0:06

Before we get started with

0:08

today's episode I would like to

0:10

quickly read you our podcast

0:12

disclaimer. This podcast is

0:15

for educational purposes only

0:17

and it is not to

0:19

substitute for professional care by

0:21

a doctor or other qualified

0:24

medical professional. You should always

0:26

speak with your physician or

0:28

other health care professionals before

0:30

doing any fasting, changing your

0:33

diet in any way. taking

0:35

or adjusting any medications or

0:37

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0:40

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0:42

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the experts affiliated with this

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podcast. Any information and

1:00

statements regarding dietary supplements

1:02

have not been evaluated

1:04

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drug administration and are

1:08

not intended to diagnose,

1:11

treat, cure, or prevent

1:13

any disease. All right, and now

1:15

we'll get started with today's episode.

1:18

Welcome back to another episode of

1:21

the Fastie Method podcast. This is

1:23

Coach Terry Lance and I am

1:25

here with Coach Heather Sugar. Heather,

1:27

how are you doing today? I'm

1:29

doing great. As usual, Terry, how

1:31

are you? I'm good. I love

1:34

getting to record these with you

1:36

because it just feels like... We

1:38

just stopped somewhere and we're just

1:40

going to pick it up again

1:42

and you know keep running this

1:44

ball down the field. So very

1:46

excited about today's topic. The way

1:49

you and I decided that we

1:51

would approach it is referring to

1:53

this as the problem of

1:55

perfectionism. I feel like we need

1:58

a big drum roll or some... some

2:00

real music here. Daisy, maybe you

2:02

could put that in when you

2:04

edit. But one of the reasons

2:06

I wanted to do this topic

2:08

with you, Heather, is I can't

2:11

remember if it's a client that

2:13

we share or maybe someone in

2:15

the TFF community, but they recently

2:17

said, you know, Coach Heather told

2:19

me, maybe I needed to allow

2:21

myself to just do this and

2:23

be a little messy with it.

2:26

So she and I talked about.

2:28

getting rid of the perfectionistic approach

2:30

to fasting to eating and things.

2:32

So I have been listening to

2:34

a book that is very focused

2:36

on perfectionism and I think it's

2:38

a fantastic book so I'll bring

2:41

in some things about that. But

2:43

that's really what made me decide

2:45

to ask if you wanted to

2:47

cover this topic because I can

2:49

tell it's something that you've given

2:51

some thought to and have some

2:53

experience with. Terry, I can't even

2:56

tell you how many clients I

2:58

have had to say, be willing

3:00

to do it messy. So often

3:02

clients come to us and they

3:04

expect to be expert beginners. And

3:06

that's an oxymoron. That doesn't exist.

3:08

When you start something new, you

3:11

aren't going to be perfect. That's

3:13

the whole point. You're a beginner.

3:15

You have to try and fail

3:17

and try again before you can

3:19

develop mastery. And the beauty of

3:21

lifestyle change is you get benefit

3:23

in the trying. So even if

3:26

it is a little messy, you're

3:28

still moving forward in your journey.

3:30

And that's really what we're all

3:32

here to do. I love that

3:34

way of thinking about it, that

3:36

there's benefit when it's not perfect.

3:38

And I, too, with clients and

3:41

community members, hear that theme so

3:43

often that I should already be

3:45

perfect at this. It's like, how?

3:47

I started fasting, let me think,

3:49

I don't know, like eight years

3:51

ago, and I'm still refining it,

3:53

I'm still learning new things. Sometimes

3:56

my fast are complicated and they

3:58

don't work real well and other

4:00

times I feel like I'm on

4:02

top of the world But if

4:04

I use that lens of perfectionism,

4:06

I would never do another one

4:08

again Because the odds of me

4:11

having a perfect fast and doing

4:13

it perfectly is pretty darn slim

4:15

Exactly and the other thing that

4:17

I see that's in that same

4:19

vein is you'll see people that

4:21

start the fasting method as recommended.

4:23

We start about starting at the

4:26

low end of the fasting dial

4:28

and gradually moving yourself up. So

4:30

they'll start with T.R.E. Time restricted

4:32

eating. They'll be eating two meals

4:34

a day with no snacking. Everything's

4:36

going great. And they're like, okay,

4:39

I've done that a week. Let's

4:41

go ahead and ramp up to,

4:43

you know, 24 hour fasts. O'mad's,

4:45

one meal a day. All the

4:47

acronyms, right. and they'll do that

4:49

for a week and they'll be

4:51

like okay got that move on

4:54

and you'll see them ramping up

4:56

the fasting dial because if it's

4:58

a little as good more's better

5:00

and they'll keep moving the goalpost

5:02

on themselves and making it more

5:04

and more difficult until they burn

5:06

out and they get overwhelmed and

5:09

they quit and what benefit did

5:11

that do them part of being

5:13

the beginner part of accepting that

5:15

this is going to be messy

5:17

is also accepting that it's going

5:19

to take a little time to

5:21

get up to, you know, the

5:24

pace of something like 342 a

5:26

week, which is a very intense

5:28

therapeutic fast. And so being willing

5:30

to kind of sit with things

5:32

a little bit longer is part

5:34

of being a beginner and taking

5:36

your time and not expecting to

5:39

be a perfect A student right

5:41

out of the gate. Yeah, that's

5:43

a really good point. This idea

5:45

that this idea that Because in

5:47

order to succeed with us, I

5:49

must become perfect. Even if I

5:51

accept that I might not begin

5:54

as perfect, I must become perfect.

5:56

We just keep moving that goalpost.

5:58

Go faster. Get there sooner. It

6:00

looks like this. Oh, wait, no,

6:02

it looks like this. like this.

6:04

And often in doing so, we're

6:06

not even paying attention to what's

6:09

actually working, what's actually not working,

6:11

what are the things that are

6:13

causing interference. We are just holding

6:15

ourselves to a timeline. And I

6:17

think that's part for many of

6:19

us of a perfectionism piece about

6:21

this. There's a right amount of

6:24

time. Sometimes it's challenging for me

6:26

here at the podcast or in

6:28

community meetings because people want to

6:30

know, well, how long will this

6:32

take? I heard Coach Heather say

6:34

it took her this amount. It's

6:36

like a poker game. I'm going

6:39

to see your six months and

6:41

I'm going to raise it. I'm

6:43

going to do four and a

6:45

half months. And again, that somehow

6:47

getting there faster is the goal.

6:49

Taking less time to achieve my

6:51

goal is even better. I often

6:54

hear people falling into that. trap

6:56

of perfectionism. Oh my gosh, yes.

6:58

And you know, back to my

7:00

example about moving the gold post,

7:02

a lot of times because they've

7:04

heard people say, three forty-two is

7:06

a gold standard, they want to

7:09

get there as fast as possible

7:11

so they can gold standard their

7:13

way, you know, across their finish

7:15

line in six months flat. And

7:17

yeah, I'm part of the problem.

7:19

I admit it. But I think

7:21

what people don't think about or

7:24

remember about my story is that

7:26

I was fasting on and off

7:28

for two years before I joined

7:30

this community this community. and was

7:32

able to start that therapeutic fasting.

7:34

So there was a whole lot

7:36

of omads before I started therapeutic

7:39

fastic regimen. So let's just clear

7:41

the air on that. But having

7:43

this kind of unrealistic expectation that

7:45

you're gonna be perfect on point

7:47

six months straight with no vacations,

7:49

no birthdays, no nothing getting in

7:51

the way between you doing everything

7:54

perfectly is just. unrealistic and so

7:56

often pacing is such a huge

7:58

issue for people and what makes

8:00

people want to quit out of

8:02

frustration. And so I think managing

8:04

those expectations around pacing is really

8:06

important, and the perfectionists are the

8:09

ones that it's hardest with, because

8:11

they think, well, I'm just going

8:13

to do everything right, and then

8:15

I will go as fast as

8:17

it, you know, is supposed to,

8:19

careful with what is supposed to

8:22

happen, because what is supposed to

8:24

happen, because there's no prescription there,

8:26

and what's supposed to happen, what

8:28

happens happens. So I mentioned earlier,

8:30

one of the other reasons that

8:32

I wanted to have this conversation

8:34

with you today is I'm reading

8:37

a book. and I know you

8:39

should never explain a book before

8:41

you finish reading it, but I'm

8:43

so excited about this topic. So

8:45

look out, y'all will probably be

8:47

hearing a lot more about it.

8:49

But it's a book called Finnish,

8:52

and the author's whole point so

8:54

far really is that the challenge

8:56

with people reaching their goals. He

8:58

used to think it was a

9:00

problem of not starting. And so

9:02

we taught people how to start,

9:04

how to get started when you

9:07

have a goal. If you want

9:09

to write a book, sit down

9:11

and write the first three pages

9:13

and then you'll just take off.

9:15

But he realized more recently and

9:17

really studying it and reflecting on

9:19

it, the bigger problem is not

9:22

finishing. And in reality, many of

9:24

us are really good at starting

9:26

goals. I cannot even tell you

9:28

how many craft projects I have

9:30

gotten so excited about doing. I

9:32

buy the supplies and I do

9:34

about a half hour and then

9:37

I never do it again. I

9:39

have so many blankets that I

9:41

started making at one point. They

9:43

have moved with me like seven

9:45

times since I started them, but

9:47

many of us have a problem

9:49

of finishing. And his message really

9:52

is about the reason we don't

9:54

finish is because of our perfectionistic

9:56

expectations. I don't remember, he shared

9:58

some statistics early on about New

10:00

Year's resolutions, goal setting, and goal

10:02

completion in general, and I think

10:04

he said 92% of people do

10:07

not complete their goals. 92%. Those

10:09

don't sound like good odds for

10:11

us, do they? So the reality

10:13

is, that's why I wanted to

10:15

have this conversation, I think we

10:17

need to keep learning how to

10:19

get out of our own way

10:22

and work on allowing ourselves to

10:24

complete the things that are important

10:26

to us. The biggest thing to

10:28

do to complete things is to

10:30

stop expecting ourselves to be perfect.

10:32

Many of us already know this,

10:34

but when it comes back to

10:37

the New Year's resolutions, I know

10:39

we're a little bit past the

10:41

New Year's time now, but one

10:43

of the reasons so many of

10:45

us don't make much progress is

10:47

because they're unrealistic goals to start

10:49

with. We aim for the moon,

10:51

because we've been told that we

10:53

should, and at least we'll hit

10:56

some good spots along the way.

10:58

Right? But it's the good spots

11:00

along the way that we really

11:02

should be aiming for. And so

11:04

in this book, he really addresses

11:06

how to help us start to

11:08

change from setting unrealistic expectations and

11:10

learning to follow through. And there's

11:12

this phrase that he uses the

11:14

day after perfection. And I think

11:17

what he's referring to by how

11:19

he uses it is the day

11:21

we realize we aren't perfect at

11:23

this. it all stops. And that's

11:25

the day we need to continue.

11:27

So when I think of TFF,

11:29

the day I don't complete my

11:31

24-hour fast, that's the time to

11:33

keep going. But when we have

11:36

a perfectionistic motivation, we just see

11:38

it as all lost, all done.

11:40

Obviously we're not going to succeed

11:42

because we didn't do that. And

11:44

he gives all kinds of great

11:46

examples in the book about... how

11:48

he's experiences and how others that

11:50

he works with experiences, but that

11:52

idea that we expected to go

11:55

and every day be just right

11:57

and every time we attempt our

11:59

fast or every meal we eat

12:01

will be just right and when

12:03

we realize it's not we throw

12:05

in the towel. I know our

12:07

listeners can't see but you're nodding

12:09

as you're listening to me so

12:11

I'm curious. Have you experienced that

12:14

before? Oh goodness. Well first of

12:16

all I certainly have and it

12:18

is something that many of my

12:20

clients deal with. They just expected

12:22

themselves to be able to change

12:24

a lifetime worth of habits on

12:26

a dime. And they're like, I

12:28

can't believe I couldn't just change

12:30

my entire way of eating and

12:33

fast three times a week in

12:35

exercise every day and meditate and

12:37

get to sleep on time. And

12:39

this whole laundry list of things

12:41

that we talk about being important

12:43

for health. And they're like, I

12:45

can't believe I just can't do

12:47

all of this stuff. Really? You

12:49

can't? Yeah, and done it for

12:52

the past 40 years. You thought

12:54

that a couple weeks. would be

12:56

all you needed? Give yourself a

12:58

little grace! But Heather, if I

13:00

do it perfectly, yes, it will

13:02

only take that long if I

13:04

do it perfectly. Yeah. Well, friend,

13:06

you ain't perfect. I'm sorry if

13:08

I'm the first one to say

13:10

it, but you are not perfect.

13:13

Not a single one of us

13:15

are. And the beauty is, you

13:17

don't have to be. as evidenced

13:19

by Terry's experience, my experience, you

13:21

get to reach goals whilst being

13:23

imperfect. Isn't that liberating? Isn't that

13:25

exciting? So, you know, on the

13:27

note that you were talking about

13:29

how people run into the issue

13:32

of they have that day where

13:34

they're like, oh no, I didn't

13:36

do the thing. I see that

13:38

a lot when people try to

13:40

do streaks, right? They'll do something

13:42

and they'll be like, I'm going

13:44

to exercise every single day. And

13:46

then the day that they miss,

13:48

they're like, well, I didn't do

13:51

it, so I guess I'm just

13:53

not going to exercise anymore. What

13:55

a terrible frame. And you know,

13:57

as someone who is into that,

13:59

I see it, I know what

14:01

the impetus is. You want to

14:03

have a string of things and

14:05

be able to say, I did

14:07

this for a month or six

14:10

months or a year, and once

14:12

you can't say that anymore, it

14:14

somehow loses its value? Sure, sorry,

14:16

I used to use Duolingo to

14:18

learn Spanish, you know, in the

14:20

health clinic that I worked at,

14:22

it was a large Hispanic population,

14:24

I wanted to learn the language.

14:26

And so I did my Duolango,

14:29

I had a 351 day one

14:31

day one day streak one day

14:33

streak. And I was in Houston,

14:35

I didn't have access to Wi-Fi,

14:37

and I lost the streak, didn't

14:39

pick up dual lingo ever again.

14:41

So how foolish! Right? I was

14:43

kind of making momentum in learning

14:45

the language, and I quit because

14:47

of some app, that's ridiculous. And

14:50

yet those are the kinds of

14:52

choices that we make, which are

14:54

just silly. I'm going to call

14:56

it myself, silly. because of course

14:58

I didn't lose 351 days of

15:00

Spanish lessons by missing one day.

15:02

And so for people that are

15:04

trying to change their way of

15:06

eating or exercise or introduce fasting,

15:09

by missing one day, you don't

15:11

lose momentum of all those other

15:13

days. So I love that. framework

15:15

that you brought up from the

15:17

book, Terry, that it doesn't matter

15:19

that you missed a day, it

15:21

matters what you do the day

15:23

after. It matters how quickly you

15:25

get back on the saddle and

15:28

keep riding. Yes, I think this

15:30

streaks analogy is so important because,

15:32

as you said, what we highlight

15:34

instead of 351 days of learning,

15:36

you're highlighting one day. and somehow

15:38

now you don't get credit for

15:40

all of that growth you've experienced.

15:42

Clearly, you probably know some Spanish

15:44

by then, but nope, you don't

15:47

get credit, and clearly you should

15:49

not go on. I think another

15:51

piece... that I'm aware of as

15:53

we're talking about this is that

15:55

for so many of us, we

15:57

do already have an awareness that

15:59

we can't do it perfectly. And

16:01

so we struggle to get started,

16:03

we struggle to maintain, and we've

16:06

already identified ourselves as someone who

16:08

can't do this. Yet it's our

16:10

goal. It's what's so important to

16:12

us, but because we see ourselves

16:14

of someone who can't make that

16:16

streak forever, forever. can't do it

16:18

perfectly. There's really no sense in

16:20

doing it at all. So I

16:22

just want to keep reiterating that

16:25

point. In his book, the author,

16:27

I didn't mention his name, is

16:29

John Aikoff, and the book again

16:31

is called Finnish. He shares a

16:33

recommendation, it's kind of a twofold

16:35

recommendation, that I think most perfectionists

16:37

at this point would stop listening

16:39

to his book, would say that

16:41

man is ridiculous. I will not

16:43

read that book. I am fine

16:46

doing what I'm doing, but what

16:48

he encourages to help us eliminate

16:50

some of this perfectionism around reaching

16:52

our goal is one of two

16:54

options. Cut the goal in half

16:56

or double the time frame in

16:58

which we expect to reach the

17:00

goal. So around weight loss, I

17:02

can't again quantify how many times

17:05

I've heard someone in our community

17:07

say I'm turning 50 next year,

17:09

I turn 65 in September, and

17:11

I need to lose 65 pounds

17:13

by then, or I need to

17:15

lose 50 pounds by then, or

17:17

whatever it is. And so I

17:19

think what he would encourage in

17:21

this point, and again, this is

17:24

not, I have three weeks to

17:26

lose 60 pounds, but he would

17:28

say cut it in half. He

17:30

did some studies and gathered some

17:32

information on a 30-day goal setting

17:34

thing that he runs and online.

17:36

group and people set their goal

17:38

and the people who their goal

17:40

in half, not only reached their

17:43

goal but exceeded it, and those

17:45

who did not cut their goal

17:47

in half, did probably less than

17:49

half. So it's really telling of

17:51

the impact of that. So cutting

17:53

your goal in half, so this

17:55

person who must lose 65 pounds

17:57

by their birthday next September, they

17:59

could cut that back to, I'm

18:02

going to lose 32 pounds. Something

18:04

that's more feasible. Because again. Oftentimes

18:06

we set our goals expecting perfection.

18:08

We underestimate how long things take.

18:10

We underestimate the amount of work

18:12

we'll have to do. And so

18:14

we set a really short timeline.

18:16

So again, the flip side of

18:18

this, if you don't want to

18:21

cut the goal in half, is

18:23

extend to the time frame, double

18:25

the time frame. So that same

18:27

person could say, I want to

18:29

lose 65 pounds. in 18 months,

18:31

my next birthday, my 66th birthday,

18:33

but to double that length of

18:35

time. So I'm curious what your

18:37

thoughts are about those suggestions and

18:39

how they might help with our

18:42

perfectionistic tendencies. Terry, I love that

18:44

so much. I am absolutely going

18:46

to be using that with my

18:48

clients because managing pacing expectations is

18:50

such a big part. of what

18:52

we do as coaches, I would

18:54

say, right? The support, the accountability,

18:56

and the keep going. I can't

18:58

tell you how many times I

19:01

have clients saying it's just not

19:03

working, it's just not going fast

19:05

enough, and I'll be like, okay.

19:07

Well, how much weight have you

19:09

lost this month? And they'll be

19:11

like eight pounds. I'm like, well,

19:13

what was your expectation, right? Half

19:15

a pound to two pounds a

19:17

week. You're doing the max. You're

19:20

doing amazing. So even when they're

19:22

exceeding or at the top end

19:24

of expectations, they don't even feel

19:26

like they're being successful because they

19:28

have this distorted view of. how

19:30

long this stuff should take. A

19:32

lot of times I think that

19:34

is, is because many of us

19:36

only have that experience of losing

19:39

weight within the first few weeks,

19:41

right, when you have that big

19:43

swoosh of water weight, and so

19:45

you think, oh, well, that's how

19:47

much weight I couldn't lose. So

19:49

if I were to keep doing

19:51

this, which most people don't, right,

19:53

they quit after two weeks, we

19:55

already established that. But if I

19:58

keep doing, I'll just have these

20:00

big whooshes weeks after weeks. And

20:02

of course, that's not how this

20:04

works. You know, fat burning takes

20:06

much longer than whooshing than water

20:08

changes take. And so yeah, a

20:10

big part of what I do

20:12

when I'm meeting with people is

20:14

saying, you know, hey, this is

20:16

going to be harder than you

20:19

think it's going to be messy

20:21

and it's going to take longer

20:23

than you want it to. And

20:25

logically we should all recognize that

20:27

to be true based on the

20:29

failure rate, based on the fact

20:31

that so many people don't succeed.

20:33

So logic dictates if it were

20:35

easy, so many more people would

20:38

be successful. But somehow people don't

20:40

have a good concept of applying

20:42

statistics to themselves. They're like, okay,

20:44

well, it's hard for 97% of

20:46

people, but me, it's going to

20:48

be fine. And I'm going to

20:50

do it at the top rate.

20:52

How about you just go ahead

20:54

and accept that you're a human

20:57

being too? It's going to take

20:59

you a long time too. And

21:01

if you're willing to accept that

21:03

it's going to take longer than

21:05

you wanted to and keep going,

21:07

then your odds of success increase

21:09

exponentially. If you quit, they dropped

21:11

a zero. Absolutely. And along the

21:13

way, if you keep going, this

21:16

topic you and I talk about

21:18

so often is you're building sustainable

21:20

habits versus just reaching your goal,

21:22

just creating the outcome. You're building

21:24

the lifestyle. And I know how

21:26

this has been really important in

21:28

your own journey. It wasn't just

21:30

getting to goal that was important.

21:32

It's maintaining the progress that you've

21:35

made by having a lifestyle. And

21:37

again, I feel like with the

21:39

fasting piece, some of us struggle

21:41

so much with giving ourselves credit.

21:43

I plan to do a 42

21:45

today. I stopped at 28. It's

21:47

all or nothing. If it wasn't

21:49

42, it doesn't count. That's just

21:51

so not true. You benefited from

21:54

the 28. So I hope that

21:56

after listening to us today, people

21:58

will practice giving credit for what

22:00

they have done. not for what

22:02

they haven't done, what they didn't

22:04

do perfectly, but seeing that moving

22:06

forward, as you said earlier, those

22:08

things that happen along the way

22:10

is the progress and that is

22:12

the way to get to school.

22:15

Terry, I mean, this is why

22:17

you are who you are. That

22:19

is just so fundamentally true that

22:21

perfect point if you rush through

22:23

this thing and get there as

22:25

fast as you really want to,

22:27

the chances that you're going to

22:29

have adjusted the habits that you

22:31

needed to adjust permanently are much

22:34

lower. So it's almost a good

22:36

idea to embrace the fact that

22:38

it's going to take a long

22:40

time because you will gradually move

22:42

to the type of person that

22:44

you need to be in order

22:46

to maintain this new lifestyle. And

22:48

when it comes to habit change,

22:50

as you mentioned, one of the

22:53

most important things that you need

22:55

to do to create a new

22:57

habit is to celebrate the inputs,

22:59

right? You do something that moves

23:01

you in the right direction. You

23:03

celebrate yourself for doing it. You

23:05

don't beat yourself up for the

23:07

stuff that you don't do. That

23:09

doesn't build new habits. You celebrate

23:12

what you should be doing. You

23:14

can also celebrate yourself for not

23:16

doing the things that you're trying

23:18

not to do. That's also a

23:20

habit building technique. But the habits

23:22

are formed in the celebration and

23:24

the reward and the feeling good

23:26

about the movement forward, not in

23:28

any self-flagellation about being less than

23:31

perfect. None of us are perfect,

23:33

none of us will be. So

23:35

every little movement

23:37

forward that you

23:39

celebrate you getting

23:41

you closer and

23:43

closer to becoming

23:45

the person you're

23:47

trying to be,

23:50

the healthy person

23:52

with these new

23:54

lifestyle changes healthy can

23:56

hopefully serve you

23:58

till the end

24:00

of your days.

24:02

that to sum

24:04

that up serve you

24:06

the problem of

24:08

perfectionism, it is

24:11

the killer of

24:13

a long -term lifestyle.

24:15

it is the killer of a

24:17

long-term look forward

24:19

to talking to

24:21

you again soon,

24:23

Heather, you and I

24:25

hope our listeners

24:27

take good care.

24:30

care. as everybody. good

24:32

choices everybody.