0:00

You can watch everything your kids

0:02

do where they go. Our parents

0:04

just didn't care. The baby monitors

0:06

now are nuts. Now she knows

0:08

that she can yell at the

0:10

camera and get us to respond.

0:12

I feel like we're teaching our

0:14

kids to get used to being

0:16

spied on. I wonder how much

0:18

it's conditioned her to be used

0:21

to already kind of living in

0:23

that nanny state. That terrifies me,

0:25

I think, almost more than anything.

0:27

Every generation, they're being rewired to

0:29

double think before they speak. It's like

0:31

they focus group inside of their own

0:33

head. How is this going to

0:35

be perceived? On a deeper level, we

0:37

have women who are being told

0:39

that they're racist or transphobic if they

0:41

feel nervous around a person in

0:43

a bathroom. We're like a step away

0:45

from telling women, well, you're just

0:47

rape phobic. Oh,

0:53

right, I'm with Dana Lash, everybody. Welcome

0:55

to Walk -Ins, welcome. Thank

0:57

you, Bridget, it's good to be here. It's so

0:59

good to have you. I loved your piece

1:01

about Gen X. I

1:03

love Gen X. I

1:05

just feel like we

1:07

were the Wild West generation. And

1:11

I was looking back and I was trying

1:13

to explain this to my kids and my

1:15

kids are Gen Z. And I'm trying to

1:17

explain to my kids just how good we

1:19

had it. They were flipping out. Like I

1:21

used to walk into the store to buy

1:23

cigarettes from my mom. And I was like

1:25

eight. It was the honor system. I would

1:27

go in and I would buy like a

1:29

carton of marble red. And

1:31

they're like, bye. And I walk out. They had no

1:33

idea if I was gonna go around back and smoke

1:36

them. I mean, they had no idea. And I was

1:38

telling that to my kids one time and they're like,

1:40

what? Like first off, Nana, let

1:42

you do that. Nana sent you to

1:44

do that. And then they allowed the

1:46

sale to happen. They could not wrap

1:48

their minds around it. But it was different

1:50

back then. It was different. It

1:52

was so different. I was thinking about

1:54

just, I mean, you said something

1:56

about being in the back of like

1:58

pickup trucks. And - My grandmother, greatest

2:00

generation, would drive a pickup truck and

2:03

put, my dad's one of 10.

2:05

So we would all be piled into

2:07

this pickup truck and my sister

2:09

and cousin have the funniest story about,

2:11

she would just go from, you

2:13

know, like yard sale to yard sale,

2:15

getting stuff. And she had

2:17

weights in the back and we had

2:19

little toddler cousins and my sister and

2:22

other cousin in the back with these

2:24

weights and she was deaf and they're

2:26

just, she's driving around and they were

2:28

screaming like, ma 'am, stop as they're jumping

2:30

over the weights and trying to guard

2:32

the little kids. I'm like, you would

2:34

be thrown in jail now. Yeah,

2:37

you couldn't, I mean, there was a woman

2:39

who was arrested because her 10 year old

2:41

walked like, I don't know how many feet down

2:43

the road from the house just to go to

2:45

a friend's house and the mom ended up getting

2:47

arrested. Like it was such a different time, like

2:49

riding in the back of pickup trucks, I was

2:51

just trying to think of all the, we would

2:53

literally leave like in the morning and we would

2:55

be out in the woods, no joke, all day

2:57

long. I had like an emergency supply of snacks

2:59

and it was always like Fig Newton's and something

3:01

sugar. I mean, I didn't, I was, you know,

3:03

a kid, I didn't, I had my emergency Fig

3:05

Newton's stash. And so like, if we got into

3:07

a tight spot, I'd be like, which I don't

3:10

know what a tight spot would be. Like there

3:12

was one time we were like, do we want

3:14

to, it was a flooded creek. Do we cross

3:16

this flooded creek and maybe drown to death? We

3:18

don't know. And let me get a bite of

3:20

Fig Newton, it was like a commercial. Let me

3:22

get a bite of my emergency Fig Newton's to

3:24

help my brain power through this important decision making

3:26

process. It was just that we were gone all

3:28

day and we'd get back at night. I

3:30

mean, our parents are never like, did

3:32

you eat? I mean, what did you

3:34

do? Like now we have life 360

3:36

and you can watch everything your kids

3:38

do where they go. Our parents just

3:41

didn't care. I mean, I think they didn't

3:43

care. They just, I felt like they

3:45

knew what to worry about and what not

3:47

to worry about. And we also, one

3:49

of the things Bridget is at Gen X

3:51

and I think you agree with this.

3:53

We also knew the greatest generation. So we

3:55

didn't just have our parents raising us.

3:57

We had the greatest generation overseeing their race.

4:00

of us and so we got a lot

4:02

of that wisdom and I feel like

4:04

that's kind of our saving grace and sort

4:06

of one of the reasons why we

4:08

saved America last week. It's interesting too

4:10

because as a Gen X

4:12

mom of a very

4:14

young toddler, so I'm a

4:16

very geriatric mom, Jen

4:19

Alpha, yeah she it's weird like

4:21

the nanny state she lives in

4:23

just naturally even with you know

4:26

we have like the monitor, the

4:28

baby monitors now are nuts like

4:30

we used to have those janky

4:32

ones where you would pick up

4:34

like the neighbor's cell phone conversation

4:36

on it and now they're just

4:39

it's it's crazy what they have

4:41

and she's I wonder how much

4:43

it's conditioned her to be used

4:45

to already kind of living in

4:47

that nanny state. I love

4:49

that you said this. I love that you

4:51

said this because I am I know that I

4:53

was like I know I can't with the only

4:56

one thinking this I love that you said that

4:58

because I'm like I feel like we're teaching our

5:00

kids to get used to being spite on yeah

5:02

and I don't necessarily like it and even my

5:04

even the fact that we now she knows that

5:06

she can like yell at the

5:08

camera and get us to you

5:10

know respond so she's not only

5:12

aware of the nanny state but

5:14

she's used to talking to the

5:16

nanny state and she'll be like

5:18

dad I want a Bubba I'm

5:20

like okay that's not how we

5:22

ask the you know random camera

5:25

for a Bubba but she knows

5:27

that someone's watching which is I'm

5:29

like this can't be good and

5:31

I was thinking about how I

5:33

she hasn't really had to

5:35

we see when she's awake

5:37

and so I'm like let's

5:39

wait until she calls for

5:41

us but yeah she knows we're coming

5:43

because she knows that we can see

5:45

her and I'm like that even that's

5:47

weird like how we conditioned her not

5:49

to call out for us like

5:51

normal kids who didn't have this

5:53

like nanny state working for them

5:55

so you can hear yourself and

5:57

how you respond to her yeah I

6:00

don't know how

6:02

to do anything. I joke too that

6:04

I should be, I'm like, I feel

6:06

like my sister and I were joking

6:08

about this the other day, about how

6:10

we feel like we should be raising

6:12

our kids to be like tech

6:17

-savvy Luddites, you know? It's

6:19

like, on the

6:21

one hand, I'm like, I want her, I

6:24

don't want her to be that weirdo

6:26

that doesn't know anything about technology and it's

6:28

so native to them anyways. But on

6:30

the other hand, I want her to know

6:32

how to grow food because when the

6:34

grid goes down in her generation, which it

6:36

probably will, she needs to be proficient.

6:39

I don't know, how have you done it

6:41

raising kids? It's

6:44

weird. And just the thing with the

6:46

cameras, like we just, they were

6:48

just glorified walkie -talkies. That's all they

6:50

were with the baby monitors. Like, my

6:52

kids were younger. Now it's like

6:54

video and infrared and you can do

6:56

all the stuff and even with life

6:59

360, so I have a college

7:01

kid and when he made the drive

7:03

to college, it's like some hours

7:05

away, I would watch just to make sure

7:07

he had no issues, but then I'm like, I'm

7:09

not gonna spy on him. I'm only gonna check

7:11

to help myself at night just to make sure

7:13

it wasn't killed by an axe murderer. He

7:15

needs where he needs to be at 1

7:18

a .m. or midnight or wherever, whenever I

7:20

go to bed, I'll look and I'll just

7:22

make sure and I feel like I've been

7:24

really good with it because otherwise it ramps

7:26

you up as a parent. So you have

7:28

this whole generation that's used to growing up

7:30

a surveillance. Then you have that same generation

7:32

of parents that are used to being able

7:34

to use that kind of stuff. That trains

7:36

us to be, we're trading privacy for security and

7:39

then we become okay with it.

7:41

It is such a weird concept. I

7:43

mean, you think about this and

7:45

maybe, maybe our parents kind

7:47

of knew what they were doing. I

7:49

mean, it's, you know, just let them go

7:51

out and do what they do and,

7:54

you know, hopefully they, we played on train

7:56

tracks. I know. Trains would come. We

7:58

would literally jump off the bridge. into the

8:00

water and wait as long as we could

8:02

until the train got close to it. Like

8:04

I think of the things that we did

8:06

and we would do the same thing. We'd

8:08

get on our bikes in the morning. We'd

8:10

ride down to the beach, the three of

8:12

us. Well, there's five of us, but the

8:14

oldest three. And we would be gone all

8:16

day. There were no cell phones. We weren't

8:18

checking in. It was just like, well, I

8:20

hope those three come home at the end

8:22

of the night. And that's what I can't

8:24

wrap my mind around because I know what

8:26

I did. We know what we did as

8:28

kids. We had the best time. It really

8:30

was the best of times. It was the

8:33

best of times. But

8:36

admittedly, I would freak out if

8:38

my kids were gone all day. And

8:40

I'm like, how did I go

8:42

from that to this? What ruined me?

8:44

Well, this is in this book that

8:46

I have been interviewing the author like

8:48

chapter by chapter on. But I think

8:50

he was, he's kind of a Marxist,

8:52

but he's very much right about a

8:54

lot of the media stuff. And it's

8:57

called Mediated. And in it, he has

8:59

this whole theory called Justin's helmet principle.

9:01

And it's basically that because, just

9:04

because we didn't grow up riding

9:06

bikes with helmets doesn't mean that

9:08

you wouldn't put a helmet on

9:10

your kid because now, A, everybody's

9:12

putting helmets on their kids. So

9:14

there's the social pressure, but B,

9:16

you don't wanna be the person

9:18

who has the kid with the

9:20

head injury because they didn't put

9:22

the helmet on their kid. And

9:24

so it ends up getting more

9:26

and more and more kind

9:28

of bubble -wrapped and insane, but at

9:31

the same time, some of

9:33

this stuff isn't necessarily bad.

9:35

But I don't know anybody. I mean,

9:37

I saw the funniest tweet that was like,

9:40

remember when you would go to school

9:42

and it was like going to a vet

9:44

hospital, like when we were growing up,

9:46

everybody had like broken arms and like there

9:48

was always like a kid in a

9:50

cast. And

9:53

he's like, you've never seen kids in

9:56

cast. And then when a

9:58

kid didn't come back from the LICE check, everyone. it's

10:00

like, you're like, oh no,

10:02

it's among us. I said it

10:04

like that. It

10:06

was, it wasn't going to the

10:08

vet. That's perfect. It was just

10:10

like that. Yeah, just like there

10:12

was always some kid in a

10:14

cast with everybody signed it. And

10:16

you just don't see that many

10:18

kids in cast. And yeah, I

10:20

want to be that kind of

10:22

mom that gives my kid that

10:25

kind of freedom to, but

10:28

I'm like, I don't know if

10:30

you have the ability to, it's

10:32

so terrifying to like

10:35

just let your kid, but

10:37

our, I mean, we would joke about

10:39

it. My cousins and I, our aunts and

10:42

uncles and parents would all be on

10:44

the beach. And we would be, we would

10:46

go walk around the rocks in Rhode

10:48

Island, like pretty far away from where all

10:50

the grownups were, definitely not within eyesight.

10:52

Like on the other side of, and we

10:54

would be jumping into the ocean,

10:57

just with little kids, I'm like,

10:59

and they didn't care. They were,

11:01

they were just like getting drunk

11:04

on beach. Exactly. Yeah, they were,

11:06

they were off having their own

11:08

party. Whatever, keeping our kids occupied. There

11:10

was like 4th of July, like the big pastime

11:12

was me and my cousins, we would have a

11:14

bottle rocket war. And we would go to this

11:16

field. We literally threw

11:18

bottle rockets at each other. I mean,

11:20

nobody got an eye out. I know

11:22

we bled our hand off. It wasn't

11:24

like Tropic Thunder, where it was just

11:26

like octopus shards. It was just, you

11:29

know, everybody was okay, but we had

11:31

like a drunk uncle who every beer

11:33

he finished, he would bring a bottle. And

11:35

amazingly enough, beer bottles, the glass beer

11:37

bottles are the perfect thing for launching like

11:39

a barrage of bottle rockets, bottle rockets,

11:41

beer bottle. And we would line them up

11:43

and we would, you know, have like

11:45

our flanks. And we got really serious with

11:47

it. I mean, if we broke up

11:50

and we had like one team versus the

11:52

other team, like other kids from the

11:54

town would try to join. It was like

11:56

a big ordeal. It was an all

11:58

night war. I really don't know. how we

12:00

figured out who won. But we

12:02

just knew how drunk the adults were

12:04

because they would give us all

12:06

their cast off bottles as our staging

12:08

ground to light everything off. And

12:10

it was, I mean, we learned a lot

12:12

Bridget about teamwork, pyrotechnics,

12:15

first aid, like a lot of

12:17

really important skills that you

12:19

need for today. I was I

12:21

joke about this on stage

12:23

and it still isn't really I

12:25

it's still not landing the way I needed

12:27

to land because I don't think enough

12:30

people are drug addicts. But I was which

12:32

is a good thing probably. But I

12:34

was joking about how now kids these days

12:36

because there's fentanyl and like all the

12:38

cocaine and all the drugs and I'm like

12:40

the kids these days need to like

12:42

drug test their drugs, which to

12:44

me is so it like there's

12:46

something so ironic and hilarious about

12:48

this. I'm like, so you're dry,

12:50

you guys are like, I want

12:52

drugs not drugs like they have

12:54

to be like scientists with their

12:56

little kits drug testing their drugs

12:59

and then they've all got to

13:01

carry around like Narcan and in

13:03

the in the event that someone

13:05

inevitably ODs. So you're also like

13:07

a first responder. This seems like

13:09

a very high barrier to doing

13:11

drugs. It's like, yeah, it's like

13:13

seems like it's so much more.

13:15

I just remember being younger

13:18

people. I don't even know where people got

13:20

it like you would go to, you know, the

13:22

high school parties and there would be the one

13:24

like a group that had stuff and you never

13:26

nobody knew where ever it came from. Nobody had

13:28

any idea where they got anything and I

13:30

don't think that they care. I think that if

13:32

people found drugs in their Halloween candy back

13:34

then they'd probably do it. We they always said

13:36

that we had drugs in our candy and

13:38

that never happened. I never got any razors or

13:40

needles or anything else in my Halloween candy

13:42

either. But nowadays, it's just everything is different.

13:44

Like the whole everything has shifted.

13:48

Trust either we're more suspicious or people

13:50

really are that bad and you can't

13:52

trust anything. Yeah, I'm

13:54

I don't know. I

13:57

don't know which one it is either and

13:59

even growing during like the dare

14:01

campaign. I was like, that seems

14:03

like the dumbest way to try

14:05

and get a bunch of oppositional

14:07

defiance disorder kids to not do

14:09

something. Like, oh, you're going to

14:11

dare me not to do it. Now I

14:14

definitely want to do it. Yeah, double talk there.

14:16

I just like assemblies because that meant no

14:18

class time. Yeah. So we just got to go

14:20

to the gym and we had like the

14:22

Harlem glow prodders come out. Oh, And

14:24

then we had the dog sniffing petting zoo.

14:27

They brought that out at all their canines. And

14:29

we couldn't pet any of them, but they

14:31

were nice to look at. Where

14:33

were you? You were in St. Louis.

14:35

Where were you? I was

14:37

in Festus, Missouri. So Southern Missouri. Okay.

14:39

The Mississippi River. So that's where

14:41

that's where I grew up at. All

14:43

my families like further south than

14:45

that. They're all like in the Ozarks

14:47

and and like down here. But

14:50

yeah, I grew up in Festus, Missouri.

14:52

So we it was we joked because

14:54

they're the counties, the county that

14:56

I'm from and the county that's nearby

14:58

are apparently hot spots for meth.

15:00

So I mean, that wasn't meth wasn't

15:02

a big thing when I was

15:05

a kid, but now it's everywhere. But

15:07

that's where I grew up. And how did

15:09

you end up in you?

15:11

You were a journalist first, right?

15:13

Yeah, I had a newspaper column.

15:15

Okay. And what was your column

15:17

about? It was actually, it was about

15:20

parenthood. It was sort of like a

15:22

female Dave Barry kind of in a way.

15:24

But I just like tackled a bunch

15:26

of different stuff. And it kind of blew

15:28

up and got super political. Because

15:30

I talked about, it was like a, I think it

15:32

was like one paragraph in my column. And it

15:34

was just like a passing thing. And I talked about

15:36

firearms in the home. And I

15:39

grew up with it. So it

15:41

didn't stand out to me because I

15:43

had never really faced opposition like

15:45

that before. And I mean, I

15:47

was what, maybe 25 years

15:49

old, 24, 25 years old. And I

15:51

had never gotten heat like that

15:53

before. And then when that came out,

15:55

the editorial board of the paper

15:57

was really mad. All of the left

15:59

-leaning subscribers. It was St. Louis Post Dispatch

16:01

and the subscribers got really mad because,

16:03

oh my gosh, dude, do we dare

16:06

get a whiff that she is not

16:08

a progressive? Like, what is happening here?

16:10

And it was, it was wild.

16:12

And I, like, people talked, they said

16:14

mean things about me in the local

16:16

press because I had like a passing

16:18

mention of owning a gun in my

16:20

column. So you mentioned the dare to

16:22

keep kids off drugs. It was

16:24

like they were daring me not to write about

16:26

guns. So I was like, well, I'm going to

16:28

write everything about guns now. And I just like

16:30

put all pedal no breaks, man. It just was

16:33

crazy. So. And

16:35

so is that how you became

16:37

kind of the the the woman

16:39

who is who's known for defending

16:41

Second Amendment rights? Or you just

16:43

leaned into it from then? Or

16:45

how how is that? How

16:47

did that become it feels like a big part?

16:49

I hate this word. And I hate even using

16:51

it with a Gen X or but it does

16:53

feel like a big part of your brand of my

16:55

brand. Yes, my brand. I hate

16:57

it. I hate it. I like

17:00

to stop it with a brand.

17:02

Yeah. I think I had always, I

17:05

had always kind of been there anyway,

17:07

but I never took it as an advocacy

17:09

issue because it was just, you know,

17:11

part of life. It was like going to

17:13

the store and getting milk and getting

17:15

him. I mean, it was just, you know,

17:17

part of life. And it was the

17:19

culture that we grew up with. So it

17:21

didn't, it just seemed like an everyday,

17:23

it seemed to every day to

17:25

make it like a boutique issue,

17:27

if that makes sense. Like I just

17:29

it just was too commonplace. But then when

17:31

I saw the reaction to it, I

17:33

was like, gosh, maybe, you know, I guess

17:36

it isn't. That's kind of wild. And

17:38

so I just sort of leaned into it

17:40

because the meaner people got the meaner

17:42

I wanted to be back. And

17:44

the more that they pushed the more that

17:46

I wanted to push back. So I guess, I

17:48

think that's also a Gen X tendency. You're

17:50

like, Oh, really? Really? And you just want to

17:52

push back all the harder. And so it

17:55

kind of, it kind of blew up from there.

17:57

And so from the, from that I

18:00

actually got invited to go on

18:02

a morning radio program and

18:04

it was a what started as

18:06

my local affiliate It was the

18:08

station that I got started in on

18:10

St. Louis in St. Louis and talked

18:13

about it and then they asked me back

18:15

and so that went on for like

18:17

a few weeks I was just on

18:19

like every week just to talk about

18:21

you know that issue and Then they

18:23

offered me a Sunday night radio slot

18:25

and I thought you people are on

18:27

crack Oh my gosh, the thought, the

18:29

thought terrified me because I wrote. I

18:32

didn't speak. It was, it's a different

18:34

thought process. Like you really have to

18:36

really admire your brain. And so they

18:38

said, well, come and try it. And

18:41

my husband was like, just give it

18:43

a try. Just do it for a

18:45

couple of weeks. And I hated it.

18:47

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18:49

want to go back. I scripted out my

18:52

whole first show because I had no idea.

18:54

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18:56

babysit me to make sure I didn't steal

18:58

anything that wasn't nailed down. And then, I don't

19:01

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19:03

night spot on a Sunday, so it was like

19:05

from 10 to 11 and all the alien conspiracy

19:07

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19:09

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20:15

me, because I totally agree with

20:17

you, I started writing, then I

20:19

started doing standup, which is a

20:21

different thought process to it. And

20:23

then kind of fell into like

20:25

this accidental punditry, which never would

20:27

I have ever guessed. And I still

20:29

don't consider myself, you know, it's

20:31

not something that I ever wanted

20:33

to write. It's

20:35

like, I am an accidental pundit only

20:37

because I got caught in the crossfire

20:39

of the culture wars. And I do

20:41

want to circle back to the Second

20:43

Amendment stuff because that was really a

20:45

pivotal moment for me of realizing like

20:47

how little I knew about anything. But

20:50

what do you, when you say

20:52

you're kind of have to rewire your whole

20:54

brain, just what, in what ways did you have

20:56

to rewire your whole brain? I

20:58

had to kind of get outside of

21:00

myself. It's really when you're so used

21:03

to writing, there's a buffer between you and

21:05

your audience. I mean, you've got the protection

21:07

of the keyboard and the protection of the

21:09

screen, and they don't see you. They don't

21:11

see you when you know that you've just

21:13

written a horrible sentence and you press backspace

21:15

or you just highlight the whole section and

21:17

take it out. Nobody knows that. They just

21:19

see the perfect curated thing. And

21:21

I think you can be a little

21:23

more reckless in your thinking and a

21:25

little bit more lazy in your output.

21:27

And when you are on stage, as

21:29

you know, because comedy is hard. And

21:32

when you're talking on a mic and

21:34

even if you're just talking about the

21:36

news, you have to be so much

21:38

more concise and you have to eliminate

21:40

a bunch of steps from your brain

21:42

to your mouth. So it's not just

21:44

your brain to your fingers, to the

21:46

keyboard, to the screen. You just got

21:49

like, that's it. And you have to

21:51

really, I kind of had

21:53

like retrain how I thought about

21:55

things and how I approached it. And

21:57

there's no verbal backspace. And

22:00

make sure that it sounded, you know,

22:02

coherent and it required even more prep, you

22:04

know, obviously before talking into the mic,

22:06

because you can prep while you write, you

22:08

can't do that when you're talking, you

22:10

kind of got to be prepared. So it

22:12

was a really different way of doing

22:14

things. And it took a little bit, it

22:16

wasn't something that came immediately. I mean,

22:18

it took a little bit of, you know,

22:20

I guess a practice of baptism by

22:22

fire, just like going on air and doing

22:24

it. And I am positive that the

22:27

first show that I did is the worst

22:29

thing that's ever aired in the United

22:31

States of America. And there's like no award

22:33

for how bad it was. I mean,

22:35

oh my gosh, I'd probably saved somewhere. And

22:37

I'm sure it's the most horrible thing

22:39

ever because it was bad. But you kind

22:41

of you learn after you do it

22:43

for a while. But it was it was

22:45

not easy. That the beginning, that whole

22:47

process of rewiring, it was it was really

22:49

difficult. Yeah,

22:51

I found that this

22:53

is definitely a. Yeah,

22:57

it's a different medium and you

22:59

are so much, there's nothing that

23:01

you are so much more vulnerable.

23:03

You are there and it's the

23:06

audience and in your words, and

23:08

there is no computer monitor and

23:10

no keyboard and there's no refuge.

23:12

It's just you are out there.

23:14

And yeah, go on. I didn't

23:16

mean to do it. Very intimate.

23:18

It is very intimate. I love

23:21

that's why the first know, I

23:23

mean, I was joking the other

23:25

day that so much of what

23:27

happened to me in even the

23:29

past eight years, I've had to

23:31

kind of grow up in public

23:33

in a lot of ways that

23:36

is so uncomfortable and really early

23:38

on when I was writing for

23:40

Playboy, I attracted this kind of,

23:42

you know, Playboy kind of red

23:44

-blooded American male audience as I

23:46

was really the only person who

23:48

was actually speaking to them at

23:51

the magazine at that time, one

23:53

of the few. And

23:55

then something, I think it was

23:57

some kind of school shooting or

23:59

something. And I was mouthing off

24:02

on Twitter and my new audience

24:04

that I had attracted immediately pushed

24:06

back and I was like I Took

24:09

a step back and I was like

24:11

I don't know anything about guns It

24:14

just made me pause and I was

24:16

like I don't know that any of

24:18

the gun laws in California I couldn't

24:20

pick up and load a gun. I

24:22

grew up and I grew up in

24:24

a pretty anti -gun household And and

24:26

I was an anti -gun by any

24:28

means at that point, but I

24:30

was just I Realized

24:33

in that moment. I was like I really

24:35

know like I'm spouting off about this And

24:37

I know nothing about it at all and

24:39

and also guns so not only do I

24:41

know nothing about guns But I also know

24:43

nothing about what it takes to get a

24:45

gun in California or in any of it

24:47

I know nothing and it made me I

24:49

had my audience write me all of you

24:51

know Tell me what you think about this

24:53

debate. What is your opinion about it? and

24:56

this and the gun laws and

24:58

the whatever and I got

25:00

such thoughtful well written

25:02

essays from men all over America

25:04

and even some from outside

25:06

of America just with their views

25:08

on American gun culture and

25:10

policy and Most of them were

25:12

responsible gun owners and grew

25:14

up with guns in there You

25:16

know, I had we grew

25:18

up in Minnesota part of my

25:20

upbringing So I had a lot of

25:23

friends who grew up with we would

25:25

you know, their dads would hunt, etc So

25:27

it wasn't like something that was completely

25:29

foreign to me But it was not something

25:31

that I had in my upbringing And I

25:33

probably would have responded the way a

25:35

lot of your readers to your column

25:37

responded when when it was like a gun in the

25:39

home We must think

25:41

of the children. Yeah and

25:44

It was that was I

25:46

think a turning point moment

25:48

in Just

25:50

opening the floodgates to recognizing

25:52

that I a lot of

25:55

the preconceived ideas I had

25:57

about everything were not really

25:59

that well We're not considered or

26:01

thought out at all. And

26:03

once that opened, it was,

26:05

it's just like here we

26:07

are. I voted for Trump.

26:10

Eight years later. There you

26:12

go. It's linked with what

26:14

you said, like kind of

26:16

growing up in public. And

26:19

especially if you are doing

26:21

anything, whether it is, I

26:23

think commentary, comedy, punditry, whatever, there's

26:26

not a lot of grace. And it's

26:28

very weird because when I started in

26:30

this, I was in my early 20s

26:32

and now I'm in my 40s. And

26:34

it's, you know, it's been a bit.

26:37

And there are things that I've done

26:39

in the past where I have like

26:41

absolutely just like been a total ass.

26:43

And you know, times when I could

26:45

have gone harder, times when I went

26:47

too hard. And all of that's out

26:49

there for better or for worse. And

26:52

that is, it's weird because it's

26:55

all added to like your public record.

26:57

Like, you know, it's not an

26:59

official record, but it's your public record.

27:01

And it's, you know, it's just,

27:03

it's weird. And even like when you're

27:05

growing in your beliefs or when

27:07

you are changing your beliefs or when

27:09

you are expanding on something, it's

27:11

always, you know, especially now it's like

27:14

that very beginning. Some people always

27:16

like to use that against you. And

27:18

that's another reason why it's very,

27:20

very, it's

27:22

difficult to just remove all those barriers

27:24

and be that vulnerable and be

27:26

that intimate with a public audience because

27:28

of all of that. And, you

27:30

know, because you might change your mind

27:33

on something in 10 years. My

27:35

gosh, in five years. But, you know,

27:37

it's not, I don't know if

27:39

it's allowed anymore. Well, there are two

27:41

things too that come up when

27:43

you talk about this that I think

27:46

of how we avoid like we

27:48

live in a very shameless culture now.

27:50

And so there is that, you

27:52

know, you see the people in this

27:54

space where you can just say

27:56

whatever and pivot and pivot and pivot

27:58

and pivot and it doesn't matter

28:01

because, you know, if you don't care

28:03

about your public record or you

28:05

don't care how you shamelessly move from

28:07

one thing to the next, then

28:09

with no real... It's not growing,

28:11

it's more just kind of

28:13

pivoting towards whatever you think is, you're

28:15

an opportunist essentially, and God bless

28:17

them. But we do live in

28:19

this kind of heightened time of

28:22

no shame, plus we have audience

28:24

capture, which I think can be

28:26

very dangerous to somebody in commentary,

28:28

and I've talked to lots of

28:30

people about this like Glenn Greenwald

28:32

and all kinds of folks about

28:34

how you avoid audience capture, because

28:36

then like you said, you might

28:38

have hold one opinion, I think

28:40

you and Chris are pretty good

28:42

about your audience seems

28:44

you aren't afraid to like piss off

28:47

your audience and necessarily

28:49

have people come at

28:51

you, and but how

28:53

do you, being

28:55

someone who's done this now for

28:57

20 years almost, how do you

28:59

kind of avoid that? I

29:02

just try to be as consistent as

29:04

possible and as transparent as possible. So if

29:06

I thought something like five years ago

29:08

and then maybe I grow from that position

29:10

or even if I just flat out

29:12

change my mind, I'll just be very transparent

29:15

about it, but I think that's important

29:17

too, like if you change your mind on

29:19

something, I wanna be able to explain,

29:21

well, this is how my thought process

29:23

worked and this is why maybe I

29:25

think like this on this issue instead of

29:27

like this, because you have to allow

29:29

people the ability to grow and change their

29:32

minds otherwise, like what in the whole

29:34

is the point of punditry? I mean,

29:36

are we not going out there to persuade

29:38

people to maybe kind of change their

29:40

views or adopt our views or consider our

29:42

views? If we're not able to say

29:44

it's okay, if you come to

29:46

a different way of thinking, then we're

29:48

never gonna recruit anybody to our side

29:50

and we're just gonna be tribal and

29:52

miserable for forever. But I think too

29:54

being consistent and there are times when

29:57

I, there are times that there's things

29:59

I don't wanna say or. positions that I

30:01

don't want to take, but it's consistent to

30:03

do so. And I think that that's

30:05

like, it's really important to be, I

30:08

try to be as consistent as possible.

30:10

And you gotta call balls and strikes,

30:12

like sometimes our side messes up, and

30:14

by my side, I just mean, like

30:16

people who just want to be

30:19

left alone and like the Constitution.

30:21

just want to live their lives

30:23

and not be bothered. And I

30:25

think it's, it's that consistency is

30:27

important, but it doesn't when you

30:29

friends anymore. Being consistent on balls

30:32

and strikes doesn't when you friends.

30:34

And I think that people have

30:36

to be okay with that. And

30:38

that's, you know, you have to be

30:40

okay with saying, you know, you have to be

30:43

okay with saying, you know, you have to

30:45

be unafraid in doing that. And I think

30:47

after a while, if I hadn't done this,

30:49

I think for as long as I have,

30:51

and had been really consistent to

30:54

the point of, in some cases,

30:56

maybe setting myself back even, I

30:58

think that I would not be

31:00

given any kind of slack at

31:02

all from my audience. I don't

31:05

think that they would have turned

31:07

their back on me, but I've

31:09

been super consistent and even

31:11

to the point where it's, you

31:13

know, not advantageous for me,

31:15

definitely at times. But I think

31:18

that's important more than anything. Because

31:20

otherwise, what's the point of the,

31:22

either you have a position or

31:24

you don't, either it's a real principle

31:26

or it's for show. So that's kind

31:28

of how I fall out on it.

31:31

That's good advice, I think. I remember

31:33

just. God, I'm still apologizing to my

31:35

audience for like my, oh, two weeks.

31:38

What's the big deal? I just didn't

31:40

know. I just did not know. I

31:42

so underestimated how much the government would

31:44

just take power and never let go

31:47

of it. And it was, I'm glad

31:49

I learned the lesson, but it's one

31:51

of those things that I've been, you

31:54

know, like I had to basically after

31:56

two weeks be like, I was wrong,

31:58

you guys were all right. And that's fine

32:00

and people should be like that's great

32:03

because that's you know That's what that's

32:05

what they that's what the whole purpose

32:07

was of trying to persuade people But

32:09

now it feels like people are like

32:11

well, that's great You were persuaded, but

32:14

I'm still going to hold it against

32:16

you and I'm going to keep I'm

32:18

going to let you at the table

32:20

of discourse I hate that none. Yeah,

32:22

I think you talk a lot about

32:25

Grace and your recent book and just

32:27

we do live in a culture that

32:29

and it's hard. I think with the

32:32

kids I see like I have nephews

32:34

who are I just have younger nephews,

32:36

nieces and I see again like

32:38

we're talking about the beginning how

32:41

how their brain is being wired

32:43

to avoid being canceled or

32:45

to avoid being conflict in

32:47

general or to avoid being

32:50

You know, they're so, they're

32:52

so aware of the fact

32:54

that the internet is forever

32:56

and can ruin your life

32:59

and ruin your opportunity, get

33:01

your ability to get jobs,

33:03

that there, are they, are they, I

33:05

don't know, I read this really great

33:08

quote last night that it

33:10

was all about how. we're

33:13

just kind of settling and selling

33:15

ourselves short. And are they kind

33:17

of forced into this position of

33:20

not taking any risks? Because they're

33:22

worried that those risks will come

33:24

back to haunt them. That's a

33:26

sad thing. The youth not wanting to

33:28

take a risk, because that's the time

33:30

that you should take risks. Yeah. I

33:32

mean, that's, risk should be, and risk

33:35

is viewed as such a negative, and

33:37

so many amazing things have come from

33:39

risk. And it's sad that the younger

33:42

generation is thinking, well, I better

33:44

play it safe instead of risk.

33:46

I mean, our whole, our whole Republic

33:48

was founded on risk. I mean,

33:50

the fact that people came here at

33:53

all was, that was from risk, all

33:55

of its risk. And they just, it's

33:57

sad. Like, my kids aren't on social.

34:00

media. And I feel like

34:02

I have to be doubly hard about

34:04

doubly out there and

34:06

doubly forthright. So they see

34:08

that it's okay to be

34:10

of your own

34:13

mind and share

34:15

what you think without compromise. But

34:18

I agree with you on that.

34:20

And that terrifies me, I think

34:22

almost more than anything, is that

34:25

the Alpha generation and even Gen

34:27

Z and even millennial, like

34:29

really everybody, every generation,

34:31

they're being rewired to

34:33

double think before they speak.

34:36

And it's like they focus group

34:38

inside of their own head. How

34:40

is this going to be perceived? Could

34:42

this be offensive to anyone? And

34:44

offensive, that's even something that's entirely arbitrary,

34:46

depending upon who's defining the offense.

34:48

And so no one wants to take

34:50

the risk of doing anything. And

34:52

that's how we're in an idiocracy right

34:54

now. We are in the early

34:57

stages of it because of that. Yeah.

34:59

Yeah. And

35:01

I think with women, this is

35:03

what something that just lost me

35:05

on the left is like the

35:07

gaslighting that happens with women in

35:09

particular around this, where it's so

35:11

even aside from just checking yourself

35:13

and being afraid of saying things

35:16

or putting an opinion out there

35:18

on a deeper level, we have

35:20

women who are being told that

35:22

they're racist or transphobic if they

35:24

feel nervous around a person in

35:26

a bathroom. It's

35:28

like this weird insidious. So

35:31

women are kind of have that

35:33

instinct of like, this is weird,

35:35

I better get out of here.

35:37

And then it's like, Oh no,

35:39

I'm just being a transphobe or

35:41

Oh no, I'm just, there's something

35:43

wrong with me. And I should

35:45

ignore that little voice. And that

35:48

to me is like, disgust, that

35:50

is where that's where truly like, there

35:52

are certain things where I'm like, this

35:54

is where the

35:56

left loses me completely.

35:58

And that really brainwashing young women

36:00

because I came from the generation of

36:02

the gift of fear as you did

36:05

where it's like no you run if

36:07

you feel like running you run. The

36:09

other side of the street yeah you

36:11

don't like yeah exactly yeah that you're

36:13

told that you're a hateful bigot if

36:16

if you do that you do that

36:18

or that you're mean or that the

36:20

fault is on you for having that

36:22

gut instinct that pisses me off when

36:25

I hear stuff like that because it's

36:27

you're like a step away from telling

36:29

women well you're just rape phobic. You

36:31

know, you're just feeling, now you're just,

36:34

we're, we're a step, I feel like

36:36

we're a step away from that because

36:38

that's the gut instinct that keeps women

36:40

alive and it's a gut instinct that

36:42

it's a, it is a smart fear

36:45

and it is the body's response to

36:47

something that the mind hasn't yet fully

36:49

realizes. And women's gut instinct is so

36:51

incredibly important. And when you're shaming women.

36:54

for not accommodating this insane cosplay theater.

36:56

That's, you're telling women to then ignore,

36:58

you know, ignore gut instinct, ignore, you're

37:00

the evolution of women's innate alarm and

37:03

just, you know. set yourselves up to

37:05

be a statistic because there are so

37:07

many stories like that where that's that's

37:09

exactly what happened. It scares me. I'm

37:11

glad I have boys because I cannot

37:14

imagine I would be fighting everyone in

37:16

the school board. I would literally be

37:18

wailing people at school board meetings, I

37:20

would be throwing punches, I'd be like

37:23

shaking the teeth out of these like

37:25

school administrators. If my daughter had to

37:27

go into a bathroom and she was

37:29

told that there's going to be a

37:32

dude, a dude with a penis in

37:34

there, pretending that he's a chick, hell

37:36

no. No, no, we're not doing that.

37:38

How mothers of daughters are doing it,

37:40

God love them. I don't know how.

37:43

I don't, I don't, I don't know

37:45

either. There was... I hate to even

37:47

bring this story up because I don't

37:49

like to I can't

37:52

like mind read the

37:54

what was going

37:56

on with the victim

37:58

of this horrific

38:01

murder in LA. But

38:03

it was a

38:05

young girl, she was

38:07

working in a

38:09

store. She, there was

38:12

a crazy guy, he was black

38:14

man that went in and he was

38:16

like mentally ill and clearly out

38:18

of his mind. And she

38:20

had enough time to text a friend,

38:22

like this guy is in here creeping

38:24

me out and then he murdered her

38:26

like horrifically. And I just, she was

38:29

young, she was 25. And then afterwards

38:31

like I hate, this is the thing

38:33

I hate about social media and why

38:35

I don't even like to bring it

38:37

up, but it did make me think

38:39

about this stuff. People

38:42

were like, well, that's the policies

38:44

you get in LA, which is

38:46

like very victim blaming. And then

38:48

she had like a BLM thing

38:50

on her, you know, one of

38:52

her social media profiles. And I'm

38:54

like, I can't mind read, but

38:56

how much of that in there, how

38:58

much of growing up with that, a lot

39:00

of this stuff that you're, that they're

39:02

being taught, did it cause her,

39:04

cause did it cause her to

39:06

pause and not run out the

39:08

back door? Like, did it cause,

39:10

why are you texting? Like, why

39:12

weren't you out of there? And

39:14

it's a great point. That's

39:17

a great point. And I don't like

39:19

to, I'm not saying that this is

39:21

her thought, this is why I hate

39:23

even bringing it up because it's not

39:25

fair to her or the family to

39:28

even try and impugn what her thinking

39:30

was in a situation like that. But

39:32

it is like, we were

39:34

raised, I was raised in

39:36

that situation, you don't text

39:38

somebody, this person's creeping me

39:40

out. If you're alone, you

39:42

just get out. Gen

39:44

X. Gen X is like, bye,

39:46

we're out of here. You hear ch

39:48

-ch in the woods and we're gone.

39:50

Literally happened to me recently, I was

39:52

about to get on an elevator. It

39:54

wasn't, and like the, it wasn't really

39:57

working cause they were moving. I was

39:59

visiting someone and - It was in the building

40:01

where, and

40:04

they were using the elevator to move. So

40:06

they kind of co -opt the elevator. And then

40:08

this guy was like, oh, he was one of

40:10

the movers or something. He was like, oh

40:12

no, you can come on, I'll bring you down.

40:14

And I got on and then he looked

40:16

at my chest. Like, he just gave me a

40:18

look and I was like, nope. Like, I

40:20

immediately was like, I'll take the stairs. Like, just

40:22

got off the elevator. And I was thinking

40:24

like, how many people in my position would be

40:26

like, I'm gonna be nice. I

40:28

don't wanna, and this is what

40:30

they say in the gift of

40:32

fear is we are the women

40:34

in particular, the only animal that

40:36

will get into a metal box

40:38

with someone that they're getting a

40:40

vibe of creepy predator or whatever

40:42

from because they're worried about hurting

40:44

their feelings. Yeah. Yeah,

40:47

imagine that hurting someone's

40:49

feelings is somehow that should

40:51

be avoided at all costs as opposed

40:53

to getting like assaulted, raped or murdered.

40:55

And there is, and that just all

40:57

leads into this. You're talking about the

40:59

25 year old in LA. I mean,

41:01

25 years old, you grow up. I

41:04

mean, that's your whole life

41:06

of being told to ignore

41:08

a gut feeling and accommodate

41:10

and prioritize someone else's feelings.

41:12

Even if they're giving you

41:14

weird vibes, ignore your

41:16

gut instinct. It's more important to make

41:18

that person feel comfortable than it

41:20

is for you to be safe. Someone

41:23

else's comfort actually outranks your own safety

41:25

and security. And that is a

41:27

wild message to tell people as

41:29

they're growing up. And so I,

41:31

I mean, I hate that, you

41:33

know, that's insane that she had

41:35

time to text and didn't leave

41:37

because we would, you know, I'm,

41:39

we're of the generation where we're

41:41

like, if you're comfort, I'm more

41:43

about my safety. We gotta get

41:45

out. We can't put ourselves in

41:47

that situation. But that's ultimately what

41:49

it is. And that's, that is such

41:51

a female nature and for

41:54

it to be exploited by

41:56

these, you know, cosplaying activists

41:58

like that. is such a

42:00

tragedy and is so evil. It's so

42:03

evil to exploit like the nurturing

42:05

that, you know, a woman wanting to

42:07

be like accommodating and nice and

42:09

just kind of like leaning into that

42:11

nature in order to exploit it

42:13

to do her harm is that's so

42:16

evil. And I do think that you're

42:18

balancing. I actually

42:20

do think a woman's

42:22

probably back of

42:24

mind calculation is balancing

42:26

two fears, the immediate fear.

42:28

But then there's the fear

42:30

of if I respond in

42:32

the way that I want

42:35

to respond and call the

42:37

cops or whatever, am I going

42:39

to end up like that woman in

42:41

the New York City park? And then

42:43

you get canceled. So it's this other

42:45

social fear of being piled on in

42:47

the event that you're wrong, that this

42:49

person isn't going to murder you. And

42:52

they're just a crazy person.

42:54

And you don't feel that

42:56

with the Daniel Penny case,

42:58

like that woman on she

43:01

tweeted, there was another incident at some subway

43:03

where it was like some like crazy.

43:05

I think I don't know if it was

43:07

a homeless guy or just somebody who's

43:09

again, I don't know what it was, but

43:11

he was like harassing another woman. And

43:13

this other woman had tweeted the story and

43:16

was saying, Well, where are the men that are stepping

43:18

up? And she was just ratioed into a hole in

43:20

the ground by all the people who were like, Well,

43:22

Daniel Penny stood up. And this is what happened to

43:25

him. Now he's on trial. And there is

43:27

there, there is something to that

43:29

because people are so afraid. And

43:31

then when when someone like Daniel Penny

43:33

steps up and then we find all

43:35

this stuff out with his case, like the

43:37

guy was Jordan, he was actually alive.

43:39

And here's a whole thread on Reddit warning

43:41

everybody about the subway platform and how

43:44

he had he actually tried to kidnap a

43:46

seven year old before and he's broke

43:48

some elderly woman's nose and try to throw

43:50

another woman under the train tracks. But

43:52

he was an innocent Michael Jackson impersonator, don't

43:54

you know? And they were trying to

43:56

like retcon his whole history just back to

43:58

that when somebody does stand up, they see

44:00

what happens to them. It's which is

44:02

not only is Daniel Penny canceled, but now

44:05

he's on trial for murder. Yeah. And they're

44:07

like, maybe it is better if I'm just

44:09

a victim. Then I can at

44:11

least have my then I can at

44:13

least have my reputation. I can have

44:15

my brand. I swear it all comes

44:17

back to that. Or maybe it's better

44:19

if I just ignore it and act

44:21

like it's not happening and don't step

44:23

in, which is them. I mean, the

44:25

majority of people do this anyway. This

44:27

is like, I think of a pretty

44:29

standard. I remember one day I

44:31

witnessed a shooting in LA and I

44:33

was like, Ah, shit, I have to go

44:36

back because I like it was another

44:38

it was another lesson in how quickly your

44:40

brain will lie to you. I remember

44:42

I was driving I stopped at the stop

44:44

sign. I looked to my right I

44:46

looked to my left, two kids come running

44:48

out of the alley and they're like,

44:51

bang, bang, bang, bang. And I was like,

44:53

that sounded a lot like guns. And

44:55

then I just I kept driving because I

44:57

was like, okay. And I kept

44:59

my brain was like, immediately was like, it's

45:01

the middle of the day. That was probably

45:03

just kids playing cap guns, what you see

45:05

didn't and I went and parked my car,

45:07

which I lived pretty close. And then I

45:09

was like kicking rocks down my alley and

45:12

my cousins like, what's wrong with you? And

45:14

I was like, I think I just witnessed

45:16

a shooting. But why wouldn't there be and

45:18

in that moment, it was like Armageddon, like,

45:20

you heard the helicopters and all the I

45:22

was like, yep, it was a shooting. I

45:24

have to go back. And the cops were

45:26

like, no one would come back. They

45:29

were like, most people who saw this would not

45:31

come back and give a statement. They

45:33

were just like, it's not normal what

45:35

you're doing. They're like, most people be

45:37

like, I don't want any part of

45:39

this. Even if they

45:41

witnessed it, even if they saw it,

45:43

they just I drove. I didn't just

45:45

drive home. I drove down the alley

45:47

because I'm an idiot and then went

45:49

to see if there was like a

45:51

body or something. And I couldn't see anyone

45:53

but there actually was someone he was

45:55

just down in that like grass in

45:57

between the sidewalk and the street

46:00

and between trees. And then the cops were just

46:02

like bungling it left and right. They're like,

46:04

we have a hostile witness. Why are you

46:06

walking her around? And yeah, but it

46:09

was another lesson in just how

46:11

quickly, you know, you wonder like

46:13

in Thailand, like we're just such

46:16

weird creatures. You wonder in Thailand

46:18

that story of the tsunami when

46:20

it's like people were walking, you

46:23

know, the water's receding and they're

46:25

all like, look at the shells.

46:28

Yeah, and the animals are all

46:30

like getting the fuck out of

46:32

the dog. Yeah, you don't want

46:35

to believe that because horrible insane

46:37

crazy things happen on the news,

46:39

not to you. Right. It's not,

46:41

I don't know, it's, you know,

46:43

that doesn't happen to you. So

46:46

it's a lot easier to kind

46:48

of just like disbelieve it. That is

46:50

a wild thing though. That's a

46:52

really good point. Like the way

46:54

that your brain will lie to

46:56

you and say, no, this isn't

46:58

happening. It's okay. Yeah, that's and

47:00

that's why I think it's so

47:03

interesting because I find like you

47:05

already have people who are gonna

47:07

don't want to get involved and

47:09

People who are your brain's gonna

47:11

lie to you in emergency anyway.

47:13

That's kind of base level normal

47:16

and now you're adding all of

47:18

this other stuff like this weird

47:20

ideology you're adding all of the

47:22

stuff about getting canceled or even

47:25

worse you know put on trial

47:27

so you're you're experiencing like a

47:29

social death versus you're you're

47:32

truly evaluating like is the

47:34

social death or actual death

47:36

yeah and in some instances

47:38

social death can feel much

47:40

worse because you're alive. That's

47:43

a really good point. It's like

47:45

social death is, some of these

47:47

people act like it's worse than death

47:49

death. Yeah, they do. They think social

47:52

death is the way that they

47:54

act. They act like it's worse

47:56

than death death. And I think

47:58

people enjoy social murder. They enjoy,

48:00

they will never, they love socially murdering

48:02

people. I think for the people who

48:04

deserve it, it is, I'm not gonna

48:07

lie, it's fun. It, there

48:09

are some people who deserve to

48:11

get socially murdered. They're horrible people. They

48:13

say, they, they do horrible things. They, you

48:16

know, I get it. But at

48:18

the same time, then I'm

48:20

like, ooh, am I a baddie? Like am I

48:22

one of the baddies? Remember

48:24

the first cancellation, Justine

48:26

Flacco, is that her

48:28

name? It was the girl that

48:30

was like, has Justine landed yet? It

48:33

was like back in 2013 and

48:35

she had some, she was some

48:37

PR, she had no followers. She

48:39

did some dumb tweet. It got

48:41

picked up and, and then it was

48:43

like an internet pile on her

48:46

life was ruined. She landed in Africa.

48:48

No. So for like six hours,

48:50

the whole world was after her and

48:52

she had no idea. Yeah. And

48:54

then she landed in her life was

48:56

like completely destroyed. And I remember

48:58

why this was right when I was

49:00

first starting to use Twitter and

49:02

really get Twitter. And I was like,

49:04

guys, this seems really bad. I

49:06

don't think we should be doing this.

49:08

This seems like a bad practice

49:10

in general, because the other problem you

49:12

have now is like, you'll, this

49:14

happens all the time with

49:16

any kind of controversial event

49:18

or anything where it's like, we got the

49:20

guy. And then you find out that

49:22

it wasn't the guy who was doing the

49:24

thing. But his life's already ruined. There

49:26

are already protesters outside of his house. It's,

49:28

it's such a like very And it's

49:31

people who, and it's always like some social

49:33

media account that thinks it's a newsroom.

49:35

And I'm not saying that newsrooms are the

49:37

only people who can, but they just

49:39

read other stuff on Twitter, aggregate it. Don't

49:41

even give a hat tip. And they're

49:43

like, guys, this is breaking. It is this

49:45

person, John Smith who did the killings. And

49:47

everyone's like, John Smith must die.

49:50

And then it's like, wait a minute.

49:52

No, it's not delete, delete. I'm going

49:54

to try to like scrub my whole

49:56

timeline. It's not this guy pretend. I

49:58

didn't say that. Let's move on. No,

50:00

because now the guy is like, he's fired

50:02

and his family left him and his

50:05

life is ruined. Yeah. All the hell

50:07

down. You know, people don't always have

50:09

to be first, but everybody has to

50:11

have a take because it's like if

50:13

you don't have a take, are

50:15

you participating? Where's your take? You

50:18

didn't, you didn't submit your take.

50:20

You've got, if you're participating in

50:22

this thing we called life, you've

50:24

got to have your take and you've got

50:27

to have it now. It has to

50:29

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51:27

25% off. Yeah, this is also

51:30

the problem with like jokes where

51:32

you I kind of fire them

51:34

off and I don't generally I

51:36

mean it's not hard to be

51:38

in stand up because it's different.

51:40

Do you get like a certain

51:42

like expectation if you're in stand

51:44

up like okay this is going

51:46

to be a little bit more like balls

51:49

to the wall than if it's. It's

51:51

hard when people are recording like

51:53

at mother ship you can't record

51:55

people have their phones locked up

51:57

and so you can actually still.

52:00

comedy the way you should do comedy

52:02

which is say messed up things workout

52:04

jokes bomb not get it right until

52:07

it's right or until you abandon it

52:09

because there's no grace there you're

52:11

depending on the audience and some

52:14

people might get offended and walk

52:16

out and whatever but you at least

52:18

aren't worried that in your attempt

52:20

to clunkily find your way to

52:22

a joke someone's not going to

52:25

record it put it on the

52:27

internet and then you'll be canceled

52:29

or your life will be destroyed

52:31

while you were trying to work. You

52:33

know Chris Rock kind of famously said

52:35

stand up is the only art form

52:37

that you have to fail publicly to

52:39

get better at it. It's like in

52:41

order to improve you've got to just

52:44

fail over and over and over again

52:46

in front of people. It's not like

52:48

writing or you know playing a song

52:50

you can practice and put it out

52:52

there and have it be good. you won't

52:54

know if something's good until and

52:57

even then when something's good it's

52:59

not always good. It's like I said the

53:01

other night I was like I feel like I

53:03

feel like I'm just getting to know this

53:05

joke. Like I thought I knew it and

53:07

then for this audience it did really well

53:10

and it doesn't normally do well. So now

53:12

I feel like I really need to like

53:14

get to know this joke better like we're

53:17

dating and I wasn't sure about it but

53:19

now I'm now maybe there's something here that

53:21

I didn't see before. I was like you

53:23

personify all of your jokes is like something

53:26

you need to get to know but it's

53:28

really just. It hit different. Every audience is

53:30

different. I don't know. And so much of

53:32

it is where you go up in the

53:35

lineup and how they're feeling. And I

53:37

mean, I bombed in front of a bunch

53:39

of lesbians the other night bombed. It was

53:41

one of the worst bombs. I've had

53:44

in a while. It was humbling. It

53:46

was a humbling bomb. There's

53:48

a very humbling bomb. It was,

53:50

but it was necessary because I

53:52

was doing jokes about, I don't

53:54

know, I was just doing normal

53:56

stuff and sometimes lesbians can be

53:58

based in some. sometimes they cannot be.

54:00

It's got softballs, isn't it? No,

54:03

I just was talking about like how we're

54:05

gonna have a dictator Elon and I

54:07

was joking about something, I don't know,

54:10

it was probably electoral related, but it was

54:12

pretty soon after the election and I

54:14

didn't realize how in their feels the

54:16

Democrats were until that moment.

54:18

And I was like, oh, I

54:20

need to be kind of

54:22

sensitive to, cause I've just

54:24

kind of been online

54:26

being like, all right, like

54:28

suckers. I

54:31

tried to tell you, I If

54:33

it was a joke, I'm wondering

54:35

how they would respond it because those

54:38

are like, that demo is like a natural

54:40

ally of all the people who are like, where's

54:42

the common sense at? Like with all

54:44

the trends stuff. I know that's what I

54:46

thought and I was trying my, I

54:48

have this whole bit that I've done

54:50

online for years and it's very hard

54:52

to translate to the stage about how

54:54

the patriarchy is so crafty. I'm like,

54:57

I wasn't someone who believed really that

54:59

much in feminism or I was just

55:01

like, okay, whatever. And my teacher

55:03

who taught us about feminism was like,

55:05

you're gonna set this movement back,

55:08

I know it. And - You're gonna

55:10

be the death of us, Bridgette. Yeah,

55:12

she knew. I was like, actually

55:14

I, and they would talk about the

55:16

patriarchy and I roll my eyes

55:18

and be like, you're giving them too

55:20

much power. And then when they

55:23

started taking like women's medals and getting

55:25

into all of our spaces, I

55:27

was like, damn, maybe the patriarchy is

55:29

real. Like maybe those radical feminists

55:31

were right. And it kind of is

55:33

a joke that threads needle both ways,

55:35

but they were not having it. And

55:37

my lesbian friend who runs the show

55:39

said it was because I, when I

55:42

made the joke, I said, and then

55:44

men started taking women's awards. And

55:46

she said, the minute I said

55:48

men, that's like a trigger

55:50

for them that I, she's like,

55:52

you can't say men because

55:54

they consider trans, you know, like

55:56

trans women are men or

55:58

whatever. So it immediately - shut them down

56:00

from being, and I was like, you guys.

56:03

But it's true. And this is the

56:05

group of people that's like, suck my

56:07

dick, beg it if they're on your

56:09

dating apps. Like, I would, I sure,

56:11

I was going away. I was reading,

56:14

like, the trans movement is like, making,

56:16

like, the lesbian bars go completely, like,

56:18

they, it's like, they don't exist anymore.

56:20

Yeah. Yep. Yep, I would think I

56:22

was defending their spaces, but nope,

56:24

they weren't having it. There's no

56:26

more space. There's no like me.

56:29

I kind of want them back

56:31

in the end, but they were

56:33

not there was deaf. I was

56:35

like, Ooh, Ariel warned me this

56:37

joke wasn't going to work and

56:39

it didn't. No, it's fine. It's

56:41

good. It's good. It's good.

56:43

You're super wrong publicly

56:45

about something. in Pundatry.

56:47

You're like, oh. Yeah,

56:49

Pundatry. Oriated, hard and

56:51

feathered. And then you just

56:54

got to, and then, or

56:56

you can just like switch

56:58

and pretend it never happened

57:00

and then just keep on

57:02

going, because that works for

57:04

some people. What's the thing

57:07

that still makes you go, like

57:09

inner cringe? Oh, I just, there's

57:11

a lot. I cannot stand. I

57:14

don't like disingenuousness. I don't

57:16

like scenesters. I don't know,

57:18

like there's a lot of

57:20

stuff that makes me cringe.

57:23

Like when people are too

57:25

effusive in their love of

57:27

an entertainment figure, a politician,

57:29

a sports team, or anything

57:31

else, I'm just like, I just don't know

57:33

why we're all supposed to just root for

57:36

this group of people that get really wildly

57:38

paid. I feel like it's bread and circuses.

57:40

I'm like, why am I supposed to be

57:42

like I live in Dallas and everybody's Dallas

57:45

Cowboys and apparently they suck this season. I

57:47

couldn't even tell you why. I know nothing

57:49

about football but everyone's like cowboys. I just

57:52

can't get into it. I just don't know

57:54

why we're all supposed to just root for

57:56

this group of people that get really wildly

57:58

paid and they have. Just, is it, that's

58:00

a hobby? Like we're, I don't

58:03

know. It seems, I really, I

58:05

just can't get into it. I

58:07

don't know. I, that, so any

58:09

kind of like super effusive love or

58:11

adoration, I just, I

58:13

just can't. Yeah. I

58:16

just did it. Excuse me. I

58:18

just did a bit about this or

58:20

I was just going after everybody in

58:22

my mentions, I don't read my mentions.

58:24

Um, Maggie was reading our comments. Maggie's

58:26

my producer and she coproduces that. And

58:28

she's also on dumpster fire. And she

58:30

reads the comments on dumpster fire. And

58:33

we, we were talking about Trump's picks.

58:35

And I, my take is just like,

58:37

this is like a reality show and

58:39

it's, we're in the fanfic era and

58:41

all these people are personalities and it's

58:43

like, okay, cool. I'm, I'm here for

58:45

the reality show. But I was like,

58:48

ah, Matt Gaetz, he kind of looks

58:50

like a scumbag. And I was like,

58:52

he just strikes. I'm like, I've been

58:54

saying this for years on dumpster fire.

58:56

No one can see a scumbag when

58:58

he's on their team. It's just like

59:00

an inability to call out scumbaggery if

59:03

they're on your team. Or they'll go,

59:05

well, he's our scumbag though. Our scumbags

59:07

are better. Your

59:09

scumbags are bad. Ours or can't make

59:11

fun of our scumbags. So I guess

59:13

there were all these like Matt Gaetz

59:15

stands in our mentions or in our

59:17

comments. And I was like, really, that's the

59:19

hill you're going to die on. You're going to,

59:21

you're, this is the guy you need to

59:23

like go to bat for. I'm so embarrassed for

59:25

all of you. That's, you

59:27

know, he lived in the Truman show

59:30

house. No, on

59:32

the Truman show. That's his parents house.

59:34

That's where they grew up. Yeah, right

59:36

there in Seaside. What do you think

59:38

about the pecs so far? And

59:40

that's, um, and he, I, I don't remember how

59:42

we got on the topic. We were, we were

59:44

at CPAC and I was going on Fox and

59:46

he was coming up right after me and, um,

59:49

he somehow he said that. And

59:51

I thought that that's interesting. You grew up in

59:53

the Truman show house. That's really weird. Yeah.

59:55

Do you, what do you think about the

59:57

pitch so far? I,

1:00:00

some I like and some I'm like the

1:00:02

hell. That's kind of where I'm

1:00:04

at. So, I

1:00:06

was like, I like Tom Holm and his

1:00:08

borders are, I don't know why he's

1:00:10

not running HHS. And I asked him when

1:00:12

he was on my program and he

1:00:14

said, no comment. So I don't know what

1:00:16

that means, but he had just said no

1:00:18

comment and they have Christine Ohm running

1:00:20

HHS. And I don't understand that. She's

1:00:23

just gonna shoot. We were joking. She's just

1:00:25

gonna shoot people at the border. She

1:00:28

took HHS to the gravel pit

1:00:30

and eliminates the agency. I'll be like,

1:00:32

I can overlook cricket if you do

1:00:34

that. But otherwise, I don't know. I

1:00:36

don't, I don't understand why she's, I don't

1:00:38

get that one. Pete Hegs at the

1:00:41

SecDef. I know

1:00:43

that he's more known as being

1:00:45

like a television personality and

1:00:47

like doing these, you know, performative

1:00:49

things that I think that people

1:00:51

kind of like know him for more

1:00:53

than his, you know, double bronze

1:00:55

star decorations, you know, his

1:00:58

accolades, his, you know, and his, he's got

1:01:00

a degree from Harvard. I don't know

1:01:02

if that means anything to anybody anymore, but

1:01:04

he understands policy. And

1:01:06

I, as long as he, cause

1:01:08

it's gonna be a hard job what he's

1:01:10

gotta do. Our recruitment is like nothing.

1:01:12

Our readiness has been obliterated. We got DEI

1:01:14

up at the highest levels. It's insane.

1:01:16

You know, we, I don't think out of

1:01:18

the three, we did like three tests

1:01:20

to see like how we would perform in

1:01:22

the Pacific, heaven forbid, if there was

1:01:25

any kind of like Chinese aggression and we

1:01:27

didn't perform that great. So that's gonna

1:01:29

be like a monumental task that he has

1:01:31

to undertake. And so, you know, I'm

1:01:33

fine with him. As long as he's gonna

1:01:35

be a shit kicker, I'm fine with that.

1:01:37

Like I want an asshole in that

1:01:39

position. I want a jerk. I want, I

1:01:41

want someone who's like patent on all

1:01:43

the steroids to go in and be like,

1:01:45

look, this is how this is gonna

1:01:47

go. We're gonna get it done this way.

1:01:49

So I'm okay with that. As so

1:01:51

long as there's results, I

1:01:53

want to see results with it. Gates is

1:01:55

AG, I have no idea why. I,

1:01:58

it's weird that he, He

1:02:01

resigned his seat, I guess, now not to

1:02:03

be under the purview of the House Ethics

1:02:05

Committee. So now that report doesn't have to

1:02:07

be made public. And everyone's always like, well,

1:02:09

Trump's playing 40 chess. In this instance, he

1:02:11

may actually be, because

1:02:13

then Gates can go through the ringer. And

1:02:16

then when everything comes out, if he

1:02:18

has to go through the confirmation process of

1:02:20

Senate, through the Senate for AG, then,

1:02:22

you know, I just don't see how he

1:02:24

makes it past that. And then Trump

1:02:26

can say that I stood by him this

1:02:28

whole time. And without actually having to

1:02:31

put up any further political capital or losing

1:02:33

anything, any kind of credibility. So that

1:02:35

might be a wise move for him. But

1:02:37

I just I don't think that Gates

1:02:39

knows I don't think that Gates can be

1:02:41

AG because you got to be a

1:02:43

special pettiness is required, I think, to do

1:02:46

what needs to be done because it's so

1:02:48

everything is corrupt. All these all these

1:02:50

agencies and all these departments are just I

1:02:52

mean, I don't nobody trust any of

1:02:54

any of them. But I just don't know

1:02:56

if he's the type that is going

1:02:58

to be able to maneuver around and everybody

1:03:00

talks about deep state. I think he

1:03:02

might get undermined by deep state rather than

1:03:04

him under my deep state. So I

1:03:06

don't know. But I think the rest of

1:03:08

the you know, the picks I RFK junior

1:03:10

at HH or yeah, at

1:03:12

HHS, that's like 20 per hour

1:03:14

health and human services. Yeah,

1:03:16

DHS is now that's 20 percent of our

1:03:18

budget. That's a lot.

1:03:20

That's like a huge amount of government control. This

1:03:23

is I just said that, you

1:03:25

know, coke industries and oil companies

1:03:27

like Exxon should be put to

1:03:29

death. Right. And a big climate

1:03:31

change guy. Yeah. And as long

1:03:34

as he if they're going to

1:03:36

silo him just on certain aspects,

1:03:39

I guess maybe it'll work. I don't know.

1:03:41

I mean, I'm not the president. I'm not making

1:03:43

the picks. But some of these I'm like, it's

1:03:47

fantastic. He's got a

1:03:49

pass. This dude has a pass. It's

1:03:51

fan fiction. Get that

1:03:53

that when we why I don't

1:03:55

know why the right does this when

1:03:57

people come over and they want to

1:03:59

join. The right or whatever the

1:04:01

hell the right is a coalition. I'm fine

1:04:03

with coalitions, but I think you got

1:04:05

to be clear coalitions

1:04:08

still revolve around a certain set

1:04:10

of principles lower tax government of

1:04:12

our business like this basic stuff

1:04:15

Saying it like oil companies. Maybe they

1:04:17

should be put to death because they disagree

1:04:19

with you about climate change That's like,

1:04:21

I don't know. Does that fit in the

1:04:23

coalition? I don't I don't know I

1:04:25

got questions about that, but the right gets

1:04:27

so excited Whenever anyone on the left

1:04:29

shows them any interest I know they get

1:04:31

super excited like this person is the

1:04:34

next Republican Jesus This person is that they

1:04:36

get very excited about this But that doesn't

1:04:38

mean that you set them right

1:04:40

there at the captain seat, right? Correct

1:04:42

that where we're going that I get

1:04:44

a little nervous about that, right? This is

1:04:46

I get this a lot being like a

1:04:48

reform slut who's been taken in Taking

1:04:51

in by the the right, but

1:04:53

the right doesn't really want me either,

1:04:55

you know, there there's definitely been

1:04:58

like I think

1:05:00

I kind of exist somewhat in

1:05:02

the middle still because I've

1:05:04

seen a lot of people on the right

1:05:06

be like Well, maybe we don't want your whore

1:05:08

vote. I'm like I Can

1:05:12

understand that because they're whole they're like

1:05:14

your whole thing was where it, you

1:05:16

know You come from playboy. You've got

1:05:18

a body count or whatever they talk

1:05:20

about over there in the man a

1:05:22

sphere and Yeah,

1:05:24

like it's it's interesting it's interesting occupying

1:05:26

like that kind of in between

1:05:28

space that I occupy and Having to

1:05:31

make decisions that I don't want

1:05:33

I don't want to be too reactive

1:05:35

in either direction That was the

1:05:37

weird thing coming from the left was

1:05:39

at do am I changing my

1:05:41

mind or am I reacting to

1:05:43

being rejected? It's always like

1:05:45

something to balance as someone who's

1:05:48

gen X and very like fuck

1:05:50

you Yeah, or are you looking

1:05:52

for normalcy because everything has

1:05:54

gotten so jacked up on the left

1:05:56

that people are like that I can't deal with

1:05:58

this. Where are the normal people at? Like, where

1:06:00

are my normies at? I got to go

1:06:02

find them. And that, I feel like that's

1:06:04

what this election was, and that's why a

1:06:06

lot of people like you and so many

1:06:08

of, they're like, no, these people are freaks.

1:06:10

I got to go over here. I got

1:06:12

to go. They're like, yes, you have a

1:06:14

penis. You're a man. That's how that works.

1:06:17

Or I shouldn't have to give the government

1:06:19

60 % of my income, like basic things that

1:06:21

we can all agree upon. What

1:06:23

do you think about Tulsi? I

1:06:25

don't know. I can't make up my mind

1:06:27

about her. Because, and this says,

1:06:29

I'm sure personally, I'm able

1:06:31

to like, I don't care if people disagree

1:06:34

with me on stuff. As long as

1:06:36

they're, they don't, you don't try to

1:06:38

reduce someone's humanity to nothing over ideology

1:06:40

because I can't stand when there's no

1:06:42

difference between the two. People used to

1:06:44

be able to talk and coexist and

1:06:46

get along and all that stuff, while

1:06:48

thinking differently. She,

1:06:50

I know she said she came out as a Republican. I've

1:06:53

tried to have her on my show, but she will not talk to

1:06:55

me. Because I was really, yeah, she will not

1:06:57

have anything to do with me. I've,

1:07:00

I was specifically interested, like in

1:07:02

her Second Amendment stuff, because she was

1:07:04

a hardcore, hardcore gun

1:07:06

control person, like a assault

1:07:08

weapons ban. She wanted a national

1:07:10

registry, all of

1:07:12

that stuff. I mean, she didn't call

1:07:14

people terrorists, but she like got

1:07:16

real close to the line. You

1:07:18

know, she was very, very hardcore gun

1:07:20

control. And now

1:07:22

she's, she says she's done a

1:07:24

180 and I read a

1:07:27

post that she did where she

1:07:29

wrote, was talking a little bit about it

1:07:31

or this video and it was real like miles

1:07:33

wide inches deep. There was not really a

1:07:35

lot there that gave me any kind of insight

1:07:37

into, yes, she did change and this

1:07:39

is why. And I'm not trying to do

1:07:41

gotcha stuff. Like I am all for like,

1:07:43

oh, you want to come and support two way

1:07:45

now? Let's do this. I am all for

1:07:47

it. I just, I want to make

1:07:49

sure I'm not getting duped because I've been in this

1:07:51

industry for so long. And there a lot of

1:07:53

son of a bitches in this industry. And there are

1:07:55

a lot of people that know where to stick

1:07:57

the shiv and know how to twist it. to

1:08:00

make sure that someone is legit when

1:08:02

they say that they're, I don't want

1:08:04

to get taken in later. And all

1:08:06

I wanted to talk to her about

1:08:08

was that particular issue. And like

1:08:10

what did, because I never, she

1:08:12

never really fully actually explained what

1:08:15

made her change and why. And

1:08:17

that's kind of a big deal.

1:08:19

And I think that gets into

1:08:21

the genuineness of someone. Is it,

1:08:23

is your conversion real or did

1:08:25

you change your mind? I mean,

1:08:27

most people can say, yeah, this

1:08:29

is why I changed my mind.

1:08:31

And you're like, great, that's awesome.

1:08:33

And that's all people, they just,

1:08:35

they want to know if there's

1:08:37

that, they can resonate, if there's

1:08:39

that, that something there, that connection.

1:08:42

But when you don't have that,

1:08:44

it makes people question it. And so

1:08:46

with her, I don't know, like, I

1:08:48

get being at DNI, because she was

1:08:50

on the terror watch list, I don't

1:08:53

know, like I just want to make sure that

1:08:55

she agrees on natural rights because

1:08:57

we've been called terrorists for

1:08:59

supporting two-way rights. Parents have been called

1:09:01

terrorists for speaking up at school board meetings.

1:09:03

I mean she's going to be the head

1:09:05

of you know an Intel agency. I just

1:09:08

want to make sure that she really has

1:09:10

changed her beliefs on those positions because I

1:09:12

don't want that to come back and bite

1:09:14

me in the ass. I don't want to

1:09:16

find out that I've been put on some

1:09:18

kind of list because someone was not entirely

1:09:20

transparent about what they thought on certain issues.

1:09:22

And that seems like a fair question to

1:09:24

ask. Yeah, definitely. She was on my podcast.

1:09:27

I feel like I might have talked about

1:09:29

gun control there, but I cannot remember for

1:09:31

the life of me, but now I'm going

1:09:33

to go like a transcript. we did talk

1:09:35

about department of education because she was like

1:09:37

I came in and I was so pro

1:09:39

department of education and I was never somebody

1:09:41

who would even consider abolishing it and once

1:09:43

I got into Congress and saw the waist

1:09:46

and saw the numbers and saw how it

1:09:48

hadn't really done anything and now she's like

1:09:50

full on like get rid of it like completely

1:09:52

dismantled the whole department of education but

1:09:54

she did explain how she kind of

1:09:56

got to that thought process so and

1:09:58

I feel like I asked about I

1:10:00

can't remember though I just can't remember

1:10:03

but yeah that would be that would

1:10:05

be interesting to find out if we're

1:10:07

all going to be terrorists. Any more

1:10:09

or less I could talk to you

1:10:12

forever, but it's already been an hour

1:10:14

So you're just gonna have to come

1:10:16

back on You're gonna come on with

1:10:19

me too. Yeah, I would love to

1:10:21

I don't I'm not really smart enough

1:10:23

to be on your show But I

1:10:25

do love the of Carol Roth our

1:10:28

mutual bestian He's so great. She's got

1:10:30

like the best hair ever you have great

1:10:32

hair too. Thank you She's yeah, she's

1:10:34

awesome. Super smart lady. So smart.

1:10:37

And so like, ahead of the

1:10:39

curve on all this stuff and

1:10:42

has been sounding so many alarms

1:10:44

that nobody's listening to other than

1:10:46

you and Jesse Kelly sometimes.

1:10:49

What is your biggest

1:10:51

defective character? Oh, my, oh,

1:10:53

my, I can tell you, my

1:10:55

biggest defective character is that, um,

1:10:57

and this, I'm not like going to

1:11:00

do a humble brag or anything

1:11:02

because I, a zealous enforcer of

1:11:04

this, I am a supremely loyal

1:11:06

person. And when I am loyal

1:11:08

to someone, and if they're like

1:11:11

disloyal to me, I'm like, Godfather,

1:11:13

like, no, no. Like, I want

1:11:15

Godfather to loyalty. Like, you, you

1:11:17

know, you, that's my thing, and

1:11:20

that's what I expect. And I

1:11:22

am in the wrong industry for

1:11:24

that. Me, wrong industry. And

1:11:26

it is an unrealistic view.

1:11:28

It is supremely unrealistic. It

1:11:31

makes me seem. almost

1:11:33

like high maintenance and like

1:11:35

unrelenting and unforgiving

1:11:37

which you know with that it may

1:11:39

be true but that's honestly like

1:11:41

my biggest thing and so I don't

1:11:43

know that's why I got a dog. Yeah I

1:11:46

I when people ask me this question

1:11:48

weird answer it seems like it's

1:11:50

a weird answer because it is

1:11:52

a defect because you're like okay

1:11:55

well Dana you can't you can't

1:11:57

expect that kind of loyalty and

1:11:59

I'm like Like, damn it, I do. I

1:12:01

do. I would say I

1:12:04

have the same level of,

1:12:07

I'm like that with people, and when I

1:12:09

get burned by them, I'm like, you're dead

1:12:11

to me, but what comes of it for

1:12:13

me, that's the defect of character, is that

1:12:15

I'm spiteful. Like, it is

1:12:17

like a tiny mafia opens in my

1:12:19

heart, and I'm like, you're dead

1:12:21

to me now, and then I will

1:12:23

fucking do everything in my power

1:12:26

to destroy you. Just, it's

1:12:28

not good. Like, it's definitely power

1:12:31

by spite. That is definitely how

1:12:33

I feel. Like, I'm like, oh,

1:12:35

somebody double -crossed me, and I'm

1:12:37

the same way, like I'm a

1:12:39

make -up and all, but again, that's

1:12:41

what happens inside my heart and

1:12:43

my head, you know, and

1:12:45

then that's, and then maybe it's petty,

1:12:48

you know, and I really, again,

1:12:50

wrong industry to have that kind of

1:12:52

character defect. And it's a lack

1:12:54

of grace. Like, I, but I'm very,

1:12:56

I will just like carry that

1:12:58

grudge. It's very hard for me to

1:13:00

like go of it. And I'm

1:13:02

in recovery. So it's

1:13:04

like, all, you know, so much of

1:13:06

recovery is like, don't carry resentments. And

1:13:09

I'm like, well, we've got another list

1:13:11

to make. I wrote,

1:13:13

literally, one of my books was about grace.

1:13:15

And after I finished it, I was like,

1:13:17

screw Grace! No! It's just like, why did

1:13:19

I write this book? And I just

1:13:21

did not want to read it or touch

1:13:23

it again. And so I put it up, like

1:13:25

I always keep a copy for myself. And I put

1:13:27

it up on my bookshelf, like in the corner. And was

1:13:29

like, no. But then when I walk into my office,

1:13:32

it looks at me and judges me like, remember, what was

1:13:34

in your head and your heart when you wrote this

1:13:36

book? And I'm like, yes, I'm trying to ignore it right

1:13:38

now. It's hard. It's like

1:13:40

an ongoing like back and forth thing. And

1:13:42

it's just me being juvenile. I mean, I

1:13:44

can be, I try to be a better

1:13:46

person, but in my heart, I am just

1:13:48

like a bar fight. I am

1:13:50

a raging bar fight in my

1:13:52

heart. And it is really hard for

1:13:54

me to class the joint up and not

1:13:57

be like that. And I try so hard.

1:13:59

And I hope.