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at LifeLock.com/podcast. Terms apply. Hey, what's

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up everyone? Welcome to this episode

0:32

of the Colin and Samier show.

0:35

Today we're talking about YouTubeers vying

0:37

for Emmys. How did YouTube become

0:39

television? Is that a good thing?

0:42

And does it even matter if

0:44

a creator wins an Emmy? We

0:46

just got back from South by

0:49

Southwest. We'll recap a bit of

0:51

that experience and we'll also touch

0:53

on the Side Men charity match.

0:55

If you make it to the deep

0:57

end, let us know. It feels like every

0:59

conference is now a creator conference.

1:01

Everything I was at Sundance and

1:03

it was full on a creator

1:05

conference can last year, all about

1:08

creators, South Buy. Maybe we're just hanging

1:10

out on the creator side of these

1:12

conferences, but it really feels like

1:14

it's creators and companies that have

1:16

an interest in creators. Yeah, I

1:18

don't think we're just hanging out

1:20

on the creator side. I think creators

1:22

represent a big part of

1:25

just general digital economy, and

1:27

I think that is... Just the way

1:29

these conferences are moving that

1:31

they're going to follow the

1:33

dollars and creators not only

1:35

represent like modern entertainment They also

1:37

represent commerce and startups and

1:40

venture funding and like they

1:42

represent a lot of things

1:44

There was a year that I remember

1:46

South by Southwest was like NFTs

1:48

it was all yeah, it was

1:50

like Everything was NFTs everything was

1:52

crypto and and we spoke that year

1:55

and I remember our room was

1:57

probably 20% full at Max.

2:00

year, we do a panel at the

2:02

South By Convention. And they have like

2:04

a YouTube floor. That's all creator focused.

2:06

And we walk by this room to

2:08

go to the green room. And the

2:10

line is out of this world. And I go

2:12

into the green room. And I go into

2:14

the green room. And I go into the

2:17

green room. And I go, what room

2:19

are we speaking in? And the moderator

2:21

goes 6A. And I just saw the line for

2:23

6A. And then I saw a tweet that

2:25

said the line for Colin for

2:27

Colin and 1S' and 1. And

2:29

there's still a line outside flex.

2:31

And yeah, but I think that's

2:33

like super representative of what this year

2:35

was. It was a creator focused year.

2:37

And years in the past, it has

2:39

not been as creator focused. And people

2:41

were there with real questions about

2:43

what's like both from the brand side,

2:46

you know, talking about like how to work

2:48

with creators from the creator side,

2:50

talking about how to work with

2:52

brands. We were on the panel

2:54

with Nick Paul, the president of

2:56

Spotter. and workshoping people's like real-life

2:59

creator-brand relationships. And

3:01

everyone in the room, it was

3:03

applicable to them. So I'm just

3:05

saying, like, it was a packed

3:07

room of people who are transacting

3:09

in the creator space. That feels

3:11

tangibly different to me. Yeah, no, it was

3:14

very cool to walk past a massive line

3:16

and assume that that line was about

3:18

to funnel into the room, but then

3:20

get inside the room and realize, oh,

3:22

the room's already full. And then at

3:24

the beginning of the talk, we did

3:26

ask everyone, are you a creator? Is it on

3:28

YouTube? Is it on Instagram? Are you a

3:30

brand? Are you a marketer? And it was

3:33

pretty split down the middle with brands

3:35

and creators. And I think that's why,

3:37

like you're saying, the creator economy feels

3:39

like it's taking over these conferences,

3:41

because you have creators there, you

3:43

have brands, and then you have

3:46

these entrepreneurs or startups that are kind

3:48

of in the middle. They're like, yes,

3:50

we are creating content that. you know,

3:52

some of the the activations that we

3:54

did. YouTube was very present this year.

3:56

They had a creator collective event that

3:59

we went to. that kind of

4:01

like the who's who of

4:03

creators were there, a ton

4:05

of prominent YouTube creators, Ret

4:07

and Link, Sean Evans, Michelle

4:09

Carrey, Ryan Trahan, Marques Brownly,

4:11

Cassie Ho, and a lot

4:13

of them were there because

4:15

there was a variety event

4:17

that was heavily surrounding

4:20

YouTube's campaign to get

4:22

creators emmys. This has been

4:24

something that Neil Mohan has been

4:26

very forward about. It's something that

4:28

we've seen a lot over the

4:31

past year. And I think this is

4:33

something we should really dig into

4:35

this concept of YouTubeers winning Emmys.

4:37

We spent a lot of time

4:39

talking to Sean Evans about this.

4:41

We've spent a lot of time talking to

4:43

Red Link about this. And you know,

4:45

the most firm question that I want to

4:48

ask is, does it matter? It's

4:50

interesting because if you look at

4:52

the Emmy's, the Emmy celebrates the best

4:54

in television. Right and now we

4:56

are at a point where YouTube is

4:58

primarily watched on TV for a

5:01

lot of creators Especially the ones

5:03

that YouTube seems to be putting

5:05

front and center like rent and

5:07

link like Sean Evans Their

5:09

content is being watched on TV

5:11

Now does it matter? If we get awards

5:14

for that now we're on the same platform

5:16

and why would it matter? So different

5:18

creators have chimed in on this

5:21

we actually asked Jimmy when he

5:23

was on the show last And he said

5:25

he wants to win an Emmy so that

5:27

his team feels like they are

5:29

rewarded for the work that they're

5:31

putting in for the caliber of their

5:33

work. If you listen to Rent and

5:36

Link, they say, oh, well, having an

5:38

Emmy attached to our show will help

5:40

with advertising dollars. So to

5:42

a degree, I think that's true. But

5:44

I don't know. Sometimes I feel like, do

5:46

we really need that validation? So I

5:48

want to take a couple steps

5:50

back because... I want to explore

5:53

Netflix as a case study.

5:55

So Netflix at the most

5:57

recent MEES won 100, had

5:59

107 nominees. across 35 titles and

6:01

won 24 awards. And the reason

6:03

I want to bring that up

6:05

is because in 2013, Netflix won

6:08

its first Emmy ever for House

6:10

of Cards. Remember House of

6:12

Cards was this really big

6:14

deal. And as I was

6:16

researching this concept, I started

6:18

thinking about and recognizing like

6:21

before House of Cards, Netflix

6:23

was an aggregator of other

6:25

people's content. Right? It was

6:27

just distributing other people's content. House

6:29

of Cards was their first big

6:31

original swing. And Ted Sarando said

6:34

to the New York Times in

6:36

2013 that winning the Emmy solidifies

6:38

that television is television no matter

6:40

what pipe brings it to the

6:42

screen. I think that is the effort of

6:45

YouTube right now. Right? Like... Yeah. To be

6:47

that next sort of Netflix in this

6:49

evolution. Right. And when Neil spoke about

6:51

it, he said something along the lines

6:54

of... The Emmys should embrace creators

6:56

so they don't risk falling behind.

6:58

So the Emmys does a risk. Yeah, so

7:00

they don't risk falling behind the current

7:02

sort of landscape and times that we're

7:05

in right now. The difference here is

7:07

that Netflix produced House of Cards. They

7:09

made it. They funded it. They had

7:11

a perspective on it. They made it.

7:13

And it looked like TV, right? It

7:16

could be watched and consumed, like TV,

7:18

on TV. You know, House of Cards had

7:20

a lot of the conversation that we

7:22

had with Sean Evans, which he used

7:25

a term that I just absolutely

7:27

loved. He said cultural penetration.

7:29

What shows have cultural

7:31

penetration? And House of Cards, at

7:33

that time, had a ton of cultural

7:36

penetration. And if you think

7:38

about right now, like what shows are having

7:40

major cultural penetration? I would

7:43

say severance right now, right?

7:45

Maybe White Lotus, you know. But like

7:47

it's interesting to try and

7:49

dictate or define what that

7:52

means. And you know, I guess

7:54

the question is, do you need a

7:56

like external group to say,

7:58

yes, you are, you matter. You matter

8:00

in culture. You know, because it's

8:02

hard to argue that like Sean

8:04

Evans and Hot Ones doesn't matter

8:07

in culture. I think it absolutely does.

8:09

But then, I think in the sea

8:11

of content that we're in, where, you

8:13

know, to Sarandos' point, television

8:15

is television, no matter what

8:17

pipe brings it forward. But now

8:20

with the amount of shows, like, what

8:22

does, is Hot Ones in the conversation

8:24

with the late night shows? What is

8:27

it in the conversation with?

8:29

What's its category? What's its

8:31

nomination status? Some of that

8:33

is up for debate. But

8:35

yeah, I guess to the question

8:37

of does it matter, I

8:40

think it primarily matters actually

8:42

functionally in the context of

8:45

advertising dollars. Like functionally

8:47

why this matters to YouTube

8:49

is big brands are still spending

8:51

a ton of money on

8:53

television. Yeah. I think

8:56

in order for creators to win

8:58

Emmy's, they're going to have to do

9:00

what Hot Ones and Good Mythical

9:02

Morning do, which is segment into

9:04

seasons. You may not think they actually

9:06

produce seasons. It can feel like

9:08

there's always a Hot One's coming

9:11

out, but they do announce seasons,

9:13

right? And I think if a Michelle Carré

9:15

with challenge accepted or a yes theory

9:17

or a different creator wants to

9:19

be considered for an Emmy, they're

9:22

probably going to have to have

9:24

to. Look and feel a little bit

9:26

like TV so that the amies

9:28

understands it the same way they

9:30

started to understand Netflix Right

9:32

to formulate ourselves into these seasons

9:34

and look more like TV. Yeah

9:36

I mean you think about made

9:38

on YouTube last year like what

9:40

one of the announcements was the

9:42

update to the UI of the

9:44

connected TV app to look more

9:46

like segmented in seasons and episodes

9:48

So I agree with you that

9:50

that is like a huge You know it's a

9:52

huge task to use

9:55

the same verbiage as television.

9:57

You know, to go, this is

9:59

season one. of Challenge Accepted. It

10:01

has six episodes in it. It's

10:03

a repeat format. In season two,

10:05

Michelle does these things. And part

10:07

of that also is like, in

10:09

television, the context of advertising typically

10:11

happens through the up fronts, which

10:13

is like, essentially this, hey, let's

10:16

bring all of our shows forward,

10:18

CBS will bring their shows forward

10:20

and go, this fall, we have

10:22

family guy or whatever. I don't

10:24

know what CBS. CSI. Yeah, whatever.

10:26

These are the number one shows,

10:28

here's how they did. And YouTube

10:30

does that, but YouTube does it

10:32

more in the context of like

10:34

the platform and like how big

10:37

the platform is. And they actually,

10:39

they don't know necessarily what's coming

10:41

up next. Yeah, right? They can

10:43

just tell you what's come out

10:45

in the past and the impact

10:47

that it's had, the viewership, the

10:49

watchtime. But they don't know what's

10:51

coming out, which I think that

10:53

is now part of all a

10:55

part of this shift of going

10:58

competing with television with television is

11:00

storytelling around this. And there was

11:02

an article today in the Hollywood.

11:04

hosting an event alongside Spotter where

11:06

we're gonna bring Mr. Beast, dude

11:08

perfect, a bunch of creators, Jordan

11:10

Matter, a bunch of creators on

11:12

stage to talk to advertisers about

11:14

what's coming in the future. Because

11:16

a lot of these media companies

11:19

now know what's coming in the

11:21

future. You know, like Sean Evans

11:23

probably knows what the next season

11:25

of Hot Once looks and feels

11:27

like when it's coming out, how

11:29

many episodes it's gonna be. So

11:31

he can pre-sell from an advertising

11:33

perspective in the same way that

11:35

television networks do. Some of it

11:37

has to do with like verbiage,

11:39

and I think the Emmy is

11:42

verbiage that supports that this is

11:44

television. Without the Emmy, it's hard

11:46

to argue to the broader ecosystem.

11:48

Like it's an easy moment of

11:50

social proof to go, no, no,

11:52

no, this is television. Look, it

11:54

wanted Emmy. Yeah, the question that

11:56

we keep going back to is,

11:58

is it good for YouTube to

12:00

be seen as television? We always

12:03

used to tell... Brands and creators

12:05

that we worked with don't make

12:07

TV for the internet. Yeah, you're

12:09

right You're right. We said that

12:11

we've said that a lot and

12:13

there was a comment we got

12:15

on one of our videos about

12:17

this on our channel from Alexa

12:19

Digital Radio, and I'll read it.

12:21

It says, I'm quickly coming to

12:24

the conclusion that YouTube is going

12:26

to end up being the same

12:28

as commercial TV is today, which

12:30

isn't good. It's moving towards areas

12:32

that lack creativity and are more

12:34

about monetization and making your channel

12:36

a business. That isn't what I

12:38

want from a creative platform, which

12:40

I don't think YouTube is anymore.

12:42

is what they're talking about, right?

12:45

Because like on a day-to-day basis,

12:47

still anyone can upload anything to

12:49

YouTube within community guidelines, but like

12:51

anyone can upload anything. You still

12:53

have Gox, right? Like you still

12:55

have incredibly artistic creators uploading. They're

12:57

just not necessarily, and Gox is

12:59

a bad example because he's heavily

13:01

part of the narrative of YouTube,

13:03

but they're not necessarily part of

13:05

the forward-facing pitch to advertisers. And

13:08

the thing that we always talk

13:10

about when it comes to platforms

13:12

is model citizens. And so we

13:14

look at who the platform is

13:16

pushing forward, the platform is pushing

13:18

forward, the TV-like creators, because that

13:20

is the best thing for the

13:22

business right now, the business of

13:24

YouTube. It doesn't mean the other

13:26

stuff doesn't exist. But that is

13:29

what's being incentivized. Yeah, pitching creators

13:31

who are trusted and consistent and

13:33

do know what's coming out and

13:35

do have massive scale. Advertisers want

13:37

that. Yeah. Right. But I agree

13:39

with you, there is still a

13:41

massive part of YouTube that is

13:43

just unique and strange. Yeah. And

13:45

where creators are making things sort

13:47

of just as they get the

13:50

idea. And I think even with

13:52

these creators that are being pitched

13:54

for Emmy's, the Sean Evans and

13:56

the Renton Links and, you know,

13:58

Michelle Carres, they still have a

14:00

very different DNA than television. Yeah.

14:02

Because they've been listening to their

14:04

comments. Right. Yeah. And to their

14:06

data from YouTube in a very

14:08

different way, and they've been so

14:11

connected to the process. And some

14:13

of that is why they actually...

14:15

can't operate in the same like

14:17

upfront schedule or like pitch schedule

14:19

of here's what next season's gonna

14:21

look like because I I can

14:23

generally tell you but if I

14:25

make an episode and then things

14:27

change with my audience or the

14:29

platform or I get feedback the

14:31

next episode's gonna be based on

14:34

that not necessarily like batching big

14:36

production and releasing six episodes at

14:38

a time and so there's a

14:40

little bit of like this I

14:42

can tell you some parts of

14:44

what it is but I can't

14:46

tell you everything that it is

14:48

because it's going to you know

14:50

morph. I also think the big

14:52

question about, you know, creators, I

14:55

think it's really interesting, is like,

14:57

do creators care? And there's this

14:59

great quote about from Mark Applier,

15:01

you know, back when he's been

15:03

nominated for an Emmy, and in

15:05

space with Mark Applier, which I

15:07

think was a YouTube original, but

15:09

that was, you know, talked about,

15:11

he was nominated for Emmy, and

15:13

he was not covered at all

15:16

by the media. when he was

15:18

nominated. And he gave a quote.

15:20

He said, it's fine that they

15:22

don't recognize me, but what amazes

15:24

me is that if any of

15:26

them were to interview me and

15:28

put those videos on YouTube, it

15:30

would do exceptionally well for their

15:32

channels. I just thought that was

15:34

like really interesting about how even

15:37

for the business of the other

15:39

media platforms, the business for the

15:41

MEs, it is a net positive

15:43

for them to cover creators. But

15:45

do the MEs need... Do the

15:47

Emmys actually need creators more than

15:49

creators need Emmys? Probably. But YouTube

15:51

needs a creator to win an

15:53

Emmy. I just wonder if YouTube

15:55

long term will get the credit

15:57

for the Emmy. It's a good

16:00

question. Because I feel like the

16:02

more that creators start investing back

16:04

in their shows, making seasons, making

16:06

things episodic, you know, repeatable formats,

16:08

25 minutes, 25 minutes. those shows

16:10

can also potentially go off YouTube.

16:12

Sure. So amazing digital circus, massive

16:14

anim- made a channel. We spoke

16:16

to Kevin who runs it. He's

16:18

doing a really interesting deal where

16:21

he's actually releasing on YouTube and

16:23

Netflix at essentially the same exact

16:25

time. So Netflix has already broken

16:27

through and is winning Emmys. I

16:29

feel like there's just going to

16:31

be this shift and this barrier

16:33

of, hey, if you're a creator

16:35

who's making episodic shows on YouTube

16:37

of a certain quality, come over

16:39

and release those on Netflix or

16:42

on Hulu. You'll find different audience.

16:44

You're going to find your algorithmic

16:46

audience. You're going to find your

16:48

community on YouTube. But hey, you

16:50

may find a totally new audience

16:52

here on Netflix. Part of this

16:54

also has to do with like,

16:56

I don't know if people are

16:58

aware of how much money it

17:00

costs to campaign to win an

17:03

award. And this year at the

17:05

Oscars, there's a really interesting stat

17:07

about Anora. Anora won best picture,

17:09

won best director, best writer, won

17:11

best writer. It won a ton

17:13

of awards. Neon, the studio that

17:15

financed it, spent $18 million on

17:17

the marketing for the Oscar's campaign.

17:19

Yeah, three times the cost of

17:21

the film. So you take a

17:23

step back and you go, this

17:26

is kind of like political campaigns,

17:28

where you have to raise a

17:30

ton of money or have a

17:32

ton of money to even go

17:34

out and campaign. It's, it's, there's

17:36

part of this that's like merit-based.

17:38

But there's another part of this

17:40

that's like, Who has the best

17:42

campaign? Right? Like you're campaigning to

17:44

voters. I remember meeting someone from

17:47

the Netflix awards team in London.

17:49

And I said, how many people

17:51

work for the awards team? She

17:53

was like, well, my direct team

17:55

is 75. My gosh. That's a

17:57

huge division of people working on

17:59

awards. Yeah. So this is a

18:01

very important thing for networks and

18:03

platforms. And it's not necessarily strictly

18:05

merit based. And I think that's

18:08

where. creators get frustrated. There's a

18:10

quote from Link from this from

18:12

South by Southwest where Link said,

18:14

if you look at the numbers,

18:16

we're exceeding those of late night

18:18

shows in the 18 to 34

18:20

demo. We're exceeding all of them

18:22

combined. Marquez added. So, you know,

18:24

I took a look at some

18:26

of the Q4 ratings for late

18:29

night. These are what are called

18:31

live plus seven days of viewership.

18:33

Kimmel. is averaging 1.9 million viewers,

18:35

late night with Stephen Colbert, 2.5,

18:37

tonight show with Jimmy Fallon, 1.3

18:39

million. So yeah, the competition is

18:41

like, Renn Link are competing, right?

18:43

They are competing in that type

18:45

of daily show format. Hot ones

18:47

is absolutely competing, right? And at

18:49

times blowing them out of the

18:52

water. But is that the comparison?

18:54

Is it like the apples to

18:56

apples comparison? of Fallon

18:58

and Hot Ones. Because by the

19:00

numbers, yeah, they should be head

19:03

to head, but there's so much

19:05

more at play than just the

19:07

numbers. Yeah, for me, when I

19:10

look at it, if I'm Sean

19:12

Evans, I'm probably saying to myself,

19:14

yeah, Emmy would be great. It'd

19:17

be cool. It'd be a marker

19:19

of my career and what I've

19:21

done. But as long as I

19:24

am consistently putting out. work that

19:26

I like and it's resonating with

19:29

an audience that continues to grow

19:31

and enjoy it. That's actually the

19:33

most important thing. Like I am

19:36

in my own lane and there

19:38

is such freedom to just being

19:40

like I actually don't need, I

19:43

don't need to win an Emmy.

19:45

Yeah, my concern is when you

19:47

unlock that door of like a

19:50

creator winning an Emmy, it opens

19:52

up that competitive landscape. for creators

19:55

and even that aspiration in a

19:57

world where we have found weight.

19:59

to have a hot once emerge

20:02

without any gatekeepers, any conversation,

20:04

any engagement with the like

20:07

bureaucracy of Hollywood. And you know it

20:09

is, it's plain and simple, I think

20:11

the most important vote is

20:13

the vote of the audience. That's

20:15

the most important vote. It just is.

20:18

Like and back to the conversation

20:20

around like cultural penetration. It's

20:22

like some people have it, some

20:25

people don't. And if you have it

20:27

and you build it yourself. Keep

20:29

going. Keep on rolling. Just keep

20:31

rolling. You know, and like it's

20:33

easier to do that without other

20:36

stakeholders. That's why these creators are

20:38

where they are today. So I'm

20:40

very fascinated by this this Emmy

20:42

effort and I just I'm curious

20:44

what what others think about how

20:47

much or how little it matters. Again,

20:49

it comes back to the advertising

20:51

business. Like that is what this

20:54

is about. It's about dollars shifting

20:56

from major TV networks to

20:58

YouTube. So shifting gears and

21:00

speaking of, you know, creators who

21:03

are doing things themselves have a

21:05

connection to an audience and are

21:07

having a major impact. Sidemen

21:09

charity match. Every year, it

21:11

didn't happen last year, it happened

21:13

2023, it happened 2025 very

21:15

recently. It amazes me the

21:17

amount of people that come and

21:19

watch digitally in person. This year

21:21

it was 90,000 people watching live.

21:24

watching a bunch of creators in

21:26

Wembley, yeah, like in Wembley Stadium,

21:28

yeah, and consistently 2.5 million concurrent

21:30

viewers on YouTube, yeah, on

21:33

YouTube, 17 million views of

21:35

the replay, not to mention, why

21:37

are all these creators so good at

21:39

soccer? Like I watched a highlight reel of

21:41

sketch in goal, I don't know, and it

21:43

just, it feels like a video game. No,

21:45

it doesn't, it really doesn't make much sense,

21:48

what's going on, like... Yeah, I've always wanted

21:50

to be asked to play, but now when

21:52

I look at it, I'm like, no, I'm

21:54

actually, I'm not on the phone. Also, Jimmy

21:56

missing the free kick, tough, tough, Jim, you know.

21:58

Look, who are we, man? Like... I, listen, never been

22:01

invited to play in it. I've never seen

22:03

you play soccer. I think I could kind of,

22:05

I mean, I am getting old now, but

22:07

like, I think I got to do it.

22:09

Robert, Robert looked politely disagree with Mark Robert

22:12

looked so young and spry. Like, he's never

22:14

been fitter in his life. He's 44 years

22:16

old and he's like sprinting around the soccer

22:18

field. He scored a goal in the, in

22:21

the, in the, in the, in the penalty

22:23

kicks. Yeah. I'm convinced the Sideman charity charity

22:25

kicks. a way for all these creators to show

22:27

how fit they are and like score a

22:29

goal and take their shirt off. I mean,

22:32

it's like a really high quality camera. It's

22:34

the coolest looking event in our

22:36

industry by far. And again, we

22:38

go back to this concept of

22:40

like making something that matters in

22:42

culture, like this matters. This absolutely

22:45

matters. When the audience votes with

22:47

ticket sales, when they vote with showing

22:49

up to an event, that matters. It

22:51

just matters. And I think there's

22:53

a lot of questions around how do

22:55

you know. If a creator matters, like how do you

22:57

know if a creator has real community

22:59

and engagement? Like, this is how you

23:01

know. You just, they host an in-person event,

23:04

people show up. At South by Southwest, I

23:06

thought one of the most impressive, if

23:08

not the most impressive thing I saw

23:10

was us going to Jake Shane's live

23:12

show. My gosh. We walked in the

23:14

door at the Moody Theater. I think

23:16

there was 3,000 people there. It was

23:19

three levels packed. Three levels, absolutely packed.

23:21

And he had this audience captivated captivated.

23:23

Captivated. Captivated. Captivated. Captivated. Like this audience

23:25

was in the palm of his hand

23:27

and he's alone on stage. Yeah. And

23:29

I looked at that and I was

23:31

like, this is what, everyone needs to

23:33

look around and go like, you know,

23:35

back to our conversation with Jack Conte,

23:37

subscribers don't really matter anymore. This is

23:39

what matters. Do you have a real

23:41

community that'll show up for you? Yeah,

23:44

it reminded me of speaking with Kevin

23:46

Hart at Spotter Summit at the beginning

23:48

of the year, and him talking about

23:50

how seriously he takes touring and seeing

23:52

his audience in person. you know we spoke

23:54

about it briefly but it just keeps coming back

23:56

to the top of my mind of like oh

23:58

you really want to build a community

24:01

based off of the work that you

24:03

do digitally, you need to go see

24:05

the people. And that's what Jake

24:07

Shane is doing. That's what so

24:10

many creators are doing right

24:12

now. The side men give

24:14

that opportunity in a lot

24:16

of ways for physical engagement

24:18

with their brand between, you

24:20

know, they have restaurants, they

24:22

have this event where it's

24:24

like this annual tentpole major

24:27

moment that... people get to

24:29

get excited for it. 90,000

24:31

people showing up is insane. It

24:33

just proves it's not a

24:35

gimmick. It's not like hacking

24:37

the algorithm. No. It's not empty

24:40

viewership. It is just like truly

24:42

a lot of people who their

24:45

brand is impacting their life.

24:47

That's I think like the reward

24:49

is that event. And I

24:51

think people in our space. This

24:53

year, I think tracking towards more

24:56

and more physical events and like

24:58

seeing your community show up in

25:00

front of your face, I think is like,

25:02

it is so important because it

25:04

is the metric. How do you, how do

25:06

you measure engagement? I think that is

25:09

how you measure engagement. You know, like,

25:11

this is, I think it's the coolest event

25:13

in our space by far. Yeah, let

25:15

alone KSI is performing at halftime and

25:17

feastables is the sponsor. It's just this

25:19

like. like it's just so strange it

25:21

is it's cool it is it's like

25:24

it's like it's a silver ball for

25:26

graders yeah super wall for graders continually

25:28

impressed by those guys yeah I'm sad

25:30

we couldn't go out this year we've

25:32

always wanted to go out just crazy

25:34

year with with fires and babies and

25:36

you know figuring out that's enough fires and babies

25:38

is it is yeah figuring out how to get

25:40

back on our feet but um I'd love to

25:43

just go and see that like I think I

25:45

think it's it's the most impressive event All right,

25:47

let's do some creator support. We got some

25:49

questions from the audience. We're going to answer

25:51

one of them right now. If you have

25:53

questions, you can submit them to us either

25:56

on our Reddit, tweet at us, or preferably

25:58

actually send us a voice memo. I'd

26:00

love to play voice memos on here.

26:02

So creator support. This comes from our

26:04

subreddit, jobs that serve as internships for

26:07

content creation career. Hey all, I remember

26:09

Michelle Carré saying that her and some

26:11

of her fellow creators worked at Buzzfeed

26:14

and that served as an quote unquote

26:16

internship for their creator journey. I'm someone

26:18

who wants to either create my own

26:21

content, comedy mainly, or become a writer

26:23

for content creators. I love the creator

26:25

process. So I can see myself being.

26:28

Content working for someone else as long

26:30

as I love what they create have

26:32

a good time of the job itself

26:34

Long story short question is how do

26:37

you break into the world? I know

26:39

it's 70% who you know But if

26:41

you don't know anyone what are the

26:44

inroads has anyone? Anyone successful at landing

26:46

a position whether it's for another creator

26:48

or a company like Buzzfeed complexly barstool

26:51

or college humor Yeah, it's it's it's

26:53

a good question like what is the

26:55

path to joining a creator? And thinking

26:58

about our inbound, we get multiple emails

27:00

every day of can I intern for

27:02

you in request. Sure. But what I

27:05

told the person who asked me was,

27:07

I think you should make it clear

27:09

to the creator that you deeply understand

27:11

what they make and their audience and

27:14

how you can help. And that's not

27:16

by sending a long email. Yeah. It's

27:18

by actually highlighting the problem, whether it's

27:21

ideas or making better thumbnails, whatever it

27:23

is. and just sending that over. Right?

27:25

Because that for me, like, we've worked

27:28

with multiple people before who've just clipped

27:30

our show and sent us clips and

27:32

we go, you're actually pretty good at

27:35

that. Yeah, or sent us thumbnails and

27:37

you're like, oh, okay. I think the

27:39

question is like, always with this stuff,

27:41

push and pull. So like, if you

27:44

send a really long email, you're like

27:46

extracting something for me or extracting my

27:48

time and suggesting that I have time

27:51

to read that. But what you should

27:53

be doing is. pushing value. So push

27:55

value out to me and let me

27:58

react to that. But it's also like,

28:00

that's hard. Like that is hard. You're

28:02

not gonna be, I don't think you're

28:05

gonna have like an extremely high success

28:07

rate there. Yeah, it's important to understand

28:09

that too. Yeah, I do think that

28:11

a lot of people end up, you

28:14

know, getting jobs with creators through the

28:16

path of, you know, another company that

28:18

engages with creators. I do think that

28:21

and I think in the content world

28:23

like that is getting harder and harder

28:25

and harder. I would look at, you

28:28

know, we have a job board through

28:30

the published press, and I saw like

28:32

a fascinating job for a creator named

28:35

Ramit Sethi, who's a finance creator. He

28:37

listed YouTube strategist as a job, salary

28:39

range, 150 to 200K, a year, right?

28:42

And so, so, yeah, crazy. So I

28:44

think the, the first step is like,

28:46

look at our job board, like see

28:48

what's going on, see who is hiring,

28:51

what type of roles they're hiring, you're

28:53

saying you're a writer. But that might

28:55

have different language in our space now.

28:58

It might be a strategist, right? It

29:00

might be like a writer is more

29:02

of someone who's looking at the YouTube

29:05

landscape and writing ideas, which falls into

29:07

the strategy bucket. So, you know, I

29:09

think you have to look at who's

29:12

hiring. Some of them are individual creators.

29:14

Some of them are more companies, like

29:16

a complexly, but a lot of those

29:18

jobs are being listed. So you have

29:21

to, it's hard to. try and get

29:23

a job with someone who's not actively

29:25

hiring. Because you're not necessarily solving a

29:28

problem for them, you might be creating

29:30

a problem for them. So I would

29:32

look at who is actively hiring and

29:35

go from there. So basically I'm saying

29:37

subscribe to our newsletter. Yeah. I actually

29:39

told that to the person as well.

29:42

I was like, yeah, we do post

29:44

job listings there. And we cover stories

29:46

of people who are operating like media

29:49

companies, which those types of companies are

29:51

hiring. So I would look at what's

29:53

like there's this. There's this great quote

29:55

that was from our episode with Jacob

29:58

Collier. And I've been thinking about a

30:00

lot, where he said, like, you don't

30:02

need to come in blazingly contribute. And

30:05

what that means is, like, if you

30:07

want to be a part of something,

30:09

first observe it, first observe it and

30:12

understand how you provide value to it,

30:14

then jump in. So I think that's,

30:16

you know, first, like, read our newsletter,

30:19

understand what's happening in the industry, what

30:21

are people doing, what moves are they

30:23

making, what problems do people have in

30:25

the space? start to identify where you

30:28

fit into the industry, look at the

30:30

job boards, look at what the hiring

30:32

is, then jump in and send an

30:35

email. But like, I think there's a

30:37

little bit too much in our space

30:39

of just, I love this creator, I

30:42

want to work for them, let me

30:44

send them an email. Yeah. I don't

30:46

think that works very much. Yeah. And

30:49

I've tried that, you know, before being

30:51

a creator myself, I sent a lot

30:53

of emails that were really long. So

30:55

I've been there. Let me see what

30:58

we've got here. This is from Unreal

31:00

Entertainment Gaming. Where do you see the

31:02

world of content creation along with the

31:05

world of streaming within the next five

31:07

years? Okay, so this is kind of

31:09

along the lines of what we were

31:12

just talking about. Outside of expanding its

31:14

reach, do you think platforms like YouTube

31:16

will continue to become harder and harder

31:19

to manage? Or do you think it

31:21

gets easier given the constant algorithm and

31:23

monetary changes? So essentially... As YouTube continues

31:26

to grow, begin to look more like

31:28

streaming, does it become a harder platform?

31:30

Yeah, I mean, I find it to

31:32

be harder than it used to be.

31:35

I do. I find it to be

31:37

harder to compete. I think there's a

31:39

lot of quality stuff now. And I

31:42

think to be in that we were

31:44

talking about this yesterday, to be in

31:46

the upper echelon of creators right now,

31:49

like you watch Cleo Abrams show, huge

31:51

of true. And you're like, that is

31:53

a good show is excellent. And you

31:56

watch a lot of these shows, like

31:58

Ryan Trahan's videos. You're like... Those are

32:00

really good videos. And people are going

32:02

to really significant lengths to make these

32:05

videos. Preston goes. His most recent series.

32:07

That took him months to make. It's

32:09

about him building this mini truck to

32:12

go on an abandoned railroad. It is

32:14

just hitting every episode. He's doing a

32:16

three-part series. Episode one, two million views,

32:19

two, a million views in like a

32:21

day. He is, but that is so

32:23

hard. to make. Did you watch Yes

32:26

Theory's latest video of training with the

32:28

Finnish army? It's an hour and eight

32:30

minutes long. It's a movie. It's not,

32:33

yeah, it's shot so incredibly well and

32:35

edited so incredibly well. But also what

32:37

they put themselves through was insane. Like

32:39

freezing for three nights in a row

32:42

out in the wilderness by themselves. Yeah.

32:44

It's totally insane. I would say like

32:46

if we're making it sound like it's

32:49

really too hard, I would try and

32:51

think about, okay, maybe I'm not going

32:53

to immediately compete. in some of these

32:56

genres. But YouTube is also an incredible

32:58

place to connect with a niche

33:00

audience. And if we've said that

33:02

before, but like 47% of Gen

33:04

Z, say they're a fan of

33:06

something they know that no one

33:09

else personally is also a fan

33:11

of. So, you know, there are

33:13

niches where you can totally break

33:15

out. And I would suggest trying

33:17

to find an underserved audience to

33:19

start because it'll be a very

33:21

forgiving audience and hopefully they'll find

33:23

you quickly. There's a creator named

33:25

Andrew Millison. And we just talked

33:28

about this with our friend Patty

33:30

Galloway. He does permaculture content. I

33:32

didn't even know what permaculture was.

33:34

And if you look at his

33:36

channel, he has found a way

33:38

to get millions and millions of

33:40

views talking about permaculture, figuring out

33:42

like sustainable agricultural plans. And that

33:45

I think is like what the

33:47

beauty of YouTube. I think what

33:49

everyone is looking at though is

33:51

the marketing of YouTube creators, which

33:53

is like who's in that top

33:55

top upper echelon group. But again,

33:57

like we said at the beginning

33:59

of the episode, you zoom out,

34:01

YouTube's a big play. You can

34:04

find your own niche there. There's

34:06

also that guy who like works

34:08

at 7-Eleven who started blogging. Just

34:10

like, people love it. It's just

34:12

fun. And I think there was

34:14

one thing that was refreshing to

34:16

watch this week, which was the

34:18

new Selena Gomez Gracie Abrams music

34:20

video. This is like all you're

34:23

talking about. I know, because it's

34:25

a return to old YouTube. It's

34:27

one shot directly into a camera,

34:29

into a whole music video. That's

34:31

it. They're just filming selfie style

34:33

in a in a bed. the

34:35

whole music video. And it reminds

34:37

me of the Call Me Maybe

34:40

music video, which was shot into

34:42

a Mac book. And it was

34:44

like, oh, YouTube's this, like, raw,

34:46

fun place where anyone can upload

34:48

anything. And this music video, I

34:50

think, is like, it's an ode

34:52

to old YouTube. And it reminds

34:54

me that, like, again, like, it's

34:56

about making something that people connect

34:59

with. The production value has gone

35:01

up, but just take a step

35:03

back and they're like, like, like,

35:05

Does this connect or not? That's

35:07

it. And like, that's the beauty

35:09

of YouTube. It's just, that is

35:11

the democratic nature. Are you making

35:13

something that connects or not? I

35:15

want to end with a voice

35:18

note that we got from Preston

35:20

Ghost, because it has to do

35:22

with awards. Uh-oh. Preston sent me

35:24

a voice memo. I'm going to

35:26

do this as fast and efficient

35:28

as possible. Sean Baker won an

35:30

Oscar for a. Oh no, I'm

35:32

nervous, dang it. Sean Baker wins

35:35

Best Director this year for Anora.

35:37

He was the Oscar. He also

35:39

wins Best Editor. He also wrote

35:41

the movie. I think you guys

35:43

could totally talk about this on

35:45

the podcast because this is what

35:47

YouTubeers do. And it's so interesting

35:49

to see Hollywood big wig wins

35:51

for all of them. It makes

35:54

me think like a YouTubeer. is

35:56

doing this today and could potentially

35:58

one day. win the same awards

36:00

because we are doing this as

36:02

individuals. Okay, that was so long.

36:04

I'm so sorry. Don't be mad.

36:06

Emmy, Samira, okay. So I, just

36:08

so you guys know, I'm notorious

36:10

for disliking voice notes. I don't,

36:13

I don't, I don't like them. I

36:15

don't know how to engage, especially if

36:17

they're any longer than a minute. I

36:19

don't, it just can't really grind your

36:21

gears. It grinds my gears. That is

36:23

a major gripe. But what Preston is

36:25

saying that is saying is saying is

36:27

saying is saying is right. You're like

36:30

fully connected to the thing. Like he

36:32

wrote it, directed, edited, even in his

36:34

speech, he said like half of my

36:37

directing is editing. Like that is

36:39

YouTubeers, right? Preston is, with

36:41

his most recent series, he

36:43

concepted it, he filmed it, he filmed

36:45

it, he is editing it himself, he's

36:48

making the music himself, like that is

36:50

what we do. Again, as we talked about

36:52

the top of the episode, like, I don't

36:55

doubt people who are creating on the

36:57

awards in the future. The biggest

36:59

question that I think is a fair

37:01

question asked is does that mean that they're

37:03

creating on YouTube or does that mean they're

37:06

creating on a different platform? I'll

37:08

leave you guys with that question. Thanks for

37:10

listening to this episode of the Colin

37:12

and Smear Show. Let us know what

37:15

you guys think about YouTubers and Hollywood

37:17

Awards. And if you have questions for

37:19

us, send us a voice note. Just make sure

37:21

it's under a minute.