0:04

President Joe Biden has always gone pretty

0:06

hard during pride months. We have

0:09

more LGBTQ plus people than

0:11

any administration or every administration

0:13

combined. No, I really

0:15

mean it. But this June, he's

0:17

in full campaign mode, launching out

0:19

for Biden Harris and dispatching icons

0:21

such as Vice President

0:24

Harris. As the great

0:26

Harvey Milk once said. And

0:29

Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg, no

0:31

video found to

0:33

talk to the American people. His

0:35

campaign may be rattled by some

0:37

survey data suggesting that Biden's support

0:40

among LGBTQ plus communities, solidly, solidly,

0:42

solidly, democratic communities may be slipping.

0:45

Coming up on Today Explained, our

0:48

reporter with some surprising findings. Every

1:01

day we see videos on social media of

1:03

people who don't seem to know they're being

1:05

filmed. Maybe they're acting out on a plane

1:07

or doing something awkward in the gym. Sometimes

1:09

they're just shopping at Walmart. And

1:11

we're left with this question. Does the person

1:13

know that they're part of a viral video? In

1:16

this country, you are literally allowed to film

1:18

anything in public, which I think is extremely

1:20

important. But like, I think that's why this

1:22

is such a matter of ethics and etiquette

1:24

rather than a legal question. This

1:26

week on Power User, we're talking about the

1:29

ethics of filming strangers in public. In

1:34

difficult times, one of the

1:36

more useful things we can do is turn

1:38

to history's greatest thinkers for wisdom. This

1:41

week, we revisit Albert Camus' writings

1:43

on the French-Algerian War and apply

1:45

some of those lessons to the

1:48

ongoing conflict in Gaza. He's

1:50

trying to explain when

1:53

we lose sight of

1:55

those individual lives. We've

1:58

lost sight of what it is. It

2:00

is that makes us fully human. Hear

2:03

more on this week's gray area, available

2:05

wherever you get your podcasts. 2020,

2:09

2020, 2020.

2:11

It's today Explained. I'm

2:16

Noelle King with Vox Senior Politics reporter

2:18

Christian Paz, who recently wrote a piece

2:20

titled, Are LGBTQ Voters About to Abandon

2:22

Biden? Joe Biden is still leading in

2:24

the polls with this block, but there's

2:26

some evidence that this year queer voters

2:29

have many of the same concerns as

2:31

the general electorate. There have been a

2:33

few surveys actually that don't necessarily ask

2:35

about the head to head between the

2:37

candidates, but ask about issues and the

2:39

way that they're thinking about 2024. And

2:42

the thing that comes up again and again in those surveys

2:45

is it's the economy, inflation, kitchen

2:47

table issues that are significantly influential

2:50

in the way that these voters are thinking about 2024.

2:54

And that kind of makes them

2:56

look a little bit like voters

2:58

from other demographic groups, whether we're

3:00

thinking about Latino and black voters,

3:03

whether we're thinking about non-college educated

3:05

voters, things that they prioritize

3:07

also tend to be the

3:09

economy, inflation, affordability, prices. And

3:12

especially for LGBTQ voters, that's

3:14

significant because that's coming in

3:16

significantly higher than concerns

3:18

over LGBTQ rights or equality.

3:21

And that's one of those interesting pictures that kind of complicates

3:24

2024, since it suggests that

3:27

LGBTQ voters are kind of behaving in

3:29

ways similar to other voters. We've

3:31

covered some of this this election season

3:33

with respect to black voters, which you

3:35

mentioned. And there's a thing

3:37

that I always wonder, Christian, which is if

3:40

a group is beginning to behave

3:42

like the rest of the electorate,

3:44

if a group is saying we

3:47

have other issues beyond just like

3:49

what our identity is, why

3:51

is that such a problem for

3:53

Democrats? It's definitely a problem

3:56

for Democrats when you think about what

3:58

it is that by groups

4:01

of voters together and make some work

4:03

and operate as a voting bloc that

4:05

gives a significant margin of

4:07

support to one party in this case

4:09

obviously Democrats because usually when

4:12

you have groups of voters that begin

4:14

to behave a little bit more like

4:16

other voters it means that they're becoming

4:18

more persuadable swing voters and

4:20

more open perhaps to considering the other

4:22

side or to reconsider what

4:24

it is that binds them to one

4:27

party and so with LGBTQ voters

4:29

and black voters those are actually two

4:31

of the most loyal voting groups

4:33

and the Democratic coalition you're

4:35

starting off with such high levels

4:37

of support that any drop-off in that

4:39

level is sure to have some kind

4:41

of effect on the overall vote share

4:43

within a given state you know within

4:46

a given district or just across the

4:48

country with the popular vote I

4:50

imagine Democrats are looking at the same polling and

4:52

realizing they may have a problem so what are

4:55

they doing about it yeah

4:59

they're definitely revving up the

5:01

outreach efforts for Pride Month obviously

5:04

we're in June a lot of it

5:06

looks like emphasizing how much this party

5:08

has done in terms

5:10

of increasing visibility for LGBTQ

5:12

folks they're bringing out secretary

5:14

of transportation people to judge

5:16

my marriage and my family

5:18

and the two

5:20

beautiful children that my husband Chasten

5:23

and I are raising that that

5:25

marriage only exists by

5:27

the grace of a single vote on the

5:29

United States Supreme Court that expanded

5:31

our rights and freedoms back

5:34

in 2015 and made

5:36

it possible for somebody like me to

5:38

get married they're you know elevating members

5:40

of Congress like representative Robert

5:42

Garcia from California as a key spokesperson

5:45

even though he is a freshman representative

5:47

everyone is Congress and Robert Garcia we're

5:50

here in Tucson Arizona with all this

5:52

amazing people launching out provided they're

5:54

bringing out Vice President Harris

5:56

to talk to specifically LGBTQ

5:58

media outlets They're bringing second

6:01

gentleman Doug Emhoff out to Pride

6:03

events to talk about the accomplishments

6:06

of the Biden administration. Another thing

6:08

that they're doing is trying to,

6:10

quote unquote, lay out the

6:12

stakes. Donald Trump is

6:15

a bully. He is

6:17

dangerous to the LGBTQ

6:19

community, to our families.

6:22

They're emphasizing the threats to IDF

6:24

and threats to

6:26

trans rights and gender-affirming

6:29

care for trans folks.

6:32

And one of the other interesting things to point out

6:34

is that, again, LGBTQ people

6:36

are not monolithic. They understand the

6:38

importance of those stakes. But at

6:41

the same time, they want both

6:43

parties to focus on some

6:45

of these everyday issues of affordability. And

6:48

so that is one thing that I think

6:50

is missing from some of this messaging during

6:52

Pride Month is it's very, very specifically

6:54

focused on LGBTQ identity and rights. But

6:56

perhaps there's a little bit less of

6:58

a focus on some of the things

7:00

that are making these voters think like

7:03

the average voter. Where

7:06

are Republicans at? And what

7:08

are they doing? It's interesting

7:10

because it's dependent on whether

7:13

it's Donald Trump himself, who

7:15

is not necessarily somebody who

7:17

speaks the most about LGBTQ identity or rights,

7:19

or even while the

7:21

rest of his party was very

7:23

directly going after trans identity and

7:25

going after books

7:28

and LGBTQ visibility.

7:31

It took him a while to actually weigh in

7:33

on that. Let's talk about same-sex marriage.

7:35

You said a few years ago that you were evolving

7:38

on that issue. Where are you? I'm

7:41

traditional marriage. It is changing rapidly. But

7:43

what do you say to

7:45

a lesbian who's

7:47

married or a gay man who's married who says,

7:50

Donald Trump, what's traditional about

7:52

being married three times? Well, they

7:54

have a very good point. And even then, it doesn't

7:57

seem like those social issues are the ones that he's

7:59

doing. is the most concerned about,

8:01

which is maybe why it's easier for

8:04

a lot of Republican

8:06

and conservative-leaning LGBTQ groups to

8:09

try to make appeals to LGBTQ voters,

8:11

rooted a little bit more in some

8:14

of those kitchen table concerns, talking about

8:17

affordability, talking about prices, talking about inflation,

8:19

with some appeals to other factors

8:22

like immigration and crime. But it's

8:24

interesting to see that even though

8:26

President Trump himself doesn't necessarily talk

8:28

a lot about LGBTQ issues, he's

8:30

kind of turned to his family

8:33

as ways to make those appeals

8:35

in his stead. So famously back

8:37

in 2016, his daughter

8:39

Tiffany Trump attended a

8:41

few LGBTQ for

8:43

Trump rallies. And people

8:45

can say whatever they want to say, but I'm

8:48

here because I support my father. He supports all

8:50

of you, and we are here to

8:52

fight for equality and democracy. And

8:55

this year, actually, in April,

8:57

former First Lady Melania Trump

8:59

appeared at a fundraiser for

9:01

the Log Cabin Republicans. That's

9:03

the major conservative Republican-aligned LGBTQ

9:05

group in the US. And

9:08

she was there to kind of announce

9:10

additional investments that the campaign and allied

9:12

groups would be making to partner with

9:14

Log Cabin Republicans to reach out to

9:17

LGBTQ conservative and Republican voters. A

9:19

few of those details haven't yet been announced. But

9:21

even like saying that that's something

9:23

that they want to do is interesting because

9:26

historically, the Republican Party hasn't necessarily thought

9:28

of this voting group as a group

9:30

that is necessarily the most fruitful for

9:33

them to try to make investments in

9:35

because that creates some tension with the

9:37

core social conservative evangelical base of the

9:39

party that they've needed for so long.

9:42

But it looks like we're seeing a

9:44

little bit of even the Republican Party

9:46

itself considering just how much to reach

9:49

out to these voters because they're also

9:51

seeing this polling. They're also seeing indications

9:53

that Trump improved in 2020 compared

9:55

to 2016. So why not

9:57

maybe try to peel off a few more votes?

10:00

on that side. And what

10:02

makes that so interesting is that there

10:04

is still obviously a fairly broad vein

10:06

of what can be described as homophobia

10:08

in the policymaking. This

10:11

has not been solved within the Republican

10:13

Party. Oh, it's definitely not been

10:16

solved. And if anything, what we've seen

10:18

is a pretty big cleavage. Even

10:21

in 2022, you still had a significant

10:23

number of Senate and House Republicans voting

10:25

in favor of codifying same-sex

10:27

marriage protections. And then

10:29

later that year also, we see the rise of

10:31

Ron DeSantis and the relevance

10:33

again of these don't-say-gay law

10:36

efforts. This morning, the Florida

10:38

law critics dubbed the don't-say-gay

10:40

bill is expanding. Gender ideology

10:43

has no place in our K-12 school

10:45

system. And we've made

10:47

that very, very clear. It is wrong for

10:49

a teacher to tell a student that they

10:51

may have been born in the wrong body

10:53

or that their gender is a choice. And

10:56

it seems like somewhere around 2022,

10:58

we have a pretty sharp return

11:01

to old-school homophobia, where

11:03

for that last year, it seemed

11:05

like it was a specifically focused

11:07

attack on trans Americans and trans

11:09

rights. According to the Human Rights

11:11

Campaign, an LGBTQ advocacy group, lawmakers

11:13

in 28 states are

11:15

considering 93 bills targeting the rights of

11:17

transgender Americans. And then it expanded a

11:20

bit more from there. And

11:22

it's a sharp contrast to the

11:24

way we saw the party kind

11:26

of change a bit from when

11:28

the first efforts

11:30

to repeal Don't Ask, Don't

11:32

Tell, the military policy that

11:34

prohibited LGBTQ service

11:37

members from serving openly in the military, that

11:40

was repealed in 2011. And

11:44

from then to 2022, we saw a general

11:46

march along a

11:48

path toward greater acceptance tolerance definitely

11:51

within the Democratic Party and

11:54

a slight kind of shift toward

11:56

the center among Republicans and then from 2022.

12:00

on, we definitely see a sharp pivot

12:02

against, definitely with

12:04

the rise of Republicans

12:07

to the right on social

12:09

issues compared to Donald Trump and

12:12

kind of pulling Donald Trump in that direction. And

12:14

what we're seeing, especially since

12:16

the 2020 election, is

12:18

one party continuing as

12:21

Milquetosis, some

12:24

of these outreach efforts might seem,

12:26

it's still relevant that the

12:28

Democratic Party is elevating folks

12:30

like Pete Buttigieg when

12:32

the other party is actively

12:34

turning against them. What

12:37

do you think in 2024, what do

12:39

you think the story of this community and

12:41

this election will be? It's

12:44

definitely going to be a nuanced picture

12:46

that develops because a lot of

12:49

history for, we're thinking about

12:51

other marginalized groups and experiences that other

12:53

voting blocs have had that has kind

12:56

of made them become less of a voting

12:58

bloc and more of just a swing group.

13:01

And here I'm thinking about Catholic voters, Italian

13:03

and Irish American voters, more recently

13:06

something that's happening among Hispanic and Latino voters

13:08

potentially, where they used to also be a

13:10

pretty significant voting bloc on

13:12

the Democratic side and are now much

13:14

more persuadable and swingable. There is a

13:17

lot of history there that suggests that

13:19

something similar would be in store for

13:21

LGBTQ voters, combined that with an unpopular

13:24

Democratic incumbent, combined that with a generally

13:26

still sour mood on the economy and the status quo.

13:30

And you see kind of a recipe

13:32

for a pretty significant shift

13:34

happening. And yet we're

13:36

also going to see something that is

13:39

maybe just unique to LGBTQ voters, that

13:41

these shared experiences are still really, really

13:43

relevant, that they're still really important, that

13:46

they're still significant enough to make them

13:48

not even consider the opposite party. And

13:53

so we're going to see just

13:55

how relevant and influential this voting

13:57

group becomes and get some

13:59

indications as to to whether

14:01

or not their experiences and

14:03

that shared sense of identity is strong

14:05

enough to overcome some of the other

14:08

factors that might otherwise suggest that they

14:10

become less loyal to the Democrats. Coming

14:15

up, a California congressman on Out

14:17

for Biden Harris. So,

14:26

more for today explained comes from Etsy. For

14:29

some people out there, giving gifts isn't easy.

14:32

Like Vox creatives Drew Johnson, you've

14:34

had some difficulties with gifts. Terrible.

14:37

I'm terrible at giving gifts. Absolutely. What's

14:39

the worst gift you've ever given? For my wife, once I

14:41

got her a tourist guide to

14:43

Italy. Okay. We've never

14:45

been to Italy. We have never

14:48

been to Italy since then. But

14:50

you didn't endeavor to go to Italy at some point?

14:52

Well, I said this is for when we go to

14:55

Italy. That was six years ago and we

14:57

have never been to Italy. Okay.

15:00

So, for people like Drew, there's a

15:02

new feature on Etsy called Gift Mode.

15:04

Drew, have you tried Gift Mode on

15:06

Etsy? Yeah, I've actually checked it out

15:08

and boy would it help me. So

15:11

the way it works is you just

15:13

have to answer a few short questions

15:15

about who you're shopping for and what

15:17

they like. Etsy says they can instantly

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give you curated gift ideas based on

15:21

hundreds of personas they've got. So

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if you need to find the perfect gift, don't panic. You can try Gift

15:26

Mode on Etsy now. Ever

15:33

since it was founded in 2014,

15:36

Vox has strived to bring clarity,

15:38

context, and nuance to the things

15:40

that affect your world. Together

15:42

we've learned about AI,

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climate change, political extremism,

15:46

fast fashion, parenting, and

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so much more. Now this work would not be

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possible without you. And to celebrate

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our 10th anniversary, we're launching the Vox

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We want this program to be something

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special for everyone who gives. To learn

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more, go to vox.com/members to join now.

16:26

And thank you, as always, for your support. This

16:33

week on The Pitch, the dreaded error

16:35

message. It

16:37

looks something like, sorry, we're currently

16:39

experiencing issues. Please try again later.

16:42

So who gets called when that problem arises?

16:45

We do. The question is,

16:47

can the machine learning-based scaling

16:50

outperform the human approach? To

16:52

me, it's so obvious. Models usually

16:54

don't have a bad day. And your models

16:57

can't quit and put in their two weeks notice. How

17:00

have you two divided up your own responsibilities

17:02

in the company? Well,

17:05

we're twins, so. I was wondering, but

17:07

I didn't want to prejudice. Twin takeover!

17:09

That's this week on The Pitch. Go

17:11

right now and subscribe to The Pitch

17:14

wherever you listen to podcasts. Hi,

17:16

gay. Happy Pride Month. We

17:19

are sashaying away with... Today Explained.

17:22

Congressman Robert Garcia, Democrat of

17:24

California, one of nine openly

17:26

LGBTQ House members, is

17:28

working with the Biden campaign to get out the

17:31

queer vote. I began by asking the question that

17:33

we were here to discuss today. The

17:35

question that we're here to discuss today is this. Can

17:38

President Biden count on LGBTQ

17:40

support in the 2024 election?

17:44

I mean, I think he can. I mean, first, let's, we've

17:46

got to be real honest. I think traditionally, LGBTQ

17:50

plus people have been strong

17:52

supporters of Democrats,

17:55

of progressives. The

17:58

vast majority are progressive. and

18:00

the president and the vice president have a

18:02

great record on gay rights and

18:04

the advancement of rights for

18:06

queer people. And so I expect very

18:09

overwhelmingly that our community is gonna come

18:11

out for the president and the vice

18:13

president. Let's not forget that

18:15

President Biden was the first person as

18:18

vice president to actually come out in favor of gay marriage

18:20

and he actually nudged at the time President

18:22

Obama. I am vice president of the United States

18:24

of America. The president

18:27

sets the policy. I

18:29

am absolutely comfortable with the

18:31

fact that men

18:33

marrying men, women marrying women and heterosexual

18:35

men and women marrying men are entitled

18:38

to the same exact rights, all the

18:40

civil rights, all the civil liberties. And

18:42

quite frankly, I don't see much of

18:44

a distinction beyond that.

18:46

So I think his advocacy is

18:49

really well noted in the community. Let

18:51

me shoot you some numbers and ask you what you think,

18:53

okay? So according to exit polling in 2020, President

18:56

Biden won 64% of the queer vote. Trump,

18:59

Donald Trump, candidate Trump won 27%. Recent

19:03

polling from the Independent Center showed that in

19:05

a Biden-Trump matchup in 2024, it's

19:08

about 56% for Biden, 28% for Trump and

19:12

another 16% were undecided. What

19:16

do you think that 16% undecided are trying to

19:18

decide? Well,

19:20

I think first, I think like any election,

19:22

these numbers will harden when the actual

19:25

choice is in front of voters. And so I

19:27

think that we'll find when all of a sudden done

19:29

in this election that you're gonna see a

19:32

significant number of voters who are actually gonna

19:34

be with President Biden. I think that will

19:36

match or exceed the last election. And

19:39

so I'm not overly concerned. I think there are

19:41

obviously, there's a lot of issues going on right

19:43

now in the world and the

19:45

way people feel about the economy as

19:47

it continues to improve. And so it's not

19:49

super surprising that all of the

19:51

president's numbers haven't hardened with all communities. I

19:53

think you're seeing that across communities, not

19:56

just ours. But

19:59

I'm not super concerned. I think Donald Trump

20:01

is a con man and

20:03

a criminal. He is going to be on

20:05

the ballot. He is anti LGBTQ plus.

20:08

He says horrible things about the

20:10

trans community. So those are all

20:12

issues that we're gonna get out

20:14

there. We're gonna remind voters what

20:16

the difference in the records are. And as we

20:18

do that, I think those numbers will

20:20

harden and shift. Donald Trump

20:23

hasn't changed a lot over the years. He hasn't

20:25

really changed the way he talks. He hasn't really

20:27

changed the way he presents. What has

20:29

changed here is the numbers. It's at 16%.

20:32

And I hear you saying you're not concerned.

20:35

Why not? Donald Trump does have a tendency

20:38

to win groups that people say he can't

20:40

win. Well, I think first, I mean,

20:42

let's also be clear. I mean, President Biden is

20:44

gonna win the LGBTQ plus community. I mean, that's

20:47

a fact that he's gonna win it on election

20:49

day and he'll win it overwhelmingly. But I think

20:52

the point about the legal

20:54

predicament that Trump's in, I mean, the

20:56

fact that he has now has these

20:59

convictions and will have more is

21:01

a good reminder of the community that someone that can't

21:04

be trusted and that wants to harm our

21:06

community. I also think that the election, I

21:08

mean, we're comparing some numbers. One

21:11

is at election day and the

21:13

other is, you know, still many

21:15

months before the election. And I

21:17

think the numbers at the end of the day

21:19

when election day is here, those

21:21

numbers will strengthen because we'll be in

21:23

a full blown campaign. We have, you

21:25

know, I helped the campaign launch out for

21:27

Biden, which is a national campaign

21:29

to engage LGBTQ plus voters. I was there

21:32

at the launch. I've done events. I was

21:34

just in Tucson, Arizona, launching

21:36

out for Biden there. And so I'll continue to

21:38

do that work across the country, activating

21:40

our base. And it's not just me,

21:43

it's other national LGBTQ plus

21:45

groups that are out there doing the

21:47

same kind of work. And so we're

21:49

never, we shouldn't take our voters for

21:51

granted and we shouldn't just assume that

21:54

they're gonna be good Democratic voters all the time. We

21:56

have to put in the work and remind folks

21:58

about the record. And that is

22:00

why I don't have a huge

22:03

concern about somehow Trump winning over more

22:05

of these votes. We're going to

22:07

remind our community how horrific Donald

22:09

Trump is for queer people.

22:12

His transgender ban leaning

22:14

into Project 2025, which

22:18

essentially wants to roll back the rights of

22:21

gay people in this country, his

22:23

extreme Supreme Court justices.

22:25

So these are all important

22:27

and certainly we're going to lean into them

22:29

really, really hard as election

22:31

day gets closer. Tell

22:33

me about Out for Biden's message, where you've

22:36

been, what you're telling folks. Right.

22:38

I mean, first we want to remind

22:40

people that, you know, it's been President

22:42

Biden that signed the Respect for Marriage

22:44

Act. It's been President Biden that has

22:46

put forward really strong judges across the

22:48

country that support our rights. It's been

22:50

President that, you know, that reverse Trump's

22:54

misguided attacks on trans people. So

22:58

we're going to remind them of that, but

23:00

we're also going to lean in to the

23:02

fact that what's next? I mean, the Equality

23:04

Act, we need a president that can sign

23:06

the Equality Act into law. That's going to

23:09

be President Biden. We need a president that

23:11

is going to kind of push back on

23:13

some of these states that are passing these

23:15

horrific anti-LGBTQ plus laws. That's going to be

23:17

President Biden. So there's a lot to remind

23:19

people of, and we need to encourage all

23:21

those voters to vote Biden Harris. We

23:24

heard in the first half of the

23:26

show that polling shows this block is

23:29

not just motivated by rights and equality.

23:31

In fact, they're also very interested in

23:33

jobs, in the economy, in inflation.

23:37

You didn't mention that as part of Out

23:39

for Biden's message. Should it be?

23:41

Why isn't it? No, well, I mean, it is. I

23:43

mean, I think I've obviously been focusing on

23:46

the LGBTQ plus broader themes, but Out for

23:48

Biden focuses on the entire Biden Harris record.

23:51

And you're absolutely right. I think that

23:53

queer people absolutely care about the

23:55

economy and they absolutely care about other issues

23:58

like reproductive rights for women. And

24:00

they absolutely care about student loan

24:02

relief. They absolutely care about climate. And

24:04

so on all of these issues, the

24:07

president is on the right side. And so we

24:09

have to remind voters of

24:12

all of that. And so I think that's really,

24:14

really important for voters. I've talked to some voters

24:16

and I was in Tucson about the

24:18

president lowering prescription drug prices. These are senior

24:22

LGBTQ members of the community. That was something

24:24

that was important to them. And

24:27

so we've got to remind everyone

24:30

about the record, but especially for

24:32

our community, we

24:34

can't walk away from the fact that Trump would

24:36

be a complete disaster for our rights. And

24:39

he is fueling this extreme

24:41

kind of white nationalism, this

24:43

extreme view of authoritarian

24:46

worldview where he's the

24:48

guiding master of our country and

24:50

can just roll back these rights

24:52

and make people feel unsafe, give

24:55

people vehicle to bully in our schools.

24:57

And we're seeing this happening right

25:00

now. And so I think a lot of

25:02

that stake for our

25:05

community, for gay voters, and we have to

25:07

be aware of what the stakes are, it

25:09

is a very clear contrast. And

25:11

we've got to ensure that we make that contrast

25:14

in the months ahead. Congressman

25:16

Robert Garcia, Democrat, California,

25:19

thank you so much for your time. Vox's Christian

25:21

Paz is back with us a

25:23

little unusually for today explained. Christian

25:25

was listening to our interview with

25:27

Mr. Garcia. Congressman Garcia didn't seem

25:29

too concerned, Christian, with that undecided

25:31

16%. Do

25:34

you think that is the campaign putting

25:36

on a brave face? Do you think

25:38

that is the campaign making an assumption

25:40

that I think in the past has

25:42

hurt Democrats that, yeah, of course we're

25:44

gonna get this voting block. They're saying

25:46

it now, but come voting day, we

25:48

got them. There's definitely a little bit

25:50

of both. I don't think

25:52

that there's much data or even

25:54

anecdotal information that leads us to

25:57

suggest that Donald Trump will win.

26:00

significantly larger chunk of the LGBTQ vote

26:02

or a majority. What I think I'm

26:04

a little more hesitant, and this is

26:06

maybe a little bit of just campaign

26:08

speak here, is the assumption

26:11

that there'll be a significant increase

26:13

in support for President Biden, given

26:15

that all signs kind of suggest

26:17

that there's general dissatisfaction across the

26:19

Democratic base and across the American

26:22

electorate as a whole. And

26:24

so on that front, I do think that there's maybe

26:26

a little bit of wish casting,

26:29

but then also recognizing

26:32

that there is plenty of time left in the

26:34

election and that there will be a lot

26:37

that the campaign does to try to reach out to

26:39

these voters and plenty of time for them to fine

26:41

tune their message as well. Christian

26:46

Paz covering the 2024 election for Vox. Thanks

26:49

for hanging out, Christian. Thank you. Today's

26:56

show was produced by Amanda Llewellyn and

26:58

edited by Amine El-Sadi. It was fact-checked

27:00

by icons Laura Bullard and Matthew Collette.

27:02

It was engineered by Rob Byers and

27:05

Andrea Kristin's daughter. I'm Noelle King. It's

27:07

Today Explained. It's

27:28

today. It's today. It's today.