school where

5:08

it's so hard to find comparable players,

5:10

given that there's been so few players

5:12

who have done this really, you know,

5:14

not only played both sides of football,

5:16

played both sides of the football at

5:18

a high level for multiple seasons. Let's

5:20

start of the cornerback side of things

5:22

with Traversantro. I guess this is the

5:24

defensive side of the equation. Cornerback has

5:26

been a weird position at the NFL.

5:28

Obviously you need them, obviously teams value

5:30

it, but we haven't seen teams really

5:32

go out of their way to pay

5:34

Star Cornerbacks. That position, you know, it

5:36

hasn't really grown dramatically over the last

5:39

decade in the way that other positions

5:41

have. Obviously teams are paying out to

5:43

Russia, teams are paying more offensive lineman,

5:45

defensive lineman. Given what you see from

5:47

Travis Hunter, like... Would there be any

5:49

concerns about taking a guy at a

5:51

position that isn't as valued at the

5:53

NFL level versus a position like, you

5:55

know, Ed Russia, where you have an

5:57

Abdul Carter, obviously a really talented prospect,

5:59

adding position that teams pay a lot

6:01

more to? Or for you, is it

6:03

just, you know, Travis Hunter, such a

6:05

incredible prospect that accounting for that. He's

6:07

still a guy I think you have

6:09

to prioritize. Well, just touching on your

6:11

first point, I think there's just been

6:13

a lack of elite type of corners,

6:15

especially to reset the top of the

6:17

market. We saw what Patrick Satane got.

6:19

Jay C. Horn just got $100 million.

6:21

So he's somebody that's just got $100

6:23

million. So he's somebody that's just reset

6:25

the market. The guy's $100 million. So

6:27

he's somebody that's just reset the $100

6:30

million. So he's just a lack of

6:32

time, wide receiver. over corner just because

6:34

of the dynamics and the yearly salary

6:36

of what these wide receivers are getting.

6:38

But I think in about two or

6:40

three years, we're gonna start to see

6:42

a big boom in the cornerback market.

6:44

And we're slowly starting to see it

6:46

now. Like I said, with J. C.

6:48

Horn, just getting $100 million with sauce

6:50

coming up. And then also with Derek

6:52

Stingly. So I think the financial side

6:54

of things is eventually gonna catch up,

6:56

especially four to five years from now

6:58

when it's time for Travis to get

7:00

paid for Travis to get paid. Certainly,

7:02

I mean, those guys are playing at

7:04

a high level and you would imagine,

7:06

especially, Darkston was awesome last year. I

7:08

mean, he deserves to get paid. It

7:10

gets a significant raise from the Houston

7:12

Texans. Cornerback, the other thing that comes

7:14

to mind for me as something I

7:16

wonder about is, you know, sort of

7:18

ending up in the right spot. And

7:21

obviously, you know, like if you're a

7:23

transcendent player, you're going to thrive in

7:25

any system. I don't think Travis Hunter

7:27

needs to be in a certain system

7:29

to thrive, but it's tougher to me

7:31

than a position like Edgerusher where, okay,

7:33

like you're gonna line up on the

7:35

outside, you're gonna get after the quarterback.

7:37

Like, yes, there's differences, yes, there's some

7:39

elements that are different, but, you know,

7:41

at the end of the day, like

7:43

you're doing the same job. There's just

7:45

like a little more variance in terms

7:47

of how you're using a scheme, what

7:49

you're being asked to do. You know,

7:51

are you playing in a primarily manned

7:53

scheme the way past or 10 is?

7:55

Are you playing in a spot drop

7:57

zone scheme? Are you playing in a

7:59

zone match? Is there a defense or

8:01

a type of defense where you look

8:03

at Travis Hunter and you're like, man,

8:05

I hope he ends up in this

8:07

kind of defense just because it plays

8:10

to his strengths better than it might

8:12

be in a different style of defense

8:14

or cornerback? Well, if you could just

8:16

place them into the Legion of Boom,

8:18

that would be perfect, which is much

8:20

cover three, just much cover three, as

8:22

they were playing. But, you know, a

8:24

scheme that has a lot of zone

8:26

concepts that allows them to keep us

8:28

back to the sideline, so a lot

8:30

of cover three, some similes of cover

8:32

four, but his ability to just... you

8:34

know, decipher concepts and being able to

8:36

attack them. And he does a great

8:38

job of baiting quarterbacks as well, manipulating

8:40

them into throwing into certain windows. And

8:42

he just steps right in front of

8:44

it. I think of the interception against

8:46

UCF. I believe it was to where

8:48

he was able to manipulate the quarterback

8:50

and to throw in the ball. And

8:52

there were plenty of others as well.

8:54

I believe it was UCLA two years

8:56

ago when he was in cover two

8:58

and he was playing a route and

9:01

then just jumped the other along the

9:03

sideline just jump right in front of

9:05

it out route really quickly so those

9:07

type of zone instincts whether it's you

9:09

know cover two cover three cover four

9:11

whatever it is and that's not to

9:13

say that he's not good in man

9:15

coverage I think he's completely fine but

9:17

where his instincts really take over and

9:19

sees play making ability is in a

9:21

zone coverage. Yeah I mean everyone's gonna

9:23

play both like you're never gonna play.

9:25

man coverage if you're in his own

9:27

heavy defense, there's gonna be concepts within

9:29

zone coverage, where if you're playing on

9:31

the backside of a zone coverage, like

9:33

you might be basically a man-to-man defender

9:35

in a lot of ways, like you're

9:37

gonna do both, but certainly it feels

9:39

like that plays to, you know, kind

9:41

of his unique awareness, his special things

9:43

that make him special, not just as

9:45

an athlete, but as a football player

9:47

as well. In terms of the wide

9:49

receiver stuff, we'll hit this and then

9:52

we'll move on to your second round

9:54

pick to your second round pick. To

9:56

some extent, like you said, Champ Bailey

9:58

played at the college level and then

10:00

became a full-time cornerback. We've seen guys

10:02

do... limited snaps at wide receiver at

10:04

the pro level. Patrick Peterson comes to

10:06

mind for me early in his career.

10:08

Devin Hester was not a full-time cornerback,

10:10

really, but we saw some stuff from

10:12

him as well. We've seen some players

10:14

on the interior, obviously very different, you

10:16

know, different style of play, but we've

10:18

seen, you know, defensive tackles who play

10:20

fullback or vice versa. If we're sitting

10:22

here five years from now, and Travis

10:24

Hunter is a superstar cornerback in the

10:26

NFL, which by all accounts, it seems

10:28

like he will be like he will

10:30

be. How much wide receiver do you

10:32

think he will be playing and how

10:34

much do you think he should be

10:36

playing at that point of his career?

10:38

So this is a debate like I've

10:40

had with so many scouts and evaluators

10:43

in the league and as a coach,

10:45

as a GM, as a position coach,

10:47

whatever, your job is to have the

10:49

best 11 players on the field at

10:51

all times. And if Travis shows you

10:53

that he can handle, you know, playing

10:55

both ways at a high clip, then

10:57

just allow him to do it. and

10:59

just let his development take care of

11:01

itself. Now, I know that's not realistic,

11:03

but let's just say that he is

11:05

able to handle it. Why not have

11:07

him out there? Maybe not every single

11:09

snap of the game on offense, but

11:11

if he shows and his body is

11:13

capable of handling, you know, a 17-game

11:15

season plus the playoff run that he

11:17

can handle those snaps, just allow him

11:19

to do it. And, you know, the

11:21

longevity may not be on your side,

11:23

but... I'm so interested to see if

11:25

he can do it just because he's

11:27

such an anomaly at the position He's

11:29

already defined the odds but the NFL

11:31

game not from like a psychological or

11:34

mental standpoint is slower than the college

11:36

game But like the flow of the

11:38

game is slower as far as like

11:40

teams huddling No teams taking a delay

11:42

game clock down. There's not as much

11:44

no huddle or up-tempo as the college

11:46

game. So he said I would not

11:48

doubt Travis being able to play on

11:50

both sides of the ball because of

11:52

that. It's lesser plays. The tempo was

11:54

slower. Now the mental hurdle and the

11:56

speed of the game is different, but

11:58

the pace of the game is slower.

12:00

So he may be able to. actually

12:02

play both sides of the ball. So

12:04

I thought that was a really interesting

12:06

point that a lot of people have

12:08

really not brought up when talking about

12:10

Travis. That's a really good point. And

12:12

certainly it feels like, you know, we're

12:14

not doing his ability to do it

12:16

justice as well to some extent. Not

12:18

you, but I think in general, when

12:20

we have conversations about Travis Hunter and

12:23

what our expectations are, you know, there's

12:25

a skill. to being able to stay

12:27

healthy. And certainly he took a couple

12:29

big hits in college. I don't think

12:31

they were really his fault, I think

12:33

they were more in the dirty side

12:35

than anything else. But, you know, certainly

12:37

it feels like, I think about someone

12:39

like Lamar Jackson, and, you know, he's

12:41

so good at how he uses his

12:43

body as a runner. He's so good

12:45

at getting out of bounds, he's so

12:47

good at sliding, sort of feeling where

12:49

hurts are coming from and being smart

12:51

about either avoiding with them. getting himself

12:53

into a safe place and yes he

12:55

might leave a yard or two on

12:57

the field at times but obviously the

12:59

benefit of having him on the field

13:01

for a full season is far outweighs

13:03

those concerns and I wonder you know

13:05

if we're sort of by looking at

13:07

other players like we're sort of underselling

13:09

the obvious thing with Travis Hunter is

13:11

that he's already been able to do

13:14

this for so long and done you

13:16

know done it at a high level

13:18

that he's already proven. he's capable of

13:20

doing it. Like it would be obvious

13:22

he couldn't do it because he wouldn't

13:24

be doing it if we hadn't got

13:26

to this point. And so, you know,

13:28

I just think I wouldn't, I want

13:30

to, if I'm a part of an

13:32

organization, I want to protect him from

13:34

himself, I want to protect him from

13:36

himself, I want to get paid, I

13:38

want him to have a, you know,

13:40

reap the benefits of the work he's

13:42

putting in there, and I would feel

13:44

a little if he about, you know,

13:46

He has the ability to do it,

13:48

and I do think there is the

13:50

you know I think he's such a

13:52

smart player and such a You know

13:54

a thoughtful person when it comes to

13:56

how he plays the game that he

13:58

can to some extent, protect himself. There's

14:00

some extent he can be thoughtful about,

14:02

you know, when he does need to

14:05

come out, when he does need to

14:07

not play. And I think that will

14:09

evolve in a way that will lead

14:11

to, you know, some sort of hybrid

14:13

role, even if it's on every down

14:15

opportunity. But certainly it feels like there

14:17

is a real chance for Travis Hunter

14:19

to be something very different than what

14:21

we've seen in the NFL in a

14:23

very long time. And then one point

14:25

I love to add that the Scout

14:27

also brought up and he asked me,

14:29

he said outside of Troy Brown, he

14:31

was with Bellichek, name a receiver that's

14:33

played receiver full time and then went

14:35

over to play corner part time. I

14:37

couldn't think of anybody else. So I

14:39

thought that was another really great point

14:41

that he raised as well. Yeah, and

14:43

I mean, Troy Brown was doing that

14:45

in his mid-30s. I think he would

14:47

have played pro football for a decade,

14:49

and I was like, yeah, I'll just

14:51

add corner back to my skills. So

14:53

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16:11

forever forward. Okay, so first

16:13

round, Travis Hunter, not surprised

16:15

we got there, certainly can't fault

16:18

that too much. Who are we going for

16:20

in the second round of our

16:22

perfect draft for defenders? So I'm

16:24

kind of cheating right here just because

16:26

this guy has like a first early

16:29

second round. That's perfect. That's perfect. Those

16:31

guys fall. Yeah, they do. But his

16:33

name is Derek Harmon. He's a defensive

16:35

tackle from Oregon. And, you know, he

16:37

started his career at Michigan State. He

16:39

was a little overweight, around 350 pounds,

16:41

which is what he came in at.

16:43

He transfers his final year to Oregon.

16:46

One of those portal guys that Oregon

16:48

just completely transformed. And, you know, he

16:50

got down to 310, 315 pounds. Believe

16:52

he weighed in it right at 314

16:54

at the combine. Look like a completely

16:56

different player this year. Very active along

16:58

the interior. Had the highest pressure rate.

17:00

of all interior defensive lineman, this year

17:03

at just over 10% which is a

17:05

really high number, really strong at the

17:07

point of attack, a really good run

17:09

defender as well. So he's another in

17:11

this really strong defensive line class that

17:13

I think could go, you know, as

17:16

early as 16 overall to the Cardinals,

17:18

but I wouldn't be surprised if he's

17:20

there in the late first, early, early,

17:22

second round as well. So Derek Harmon

17:24

of Oregon is somebody that's helped

17:27

himself tremendously this year. getting in shape,

17:29

getting into, you know, it changes the

17:31

roles you have to be able to

17:33

play at, you know, 350, you're probably,

17:35

you know, going to be a one

17:38

technique, you're probably going to be a

17:40

nose, you know, you're probably going to

17:42

be a guy who's just a run

17:44

down defender, but getting into, you know,

17:46

a different way class, getting into a

17:49

different responsibility, means you have more power

17:51

ability to get after the quarterback and

17:53

Derek Carmen doubled his career sack total

17:55

in his final year at Oregon with

17:57

five sacks. Let me ask you, because this

18:00

It's something that comes up when I

18:02

talk to people in the league, and I

18:04

haven't really ever tracked it. It'd be hard

18:06

to do a study on it, but I'd

18:08

be interested to hear what you think about

18:10

it. You'll hear about teams who, and this

18:12

has been, it's more in the past because

18:14

obviously college programs have gotten so good at

18:16

developing talent, but. you'll hear teams say, oh,

18:18

well, once he gets in our building, you

18:20

know, we're going to have a meeting right,

18:22

we're going to have him, you know, in

18:24

a pro week, we're going to have him

18:26

with a pro, a pro coach, a round

18:29

with their pro players, like, we're going to

18:31

get him to be the best version of

18:33

himself, we're going to get him in the

18:35

best shape he's ever been in. that's something

18:37

you believe in at this point that like you

18:39

guys can unlock a new level in terms of

18:41

the circumstances and the situation around them at the

18:43

pro level or do you think that college programs

18:45

have gotten such a point that really it's not

18:48

that much different there's not that much difference between

18:50

maybe you know what obviously dirt current would have

18:52

an Oregon which is like you know one of

18:54

the you know advanced programs in the country and

18:56

what he would have at the pro level if

18:58

he went to it to. It really

19:01

just depends on the player, honestly, just

19:03

because everybody's ambition levels, you know, love

19:05

for the game and wanting to get

19:07

better levels are different. But I think

19:09

with the advancement in college over the

19:11

past five or ten years, you don't

19:13

really hear that as much. Unless like

19:15

a player is just like physically severely

19:17

underdeveloped and they have a ways to

19:19

go. You don't really hear that for

19:21

early round guys now just because they're

19:23

coming out so pro ready now and

19:25

you have the transfer portal and you

19:27

know guys, they can. financially they can

19:29

take care of themselves now just because

19:31

of NIL and you know they can

19:33

eat better they can avoid you know

19:36

meal plans outside of the facilities now

19:38

guys are sponsored by certain meal plans

19:40

now and you know getting themselves in

19:42

those types of programs so you

19:44

don't hear it as much now

19:46

unless you know it's like a

19:48

third or fourth round guy that

19:51

severely underdeveloped in a certain area

19:53

whether it's physically or you know mentally

19:55

in some aspect of things like that.

19:57

you know, played well in the

19:59

playoff. and certainly Derek Carmen

20:01

sounds like, you know, someone where

20:04

it sounds like he played well during

20:06

the CFP playoffs. Do you, how do

20:08

you weigh what you saw at the

20:10

very end of the season versus what

20:12

you saw, you know, during conference play,

20:14

what you saw earlier in the year?

20:16

Like, does it, do you weigh that

20:18

more because it was, you know, in

20:20

a higher profile game? Again, you know,

20:22

maybe to some extent, best on best

20:24

competition or... Do you feel like, you

20:27

know, maybe we overvalue that a little

20:29

bit just because it's the most recent

20:31

thing we saw? It's a case by case

20:33

basis, honestly. And, you know, one that I love

20:35

to use is CJ Stroud against Georgia in the

20:37

playoff a few years ago. A lot of people

20:40

wanted to see that from Stroud earlier in

20:42

the season, but some people ignored it when

20:44

they saw her from CJ Stroud and really

20:46

questioned his athleticism. So I definitely think you

20:48

have to take it into account just because

20:51

we always want to see as a scout

20:53

the first. game tapes that I'm going to cut

20:55

on is who was the best teams or the

20:57

best players that he played against so you're definitely

21:00

going to take it into account as far as

21:02

the competition that they faced and then also the

21:04

college football playoff that's something that I love and

21:06

you know just for example Ashton Gente against Penn

21:08

State that's obviously going to be one of the

21:10

better defenses that he played against in the playoffs

21:13

so you're definitely going to weigh those games a

21:15

little bit more heavily than some of the other

21:17

Mountain West defenses that he went up against.

21:19

Yeah, and you know, there, again,

21:21

this is more the past than

21:23

in this recently, there have been

21:25

teams where I know whether it's

21:28

the head coach, whether it's GM,

21:30

whether it's even the owner, like,

21:32

you know, playing well in a

21:34

bowl game, playing well in a

21:36

playoff game. get your name in the

21:38

building in a way that maybe it

21:40

wouldn't be otherwise. I think on an

21:42

evaluated perspective, when you're talking at people

21:44

who are looking at these guys closely,

21:46

I don't think, you know, I think

21:48

like you said, that's a case-by-case basis.

21:51

It makes sense for, you know, to

21:53

evaluate in context with, you know, how,

21:55

what was the quality of the competition

21:57

versus the competition earlier in the year.

21:59

you know, a bull game in the past

22:02

or in the playoff earlier, where they just

22:04

said, we want that guy. I know that

22:06

guy needs to be on our team and

22:08

even though a, you know, the GM, even

22:10

though these scouts did not have that caliber

22:12

of great on them, it's the guy owns

22:14

the team has a big say when it

22:16

comes to things in April. And so it's

22:18

an interesting process. You know, I think certainly

22:20

it's, I think we, you know, on the

22:22

outside we think about this like this like

22:24

this, you know. this really thoughtful process. And

22:27

I think there is people like you scouts,

22:29

evaluators, putting them in there. And then there's

22:31

a little bit of chaos that comes in,

22:33

you know, when you come to have people

22:35

who are not directly involved. You have a

22:37

coach who falls in love with a guy,

22:39

you have an owner who falls in love

22:41

with a guy, and that leads to some

22:43

interesting decisions when you actually get to draft

22:45

day. Give me your third round pick here

22:47

after we got a corner back in Travis

22:49

Hunter, an interior alignment in Derek Carmen. limited

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tropics and save at Whole Foods

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Market in store and online. So

40:13

I'm gonna go with his name is

40:15

quanderious Robinson. He's also named Q or

40:17

called Q Robinson He's a defensive end

40:19

out of Alabama and he's another guy

40:21

that was a late breakout player He

40:23

got hurt in the LSU game, but

40:25

prior to that point he was playing

40:27

really well He was primarily a special

40:29

teams player during the first four years

40:31

of his career and he had a

40:33

late breakout as I mentioned the production

40:35

was very minimal, but you're talking about

40:37

somebody that has a ton of traits

40:39

I think he's gonna be a deep

40:41

designated past Russia initially, but I think

40:43

he has the upside to eventually turn

40:45

into a starter. Later on down the

40:47

line, maybe in the second or third

40:49

year of his contract, he's probably gonna

40:51

go, like I mentioned, fourth or fifth

40:53

round, just because he has such a

40:55

limited sample size, I believe he only

40:57

played 300 snaps total or somewhere around

40:59

that range on the defensive size of

41:01

past Russia. So the sample size is

41:03

really limited, but I mean, you talk

41:05

about the traits. I'm a firm believer

41:07

in late rounds. taking those athletic guys,

41:09

excuse me, that has those traits just

41:11

because they're lottery tickets, man. I'm taking

41:13

quarterbacks and I'm taking edge rushes in

41:16

the way around. So Quanderius Q. Robinson

41:18

from Alabama is definitely one guy of

41:20

a circle that definitely fits into that

41:22

bucket this year. That's a really good

41:24

conversation to have as well to me

41:26

because I think about, so the conversation

41:28

we have about some of these players

41:30

and. why a guy might fall? And

41:32

there's always different reasons. Like maybe there's

41:34

a guy who wasn't playing at a

41:36

high level, but he was playing very

41:38

often. Maybe there's a guy who had

41:40

off field issues, but maybe that's been

41:42

resolved. Maybe there's a guy who had

41:44

a bunch of injury issues, but when

41:46

he saw him play, he was impressive.

41:48

I think a very fair reason for

41:50

why you did not get a ton

41:52

of burnaway, maybe you're an underrated talent,

41:54

would be that you played at Alabama

41:56

for 40. Like the quality of talent

41:58

you're dealing with, especially during the saving

42:00

years, is some of the best on

42:02

the planet. And so, you know, that

42:04

to me seems like a really reasonable

42:06

case for why a guy might, you

42:08

know, if we could know everything about

42:10

these players might really be a second

42:12

or third round caliber talent, but just

42:14

because we saw him so infrequently, he

42:16

is a. more likely to go late,

42:18

you know, in day three. With someone

42:20

like Quindarius Robinson, I mean, you know,

42:22

isn't a situation where you're seeing like

42:24

a splash player too, and you're just

42:26

like, oh man. like if I get

42:28

five or six of those a year

42:31

I'm good or do you see more

42:33

from him on a snap by snap

42:35

basis even in a limited snap basis

42:37

that makes you think okay this guy

42:39

does have the ability even if he

42:41

is a designated past rush or at

42:43

first to kind of grow into more

42:45

of a starters role like is there

42:47

something you see in Robinson that makes

42:49

you think yeah he could handle a

42:51

larger workload you know down the line

42:53

in the NFL? I think it's a

42:55

little bit of both honestly and you

42:57

know what gives me so much confidence

42:59

about his evaluation is that whenever I'm

43:01

weighing those late round guys I'm always

43:03

gonna weigh the guys more positively that

43:05

have that special teams experience just because

43:07

I always call it getting more bang

43:09

for your book and this goes for

43:11

a linebacker's corners and then also defensive

43:13

lineman as well those guys have to

43:15

play special teams so if they have

43:17

experience or worth of experience on special

43:19

teams I have I'm already curious to

43:21

put those guys on there just because

43:23

they have so much experience. He's been

43:25

a core four guy on special teams.

43:27

And then also I know he has

43:29

those athletic traits to give me something

43:31

on third down, whether it's those NASCAR

43:33

packages, or like to call those late

43:35

down situations. I already know that he's

43:37

an experienced past fresher to where he's

43:39

going to be able to give me

43:41

something right away. Not only on late

43:43

down situations, but also on special teams

43:46

as well. So I think that's something

43:48

that's definitely going to work in his

43:50

work in his favor. Yeah, I mean,

43:52

I always talk about this, I wrote

43:54

about this a lot winning. came to,

43:56

you know, I was previewing free agency

43:58

in the NFL, and I think there's

44:00

fans where it's like, you know, looking

44:02

at someone like, I don't want to

44:04

disparage anybody, but like De Andre Hopkins,

44:06

where it's like, De Andre Hopkins is

44:08

a legendary football player, a superstar at

44:10

his best. But he doesn't play special

44:12

teams. He should not be asked. He's

44:14

monetary freaking Hopkins, like you're not gonna

44:16

ask for special teams. But, you know,

44:18

I think you see guys at like

44:20

the wide receiver for wide receiver five

44:22

level or, you know, the backup linebackers,

44:24

different guys like that, well, it's like

44:26

the backup linebackers, different guys like that,

44:28

and it's like, well, why don't we

44:30

have, you give Juncker Hopkins that role,

44:32

who goes the last couple years, and

44:34

it's like, like, underestimate your need to

44:36

do that stuff to survive. I think

44:38

about someone like, the guy I always

44:40

bring up for some reason is Zach

44:42

Pascal, who's on the Eagles and it's

44:44

on the Cardinals now and it's like,

44:46

that dude's gonna have like five catches

44:48

a year. He's not gonna, you know,

44:50

no one's gonna have his jersey in

44:52

the stands, but he is gonna be

44:54

a core special teamer, he's gonna block

44:56

well, like that's what you want from

44:58

your, the players, you know, in the

45:00

40s, in the 50s, and your NFL,

45:03

and your NFL roster, and your NFL

45:05

roster, and your NFL roster. And so,

45:07

and your NFL roster. And so, and

45:09

your NFL roster. And so, and so,

45:11

you know, and so, you know, you

45:13

know, you know, you know, you know,

45:15

you know, you know, you know, you

45:17

know, you know, for, for, for, for,

45:19

for, You know, it's on the opposite

45:21

side of the ball, but someone like

45:23

Robinson, I mean, if you can do

45:25

that, that's going to help you survive

45:27

long enough to get the opportunities to

45:29

be a past rushier. They get the

45:31

opportunity, you know, it's a lot easier

45:33

to justify having a guy who might

45:35

be a 10 snap a game past

45:37

rushier if he can also play special

45:39

teams. Absolutely, there's so much value in

45:41

the special teams, man. A lot of

45:43

people don't really realize just how essential

45:45

those plays can turn over games. And

45:47

then also, once again, if you can

45:49

get a guy that's playing, like you

45:51

mentioned, that can be that bottom of

45:53

the depth chart, why receiver five or

45:55

six, but he's an ace special team,

45:57

special teams guy, there's a lot of

45:59

value in that. And like you mentioned,

46:01

nobody's gonna be wearing his jersey in

46:03

his jersey in the stands, or he's

46:05

not. or something like that. So there's

46:07

a lot of value in those. guys.

46:09

Absolutely. We have two picks left. Give

46:11

me your sixth round selection. So, like

46:13

I said, I'm a big fan of

46:15

taking those players that can be part-time

46:18

players that eventually could develop eventually into

46:20

something. And maybe somebody that falls because

46:22

they're undersized or, you know, maybe have

46:24

off the field or anything like that.

46:26

This guy doesn't have off the field,

46:28

but he is undersized. His name is

46:30

Aneas Peoples. He's a defensive tackle from

46:32

Virginia Tech. Very undersized at about six,

46:34

one, two hundred and ninety pounds, but

46:36

nobody could block them this year. whether

46:38

it was, you know, during the games

46:40

the season, the senior bowl, the white

46:42

it could block him, and, you know,

46:44

he goes out, he performs really well

46:46

during the, the pre-drive circuit this year

46:48

as well. And, you know, he's never

46:50

gonna be one of those early down

46:52

guys that's gonna be taking on double

46:54

teams or somebody you count on against

46:56

the run, but as far as being

46:58

that slippery past rush that can just

47:00

deconstruct blocks and penetrate the first level,

47:02

I definitely think there's a role for

47:04

him and you kind of have to

47:06

use them. I like to say like

47:08

a relief pitcher of where you bring

47:10

him in certain situations whether there's third

47:12

down, third long, whatever it may be,

47:14

to where you know he's gonna win

47:16

his one-on-one and you know the Philadelphia

47:18

Eagles have really taken this blueprint and

47:20

you know the Bucks did it to

47:22

an extent to during their Super Bowl

47:24

run of where just taking these late

47:26

round guys or you know undersized players

47:28

that eventually can be contributors long term

47:30

so and these people's definitely fits into

47:33

that category of where he's never going

47:35

to be counted upon early on but

47:37

if he can go to a rotation

47:39

to where he can be you know

47:41

that fourth or fifth guy that comes

47:43

in and those obvious long down situations

47:45

are passing situations there's a role for

47:47

him in the NFL. I love this

47:49

because I think that that that role

47:51

of like interior disruptor of like interior

47:53

disruptor who plays you know some level

47:55

of Pass downs and all you have

47:57

to fill and run downs is a

47:59

super undervalued and under appreciated asset I

48:01

mean, you know on a much higher

48:03

level guys who were full-time I think

48:05

we sleep on these guys. I think

48:07

that's a more valuable archetype than a

48:09

guy who went in the middle of

48:11

the first round, even though he was

48:13

Aaron Donald because we were like, you

48:15

know, is he a little undersized? Another

48:17

guy, Geno Atkins, with the Bengals, where

48:19

he was a, I think a third

48:21

round pick and had a long career,

48:23

was super successful, super talented. I think

48:25

we sleep on these guys. I think

48:27

that's a more valuable archetype than we

48:29

give people credit for it. Do you

48:31

feel like that is a situation where

48:33

he has to end up in the

48:35

right place, like just because he is

48:37

a little smaller, or do you think

48:39

just past rush placed no matter where

48:41

you go? I think he

48:44

has to go to the right situation. And

48:46

if you're counting on him to be a

48:48

starter right away, I don't think that's the

48:51

best role for him. So once again, he's

48:53

kind of like that guy, you know, that's

48:55

like eight or nine. I love using sports

48:57

analogies to describe football for whatever reason. That's

49:00

how I am. So he's that eight or

49:02

ninth guy that comes off the bench and

49:04

basketball that's just that energize or bunny that

49:06

just brings so much energy. that he's exactly

49:09

he's exactly that guy he's the energizer bunny

49:11

so I wouldn't want him being a full-time

49:13

starter initially but if he can be that

49:16

fourth or fifth guy in the defensive line

49:18

or defensive interior rotation that can come in

49:20

and those obvious passing down situation and eventually

49:22

you know give give something more long term

49:25

whether it's a starter you know consistently being

49:27

a DPRK along the interior I definitely think

49:29

there's a role for him and we've seen

49:31

whenever you can develop a pass rush rush

49:34

in waves we saw it with the Eagles

49:36

this year yeah And I mean, Milton Williams

49:38

really played that role early on in his

49:41

career before he eventually became a starter. And

49:43

I believe he's a third round pick. So

49:45

with people, him having that type of role

49:47

initially, being that fourth or fifth guy off

49:50

the bench and eventually potentially developing it to

49:52

the starter, I think that's what he can

49:54

be. Yeah, I mean, that is certainly a

49:57

role that I think is really valuable. I

49:59

mean, defensive tackles, getting paid a ton of

50:01

money these days, if you can rush the

50:03

quarterback, very close to what type edge rushers

50:06

are making. So, you know, again, is he

50:08

going to be Aaron Donald? Probably not, but

50:10

can he be a useful player? I think,

50:12

absolutely. Final pick here. I feel like you've

50:15

done such a good job. You've built like

50:17

a whole little team here. Two defensive tackles.

50:19

We've got an edge guy, we've got a

50:22

line backer, we've got a couple defensive backs.

50:24

Finish up here, bringing home strong, who is

50:26

your seventh and final round selection. So this

50:28

guy's gonna go a little earlier than the

50:31

seventh round, but I want to make sure

50:33

to talk about him because I love him

50:35

so much and I think he's gonna be

50:37

a really good player. His name is Upton.

50:40

And you know Jim Nagy does such such

50:42

a great job in the senior bowl when

50:44

he was there he was the guy that

50:47

put me on the radar or stout on

50:49

my radar just because the NFL was so

50:51

interested in him but it's really hard sometimes

50:53

for the media to catch up to some

50:56

of these guys are hidden gyms that the

50:58

NFL has and you talk to scouts they

51:00

don't want to give you the names just

51:02

because you'll tweet about them and everybody would

51:05

know about them so up the stout definitely

51:07

was the one name that I was late

51:09

to he's undersized. Yeah, 180 pounds, but he

51:12

played outside. He played outside corner at Western

51:14

Kentucky. I believe only gave up three catches

51:16

this past season. He's very physical and run

51:18

support. He reminds me a lot of Amika

51:21

Robertson when he was coming out of Louisiana

51:23

Tech. Another guy that was extremely undersized, he

51:25

actually played outside corner in Detroit last year,

51:28

very similar measurables, outstanding ball production. You can

51:30

blitz them off of the edge. There's so

51:32

many things that he can do. I think

51:34

he has the potential to be a nickel

51:37

corner as early on as a rookie. It's

51:39

just how comfortable. are with the size. And

51:41

another trend that I'm really interested to see

51:43

if the NFL does really change, those nickel

51:46

corners really don't go until about the third

51:48

or the fourth. round. That's really that's really

51:50

been the sweet spot of where you see

51:53

a lot of these nickel guys go. So

51:55

for somebody like an up and stout, I'm

51:57

really interested to see where he is selected.

51:59

If I had to guess, I think probably

52:02

the fifth round right now is probably where

52:04

he ends up going, but I think somebody's

52:06

gonna get a steal with him. Yeah, there's

52:08

a lot of stuff to talk about here.

52:11

He's a really fascinating player you brought up.

52:13

A couple things that come to mind. I

52:15

want to start with, you know the idea

52:18

of... where you take those guys. Certainly, it

52:20

feels like, given how often you're playing in

52:22

your sub-packages, I mean, the nickel is basically

52:24

your primary package for a lot of teams,

52:27

that guy's on the field. I mean, that

52:29

guy's on the field a ton. And so

52:31

we haven't seen slot corners get paid as

52:33

much as outside corners, but I also wonder,

52:36

you know, how good we are, or maybe.

52:38

you know, whether we're underestimating guys' abilities to

52:40

play outside. I think about someone like Mike

52:43

Sainer still, where, you know, the commanders took

52:45

him in the second round last year, and

52:47

I think the idea originally was, okay, he's

52:49

gonna be in the slot. Like, that's gonna

52:52

be the role for him. We're gonna have

52:54

Benjamin said to choose outside. We're gonna have,

52:56

you know, have a competition. Maybe Mc Davis

52:59

is our other outside corner. And then by

53:01

the end of the end of the year.

53:03

Noah Ivanogany is playing in the slot. Like

53:05

Sainer still is playing outside. He's been playing

53:08

outside all year, playing well, even though he's

53:10

five foot ten. And then they trade for

53:12

Marshall and Ladimor or whether they're at said

53:14

corner. You know, I think, I guess I

53:17

wonder, like, how good do you think we

53:19

are at evaluating whether guys can play on

53:21

the outside or can play in the slot?

53:24

And does that play, you know, in, set

53:26

play to stout's strengths because we've seen him

53:28

play on the outside so maybe he can

53:30

play even as an undersized corner back on

53:33

the outside or you think it's just at

53:35

some point the size is too much to

53:37

overcome. I think as long as he's not

53:39

like severely undersized which I don't think he

53:42

is honestly even at five or eight and

53:44

a half just because we've seen guys like

53:46

Omic Robertson doing it doing it and you

53:49

know Sandrasdale is a little bit taller but

53:51

we've seen those guys that just have that

53:53

just have that competitive edge to efficiencies and

53:55

I think stout definitely is one of those

53:58

guys and just watching them at the senior

54:00

ball. I mean he was competing with guys

54:02

like Jayden Higgins and some of these other

54:04

big wide receivers on the outside and he

54:07

was completely fine. So I think it really

54:09

once again is just a case-by-case basis with

54:11

each team and then just how comfortable you

54:14

are with the size deficiencies and there may

54:16

be a team that is comfortable playing on

54:18

the outside. You just never know with a

54:20

lot of these teams but I think he

54:23

projects better inside these better inside these teams.

54:25

Not durable, he is in run support, how

54:27

you can blitz him as well. And then

54:30

as an outside corner, I don't think he

54:32

can blitz him as much, especially a guy

54:34

that plays nickel, just because of the alignment.

54:36

So I think he'd be taking some things

54:39

away as far as what he does well,

54:41

I mean, if you put him outside. Yeah,

54:43

I mean, eight tackles for loss last year,

54:45

certainly was getting in the backfield and making

54:48

plays pretty consistently. Western Kentucky, not the smallest

54:50

school in the smallest school in the whole

54:52

world, but it's not Michigan, I mean, I

54:55

mean, I mean, how do you. How do

54:57

you weigh what you see at a place

54:59

like the Senior Bowl where you have a

55:01

guy against stiffer competition versus what you see

55:04

when he's, you know, maybe playing at a

55:06

high level against lesser competition in conference USA

55:08

or at a lower level? Well, I think

55:10

this is why the postseason all-star games are

55:13

so great for an evaluator Just because and

55:15

the example that I love to use is

55:17

Quinnion Mitchell last year What was the big

55:20

question mark about him? He didn't play against

55:22

anybody But once he goes to the senior

55:24

bowl He has one of the better weeks

55:26

that I've ever seen of any prospect regardless

55:29

of position and then he carries that over

55:31

into the combine and he runs really well

55:33

and he performs really well so you know,

55:35

as an evaluator, you love to see those

55:38

smaller school prospects go against, you know, guys

55:40

from the SEC, the ACC, the Big 12,

55:42

the Big Ten, or what have you, just

55:45

because now that gives us a litmus test

55:47

of, okay, these are the types of competition

55:49

that he's gonna face, or potentially face in

55:51

the NFL, and he looks completely fine. There's

55:54

not a, you know, he doesn't, what I

55:56

like to call, he doesn't like a fish

55:58

out of water out of water of water,

56:01

where he just, and still shutting these guys

56:03

down, just like what he did while he

56:05

was at Toledo. Is there, are you someone

56:07

who believes in like firm height cutoffs, where

56:10

you're just like, okay, there's a point where

56:12

I can't take, not a cornerback necessarily, but

56:14

at, you know, offensive line, a defensive line,

56:16

running back, a wide receiver, or are you

56:19

more like, you know, it depends on how

56:21

they play? Like, do you think a, like

56:23

if he was five foot seven. the talent

56:26

plays up more than any particular size or

56:28

weight. Well, that's why I think analytics are

56:30

so important. Honestly, Bill, just because it gives

56:32

you a probability with a lot of guys.

56:35

We saw it with Will Campbell and, you

56:37

know, the arm length, the 33 inch arm

56:39

length of, there's not a lot of guys

56:41

or hardly any that started at tackle and

56:44

had success with that. I know another for

56:46

a lot of corners is if their arms

56:48

are under 30 inches, it's very rare to

56:51

see a guy have a lot of success

56:53

or any success at all with the outside

56:55

corner. So whenever you can add a probability.

56:57

period, GM's are always going to take that

57:00

just because it's such a crapshoot of what

57:02

I like to call an educated guess. No

57:04

matter how good these prospects may be, there

57:06

isn't a such thing as a quote-unquote safe

57:09

prospect. So whenever you can add probability into

57:11

drafting, GM's are always going to take that.

57:13

So there's going to be some teams that

57:16

don't even have up-nastout on the draft board

57:18

just because of how small he is. But

57:20

there's always going to be outliers. I know.

57:22

and you know he goes back and forth

57:25

between the outside and nickel but one of

57:27

those rare guys with smaller or shorter than

57:29

30 inch arms that had success as an

57:32

outside corner and there's been some others as

57:34

far as offensive tackles that have had shorter

57:36

than 33 inch arms that have went on

57:38

to have success but there's just not a

57:41

lot of GMs that are comfortable betting on

57:43

those outliers at the position and they just

57:45

like to add the probability that could be

57:47

on their side to make a better educated

57:50

guess. I could not have said it better.

57:52

There's just this, you know, I think when

57:54

we talk about stuff on TV or we

57:57

talk about stuff, you know, in a really

57:59

quick fashion, like, we reduce this stuff to

58:01

such a simple thing, and it's not. Like,

58:03

there's so many variables that we can play

58:06

here and using data, it helps. And in

58:08

some cases, it's really helpful. In some cases,

58:10

it's not helpful at all. But like, it's

58:12

more like guardrails for this stuff than anything

58:15

else than anything else. We're still trying, this

58:17

is still such a hard process that I

58:19

think we reduce guys to bus, we reduce

58:22

guys to stars, and so much of this

58:24

is context, so much of this is where

58:26

a guy lands, so much of it is,

58:28

you know, whether a guy stays healthy, so

58:31

much of it is, you know, like an

58:33

evaluation process that is still really incredibly difficult.

58:35

And so I just think, you know, using

58:37

data is helpful, using... you know, traditional skiding

58:40

is helpful, any information is good, as long

58:42

as you can synthesize it and use it

58:44

correctly and use it appropriately. And I think

58:47

the best organizations in football, I mean, you

58:49

brought up the Philadelphia Eagles, right? Like, that

58:51

is one of the most analytically inclined organizations

58:53

in the league, but I guarantee you, they

58:56

are using. old school scouting, they're using video,

58:58

they're using, they're talking to teams code, like

59:00

they're doing everything. And if you can do

59:03

everything well, you end up drafting good players.

59:05

And even they took Jaylon Rager over Justin

59:07

Jefferson, like it is still hard for them.

59:09

So I just, you know, I think this

59:12

is such a difficult process and it's been

59:14

so much fun, understanding. you know your process

59:16

and how it relates to these players I

59:18

feel like I always learn so much when

59:21

I talk to you about this stuff and

59:23

I feel like it's just such a it's

59:25

such a joy for me to learn more

59:28

about something I don't have a good handle

59:30

on. I appreciate it and very complimentary that's

59:32

why I love coming on here but I

59:34

mean you do have some teams that do

59:37

have older scouting reports that just go off

59:39

of the eye test just because it's all

59:41

about what you were what you were raised

59:43

on as a scout and if it was

59:46

strictly as far as how those scouts were

59:48

raised when they were coming up through the

59:50

ranks too. Right. It is better to do

59:53

that for sure. Even some 60 year olds

59:55

in the scouting department, they're just gonna go

59:57

strictly off of the eye tests. And I

59:59

mean, they've done a good job of drafting.

1:00:02

Yeah, right. You could do that for sure.

1:00:04

Right. So it's just a matter of exactly

1:00:06

what you want to do. And as far

1:00:08

as how those scouts were raised when they

1:00:11

were coming up through the ranks too. Right.

1:00:13

modern scout or vice versa. So yeah, I

1:00:15

mean, we have a pretty exciting group of

1:00:18

players here. I'll go over them again. First

1:00:20

round pick for Jordan Reed in his perfect

1:00:22

defensive draft, Travis Hunter, sure you're ready to

1:00:24

know Travis Hunter, the star cornerback from Colorado,

1:00:27

Derek Harmon, second round pick, defensive tackle from

1:00:29

Oregon, enter Macuba, the safety from Texas, the

1:00:31

guy who's gonna go all around the field

1:00:34

for us on defense. fourth round pick Demetrius

1:00:36

Knight the veteran linebacker at a South Carolina.

1:00:38

Quanderius Robinson's going to be our developmental edge

1:00:40

prospect. He's going to play special teams. It's

1:00:43

going to be a designated pass rush. We're

1:00:45

going to get him on the field on

1:00:47

passing downs. And he is Peebles, he's going

1:00:49

to join him. They're going to be our

1:00:52

energy guys off the bench. They're going to

1:00:54

be the fan favorites coming in, making plays

1:00:56

in our pass rush rotation, our third and

1:00:59

fourth alignment and then Upton stout finishing out

1:01:01

finishing up. undersized cornerback in the slot, really

1:01:03

exciting group of players here, but Jordan. I

1:01:05

feel like I could listen to you talk

1:01:08

about these guys all day. If people want

1:01:10

to hear, read, understand more about the draft,

1:01:12

and what you're seeing, where can people do

1:01:14

that? Yeah, so you can find me on

1:01:17

X Twitter, whatever you call it or want

1:01:19

to call it at Jordan, J-O-R-D-A-N, underscore, read,

1:01:21

or E-I-D. You can find my work along

1:01:24

with my colleagues, Field Yates, Mel Kuiper, as

1:01:26

well as Matt Miller on ESPN Plus, and

1:01:28

all ESPN platforms, we're releasing mock drives, player

1:01:30

rankings, player rankings, and then our player articles

1:01:33

as well, pretty much, pretty much weekly, mock

1:01:35

draft come out come out

1:01:37

which will be a

1:01:39

full full seven round of my

1:01:42

favorite projects to do

1:01:44

every year. I'm sure

1:01:46

you can hear it

1:01:49

in my voice. I'm sure

1:01:51

you can hear it in my I

1:01:53

love it. I'm so

1:01:55

excited. I love it. I'm so

1:01:58

going to be on

1:02:00

paternity leave. I'm going

1:02:02

to be reading this

1:02:05

at like three in

1:02:07

the morning. to be love

1:02:09

it. know, with at in

1:02:11

my in the morning. I love it.

1:02:14

you. Thank you. I'm

1:02:16

looking forward hands looking

1:02:18

forward to reading this.

1:02:20

Jordan, thank you so

1:02:23

much, my friend. to Thank

1:02:25

you. you.