0:03

Welcome to Unstoppable at Craig , where

0:05

we pull back the curtain on what makes healthy

0:07

workplace cultures click and what happens

0:10

when people are empowered to expand

0:12

the boundaries of what is possible . We'll

0:14

explore the perspectives of employees and

0:16

leaders who have carte blanche to speak

0:18

their truths , tell their stories and unlock

0:20

uncommon ways of approaching challenges

0:22

. I'm Dr Jandel Allen-Davis

0:25

, CEO and President of Craig Hospital

0:27

, a world-renowned rehabilitation

0:29

hospital that exclusively specializes

0:32

in the neurorehabilitation and research

0:34

of patients with spinal cord and brain

0:36

injury . Join me as we learn from people

0:38

who love what they do and what happens

0:40

when fear doesn't stifle innovation

0:42

. Welcome

0:45

to another episode of Unstoppable

0:47

at Craig , and today I

0:49

am joined by Katie Kramer , who

0:51

is the president and CEO of

0:54

the Betcher Foundation . And you

0:56

know , as we think about , remember that

0:58

the theme of , or the . If

1:00

there's a thread that runs through every

1:02

episode of Unstoppable

1:04

, it's this notion of what makes

1:06

for great cultures , and

1:08

there are things that are tangible

1:10

, there are things that are intangible , that are part

1:12

of the leadership alchemy

1:15

that pulls together great cultures , and

1:17

there's something really , as those

1:19

of us who have either been beneficiaries

1:22

of philanthropy or

1:24

those who have been

1:26

able to actually be the benefactors

1:29

of philanthropy , there's something

1:31

incredible that , that

1:33

sort of generosity from millions of

1:35

people sometimes

1:37

a family , sometimes even in the smallest

1:40

ways what that fuels in terms of the

1:42

power of leadership to truly

1:45

transform and change lives . And so it's

1:47

just going to be fun to spend some time

1:49

with my dear friend , katie

1:51

Kramer , and we go way back

1:54

. We go way back to 2006

1:56

. That's unbelievable how fast

1:59

time flies and what our journeys have

2:01

taken us to where they've taken us over that

2:03

very , very long time . So I want to thank

2:05

you , a for just saying yeah , let's talk

2:07

. That's always fun . But also the

2:10

Betcher Foundation has been an amazing , amazing

2:12

partner of Craig and it is part of

2:14

the fuel that makes this place so

2:16

, so wonderful . So , on behalf

2:18

of people who are

2:21

in beds right now here at Craig

2:23

, family members who are supporting them , team

2:25

members who are doing the work that they do to support

2:27

those families , those who have come before

2:30

and actually even those who don't know they're

2:32

going to need us but Will I just say thank

2:34

you , thank you , thank you and welcome Well

2:36

thank you , what a way to

2:39

start , jandel .

2:40

You always get me right there in the heart

2:42

and just

2:45

knowing what an incredible place

2:47

that this is . And

2:49

for me , the relationship

2:51

with Craig is deeply personal

2:54

, in addition to being professional

2:56

and the fact that we've been friends for so

2:59

long and you're here as

3:01

following many incredible

3:03

leaders at Craig over the years . But

3:06

you in this role here and

3:08

this place for our

3:10

community , you know one of a kind

3:12

and it's an honor to

3:14

come alongside , and the Betcher Foundation I know

3:16

has supported with many grants over the years

3:19

and in the mission , and

3:21

so thank you what you do for the world

3:23

the world not just our , not just Colorado

3:25

.

3:26

Well , we both got to say thank you , and I will say

3:28

you are more than more than welcome , and I

3:30

think it's interesting that you said there's the

3:32

better sort of part of

3:34

which is such a huge part of your story , but

3:36

then that it's deeply and intensely personal

3:38

too . So why don't you just start by sharing

3:41

some of your journey , that journey

3:43

from intern to president and CEO ? And

3:46

you're celebrating good grief . How

3:48

can it be your 27th anniversary as

3:50

a foundation ?

3:51

But tell your story ? Well , sure , so

3:54

I did . I alluded to the fact that the

3:56

relationship with Craig was personal and

3:58

that goes beyond our friendship , because

4:00

the mission is deeply personal

4:02

to me and I don't know that a lot

4:05

of people know this about my story

4:07

, but I was in a car

4:09

accident when I was 22 years old

4:11

and had a traumatic brain injury , and

4:13

there was a period of time when I

4:17

didn't know if I'd ever be able to work again

4:19

, and so the impact on

4:21

my family and my friends , it

4:24

was profound , and so the impact

4:26

on my family and my friends , it was profound . And so just to share a

4:28

little bit more of the depth of that story

4:30

and then sort of how it fits in with the Betcher

4:32

story too , so

4:37

I'll take you back to ninth grade . I walk into

4:39

my new high school and there was this

4:41

wonderful guidance counselor , mrs Bornhauser

4:44

, who called me into her office and she said Kate

4:46

, I think you might be Betcher material

4:48

.

4:49

And I know , and I was like oh my goodness , what is that ?

4:51

But I better find out . And then

4:53

had heard of the wonderful Betcher scholarship and

4:56

so made it my goal throughout high school to

4:58

try to put myself into

5:01

a position just to compete , because it's very competitive

5:03

, and feel very blessed

5:05

that I was lucky to

5:07

be 40 of the students

5:10

that were chosen that year when I graduated from

5:12

high school in 1993

5:14

. And so I

5:16

had the chance . It was life changing

5:19

. Betcher's invested in me too . I'm

5:22

a beneficiary , but

5:24

they invested in my potential

5:27

and paid for my undergraduate education . I went to CU

5:29

Boulder and so I had a wonderful

5:31

experience there . And it

5:33

ends up being a full circle story with Betcher

5:36

, because when I was just finishing up senior year

5:38

, there was this

5:40

fellowship position that

5:42

was advertised at the Betcher Foundation and

5:44

I thought how wonderful . I was newly married to

5:46

my wonderful partner , Joe Kramer , and

5:49

we thought how perfect

5:51

for me to take a year it was a year-long fellowship

5:53

and give back to this

5:55

organization that had invested in me . And actually

5:57

my sister won a Badger scholarship too , so it

5:59

literally changed generations

6:02

of our family to have the

6:04

gift gift my parents didn't have to worry about our education

6:06

and so

6:09

the chance to work there under

6:11

a wonderful leader , Tim Schultz , and have

6:13

this fellowship . I got the job and was

6:15

real excited to start , and it

6:18

was . I was commuting from Boulder . I

6:20

was just finishing up a last semester at CU . I was just finishing

6:22

up a last semester at CU , and on my way

6:24

down to work in downtown Denver

6:26

, where we're located on Highway 36 , classic

6:30

story Traffic

6:34

came to a stop and I was able to stop , but the person behind me wasn't , and so I think the

6:36

thing that is so just paradoxical

6:39

about it is , you know , it seemed like it was

6:41

like $2,000 worth of damage

6:43

to my car . You

7:06

know , it seemed like it was like $2,000 worth of damage to my car and you know the thing

7:08

, it was almost seven years before I fully recovered in all the ways . So so much too , but I had seizures

7:10

as a result of that experience and I did all sorts of therapy because I had a neck injury as well as the brain injury

7:13

. But for somebody who had

7:15

an identity that I

7:17

felt like if I worked hard enough , I could always

7:20

get the A or I

7:22

couldn't do that anymore . Get

7:27

the A or I couldn't do that anymore . And so I remember when I was playing Yahtzee with Joe at the

7:29

time and I couldn't add the dice , I think we didn't know right away

7:31

that I had the

7:33

extent of the injury , but

7:36

or couldn't remember , like the , a

7:38

phone number , all the digits , or

7:41

would feel like I'd be reading the same thing . I was

7:43

still in school , so trying to read the

7:45

same passages over and over and over and not

7:47

feeling like I could get

7:49

the wiring in my brain to understand

7:53

what I was reading . And

7:56

then , you know , had the chance to do cognitive

7:58

therapy and stuff , and so I'm just so grateful

8:00

that there were therapists and neurologists

8:03

and that came alongside me in that

8:05

recovery . But yeah , it was . It was

8:07

a really scary time and and

8:09

my neurologist did tell Joe privately

8:12

I did not know this at the time that he

8:14

wasn't sure that I would be able to work

8:16

full time and a lot of that stemmed

8:18

from just the , just the seizures I would continue

8:21

to have . So you know , fighting

8:23

back through that , I am

8:25

grateful for all the support and

8:27

I was determined .

8:30

I really was .

8:31

So , at any rate , that's

8:33

a little bit about that piece , and then

8:35

the rest of the journey at Betcher

8:38

Jandel is . I'm

8:40

grateful to them for helping

8:42

me through that really difficult time in

8:44

my life where they cut back hours for

8:46

me and allowed me some accommodations

8:49

to be able to continue to work . I'm so

8:51

grateful for that . And it

8:53

was about within

8:55

a year that we had

8:57

a position open . It was a longtime scholarship

9:00

secretary at the time and

9:02

I , at 22 , had the audaciousness

9:05

to put together a proposal of what

9:07

if we hired a director of the scholarship program

9:09

. And then I applied . Oh

9:12

, I love it I

9:14

wanted the job and Tim believed

9:16

in me and let me have the chance to run

9:18

our scholarship program for five years and then

9:20

invited me to be the vice president when I was 26 years old

9:22

and I certainly grew into that 26 years old . And

9:24

I certainly grew into that role over time

9:27

and I've been the CEO for the last seven and a half , so

9:29

I cannot believe that it's been like a blink , but

9:31

I've had a chance to do just about every

9:33

job at the Fletcher Foundation in the period of

9:36

those 27 years

9:38

.

9:38

Yeah , there was so much in that

9:40

.

9:40

I'm sorry , yes , no , no , no , no , no , and I can I could

9:42

wait .

9:43

So , first of all , thank you for sharing that way

9:45

that you know the your your

9:47

experience with this brain

9:49

injury traumatic brain injury and

9:52

you're mentioning that it changed

9:54

you that that you know that's

10:00

nobody wants these , but there are ways we hear this walking through the halls . I know

10:02

this about patients whether spinal cord or brain injury who there's

10:05

a resilience that kicks in , especially

10:07

if you're supported by the right folk

10:09

. And by the right folk it's not

10:11

just the great therapist . That

10:13

is what happens within this health care

10:15

domain , in an

10:20

organization that says she

10:23

is one of ours

10:25

and we're going to invest in her and we're going to

10:28

make , we're going to provide the kinds of accommodations

10:30

that enable her to get

10:32

back to or move ahead to

10:34

whatever's next . And you know , that's

10:37

a mark of great cultures that I felt

10:39

it important to say publicly

10:41

on this podcast , because

10:44

we are wasting talent when we

10:46

don't . And look at you

10:49

today . And it also goes to show how miraculous

10:52

the brain can be . You know that recovery

10:54

can take some time , but it does happen . Brains

10:56

are that squishy little bit

10:58

of gelatin between our ears , does amazing

11:01

, amazing things , and it is , at the same time

11:03

, still a mystery . But the other thing

11:05

I heard back to Tim

11:08

who doesn't love Tim Schultz

11:10

? Let's just start there in

11:12

terms of the kind of culture he had

11:15

built that enabled you to stay

11:18

for 27 years and he said yes

11:20

, when you brought things , talk about

11:22

the culture at the foundation .

11:24

I think that's a great story of

11:26

evolution , Jandel , and what

11:29

Tim brought to it and I feel proud

11:31

to continue is , I

11:33

think , that philanthropy . And just quick

11:35

background about Vetra Foundation private family

11:37

foundation started in 1937

11:40

by a wonderful , generous family

11:42

of serial entrepreneurs in the state . They were

11:44

immigrants . They came here like so many

11:46

wanting to work hard and

11:49

build something and build a family

11:51

and a life and a community . And they did

11:54

well . They were blessed , they

11:56

did well and they decided

11:59

they wanted to give back and invest in the state of Colorado

12:01

. So we do only grantmaking in the state of Colorado

12:03

back and invest in

12:06

the state of Colorado . So we do only grant making in the state of Colorado

12:08

. And

12:13

throughout that time we've given away like $420 million in every part of

12:15

the state . But the story of that it's now 87 years old

12:17

. The Betcher Foundation . And

12:20

when Tim started the

12:22

period of time , my first jobs , jandel

12:24

, when I started as the intern with the fellowship

12:27

position , I got the first domain

12:29

name . I built thank you , cu

12:31

Boulder , leeds College of Business for my business

12:33

education , but built the website , wow

12:36

, built a selection database to

12:38

, you know , try to automate some of our all

12:41

the handwritten selection process that was formerly

12:44

of the better scholarship program to the first marketing

12:46

brochure . So we were coming

12:48

in a time where technology

12:50

was everything was done

12:52

. When I started , you know , people were still there

12:55

, were secretaries and executives and we

12:57

were on typewriters and not networked computers

12:59

. That was another job that I had to do . So

13:01

there's a reputation sometimes with philanthropy

13:04

that it's like the ivory tower and very inaccessible

13:06

and stuffy and I would say

13:08

that there may

13:11

have been some of that . I was certainly intimidated

13:13

coming from my better scholarship

13:15

interview when I

13:17

was 18 years old .

13:20

You would have been anyway , right ? Yes , of course

13:22

.

13:23

But I think what the work

13:25

to make and continues to

13:27

be our work to make

13:29

, what we do , we are servants and

13:31

what we do we cannot

13:33

do without people like

13:36

Craig and all the organizations that we invest

13:38

in throughout the state . So

13:50

to make sure that our work is accessible , that we

13:52

are partners in helping people get the resources that they need . And

13:54

so he tore down that ivory tower and those walls and I love that . He used to say

13:56

, jandel , our job , we

13:58

can't fund everybody and not everything

14:00

fits our priorities . Like it just

14:03

doesn't you do these things and other foundations do

14:05

other things . But he said it's a goal

14:07

always that someone

14:09

, if they're going to meet with us , that we give

14:11

them three ideas they didn't have . And

14:14

so this idea of trying to be

14:16

a connector there's that resources does

14:18

doesn't mean like money always

14:20

, but it's your . It's

14:22

your the connections , the ability

14:27

to connect dots , like we work throughout

14:29

the state . So I know what happened in Mancos

14:31

last year and Holyoke last year and Cortez

14:34

, and so when people come to us coming

14:36

with a project that's similar , we connect dots for them

14:38

and sometimes we give grants but we

14:41

continue to , I think , provide our

14:43

value and part of our philanthropy is

14:45

our people that work there . We're part

14:48

of this gift that the Boettcher family

14:50

, I think , invested in for the people of Colorado

14:52

, that we help people find access to resources

14:54

.

15:13

Gosh you know it's interesting .

15:14

I think that we talk about . You know the

15:17

phrase that we have the opportunity to give . They've

15:19

been chosen because of their leadership

15:21

and their service , their heart for service . It's

15:24

wonderful , and so we

15:26

talk about that philanthropy

15:28

. I think the way we define it is time

15:30

, talent , treasure and ties . Ties

15:33

Because one of the things and that's

15:35

that connection piece , like if you have

15:37

access to a

15:40

community or connection , the power of

15:42

a network , you know that . Well this

15:44

is the Leadership Denver Network we've been part

15:46

of through the Leadership Foundation all these

15:48

years the power of that

15:50

network that we can bring to bear to

15:52

the people that we're supporting and

15:55

serving . It's powerful beyond just

15:57

the money that you show up and share

15:59

your talents or you give your time . You

16:01

know , invest , even with your dollars , gosh

16:04

, you know . So it's like pay it forward

16:06

.

16:06

It's a force multiplier . You know

16:08

all the words we use , and I love the ties

16:10

part , because I think one of

16:12

the most important thing we do as leaders is service

16:14

connectors of ideas , of systems

16:17

, of people , of places . And how cool

16:19

that you get to do the work statewide and

16:21

can connect communities to each other

16:24

, great ideas , work that's going on other

16:26

places . You know I love

16:28

the generational issues of being

16:30

in roles , like whatever the roles are . When

16:32

I was in my mid-40s , I was

16:34

at KP , kaiser Permanente and

16:37

had little ones , but I was in clinical

16:39

practice , so I wasn't home many nights

16:42

. Well , every third to fourth night

16:44

I was out somewhere delivering babies

16:46

and taking care of women . And then to find ourselves

16:48

in these CEO roles as women . There's

16:50

lots of different , it seems to me , lenses

16:52

. We could look at that through whether it's the lens

16:55

of ages and stages , and

16:57

I'd wonder , though , through the lens of

16:59

being a female CEO , and

17:01

not necessarily even mid-40s with kids

17:03

. But in what other ways did

17:05

you need to , or have you

17:07

had to , navigate challenges but also

17:09

opportunities Like what do we

17:11

uniquely bring when we tap into

17:14

and I'm going to say it this way that feminine

17:16

sort of spirit

17:18

, I suppose , because men can tap into that

17:20

too . I think we can do our masculine and our feminine

17:23

. That's some of what we have to be able to do ?

17:24

That's a great question , and I

17:27

think one of the things that I feel most proud of in my life

17:29

is I've had a chance to be , an

17:31

opportunity to be a trailblazer

17:34

in a couple ways the first female

17:36

XYZ like whether it was the first I grew up in the Episcopal church . And I was the first first

17:38

female xyz like whether it was the first I grew up in the episcopal church and

17:40

the I was the first female

17:42

acolyte in our church

17:45

I wanted to be an altar boy .

17:46

Yeah , they didn't have them back in

17:48

the day , yeah , I was proud of that cool

17:51

and even um .

17:52

I was the first executive at

17:54

betcher that was a female , like we had wonderful

17:57

um again . They were called secretaries

17:59

at the time , but I was the first person that

18:01

didn't have that title in that role

18:03

. And then , even coming into this role

18:06

, I'm the first

18:08

female CEO , the

18:10

youngest and the first Vector Scholar

18:12

, and so I take great

18:14

pride in that being the first

18:17

, and also it feels like

18:19

a lot of responsibility .

18:21

It cuts a few ways , doesn't it ? Exactly

18:24

, those firsts are something I don't think that hit

18:26

me until sometimes , since I've been

18:28

over here . First woman .

18:30

I agree . Ceo .

18:31

First African-American CEO

18:34

of either gender , and then

18:36

a number of those crazy firsts Talk

18:38

about I was going to ask . This is going to be my next question how

18:40

do you define or how

18:42

do you characterize the responsibility

18:44

that you carry with it , that it comes

18:46

with With ?

18:47

being the first yeah .

18:48

As you said , first it comes with . It's really

18:50

cool , that's right , and it has responsibility

18:53

. What are some of those ?

18:55

things . The first thing I would say

18:57

is I had a quote

18:59

in my bulletin board from

19:02

the time I was in middle school . I don't know where it came across

19:04

it , but it's a quote by Louis Pasteur . That

19:06

was comparison is the

19:08

death of true self-contentment

19:10

, so something like that . I

19:13

may have misquoted that exactly , but the thinking

19:15

I try not to think about that too much because sometimes

19:17

that feels too big . I

19:20

don't , I try not to think about that too much because sometimes that that

19:22

feels too big . That that responsibility , I just , I

19:25

just do me .

19:27

I love it .

19:29

What else can ?

19:30

you do Right .

19:31

I mean I , I cannot

19:33

. I'm never going to be Jandel , Allen Davis

19:36

or Tim Schultz or who you pick the

19:38

leader . I just want to be Katie Kramer

19:40

, mandela , Allen Davis or Tim Schultz or who you pick the leader . I just know

19:42

how to be Katie Kramer and I am grateful for my parents for always just

19:44

encouraging me to be me , and

19:47

so I just

19:49

try to think about the things that I value

19:52

. I think that that guides me

19:54

, things that I care about and how I show up

19:56

, and I think

19:58

one of the special

20:00

ways that and I don't

20:02

this is I don't , it's not a female thing . The

20:04

first thing , it's just a maybe a Katie thing

20:06

yes . I

20:15

just believe we're whole people , jandel , like I don't know how you

20:17

can like not come into even the workplace and not acknowledge the fact

20:19

that you have spit up on your shoulder

20:21

or the car didn't start or

20:23

the dog whatever , blah , blah , blah

20:26

. That doesn't mean that we're not

20:28

professional in the workplace , but it's just

20:30

a recognition that people always are

20:32

carrying some load and

20:34

we never know that . And so if you

20:36

don't show up with empathy , no matter what

20:38

gender you identify with

20:40

, that's . I think one of the most important

20:43

things is seeing

20:45

people in their wholeness

20:48

.

20:49

And if I can interrupt , I would go so far as to say

20:51

, first of all , I'll say amen . I

20:54

used to say to the

20:56

last executive team I sat on and

20:58

say here too that I'll say it differently

21:00

. I say people . I used to say our

21:02

people . I would say those we serve

21:05

want to see us and

21:07

they want to be seen by us . They want to

21:09

see us . Amen , the whole of us

21:11

, totally . You know , for me , when I

21:13

have to sort of say something

21:15

that may feel I don't know some way

21:17

, and it's how I'm choosing to hear

21:19

it or think it , you know , I say , oh my

21:21

gosh , my pits are sweating . Right , because

21:24

their pits sweat too .

21:25

And when you allow yourself , if you

21:27

allow yourself to bring your whole self to

21:29

work and show up in all your humanness , right and all the

21:31

crazy ways .

21:33

It's that thing that Marianne Williamson

21:36

said , or it's also , I

21:38

think Nelson Mandela must have said

21:40

it in a speech that when we hide our light

21:42

under a bushel basket , we're not serving

21:44

anyone and showing

21:47

your light , bringing all

21:49

your wonderfulness . That's why I'm sitting here smiling

21:51

at you , because you listen , I

21:54

can't be Katie Kramer , let's just call it . You're

21:56

saying you can't be . Oh my gosh , you're amazing

21:58

. When you do that , it gives permission

22:01

for others to bring their whole selves in too

22:03

. Don't be so dang buttoned up , no

22:05

doubt . And the other thing I will say

22:07

is .

22:08

I deeply believe that from

22:10

our emotion , from our heart , comes the power

22:13

. I really believe that it's

22:15

head and heart together and

22:17

I will tell people you

22:19

know , I'm not ashamed to say that there are

22:21

things what we do is deeply

22:24

meaningful . It brings me to tears

22:26

and also , when things are hard , I

22:28

cry . You know , my God , like

22:30

I'm feeling overwhelmed with my schedule . My

22:36

sweet executive assistant , megan's , like what can we do

22:38

so ? And I tell folks don't you ever

22:40

apologize for your tears ? Amen

22:42

. It really means . It just

22:44

means that you care deeply , or

22:46

you're touched by it , or it's hard , yeah

22:48

.

22:49

And it is and again

22:51

it brings . I think that's one of the things that

22:54

makes for great cultures is

22:56

enabling and creating

22:59

the space for people to bring their whole

23:01

selves to work and to

23:03

be supported and to give support

23:05

, and there's something about Craig

23:07

that makes that , I think , essential

23:09

, and it can be a work in progress

23:12

at different times . But even just coming up to do

23:14

this interview , I got on the elevator

23:16

because there was a patient , a family

23:19

member , who were also on , and so I introduced

23:21

myself and said hello , and as I was getting off

23:23

at two and they were going up to four , as I was standing

23:25

there just asking a little bit about them to

23:27

see this person's family

23:29

member just go . Thank you so

23:32

much for this and . I said you're welcome . I said

23:34

, and I'm about to cry , and she's about to cry

23:36

. And so I had a dear

23:39

friend and mentor from my Kaiser Permanente

23:41

days , carrie Conan , who said you should cry

23:43

every day . Yeah , she cried every

23:45

day . It just means what you're doing matters , and

23:47

sometimes it's the hard tears and

23:49

a lot of times it's just tears of joy

23:51

and you know or

24:00

tears of breakthrough , or eurekas , you name it .

24:01

It's all kinds of things that I get to see here that just make me so excited and happy . Well , and we're lucky to work in these mission-driven organizations

24:04

that you get the privilege of helping

24:06

, yeah .

24:07

What are those few leadership

24:10

lessons or leadership

24:12

, I'd say , requirements

24:14

that you think that folks

24:16

need to have , and is your responsibility

24:18

to help them learn .

24:19

Right , wow , the thing that

24:21

comes to mind first is listening

24:23

.

24:25

That would be good . Yes , in a lot of places these days

24:27

.

24:27

Listening , everywhere listening , and

24:30

we've invested , like just even

24:32

in professional development in our on our own team

24:34

about how how to listen and

24:37

and I think we do that as an organization

24:40

professionally listen right Like what are people's

24:42

needs , how can we serve

24:44

, and so

24:46

I think that's a critical thing

24:48

for any leader in their development

24:50

to listen

24:53

to what people need around them , to

24:55

notice , to be empathetic

24:57

about those types of things . So I feel like that

25:00

is one of the most important things that I see

25:02

in my daily work and it

25:05

carries over when I think about how we

25:07

develop our own leaders at the

25:09

Bachelor Foundation and we invest

25:11

deeply in everyone's leadership

25:14

development . We believe everyone is a leader

25:16

. Everyone has their own individual development

25:18

plan . We talk about what are their dreams

25:20

short-term , mid-term , long-term

25:22

because we

25:24

want to be part of that journey . And

25:27

again , the journey may not always be a betcher , but

25:29

there's really transparent conversations that

25:31

happen amongst our team

25:33

about how

25:36

do you want to grow , and

25:38

we have feedback loops built in right that

25:40

we're talking about things quarterly , so

25:43

there's an ability

25:45

to take ownership

25:47

in your own growth right internally

26:00

at Betcher , but how we think about that for our own team and for our scholars

26:02

. So I'm even thinking we have our scholars experience , which is

26:04

our retreat for all the incoming

26:07

students that are starting college in the fall , as

26:09

well as all of our current students

26:11

that are at the university . And

26:13

that's part , fundamentally , of

26:15

what we talk about . We talk about mental

26:18

health , we talk about listening

26:20

, we talk about how to be

26:22

empathetic , support people in need , support

26:25

friends , how to be good , how to be a good friend , how

26:28

to compromise . You know , some of those

26:30

, those pieces which I wish

26:32

especially , you know , charged

26:34

in our world right now . It feels

26:37

contentious , it

26:39

is , and I just I

26:41

think if we were

26:43

able to continue to see the big picture

26:46

and there's always

26:48

lost Jandel , and you

26:51

can't always get your way , and

26:53

so you know , when leaders come to the table

26:56

, whether they're trying to compromise

26:58

about water in Colorado or

27:00

whatever that is , you

27:02

know there's values in conflict . The reality

27:04

is we usually have the same values

27:07

. It's just a matter of how much you prioritize

27:09

them or whatever . So I think if you can look for

27:11

where we have the

27:13

commonalities and come from that , I

27:16

think that that really helps you

27:18

to be effective in a leadership context

27:20

, no matter what your context is .

27:23

So listening , and I would think , just

27:25

knowing you , that it's listening to the said

27:27

and the unsaid . So true Listening

27:30

can involve way more than just your ears

27:32

.

27:32

Well , and what's not being said right

27:34

, and who's not invited to the table

27:37

?

27:37

And what's that body language over there saying

27:40

? So I'll say to folks

27:42

I can see your thought clouds . I

27:44

can't see what's in them , but I can see just based

27:47

on things . So there's the listening part there . You

27:56

know , as I've heard about , the phrase I use

27:58

is have these invisible backpacks that are , in

28:01

some parts , lived

28:04

experience , in some part what happened that morning

28:06

.

28:06

Right , you know those sorts of things that you're bringing into

28:08

the office .

28:09

So I heard sort of appreciating

28:11

that and there's

28:14

a phrase that if I were going to encapsulate

28:16

this and it is an important leadership thing what I didn't

28:18

hear you say is learn the finances

28:21

, learn the quality . I mean

28:23

, those are you know . Learn , you know . That's what I think

28:25

about . And well , we all need to , no matter the thing

28:28

that , that really this

28:31

isn't a game of showing what you know

28:33

, it's that what's

28:35

that phrase that goes people don't

28:38

care what you know , know

28:40

until they know that you care .

28:42

Oh , so great .

28:43

Yes , absolutely .

28:45

And it is . It's beyond IQ , it

28:47

is the EQ piece right here , the emotional

28:49

intelligence , and I think even other things I've been reading

28:51

too , jendell , just in a world that

28:53

is so volatile

28:56

and changing , is your AQ

28:58

, your adaptability quotient

29:00

, which I love , yeah , so there's some

29:02

. I wish I was , I

29:04

could keep it in my mind to give

29:07

credit to people that are smarter

29:09

than me , that have those ideas , but I definitely

29:11

see that the ability to things

29:13

change so quickly and one

29:16

of the things that I didn't say that I think that's part

29:18

of it , and the challenge of a leader is you

29:21

know how you were talking about , seeing

29:24

what's not said and the

29:26

thought clouds , or whatever . But I

29:28

think one of the things that I struggle with too is just the

29:30

courage sometimes to

29:33

call it out or

29:35

take action on it , because

29:37

you know we have a good thing going

29:39

and we're getting along and there's but there's still some

29:41

conflict . So , you know , making

29:44

sure that you have the courage to step into

29:46

that . Or you can read

29:48

the room and

29:50

how hot the system is , and I'm using air

29:53

quotes here- for those of

29:55

the context , of how far you can push

29:57

. And one of my other favorite leadership quotes

29:59

leadership is disappointing

30:02

people . At a rate they can accept Marty

30:04

Linsky and Ron Heifetz . I love that I

30:06

love their work and what I like about

30:09

that is sometimes and

30:11

I think that this is where we get stuck sometimes in life you

30:13

end up with you're passionate about a

30:15

cause and you care so deeply and

30:17

you want change now and

30:21

you want to burn it down because you can't take it anymore . Yes

30:24

, and there

30:26

are sometimes systems or

30:29

people that can't accept change

30:31

, and so you have to have a balance for how

30:33

far can you push and how much

30:35

do you need to bring people along , because

30:38

I think part of that leadership challenge

30:40

is talking to people , inviting

30:42

them into the conversation , having ownership as

30:45

part of the solution . But

30:47

I think that that's tough , is pacing

30:49

. Change is tough sometimes .

30:51

I think it's one of you know . Even back to the question

30:53

I asked about what will and I'm going

30:55

to say we do or how are we navigating

30:58

leadership , following folks who have

31:00

built strong organizations with an understanding

31:03

that we're going to add to the

31:05

strength is the pace of that kind

31:07

of change ? And so

31:10

I'm just grateful that you talked

31:12

about how that can be tough . And

31:14

I think the other thing that is sort of part

31:17

of that is this how do you manage that conflict

31:20

, whether it's you know well , wait a minute

31:22

, you're not , we're not old , this

31:24

isn't like we used to do it or those sorts of things

31:26

how you manage and work through that in

31:29

a way that preserves your soul and doesn't let

31:31

us get afraid to do what we need

31:33

to do or question the systems that

31:35

must be torn down . Yeah , and

31:37

you got to do it . You got to do it , and

31:39

I don't know how you do it , but I'll tell you

31:41

that for me it's . I want this

31:43

place to be here 100 years from now

31:46

, 200 years , 117 year

31:48

old institution . Awesome that . Back

31:50

to adaptive quotients . They've

31:52

lived it , starting with tb

31:55

right and polio , yes , and

31:57

now neuro rehabilitation for spinal cord

31:59

and brain injury um , now

32:01

they're not going to let me deliver babies here . I always have to

32:03

say that at some point We've got plenty

32:06

of work to do in this space . There is so

32:08

much to do , both in terms of the

32:10

current building off of the legacy

32:12

, of what this wonderful , wonderful

32:14

gem for the country , let alone the world

32:16

, is in some ways . But then it's future

32:19

. We've got exciting plans that go

32:21

beyond capital , you know , in terms of the

32:23

physical space . But , thinking about

32:25

the communities , back to some

32:28

of the work that you all are even thinking about

32:30

the communities out there that we

32:33

send patients back to and

32:35

I'll call them patients then when

32:38

we send them back but they are persons , they

32:40

are people living alongside a disability . They are persons , they are people living

32:42

alongside a disability , and there's work to do in those

32:44

communities that we have a responsibility

32:47

to engage in , lead

32:49

, make better for people , and that

32:52

one's not a hard one to

32:54

push , but it's certainly at

32:57

all . I

33:02

mean people are excited about the potential there and see the importance and see the enormity

33:04

of a task like that and how you even do it alongside other partners , while

33:07

doing the work we need to do today Right To

33:09

evolve our inpatient programs .

33:11

Past present , future .

33:12

You're always living it Well . I want to thank

33:14

you , but I also want to make sure I give you last word

33:17

.

33:17

Oh , I'm grateful . So my last word

33:19

is gratitude . Thank you , friend , so much

33:21

and you have continued

33:24

to be a wonderful role model and friend

33:26

for me these many years and it's awesome

33:28

to be on the journey together .

33:30

So it's a journey we're going to take it , thank

33:32

you , thank you , wow

33:36

. So Katie and

33:39

I go back nearly 20

33:41

years in friendship . It's coming on pretty

33:44

soon next year It'll be 20 years that

33:46

we've known each other and I've watched

33:49

her growth Not that she didn't

33:52

already start as such a strong leader

33:55

even back then and it's been

33:57

just a real gift to

33:59

know a leader

34:01

of this caliber and a friend

34:03

and a person and a woman of this caliber

34:06

. So much was packed into

34:08

our time together . I

34:10

like the concept of philanthropy

34:13

in four dimensions that

34:16

it's not just about the treasure they give away

34:18

, but the time that they invest in those

34:20

that they serve , the opportunity

34:22

to help develop talent through

34:25

philanthropy not just those who are asking

34:28

, but how they use their

34:30

or she uses her role

34:33

in supporting

34:35

communities to connect people

34:37

and obviously the treasure , but

34:39

also the ties . That is , we're

34:42

building community , we're making new friends

34:44

, we're connecting new people , new ideas

34:46

. What an amazing treasure

34:48

and an essential part of strong

34:51

communities . Great foundations

34:53

are and great philanthropy of all sorts

34:57

are , and I think

34:59

it's one of the more important roles that we play

35:01

as leaders is this idea of recognizing

35:03

that we actually serve missions

35:06

, we serve communities and

35:24

to think about leadership . I love that she grounded what we do wonderful , wonderful

35:26

organizations and our accountability , responsibility and the joy is to make sure

35:28

those organizations endure . While we're evolving them based

35:30

on what's needed at the time , you

35:32

never forget the essential parts of the legacy

35:35

that's been built , the core of who organizations

35:37

are , and we have to make sure

35:39

, in order to serve the future

35:42

, that we're paying and very close

35:44

attention and are mindful of the present . And

35:47

then , of course , we've got to be looking out over the horizon

35:49

, based on what we're seeing right now around what

35:51

next ? And having to step boldly

35:54

and courageously into those spaces , even

35:56

when our voice is shaking , as I

35:58

said . And then this idea

36:01

, because of what philanthropy has the ability

36:03

to do through being more flexible

36:06

, about matching capital

36:08

to needs , then looking

36:10

at the work that they're doing now

36:12

, recognizing that we are in desperate , desperate

36:14

need of strong leadership on so many

36:17

planes and dimensions today , and

36:20

supporting communities this way is important

36:22

. And then , my heavens , the adaptability

36:24

quotient . When I wrote that down , I thought well

36:26

, that is Craig's DNA , you know

36:28

, in terms of both , who we serve , but

36:31

also in terms of this incredible

36:33

team of professionals

36:36

of all stripes that have

36:39

to meet patients and families

36:41

where they are and adapt their style in

36:44

order to do the best work that we do

36:46

here . There's a versatility that's

36:49

part of being adaptable . That really

36:51

is a true core leadership

36:53

strength and probably finally

36:55

I mean Katie's clearly amazing I

36:57

mean good grief . You know multi-generational

37:00

Coloradan , just

37:02

always a person who says yes

37:04

to opportunity but leads

37:07

boldly and courageously and has

37:09

the ability at the same time , to be vulnerable

37:11

and talk about the tough stuff . I

37:13

loved this conversation because

37:16

of that . But you know , finally

37:18

, that recognition that part

37:20

of what builds strong cultures and makes

37:22

them endure is making sure that

37:24

we really are tending to that next

37:26

group of leaders and the opportunity

37:29

that we all have to lead from wherever we

37:31

stand , and that leadership

37:33

is so , so , so much more than a title

37:35

. So I would say again

37:37

you know I feel so blessed to

37:39

get to do what I do every day in service

37:42

to Craig Hospital and our community

37:44

and these

37:47

conversations , trust me

37:49

, I get way more than I give

37:51

and I've taken away from Katie

37:54

today some real

37:56

cool things to think about in

37:58

terms of how I serve at Craig , but

38:00

also how I care for myself , and

38:03

I hope you did too . So

38:05

thank you for making time to

38:07

be part of this Unstoppable at Craig

38:09

episode . Thanks so much .