0:00

Dave here, do you keep swearing that

0:02

this is finally going to be the

0:04

year that you do video well for

0:06

your e-commerce brand? Or maybe you've

0:09

had it with e-commerce all

0:11

together and you have ambitions

0:13

to be a full-time You-Tuber. Come

0:15

on, you know you've thought about

0:17

it. Well, this episode's going to

0:20

be great for you because today

0:22

we have Steve Chu from My

0:24

Wife Quitter Job. Now you've probably

0:26

heard Steve on lots of different

0:29

podcasts, including... basically nothing to 400,000

0:31

subscribers in just three or four years.

0:33

So we talk about a lot of different

0:35

actionable things to number one, do your

0:37

videos cheaply and easily so you don't

0:39

dread doing them, so you don't commit

0:42

a whole day to recording a 30-second

0:44

video. We're going to talk about just

0:46

things that you can do to get

0:48

videos out right away and quickly and

0:50

today. And also we're going to talk

0:52

about things that you can do to

0:54

launch your videos with success on YouTube

0:56

or whether it's Tiktok Shorts or wherever

0:59

you want to publish them to. So

1:01

lots of actionable SCO things that you

1:03

can do for your YouTube videos to

1:05

actually get them watched. So I think

1:07

you guys are going to love today's

1:10

episode and with that being said, on

1:12

to the pod. Ready to start and

1:14

grow your own profitable e-commerce brand? This

1:16

is the e-com crew podcast, the web's

1:18

most transparent podcast, where we don't hide

1:21

our brands, our products, or

1:23

our failures. From creating stellar

1:25

products to selling both on

1:28

Amazon and off Amazon. Keep

1:30

listening for authentic stories, practical

1:33

advice, and tactical tips for

1:35

starting and running your own

1:38

e-commerce business. Hey

1:41

guys, I just wanted to interrupt

1:43

this podcast to mention a new

1:45

course that we have launching this

1:47

week called e-commerce and FBA for

1:49

Canadians. So I know only 11% of our

1:51

audience are Canadian, but for those 11%

1:53

of you, you probably have encountered many

1:56

of the same struggles that I as

1:58

a Canadian have encountered. as I've tried

2:00

to start, run, and grow an FBA

2:02

and e-commerce business as a Canadian. So

2:04

just things like where should you register

2:06

your company? How can you get lending

2:08

in Canada? Come on Canadian. You know

2:10

that is a major issue in Canada.

2:12

And how even just to ship your

2:14

products from Canada into America? So these

2:16

are all things that I've spent a

2:18

lot of effort and a lot of

2:20

money over the years trying to figure

2:22

out. and I break it all down

2:24

for you in this FBA for Canadians

2:26

course. So if you're not Canadian, forget

2:28

this ad all together. But if you

2:30

are Canadian, definitely check it out, go

2:32

to the landing page. I think it's

2:34

one of the most unique and high-value

2:36

courses that you're going to find if

2:38

you are Canadian and check it out.

2:40

And I'd love to see you guys.

2:42

And now, back to the podcast. Steve, welcome

2:45

to the podcast. What's up, Dave? Am

2:47

I the Asian version of Mike Jack

2:49

Jackness here? I don't talk enough to

2:51

be him, but... You're the Asian, more

2:53

buffer version of Mike Jackness. Well, I'm

2:55

happy to be here, man. This is

2:57

the first time I think that you're

2:59

interviewing me, not Mike. Yes, so I

3:01

was going to talk about that. This

3:03

is the first time that I've interviewed

3:05

you. Do you remember the first time

3:07

I interviewed you? Do you remember the

3:09

first time I interviewed you? Were you

3:11

running Chinese importing.com or something like that?

3:13

Well that transitioned into eCon. So everything

3:15

got redirected. Okay. It's kind of funny

3:17

you mention it. Like I got the notification

3:19

a couple weeks ago that the domain

3:21

is ready to expire and we transferred

3:23

it about 2016, like redirected everything. And

3:25

I wonder, can I let it expire

3:27

now? Do I have to keep paying

3:29

the 20 bucks a month? That's a

3:31

good domain. I don't think I would

3:33

let it expire. Says the one who

3:35

has like 50 domains lying in his

3:37

account though. All right, I will renew

3:39

it one more year. But yeah, and

3:41

do you remember what year it was

3:43

that I had first interviewed you? It

3:45

had to predate ecom crew, so it

3:47

had to be like, I don't know,

3:49

2014 maybe. Wow, good guess. Yeah, 2014.

3:51

Was it 24? It was 2014. That day

3:54

I messaged you. I'm like, oh my

3:56

God, Steve, too. I found you through

3:58

a directory that we're both part of,

4:00

e-commerce fuel, Andrew. There's a free plug

4:02

for the day. Message you, asked you,

4:04

if you'd be willing to come on

4:06

the blog and let me interview you,

4:08

you said yes, dude. I literally thought

4:10

that day, man, I have made it.

4:12

I'm having Steve too on the blog,

4:14

he's interviewing for Chinese importing.com, and that

4:16

was the day that was the day

4:18

that I thought, that I thought, that

4:20

I thought, that I thought, that I

4:22

thought, that I thought, That's hilarious because

4:24

I had nothing back then. I like,

4:26

I had the blog and that was

4:28

it. Yeah, but you're still somewhat of a

4:30

like a minor celebrity. Not like you

4:32

are now, of course, like major celebrity.

4:34

Was I? Okay. I thought you dared,

4:36

you daring was the celebrity back. Yeah,

4:38

you too were kind of neck and

4:40

neck. Yeah, we met at ECF, man.

4:42

But yeah, let's, what's enough of the

4:44

flattery. Let's get into the guts. Enough

4:46

of the flattery for the flattery. So,

4:48

so 2014, so 2014, you helped, you

4:50

helped, you helped, you helped, you helped,

4:52

you help, teach me, teach me, teach

4:54

me, teach me, teach me, teach me,

4:56

teach me, 2025 you're going to help

4:58

teach me all about video, specifically YouTube,

5:00

but also just video content in general.

5:02

And so I think for the audience

5:04

listening. Most of you guys listening are

5:06

running e-commerce companies. So we'll talk about

5:08

video for e-commerce because like we talked

5:10

about before Steve You're about to launch

5:12

a channel specifically for bumblebee linens. But

5:14

also just YouTube in general because I

5:16

think even people running e-commerce brands are

5:18

still thinking about hey, maybe you know,

5:20

maybe I want to get into the

5:22

just a purely YouTube game and you've

5:24

done amazing. Steve just for everybody listening.

5:26

He's at over 400,000 subscribers now Something

5:28

around there. Yeah, so I mean you've

5:30

hit it out of the park So

5:32

hopefully in this podcast you can tell

5:34

us a little bit of a secret

5:36

sauce of doing video either for pure

5:38

YouTube place or for e-commerce Yeah, and

5:40

I've been trying to convince you to

5:42

just take YouTube more seriously Right and

5:44

you have kind of trying well and

5:46

we talked about this before the reason

5:48

why? for me I've been taking it more

5:51

seriously is basically Google absolutely decimated all

5:53

small content publishers especially in our space

5:55

yep and I think we've both come

5:57

to the realization at some point since

5:59

that helpful update came along that yeah

6:01

you know what maybe there'll be a

6:03

very very very minor recovery but nothing

6:05

is going back to the way it

6:07

was. Like chat GPTA has kind of

6:09

changed that game for, well, forever. Yep,

6:11

absolutely. Yeah. What do you want to

6:13

start with this, Dave? What I want

6:15

to start with, when did you start

6:17

to take YouTube seriously? Because to your

6:19

credit, I think you saw the writing

6:21

on the wall a little bit before

6:23

2023 when that helpful update kind of

6:25

took out blogging altogether. I think you're well

6:27

ahead of that game. So when did

6:29

you really start to take it seriously?

6:31

2020. Right before the pandemic started, I

6:33

can't remember, I got hit with an

6:35

update, a Google update then, and I

6:37

was like, okay, I can't live like

6:39

this. And I needed another way. Another

6:41

Google way. Yeah, I know. Ironically, right?

6:43

Another Google way. But the difference with

6:45

this way was is that video can

6:47

be easily repurposed, cut into chunks for

6:49

short form, which was kind of coming

6:51

into play back then too. Yeah, so

6:53

whereas the blog, like, it was just

6:55

so volatile. There was, like, a new

6:57

update, like, every other month. This is

6:59

once AI started. That's what I really

7:01

started seeing the writing on the wall,

7:03

actually. Yeah, so as soon as AI

7:05

started, so around 2020, I guess that

7:07

was kind of getting into the first

7:09

rumblings that AI was going to be

7:11

a thing and might actually be. capable

7:13

at some point in the near future

7:15

future. That's when you start around 2020.

7:17

Were you starting literally from ground zero?

7:19

And I guess what I want to

7:21

try to figure out is how long

7:24

did it take you to go from

7:26

let's say either zero or 5,000 subs

7:28

up to 100,000 subs? Okay, so technically

7:30

it wasn't ground zero, but in a

7:32

way it was because I was just

7:34

using it as a storage for videos.

7:36

Yeah. So everything was unlisted. I don't

7:38

think I had like published videos on

7:40

the channel. And I was just guiding

7:42

people there through my otter responder sequence

7:44

and people were still subscribing. Nice. Yeah.

7:46

So you started roughly more or less it

7:48

was zero then and then how long

7:50

to get to 100K? I want to

7:52

say it took two years for that

7:54

to happen. Okay. Well, that's pretty quick.

7:56

So what were you doing to get

7:58

to 100K in two years? Okay. So

8:00

in the beginning, I don't know how

8:02

you feel about video, but when you're

8:04

first starting video, it feels really like

8:06

a ton of... work. Yeah. Right. So

8:08

what I was actually doing in the

8:10

very beginning is I was literally just

8:12

reading my blog posts. Nice. Like I

8:14

just throw it on the teleopor and

8:16

just try to read it as naturally

8:18

as I can. And fortunately I wrote

8:20

the way I talk. So it wasn't horrible.

8:22

It wasn't ideal because I think in

8:24

order to be really successful on YouTube,

8:26

you can't just read off a blog

8:28

post, obviously. But that got me in

8:30

the rhythm of publishing once a week.

8:32

and all those guys in there were

8:34

crushing it and I just had them

8:36

look at a video and I remember

8:38

they just ripped it to shreds like

8:40

where you get this content from it's

8:42

so boring you know you need like

8:44

a hook and all that stuff like

8:46

okay well just just teach me if

8:48

you can just help me rewrite one

8:50

thing then I'll know what to do

8:53

from here and out and that's where

8:55

things started really taking off and so what

8:57

was the key like talking about a

8:59

hook is that just in the first

9:01

15 seconds having the first 15 seconds

9:03

you got to give him a reason

9:05

to stay and if you can tell

9:07

a story or be just really dramatic

9:09

about the whole thing. Okay. And then

9:11

after that, pretty much every two or

9:13

three minutes, you got to redo that

9:15

dramatic thing again to keep them watching.

9:17

Yeah. Okay, okay. So on that note,

9:19

how long do you think is the

9:21

ideal video length? Because I obviously have

9:23

creeped your YouTube channel and it seems

9:25

like every single video that Steve Two

9:27

publishes is nine minutes and 33 seconds.

9:29

It's actually around 12 minutes. Here's why.

9:31

Okay, I wanted to get monetized, right?

9:33

And back in the day, I don't

9:35

know if this is still true. You

9:37

need at least eight minutes in order

9:39

to be able to add ads within

9:41

the content. Like a mid-roll ad? Yeah,

9:43

mid-roll ad, yeah. So that's why the

9:45

minimum was eight minutes. And what I

9:47

discovered is that 2,000 words is roughly

9:49

10 to 12 minutes. So literally I

9:51

would just write the script until I

9:53

hit 2, It does for a different

9:55

reason because I have a video editor

9:57

and I know what her limits are

9:59

in terms of how many minutes she

10:01

can edit. And not charge you more?

10:03

No, not charging you more, but just

10:05

because I have her doing a lot

10:07

of stuff because each video is actually

10:09

ripped apart in a short form video

10:11

and she's also editing the podcast and

10:13

all that stuff as well. Okay, so

10:15

she's all hands on deck. She's doing

10:17

basically everything media for you from video editing

10:19

to podcast. Correct. So to answer your

10:21

question, there really isn't a good length

10:24

or an ideal length. Whatever it takes

10:26

to keep people watching actually. But there

10:28

are some videos that are shorter, some

10:30

that are longer, depending on what I

10:32

have to say. Like I have some

10:34

buddies, they make like four minute videos.

10:36

There's a guy in one of my

10:38

mastermind groups who's literally making five second

10:41

videos and killing it. So it just

10:43

depends. So would you say that the

10:45

watch time is a bigger factor

10:47

in SEO than video time? It is.

10:49

Yeah, I actually don't even do SEO

10:51

anymore for YouTube. Is that what you're

10:53

asking? Like the keyword research and stuff?

10:55

What are the factors that YouTube is

10:58

looking at to rank a video? And

11:00

like, watch time, I figure, has to

11:02

be some factor in the algorithm because

11:04

obviously YouTube wants you to watch more

11:06

because more opportunities to show ads. But

11:08

you think that's a less of a

11:10

factor than overall just consumption rate. Well,

11:13

no. So watch time is definitely a

11:15

very, very high factor there. I think

11:17

what it does now is it actually

11:19

shows your video to your existing subscribers

11:21

and depending on how well it does,

11:23

it then spreads it to the rest.

11:25

important to maintain like the same type

11:27

of content that your audience likes. I

11:29

had a buddy during the pandemic. He's

11:31

a he was a personal finance youtuber

11:34

and you know they were giving stimulus

11:36

checks right and everyone wanted to know

11:38

about stimulus checks so every piece of

11:40

content during the pandemic he wrote about

11:42

stimulus checks and some of these videos

11:44

were getting millions of views who was

11:46

addicted to it but then once the

11:48

pandemic ended he attracted a whole bunch

11:50

of people who didn't have any money

11:53

and his channel never recovered. Interesting. So

11:55

you're saying if you're let's say an

11:57

e-commerce blogger, you're putting out e-commerce content,

11:59

e-commerce content. and e-commerce content and all

12:01

of a sudden publishing, let's say something,

12:03

a little bit off the radar, say,

12:05

investing in agricultural real estate, which is

12:07

obviously going to bomb with your overall

12:09

audience. Even though that might be a

12:11

killer piece of content, it could really

12:14

long-term kind of hurt the channel for

12:16

at least. It could. Actually, I kind

12:18

of made that mistake too. I did

12:20

a video on Timu. Like just, is

12:22

it legit and whatnot? Because that was

12:24

one of my blog post that did

12:26

really well. But I think I attracted

12:28

a lot of subs of cheap shoppers.

12:30

Yeah, right? So you just got to

12:32

be careful. Yeah, that's interesting. I know

12:34

with econproof, that's I think part of

12:37

the problem that we ran into a

12:39

couple years ago is that all of

12:41

a sudden we went from an e-commerce

12:43

blog for e-commerce sellers to the point

12:45

where some of our freelancers had tiptoed

12:47

into like Amazon customer-centric articles. And it

12:49

seems to be what you're saying is

12:51

that YouTube is the exact same way.

12:53

They're putting you into a bucket and

12:55

if you venture out of that bucket,

12:57

you're going to confuse algorithm and they

13:00

just don't know what bucket it puts

13:02

you in. Yeah, I don't know about

13:04

it, bucket, but it does show your

13:06

video to a subset of your existing

13:08

subscribers. And if those aren't the ones

13:10

that like that type of content, it

13:12

could hose your entire video. Like I

13:14

have videos that don't do that well,

13:16

even though their watch time is really

13:18

long. a good watch time is anything

13:20

over 50% and sometimes I get that

13:23

but the video doesn't go anywhere. Interesting.

13:25

Okay that's great advice I think both

13:27

for me and hopefully for the listener

13:29

so stay on target for whatever you're

13:31

talking about so yeah I guess on

13:33

that note do you have a couple

13:35

of good examples of people in e-commerce

13:37

who have great YouTube channels and you

13:39

know Smaller e-commerce companies. There's a lot

13:41

of big brands that are absolutely killing

13:43

it with video But do you have

13:46

any examples from like your students or

13:48

just smaller brands in general? You know

13:50

what's funny is most of my students

13:52

these days and the way I kind

13:54

of teach is short form. Short form,

13:56

may? Mainly because most people don't have

13:58

the patience to get long form up.

14:00

Like it was so miserable in the

14:02

beginning. Like that first year, I was

14:04

lucky to get a thousand views on

14:06

a video. And these videos take a

14:09

lot longer than short form. Meanwhile, when

14:11

I was on Tiktok and I think

14:13

I have a hundred thousand something on

14:15

Tiktak or whatnot, you know, I just

14:17

pick up my phone, just say some

14:19

random stuff, and then all of a

14:21

sudden some of these get like millions

14:23

of these get like millions of views.

14:25

And so the students who are successful,

14:27

like I can only think of one

14:29

that has a decent YouTube channel, nothing

14:32

amazing, but she doesn't get as much

14:34

business as like, you know, Eric Bandholtz,

14:36

a beard brand, for example. Like, he's

14:38

the guy I always use as an

14:40

example. He gets like 50% of his

14:42

sales from his YouTube channel. Nice. And

14:44

that's mostly long form content though. Long

14:46

form. Yeah. Yeah. That's actually almost all

14:48

long form for him for his. So

14:50

for my brand, I'm doing long form

14:52

and short form and short form with

14:55

the same with the same with the

14:57

same. And so that's where you can

14:59

kind of save time there. Do you

15:01

think for your average e-commerce brand, let's

15:03

say that you're running a boating brand,

15:05

are you still doing that? Long story,

15:07

but I definitely have done it. So

15:09

anchoring.com, my past life, I sold boat

15:11

anchors as many people in the audience

15:13

know, let's say. I'm running an anchoring.com,

15:16

selling boat anchors. Do you think there's

15:18

a market there for like short-form video?

15:20

Like to me that feels like something

15:22

that just has to be long-form video,

15:24

how to pick your boat anchor, how

15:26

to dock your boat. Like that's just

15:28

naturally going to be long-form. And I

15:30

feel like most e-commerce brands probably fall

15:32

in that category where I feel like

15:34

the opposite actually. You do. Because remember

15:36

your goal is to attract an audience

15:39

of boat lovers in this case, right?

15:41

And maybe even just talk about your

15:43

boat and then people will ask you

15:45

like where you get in your boat

15:47

supplies or whatever. Whereas long form is

15:49

great too. I mean, don't get me

15:51

wrong. Like if your goal is to

15:53

do like tutorial type of videos, then

15:55

I think that's the way to go.

15:57

But I mean, short form is where

15:59

it's at. Do you have TikTok on

16:02

your phone? Yes. When was the last

16:04

time you got sucked in so much

16:06

on YouTube versus Tiktak? the three-hour tic-toc

16:08

hole. Yeah, and here's the other thing,

16:10

and I'm not selling on tic-toc shop

16:12

yet, and to be honest with you,

16:14

I'm not 100% sure I'm gonna do

16:16

that this year either, but people do

16:18

shop on that platform, even without tic-toc

16:20

shop, like if they see something interesting,

16:22

they'll go into the file and they'll

16:25

just click on your URL for your

16:27

shop. So many examples of short form.

16:29

So it's funny, there's students in my

16:31

class, they want to sell jewelry, or

16:33

they want to sell clothing. And I'm

16:35

like, don't do it. Don't do it.

16:37

But then here they are making millions

16:39

because of TikTok and Instagram. Yes. I

16:41

feel like it's very category specific. So

16:43

to your point, how often have I

16:45

gotten sucked into a TikTok hole? Okay,

16:48

often. How often have I actually bought

16:50

something off TikTok? purchase right that second.

16:52

So I feel like long form content

16:54

in terms of conversions should still do

16:56

better. Tik Talk, I feel like for

16:58

your average kind of bolts and nuts

17:00

e-commerce brand, I feel like short form

17:02

probably is not going to do well

17:04

unless it's like apparel or luxury or

17:06

fashion, something in that niche. I think

17:08

for what you're describing is probably true,

17:11

but I don't know what your customer

17:13

demographic is like, but for me. It's

17:15

like 99.9% women. And I would argue

17:17

that most people shopping are women, right?

17:19

I think in your case, boat anchors

17:21

does not sound like a female-dominated industry,

17:23

or just boating in general, right? So

17:25

maybe you're right for that industry. But

17:27

I would say for most products out

17:29

there, that's not the case, right? Anything

17:31

that requires research and whatnot, maybe I

17:34

can see YouTube being better. Right. But

17:36

for the impulse purchases, likely female dominated

17:38

or at least female majority for your

17:40

audience, you think short form is the

17:42

way to go. I think so. It's

17:44

also to a question of motivation because

17:46

it's much easier to pump out a

17:48

short form video. Yes. Then it is

17:50

to pump out a long form and

17:52

just see it fail, which it will.

17:54

Yeah, they will in the beginning. Actually,

17:57

you know that this shirt that I'm

17:59

wearing here, true class. I bought that

18:01

because of Tiktok. Because Tiktok made you

18:03

buy it. Tiktok made me buy it

18:05

because it was this guy who looked

18:07

fat and overweight and then he put

18:09

on this t-shirt and it emphasizes the

18:11

arms and sucks in the stomach. Sold.

18:13

Wow. Right? So people can't see but

18:15

Steve's pecks are absolutely bursting out of

18:17

the shirt right now. It's a t-shirt,

18:20

okay. What's the name of the brand?

18:22

True classic. True classic. Okay. Yeah. I

18:24

can buy that at Walmart? No, not

18:26

Walmart. Their t-shirts are actually 30 bucks

18:28

a piece, by the way. And they're

18:30

$250 million a company. Selling t-shirts, playing

18:32

t-shirts. They don't sell anything special or

18:34

fancy either. So you cannot buy at

18:36

a Walmart, but I assure you that

18:38

I can go on a team, you

18:41

know, and find a rip off of

18:43

it. You can. You can. You can.

18:45

You can. Cool. Okay. So that's kind

18:47

of the formula that you think for

18:49

short forum versus long forum content. On

18:51

that note, you are starting, you are

18:53

going to become the face of an

18:55

e-commerce YouTube channel. I know. Don't remind

18:57

me. So for everyone who doesn't know

18:59

who I am. I sell wedding linens

19:01

online. that are personalized for special occasions.

19:04

And then we have a large subset

19:06

of customers who just ironically collect handkerchiefs

19:08

and linens. Our demographic ranges from like

19:10

women in their 30s all the way

19:12

until like 55 plus. And so, you

19:14

know, we were just talking about Google

19:16

and had that wasn't coming back, but

19:18

we got hit by one of the

19:20

algoes. So I needed a way to

19:22

just kind of supplant that traffic. And

19:24

for the most part, you know, Facebook

19:27

ads has already supplanted that, but. in

19:29

order to grow moving forward, I just

19:31

feel like everything is going towards social

19:33

or social selling. And so that's why

19:35

I was like, okay, I'm going to

19:37

start a YouTube channel and publish TikTok

19:39

shorts, Instagram reals, and you know, the

19:41

whole gamut, all from the same piece

19:43

of content. And my wife didn't want

19:45

anything to do with it. And I'm

19:47

like, great. My wife doesn't want the

19:50

job. She doesn't want to do it.

19:52

You know, we've already kind of differed

19:54

over the years. Like, like she just

19:56

wants the lifestyle, the lifestyle, right. Whereas

19:58

I feel like I always want to

20:00

try the new thing. So like my

20:02

store, Bonneby Lennon, has become kind of

20:04

like a laboratory, right? Something new comes

20:06

out, I try it, and then I

20:08

report on the results. That's kind of

20:10

my MO now. So what I'm doing

20:13

is what works really well on short

20:15

form and YouTube are stories. So what

20:17

I've been doing is I've been compiling

20:19

like the love stories of our customers.

20:21

So a customer, for example, world. embroidered

20:24

a handkerchief that says like will you marry

20:26

me right and so I'll just reach out

20:28

to that person and say hey how are

20:31

you planning your proposal tell me about your

20:33

relationship how you got together and then I'll

20:35

just tell that story on YouTube and embellish

20:37

the heck out of it because yeah most

20:40

people don't give enough details and it's all

20:42

going to be short-form like 30 to 60-second

20:44

content it is not actually I'm aiming for

20:46

three minutes and there's a reason why I'm

20:49

aiming for three minutes. So three minutes is

20:51

like the limit of most short form platforms

20:53

right now, although TikTok is longer. And the way

20:55

I'm doing it is I'm using AI to generate

20:58

artistic profiles of these people. So kind of like

21:00

anime style. Yep. And I don't know what they

21:02

look like. And most of them, I don't have a

21:04

picture, they don't want to submit a picture.

21:06

Some of them don't even want their names.

21:08

Sometimes I don't even contact them contact them

21:10

at all. they like write this really long

21:12

testimonial and I just turn that into

21:15

a story. And so I'm creating these

21:17

anime characters, telling the story, making it

21:19

really dramatic and interesting, and it's based

21:21

on, you know, like... a true story, I

21:23

guess you should say. And then I'm using

21:26

AI to animate it sometimes too. How are

21:28

you using AI to animate it? Like what

21:30

tools are you using? There's a tool called

21:32

Kling. Where you can upload a picture and

21:35

tell it to animate it, do whatever you

21:37

want. I wish I could show you an

21:39

example here live, but in my one of

21:42

my recent stories, none of this is live

21:44

yet. It's going to probably go live in

21:46

April. The Hanke embroidery was. I swiped left

21:48

is a swipe left or swipe right

21:51

I never dated on the apps but

21:53

and it became forever that was that

21:55

was always written on the hanky so

21:58

I created these couples like using anime

22:00

style characters and then using cling I

22:02

said had these two characters kiss and

22:04

it did a pretty good job and

22:06

so I use that as kind of

22:09

like the closing for the video. So

22:11

you're not going to be the face

22:13

of it and I think this brings

22:15

up a really valid question like if

22:17

you're not kind of the customer avatar

22:20

and you're totally different from the customer

22:22

avatar can you do it completely faceless?

22:24

I'm not actually so I'm the narrator

22:26

yeah but I'll come in and I'll

22:28

give an intro. And then most of

22:31

the story is told storybook style with

22:33

these images. Because with AI you can

22:35

preserve the faces now and then just

22:37

create images in different scenery. Yep. And

22:39

it's all anime style, right? So it

22:42

doesn't need to look realistic or anything

22:44

either. Interesting. Yeah, because I think that's

22:46

a big barrier for a lot of

22:48

people is number one, they don't fit

22:50

their customer avatar. Okay, fine. You can

22:52

get over that I think and see

22:55

if you're kind of illustrating the fact

22:57

in the fact that it's okay. Most

22:59

people are afraid to be on camera.

23:01

They either don't want their face out

23:03

there, they don't want to be judged,

23:06

this, that, and the other thing. Do

23:08

you think there's an opportunity though for

23:10

faceless when it comes to an e-commerce

23:12

brand? Or as a broad rule of

23:14

thumb, face on camera is going to

23:17

be way better than faceless. I mean,

23:19

here's what I think. I think it's

23:21

important to... put your face on it.

23:23

I mean look I'm a middle-aged Chinese

23:25

dude trying to sell handkerchiefs and I

23:28

should not be the face of this

23:30

company but you know what's funny is

23:32

my business partner Tony she said something

23:34

different she said I think it might

23:36

be refreshing to see a guy talking

23:38

about this stuff so it might just

23:41

work is what she said. I've been

23:43

burned the other way Steve. I think

23:45

it was a different angle though that

23:47

you guys were approaching it. So you're

23:49

not approaching it from the angle of

23:52

you're going to make a ton of

23:54

money off these people selling handkerchief. Yeah,

23:56

I'm just telling them their stories. You

23:58

know, here's the thing, like that's not

24:00

the only content that we're going to

24:03

be putting on these channels, right? If

24:05

you look at a lot of these

24:07

popular... e-commerce brands that just kind of

24:09

blew up. It's silly videos like, hey,

24:11

I'm just gonna pack this order in

24:13

front of you guys. And we give

24:16

out free hankies all the time, so

24:18

I'm just gonna say, hey, for this

24:20

order, order number, whatever, whatever, whatever, here's

24:22

a free hanky. And that'll be like

24:24

one short 10, 30 second video, something

24:27

like that too. I'll sprinkle those in

24:29

between the love stories. Okay. So what's

24:31

going to be your strategy for your

24:33

strategy for initially getting your subscriber for

24:35

initially getting your subscriber count for this

24:38

subscriber count for this channel for this

24:40

channel? great advice for anybody listening. Like

24:42

you've obviously done it great with my

24:44

wife, quit her job, with the YouTube

24:46

channel, like what's going to be your

24:49

game plan for bumblebee linens? Yeah, so

24:51

to launch this channel, what I'm gonna

24:53

do is I'm gonna publish like five

24:55

of these and then I'm gonna run

24:57

a big contest for bumblebee linens subscribers.

24:59

And I'm pretty sure that these people

25:02

will be interested in watching these stories,

25:04

right? Yep. My wife reads romance novels.

25:06

I don't know if yours does, if

25:08

your wife does, but she eats that

25:10

stuff up. So I'm guessing like a

25:13

large portion of our customer base will

25:15

be interested. So I'll give away like

25:17

free hankies, gift certificates, whatnot, if they

25:19

subscribe and if they watch. And that'll

25:21

be the launch. And you know, if

25:24

I can get like a thousand subscribers

25:26

out of that, that'll be a win.

25:28

But it's it's going to be a

25:30

slug. Right. Like these videos, especially on

25:32

the YouTube channel. Yeah, so it's a

25:35

year of negative ROI. I mean, ROA

25:37

is hard to think about this because

25:39

I have my video editor who's already

25:41

paid for for my wife quit. So

25:43

maybe my wife quits funding it, I

25:45

guess. I don't know. It's a little

25:48

murky. Yeah. But it's still your time

25:50

at the very least. Like I'm sure

25:52

you're... Oh, absolutely. Even though the videos

25:54

may take three minutes to film. I

25:56

mean, what are you budgeting for a

25:59

time? I think this. in about an

26:01

hour. Does that include scripting in the

26:03

whole thing or is that just recording?

26:05

Yeah, wow. Yeah, and you know why?

26:07

it's because AI, right? Yeah. I already

26:10

have like this framework for how the

26:12

story flows. And I'm just following some

26:14

standard like Hollywood models, you know, big

26:16

dramatic beginning, problem, solution, and then the

26:18

aftermath. And then I have the testimonials

26:21

and they're like the data from the

26:23

customer and I just kind of feed

26:25

that in and have claw, I use

26:27

cloud for that. Claude's, does a much

26:29

better job. Okay. Spitting out the script

26:31

and then it's 90% of the way

26:34

I got to edit it obviously yeah,

26:36

but and then I actually have it

26:38

storyboarded also So my next prompt will

26:40

be based on this story create a

26:42

story and create prompts for mid-journey, which

26:45

is what I'm using to generate and

26:47

so it'll be like, you know Tom

26:49

and Lisa, you know sharing food or

26:51

something like that and that gets fed

26:53

into mid-journey I haven't scripted all this.

26:56

Eventually it's just going to be a

26:58

script where I push a button. Right

27:00

now it's manually being fed, you know,

27:02

into mid-journey and all that stuff. And

27:04

so, ideally we just have all these

27:06

images, a script, and what my editor

27:09

has to do is just kind of

27:11

mash it all together so that it

27:13

kind of flows. And I have a

27:15

green screen, oh, it's not set up

27:17

right now, but I have a green

27:20

screen over there, where I've taken all

27:22

these pictures. like me in front of

27:24

the sewing machines, not me in front,

27:26

just like a picture of the sewing

27:28

machines or in front of our, you

27:31

know, nameplate in the office and whatnot.

27:33

And so as I'm narrating, I'm in

27:35

different spots in the office without actually

27:37

physically having to go to the office.

27:39

Interesting. Wow. Okay. Even though the office

27:42

isn't that far away, I'm just kind

27:44

of lazy. Yeah, yeah. I mean, that's

27:46

kind of the Steve2 SOP is like

27:48

being able to. the game plan to

27:50

do it in a relatively short amount

27:52

of time. Yeah, I mean, these are

27:55

short things. I mean, contrast that to

27:57

a YouTube video that takes me a

27:59

lot longer to script. I'm in a

28:01

YouTube video, probably takes me a good

28:03

90 minutes to two hours to script.

28:06

And then the filming is always easy

28:08

because I use a teleprompter. That's actually

28:10

my biggest saving grace of all

28:12

this stuff. Okay, so you're launching

28:14

with five videos, you're gonna blast

28:16

it to your email list, hope

28:18

you get a thousand subs, write

28:20

up that by incentivizing them. And then

28:23

is there an ideal content schedule that

28:25

somebody should be aiming for? Like one

28:27

a week type thing? At least one.

28:29

And then the remaining three short form

28:31

are just going to be lifestyle

28:34

things around the office. I'm just

28:36

going to instruct our employees to

28:38

just film themselves as their packing

28:40

orders or film themselves doing whatever

28:42

it is they do. That all goes into

28:45

a folder on Dropbox and then I just

28:47

tell my video editor, hey, here's the theme

28:49

for this one, just mash something up and

28:51

we'll just see how it looks. The beauty

28:54

of short form is like, you have no

28:56

idea what's going to work. Yeah. I'm just

28:58

going to publish this because I need to

29:00

publish something. And that's the video that does

29:02

well, compared to the ones that I

29:04

spend a lot of time on. Yep. In

29:06

that regard, I think kind of similar to

29:08

the Amazon playbook, where the Amazon playbook is

29:11

you launch three products, they're all okay products.

29:13

One of them, you can have relative confidence,

29:15

this is going to absolutely bomb, you'll never

29:17

reorder it. One of them will probably do

29:19

okay, and one of them will probably do

29:21

pretty good. And trying to pick which one

29:23

is going to do which, I think it's

29:25

very hard to estimate, but that's when I'm

29:27

talking to people when they're thinking about launching

29:29

something on Amazon. I always tell them, do

29:31

it in a batch of three because if

29:33

you take one swing at the bat,

29:35

you have no idea if that product

29:38

is going to take off. There's a

29:40

pretty high luck factor. But if you

29:42

do, if you launch enough products and

29:44

you take enough swings at the bat,

29:47

probably one of those is going to

29:49

take enough swings at the bat, probably

29:51

one of those is going to take

29:53

off. And it's going to take enough

29:55

swings at the bat, probably one of

29:58

those is going to take off. take

30:00

off. I mean I call it panning

30:02

for gold. Okay. Right. I mean this

30:04

is a big commitment right because once

30:06

I launch we are committed to doing

30:08

these once or twice a week in

30:10

perpetuity right the beauty of this is

30:12

is that it can go in our

30:14

auto responder sequences in fact you already

30:16

wrote the auto responder sequence like hey

30:18

do you have a story to tell

30:20

if you do fill out this form

30:22

and I'll ask them the questions that

30:24

are necessary for each story and people

30:26

will I'm hoping want to be featured

30:28

want to be featured. Hopefully people will

30:30

just buy it, not necessarily because they

30:32

want the handkerchief itself. They want the

30:34

video. Yeah, exactly. That's the hope. That's

30:36

the long term hope. Oh, man. You're

30:38

making a pretty good pitch for why

30:41

this could work, actually. And I think

30:43

this does go to show the power

30:45

of video right now. If you can

30:47

have a product-based business, which is congruent

30:49

with short-form video or video in general,

30:51

I think that's one of the keys

30:53

to being successful in e-accessible in e-comers.

30:55

In 2025. I mean, it's really about

30:57

mindshare, right? Like, you know how many

30:59

people sell handkerchiefs and personalized handkeys online

31:01

now? Like, it's flooded. Even on Amazon,

31:03

it is flooded, right? I mean, you

31:05

would think something as obscure as that,

31:07

no one would be competing, but you

31:09

want people to buy from you because

31:11

of some reason, right? Just like these

31:13

true classic T's, I probably wouldn't buy

31:15

the generic ones on Timu. Yeah, because

31:17

I don't trust them. Like the fabric

31:19

is actually quite premium on the shirt.

31:21

It feels really nice. And I just

31:23

like the brand. Yeah. And I wish

31:25

it was cheaper, but you know, fortunately

31:27

I can afford the shirts, right? So

31:29

$30 for a T. It's a lot,

31:31

right? Yeah, I don't know. I mean,

31:34

we're built the same way. So for

31:36

us, $30 for a T is a

31:38

lot. Agreed just as we mean you

31:40

think it is you can buy 10

31:42

t-shirts for four bucks on team I

31:44

saw a deal the other day. Trust

31:46

me. Yeah, I just had a package.

31:48

You love her yesterday. Not with 10,

31:50

but with three. Yeah, there you go

31:52

Cool. Okay, last, can a couple questions

31:54

to wrap up here. Equipment, baseline what

31:56

somebody needs to get going. I think

31:58

when I first tried video, I think

32:00

this is kind of my life story

32:02

of what happened to video, probably seven,

32:04

eight years ago when I was writing

32:06

anchoring.com, trying to do video and it

32:08

was just a total time suck. Went

32:10

to a studio rented all this fancy

32:12

equipment actually from the university that I

32:14

had gone to. as a kid, rented

32:16

out some equipment, set up this big

32:18

elaborate studio. You know, it was days

32:20

and days and days that it took

32:22

just to record, I think, three videos.

32:24

And it was just a deterrent to

32:27

ever doing it again. What is kind

32:29

of a baseline for what somebody needs

32:31

today to get started with any type

32:33

of video, whether it's YouTube or Tik

32:35

or whatever. I think if you're on

32:37

a budget, all you need is a

32:39

mic, some sort of mic to make

32:41

you sound better. That is the bare

32:43

minimum. So not even a bare minimum.

32:45

So not even a camera. iPhone or

32:47

whatever is fine for a camera, but

32:49

microphone is there's no two ways about

32:51

it You need a good mic. I

32:53

think you need a good mic I

32:55

think audio is important, but these mics

32:57

are dirt cheap like you can get

32:59

one for like 15 bucks a corded

33:01

one if you want a wireless one

33:03

like a wireless Bluetooth one that's like

33:05

30 bucks The cost of a t-shirt

33:07

exactly I am using Actually, this isn't

33:09

video, but I use the road wireless

33:11

go-toos. Okay, nice. And then today I

33:13

film with the Sony A-74, because I

33:15

like the blurred background effect. Yep. But

33:17

yeah, I mean, most of the Tiktakers,

33:19

my one student who does multi-million selling

33:22

jewelry, she does everything on her iPhone.

33:24

Yep. Yeah, you don't need anything. In

33:26

terms of lighting, is there like a

33:28

simple ring light? You think that's good

33:30

enough for most people or most people

33:32

or even that? Yeah, I have. Yeah,

33:34

you can't see this, but I have

33:36

two ring lights right now. So I

33:38

just have one kind of at an

33:40

angle facing me and that's pretty much

33:42

it. You can get really creative. Like

33:44

some of these guys in my mastermind

33:46

group, they have like very subtle lighting

33:48

so that it creates a shadow on

33:50

your face. I don't think it matters

33:52

for the type of videos that I

33:54

make. Like it's just a talking head,

33:56

essentially, that's my YouTube channel, right? So

33:58

Mike and maybe a ring light. Mike

34:00

and ring like and I highly recommend

34:02

a teleprompter. Here's the thing, like before

34:04

the teleprompter, I would go on and

34:06

fumble my way through it. Yep. And

34:08

it would take my video editor maybe

34:10

three times longer to edit it. Yep.

34:12

Right. Whereas, you know, I throw it

34:15

on telerompter, even if it's just bullet

34:17

points. I don't fear the filming part.

34:19

I used to always fear the filming

34:21

part. Yep. Because as soon as you

34:23

flip the camera on, for some reason,

34:25

like my mind goes blank, and I

34:27

can't talk anymore. Yep. And I think

34:29

with AI now to chat, computer, Claude,

34:31

or whatever someone's AI tool of choice

34:33

is, it makes the scripting so much

34:35

easier, like feeding it in bullet points,

34:37

and it can do a pretty good

34:39

job of getting a script. And I

34:41

think it's one of those things too,

34:43

too, where you see the AI script,

34:45

where you see the AI script, where

34:47

you see the AI script, where you

34:49

see the AI script, When you actually

34:51

read it and you put a little

34:53

bit of emotion into it and with

34:55

a little bit of editing like it

34:57

does sound fairly natural I mean here's

34:59

actually my amo my process I will

35:01

write the entire script myself without AI

35:03

and it's just this jumble of ideas

35:05

that I write down and then the

35:08

only prompt I use really is make

35:10

this flow better Okay, and then it

35:12

turns all the junk into stuff that's

35:14

more intelligible, but that way it sounds

35:16

like me. It's my own writing and

35:18

everything and everything There we go. That

35:20

is the prompt for everyone to remember.

35:22

Okay, let's see. Any other questions? Okay,

35:24

last question. Then we'll wrap up and

35:26

then we'll also give a little plug

35:28

for seller so much, which is coming

35:30

up here in less than two months.

35:32

Last thing before we talk about seller

35:34

summit, thumbnail tip. Any tips for increasing

35:36

CTR and thumbnails? Crazy face in the

35:38

thumbnail. Yeah, you know what's funny is

35:40

I'm using this tool called VIDIQ now,

35:42

which actually. has AI rate your thumbnails

35:44

and your titles. In the thumbnails they

35:46

always say use some sort of facial

35:48

expression. And I, you know, I used

35:50

to make fun of all the YouTubeers

35:52

with the funny facial expressions, but I

35:54

actually think it works. Yeah. Here's my

35:56

unconventional advice, I guess, that most people.

35:58

don't really talk about is I choose

36:00

a theme in a color scheme for

36:03

my thumbnails so that even if someone

36:05

just sees mine like without even be

36:07

able to read the title or see

36:09

my face they know that that's from

36:11

my channel it's a little bit of

36:13

brown recognition and so I just have

36:15

a consistent look yeah for people who

36:17

haven't checked out Steve's YouTube channel

36:19

very consistent format to all

36:21

the thumbnails but different face every time

36:23

or it's just you have like a

36:25

library of 10 Chris and Steve two

36:28

faces that you're kind of recycling. So

36:30

I actually just recently changed that. I've

36:32

kind of upgraded a lot recently. I'm

36:34

now filming in 4K, which I didn't

36:36

do that before. Wow. But now what

36:38

I do is at the end of

36:40

each video, and this is why I

36:42

switched to 4K actually, at the end

36:44

of this video now. Before I was

36:46

just taking pictures of myself after, I'm

36:48

like, I don't want to do that.

36:50

So now at the end, since it's

36:52

in 4K, I just pose for like

36:54

10 seconds. And then my video editor

36:56

chooses a funny one. Okay. Just saves

36:59

time. Another Steve productivity hack for you

37:01

guys. I don't think you need

37:03

to film in 4K though, just

37:05

for anyone listening. I don't think

37:07

it's necessary. Just make stupid faces

37:09

with your iPhone. Yeah. Okay, cool.

37:11

Well, let's wrap up. Let's talk

37:14

about Cellosomet for just a minute,

37:16

because it's May 5th for Cellosomet.

37:18

It's May 6th through the 8th.

37:20

It's a conference I've been running

37:22

for like the past nine years.

37:24

I've still yet to get Dave

37:26

to come, although Mike has come

37:29

every single year, except for the

37:31

first year, I'm pretty sure he's coming

37:33

back this year. I'm going to see

37:35

him next week. You're going to work

37:38

on a small intimate event, because... I

37:40

hate large events. Like I really do

37:42

hate large events. I like going to

37:45

events where you can actually meet everyone

37:47

and everyone eats together, everyone parties

37:49

together at night, because I get kind of anxious

37:51

at events personally, where I'm like, oh my God,

37:53

who am I going to hang out with? Who

37:55

am I going to meet? It's not the case.

37:57

So, and then every session is a learning

37:59

session. like you'll come out with actionable

38:01

strategies, no one sells on stage, which

38:03

is something that I absolutely detest. And

38:06

on the first day, we actually do

38:08

a mastermind. We break up people into

38:10

groups of about 10, and we rent

38:12

rooms for everybody, and we just go

38:14

around hot seat style trying to help

38:16

each other with their businesses, and we

38:18

cater in food and that sort of

38:20

thing. And that way, you know, even

38:22

on the first day, you're already getting

38:25

to know nine other people pretty intimately

38:27

before the event even even starts. Yeah,

38:29

and I believe this during this year's

38:31

session too. You are doing some video

38:33

content as well, or some talks on

38:35

video. We are. Actually, yeah, over the

38:37

years, you know what's funny is when

38:39

we were first launching the event, a

38:42

lot of people were Amazon only. But

38:44

over the like the eight or nine

38:46

years that I've been doing this, it's

38:48

been more steering towards D to C.

38:50

And people want to know less about

38:52

Amazon and more about like how to

38:54

create a brand, which makes sense. Yeah,

38:56

it does make sense. And I think

38:59

because the Amazon playbook is kind of

39:01

out there in terms of what you

39:03

can learn, it's, you know, pretty widely

39:05

available, but the DDC playbook or even,

39:07

you know, having a brand that is

39:09

very driven by short-form video or long-form

39:11

video, that part of the e-commerce game

39:13

is still relatively unknown. The information out

39:16

there is not nearly as clear as

39:18

what it is for Amazon. Yeah, I

39:20

mean, so we'll have sessions on Tiktok,

39:22

Instagram, Facebook and YouTube and YouTube. among

39:24

a whole bunch of other things, paid

39:26

advertising, branding. A lot of sessions on

39:28

AI also, we talked about some of

39:30

the AI things here already on this

39:33

episode, but there's a lot more, especially

39:35

to do with imaging. I think the

39:37

whole modeling industry is going to go

39:39

under personally. Like you don't need to

39:41

hire models ever again, I don't think,

39:43

for any of your stuff. Okay, AI

39:45

is replacing that. Well, that's bad news

39:47

for you and I, Steve. Oh, yeah,

39:50

I know. My modeling career, you know,

39:52

we're getting old now though, Dave, so

39:54

I'm not getting as many. We still

39:56

look young. And then for speakers, a

39:58

couple that you're excited by, I've seen

40:00

Neil Patel is there. is coming I

40:02

have met him on several occasions but

40:04

never really hung out hung out I

40:07

mean that's pretty good score and then

40:09

so I think most people know Neil

40:11

Patel anybody else that you're kind of

40:13

looking forward to kind of off maybe

40:15

off the beaten track a little bit

40:17

that maybe might be a new track

40:19

here's the thing like I usually tried

40:21

to get people to speak who are

40:24

actual brand owners yeah because I want

40:26

people are in the trenches yeah actually

40:28

selling as opposed to like the faces

40:30

of like the business so I would

40:32

guess that Most of the people in

40:34

the audience probably haven't heard of a

40:36

lot of the speakers. But I do

40:38

have some guys in the industry like

40:41

Brett Curry. He's been around the block.

40:43

He runs Google advertising mainly and YouTube

40:45

advertising. Bernie and Retu. Yep. Yeah. I

40:47

love those two guys. They're both giving

40:49

AI sessions. Bernie is like an electrical

40:51

engineer. Like we have so much in

40:53

common. So we can totally relate to

40:55

each other. Let's see Isabella Ritz. I

40:58

don't know if you've I know the

41:00

audience heard or heard yeah and I think

41:02

that's it for the Amazon space for the

41:04

most part it's usually 50-50-d to see with

41:06

content sprinkled in Well, I think that's one

41:09

of the great things about seller summit. Again,

41:11

I've never had a chance to go just

41:13

because of the fact that you do it

41:15

at the absolute worst time for me, which

41:17

is like the beginning of May, which is

41:20

just typically a very hard time for me.

41:22

But everyone that I know that has gone

41:24

to seller summit, they say it's one of

41:26

two events that they go to year over

41:28

year, one of them being seller summit and

41:31

the other one being e-commerce fuel live. So

41:33

everyone that I've talked to that I've talked

41:35

to that is a regular that is a

41:37

regular. Summit says the same thing that is

41:39

one of their must-go-to events. Throughout the year,

41:42

and I think the fact also that you

41:44

do bring in some speakers that maybe people

41:46

have not heard of, that's always a big

41:48

score for me. When I can go to

41:51

a conference and hear somebody that I've never

41:53

heard before, almost always you're going to pick

41:55

up a nugget of wisdom that you haven't

41:57

heard anywhere else, just for the fact that

41:59

they are new, it's a new talk to

42:02

them that you've never talked to. You know

42:04

what I found, like the people who do

42:06

the speaking circuits, they tend not to be

42:08

the ones doing the actual work. You know,

42:10

they don't get their hands dirty on the

42:13

stuff. Yep, they're leading teams, not necessarily. Exactly.

42:15

I want the nitty gritty, that's my style.

42:17

The nitty gritty, perfect. So, yeah, either we'll

42:19

link up to sell a summit in the

42:21

show notes or just Google, sell a summit,

42:24

and beginning of May in Fort Lauderdale, Fort

42:26

Lauderdale, right? It is, Fort Lauderdale, Fort Lauderdale,

42:28

right on the right on the beach, right

42:30

on the beach. Cool Steve, thanks a lot

42:33

and I fully expect that our ecom crew

42:35

YouTube channel is going to get to 100K

42:37

within a year. If not, I'm holding you

42:39

personally accountable. It can. You just got put

42:41

in the work, Dave. I know you can

42:44

do it. I know you can do it.

42:46

I know you can do it. I do

42:48

too. All right Steve, thanks a lot man

42:50

and until the next one, happy selling. We

42:52

hope you enjoy this episode of the ecom

42:55

crew podcast. If you haven't done so already

42:57

done so already, please. Did you know that

42:59

ecom crew has a ton of free content

43:01

including e-commerce courses? Head over to ecomcrew.com/free to

43:03

check it out today. That's going to do

43:06

it for this episode of the ecom crew

43:08

podcast. Until the next one, happy selling and

43:10

we'll talk to you soon.