0:00

In this episode of the

0:02

full nerd, Rhysons burning

0:04

up baby and Battlemation

0:06

December? Question mark? If

0:08

you couldn't hear that in

0:10

my voice. And I like

0:12

the question mark there, that

0:14

was good. And welcome to

0:16

episode 325 of the full

0:19

nerd. PC World's weekly podcast

0:21

about PC building news. I'm

0:23

your villain host, Adam Patrick

0:25

Murray, but I am joined.

0:27

by some amazing people. I'm going

0:30

to call you amazing people.

0:32

The first amazing person here

0:34

on the screen is Brad

0:36

Charkas. Oh, well thank you.

0:38

I would consider myself just

0:40

a guy, but hello Adam, hello

0:42

internet. Just a guy. Brad, just

0:45

the guy, Brad, oh, we're talking about

0:47

Blue Sky, is your handle,

0:49

just Brad Charkas? Yep, same

0:51

thing on Twitter and Blue

0:53

Chalko. Should you miss an

0:55

opportunity there. I had to

0:57

have my accounts verified on

0:59

Twitter and Facebook and Instagram back

1:01

in the day because people kept

1:03

running crypto scams in my name.

1:06

Oh, I tried to lock down

1:08

the official. All right, well if

1:10

you're on Blue Sky you should

1:12

definitely follow Brad Charkas and PC

1:14

World and hopefully soon the full

1:16

nerd. You know who else you

1:19

should also follow on Blue Sky

1:21

is Will Smith? Hello Will. Hi,

1:23

I'm just got on people.

1:25

Yeah. It's good to be

1:27

here. Thanks for having me.

1:29

Yeah. And then controlling the

1:31

verticals and horizontals is Willis Lie.

1:34

Hello, hello everyone. Happy Tuesday. I

1:36

need a new handle for Blue

1:38

Sky. What would it be? Willis.

1:40

Willis 4K. Willis dot 4K. Yeah.

1:42

So. Yeah, or early on in my internet

1:45

life, I definitely had a handle, but

1:47

now, like, now I've pretty much just

1:49

been my name for the past, I

1:51

don't know, two decades. What do you

1:53

guys feel? Do you, do you like

1:55

having your, your, your actual public name?

1:57

Like, because you, you just don't want

1:59

to do what? Willis lie? I've done

2:01

it for professional work media cases. I

2:03

think for this one, I don't know.

2:06

One of the Instagram I'm making is

2:08

for food, you know, related. So I

2:10

think I changed it to Willis eats

2:12

everything. Willis eats everything. I mean, you

2:14

can get a lot of domains right

2:17

now. You can get dot l-o-l for

2:19

299. Willis lie. l-l-l-l-l-l-l is available. It

2:21

might be taken, that's a hot one.

2:23

That is a hot name. Speaking of...

2:26

Speaking of hot ones, speaking of hot

2:28

ones, we have my little accessory box

2:30

here. It's only got one item in

2:32

it today. I was worried you had

2:35

hot sauce there for a minute. No,

2:37

no, no, no, no. I'm going to

2:39

let you do the honors of what's

2:41

in this accessory box, because it relates

2:43

to these boxes here. This feels... Oh!

2:46

The suspense! You didn't know what I

2:48

put in there. You were supposed to,

2:50

you know... No, no, it's like, yachtsi.

2:52

Oh. You use the thing for the

2:55

yachtsi? I just throw it on the

2:57

table. Yachtsi! Yeah. Yeah, over, oh for

2:59

oh. What is that? It is a

3:01

die. This one is a D8, I

3:03

think. Yeah, yeah, that's an eight. Not

3:06

only is it any dice dice. I

3:08

have in front of any dicey. One

3:10

of dice. is a gamers nexus die

3:12

set. Wait, is this a product placement

3:15

bit? Yes, Steve handed a bunch of

3:17

money to me and I'm placing his

3:19

product on the full nerd. So there

3:21

you go, full nerd today brought to

3:23

you by gamers nexus die sets. I

3:26

got two die sets. This one is

3:28

the cat. So the thing is, I'm

3:30

not somebody who plays with dice. I

3:32

don't do D&D. Are you ever getting

3:35

a D&D, Brad? Oh yeah, me my

3:37

girlfriend and my kids were into it.

3:39

Do you have a lot of dice

3:41

sets around then? Uh, four or five?

3:44

And I'm actually thinking about buying that

3:46

exact dice set for my daughter for

3:48

Christmas. She doesn't watch a show, so

3:50

it's not a spoiler. I actually have

3:52

an extra one, so I'll send it

3:55

out. So I've only ever played D&D

3:57

virtually. Like I started playing during the

3:59

pandemic, and we played virtual dice. So

4:01

we were just hitting a button, and

4:04

it would tell us what the numbers

4:06

were. So I've never thrown a real,

4:08

I mean I've thrown a real D20

4:10

before, but not for this type of.

4:12

Well yeah like I mean I played

4:15

I played D&D for so long I

4:17

used to be I set up like

4:19

a dice rolling pot in IRC chat

4:21

rooms back in like the 90s so

4:24

we could play virtually over IRC. Nice

4:26

and I'll say yeah, I mean I've

4:28

been to plenty of like conventions and

4:30

stuff where you just like always like

4:32

Random tables just full of buckets of

4:35

dice, you know, and for me It's

4:37

always just been a diamond dozen kind

4:39

of thing, but like these are these

4:41

are nice dice set Not only is

4:44

it come with a dice these two

4:46

come with I almost said world of

4:48

warcraft. It's not world war. There's magic

4:50

the gathering cards. Yeah magic the gathering

4:53

cards. One of them is a CEO

4:55

snowflake very important the other one is

4:57

a custom-made goblin wait does he have

4:59

the cat in charge of the company

5:01

for tax purposes you think that's something

5:04

you're gonna have to talk to Steve

5:06

about okay okay but yeah so it's

5:08

it's it's it's the die set I

5:10

will say I do have a little

5:13

bit of a grievance Steve if you're

5:15

watching I'm you might get a call

5:17

from our lawyers because the PC world

5:19

power symbol is engraved on the top

5:21

here and I don't think our lawyers

5:24

are gonna like that Yeah, see that's

5:26

PC world right there. I don't think

5:28

that's a PC world registered. I don't

5:30

want to be the guy here. Since

5:33

1983, PC world has used the power

5:35

symbol. Now you're playing with power. So,

5:37

you know, that's what we always say

5:39

here. We'll see. So yeah, this is

5:42

the snowflake one. It comes to, yeah,

5:44

so it comes in here. It has

5:46

a little padding things, but I took

5:48

them out. It has this little lid.

5:50

It's like a weird divider thing. I'm

5:53

not quite sure what that's for, but

5:55

maybe because I'm not into dice. Keeps

5:57

them from around. But then yeah, there's

5:59

seven. What is this? Is that? No.

6:02

One, two, three, four, five, six, seven.

6:04

Yes, seven dice in here. Everything from

6:06

a D20 to a D4? No. Okay.

6:08

I have a question. And yes, inside

6:10

each one of these dice is a

6:13

little snowflake. There's a cat. a little

6:15

cat but it's it's not set it

6:17

looks like it's gonna make it roll

6:19

weird because they're not centered you know

6:22

if you watch Steve's announcement video he

6:24

said he did a ton of testing

6:26

and and you know you know if

6:28

there's somebody who likes to test it's

6:30

definitely Steve look I know that Steve

6:33

likes to test but like usually so

6:35

can I can I do my thing

6:37

I hit my normal D20 here. Okay,

6:39

here we go. Uh, yeah, so wait,

6:42

wait, wait, wait, real quick. Just tell

6:44

people what you're doing. So for audio

6:46

listeners, this is a standard, it's just

6:48

a purple D20, I got it at

6:51

a conference at one point. A dime

6:53

it doesn't kind of one, right? It's

6:55

just a, yeah, you got a bag

6:57

full of them and it's just random.

6:59

Oh, well, okay. So, so you spin

7:02

this, it'll just, it'll just spin like

7:04

a spin like a spin like a

7:06

spin like a top if you do

7:08

like a top if you do like

7:11

a top if you do it, like

7:13

a top if you do it, like

7:15

a top if you do it, like

7:17

a top if you do it, like

7:19

a top if you do it, like

7:22

a top if you do it, like

7:24

a top if you do it, like

7:26

a top if you do it, like

7:28

a top if you do it, like

7:31

a top if you do it, like

7:33

a top if you That goes pretty

7:35

good. Yeah, it goes pretty good. That

7:37

was a bad spin, too. I hope

7:39

I hit a bounce. Try to spin

7:42

it, yeah, right? Oh, yeah, that's good.

7:44

Okay, so that's one good spin. That's

7:46

a kind of spin that just like

7:48

mesmerizes you. Yeah, I see I can't.

7:51

Wait, is this also a D20? This

7:53

is a D20, and it's wobbly, D20s.

7:55

I don't know about this. I don't

7:57

know if I would use this in

8:00

tournament play is what I'm saying. I

8:02

will say the only the only other

8:04

thing and somebody asks us in chat

8:06

is if it's sharp These are very

8:08

sharp. So I do wonder So this

8:11

d20 has very rounded corners. So I

8:13

wonder if that adds to yeah, because

8:15

this this one is a good one

8:17

there. Oh, you got a good one.

8:20

Maybe I just have to get the

8:22

cat on the right axis. It's still

8:24

a little wobbly Okay, but that's okay.

8:26

So it's okay. I feel better about

8:28

this now. I couldn't get it to

8:31

work today. The one with the coil

8:33

generated magnetic fields and I think jacked

8:35

up an SSD last year. Yeah, hi.

8:37

I'm not, I'm not into dice, but

8:40

I'm into cats. Yeah. So I really

8:42

like having these dice around. And you

8:44

know, if we ever need to make

8:46

a decision like, hey, what do we,

8:49

what do we, what do we think

8:51

the RTX 40 series or 50 series

8:53

is going to cost? We just do

8:55

a die roll roll roll roll roll

8:57

roll roll roll roll. Just throw all

9:00

of them up. So here throw two

9:02

to do the multiplier. That's the thing

9:04

here's a here's a d10 and there's

9:06

your there's your okay. Yeah, well, which

9:09

one do we do first? Doesn't matter.

9:11

Okay. Well, let's do this as a

9:13

d20 landed on 15 times eight times

9:15

eight So that's a $1,200 15 times

9:17

eight equals No, that's a hundred and

9:20

fifty no 15 eight eight Yeah, 15

9:22

times 8, that's what I did. I'm

9:24

saying is $150. I would take a

9:26

$50.90 for that. Yeah, or no, no,

9:29

let's let's add a zero on to

9:31

it. So $150, $80 is a $50,90

9:33

as according to Gameers Nexus. Yeah. So

9:35

there you go. I wonder if you

9:37

roll a certain number, will you magically

9:40

summon Steve? So like the 20 on

9:42

here, I don't know if it's always

9:44

the highest number, but I'm going to

9:46

assume it is. Has a little GN

9:49

logo on it. Okay. So yeah, I'm

9:51

going to say if you land on

9:53

that GN logo, then Steve does show

9:55

up. Okay. Also, there is a there

9:58

is an interesting smell to the set.

10:00

I can neither confirm nor deny that

10:02

this is the same smell of Steve's

10:04

hair spray. Wow. Because I know he

10:06

packaged all these. So. Yeah, I'm not

10:09

gonna I'm like all these really all

10:11

of these by hand Wow, maybe maybe

10:13

while he was doing it He was

10:15

just you know like touching up his

10:18

hair spray a little bit If that

10:20

is the smell of his hair I'm

10:22

not going to confirm tonight. And yes,

10:24

thank you, Deatus, trust my nose on

10:26

things because I do like to smell

10:29

things. Speaking of smelling things, I would

10:31

have loved to smell what a burnt

10:33

up 900x3D smelled like. No, no, no.

10:35

Did it really catch on fire? I

10:38

didn't, I didn't, uh... Yeah, so, yeah,

10:40

look at this. So, our first topic,

10:42

oh, side note, it's kind of a

10:44

slow week, you know, not a ton

10:46

of stuff going on, so, you know,

10:49

we had to take a little bit

10:51

to what we're going to talk about,

10:53

but... Never apologize. Yeah, well this first

10:55

story is about a rising 7-9800X3D that

10:58

ran too hot, ran too close to

11:00

the sun and burnt out. And at

11:02

first, I feel like everyone was like

11:04

bracing themselves because if you remember, when

11:07

the 7800X3D came out, There were some

11:09

voltage issues that led to, you know,

11:11

actual bubbles on CPUs and motherboards burning

11:13

up. I have a link in the

11:15

chat or in the description to a

11:18

video cards article where it was first

11:20

reported that I could tell about, yeah,

11:22

this ready user that has some very

11:24

obvious burn marks, not only on their

11:27

CPU, but also on the socket itself.

11:29

And I feel like a lot of

11:31

people were like, oh no. Here it

11:33

is again. So, but, and then even,

11:35

even, even MSI sent out a statement.

11:38

I should have linked to it here,

11:40

but MSI was like, oh, hey, we

11:42

really care about the quality of our

11:44

motherboards. We're looking into it with Steve

11:47

from Gameers' Nexus, so you know, they're

11:49

serious. I think Steve even purchased it

11:51

from the, the, the editor, just to

11:53

do some. There was actually, there were

11:56

actually two reports of this. There was

11:58

one. on a Chinese forum called Quasar

12:00

Zone. I missed that one. Yeah, Steve

12:02

bought the one off the rentic guy.

12:04

The interesting part about this is that

12:07

they were both MSIs, MAGX, 870, Tamahawk,

12:09

Wi-Fi, Motherboard. So both are tied to

12:11

that motherboard. I spent this morning looking

12:13

at the actual pictures, and if you

12:16

look at the actual pictures, like. I

12:18

can understand why everybody's worried about this.

12:20

We had the issue with last gen

12:22

where I think it was pretty, it

12:24

was across the board, but it was

12:27

largely issues, wrong motherboards that had the

12:29

voltage SOC issues. And then obviously the

12:31

whole Intel thing. But looking at these,

12:33

there's some damage around the outside of

12:36

the bracket, like the plastic part on

12:38

the outside of the brace on both

12:40

of them. And I think if this

12:42

was a widespread issue. We would have

12:44

seen many more of this by now.

12:47

Does it do you do what's the

12:49

is the theory that they put the

12:51

CPU in upside down and No, the

12:53

the theory is that the he didn't

12:56

properly seat the CPU because a little

12:58

plastic piece was kind of poking out

13:00

So it wasn't properly properly seated Led

13:02

to you know, I'm weird short. Yeah

13:05

some some sort of shortage issues which

13:07

you know led to the the burning

13:09

of the socket and the CPU it's

13:11

probably fine you buff that off it'll

13:13

work out either one of them posted

13:16

so yeah and that's a big difference

13:18

from the asus ones from last year

13:20

to like the asus the SOC voltage

13:22

issue is something that popped up after

13:25

several weeks several months of time because

13:27

it was just feeding too much voltage

13:29

over too long of a period well

13:31

these they both have huh oh no

13:33

go ahead sorry These they both have

13:36

damage you can see on the the

13:38

plastic bit at the outside of the

13:40

socket both on the top and on

13:42

one of the sides It could be

13:45

user error who knows I don't want

13:47

to cast blame on people without knowing

13:49

what's going on But if those came

13:51

like that from the manufacturer it could

13:53

throw it off by a couple degrees

13:56

and then when you wedge in You

13:58

would still be able to clamp down

14:00

with the retainer spring or whatever you

14:02

call it and if it's just off

14:04

a couple of degrees I could see

14:07

something like this happening. Also chat

14:09

saying the the pins are bent

14:11

on both boards it sounds like

14:13

it seems like it's some sort

14:15

of could be a mixture of

14:17

the MSI board coming with with

14:20

problems and then the the user

14:22

kind of slotting it in and

14:24

not realizing what they had done

14:26

so yeah I think excuse me. I

14:29

think either way it does warrant further investigation

14:31

that's for sure. I don't know how how

14:33

deep of knowledge that these these people who

14:35

had these CPs are but I would say

14:38

for a normal person just building a PC

14:40

I mean you just you just slam it

14:42

in there like I don't inspect every socket

14:44

that I have to be like I mean

14:46

you can tell if there's like bent pins

14:49

but immediately if a pin's but yeah yeah

14:51

you see that but other than that you

14:53

know like I'm not checking the plastic bits

14:55

around the edge or anything like that you

14:57

just kind of putting it in and

15:00

going, at least for me.

15:02

I've never seen this little,

15:04

like for people who are,

15:06

if you want to look

15:08

this up, you can search

15:10

for the motherboard model, MSI,

15:12

Tomahawk, X870, burn. I have

15:14

a link in the, and

15:16

there's a link in the,

15:18

there's a link in the,

15:21

there's a link in the,

15:23

like a faulty socket maybe.

15:25

It's hard to say. I don't

15:27

know. like there's oh yeah yeah yeah so

15:29

it's like maybe they didn't have it quite

15:31

lined up and then smashed it in with

15:33

the thing I just think this is one

15:35

of the situations where if you're careful you're

15:37

usually not a problem the other thing to

15:39

remember is on the on the Zen 5

15:41

launches they had some other problems too they

15:43

had some like weird USB stuff going on

15:45

they had the voltage stuff like like like When

15:48

you buy brand new stuff, it's always a little

15:50

higher higher risk than waiting six months and

15:52

buying it after it's been out for a

15:54

while But this is an X 1870 motherboard.

15:56

So there's a brand new yeah brand new

15:59

motherboard obviously rise in 9,000 so you

16:01

know, but I mean the socket's

16:03

been around for a while. It's

16:05

not like it's a new socket

16:07

this time. Yeah, yeah, I don't

16:09

know I I'm you know this

16:11

this feels like user error or

16:13

manufacturing error maybe a little bit

16:15

of column A a little column

16:17

B. I could genuinely see it

16:19

being either I don't think it's

16:21

a deeper issue. I think it's

16:23

either MSI is shipping these out

16:25

with that weird scraping at the

16:27

top that's like slightly misalining them

16:29

when you close the retainer bracket

16:31

it bends those pins because it's

16:34

off by like three degrees or

16:36

something yeah or I could see

16:38

people just put it in backwards

16:40

and forcing that pin down and

16:42

that's what bends all those pins

16:44

yeah if you if you if

16:46

you put it in upside down

16:48

and then smashed it down that

16:50

would absolutely I mean look we

16:52

have a we have a board

16:54

in there we could just drop

16:56

a CPU and fire it up

16:58

see what happens yeah you definitely

17:00

can't just flip it I mean

17:02

those those little tabs out of

17:04

the end like yeah yeah I

17:06

know that would that would stop

17:09

you for sure I mean you'd

17:11

think that but it turns out

17:13

you know it's it's like the

17:15

it's the rule of vice scripts

17:17

right you give somebody a pair

17:19

of vice scripts you can make

17:21

all sorts of things that seem

17:23

like they wouldn't work work and

17:25

and it seems like it's a

17:27

moist you know take deconstruct their

17:29

computer to see if they have

17:31

a problem? Not whatsoever. To me,

17:33

like this looks like, either like

17:35

I said, from the manufacturer issue

17:37

or user installation issue, and in

17:39

both of these cases, I was

17:41

reading up on them, they did

17:44

not post and go to the

17:46

desktop as expected. So if you

17:48

have this board and you have

17:50

this chip and your PC is

17:52

running fine, I think you're good

17:54

to go. I don't think this

17:56

is indicative of a deeper issue

17:58

whatsoever. Yeah, like there's no, if

18:00

it's, if it's posting and working,

18:02

there's no reason to take it

18:04

apart and risk, you know, having

18:06

this problem. Well, it's kind of

18:08

like the same thing with the

18:10

12 volt high power. Plugs rated

18:12

for a certain many of the

18:14

insertions but people kept like pulling

18:16

it out to check to see

18:19

if it was burnt. Well I

18:21

mean it's it's not that as

18:23

much as like the 12 volt

18:25

high power like there was definitely

18:27

a problem where if you didn't

18:29

click it in place which is

18:31

again a little bit of design

18:33

error a little bit of user

18:35

error this feels more like there's

18:37

some sort of flaw somewhere in

18:39

the manufacturing process or maybe there's

18:41

a batch of faulty sockets sockets

18:43

out there or whatever but if

18:45

you It looks like if you

18:47

put the right edge in first

18:49

on this and then let it

18:51

drop down, you're probably going to

18:54

be okay and then taking it

18:56

out could cause you to have

18:58

the problem if you take it

19:00

out and receded it again in

19:02

not exactly the right way. Well,

19:04

yeah, for these things are super

19:06

tight. Not incredibly tight when it

19:08

comes to manufacturing, but tight enough

19:10

where if it's off a few

19:12

degrees and you use that retainer

19:14

spring to climb it down, I

19:16

could totally see that. Yeah. Yeah,

19:18

so like I said, MSI did

19:20

a statement. Seems like they're working

19:22

with Steve to do some more

19:24

testing as well. I think that's

19:26

kind of the final piece of

19:29

the puzzle is how is MSI

19:31

going to handle the situation? Because,

19:33

you know, usually in these kind

19:35

of situations, there's a lot of

19:37

pressure on being like, okay, you

19:39

know, how are you going to

19:41

address it? Are you going to

19:43

make it right by the customer

19:45

who has been affected? You know,

19:47

what kind of things are you

19:49

doing in the community? They've seemed

19:51

to quickly have addressed the issue

19:53

partnering with somebody like Steve is

19:55

obviously a good thing. So the

19:57

next step is to see, okay,

19:59

how widespread is it? How willing

20:01

are they to come out and

20:04

say, you know, if there's a

20:06

problem that anybody needs to address?

20:08

And then, you know. Does the

20:10

warranty actually cover something like this?

20:12

Well, and the other thing, if

20:14

you're worried about this kind of

20:16

thing, is when you're seating the

20:18

socket, the CPU in the socket,

20:20

before you clamp it down, make

20:22

sure that you can see the

20:24

keys on the side and they're

20:26

lined upright and they're both poking

20:28

through and like the CPU should

20:30

nestle down into. that socket when

20:32

you lower it in there. It

20:34

shouldn't be, it should not be

20:36

proud and above the edge of

20:39

the socket and then rely on

20:41

the pressure of the clamp to

20:43

push it down. That's not what

20:45

you want. And usually what I

20:47

like doing is just, like, licking

20:49

the edges of the CPU to

20:51

really just, like, make sure it's,

20:53

like, it goes in there smooth.

20:55

I'm just kidding. No, no, no,

20:57

no, no. You can smell CPUs,

20:59

but licking them, yeah. Licking them,

21:01

yeah. Licking the paste off is

21:03

totally fine, but not, not, don't

21:05

do liquid metal. It's one thing

21:07

to smell, yeah, don't lick any

21:09

pins. yourself not not came off

21:11

the line with bent pins. Oh

21:14

the the most horrible thing I

21:16

ever did I was on an

21:18

incredible deadline for something an extreme

21:20

edition Intel board and I got

21:22

the the hardware in the day

21:24

before the embargo and so I

21:26

was rushing to put it together

21:28

and I just straight dropped the

21:30

CPU into the socket and corner

21:32

first yeah and I bent a

21:34

good chunk of the pins and

21:36

the motherboard But like I said

21:38

I was on deadline for like

21:40

8 a.m. 9 a.m. the next

21:42

day So I had to sit

21:44

there with the magnifying glass since

21:46

and tweezers and straighten them all

21:49

out and then get testing done

21:51

and I didn't sleep for I

21:53

think it was like 50 hours.

21:55

Did it work? It did work.

21:57

Oh yeah, you can usually unbend

21:59

pins unless you break them entirely.

22:01

Yeah, I just I was like

22:03

a little tiny circle because I

22:05

caught it But the corner hit

22:07

and I was like well time

22:09

to get out the mechanical pencil

22:11

and my magnif my like like

22:13

this is why having one of

22:15

those clamp-on magnifying glasses with the

22:17

light on it is really important.

22:19

Oh yeah I really want one

22:21

of those. Because you can like

22:24

get it right down in there

22:26

and you can see everything and

22:28

like this is the one of

22:30

the amazing human brain things right

22:32

is if you magnify what you're

22:34

looking at you're your brain will

22:36

automatically scale down the movement of

22:38

your hand to match that magnification.

22:40

So if you're like working on

22:42

a dissecting scope, you can do

22:44

tiny tiny little movements with your

22:46

fingers. It's pretty good. That's actually

22:48

what I wanted to do and

22:50

I wanted to run into the

22:52

hardware store and buy in one

22:54

of those. And it still took

22:56

me like three hours. It's all

22:59

like it was awful. I can't

23:01

imagine doing it on something pre-release.

23:03

You couldn't just go get another

23:05

board. It was the day before

23:07

it was like $2, $2, $2,

23:09

$2, $2, $2,000. Oh, that's rough.

23:11

And the Intel ones, before they

23:13

started putting the flange on the

23:15

side of the heat spreader, that

23:17

you could kind of grip on

23:19

to to lower it in, it

23:21

was really easy to just drop

23:23

it because it was just straight

23:25

edges and you had to line

23:27

it up exactly right. And you

23:29

weren't supposed to do it at

23:31

an angle and like flip it

23:34

day. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of

23:36

people are running scary headlines with

23:38

this. But the actual analysis that

23:40

I've seen pretty much aligns with

23:42

what we've said here. Like, don't

23:44

worry about it. Like, this is

23:46

either an MSI issue on two

23:48

boards out of however many they've

23:50

sold or a user error issue.

23:52

So don't avoid 9800X3D just because

23:54

of these two reports. On a

23:56

scale of 1 to 20, let's

23:58

see how much Steve thinks you

24:00

should worry about it. Oh, no.

24:02

Seven out of 20 so yeah,

24:04

don't worry about it too bad.

24:06

Be careful when you're assembling, but

24:09

don't don't make changes in person.

24:11

Yeah, that's what a seven means.

24:13

Yeah, it's a mixed bag. Speaking

24:15

a mixed bag, Intel Battlemage is

24:17

around the corner. Yeah. You know,

24:19

if you know, this show, you

24:21

know that Brad loves to talk

24:23

about rumors. There has been a

24:25

word I would use. Yeah, loves.

24:27

There has been a bubbling. of

24:29

battle major rumors for a while

24:31

and we've kind of touched on

24:33

them here and there but you

24:35

know it's most rumors but there

24:37

is a brand new one that

24:39

seems to indicate some things going

24:41

on. I have a link over

24:44

to a Tom's Hardware article by

24:46

Sam saying that the this newest

24:48

leak is a is an actual

24:50

like shipping manifest for two looks

24:52

like Intel B580 GPUs. This is

24:54

for the boxes. Uh, and, and

24:56

they're theorizing that this means that

24:58

Desktop Parts could be launching in

25:00

December. I mean, I said it

25:02

last week, Vintel wants to make

25:04

a splash with his GPU, the

25:06

time to do it is before,

25:08

in video, rolls out, 580s, there

25:10

we go. There we go. You're

25:12

the leak master in terms of

25:14

this leak. How how are you

25:16

feeling about this one? I don't

25:19

think it'll be the least leak

25:21

master until I'm 75 or so.

25:23

This one. There's a lot of

25:25

smoke. I'm not convinced it's a

25:27

fire yet. Very well, maybe because

25:29

this follows up a report from

25:31

early November that said, hey, you

25:33

know, we're hearing that in December

25:35

there might be a battle mage

25:37

teaser. That was from Golden Pig,

25:39

I believe the guy's name is.

25:41

Golden Pig is a Golden Pig

25:43

upgrade brought to you by. Rated

25:45

Trustworthy by PC gamer.com, it's my

25:47

understanding. Yeah, well he's pretty all

25:49

right on the Weebo chats in

25:51

general. We're seeing this Intel BMG

25:54

B580 shipping manifest on the site

25:56

that tracks shipping manifest. That's really

25:58

easy to fake. So take that

26:00

with a big punch assault, but...

26:02

You know, that combined with there's

26:04

another rumor. that just came out

26:06

this week, that Adam didn't mention,

26:08

a teaser from a guy named

26:10

Tomas, T-O-M-A-S-C, and then a Geronski,

26:12

like a Polish name or something

26:14

like that, somewhere around there. They're

26:16

a data minor who actually have

26:18

a pretty good record for releasing

26:20

stuff, and they found a teaser

26:22

image about Intel Ark, Battle Mage,

26:24

S-O-C-C, 12-20-24. So there's an awful

26:26

lot of smoke around this. I'm

26:29

not sure if there's fire if

26:31

there's fire. I agree with Will,

26:33

I think that it would be

26:35

smart for Intel to get out

26:37

ahead of AMD and a video.

26:39

But personally, I haven't heard anything

26:41

about this yet. So... Well, I

26:43

guess here's the next thing. They

26:45

could just tease it. They could

26:47

just be like, hey, guess what?

26:49

Battle Maiden info coming soon. CS

26:51

2025, tune in. Or do you

26:53

think it could be an actual

26:55

launch of parts in December next

26:57

month? I would

27:00

doubt it to be an actual

27:02

launch, except for a paper launch

27:04

that's close to the holidays, that's

27:06

supposed to see. I could see

27:08

them doing a teaser and saying,

27:10

hey, it's coming early January. But

27:13

considering that Battle Mage's XE2 architecture

27:15

is already the architecture inside of

27:17

Lunar Lake, I could see them

27:19

haven't already been working on this.

27:21

So I could see it going

27:23

either way to be honest. What

27:26

do you think? Unless they're very

27:28

confident they're going to beat Blackwell.

27:30

Right now Intel has some stock

27:32

market problems that transcend the success

27:34

or failure of their independent, their

27:36

standalone discrete GPU part. And if

27:39

they think they can get Wall

27:41

Street excited about a discrete GPU

27:43

that's going to be real good

27:45

for doing AI training or whatever,

27:47

maybe they'll roll out some announcement

27:49

early. Like they're not going to

27:52

move the needle. Unless they're very

27:54

confident they're going to beat Blackwell.

27:56

in discrete GPU land, which I

27:58

don't think anybody thinks is possible.

28:00

Oh, no. I feel like they

28:02

haven't even tried to say anything

28:05

like that. Yeah, no, no. It's

28:07

like it's just a it's just

28:09

a nonsensical thing to say. So

28:11

I think that they'll probably announce

28:13

something and may even start shipping

28:15

like it would make sense for

28:18

them to start shipping like the

28:20

existing GP users are both pretty

28:22

old at this point and and

28:24

if they have something that's competitive

28:26

with existing gen hardware at a

28:28

really good price point, I mean,

28:31

why not start shipping those cards?

28:33

Or the thing I'm thinking of

28:35

is that we already know invidious

28:37

coming out swinging at the high

28:39

end. Yeah. 50-90, $2,000, AMD is

28:41

already alluded to, hey, you know

28:44

what, we're not shooting for the

28:46

high end, we're going solidly for

28:48

that mid-range. I think that does

28:50

leave an opening for Intel to

28:52

be like, oh, that's cute. You

28:54

know what? We're coming in right

28:57

here at $200. Boom. Battle Maids,

28:59

you know, not 200, I have

29:01

no idea. We could roll to

29:03

see what the price is going

29:05

to be. But, you know, like,

29:07

like for me, I think it's

29:10

more like they do have an

29:12

opportunity to be like, okay, that's

29:14

really cool that they're going for

29:16

that. We're not going for that.

29:18

We're going for every man, you

29:20

know, a nice, solid card that's

29:22

going to do you some good,

29:25

but we're really aiming for that,

29:27

that entry level user, and I

29:29

would say. The number scheme at

29:31

least on this shipping manifest, this

29:33

is a B580, which is not

29:35

even the high end either, because

29:38

that would be a replacement for

29:40

the B380, which was... Here's a

29:42

580, there's an A580. Oh, there's

29:44

an A580. Yeah, yeah, yeah, so,

29:46

it's not even the high end

29:48

of the the alchemist stack, so...

29:51

Yeah. I just, when I search

29:53

Google News for Battle Maids, GPU,

29:55

imminent, I get articles dated January

29:57

15th, 2024, July 7th, 2024, August

29:59

8th, 2024, April 20th. second 2024

30:01

July 10th 2024 one month ago

30:04

one month ago one month ago

30:06

when we go seven hours ago.

30:08

Hashtag wait for battle mage has

30:10

been around for a bit. It's

30:12

it's a trending on blues guy.

30:14

There's no trending on blues guy

30:17

that's the whole point. I'm gonna

30:19

make this trend on blues guy.

30:21

But yeah like if they have an

30:23

every every man card like a real

30:25

solid 1080. at a nice price that's

30:28

that's a that's compelling and like their

30:30

driver's hitch is better now than it

30:32

was when they launched the first-gen parts

30:35

like the lunar lake drivers have been

30:37

pretty solid from the I haven't done

30:39

a ton of games testing but

30:41

it's I was impressed with what I

30:43

did try they're good yeah to me like

30:46

who knows maybe they do do they pull off something

30:48

spectacular with series to you and they

30:50

go for the whole stack But to

30:53

me, the entry point for Battle Mage

30:55

would be, like, both in video and

30:57

AMD, basically left 300-ish

30:59

dollars and below alone. Like, if

31:01

they can pull out a super solid 1080P

31:04

card and have it for $2 to $300,

31:06

announced before, and video comes

31:08

out and announces this $2,500, freaking

31:10

50-90, like, I could see why

31:12

they would want to do that. I mean, we're

31:14

in a weird spot where it's like,

31:17

it's like super cars when the Bugati

31:19

Veyron came out, right. all of a

31:21

sudden there was this one car that

31:23

was way faster than anything else anybody

31:25

else was doing by like by like

31:27

an enormous amount and all of

31:29

a sudden the interesting stuff started happening

31:32

at much lower price points and and

31:34

you know it's it's like the 15

31:36

40 90 50 90 like I'll be

31:38

impressed if anybody comes out with something

31:40

as fast as a 40 90 this

31:43

generation that's not an idea. I mean,

31:45

the 7900XXX was pretty

31:47

close. Yeah, I was in

31:49

Raster and pure Raster. Yeah,

31:51

I was damn close. But here's

31:53

the other thing that I think

31:55

could be, and you tell me

31:58

what you think about this. We

32:00

have yet to see high-end laptop,

32:02

Intel laptop, Aero Lake CPUs yet,

32:04

right? Could this be in relation

32:06

to High End Laptop? Could this

32:08

be a laptop part and not

32:10

an actual discrete desktop part? It

32:12

definitely could be because when Intel

32:14

announced Aero Lake for the Desktop,

32:16

they announced that Aero Lake H

32:18

will be coming to gaming laptops

32:20

and that will be, I presume,

32:22

the basis of the graphics inside

32:24

of those. Since it was for

32:26

Lunar Lake, I'm not sure about

32:28

Arrow Lake. So this could very

32:30

well be, and we're expecting to

32:32

see those around CES, so this

32:34

could be a teaser of what

32:36

we're going to see at CCS

32:38

and gaming laptops. But I would

32:40

hope that if they do plan

32:42

on launching Battle Mage Discreet Graphics

32:44

soon, I would hope that they

32:46

get out before AMI. Yeah. That

32:48

was my other thought, yeah. And

32:50

yes, Arrow Lake does have XE2

32:52

architecture, but it's different than what's

32:54

in Lunar Lake. And I think

32:56

the Arrow Lake H, so the

32:58

high-end laptop parts, will probably care

33:00

more about that IGBU than like

33:02

a desktop part, because you assume

33:05

the desktop parts are going to

33:07

be paired with a discrete GSPU,

33:09

so. It's always really funny to

33:11

me, because when you look at

33:13

the high-end H-class gaming laptops, they're

33:15

always paired with a GQ. Right.

33:17

And yet they always put the

33:19

best money into the graphics on

33:21

those. It's like nobody's ever going

33:23

to touch that aside from quicksink.

33:25

Well, well, but a lot of,

33:27

yeah, a lot of workstation laptop

33:29

users use those two. And like

33:31

when you're on, if if you're

33:33

using those for productivity and work,

33:35

having the IGBU for all the

33:37

times that you're not doing 3D

33:39

stuff, it turns out gives you

33:41

a little bit more battery life

33:43

in the long run. That makes

33:45

sense. And I actually really do,

33:47

once again, I really do like

33:49

this laptop. It is a 16

33:51

inch laptop that does not have

33:53

a discrete GPU. So like if

33:55

they had an arrow like H

33:57

version of this that had a

33:59

really good IGP, like to me,

34:01

like that would be a good

34:03

use case for sure. Someone who

34:05

is looking at this from the

34:07

perspective of a camera on the

34:09

TV I think that's a ridiculously

34:11

thin laptop for being that powerful.

34:13

Yeah yeah I like these 16

34:15

inch laptops that are powerful but

34:17

that are powerful enough but they

34:19

don't have a discrete GPU so

34:21

it doesn't have to be thicker

34:23

and heavier and hotter and all

34:26

that kind of stuff. That's that's

34:28

my sweet spat as of right

34:30

now. I like a sweet bat.

34:32

through this dice on a scale

34:34

of one to 20. Or maybe

34:36

we should do a 10. I

34:38

feel like we're channeling Steve at

34:40

a dangerous level over here. He's

34:42

gonna, he's gonna call me and

34:44

be like, dude, you can't, you

34:46

can't use my name like this.

34:48

So one through, one through 10.

34:50

That's an eight. One, two, three,

34:52

four, five, yeah, is a 10.

34:54

One, two, two, three, four, five.

34:56

Okay, this is also a, one,

34:58

one, one through 10. How likely

35:00

is it the battle mage will

35:02

launch in December according to this

35:04

dice? Eight out of ten. That's

35:06

pretty good. That's pretty good. Seems

35:08

pretty good, but it might have

35:10

some minor problems. You know, you

35:12

guys didn't, uh, summon Steve, you

35:14

guys accidentally summoned gear seekers in

35:16

the house right now. Nick, what

35:18

is going on? Glad to have

35:20

you here. I don't know if

35:22

you have your own. Dice set

35:24

I follow I follow him on

35:26

blues guy. Oh, you should follow

35:28

gear seekers on blues. Is it

35:30

gear seekers? Yeah. Yeah gear seekers

35:32

dies You don't know this and

35:34

yeah a front of the show

35:36

data has a very good point

35:38

Steve would love the scientific nature

35:40

of this testing. Yeah, that's true

35:42

Definitely not leaving things to chance

35:44

at there's numbers involved. It has

35:47

to be right There are numbers

35:49

involved. So I mean, hey, guess

35:51

what? December is literally around the

35:53

corner, so we will probably know

35:55

more soon. 30 days of September,

35:57

April, June, and November. days from

35:59

December right now. 12 days from

36:01

December. I'm not going to mess

36:03

so I'm going to trust you

36:05

here. Yeah. Yeah. Battle mage. We'll

36:07

see. We'll see. I don't know.

36:09

I like I'm interested to see

36:11

what more GPU cores do. Like

36:13

the lunar like GPU cores are

36:15

pretty good for a laptop. I

36:17

want to see what happens when

36:19

you put 30 of them in

36:21

a in a in a in

36:23

a giant discrete GPU and let

36:25

it rip. Yeah. And it's weird

36:27

timing because Intel obviously needs to

36:29

make money because they've surprisingly been

36:31

losing money handover fist the last

36:33

year or so. But they also

36:35

desperately need a win. Like, the

36:37

core culture was good, but the

36:39

gaming story and everything just, it's

36:41

not selling very well. The top

36:43

10 CPUs being sold on Amazon

36:45

right now are all A&D. Before

36:47

that we had the 14900K having

36:49

issues. I feel like Intel needs

36:51

a win if they can drop

36:53

something like this at a competitive

36:55

price that does great 1080P gaming,

36:57

which is still what the vast

36:59

majority of people play. I think

37:01

it could be a win for

37:03

them. So, you know, the weird

37:05

thing about this is that it's

37:08

not, like it's rumored to be

37:10

a TMC process, because presumably because

37:12

the GPU chips and the lunar

37:14

Laker TFS or TMC. Yeah. And

37:16

I wonder. Yeah, I don't know.

37:18

We'll see. I'm wildly curious. If

37:20

they can hit like RTX4080 level

37:22

Perf at a much lower price

37:24

point, that's that's that they'll like

37:26

the world on fire. I don't

37:28

think they're gonna get that close.

37:30

Keep putting more GPU. Like I'm

37:32

not a chip designer, but I

37:34

say you just pack more GPU

37:36

cores in there. It's gonna get

37:38

faster, right? That's how you shove

37:40

it in there. Make sure the

37:42

pins aren't bent. You know what?

37:44

And this is surprising. I remember

37:46

when that dried up on New

37:48

Egg and the A750 as well,

37:50

but the A580, you can actually

37:52

still get on New Egg for,

37:54

you got the Azrock Challenger, which

37:56

I think, oh no, we have

37:58

the sparkle. Oh, so this. Sparkle

38:00

is 180 right now. The Azrock

38:02

Challenger version is $170 to $10

38:04

discount on sale. Those are really

38:06

popular with streamers for second, for

38:08

stream PCs because you could do

38:10

a V1 on those and not

38:12

on a lot of the other

38:14

cards that are not. To me,

38:16

that's where Intel can, if they

38:18

choose to, like forge ahead, I

38:20

feel like Art, the first gen,

38:22

was really good for creator tasks.

38:24

Like if they keep that going

38:26

you can't just keep adding AV1

38:29

decoders and encoders that doesn't make

38:31

sense. Yeah. They can figure out

38:33

something to make this add quick

38:35

sync add to all this stuff

38:37

like you can make it a

38:39

great 10 ADP card with benefits.

38:41

Yeah. And I'm really curious to

38:43

see how it goes. Wow you

38:45

can still get A750s. Oh and

38:47

A 770. It was on sale

38:49

for uh two hundred and sixty

38:51

nine dollars last week I think

38:53

it was. Okay. I guess I

38:55

was thinking of the. They're reference

38:57

cards. They're gone. Yeah, those dried

38:59

up. But yeah, you can get,

39:01

here's A770, that Aeser, Predator, Bifrost.

39:03

I know, a friend of the

39:05

show Ziv purchased one of these

39:07

to see how that design held

39:09

up. It's a 270. Looks like

39:11

that's the cheapest A770 out there.

39:13

So, I mean, there's still alchemist

39:15

cards floating around. Hmm. Well, we'll

39:17

see. Hopefully we find out in

39:19

a month. Yeah, I'm fine with

39:21

wait until 2025, so I have

39:23

an easy December though. Don't hear

39:25

what I'm going to say here.

39:27

Yeah, yeah, we have almost two

39:29

weeks off of for Christmas break.

39:31

So I would prefer to enjoy

39:33

those. Do I have some video

39:35

card announcement news for you guys?

39:37

Oh, great, great, great. Yeah, well,

39:39

once again, kind of a... a

39:41

finished newsweek. So let's let's hop

39:43

over to Q&A. If you have

39:45

any questions right now at and

39:47

you're watching live in the YouTube

39:50

chat at the full nerd podcast,

39:52

it's an easy way for us

39:54

to see it over there. If

39:56

you're watching or listen this later,

39:58

there's a link in the description

40:00

to our discord and there is

40:02

a channel in there for the

40:04

full nerd questions you can get

40:06

your questions in and hopefully we

40:08

will read them here on this

40:10

show I will say I think

40:12

I missed a super chat earlier

40:14

right yes oh yeah friend of

40:16

the show Skeetsayer thank you so

40:18

much gave us five Canadian dollars

40:20

said the the the user burnt

40:22

the CPU installed it upside down

40:24

that is why it turned on

40:26

and arked all over the place

40:28

so yeah fun Times. This is

40:30

not a question. This is

40:32

just a comment from Nick

40:34

says I think battle mage

40:36

will be like arc a

40:38

generation behind performance

40:41

wise, but overall not terrible.

40:43

And for the show Wildcat

40:45

says please do an A770

40:47

revenge before December. Maybe we'll

40:49

get Keith on that. Yeah.

40:51

Yeah. No, that might be

40:53

interesting. I'm curious to see

40:55

how it's how. things have

40:57

shifted over the I mean

40:59

especially now that there's a

41:01

tunnel lunar like GPUs and

41:03

in process like like there's

41:05

the installed base of these is higher

41:08

yeah all right going over to

41:10

discord oh I'm speaking mentioning Keith

41:12

De Otis asks will Keith do

41:14

another monthly chicken for Battle Mage

41:16

I really like the series for

41:18

first-gen and Intel DPUs I would

41:20

love him to I think I

41:22

think that we have an opportunity

41:24

to expand it as well. So

41:26

I'm not quite sure. I need to

41:28

follow up with him for the 2025

41:31

plans, but I do like that idea.

41:33

I did think that was very, uh,

41:35

a good user service to kind of

41:37

see where it's at. I mean, Kuzark,

41:39

yeah, like, definitely they had a lot

41:41

to work on, but I mean, hopefully

41:44

Battle Mage doesn't come out

41:46

in. the same kind of state where the

41:48

month over month they're getting like emails

41:50

in our inbox being like hey guess

41:52

what performance uplift of 50% oh great

41:54

yeah so yeah yeah to me that's

41:56

the question like if you go back

41:58

and read my initial arc review. Like

42:00

it starts with, here's the six bugs

42:03

I ran into. Here's the 15 bugs

42:05

in various games they told me about.

42:07

Like, the hardware itself is fine in

42:10

the places that it needs to be,

42:12

but it sucks at DirectX11, it has

42:14

all these bugs, etc. Hopefully by now,

42:17

Battle Mage will mostly have that smoothed

42:19

out. So I would, before committing to

42:21

it, I would say it depends on

42:23

what it's like at launch. Like if

42:26

it comes out and everything's running fine.

42:28

I don't think there needs to be

42:30

a monthly check in. But if it

42:33

comes out and then a month later,

42:35

Intel's like, hey, we squeeze some more

42:37

out of here, here's 20% then, yes.

42:40

Yeah, there's definitely something to it. We

42:42

will see, uh, getting questions over on

42:44

Discord, Liquidar, as seems Greg Comer, Comer,

42:46

has left Valve after 27 years. Now

42:49

that Phil Specter has confirmed that Microsoft

42:51

has a handheld in development, do you

42:53

think there's any meat to the rumors

42:56

that... Comer? Comer? I don't know. Maybe

42:58

working on that project or is the

43:00

gaming community chasing grumpkins? That is a

43:02

good question. And I did see those

43:05

headlines about what Phil said about a

43:07

handheld. He also said it's early days.

43:09

years away. Yeah, I don't think this

43:12

is anything coming. And I'm not familiar

43:14

with with Greg. What was his he's

43:16

somebody who's been a valve since the

43:19

very beginning. My assumption is he came

43:21

over with Gabe and the Microsoft folks

43:23

when they started valve given that he

43:25

worked on half-life one and and has

43:28

been there for since the beginning. But

43:30

it looks like he was instrumental in

43:32

in steamedek. Well, that's what people say.

43:35

But like the way valve works, everybody

43:37

touches everything. I don't like When somebody

43:39

who's been at valve since the very

43:41

beginning and presumably has some fairly substantial

43:44

equity options as a result of that

43:46

decides to leave and they're 55 60

43:48

years old I assume like there's a

43:51

couple of things you can assume right

43:53

one is that maybe they just don't

43:55

want to work anymore which is totally

43:58

legitimate one is Maybe Microsoft recruited them,

44:00

maybe somebody else recruited them, come and

44:02

work on handheld stuff. Like, I wouldn't,

44:04

given that Valve was founded out of

44:07

Microsoft for all intents and purposes, and

44:09

so a lot of those people have

44:11

Microsoft on their resume from the 90s,

44:14

which is, just to be clear, 90s

44:16

Microsoft and 24 Microsoft, wildly wildly different

44:18

companies. Very. You know, it's not like

44:20

Google 20 years ago and Google today.

44:23

Wildly different companies. Companies change a lot

44:25

over that period of time. Valve is

44:27

very different than it was 20 years

44:30

ago. So don't, I don't, I think

44:32

people are getting out there, jump to

44:34

conclusions, Matt. Yeah, I also don't know

44:37

if there's any hard evidence that he

44:39

is such an instrumental figure in the

44:41

steam deck. like you said I think

44:43

a lot of people worked on the

44:46

steam deck I have not heard his

44:48

name do you yeah yeah like there's

44:50

a ton of there's like like Lawrence

44:53

Yang is one of the art people

44:55

I know of as the architect and

44:57

he's kind of the most vocal on

45:00

yeah but I mean there's a ton

45:02

of people that work on software there's

45:04

a ton of people that work on

45:06

thing the way valve works is typically

45:09

somebody gets tapped to be the the

45:11

human gets tapped to be the the

45:13

human face of a project the VR

45:16

and left for dead and a bunch

45:18

of stuff prior to that because he

45:20

was willing to do that work and

45:22

take the both the good and the

45:25

bad of being the public face of

45:27

valve in a lot of in a

45:29

lot of in a lot of cases.

45:32

A lot of people just choose to

45:34

sit quietly and do their work and

45:36

not be hassled by dealing with the

45:39

public which given the way games discourse

45:41

has gone over the last 10 or

45:43

12 years makes a ton of sense

45:45

and I totally get in respect that

45:48

as a as an opinion. like valve

45:50

is a is a collective you know

45:52

valve is a weird company it's a

45:55

black box they make so much money

45:57

per employee per headcount because of the

45:59

way steam works that they don't work

46:01

like normal companies and you can't make

46:04

a something it's not like it's not

46:06

like when good Google went out and

46:08

recruited a bunch of AI people from

46:11

Carnegie Mellon to work. You're like, oh,

46:13

they're clearly spinning up a self-driving car

46:15

team. Yeah, of course they were. No,

46:18

duh. Like, this guy might just want

46:20

to retire and go to, go, like,

46:22

buy, upload or something. That's what I'm

46:24

seeing. That's what I'm seeing with a

46:27

lot of in-video folks these days. Like,

46:29

a lot of my contacts have been

46:31

there forever and they're the richest company

46:34

in. The people that we know that

46:36

started working in in video in 2003

46:38

had a strike price of like $10

46:41

or $12 on invidious stock and it

46:43

was $900 the other day. Wow. So

46:45

there's a better who writes for Barron's

46:47

name take him first adopter on Twitter.

46:50

Yeah. He's awesome. He has a invidious

46:52

book the invidious way coming out soon.

46:54

Former maximum PC editor also. Yeah, he's

46:57

great. Yeah, I love that. Yeah, I

46:59

thought that he ran the numbers and

47:01

he said if you'd put $10,000 into

47:03

a video when it launched back in

47:06

the day you'd have like $40 million.

47:08

Yeah, wow. Okay, well best case scenario,

47:10

best case scenario, even if this guy

47:13

was super instrumental in the steam deck

47:15

and he is going over to Microsoft

47:17

to help with those handheld efforts. I

47:20

also don't believe that one guy can

47:22

turn the tides or immediately be like,

47:24

oh yeah, the Xbox handheld is going

47:26

to be an amazing thing, right? You

47:29

know, Microsoft is a very big company.

47:31

There's a lot of things they're trying

47:33

to feed into it. Yeah, I can't

47:36

see one person coming in being like,

47:38

okay, this is this is immediately going

47:40

to make it a must have. I

47:42

mean, I think there are definitely people.

47:45

that can move the needle in a

47:47

big way for an organization even an

47:49

organization the size of Microsoft or Apple

47:52

or Google or something like that. product

47:54

that is essentially unannounced, you know, Phil

47:56

is clearly, you know, Sony made their

47:59

bet on handhelds, which is, hey, we

48:01

think our PlayStation streaming is pretty good

48:03

and we're gonna set it up so

48:05

you can just do that from anywhere

48:08

and have like a little remote PlayStation

48:10

that connects to the mothership, which is

48:12

like. like good on them that's a

48:15

bold choice I think everybody's tried that

48:17

it logic tech made their own handheld

48:19

streaming thing that I think they sold

48:22

like 10 of the G cloud yeah

48:24

like I've never heard of anybody buying

48:26

one of these Sony things because at

48:28

that same price point you can just

48:31

buy a steam deck and then run

48:33

I can't read a Tiyaki on it

48:35

and stream from your PlayStation get exactly

48:38

the same experience minus the fancy triggers

48:40

and and and have a much more

48:42

versatile device so like I don't know

48:44

Like I I this is all just

48:47

kind of idle speculation about personnel that

48:49

like is Who knows what people do

48:51

inside like no people inside valve don't

48:54

know what people inside valve do right

48:56

like like hey? What is what is

48:58

what is what is Bob working on

49:01

these days? I have no idea I

49:03

haven't talked to Bob in three years

49:05

It turns out Bob's been off making

49:07

some dota first person third person dota

49:10

clone. I've heard Bob's your uncle Bob

49:12

is your uncle I just want to

49:14

say I want to say from Phil

49:17

Spencer's comments about that Xbox handheld. Like

49:19

it's years away. It sounds like it's

49:21

not even close. It's also yeah, I

49:23

would get your hopes up too much

49:26

about that. Yeah, and it really felt

49:28

like one of those things of like,

49:30

oh, hey, we're working on cool stuff

49:33

too. We've got this thing that we're

49:35

working on. Come on. Let's stay excited

49:37

about Xbox. You know, like, yeah. But

49:40

at the same time, that's kind of

49:42

what Microsoft has had a problem with

49:44

recently is like announcing things way too

49:46

early. And I know you got to

49:49

do that sometimes for business reasons, but

49:51

also just, you know what, just talk

49:53

about it when there's something to talk

49:56

about. Yeah, in my mind. So, well,

49:58

actually. Here's a better follow-up question from

50:00

Nick. Do we need an Xbox handheld

50:02

though? I'm gonna say yes. Give me

50:05

all the damn handhelds Nick. Why are

50:07

you trying to hold out handhelds for

50:09

me? Like I don't understand. I thought

50:12

we were friends. Look, the real solution

50:14

is that Microsoft's gonna buy Nintendo and

50:16

then the switch will become the Xbox

50:19

handheld. You'll also be able to play

50:21

Mario on the Xbox. It's the only

50:23

way for this to work out. Perfect.

50:25

It's my understanding. Yeah, okay. I'm just

50:28

a scientist. By the time Xbox handheld

50:30

comes out, will it be, what were we

50:32

saying? Sented thermal pace? Will there be sent?

50:34

That should be, that should be, that should

50:37

be, that should be sooner. Being serious for

50:39

a minute though, I would love an Xbox

50:41

handheld. Like we said for years that

50:43

if you have a PC, like a

50:45

switch is the natural companion because you

50:47

can't play any of those games. But

50:49

Microsoft has Xbox Play Anywhere Game

50:51

Pass Ultimate all of that stuff.

50:53

And if you already have a PC and an

50:55

Xbox to be able to subscribe to

50:57

Xbacks Game Pass or use your Play

51:00

Anywhere games, you already have both of

51:02

those. And it's already set up for

51:04

XCloud. So to me, as someone who's

51:06

invested in that, if they can put out, even

51:08

if it is primarily a cloud based

51:10

system, I'm already bought into Xbacks Game

51:12

Pass Ultimate as a game pass ultimate

51:14

as a PC player who has an

51:17

Xbox as an auxiliary device. and I

51:19

would totally buy an Xbox handheld to

51:21

use a bed forever. Let me tell

51:23

you about my steam deck, Brad. I

51:26

connect to the X cloud to play

51:28

Fortnite on my steam deck when my

51:30

kid wants to play Fortnite and I

51:32

don't want to go inside in the

51:35

office anymore. And that's a pretty good

51:37

experience. There's a dedicated client and everything.

51:39

Steam deck might be my Christmas gift

51:41

to myself this year. It's a

51:44

pretty good gift, I'm going to

51:46

say. It's a good one. We

51:48

get a question from the happening

51:50

over on Discord front of the

51:52

show. So why can't DIY CPUs

51:55

have direct dye cooling like

51:57

laptops? I will say when the

51:59

1400K... came out, Corsaire had reached

52:01

out about getting a tower, a

52:03

custom tower in from origin, assuming

52:05

it was origin branded or was

52:07

it Corsa? Probably. That they had

52:09

direct eye cooling, or I'm sorry,

52:11

delitted CPU. So that's essentially direct

52:14

eye cooling, right? Yeah. So like

52:16

you can, I mean. D-litting is

52:18

definitely a thing. I mean, go

52:20

subscribe over to DeBower. So it's

52:22

literally every CPU that comes out.

52:24

So, like, I don't think it's

52:26

as ubiquitous, but I think, I

52:28

actually think the thing it comes

52:30

down to is that that's... Either

52:32

you're gonna do it yourself or

52:34

are you gonna buy a pre-built

52:36

if you buy if you buy

52:38

a pre-built That's already kind of

52:40

like set up for that cooling

52:42

system that kind of takes a

52:44

lot of the DIYness out of

52:46

it because that that would probably

52:48

be a real pain in the

52:50

butt to try to swap anything

52:52

out or anything like that so

52:54

Yeah, what's is the benefit just

52:56

that you lose the tiny amount

52:58

of inefficiency of going through the

53:01

heat spreader and you put your

53:03

thermal block directly on the dye?

53:05

Yeah, you get you get slightly

53:07

better cooling like it depends on

53:09

what you're using but you can

53:11

get up to 10 degrees better

53:13

cooling sometimes and the idea is

53:15

that you can boost more at

53:17

the at the risk of potentially

53:19

crushing your seat like I remember

53:21

those old those old Thunderbird days

53:23

and like you did one one

53:25

quarter turn on the screw too

53:27

far and crack. Yeah, shout out

53:29

to anybody who delids I'm not

53:31

doing it myself. Yeah, that seems

53:33

that seems like. I'll pick a

53:35

CPU once just to just a

53:37

try. Let's try to see how

53:39

it is. You can get a

53:41

thermal grizzly dealid die-made AM5 for

53:43

50 bucks. There you go. Yeah,

53:46

and then just smack that bad

53:48

boy on. Just liquid metal it

53:50

up while you're at it. Let

53:52

it let her rip. Yeah, I

53:54

think. But the actual answer to

53:56

this question is because laptops are

53:58

built as close contained system. Yeah,

54:00

like they can plan around all

54:02

that. could do that. Prebilts are

54:04

prebilts. They would have to put

54:06

a lot of extra effort and

54:08

time into doing that. And then

54:10

it like I presume it messes

54:12

with our individual warranties. I'm guessing

54:14

until an AMD wouldn't be super

54:16

thrilled and honor the warranties if

54:18

a company is delidding chips. Yeah,

54:20

the company is going to eat

54:22

the warranty on that. Yeah. I

54:24

well and like the benefit is

54:26

hey you get a little bit

54:28

more efficiency on the cooling when

54:30

probably if you go from a

54:33

240 to a 360 aio or

54:35

whatever you're gonna see the same

54:37

impact when with much less risk

54:39

to everyone involved. I mean I

54:41

think really the only benefit well

54:43

not the only a good benefit

54:45

would be small from factor right

54:47

if you're like hey you know

54:49

what I want to try to

54:51

get as much cooling capability in

54:53

a small system I could see

54:55

that but Yeah, no. I feel

54:57

like people used to say every

54:59

time Brad says divorce now they

55:01

would do a shot. I feel

55:03

like we're getting close to point

55:05

where when Adam says SFF. Oh,

55:07

we're passing. Oh, yeah, we're passing.

55:09

Get the stomach pumps out. Yeah.

55:11

All right, moving on. YJS. Nope.

55:13

Wait. Yeah. No. Lewis Law, friend

55:15

of the show Lewis Law asked

55:17

what DDR5D RAM kit would you

55:20

guys recommend for an Asrock X870?

55:22

So X870, high end, not quite

55:24

sure what what CPU you're pairing

55:26

it with or what you do,

55:28

those are always the follow-up questions.

55:30

But for the most part, I

55:32

feel like 6,000, XBO6, is like

55:34

the sweet spot. I know it

55:36

can go higher, like, definitely, but...

55:38

I don't know. I prefer stability.

55:40

Yeah. And if you're going to

55:42

do something passagetic, I feel like

55:44

6,000 is safe. I mean, I

55:46

think what, if you have the

55:48

new boards, you can go up

55:50

to 6,400 and be safe supported

55:52

supposedly. Yeah, yeah. We haven't tested

55:54

that a ton, at least on

55:56

our end here. But yeah, I

55:58

would, I would do. Yeah, testing

56:00

does sometimes be testing, Brad. Yeah,

56:02

I think I err on having

56:04

lived that fast RAM's life for

56:07

a while and watching it blow

56:09

up my face pretty spectacularly. I'm

56:11

happy to live a humble 6,000

56:13

now. Yeah, yeah, that's what I

56:15

would aim for. Brad, any thoughts?

56:17

That's my generic answer as well.

56:19

If he's looking for specific manufacturers

56:21

and stuff, I can't get into

56:23

that, but 6,400 is what I

56:25

would. Yeah. And here's a good

56:27

follow-up DM question from Derek Chang.

56:29

Asked, wait, can you see dims?

56:31

I'm sorry, see you dims in

56:33

the same you dim slots? Yes,

56:35

the pinout and the actual slot

56:37

itself is the same. You cannot

56:39

mix and match, though. And as

56:41

of right now, CUDIMs are only

56:43

supported on Aero Lake. We did

56:45

actually test slotting them in 14th-gen

56:47

and AM5. Yeah. I don't remember.

56:49

With mixed results. One through an

56:51

error, like a Bios type message

56:54

popped up, there's like, hey, this

56:56

is not the right memory for

56:58

this board, but if you do

57:00

this thing, then we'll switch over

57:02

and it'll turn off the clock

57:04

chip and it'll probably work. and

57:06

we didn't do that because we

57:08

were afraid we would then not

57:10

be able to turn the clock

57:12

chip back on and use it

57:14

for other motherboards. Yeah and these

57:16

were test benches so we didn't

57:18

want to screw and then the

57:20

other one just didn't boot like

57:22

it black screened or it worked

57:24

but it was janky I guess

57:26

it was the right way anyway

57:28

don't see see you dims I

57:30

think are still firmly in my

57:32

not for now category well and

57:34

when you did get into work

57:36

on air like the benefit was

57:38

not really there quite yet, especially

57:41

for the price. Yeah, for the

57:43

considering the kind of high increase

57:45

in price and the amount of

57:47

jank required to get it working,

57:49

the performance boost was not there

57:51

for the stuff that we didn't

57:53

do the full suite of tests.

57:55

At some point we should probably

57:57

revisit that maybe after the biases

57:59

have settled out a little bit.

58:01

And actually Nick says he was

58:03

able to use a CUD. kit

58:05

on an X870E Tai Chi with

58:07

the 9800X3D, what clocks? But he

58:09

says he was hit or miss.

58:11

So yeah, it's not officially supported.

58:13

Maybe you can get it to

58:15

work. Maybe you can clock it

58:17

down. But yeah, I personally wouldn't.

58:19

Per our last conversation, I prefer

58:21

stability. So I wouldn't. Gordon, Gordon

58:23

put this in the end of

58:26

the 9800X3D video, I think. But

58:28

if I recall right the Intel

58:30

14th gen board. Oh, it was

58:32

the error-like one, yeah, right. The

58:34

Intel 14th-gen board worked through the

58:36

error message and the AM5 board,

58:38

which was not an 870, it

58:40

was the earlier one, because it

58:42

was before we, the 900X3D, through

58:44

an error, and booted sometimes and

58:46

sometimes just wouldn't boot and was

58:48

weird. So. So, we will see,

58:50

is this something that can be

58:52

supported with a Bios update? I

58:54

actually don't know. That was my

58:56

understanding from reading, I think, Micron's

58:58

fact on what CU-Dims are, said

59:00

that with Bios updates, they'll be

59:02

able to, Motherboards that don't support

59:04

CU-Dims, or CBUs that don't support

59:06

CU-Dims, will be able to disable

59:08

the clock chip selectively, but that

59:10

Bios support, that's a future thing,

59:13

not a current thing. Was my

59:15

understanding. Oh, and then Nick follows

59:17

up and says the memory speed

59:19

he was able to hit was

59:21

3200 mega transfers per second So

59:23

I got it up to 84,

59:25

but I had to do the

59:27

half. Well, I mean on on

59:29

the 9800 Oh, oh on the

59:31

9800 X3. Yeah, that seems right.

59:33

So Jeddak Yeah, oh, Jeddak even

59:35

Let's get over here to mostly

59:37

running at Stockish has a good

59:39

Black Friday question. We're gonna hold

59:41

that till next week Because we're

59:43

going to have a whole Black

59:45

Friday episode. It is the blackest

59:47

Tuesday. What is it the Green

59:49

Lantern says? The darkest night. So

59:51

yada yada. Elena will be here

59:53

with deals. I think that's the

59:55

exact quote. Yeah. I just have

59:57

no idea what we're talking about.

1:00:00

We got a question from Will

1:00:02

Smith, wow. Welcome to Earth. Will

1:00:04

Smith? The Will Smith? There's a

1:00:06

Will Smith. The Will Smith. No,

1:00:08

I'm pretty sure it's The Will

1:00:11

Smith. Wow, I guess he's a

1:00:13

big PC builder. What's up with

1:00:15

motherboard prices, guys? The new chipset

1:00:17

seem real expensive. Wow, that's a

1:00:20

really good question. Very smart person,

1:00:22

too. Yeah. Yeah, a lot of

1:00:24

a lot of commentary. Yeah, well,

1:00:26

I don't know if it's in

1:00:28

relation to AMD or Intel specifically

1:00:30

But yeah the X 1870 Line

1:00:32

is out for the new Verizon

1:00:34

9,000 CPUs. We have yet to

1:00:36

get any in for the the

1:00:38

next chipset the B chipset or

1:00:40

even the wait they got rid

1:00:42

of the a chipset right? Now it's

1:00:45

just two levels of B or

1:00:47

three levels of B. I can't

1:00:49

remember. A I think is available

1:00:51

for pre-built at the very cheap

1:00:53

other So yeah, so for Rise

1:00:55

of 9,000 the newest chipsets are

1:00:58

definitely the high-end and then the

1:01:00

Arrow Lake You know I haven't seen

1:01:02

too many rounds up of a

1:01:04

Arrow Lake Motherboards, but yeah for

1:01:06

the most part I mean we're

1:01:08

talking about high-end They're all expensive.

1:01:11

Yeah, yeah, I guess the the

1:01:13

Mr. Will Smith is trying to

1:01:15

ask you know, why why so

1:01:17

high? Why are there no cheap

1:01:19

motherboards for all these hot new

1:01:21

CP? I guess is the question.

1:01:23

Yeah, well, I think I was

1:01:25

interpreting it. With each new generation,

1:01:27

I think companies want to lead

1:01:29

with their highest in stuff and

1:01:31

they know that enthusiasts are probably

1:01:33

the ones buying early, right? So

1:01:35

then the the lower chipset, the

1:01:38

lower cost chipsets will come out

1:01:40

later, is like the major idea. I

1:01:42

think I have behind it. But

1:01:45

overall, I feel like we have

1:01:47

seen a trend in motherboard prices

1:01:49

kind of creeping up. But then

1:01:51

again, there's been a lot of

1:01:53

features. So I feel like when

1:01:56

13th-gen, when we built my 13th-gen

1:01:58

machine and you were like, hey, you want

1:02:00

a white motherboard here's the white

1:02:02

motherboard it's really expensive and it turns

1:02:04

out it's gonna kill a bunch of

1:02:07

CPUs for you that was like

1:02:09

a five hundred and fifty dollar motherboard

1:02:11

I was like that is an insane

1:02:13

price to pay for a motherboard

1:02:15

and now these are all starting at

1:02:18

like five hundred bucks is what

1:02:20

it feels like and it feels like

1:02:22

that jump happened in the last like

1:02:24

two Like, does 14th-gen count as

1:02:26

a generation? I don't know. It feels

1:02:29

like it's happened in the last generation

1:02:31

in a half. Technically, yes. It's

1:02:33

gotten worse. It's gotten worse, but this

1:02:35

has been a trend that's been going

1:02:38

on for a little bit. Like,

1:02:40

since before the pandemic, motherboard price has

1:02:42

been creeping up. If you spent

1:02:44

$250 back in the day, you'd have

1:02:46

like a baller motherboard. Now that's entry

1:02:49

level. Part of it, I think,

1:02:51

is, one, technology is just getting more

1:02:53

expensive as we're just getting more expensive

1:02:55

as we're seeing with everything with

1:02:57

everything, as we're seeing with everything, as

1:03:00

we're seeing with everything. I think the

1:03:02

companies are trying to make some

1:03:04

money. And Adams, right, whenever a new

1:03:06

CPU generation launches, usually it's only the

1:03:09

flagship boards that come out for

1:03:11

like six months. And then it's like,

1:03:13

okay, if you're worried about value,

1:03:15

wait six months, you're going to wait

1:03:17

six months to get this chip on

1:03:20

sale. That's when the B class

1:03:22

boards will come out. But three, I

1:03:24

think it's worth keeping a mind that

1:03:26

motherboards don't just hold the CPU.

1:03:28

They also need to build in additional

1:03:31

layers of the PCB, additional traces, all

1:03:33

that kind of stuff, for PCII5,

1:03:35

for all these different DDR5. Like they're

1:03:37

infinitely more complex, and they generate more

1:03:40

heat, and it's a lot more

1:03:42

technically complex than what motherboards used to

1:03:44

be. So I think that plays

1:03:46

a large part of it. I also

1:03:49

think a large part of it is

1:03:51

companies are just trying to make

1:03:53

money, but I think the answer is

1:03:55

somewhere between those two. There are a

1:03:58

lot of hardware features too. I

1:04:00

know a lot of these boards that

1:04:02

we got in. We're like, oh, check

1:04:04

out this quick release slot or

1:04:06

the the heat sink that goes over

1:04:09

all these M.D.2's is just like

1:04:11

a, you just kind of flip a

1:04:13

tab and you don't have to unscrew

1:04:15

anything. So there's, and then there's

1:04:17

the UAFI that they're constantly redoing. Aces

1:04:20

just updated theirs to be an HD

1:04:22

now. Now you can get in

1:04:24

a full HD. I will say the

1:04:26

cheapest motherboard that I got in this

1:04:29

roundup was a gigabyte X870, ORIS

1:04:31

Elite Wi-Fi 7 for 290. Okay, that's

1:04:33

a reasonable price for that. And this

1:04:35

one actually does come in a

1:04:37

white version as well. So it's the

1:04:40

ice version. I don't have the

1:04:42

ice version, but it. they do have

1:04:44

a white version at 290, which yeah,

1:04:46

like you said, white white versions

1:04:48

used to be a real high-end thing.

1:04:51

So this is not bad. Aesus had

1:04:53

the Tough Gaming X870 plus Wi-Fi

1:04:55

for 310. So a little bit more,

1:04:57

but also X870, which is, you know,

1:05:00

a higher-end chipset. So, yeah. Okay,

1:05:02

I don't know. I mean, it seems

1:05:04

like maybe there are more layers.

1:05:06

One of the things I was looking

1:05:08

at, it's funny, this is one of

1:05:11

the things that's not documented super

1:05:13

well anywhere, because nobody's like, hey, our

1:05:15

motherboard has 12 layers or eight layers

1:05:17

or whatever. But it seems like

1:05:19

generally the design, the number of layers

1:05:22

is creeping up as we get things

1:05:24

that are incompatible with being adjacent

1:05:26

to each other, like Wi-Fi and audio

1:05:28

on the same PCB. Yeah, I don't

1:05:31

know. It's a weird, it is

1:05:33

unsettling, because at the rate that they're

1:05:35

getting more expensive, they're going to

1:05:37

be more expensive than the CPU soon,

1:05:39

which feels bad, man. I genuinely think

1:05:42

that's half the answer. Things are

1:05:44

just getting so much more complex and

1:05:46

have so much more power and so

1:05:48

much more heat that they need

1:05:50

to invest more in the motherboards. But

1:05:53

that being said, it sucks spending as

1:05:55

much or more on your motherboard

1:05:57

than you do on your high-end gaming

1:05:59

chip. And get where this question

1:06:01

is coming from. I think I feel

1:06:04

less bad about it on the AM5

1:06:06

side than I do on the

1:06:08

Intel side where that motherboard's a one-off.

1:06:10

And the AM5 you have some downstream,

1:06:13

what is it, downstream optionality I

1:06:15

think is what you would, how I

1:06:17

would say that. I did. It's a

1:06:19

super synergy talk right there. Yeah,

1:06:21

wow. You've got to enhance your verticals

1:06:24

guys. Get in there and really multiply

1:06:26

your downstream optionality for optimal shareholder

1:06:28

value. I hate this. I mean, the

1:06:30

other thing is, yeah, like, you

1:06:32

could theoretically plop in your brand new

1:06:35

9800X3D in a B650 motherboard theoretically, as

1:06:37

long as it supports it, which

1:06:39

I believe most of them do at

1:06:42

this point. And yeah, I've actually used

1:06:44

this MSI-Pro B650 motherboard. It's $130

1:06:46

on New Egg right now. So, like,

1:06:48

it's... there still are options out there

1:06:51

like I think we see a

1:06:53

lot of high-end stuff because that's also

1:06:55

what companies like to send yeah and

1:06:57

that's what a motherboard should cost

1:06:59

a hundred and thirty dollars I remember

1:07:02

when I bought a the first

1:07:04

time I bought a motherboard that cost

1:07:06

more than a hundred dollars like this

1:07:08

is too much roll it back

1:07:10

yeah well and then like especially that

1:07:13

that roundup that I got in recently

1:07:15

I was looking at all the

1:07:17

features too and it's like okay well

1:07:19

I like to have a very fast

1:07:22

gigabit Ethernet port or 2.5 I'm

1:07:24

sorry 2.5 or 10 or actually some

1:07:26

of them have five so like

1:07:28

usually the AC's pro art definitely has

1:07:30

more features that are for quick quick

1:07:33

file transfer things like that some

1:07:35

of them have Wi-Fi 7 all of

1:07:37

the new X870 have USB4 that's kind

1:07:39

of a selling point of probably

1:07:41

the biggest selling point of the the

1:07:44

chipset specifically is that guaranteed inclusion so

1:07:46

yeah they kind of segmented out

1:07:48

still so it's you I doubt you're

1:07:50

gonna find a hundred and fifty dollar

1:07:53

motherboard with a ten gig ethernet

1:07:55

port right but maybe yeah I don't

1:07:57

know let's get over to another

1:07:59

question pyro cumulus asked one that I'm

1:08:01

not oh Last note, if Gordon were

1:08:04

here, I think he'd point out

1:08:06

that also motherboard manufacturers are always the

1:08:08

ones that get stuck with the things

1:08:10

that they need to throw in.

1:08:12

Oh. Oh, you got to add in

1:08:15

a PCIE cable? Yeah, make the motherboard

1:08:17

manufacturers do it. Oh, you got

1:08:19

to add in this extra thing. Yeah,

1:08:21

yeah, you have to make the

1:08:23

motherboard manufacturers do it. So. Look, all

1:08:26

those tiny screws don't pay for themselves.

1:08:28

Exactly. Front of the show pirate

1:08:30

cumulus Asa is super micro screwed. Oh,

1:08:32

yeah, they've got some stuff going on.

1:08:35

Like, there's lawsuits and like legal

1:08:37

proceedings and all sorts of. Yeah, it

1:08:39

seems seems iffy. Yeah, what's going on

1:08:41

there? Nexus did a really nice

1:08:43

expose video on all the close family

1:08:46

ties between suppliers that it has. There's

1:08:48

an activist like investors slash journalists

1:08:50

firm called Hindenburg Research that did its

1:08:52

own follow-up investigation. Now they're threatened

1:08:54

to be delisted by NASDAQ, I think

1:08:57

it is. Their very top-ranked public accountant.

1:08:59

Said yeah, we ain't working with

1:09:01

these guys anymore Wow So yeah, it's

1:09:03

looking interesting. I don't think they're screwed

1:09:06

No, I think there's still a

1:09:08

very good company who does what they

1:09:10

do I think it's just perhaps cultural

1:09:12

differences in the way Asian versus

1:09:14

American expectations are for paperwork and stuff

1:09:17

Is it it's not looking good?

1:09:19

Is this all downstream of them getting

1:09:21

in trouble for telling stuff to China

1:09:23

that they weren't supposed to sell

1:09:25

to China or is that something else?

1:09:28

This is about like his brother's companies

1:09:30

are the suppliers for them get

1:09:32

sweetheart deals. There's a bunch of iffy

1:09:35

accounting practices like I would go best

1:09:37

in my off the cuff recollection.

1:09:39

I would go if you're truly interested

1:09:41

in this go see Steve a gamers

1:09:44

next is deep dive go read

1:09:46

that Hindenburg research thing. I don't think

1:09:48

they're screwed, but it definitely took

1:09:50

some of the lint off the diamond

1:09:52

or whatever you want to say. Interesting.

1:09:55

Wow. All right. Yeah, maybe. we'll

1:09:57

ask Ian next time he's on two.

1:09:59

I feel like it's definitely Ian question.

1:10:01

Roll the dice now. Oh, how

1:10:03

screwed, okay. One out of ten, ten

1:10:06

being the most screwed. We are not

1:10:08

financial analysts. Oh, one out of

1:10:10

ten. Oh, that's that's super screwed. All

1:10:12

right, yeah. One no screwed or ten

1:10:15

the most screwed? One is the

1:10:17

least critical fail. No, one's a critical.

1:10:19

One's usually the worst. D and

1:10:21

D. No, ten is the usually bigger

1:10:23

number better, Adam, Adam is my understanding,

1:10:26

Adam is my understanding. No, that's bad

1:10:28

news. Oh, okay. Well, here we go.

1:10:30

Yeah, Steve predicted it here. Yeah, Steve.

1:10:32

I'm sorry, Steve. I'll send you a

1:10:35

letter, a handwritten letter, apologizing. Oh, no,

1:10:37

it's, it's, they cancel each other out

1:10:39

because you use the PC World logo

1:10:42

on your box, so. There we go.

1:10:44

Just like we always say always be

1:10:46

testing right now. Always be hitting that.

1:10:49

Also a front of the show date

1:10:51

is asked are we going to keep

1:10:53

these as show pieces? Yes we're going

1:10:55

to have them around and actually so

1:10:58

Alex we're basing all of our coverage

1:11:00

on these from here on out. Yeah.

1:11:02

Hey want to know how the new

1:11:04

59 is? Yeah there you go. Well

1:11:06

we're going to roll the Steve and

1:11:08

Gabris Nexus is going to let us

1:11:11

know where here's the one to ten.

1:11:13

Five stars. Yeah, would save a lot

1:11:15

of them on benchmarking is all I'm

1:11:17

saying. Hundreds of hours. Yeah, yeah.

1:11:19

Yeah, how many frames per second

1:11:22

does cyberpunk get on a 50-90?

1:11:24

Five. Yeah, perfect. Got it. Done.

1:11:26

We're benchmarking. Oh, I got to

1:11:29

do it three times than average

1:11:31

it. Yeah, yeah. So I will

1:11:33

say that Alex on the video

1:11:36

team and Mike Crider on

1:11:38

the... News team. The news

1:11:40

team. He's an editor? What's

1:11:42

this official title? Actually, I

1:11:44

don't know. Right. He's a

1:11:46

writer. They're both D&D guys.

1:11:48

Oh, wow. So I'm actually

1:11:50

going to have them help

1:11:52

me come up with a, a,

1:11:54

I love doing these PC, these

1:11:56

live PC builds. We're like, we

1:11:58

have the chat. figure out what

1:12:01

we're going to put in it. We're

1:12:03

actually going to make a D&D adventure

1:12:05

of a PC build where we use

1:12:07

dice rolls to determine the parts. Yeah,

1:12:10

that sounds fun. Yeah, we get a

1:12:12

popamatic so we can have that link

1:12:14

every time we hit the button. No,

1:12:17

we got a call Wendell because yeah,

1:12:19

if they're saying Wendell has been the

1:12:21

one who's like done the hardcore testing

1:12:23

to make sure that these are legit,

1:12:26

then yeah, we need to call them

1:12:28

up. All I know is the old

1:12:30

purple spins a lot longer than the

1:12:33

cat dice. Uh, yeah. Okay. So, yeah,

1:12:35

that's it for today. I'm gonna call

1:12:37

this a show over. Wow, shutting it

1:12:40

down. Yeah, shutting it down. Much time.

1:12:42

Uh, oh, oh, I'm sorry. You know

1:12:44

what? Oh, I'm sorry. You know what?

1:12:46

Oh, false stop. or in the live

1:12:49

stream and he was referencing the white

1:12:51

steam deck. No, I did not buy

1:12:53

a white steam deck. That went up

1:12:56

today, right? Yesterday. Yesterday. Okay, well it's

1:12:58

probably already sold out. It was sold

1:13:00

out in moments. Look, the press release

1:13:02

that we got from Valve was like,

1:13:05

hey look, here's what we're going to

1:13:07

do. We're going to do all these

1:13:09

out based on the number of steam

1:13:12

decks sold in the different regions. So

1:13:14

if your region sold more steam decks,

1:13:16

there's more of them going there. Oh,

1:13:18

okay, there you go. Three and five

1:13:21

business days. Not sold out. You see,

1:13:23

then it's not that, it's not that

1:13:25

limited. I'm waiting for, I'm telling you,

1:13:28

I'm waiting for the, for the spice

1:13:30

orange one. And Adam's ordering him live

1:13:32

right now. Yeah, he's ordering it right

1:13:34

now. No. He's looking at his fingers

1:13:37

hovering over here. If you use my

1:13:39

laptop, the track pad. I do like

1:13:41

the white. But like I said I

1:13:44

already got that other limited edition one

1:13:46

with the the transparent and I actually

1:13:48

like 20 20 by 20 white steam

1:13:50

decks You got three can't see oh

1:13:53

oh oh yeah yeah 20 yeah yeah

1:13:55

critical hit critical hit yeah no sorry

1:13:57

sorry sorry I'm not gonna I'm not

1:14:00

gonna I'm not gonna bite unless I

1:14:02

hear that it smells different than I

1:14:04

can but it's you know it's a

1:14:07

steam deck like vanilla scented like a

1:14:09

vanilla scented candle kind of situation yeah

1:14:11

what what would a white steam deck

1:14:13

or what should a white steam deck

1:14:16

smell like probably white chocolate white gator

1:14:18

raid white gatorade ice I like all

1:14:20

this. Okay, maybe I should buy. I

1:14:23

think it's just to see if it

1:14:25

smells like white gatorade. No, for science.

1:14:27

Perfectly real whereby. Save it for the

1:14:29

Steamback 2 coming 2025. Year of Linux,

1:14:32

you got to save your money for

1:14:34

all those links and else coming out

1:14:36

next year. That's the thing. Well, that

1:14:39

is true. It's the future. Okay, check

1:14:41

back next week for your fix of

1:14:43

PC Talk here on the full nerd.

1:14:45

If you want to listen to listen

1:14:48

to us on the go. subscribe to

1:14:50

us over on Spotify, Apple, podcast, pocketcasts.

1:14:52

Uh, now we're on Deezer. On Deezer.

1:14:55

Thanks to Will Smith. Uh, you should,

1:14:57

you should hop on Deezer, subscribe to

1:14:59

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1:15:01

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1:15:08

it. I dare you. I guess. And

1:15:11

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1:15:13

Blue Sky. I'm going to create a

1:15:15

full nerd for Blue Sky. Follow us

1:15:18

over there. I don't know what the

1:15:20

hell we're going to do. It's PC

1:15:22

World HQ on Blue Sky because somebody

1:15:24

already took PC. What? Look, who took

1:15:27

the Blue Sky PC world? And on

1:15:29

top of that, the invidious G-Force account

1:15:31

on Blue Sky is a parody account,

1:15:34

so don't fall for that. The general

1:15:36

rule on Blue Sky is it's really

1:15:38

easy to set up a domain. So

1:15:40

if it's not, like, if it doesn't

1:15:43

end in dot-gov, it's probably not a

1:15:45

government account, right? There's senators and house

1:15:47

members and stuff on there. They all

1:15:50

have their dot-gov accounts. We can do

1:15:52

the same. I can help. you all

1:15:54

with the PC World stuff. So actually,

1:15:56

yeah, because we could get PCworld.com. PCworld.com

1:15:59

is available. We're the only ones to

1:16:01

control that. Whoever has the DS. We

1:16:03

can change the thing. Oh yeah, yeah.

1:16:06

We're just going to reach out to

1:16:08

our IT department that always works. I

1:16:10

usually bring gear when I talk to

1:16:12

our engineering department. Yeah, yeah. Hey, engineering

1:16:15

department. Do we have the domain for

1:16:17

this? Yeah. Oh, oh, I'm seeing PCworld.com's

1:16:19

not working anymore. Anyway, joking our IT

1:16:22

department. We're like you guys at IT.

1:16:24

Yeah, shout out to IT. They're not

1:16:26

working. Except for Adam. They're not watching.

1:16:28

Anyway, the end of the notes, I

1:16:31

would like to thank everybody that joined

1:16:33

me here today, including you. But first,

1:16:35

I'm going to thank Brad. Brad, thank

1:16:38

you for joining us. Well, thank you

1:16:40

for having me. It's been a pleasure.

1:16:42

Yeah. Thank you, Will Smith, for joining

1:16:45

us. I'm thrilled to be here. It's

1:16:47

always a pleasure, sir. I think that

1:16:49

you are 13 out of 20. Yeah,

1:16:51

no, that's average. Some people in the

1:16:54

comments would say that that is too

1:16:56

high, but you know, yeah, I'd like

1:16:58

to think I'm average. I think you

1:17:01

did a great job. The 13, 13

1:17:03

out of 20 is not bad. And

1:17:05

thank you to Steve for, for, for,

1:17:07

for not actually sending these. I did

1:17:10

buy these with money. Not a product

1:17:12

placement. Not a product placement. but we

1:17:14

are gonna have someone with them so.

1:17:17

And thank you Willis Live for controlling

1:17:19

the Virgals and Horizontal. Get us out

1:17:21

of here. All righty, thank you Adam.

1:17:23

Thank you everyone for tuning in and

1:17:26

we will see you next time. Bye.