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Peloton. Visit One Peloton.com. Welcome

1:05

to the Lacey CEO podcast,

1:07

I'm Jay Lu. Join my

1:09

conversations with the entrepreneurs behind

1:11

the iconic brands we all

1:13

know and love. Hey potty

1:15

Pam, in this episode we're

1:17

joined by Anita Sarka, the

1:20

founder of Hero Packaging

1:22

and the voice behind

1:24

Sell Anything Online. We'll

1:26

dive into marketing in

1:28

the modern age, our

1:30

latest marketing wins. and

1:32

the latest on the

1:34

tariffs in the US

1:36

and then we'll get

1:38

a little personal talking

1:41

about the loneliness that

1:43

can come along with

1:45

leadership, the misconceptions

1:48

people have about us

1:51

and our businesses. It's

1:53

real and filtered and

1:55

full of insights. Let's

1:57

get into it. out

2:00

than me shouting. One, just keep talking.

2:02

If you haven't tuned into the podcast

2:04

before, this is not what I normally

2:06

sound like. I mean, it's science of

2:08

a good time. Yes, exactly. We have

2:10

today with us, Anita Sarka. Hello, welcome

2:12

back. I always love chatting with you.

2:14

Thank you. Third time? Is it? Yes.

2:16

Amazing. I feel like this is the

2:18

tenth. Yeah, it does actually. Yeah, but

2:20

I love it. I love coming in

2:23

here. We always have the best chats.

2:25

I know. How is hero packaging? I'm

2:27

great. I think hero is like I

2:29

so I think I told you this

2:31

last time but I feel like we're

2:33

doing so much better and it just

2:35

feels really good. I just got my

2:37

numbers back for March and I was

2:39

really worried about it so like I

2:41

had we had a really good revenue

2:43

month but we also had a really

2:45

good revenue month in February but we

2:48

weren't profitable in February and then in

2:50

March we got our numbers back and

2:52

we all yes so congratulations me. big

2:54

equipment. Yes. And that's paying off? That

2:56

is the thing that is saving us.

2:58

Amazing. If I had not innovative to

3:00

manufacturing, we would have died in the

3:02

bum. Wow. That is the truth of

3:04

the matter. Like if we just stayed

3:06

to what we knew and we just

3:08

imported our goods and then sold them,

3:10

that was, it's declining. I mean, still

3:12

high, but it's declining. Manufacturing is giving

3:15

us bigger margins and we can turn

3:17

around things quickly. People like made in

3:19

Australia. We feel like we can control

3:21

everything from start to start to finish.

3:23

Yeah. and it's doing really well. So

3:25

that's good. Amazing. Congratulations. That's so good.

3:27

I mean, it's like always scary to

3:29

business is about like a series of

3:31

taking different risks, right? Not that initial

3:33

risk. And sometimes you can be scarier

3:35

when you're bigger because you're It's going

3:37

to be a lot of money. A

3:40

lot of money. And you have to

3:42

put the money in before you see

3:44

any returns for like six months. And

3:46

you invest in, like we need a

3:48

lot of people to do it. So

3:50

we need to invest in the people,

3:52

the machinery, like the inks, the toners,

3:54

everything. And then it's like, do we

3:56

make sales or not? And it's kind

3:58

of scary. But tell me, I want

4:00

to know how showpos. going. I think

4:02

everyone wants to know how showplay going.

4:04

Showplay's been really good. It's been a

4:07

really exciting year. Last week I was

4:09

in Miami and LA and tomorrow I'm

4:11

going to Coachella. It's just insane even

4:13

this weekend we were like as a

4:15

math geek and a math ski. I

4:17

was like I do love maths and

4:19

I love maths. I'm trying to say

4:21

mathematics. I don't think you guys can

4:23

tell because of my broken voice. I'm

4:25

trying to make a joke and it's

4:27

not any. But we were like, this

4:29

had a big one this Sunday and

4:31

then we're just like watching it with

4:34

the entire cast. I'm like, how are

4:36

we in the show? And then before

4:38

we were like, actually we had all

4:40

the like bachelor girls at our Rachel

4:42

Kirkano activation at our event. I mean,

4:44

we basically didn't influence a collab and

4:46

it couldn't have gone better because she

4:48

was just like so lovely, so lovely,

4:50

so lovely, so on brand. like you

4:52

know the influences like genuinely want to

4:54

work with you? Yes, I love the

4:56

clothes, loved her, I thought it was

4:59

amazing. And then we ended up activating

5:01

like as the plans like progressed, we

5:03

activated essentially in Sydney, in Miami and

5:05

LA, like the unwell network gave us

5:07

a boat. to like, because they want

5:09

her there. I thought you would just

5:11

went to their event or something. They

5:13

organized it for us. And she's just

5:15

like amazing. And I really, you know

5:17

what I secretly kind of love, like,

5:19

you know, we had the support of

5:21

the PI agency, we did have the

5:23

support of the local team, but I

5:26

was just there with our head of

5:28

brand, and then we were like. in

5:30

this like hotel room sending out careers

5:32

on the day before the event and

5:34

it had this really raw startup feel

5:36

yeah and I feel like I'm like

5:38

I'm like it's like start up and

5:40

just the fact that we were like

5:42

going out kids and family seemed so

5:44

far away I felt so like back

5:46

in like the startup days and that

5:48

kind of like I loved it it's

5:51

the nicest feeling to do all of

5:53

that stuff like but are they going

5:55

to post about it was very like

5:57

gratifying The idea that you can still

5:59

be excited about your business, how many

6:01

years has been 12 years? 15 this

6:03

year. 15 years crazy. you can still

6:05

feel excited and have that small business

6:07

mentality and grow this thing and like

6:09

feel like. everything is new and you're

6:11

like reinventing and stuff. That's amazing. People

6:13

get so bored. Yeah. You know, people

6:15

like I want out soon, I'm done

6:18

with this, like I want to move

6:20

on to the next thing, shiny object

6:22

syndrome. I reckon you have the ability

6:24

to have the shiny object syndrome, but

6:26

within your own business, because you get

6:28

to go, oh well I want to

6:30

work with that person, I want to

6:32

bring out this idea, da da da

6:34

da da da. You get to do

6:36

whatever you, whatever you want, and you're

6:38

making, There's like opportunities there, but yeah.

6:40

What's our marketing win you've had? So

6:42

boring. I switched email platforms and it

6:45

went so well because it saved me

6:47

$1,500 USD plus another $1,000 with another

6:49

app that I was using. The

6:51

main point is like, if you

6:53

can review your expenses, like I

6:55

just looked at my email platform,

6:57

I'm like, this is costing me

6:59

so much money. If I can

7:01

switch over, I am saving so

7:03

much. I am saving so much.

7:05

And it's the same deliverability. Email

7:07

still confuses me because we used

7:09

to be on like for super

7:11

cheap. And I think maybe because

7:14

there were less emails around then,

7:16

maybe it's more like competition for

7:18

your inbox and the open rates

7:20

and you know, but we were

7:22

getting better results back then relatively

7:24

compared to and spending nothing. You

7:26

know, I even look at like

7:28

some shark tank businesses. I see

7:30

how much they're getting charged for

7:32

email and I can't believe how

7:34

high that is. It's a lot.

7:36

to be honest with you they

7:38

all work the same just look

7:40

at them and see which one

7:42

is more cost effective honestly yeah

7:44

because you don't have to just

7:47

go with what everyone else is

7:49

using yeah can choose like something

7:51

that maybe people aren't using but

7:53

also costs you much less yeah

7:55

think about it what's your marketing

7:57

win it's on a major win

7:59

but our senior digital marketing manager

8:01

went to a tick-talk workshop and

8:03

I sometimes go to the conferences

8:05

and learn absolutely nothing yes I

8:07

can't like pay attention just like

8:09

university but like She came back

8:11

with just like so much you

8:13

can do so I don't even

8:15

have the answers I feel like

8:18

there's lots of like just resources

8:20

out there that everyone can be

8:22

learning from that I just feel

8:24

like there's so much more we

8:26

can do something like everyone at

8:28

home this much you can do

8:30

it was about doing ads better

8:32

creating a content flywheel using just

8:34

different like content pillars so much

8:36

more that we could be doing

8:38

and it's like I talk about

8:40

content all the time but it's

8:42

like okay there's just like actually

8:44

that's from TikTok itself can you

8:46

create a piece of content to

8:49

break down what she learned so

8:51

that we can all learn from

8:53

you because I feel like we

8:55

need to know I think like

8:57

everyone would love to know that

8:59

yeah especially get the ads piece

9:01

I feel like it's really because

9:03

we kind of like feel like

9:05

I've nailed like a nail like

9:07

Google ads a meta You must

9:09

try it a lot. Yeah, I

9:11

think, I mean, I don't, Waldi

9:13

does it, so that's why. Oh,

9:15

okay, yeah. Now, but I think

9:17

now that he is like taking

9:19

it seriously, he likes to hear

9:22

from someone that's not me, to

9:24

take it seriously, so he likes

9:26

to hear from someone that's not

9:28

me, to take it seriously, so.

9:30

Do you know what I don't

9:32

like seeing, Shopoe's competitors, and they

9:34

come up in my, like the

9:36

ads all we're doing wrong? Yeah.

9:38

do it. Watch the space. Something

9:40

else that came out this week

9:42

was the US tariffs? Yes. We

9:44

need to talk about it because

9:46

you are going to Coachella right

9:48

like so you have a US

9:50

market? Yes, huge. Yes, that's going

9:53

to affect you a lot. First

9:55

of all guys when we're talking

9:57

about the tariffs and duties like

9:59

This is not the news. This

10:01

is just our opinions and what

10:03

we have remembered from the news

10:05

and Tiktok. So don't quote us.

10:07

Don't quote us. Don't quote us.

10:09

Next minute news.com. Are you? We're

10:11

like, we're watching a lot on

10:13

YouTube about like how they did

10:15

this with like, they raised a

10:17

piece of legislation in the 30s

10:19

where they introduced tariffs and duties

10:21

and right before the recession. the

10:24

fuck well actually if we go

10:26

back further I think in the

10:28

20s it was America 20s movies

10:30

no the 20s they actually introduced

10:32

free trade in globally and it

10:34

made everyone do so well the

10:36

whole world was thriving because of

10:38

it then they imposed the tariffs

10:40

yeah like losers sorry no not

10:42

to be political my opinion only

10:44

and then it there was a

10:46

recession and now you can see

10:48

the impact of these tariffs so

10:50

in any implemented them like immediately

10:52

isn't it like government and like

10:54

legislature and I have to give

10:57

us 12 months yeah doesn't the

10:59

Senate or someone need to like

11:01

be like, whoa, what are you

11:03

doing? I don't know how it

11:05

works. If you're putting a tariff

11:07

on steel, what happens to jobs

11:09

of companies that have to import

11:11

that steel? Exactly. What happens to

11:13

like their price, their cost prices

11:15

are going up. So what's going

11:17

to happen? Like I actually don't

11:19

know how it's going to play

11:21

out. What I do think I'm

11:23

trying to stay positive, I'm on

11:25

glass half all kind of person.

11:28

I actually think the good thing

11:30

is this is why it's so

11:32

important, more important than they're ever

11:34

to focus on brand. Because if

11:36

you have a brand that gives

11:38

people a reason to pay for

11:40

those duties and pay for those

11:42

prices, think about the other companies,

11:44

the US companies, the sheens and

11:46

the team moves, and even like

11:48

the target equivalent, like target came

11:50

up pricing level of competition that

11:52

now has to get the duties.

11:54

They don't really have a reason

11:56

to be less competitive. So if

11:59

you have a brand, a lot

12:01

of your competition is actually going

12:03

to, yes, it's going to be

12:05

American companies that are making, but

12:07

then if you're making it locally,

12:09

the pricing won't be great. Anyway,

12:11

so wouldn't we... I know. be

12:13

okay? I don't know. I think

12:15

it's going to really affect business

12:17

owners because what happens is they're

12:19

taxing the businesses but the tax

12:21

will ultimately go to the consumer

12:23

because the prices will be increased

12:25

and then it like so the

12:27

consumers will end up having to

12:29

pay more then there's inflation and

12:32

it just the whole world is

12:34

affected. So let's go through the

12:36

tariff numbers, right? So he's put

12:38

a blanket tariff on every single

12:40

country in the world of 10%.

12:42

There's no exceptions to that rule.

12:44

So 10%. So Australia has it,

12:46

UK has it, Canada and Mexico

12:48

all have 10%. Then he's added

12:50

on more tariffs based on his

12:52

opinions, based on his opinions. the

12:54

worst affected has a 54% tariff.

12:56

Anything that is imported from China,

12:58

Vietnam, 46%, so Nike's share price

13:00

dropped because they manufacture in Vietnam,

13:03

their shoes. So my understanding is

13:05

like that will impact probably a

13:07

couple like Nike. So this is

13:09

the thing, like I think the

13:11

de minimis charge hasn't changed. So

13:13

like for someone like Shopo, like

13:15

the US de minimis charge was

13:17

800. I don't know what it

13:19

is in Vietnam, assuming it's the

13:21

same. The way that's different is

13:23

if we're sending an order to

13:25

the US from Vietnam, under $800,

13:27

still no duties, whereas from China,

13:29

anything over $0, duties. So they're

13:31

for a big company, like Nike,

13:34

I think so much of what

13:36

they're doing is selling into distributors

13:38

and like stores. So that's all

13:40

going. That's going to F from

13:42

there, but like. It's really hard.

13:44

I mean like there are brands

13:46

who are starting now who just

13:48

make sure that they're priced higher

13:50

but what about brands that are

13:52

currently selling into the US and

13:54

now it's like they're not making

13:56

that much profit. I mean I

13:58

was looking this case study where

14:00

this company was selling t-shirts 10,000

14:02

units a month okay and their

14:04

duties just that that fee now

14:07

has gone from $6,000 USD to

14:09

21,000 USD per month. That's a

14:11

lot of money. So I guess

14:13

like we need to kind of

14:15

think about, you're saying glass half

14:17

full, like what can we do?

14:19

Yes. Well, I mean, it's like.

14:21

These duties already exist for the

14:23

EU and the UK, right? So

14:25

it's like, how are people winning

14:27

there? But we should find someone

14:29

who's winning in the UK, like

14:31

this and ask them what they

14:33

do. I think that if you

14:35

have to increase your prices, that's

14:38

okay. But you could be transparent

14:40

with your customers too. Yeah, absolutely.

14:42

I think another thing is like

14:44

the exchange rate is pretty favourable

14:46

for an Australian business right now.

14:48

No. The Australian dollar has dropped

14:50

a lot. So you're getting more

14:52

back. But if you have to

14:54

pay in U.S.D. for like if

14:56

you have to pay your supplies

14:58

in U.S.D. I just feel like

15:00

yeah, it's so much uncertainty. Gemma

15:02

thinks like, I mean, we've been

15:04

sending each other things about the

15:06

U.S. Tiktok thing. I lost my

15:09

Tiktok account because I signed up

15:11

when I was in New York.

15:13

She thinks it's going to reverse

15:15

back to Tiktok. But you'll still

15:17

be making sales. But you can't

15:19

put all your eggs in one

15:21

basket basically. And I think also

15:23

just coming back to the tariff

15:25

situation, I think that because it's

15:27

affecting everyone, you are not alone

15:29

in it. And I think that

15:31

there are ways to increase your

15:33

prices. There are ways to kind

15:35

of think creatively, build a brand.

15:37

Like there are things that you

15:40

can do and just know that

15:42

it's not just your business. It's

15:44

everyone's business. Very very intrigued to

15:46

see how it. Like that's insane.

15:48

It is. Wait, did I say

15:50

job title yet? Get started today

15:52

and see how you can avoid

15:54

the void and reach the right

15:56

buyers with LinkedIn ads. We'll even

15:58

give you a $100 credit on

16:00

your next campaign. Get started. at

16:02

LinkedIn.com/results. Terms and conditions apply. Compelletson

16:04

transformed to thea con entrena mientos,

16:06

that's a adapting a tea, that's

16:08

the show yoga, comariachi, as the

16:10

calico parati, in the spagnon, who

16:13

has said that's in person, though,

16:15

capitulo, enfrentano, uncambulcambulante, or superano, propelante,

16:17

flexibility, palleton, flexibidal, la hill in

16:19

three classes, embibo, or on demand,

16:21

tedious, tedious, tes, or on, té,

16:23

t'o, t'a, t'a, t'a, t'a, t'am,

16:25

t'am, t'a, t'a, t'a, t'a, t'a,

16:27

t'a, t'a, t'a, t'a, t'a, t'a,

16:29

t'a, t'a, t'a, t'a, t'a, t'a,

16:31

t'a, t'a, t So

16:44

I thought we'd pull the curtain back

16:46

on our founders in front of us

16:48

today and I've got some listener questions

16:50

and personal questions that I'd love for

16:52

you guys to answer if possible. First

16:55

one is, what's something you've achieved that

16:57

didn't feel as satisfying as you thought

16:59

it would and what did that teach

17:01

you? Oh my God, that's a great

17:03

question. Something that I didn't feel as

17:05

exciting. Do you know what? And this

17:07

is complete honesty. Every opportunity makes me

17:09

feel really excited. Like I have been

17:11

in this room three times and when

17:13

you emailed me to say, can you

17:15

come back on this, it makes me

17:18

feel like I... I can't believe I've

17:20

been asked to come back. No, I

17:22

mean it. Every opportunity makes me feel

17:24

like, I don't know if I belong,

17:26

but I like, I love it here

17:28

and it makes me feel really, really

17:30

happy. I don't think there's any opportunity

17:32

that's come up where I'm like, I'm

17:34

not that excited. Like, this is not.

17:36

Yeah, I love it. And when I

17:39

spoke at Bichcon, just sitting there and

17:41

be able to enjoy looking at others

17:43

knowing that I'm about to go up

17:45

on stage. I'm about to go up

17:47

on stage. And like people are gonna

17:49

listen to me. I fucking loved that.

17:51

Like I'm like, I'm like, I should

17:53

be so grateful for that. And so

17:55

like, honestly, that my answer is no,

17:57

I don't have any opportunity where I'm

18:00

like, I've done it now and I'm

18:02

not that now and I'm not having

18:04

any opportunity where I'm like, I've done

18:06

it now and I'm not that excited.

18:08

I basically watched this like tick-tock the

18:10

other day and this guy is like,

18:12

you know, I'm in that phase where

18:14

I'm making like $10,000 a month and

18:16

it's so exciting. Like I just booked

18:18

my first business slide. It's so exciting.

18:21

And I know that there's going to

18:23

be a point in my life where

18:25

I might be making 100K. a month

18:27

or a week, I probably will be

18:29

unfazed by it. So I really want

18:31

to like enjoy this moment. And I'm

18:33

like, that is so true. Because I

18:35

know that the small winds back at

18:37

those times, you know, the first time

18:39

we had like a bus side, we

18:42

had a carried brash or bus side

18:44

party because you're like young and you're

18:46

like sitting by the bus stop with

18:48

champagne being like waiting for a bus

18:50

to come. Whereas like now you wouldn't

18:52

do that you wouldn't do that. I

18:54

personally still get excited. So I think

18:56

it's like striking that balance and then

18:58

when you're small you almost have permission

19:00

to be like, you know, you know,

19:02

there is a bit of that. I

19:05

guess I'm very grateful that I always

19:07

stop to smell the roses and I

19:09

always celebrate it. I, you know, I

19:11

have lots of memories of sitting next

19:13

to like whoever I'm like, you know,

19:15

whether it's like my general manager or

19:17

worldly or someone else at work. And

19:19

then we're like, can you believe this?

19:21

let's just pause for a minute and

19:23

just think about what we're doing. So

19:26

I've always like had that mentality and

19:28

I definitely have friends now about them

19:30

with businesses who are just still trying

19:32

to get just trending water trying to

19:34

get to the next thing and just

19:36

saying like wow they're actually not enjoying

19:38

it so I just you're definitely a

19:40

great example of someone who does appreciate

19:42

every moment. every opportunity but I don't

19:44

think everyone does and I think having

19:47

been through the journey I have to

19:49

say like those small moments back in

19:51

the days are so memorable and everyone

19:53

should just like make the most of

19:55

it. Absolutely I think it's a real

19:57

privilege thought to think. I'm not that

19:59

excited about this opportunity. Like what a

20:01

privilege to be able to say that.

20:03

I think we should all be grateful

20:05

for every opportunity because they're like you

20:08

don't know when they're going to stop

20:10

when they like what the next one

20:12

is you should just enjoy every moment.

20:14

Yeah. You know what I genuinely get

20:16

excited about like it random's come on

20:18

I'm like I love Shippo or I

20:20

love the podcast like every person like

20:22

those little interactions I still tell Wally

20:24

like oh my god they're like I'm

20:26

so sorry I'm sorry I'm sorry I

20:29

was like no to my like that

20:31

person want to take a photo with

20:33

me he it's so exciting yeah you're

20:35

a celebrity oh no so I guess

20:37

kind of playing off that is there

20:39

a part of the journey that feels

20:41

lonely even now are you lonely at

20:43

all? Definitely to an extent. I think

20:45

less than ever I think the podcast

20:47

actually has really helped. I think I've

20:50

met so many more founders through the

20:52

podcast that I'd like similar like who

20:54

you know I guess this way I'm

20:56

like kind of like finding out who

20:58

my people are who I can talk

21:00

to or can turn to and ask

21:02

for help. So I think that's really

21:04

helped because none of my friends really

21:06

maybe bar one like a lot of

21:08

to not many of my friends have

21:10

businesses so that's like I don't have

21:13

people like in that respect to turn

21:15

to. I feel like you're not lonely

21:17

because you have good people around you.

21:19

I think more so I work it's

21:21

different now because back in the days

21:23

we were all like the same age

21:25

going out every weekend together and now

21:27

I'm like I feel more like at

21:29

least a banda pump than like in

21:31

a good way. No, she's just like,

21:34

you know, she's like not really part

21:36

of it. Yes. She's like, it's the

21:38

band of pump kids. And she's just

21:40

there like, a mom around. She's actually,

21:42

she's an idol. You know, but then

21:44

she's like, so anyway, I feel a

21:46

bit more like that now as that's

21:48

kind of changed from like the way

21:50

it was. I don't think that necessarily.

21:52

the van to pump kids are the

21:55

ones that you will make you feel

21:57

less lonely. It's the people at your

21:59

level. So like there's Waldie obviously, but

22:01

then also your friends who might not

22:03

be in business. Yeah, I mean back

22:05

in the days, my friends were like

22:07

the girls that worked at Chopin. Like

22:09

the friends are like, all of my

22:11

bridesmaids worked at Chopin. Oh my God.

22:13

Okay. Yes. So I think that's probably

22:16

like a bit different. Yeah. We can't

22:18

age Chopin with me. Shopo. Well for

22:20

me I am an only child and

22:22

so I am okay being alone and

22:24

I do feel lonely but not in

22:26

business anymore I feel like the thing

22:28

that I've learned about businesses the more

22:30

you talk about your problems and more

22:32

honest I am about the problems like

22:34

I'll say to you Jane. you know,

22:37

like this is what happened to me

22:39

or this is the profit amount or

22:41

this is whatever, and it really sucked

22:43

and I failed or whatever. And you'll

22:45

be like, oh my God, I've gone

22:47

through that before, I've done the exercise.

22:49

I feel like me being able to

22:51

communicate really well and openly about the

22:53

problems I'm facing and not being embarrassed

22:55

about them has really helped me to

22:57

not feel lonely. I feel like a

23:00

connection with other business owners because a

23:02

lot of the time people hide all

23:04

the shit stuff. But then when I

23:06

bring it out into the open, everyone's

23:08

like, oh my God, I've had that

23:10

too. This is what I did. I'm

23:12

like, oh, thank God. Yeah, absolutely. Talking

23:14

about it more has helped. You're great

23:16

with that, because we know at the

23:18

Beach Condena, actually you were talking to

23:21

my friend Jude, who has also now

23:23

been on the podcast. And it was

23:25

you meet Jude and Hannah, and I

23:27

feel like it's when the people that

23:29

you're with. come in and they're vulnerable

23:31

and they open up that lets you

23:33

drop your guard down and be yourself

23:35

and I think that's the most important.

23:37

That's when you have the really great

23:39

conversations. Yes. It just takes one person

23:42

to be like, okay, I want to

23:44

bear it all in front of you.

23:46

Yes. Be that person, like for whoever's

23:48

listening, be that person that can be

23:50

a little bit more vulnerable to have

23:52

better conversations, to have better friendships. The

23:54

only way you cannot feel lonely is

23:56

if other people can relate to you

23:58

can relate to you. So to wrap

24:00

it up with your last question. What's

24:03

a misconception people have about your business

24:05

that you wish you could correct? About

24:07

the business or about me as a

24:09

founder? Either all, because I guess like,

24:11

you know... in Jane's case as well,

24:13

like your personal brand is a business

24:15

in and of itself and the same

24:17

it would be for you an eater.

24:19

So either. Okay, I'll go first. Everyone

24:21

does this, but I put my highlight

24:24

reel on social media. So I'll be

24:26

like on a podcast, I'll talk about

24:28

this podcast and then I'll talk about

24:30

how I'm going to go to an

24:32

event and I get to my name

24:34

was on a bus the other day

24:36

and all this sort of stuff. like

24:38

all the good stuff is on social

24:40

media so I get messages I kid

24:42

you not about 40 to 50 messages

24:44

a day on Instagram saying you're killing

24:47

it you're smashing it they're not seeing

24:49

like I know this is going to

24:51

sound really bad and negative, it's not,

24:53

but they don't see the absolute stress.

24:55

The other eight hours where I'm like,

24:57

what's happening with our numbers, someone in

24:59

the team is, you know, feeling a

25:01

certain way, I've got to manage them,

25:03

then we've got to like make sure

25:05

that this is going out on time

25:08

and customers are angry about certain, like,

25:10

inventories, like, can we be honest? and

25:12

say that business is like 10% incredible

25:14

15% incredible but there is a lot

25:16

of hard stuff that we have to

25:18

go through and I think that I

25:20

would I want everyone to think that

25:22

everything is super easy at a certain

25:24

level because there's just bigger challenges bigger

25:26

things that we just don't talk about

25:29

it. Can I throw this to Gemma

25:31

because you know but you know more

25:33

the outside perception of me and then

25:35

now you work closely with me. What

25:37

do you think? I think it's probably

25:39

similar and like what we put on

25:41

social media is all this fun... Just

25:43

stealing your answer see. Yeah, but like

25:45

all this kind of chaos but I

25:47

don't think that they see how involved

25:50

you are with you know the data

25:52

side of things, the analytics of every...

25:54

as well. Because I think sometimes I

25:56

forget, even though we talk about it

25:58

all the time, like I forget he

26:00

came from a big four, you've got

26:02

all these skills and, you know, seeing

26:04

Jane on an Excel is just insane

26:06

to me. Did you like me? And

26:08

Jess, we were like in an Excel

26:11

yesterday and we're both like having two

26:13

people edit, but like having us both

26:15

formatting, editing, putting formulas, blah blah blah.

26:17

We weren't trying. And I was like,

26:19

man, it's so satisfying, we're doing this

26:21

like magic. I love it. It just

26:23

panics me. I think this is your

26:25

question, you've got this. Okay, how about

26:27

this? Can I tell you what I

26:29

know people, what they see of you?

26:32

And then you can tell me this

26:34

true or not? Interesting, yeah. Okay, so

26:36

what people think of you is that

26:38

like, you do all of the fun

26:40

stuff, and that's, they see that, right?

26:42

And it's basically what Gemma was saying,

26:44

like, they see you doing all the

26:46

fun stuff. Like, they don't know the

26:48

other side of it. So, is that

26:50

a misconception? Like, you only do, which

26:52

I know it's not, but do you

26:55

only do the fun stuff? Like, you're

26:57

going to Coachella, you've traveled to Miami,

26:59

like, you've done all these things. I'm

27:01

honestly doing less and less of the

27:03

boring stuff. It's actually probably a little

27:05

bit true. But I think the truth

27:07

is, like, I've done it all. Yeah,

27:09

no, he honestly like he's doing things

27:11

that I just genuinely don't like and

27:13

he genuinely likes and that is Honestly

27:16

so lucky. Yes. Yeah, and then I'm

27:18

glad and I can understand everything because

27:20

I've been to it like I've been

27:22

there on a smaller scale when the

27:24

business so he joined like six years

27:26

ago I probably only like but in

27:28

the last five years is when he's

27:30

really taken like started to take things

27:32

over. So that has been good. I'm

27:34

a bit surprised how much I'm still

27:37

signing off a lot of things and

27:39

like not everything lots at slots like

27:41

you can't be possibly across everything but

27:43

like getting to details I try not

27:45

to get too into the weeds but

27:47

I feel like sometimes you still have

27:49

to because it's like you spend more

27:51

time trying to tell someone to have

27:53

to do something when it's an edge

27:55

case and I think that is probably

27:58

just like It's better just to be

28:00

okay with it. And it is kind

28:02

of your business, you just do whatever

28:04

you want in a way. I feel

28:06

like it's extra energy for me to

28:08

get the words out today. Thank you

28:10

so much Anita. I always love chatting

28:12

to you, but we have a really,

28:14

really good business to review in the

28:16

next segment for help my small business.

28:19

Yes. So I can't wait to do

28:21

that. And guys, make sure you tune

28:23

in. Thank you, Anita. Love you. Okay,

28:25

that's it from me for now. Thanks

28:27

for listening and don't forget you can

28:29

now watch the full podcast episodes on

28:31

my YouTube channel called you guessed it

28:33

lazy CEO channel And if you're loving

28:35

the podcast, don't forget to follow and

28:37

you can do me a huge favor

28:39

by leaving us a review And if

28:42

you want more you can join the

28:44

conversations on the podcast Instagram at the

28:46

lazy CEO underscore podcast all linked in

28:48

the show note. Catch you next Tuesday

28:53

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