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trying to figure out like why you're

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not selling out of stadium yet.

2:02

Welcome to episode 508, Troy Cartwright.

2:04

Troy has a podcast called Ten

2:06

Year Town. That's how I was

2:08

introduced to him. It's really good

2:10

podcast. It's, I would say, a

2:13

better version of this show. You would

2:15

say that? Yeah, probably. Yeah, he's like a

2:17

legit songwriter, he's a legit

2:19

artist, and we talk a lot about

2:21

that, but I was drawn to his

2:23

podcast because I was following it. on Tiktok

2:26

and the clips would come up and now

2:28

I was like dang and I went and did

2:30

his podcast and I don't think it's this

2:32

big yet but I was like yeah this is

2:34

a better version of what I do in

2:36

that wild though you see something on Tiktok

2:38

and you think it's massive like I've

2:40

been seeing his clips for a long

2:43

time now and it's weird seeing his

2:45

perspective from his side yeah yeah I

2:47

really like it I like him I

2:49

like him a lot and so we'll

2:51

talk to him coming up in just

2:53

a second episode five oh And I

2:55

am fascinated and have been fascinated with

2:57

the Oklahoma City bombing. I'm like so

2:59

into, that's kind of how I learned

3:01

about it. I just watched the Netflix

3:03

documentary that just came out. Oh, there

3:06

is one? Yeah. I saw, so that's

3:08

what I saw you talking to. I

3:10

didn't know that was on Netflix. Yeah.

3:12

The director of the, the director of

3:14

it, because I was too young when

3:16

it happened. I don't really remember

3:19

it. There's like eight avenues of

3:21

crazy. Meaning, you could go the route

3:23

of who really was he, who were

3:25

they working for? There's all that. There's

3:28

also just how it was caught.

3:30

That's wild. It was also crazy that

3:32

when they didn't know it was

3:34

him, they started accusing other people,

3:36

they were like, oh, we saw

3:38

Middle Eastern people coming out of

3:40

that building. Yeah, doesn't it show,

3:42

I mean, that stuff still happening

3:44

today. Yeah, like even back in

3:46

the 90s, like that was just

3:48

there. And in the 90s, there

3:50

was nobody. to go, hey we don't think

3:53

that's right, there were like three channels,

3:55

four channels, but, so the bomb goes off,

3:57

it's not a spoiler because it's a

3:59

real event. history. The bomb goes off

4:01

and the guy who set the bombs

4:04

drives away and his license plate, the

4:06

explosion, actually shook the car so his

4:08

license plate fell to the ground. And

4:10

they found the license plate. Yeah, and

4:13

he was driving like 70 miles from

4:15

there, got pulled over for another reason.

4:17

Yeah, because he had no license plate.

4:20

Not because they were like, that's the

4:22

guy. And then he had a gun

4:24

on him. And no

4:26

license plates, they put him in

4:28

jail, but not because of the

4:31

bombing. And then he's in jail

4:33

the whole time, and they're looking

4:35

for, like you said, a Middle

4:37

Eastern guy, they're looking for all

4:39

these fake things, and he's sitting

4:41

right there in prison. It's a,

4:43

all, it's tragic, it's sad. And

4:46

he almost got ahead of jail,

4:48

like he was in court, they

4:50

were like, everybody let this guy

4:52

go, like, wait a minute. Yep.

4:54

because you're talking with the director

4:56

of that project. Yeah, and one

4:59

of the retired FBI agents who

5:01

was there rescuing people. I went

5:03

to the building across the street

5:05

because I went and toured the

5:07

whole thing and so went up.

5:09

And there's audio of from the

5:11

building across the street as they're

5:14

having a town hall meeting because

5:16

they record all the town hall

5:18

meetings and you hear it in

5:20

the town hall meeting, how loud

5:22

the explosion was to the people

5:24

across the street. Yeah. I didn't

5:26

realize how massive the destruction was

5:29

too. So, and again, there are

5:31

a lot of conspiracy lanes to

5:33

travel down if you choose, but

5:35

that's everything. But yeah, you're right.

5:37

Check out that on movie, Mike's

5:39

movie podcast. And not so much

5:42

just a plug about Mike's podcast,

5:44

which is great, but I'm super

5:46

interested in that. I'm super interested

5:48

in songwriters and especially viewpoints of

5:50

songwriters, which is what Troy does.

5:52

He brings on others and they

5:54

have talks. And so this is

5:57

my talk with him. This is

5:59

Troy Cartwright. And again, the. Here's

6:01

the episode, enjoy. Troy, good to

6:03

see you. Good to see you.

6:05

How you doing? I don't know.

6:07

It's kind of like that. I

6:09

don't know. Good? Yeah. Yeah. My

6:12

days, I think, are layered a

6:14

bit different than yours. Yeah. Just

6:16

from the waking up part, right?

6:18

So I think we're, when people

6:20

ask me that question, it's often

6:22

like, how are you doing? I'm

6:25

like, you know, I think that's,

6:27

I'm at a different stage of

6:29

my day. So it's relative to

6:31

what stage of the day, you

6:33

know, you're in. Yeah. I was

6:35

gonna say before, I really like

6:37

you by the time on. Take

6:40

Talk, saw the clips. Yeah, and

6:42

really had a great time on

6:44

your podcast. And I hope it

6:46

was well received and you have

6:48

to say that. So I don't

6:50

want you to say it. You

6:52

have to say it. It's an

6:55

obligation to say that. But yeah,

6:57

you do a great job. And

6:59

I left going, man, that was

7:01

fun for me because I didn't

7:03

feel like I had to do

7:05

what I feel like I often

7:08

have to do, which is take

7:10

control. So it's not a dud.

7:12

And I'm not right when I

7:14

do that. I didn't have to

7:16

do that with you. You owned

7:18

it. And I hope people hear

7:20

this and go, wow, maybe if

7:23

this interview is not terrible, I'll

7:25

go check out Troy's podcast. Yeah.

7:27

So how are you enjoying that?

7:29

I'm loving it. Still? Oh yeah.

7:31

It's one of those things, right,

7:33

where if I would have known

7:35

how hard it was when I

7:38

started, I'm not sure I would

7:40

have done it. That's this whole

7:42

career too. I mean that's a

7:44

microcosm for everything this whole freaking

7:46

city Yeah, so it's been a

7:48

lot of work, but it's you

7:51

know, it's been really rewarding and

7:53

and I You know, I enjoy

7:55

getting to To like to tell

7:57

the stories, you know, and and

7:59

I like talking to people yeah,

8:01

I think you like what people

8:03

should like about podcasting because I

8:06

feel like you pay attention you

8:08

care you are interested and curious.

8:10

Like you have all the things

8:12

that I think I wish I

8:14

cared about. Or I'm just like,

8:16

oh God, there's a lot to

8:18

say and there's another human in

8:21

the room and let's just see

8:23

what happens. Like that's what I

8:25

liked about because I. You're very

8:27

warm. I'll come back to the

8:29

podcast. I wanted to lead with

8:31

that though, because I do feel

8:34

that way. And I know we've

8:36

texted once or twice. But I

8:38

wanted to say that at the

8:40

beginning, so I didn't forget. But

8:42

what I did know a lot

8:44

about as far as your career

8:46

was, your music, your writing. I

8:49

knew you from doing the podcast,

8:51

but I knew you did the

8:53

podcast because you were also a

8:55

writer, but I didn't really know

8:57

what that story was. Yeah. I'm

8:59

seeing now on TikTok because I'm

9:01

a psycho super fan of yours.

9:04

Are you writing again? Are you

9:06

now writing and making content with

9:08

what you're writing because I'm seeing

9:10

content? Yeah. So where are you

9:12

in that stage? So I am

9:14

writing every day. So where are

9:17

you in that stage? So I

9:19

am writing every day more or

9:21

less since I moved to Nashville

9:23

eight years ago. Almost nine years

9:25

ago now. I'm coming up on

9:27

the title of my podcast, you

9:29

know, so something's got to break

9:32

soon. Oh, you're about to be

9:34

a millionaire then, because if you

9:36

make it 10 years, you're automatically

9:38

a millionaire. That's how it works.

9:40

Yeah. Yeah. So I'm writing all

9:42

the time and I have been

9:44

working towards a new record for

9:47

my artist project. And, you know,

9:49

in addition to that, I am

9:51

writing songs for... other people. So

9:53

is that why I'm seeing you,

9:55

do you in music content? Because

9:57

you're working on you. Yeah. That

10:00

would make sense. Yeah. Because if

10:02

you're writing, and you're publishing, or

10:04

you're writing, whatever you're doing, and

10:06

you're writing for other people, or

10:08

you're writing to be pitch, you're

10:10

probably not putting a lot of

10:12

that content on social media. Yeah.

10:15

Makes sense if you're doing your

10:17

own project. Yes. And it is,

10:19

you know, It's a it's a

10:21

it's quite a long story and

10:23

I'm happy to go into it

10:25

if you You know, you can

10:27

get discovered you can reach people

10:30

and When you're writing and making

10:32

songs you're trying to you hope

10:34

that it can mean something to

10:36

somebody Yeah, the Environment is very

10:38

different and also the same in

10:40

the way of what's great about

10:43

now is The finger-quote gatekeepers have

10:45

far less control. Yeah, but the

10:47

finger-quote gatekeepers are now an algorithm

10:49

that right you don't even know

10:51

who they are at least You

10:53

kind of knew the devil you

10:55

were dancing with before. But the

10:58

freedom now is, is that you

11:00

have it and it just takes

11:02

the right thing at the right

11:04

time and the right algorithm looking

11:06

for the right, for it to

11:08

hit. Right. There's something I heard

11:10

one time about like increasing your

11:13

luck surface area. So you still

11:15

got it. Like if you go,

11:17

if you want to go viral,

11:19

you know, it takes a lot

11:21

of luck, but can be more

11:23

tries lead to. More luck and

11:26

that's hard work and and I've

11:28

had you know some stuff Go

11:30

really viral what's really viral you

11:32

real last few years um define

11:34

a number I think when I

11:36

posted That's why which was Trying

11:38

to think if it was 23

11:41

or 22 think it was 22

11:43

I posted it right before Valentine's

11:45

day and I went to bed.

11:47

It wouldn't post. It was weird.

11:49

It like God love I went

11:51

to bed story. Yeah, but it

11:53

was big. It's like a I

11:56

think that one was many hundreds

11:58

of thousands, if not close to

12:00

a million. Yeah. But literally, yeah.

12:02

I posted this thing and I

12:04

was uncomfortable. I was singing to

12:06

my camera, you know, not really

12:09

my, necessarily my vibe. Yeah, it

12:11

feels a little goofy. Yeah, went

12:13

to bed. I think that one

12:15

was many hundreds of thousands, if

12:17

not close to a million. The

12:19

next day. The next day. And

12:21

I had just gotten dropped. from

12:24

my record deal. So it was

12:26

like, okay, here we go. You

12:28

know, I was right. Are you

12:30

a God guy? Yeah, yeah, in

12:32

my own way, yes. And I

12:34

think it's a great answer in

12:36

your own way, yes, because I

12:39

am in my own way as

12:41

well. I think we all are

12:43

and we have our own different.

12:45

But did that, was that ever

12:47

part of it where it's like

12:49

something, it didn't even have to

12:52

be a God thing? Yeah, something

12:54

bigger. Just showed me That whatever

12:56

I lost in that hey, you've

12:58

now been dropped that maybe it's

13:00

not all lost But did that

13:02

happen at all with you? Yeah,

13:04

you know, there's this there's this

13:07

quote I really like that says

13:09

opportunity is a strange beast it

13:11

frequently appears after a loss and

13:13

I and that has been true

13:15

for me a lot of times

13:17

and it was it was an

13:19

interesting time because I was dealing

13:22

with sort of a little bit

13:24

of an identity crisis because ever

13:26

since I, when I first moved

13:28

to town, I had some momentum

13:30

coming, when I came here from

13:32

Texas. Well, momentum based on what?

13:35

Based on some music I had

13:37

put out. And this was very,

13:39

very like, you know, comparatively small,

13:41

but it was, there was something

13:43

bubbling up and I was doing

13:45

something that I think, you know,

13:47

somebody, somebody liked. and that your

13:50

artist, you're sick, because you have

13:52

different versions of your career. Yes,

13:54

I have. Your performance, got it.

13:56

Yeah. Yes, I have kind of

13:58

a songwriting and artist and now

14:00

a podcast. Yeah, you gotta do

14:02

like, explain like I'm five at

14:05

times. Okay, so you move here

14:07

with some momentum. Yes, based on

14:09

your performance. Correct. Performing. I had

14:11

started up until that point, I

14:13

was just living in Dallas writing,

14:15

you know, in my bedroom basically,

14:18

and I had made a record

14:20

and I had put part of

14:22

that record out and somebody. that

14:24

worked as like an independent radio

14:26

promoter invited me. They said you

14:28

should come to Nashville and you

14:30

should meet some people. So that's

14:33

how I met a publisher named

14:35

Jake Gear and then he set

14:37

me up on some co-writes blah

14:39

blah blah. Like a year later

14:41

I moved to Nashville and I

14:43

got on the radar of somebody

14:45

at the label and they signed

14:48

me. It happened pretty quick, you

14:50

know, I got I got a

14:52

record deal and that was that

14:54

was a dream at the time

14:56

It was a dream come true.

14:58

It happened so quick that you

15:01

didn't really Dot the eyes and

15:03

cross the T's and or even

15:05

understand that that was a thing

15:07

You know, I've been thinking about

15:09

this a little bit It's in

15:11

it was a perfectly Fine deal.

15:13

Yeah, I was I'm not insinuating

15:16

it was luprome and shady right

15:18

right right right right it was

15:20

there there's a lot of things

15:22

looking back on that I wasn't

15:24

thinking about. Part of that was

15:26

just like, what do I want

15:28

to sound like? What do I

15:31

want to say? How old were

15:33

you? 20, it was 26. You're

15:35

just starting at that age to

15:37

figure out what you're just starting

15:39

to figure out. Yeah, I mean,

15:41

you don't even know what you

15:44

don't know. Yeah, so that crisis,

15:46

I understand the, okay. So what

15:48

happens is, you come to town,

15:50

here I go from writing, I

15:52

was very rigid. with my schedule

15:54

when I was riding by myself.

15:56

I woke up every day. writing

15:59

at 11 and I wrote until

16:01

2 or 3 in the afternoon

16:03

every day. So when I moved

16:05

to Nashville, okay now I'm getting

16:07

set up on these co-writes and

16:09

I'm writing with people and now

16:11

there's these things called track guys.

16:14

So now you're getting like these

16:16

almost, basically you're ending the day

16:18

with a song that kind of

16:20

sounds like a record. But you're

16:22

going through, you know, maybe a

16:24

hundred different combinations of writers. So

16:27

over time. when you don't know

16:29

exactly what you want to say

16:31

and what you want to sound

16:33

like, you can strangely lose your

16:35

voice in that process. It kind

16:37

of reminds me, Evan, it's not

16:39

exactly the same, the quote, if

16:42

you don't stand for something, you'll

16:44

stand for anything. Yeah. And it's

16:46

that you aren't for sure. Yeah.

16:48

And you're around a lot of

16:50

other people who kind of are

16:52

for sure. And so you're kind

16:54

of pulled in directions of what

16:57

you think might be the thing

16:59

that works. No doubt. And what

17:01

happens is then you get a

17:03

record deal, well, they're geniuses. They

17:05

know. So I want to do

17:07

what they say. You know, I

17:10

want to be, you know, I

17:12

like, I want to be a

17:14

good artist and well-liked and I'm

17:16

a people pleaser. So all of

17:18

these things, it's nothing nefarious is

17:20

happening. It's just, it starts to

17:22

slant towards the middle, you know.

17:25

And then... I'm making music that

17:27

sounds like the radio, which is

17:29

cool, but... You lost your edge

17:31

though. Yeah. The answer they got

17:33

you here, you no longer have.

17:35

100% Because you're now here and

17:37

you're trying to sound like here.

17:40

Which is very easy to do.

17:42

Yep. Because yeah. Same. Anybody that

17:44

moves the town and you're around,

17:46

quote, these geniuses. Yeah. They're just

17:48

us. And when they moved here,

17:50

they saw the geniuses. It's almost

17:53

a cycle that everybody goes through

17:55

and you have to do it

17:57

wrong in order to fully understand

17:59

that no one ever right? Yeah,

18:01

nobody knows anything. You just, you

18:03

do eventually have to get back

18:05

to a place where you go

18:08

like, what do I, what do

18:10

I want to say? You know,

18:12

and, and part of that is

18:14

just learning the lessons of taking

18:16

the hits. You know, I mean,

18:18

that's, that's a big part of

18:20

it. Yeah, to me it was

18:23

if I'm going to fail, because

18:25

I've already failed a bunch of

18:27

times here doing different things. At

18:29

least I want to fail doing

18:31

it my way because at least

18:33

that feels like I honestly failed.

18:36

Yeah. And there's something, there's a

18:38

real truth to success or failure

18:40

when it's your truth because you

18:42

know it's genuine either way where

18:44

if I, you know, there were

18:46

times my first couple years here

18:48

I was hated. I was hated

18:51

because I was way different. So

18:53

at times I would manipulate or

18:55

modify. And it wouldn't go well

18:57

and I got to the point

18:59

where it was, hmm. If it's

19:01

not going to go well, I'd

19:03

rather it not go well with

19:06

me being exactly me because then

19:08

I know it's me. It's not

19:10

whatever I'm chasing. Do you feel

19:12

like you were modifying yourself to

19:14

like fit into like some mold

19:16

that you thought it was supposed

19:19

to fit into? My situation, as

19:21

similar as it was to yours,

19:23

was different in that mine was

19:25

genuine by the word hatred. The

19:27

industry because I was so different

19:29

and the industry is a big

19:31

evil man that doesn't have a

19:34

face It's like when people complain

19:36

about the Radio and I'm not

19:38

mr. fight for radio either, but

19:40

it's like radio just won't there's

19:42

that's not a thing right so

19:44

so when I say that the

19:46

so I it was an uneducated

19:49

hatred toward me because I was

19:51

different and I challenged norms and

19:53

norms that felt comfortable then felt

19:55

threatened threatened And And after a

19:57

long time of it being difficult

19:59

for me, I thought, what can

20:02

I do to make this not

20:04

so difficult for me? So it

20:06

wasn't that I was going, I'm

20:08

going to do this to get

20:10

better because I have confidence in

20:12

that area, but it was, this

20:14

sucks. Like I'm having articles written

20:17

that aren't true about me and

20:19

like local music industry magazines. I'm

20:21

having four or five different type

20:23

of deals. And I'm like, I'm

20:25

going to lose some of my

20:27

edge. So some of that edge

20:30

is not given back to me.

20:32

Yeah, so the parallels from your

20:34

story of mine are similar, but

20:36

The same thing it still didn't

20:38

go well once I changed and

20:40

got a little softer Yeah, I

20:42

was like I'm just gonna be

20:45

me and then if I fail

20:47

at least the truth is I

20:49

failed because I failed With with

20:51

who I was totally yeah, you

20:53

you almost think it's gonna be

20:55

easier because you give in to

20:57

what you think you're supposed to

21:00

do But the, you know, the

21:02

end result is, I was just,

21:04

I was becoming very dissatisfied. I

21:06

was waking up and looking in

21:08

the mirror and being like, I'm

21:10

not, this feels out of sync.

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22:29

importance of taking care of our

22:31

physical and mental health. But what

22:33

about our sexual health? I've been

22:36

there. Feeling totally stuck when it

22:38

comes to my libido. That's why

22:40

I started taking Addie. And let

22:42

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22:44

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22:46

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22:53

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stress from low libido. What's

33:52

the one with the I think

33:54

it's called arches? I was gonna

33:57

say the one with the arches,

33:59

but arches and You drive from

34:01

Salt Lake. It's like a four-hour

34:03

drive and I was like look

34:05

I don't know like I don't

34:07

know I don't know I don't

34:10

know if I can keep doing

34:12

this like I don't know if

34:14

I have it in me to

34:16

keep going and and she told

34:18

me she was like look you're

34:20

you're too good and you're too

34:23

close to give up now you

34:25

have you have to keep going.

34:27

What's funny about you saying that

34:29

is the fact that she could

34:31

see how close you were but

34:34

you felt so far away. at

34:36

the exact same time. Yeah, and

34:38

there have been many times since

34:40

then where, you know, she's believed

34:42

in me. You need that belief.

34:44

I'm so lucky to have people

34:47

in my life like that. And

34:49

ultimately, you know, you gotta believe

34:51

in yourself. And that can be

34:53

the hardest one to find of

34:55

all. I think some of it

34:57

though is that you look like

35:00

Jesus. I get it. It's like,

35:02

people are just like, you know

35:04

what, the guy looks like Jesus.

35:06

Let's give the song a string.

35:08

Yeah, I get, I get, I

35:11

get Jesus and, and Diet Ryan

35:13

heard a lot. Wish version, heard,

35:15

yeah. Baby heard, yeah. That's funny.

35:17

I, I'm, I'm really good friends

35:19

of Ryan. I was texting on

35:21

them last night. Yeah. He just

35:24

put out a record. This is

35:26

really good. This is really good.

35:28

What are you drinking? I was

35:30

a good one too. I'm big

35:32

Ryan fan, so yeah, so I

35:34

know all of his stuff. Just

35:37

because we're friends and if I

35:39

don't, he'll quiz me and then

35:41

I'll be a loser, but I,

35:43

that's a great song. Yeah. So

35:45

I was looking through some of

35:47

the cuts. Ryan, don't, don't, don't,

35:50

don't tell me. Okay. So not

35:52

a single but how does Cody's

35:54

albums. He's a big artist. Do

35:56

well. Yeah Yeah, yeah. And it's

35:58

hard to make money if your

36:01

song is not a single, but

36:03

are you seeing anything off of

36:05

that, not being a single, but

36:07

because it's codeine, and he does

36:09

stream so well? I think I

36:11

will. It's like, for those people

36:14

that don't know, there's a long,

36:16

there's a lot of lag time

36:18

in between when a song comes

36:20

out. I think that record came

36:22

out in the fall, and so

36:24

I haven't even seen. You know,

36:27

it'll be, it'll be whatever June

36:29

quarter is before I, I see,

36:31

any other. Not, not great. Nickelback.

36:33

Nickelback, yeah, it's pretty crazy. That

36:35

was a weird one. Please. Long

36:38

story short. No, I want, I

36:40

want, long story mid at least.

36:42

Yeah, so I, I, my publisher

36:44

at the time, this guy named

36:46

Overton. He was over at Warner

36:48

Chapel and he got an email

36:51

from somebody who was working with

36:53

Nickelback and they were looking for

36:55

songs. I don't even remember what

36:57

the prompt was. What the prompt

36:59

was was not what the song

37:01

was about. So you didn't have

37:04

the song already to give them.

37:06

They gave you the prompt for

37:08

something they were looking to have

37:10

so you went on wrote it.

37:12

No. The song was written. Somebody

37:14

reached out to my publisher and

37:17

said... We're looking for songs like

37:19

this, do you have anything? Got

37:21

it. So my publisher put together

37:23

a link of like, I think

37:25

it was like six songs, and

37:28

just send it over. And this

37:30

happens all the time, and it

37:32

never works. Never. It's like an

37:34

audition. It never happens. Yeah, you

37:36

never get the audition. And projecting,

37:38

because I never get the audition.

37:41

Yeah. Yeah. And I think it

37:43

was probably six weeks later, he

37:45

gets an email or a call.

37:47

And it says, hey, this song.

37:49

This is Chad's favorite song. He

37:51

loves this song. And so Will

37:54

called me. and told me that

37:56

and I'm like, okay, okay, like

37:58

what? What does this even mean?

38:00

He's like, I have no idea.

38:02

Oh, that was it. There was

38:05

no, no other, it was just

38:07

his favorite song. It's not like,

38:09

hey, he's gonna cut it, hey,

38:11

he has cut it. Yeah, I

38:13

mean, at that point, you're like,

38:15

I think he's gonna cut it.

38:18

Yeah, but it's just, right now,

38:20

it's just he likes it. You

38:22

know, I've moved on. I had

38:24

this jet ski in my mind

38:26

that I was going to buy

38:28

with that money and you know,

38:31

that dream had died. And then

38:33

it was, yeah, it was like

38:35

after, I was on the road,

38:37

I was driving back from a

38:39

show in Houston, I think. You

38:41

know, then like a Walmart and

38:44

like a little rock or something,

38:46

and I just get a text

38:48

and it's the song. The file

38:50

they'd cut and they said the

38:52

file had cut it and he

38:55

and he and Chad came in

38:57

and like he he had like

38:59

Tweaked a couple things and yeah,

39:01

and then that was the song

39:03

and it was like I mean

39:05

it was crazy because Nickelback's Silver

39:08

Side up was the second record

39:10

I ever bought you know when

39:12

I was 12 and everybody had

39:14

it Yeah, it's a great record.

39:16

Yeah, they have great songs and

39:18

I Am a hater of Nickelback

39:21

haters You know, it's just one

39:23

of those things. You know, everybody

39:25

hated FGL for a while for

39:27

some reason. People hate stuff that's

39:29

popular, you know. I think that's

39:32

all it is. I just had,

39:34

I was just talking to, to

39:36

chief who's, was their manager and

39:38

is now their manager again. And,

39:40

and yeah, it's just, it's just

39:42

one of those things. You know,

39:45

everybody hated FGL for a while

39:47

for, for, for some reason, you

39:49

know. And, my, my personal reasons

39:51

personal reasons. But yes, I understood

39:53

that, I understood that. I understood

39:55

that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Coal play

39:58

if you get so big you

40:00

get corny, even if you're not.

40:02

My question has been, and I've asked

40:04

it a couple times to friends,

40:06

and even on this podcast, like,

40:09

I'm waiting for Morgan Wallen to

40:11

get corny. Even if nothing changes

40:14

with what he does, you reach a level

40:16

of popularity where it

40:18

doesn't matter how great, you can

40:20

be sustained greatness. But once you

40:22

hit this level of so many people

40:25

love you, then it's corny to

40:27

also be one of the one of

40:29

the people. that loves you. Yeah. And so

40:31

it's, I wonder when Morgan Wallin gets corny.

40:33

And he's not there yet, but if you,

40:35

it's just a popular, when you get so

40:38

popular, you get a bit corny, only

40:40

because you're so popular. Yeah, well it

40:42

becomes the, it almost like the potency

40:44

of what you're doing almost gets diluted

40:46

because so many people start doing

40:48

it as well. I mean, you see,

40:51

you see it happening right now

40:53

with Morgan. You know, I mean, a

40:55

lot of people are chasing that sound

40:57

and it's a great sound, so

40:59

I understand it. The Bobbycast, we'll be

41:02

right back. Does this podcast

41:04

make you happy? Of course it

41:06

does. That's why you're here. But

41:08

it only comes out once a

41:11

week for happiness every night. You

41:13

need Adam and Eve. Yes, I'm

41:15

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Adam and eve.com code I heart

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for 50% off. Company. today.

41:45

And no matter what the day holds,

41:47

we come to the Today Show for

41:49

all of it. When things are tough,

41:52

we talk about it. When there's something

41:54

to figure out, we dig into it.

41:56

And when there's joy, we celebrate it.

41:58

Because today is where all happening. We

42:01

get the best start to every

42:03

morning because we started together. Watch

42:05

the Today Show with Savannah Guthrie

42:07

and Craig Melvin weekdays at 7

42:09

a.m. on NBC. Hi, it's Jenny

42:14

importance of taking care of our

42:16

physical and mental health. But what

42:19

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42:21

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42:23

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42:25

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42:27

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Addie at Addie. This

44:02

is the Bobby cast and I could

44:05

even understand why people would go out.

44:07

Oh, that doesn't feel nice like you're

44:09

saying Morgan Wallin's corny No, I'm saying

44:11

I'm using Morgan Wallin as the standard

44:13

of when you look at massive acts

44:15

Yeah, who got so big and so

44:17

many people love them that it was

44:19

no longer cool to be one of

44:21

the people that love them because so

44:23

many people love them that you're just

44:25

part of the herd and nobody wants

44:27

to be part of the herd. Yeah,

44:29

and so it's cool to see Morgan

44:32

It's cool to see like Zach Brian.

44:34

It's cool to see Luke Combs Not

44:36

be corny yet and and be able

44:38

to do stadiums Yeah, because that's about

44:40

the time when you become so popular

44:42

people feel like I don't want to

44:44

be a fan anymore because everybody loves

44:46

them Yeah, it's kind of hard to

44:48

imagine like was Tom Petty corny at

44:50

some point? Did that happen? It's dude

44:52

first of all. I love Tom Petty

44:54

like that is like my favorite. I

44:57

was watching a tick-talk last night because

44:59

I'm on Tom Petty take talk like

45:01

I used to be it's one of

45:03

the best places to be yeah and

45:05

so oh we're gonna side really on

45:07

this one for a second so Tom

45:09

Petty to me top three grades American

45:11

rock artists of all time I say

45:13

American because you can go through the

45:15

debate I did have Ringo Star here

45:17

a few weeks ago it was awesome

45:19

wow yeah what a lot set what

45:21

your buddy is yeah rub that's legendary

45:24

rub that in there so Tom Petty

45:26

was talking about how if he went

45:28

to watch Ray Charles He

45:31

would want to hear Ray Charles do I

45:33

forget what song he said was specifically but

45:35

what I said or whatever song it was

45:37

yeah He said I know he started playing

45:39

that thing after 50 years But if He

45:41

doesn't play it. I'm disappointed. Yeah, and he

45:43

said I have three songs that I feel

45:45

that way about And so I paused it

45:47

because I'm insane on my head and so

45:49

I played a trivia game with myself were

45:51

the only person that could win or lose

45:53

was me. And so I tried to guess

45:55

the three songs that Tom Petty was about

45:57

to say that they expect him to play

45:59

at every show. And before he even said

46:01

the songs, he said, I play them at

46:03

every show. I don't mess a lot with

46:05

the melodies, but I try to put them

46:07

in places that excites me and I try

46:09

to put them as a part of things

46:11

that can still excite me because I don't

46:13

get excited about playing them because I've played

46:15

them so many times. Because I've played them

46:17

so many times. So many times. He wasn't

46:19

saying they weren't saying they weren't saying they

46:21

weren't saying they weren't saying they weren't saying

46:24

they weren't saying they weren't great. And

46:26

I can understand that on like

46:28

the radio side we do a

46:30

segment. It's called Tell Me Something

46:32

Good. We've done her 15 years.

46:35

We've done her 15 years. We've

46:37

done her four times a day.

46:39

I can never do it again

46:41

to be the happiest person ever

46:43

in my life, but it tests

46:45

so well. It researches so well.

46:47

I go places and people sing

46:49

the jingle to me. Wow. And

46:51

so I owe it. If people

46:53

say the most to me and

46:55

do they love the most? I

46:57

don't really like doing it. Yeah.

46:59

But I used to love doing

47:01

it and I understand why people

47:04

like it and repetition is going

47:06

to warm me out. So with

47:08

Tom Petty, what do you think

47:10

the three songs are? American Girl,

47:12

free-fallen, and I'm going to guess

47:14

won't back down? All three, I

47:16

would have said, probably, because he

47:18

has so many songs. Yeah. The

47:20

three that he said were, last

47:22

dance marriage, yeah. Free-fallen. And Rennigate.

47:24

Rennigate. And he said he just

47:26

had no interest in playing them

47:28

anymore. And he thought they were

47:31

great when he wrote them. But

47:33

when they would show up, he'd

47:35

be like, oh my God. So

47:37

we had to find ways to

47:39

make it interesting. To keep it

47:41

interesting to him. Yeah. There would

47:43

be times too. By the way,

47:45

this is why I enjoy you

47:47

over here because I feel like

47:49

we can just talk music, which

47:51

is nice. Yeah. Also because you're

47:53

like a Savant. you like Berkeley

47:55

and you're like super genius and

47:58

I'm not near smart as you

48:00

so I can ask you things

48:02

to get smarter like I like

48:04

being around people like that so

48:06

there are artists that I love

48:08

and have been to their shows

48:10

and a similar thing has happened

48:12

when they've played a song so

48:14

many times where they start messing

48:16

with the melodies and changing the

48:18

words a little bit. I don't

48:20

like that. I understand that. And

48:22

you can do like creep from

48:24

Radiohead when they just stop playing

48:27

it for a decade. Well yeah,

48:29

you get tired of it. For

48:31

sure. But it's to have the

48:33

awareness like Tom Petty's awareness of

48:35

I'm so tired of this. But

48:37

let me put myself as a

48:39

fan. And if I were at

48:41

a Ray Charles show, I would

48:43

want to hear that song, even

48:45

though I know he feels how

48:47

I feel, so he kept playing

48:49

it. Garth does the same thing.

48:51

Garth does all the hits. You

48:54

know he's tired of it. You

48:56

know as an artist, you being

48:58

an artist, you want to play

49:00

new, fun, creative, fulfilling, exciting things.

49:02

You want to go where that

49:04

excitement is, but you, I think

49:06

the thing that that I always

49:08

try and remember. with that's why,

49:10

for example, I've played that song

49:12

so many times, but I know,

49:14

I know that it means a

49:16

lot to people, and I know

49:18

that there are people coming to

49:21

my show because it was their

49:23

first dance at their wedding or

49:25

it was playing for, you know,

49:27

when they got engaged or whatever

49:29

that is, it's their song, so

49:31

I know that I... I'm super

49:33

grateful for the opportunity to have

49:35

created something meaningful. After I remind

49:37

myself to be grateful. Because I

49:39

think it's easy for me to

49:41

forget. And it's easy for me

49:43

to forget. And it's not like

49:45

I'm working at the mill like

49:48

my stepdad, but it's easy to

49:50

forget because we're in our own

49:52

little world where we're trying to

49:54

create 10,000 things at once and

49:56

is as good as bad. Where

49:58

all of our insecurity, security, security

50:00

is based on the feedback of

50:02

people. by consuming our, it's a

50:04

nutty world, right? Like, a screw's

50:06

gotta be off for us to

50:08

do that. this, hopefully it's the

50:10

right screw. And so the fact

50:12

that Tom Petty had the awareness

50:14

to make him a fan, to

50:17

keep him from being good to

50:19

his fans, was so freaking cool

50:21

to me because he is, he's

50:23

at the top of the mountain.

50:25

Yeah, same man. I mean, he's,

50:27

he's the guy, you know, and

50:29

like, reading conversations with Tom Petty,

50:31

I don't know if you've ever

50:33

picked that up, but it's. It's

50:35

just a collection of things he

50:37

said in interviews, you know, and

50:39

it's, it's, it's, it's, it's inspiring

50:41

to read, you know, I mean,

50:44

he's just a guy like everybody

50:46

else, but he, he was tapped

50:48

into something. I'd be hypocritical, which

50:50

I often am. When Bob Dylan

50:52

went acoustic to electric. Yeah, it's

50:54

exact opposite, right? Well, I was,

50:56

I was gonna bring that up,

50:58

you know, you think about like,

51:00

uh, somebody like, like a, like

51:02

a, like a Bob Dylan or

51:04

in Neil Young that. just, they're

51:06

playing shows and they don't care.

51:08

And they're, they're changing their songs

51:11

completely. They're kind of, I think

51:13

a lot of creativity is just

51:15

sort of chasing, chasing this undefinable,

51:17

inattainable thing and maybe that's what

51:19

they've got to do to keep

51:21

doing it and, uh, and that's,

51:23

that's what they've chosen to do.

51:25

Yes, I, it's a courage and

51:27

a confidence. Yeah. Because I saw

51:29

RAM once, they never played a

51:31

hit. It was the worst experience

51:33

in my life. And I love

51:35

RAM. Yeah. They played an entire

51:37

new record. I hated that show.

51:40

I respect that show. Yeah. Because

51:42

they knew everybody was gonna hate

51:44

it. That's tough. They had to

51:46

do it, I guess. But if

51:48

Michael Stuy got famous, because again,

51:50

he has a couple of screws

51:52

loose. They're the right screws. Mm-hmm.

51:54

Mm-hmm. You know. Very

51:57

late 70s 80s, 80s, you know,

51:59

early 90s. were massive. For a

52:01

reason, they were different. I was

52:04

pissed. I was like, this sucks.

52:06

And it still pisses me off

52:08

that I saw a band that

52:10

I love not play a single

52:12

song that I know, but that

52:15

doesn't mean I also can't respect

52:17

the courage and the confidence that

52:19

it took to do that. Yeah.

52:21

Well, there, it's a fine line

52:23

to walk, but you know, sometimes

52:26

I just think of... of like

52:28

Bob Dylan and I'm like, that

52:30

is a very free man. He's

52:32

walking through life playing only by

52:35

the rules that he wants to

52:37

play at and it's very tempting

52:39

to want to do that. That's

52:41

somebody who knows who they are

52:43

and I'm jealous of that. Yeah,

52:46

it's a very, you have to

52:48

have a very strong sense of

52:50

self to be able to operate

52:52

that way. And you gotta be

52:54

wildly irrational. Which is all this

52:57

business. Well, I mean, that is

52:59

the absurdity of life. You have

53:01

to be so irrational. Think about

53:03

just even you. Thinking that you're

53:05

good enough to be able to

53:08

record something and people will spend

53:10

three minutes of their day, which

53:12

they have limited time, listening, or

53:14

spending a few bucks to come

53:16

watch a show that you're going

53:19

to play at, or like me

53:21

thinking, I'm going to go to

53:23

a theater and people are going

53:25

to buy a ticket. or spend

53:27

15 minutes or an hour. That

53:30

is such an irrational. Yeah, and

53:32

a balance of, I'm wildly insecure,

53:34

yet I still think everybody needs

53:36

to listen to everything that I

53:38

do. Yeah, but I think what

53:41

you're just, what you're talking about

53:43

is, are you familiar with this,

53:45

this idea of like the absurd?

53:47

Yes. So like, you know, like

53:49

Albert Kimu is like the universe.

53:52

doesn't care about you. And the

53:54

way that we create value as

53:56

a human being is to like

53:58

do it anyway. You know, and

54:01

I think exactly what you're describing,

54:03

you're gonna show up to a

54:05

theater and like, you know, hope

54:07

that people show up, which is,

54:09

it's absurd. It's absurd that people

54:12

would spend, yes, it's absurd to

54:14

think that I think I'm good

54:16

enough for people to dedicate their

54:18

time and money to come to

54:20

do it. But don't you feel

54:23

like doing it? Do you feel

54:25

like that gives your life meaning?

54:27

Yes, at the same time. It's

54:29

the dichotomy of all dichotomies. Yeah.

54:31

I am a wildly insecure person

54:34

at the same time I can

54:36

still have a massive ego. That

54:38

I think I manage healthily 88%

54:40

of the time. So yeah, it's

54:42

an odd business, especially when you

54:45

start to diversify and do different

54:47

things like you've done from being

54:49

an artist, being a songwriter, doing

54:51

the podcast. I did see... I

54:53

mean, I didn't love it, but

54:56

you know, I got followed by

54:58

Two Better Podcast, which was, you

55:00

had Kippon, you had Craig Wiseman,

55:02

and I was like, God dang,

55:04

people forgot about me so quick

55:07

on the Old Ten Year Town

55:09

Podcast. That's all right, you know,

55:11

I was the opening act, you

55:13

know, I was the baby, I

55:15

was the baby act on the

55:18

old podcast. I, I, I, I,

55:20

I, uh, I really enjoyed our

55:22

conversation, once a week. for happiness

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of taking care of our physical

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1:00:00

I respected that process with him

1:00:02

because he asked for it, expected

1:00:04

it, and Delivered his fairness to

1:00:06

it. And I love Kip because

1:00:08

of that. Kip and I are

1:00:10

not alike in a lot of

1:00:12

ways. Our birthday is one day

1:00:14

apart. It's pretty cool. But I

1:00:16

love Kip, but if you were

1:00:18

like, hey dude, can you come

1:00:20

pick me up six hours away?

1:00:22

I will get in the car

1:00:24

and go get him. Yeah. What

1:00:27

are we going to hang out?

1:00:29

Probably not, because he like does

1:00:31

muscle stuff. He like climbs stuff

1:00:33

and does man stuff. Craig Wiseman.

1:00:35

And you should go listen to

1:00:37

the episodes that you did with

1:00:39

Craig. Like the guy has done,

1:00:41

seen, and worn at all. He's

1:00:43

done a lot of different stuff.

1:00:45

Yeah. And he still, I think

1:00:47

the most inspiring part of it

1:00:49

to me is with Craig, you

1:00:51

know, it still comes from this

1:00:53

desire to be close to that.

1:00:56

to that thing, you know, to

1:00:58

where, to like, we just want

1:01:00

to get as close as we

1:01:02

can to like where the magic

1:01:04

is happening. Can you get to

1:01:06

the magic though? Because I don't

1:01:09

feel like you actually can. I

1:01:11

feel like I can't, I'll never

1:01:13

get to this place that I

1:01:15

am pursuing. That doesn't mean I've

1:01:17

stopped or tried any less. I

1:01:20

just don't know if that place

1:01:22

exists. But that doesn't mean it's

1:01:24

not true. Can you get to,

1:01:26

is there a magic place that

1:01:28

you can get to and be

1:01:30

fully fulfilled? For me, I can

1:01:33

only speak for my own self.

1:01:35

I think you have to fall

1:01:37

in love with what the process

1:01:39

is and not what the result

1:01:41

is. And so there's a moment

1:01:44

that there's a place that you

1:01:46

can go to when you were

1:01:48

writing a song where you are,

1:01:50

Craig talked about it a little

1:01:52

bit on Tenure Town, but where

1:01:54

it's called like a thin place.

1:01:57

where you are in the presence

1:01:59

of something. of

1:02:02

like, you know, the creator or

1:02:04

the universe, whatever you want to

1:02:06

call it, and, and, um, I

1:02:08

have, I have been there a

1:02:11

few times. Do you know you're

1:02:13

there when you're there? A little

1:02:15

bit, but, but, but you, it's

1:02:18

kind of like, uh, you don't

1:02:20

want to think about it too

1:02:22

much. It's, it's, it's very surreal

1:02:24

and it's, it's, it's, it's, it's

1:02:27

a very, very, very hard place,

1:02:29

to get to it doesn't happen

1:02:31

very often but I mean I

1:02:34

think like I'm not a good

1:02:36

golfer but I'll play a few

1:02:38

times a year and every now

1:02:40

and then you just you just

1:02:43

hit one you're like oh my

1:02:45

gosh I could go pro and

1:02:47

it's song writings it's it's similar

1:02:50

it's just some days you you

1:02:52

know you're in the presence of

1:02:54

something really powerful and that is

1:02:56

that is like worthy of For

1:02:59

me, it's worthy of like dedicating

1:03:01

my life to chase. My analogy

1:03:03

would be playing craps. You ever

1:03:06

play craps at all? I love

1:03:08

playing craps. If I'm writing for

1:03:10

whatever, book, jokes, yeah. If I'm

1:03:12

just live on the air, feeling

1:03:15

it, killing it, if I'm at

1:03:17

a table and I'm just throwing,

1:03:19

and I'm just throwing, and I'm

1:03:22

hitting points, I'm not crapping out.

1:03:24

I'm not in my head, I'm

1:03:26

not going, well I wonder when

1:03:29

I'm going to crap out. I

1:03:31

wonder how long this is going

1:03:33

to go. I'm just in it,

1:03:35

not thinking about it too much,

1:03:38

because I think if I think

1:03:40

about it, it's going to end.

1:03:42

But then when it's over, I'm

1:03:45

like, holy crap, like I was,

1:03:47

we went 40 minutes. I didn't

1:03:49

crap out for 40 minutes. When

1:03:51

I get in those spaces, it

1:03:54

feels like I had a great

1:03:56

run at the craft table. Right,

1:03:58

right. You're in the, I think

1:04:01

what happens is you're very, very

1:04:03

present. And so when you're in

1:04:05

that creative place or at the

1:04:07

craps table, you're so in the

1:04:10

moment, there's a, there's, it's almost

1:04:12

like a, like a, a bubble,

1:04:14

right? You just don't, something's gonna,

1:04:17

you know, someone's gonna come along

1:04:19

and pop the bubble. You're just

1:04:21

trying not to think about it.

1:04:23

The bubbles never live forever. No.

1:04:26

But the bubble's pretty awesome to

1:04:28

be in and it's rare to

1:04:30

get in it. So when you

1:04:33

get in it, you really want

1:04:35

to try to experience it without

1:04:37

me having a complete inner monologue

1:04:39

of why I'm experiencing what I'm

1:04:42

experiencing. When's this experience going to

1:04:44

end? Is there ever going to

1:04:46

happen again? I run from that.

1:04:49

And just try to live in

1:04:51

it. But dude, it's so cool

1:04:53

to just see what you're doing.

1:04:55

Again, I said that to you.

1:04:58

During the podcast, but then even

1:05:00

after like I enjoy talking with

1:05:02

you afterward too because I was

1:05:05

just like hey, whatever you need

1:05:07

like I see what you're doing

1:05:09

the and keep doing it and

1:05:11

it sucks But so does everything

1:05:14

else. That's awesome. Like everything's awesome

1:05:16

sucks because it's supposed to suck

1:05:18

Or everybody would be doing it

1:05:21

Yeah, it's hard But it's rewarding.

1:05:23

Yeah, both. And two things can

1:05:25

be true. Yeah, it can suck

1:05:27

and be awesome at the same

1:05:30

time. Yeah. And sometimes not the

1:05:32

exact same time, but sometimes things

1:05:34

can suck until they get awesome

1:05:37

until they suck again until they

1:05:39

get awesome again. Yeah. And podcast

1:05:41

is great. What have you learned

1:05:43

from the podcast? Hmm. I think

1:05:46

I've learned a lot about how

1:05:48

much everyone's journey. is when I

1:05:50

think about all the twists and

1:05:53

turns in mind I feel like

1:05:55

an alien a little bit, you

1:05:57

know, I think I've always felt

1:05:59

that way my whole life like

1:06:02

I'm a little bit of an

1:06:04

alien on the outside looking in

1:06:06

and so getting to hear other

1:06:09

people's stories, you start to understand,

1:06:11

like, that's kind of part of

1:06:13

it, as part of life. I've

1:06:15

learned a lot from that, and

1:06:18

I've gained a lot of inspiration

1:06:20

from hearing other people's stories. Other

1:06:22

people's stories have made me not

1:06:25

feel as alone in my group

1:06:27

of aliens. Yeah, there are other

1:06:29

aliens like me use the I'll

1:06:31

use alien to I didn't think

1:06:34

there were I didn't think there

1:06:36

were and no other aliens exactly

1:06:38

like me But there are other

1:06:41

aliens like me that go through

1:06:43

the same struggles mental struggles Imposter

1:06:45

syndrome struggles, totally success syndrome struggles,

1:06:47

totally success struggles comparison struggles all

1:06:50

of that's happening to all of

1:06:52

us. Yeah, but since we're not

1:06:54

talking about we're not seeing it.

1:06:57

We're not seeing it. We're not

1:06:59

seeing it's theirs. Yeah, there's a

1:07:01

There's a disconnect I think that

1:07:03

happens on sometimes can happen on

1:07:06

social media where it does all

1:07:08

look good, you know, and I

1:07:10

think I think there's a real

1:07:13

opportunity right now just like we're

1:07:15

having right now for for honest

1:07:17

conversations and and authenticity and and

1:07:19

I'm you know, I'm obviously like

1:07:22

trying to figure it out, figure

1:07:24

it out as I go, and

1:07:26

just trying to figure out how

1:07:29

all of this stuff goes together,

1:07:31

you know. And the beauty is

1:07:33

you will never figure it out?

1:07:35

Yeah, it doesn't go together. I

1:07:38

mean, that's it. It doesn't go

1:07:40

together. And we'll never figure it

1:07:42

out. But that's what's awesome. Before

1:07:45

you came in, we talked about

1:07:47

the podcast. And what do you

1:07:49

want to say about the podcast?

1:07:52

What do you want to say?

1:07:55

I think I'm just, I have,

1:07:57

we went into it. a little

1:07:59

bit about that's why and you

1:08:01

know, doing all of that music

1:08:03

independently allowed me a lot of

1:08:05

latitude to with income and resources

1:08:08

to like create some stuff that

1:08:10

I always dreamed about making the

1:08:12

podcast is one of those that

1:08:14

that is an offshoot of my

1:08:16

successes as a recording artist and

1:08:18

I wanted to make the record.

1:08:20

that I've always wanted to make

1:08:23

without any kind of, you know,

1:08:25

stipulations on what it needed to

1:08:27

sound like or it needed to

1:08:29

have this hit or that hit

1:08:31

or whatever. I just wanted to

1:08:33

make something that I could work

1:08:35

hard on and be very proud

1:08:38

of and be excited to like

1:08:40

put out into the world that

1:08:42

I felt feel like is reflective

1:08:44

of of who I am who

1:08:46

I am. Make any money on

1:08:48

the podcast? Getting there. I had

1:08:50

a lot, I had a, um,

1:08:53

you really inspired me actually. I

1:08:55

actually actually asked that question on

1:08:57

your podcast too. And I said,

1:08:59

and I said, and I think

1:09:01

I said no, which was true.

1:09:03

But I mean, it's impossible. But

1:09:05

yes, that's why I asked. I

1:09:08

really wanted to know. Well, you

1:09:10

told me, I don't know if

1:09:12

you remember this, uh, we were

1:09:14

talking afterwards and you said, uh,

1:09:16

you were telling me about cold

1:09:18

email email emailing people. And I'm

1:09:21

like, okay, well, he's doing it,

1:09:23

why can't I? Like, I mean,

1:09:25

I feel awkward, but I'm just

1:09:27

gonna do it. And I, yeah,

1:09:29

I did. I literally just copied

1:09:31

you. I went on LinkedIn, and

1:09:33

I found some people that I

1:09:36

thought might be a good fit,

1:09:38

and I did some combinations to

1:09:40

figure out this company's email format

1:09:42

of this person's name so that

1:09:44

I could get into their inbox.

1:09:46

and uh... worked. It's crazy. It's

1:09:48

actually not crazy, but it's crazy.

1:09:51

It's crazy because it's so simple.

1:09:53

Yeah. And, but it was awkward.

1:09:55

It's, but so was recording that

1:09:57

song. So was recording your song

1:09:59

after your single had been said

1:10:01

no. It was awkward to put

1:10:03

the phone up and sing a

1:10:06

song into a freaking camera. Yeah.

1:10:08

And then it goes viral. I

1:10:10

watched, you know, watch your stuff.

1:10:12

Yeah. Thank you. It's pretty cool.

1:10:14

I don't even know he is

1:10:16

as the artist. It's what's crazy.

1:10:18

It's weird. Sometimes people will be

1:10:21

like, I don't really, they don't

1:10:23

listen to the radio show, they'll

1:10:25

have watched Idol for years or

1:10:27

whatever it was, they'll know me

1:10:29

for these weird things. And I'm

1:10:31

like, oh, I don't really think

1:10:34

that that's funny. Is that disorienting?

1:10:36

There's just no orientation to it

1:10:38

at all. Unless they try to

1:10:40

stab you. Otherwise, it's great and

1:10:42

I'm famous, so fractured. Nobody's famous,

1:10:44

yet everybody's famous. And yeah, boy.

1:10:46

And like you said, there's a

1:10:49

chance for if you just do

1:10:51

it enough, there are no gatekeepers,

1:10:53

actual human formed gatekeepers. There's an

1:10:55

algorithm we can't figure out, but

1:10:57

it's a different gatekeeper, but it's

1:10:59

a different gatekeeper, but it's not

1:11:01

one that. is going to get

1:11:04

canceled for doing inappropriate things in

1:11:06

an office, you know? Yeah, yeah,

1:11:08

yeah, it's just a, it's, it's

1:11:10

some kind of pulled out, on,

1:11:12

on, beyond understanding algorithm. Everybody has

1:11:14

a chance though. Yeah. And everybody

1:11:16

didn't always have a chance. Right.

1:11:19

Everybody has a chance now. Yeah,

1:11:21

it's, it's an exciting time. Well,

1:11:23

I'm a big fan. We put

1:11:25

all your information down in the

1:11:27

notes as well. And check out

1:11:29

the podcast. And. I'm gonna go

1:11:31

and... What nickelback song was that?

1:11:34

I wanna... Horizon. Okay, check it

1:11:36

out. That's my favorite knuckleback song

1:11:38

ever. I know I don't know

1:11:40

what it is, but I'm gonna

1:11:42

let's do that. That's pretty cool.

1:11:44

I believe you when you said

1:11:47

it. You got a skill. There's

1:11:49

no way you believe that. But

1:11:51

that's pretty cool to hear like

1:11:53

somebody like a familiar voice singing

1:11:55

something that you created in your

1:11:57

brain. Regardless, that's cool. Yeah, like

1:11:59

the feeling of when I just

1:12:02

pressed play the first time in

1:12:04

the and the guitars are playing.

1:12:06

Yeah, that's cool. Yeah, it's crazy.

1:12:08

You know, it doesn't make sense,

1:12:10

but it did happen. Check out

1:12:12

Tenure Town Podcast and everything else

1:12:14

is down in the notes. Good

1:12:17

to see you, Troy, and let's

1:12:19

do this again soon. All right,

1:12:21

thank you for having me. Thanks

1:12:23

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