0:14

Welcome to You're Not Crazy , a

0:16

podcast for the adult children of

0:18

parents with borderline and narcissistic

0:21

personality disorders . I'm

0:23

your host , tori Wixel , a

0:25

therapist and coach with over a decade

0:27

of experience in the mental health field . Now

0:30

let's jump in . Hi

0:32

and welcome back to this week's episode of

0:34

You're Not Crazy . If you

0:36

are one of our new listeners , I want

0:39

to officially welcome you

0:41

to our podcast . I am so

0:43

happy to see

0:45

some new people trickling

0:47

in , getting messages from

0:49

people who are new to the podcast

0:51

and , as always , I am eternally

0:54

grateful for our longtime listeners

0:56

as well , who have been there since

0:58

the beginning and continue to help

1:00

spread the word of You're Not Crazy

1:02

. It's been so cool to see

1:05

this community grow , and

1:07

I'm so glad that it

1:09

is continuing to grow

1:11

and help other people feel

1:14

so much less alone in their journeys

1:16

. It's really been an awesome

1:18

and very rewarding experience to do

1:20

the podcast , so welcome . A

1:24

few housekeeping things before we dive

1:26

into the heart of today's episode One

1:28

. I believe last week I talked about

1:31

my new mini course called Before

1:33

Boundaries . I initially had posted

1:36

it up on confidentboundariescom

1:38

for a small

1:40

price However small

1:48

price . However , I adjusted that and it's now available at confidentboundariescom for

1:50

what I call pay what you can . So if what you can

1:52

pay is $0 , then

1:55

go sign up for $0 . If you are

1:57

able to pay a little bit more then

1:59

I appreciate that as well . But

2:01

I just changed that fee structure

2:04

over there . So if

2:06

you haven't taken before boundaries , if

2:08

you are struggling with boundaries

2:10

, that is a course you definitely want

2:12

to take . It is also available

2:15

in the Confident Boundaries online community

2:17

membership in our on-demand

2:20

library . So if you are already a part of the

2:22

Confident Boundaries community , just

2:24

head on over to the On Demand library and

2:26

you can find it there . But I highly

2:28

recommend you take that course because

2:30

it is a really easily

2:32

digestible 15-minute video

2:35

where I break down the differences

2:37

between BPD and MPD and why

2:39

these disorders make boundary

2:42

setting especially challenging . Disorders

2:46

make boundary setting especially challenging . If you even suspect that your parent has either

2:48

of those disorders , it is a really good place to start

2:50

to really understand what that means . I

2:53

know a lot of people are on the fence about

2:55

does my parent really have BPD

2:57

or MPD ? They've never been officially diagnosed

3:00

or I don't know if they have . This

3:02

is your go-to course to get some clarity

3:05

. I talk about really common

3:07

signs and symptoms and behaviors

3:09

that come up with these disorders and

3:12

it will give you a lot of perspective

3:14

. And while it absolutely

3:16

is not me diagnosing your parent because

3:19

that would be impossible for me

3:21

to do via a video course and

3:23

, having never met them , impossible

3:27

for me to do via a video course and having never met them

3:29

If you can relate and empathize with what I am saying in the

3:31

video , then we would be a very good fit for

3:33

working together as far as addressing

3:36

your family dysfunction . So that

3:39

is also a common question that comes up

3:41

. What if I don't know for sure that my parent

3:43

is a narcissist ? What if I don't know for sure that my parent is a narcissist ? What

3:45

if I don't know for sure that they have BPD

3:47

? They've really never been diagnosed . That

3:50

doesn't necessarily matter . What matters

3:52

is the pattern of behavior

3:55

that we're seeing and how that impacts you

3:57

, and if you can relate to the things that I'm talking

3:59

about in this podcast , if you can relate to

4:01

the things that I'm talking about in the boundaries

4:03

workshop and the mini course

4:05

before boundaries , then we

4:08

are making progress and

4:10

we are addressing your family

4:12

in a way that is resonating

4:16

and true to what you've experienced . So

4:18

don't get so caught up in the diagnoses

4:20

. They're only helpful to a certain

4:22

extent to give us some common language to

4:25

talk about , but I

4:27

know it can also be a little catch-22

4:29

. It can make things a little tricky too . Okay

4:33

, so let's jump into the heart of today's

4:35

episode , which is talking

4:37

about codependency . Codependency

4:41

is something that

4:43

is so

4:45

common when you grow up in

4:47

a dysfunctional family situation

4:49

, when one of your parents has BPD

4:52

or MPD . It also is

4:54

something that so many people

4:56

don't understand that they

4:58

actually are struggling with , and

5:00

, as someone who I

5:03

myself have had

5:05

a very windy

5:08

road , let's say , with my own codependency

5:11

, I think it's a really important

5:13

and helpful topic to

5:16

dive into on the podcast . What

5:19

exactly is codependency ? What

5:21

does it mean to be codependent ? What does it

5:23

mean to be in a codependent relationship

5:26

? We get very enmeshed

5:28

with people that we care about , and

5:31

we very much want

5:33

people we care about to

5:35

be very invested in us

5:37

, and so we pour ourselves

5:39

into them , hoping that

5:42

we'll be reciprocated . And

5:44

there are really common traits

5:46

of people who struggle with codependency

5:49

. That can be things like

5:51

over explaining or

5:54

over justifying your decisions

5:56

. It can be being hyper vigilant

5:58

to other people's moods

6:00

or shifts in the way

6:02

that they're talking like the walking on

6:05

eggshells thing that is really common

6:07

to experience or feel

6:09

. If you're around someone with BPD or MPD

6:12

, perfectionism

6:14

is a big one to try to avoid

6:16

conflict or criticism . Really

6:20

, people pleasing Codependency

6:22

and people pleasing go hand in hand

6:25

. So if you have found yourself to be a

6:27

pleaser , you also might have some

6:29

codependent traits . These

6:31

are all extremely common

6:34

aspects of codependency

6:36

and by no means does this describe

6:38

every codependent trait that could

6:40

possibly show up in your life , but I

6:42

think that by talking through

6:44

some of these , it gives you a good sense

6:46

of what codependency is

6:48

. So let's talk about it

6:50

a bit more and dive into

6:53

what do we do if we

6:55

relate to having codependent traits

6:57

. This one is especially

7:00

tricky because when

7:04

people have borderline personality

7:06

disorder , they also have a lot of codependent

7:09

traits typically Not

7:11

people with narcissistic personality

7:14

disorder , but people with BPD tend to

7:16

have a lot of codependent traits . There

7:18

is a lot of

7:20

dependence on other people

7:22

to regulate their emotions

7:24

and a lot of external pressure

7:28

on people around them to do and

7:30

say the thing that they

7:32

need in that moment in order for them to be

7:34

okay . And when you grow up with a parent

7:37

like that , you

7:39

are going to have a higher chance

7:41

of being codependent because

7:43

your emotional needs are

7:45

not consistently being met , and

7:48

that is really what drives a lot

7:50

of codependency and codependent traits

7:52

. But if you grow up with

7:55

a parent with BPD and

7:57

you see some of those codependent traits

7:59

in yourself , you might freak out

8:02

, like I've done in the past , and

8:04

think , oh my gosh , what if I

8:06

myself have BPD ? What

8:08

if I'm the problem

8:10

? What if I am doomed

8:13

to repeat all of this trauma

8:16

? And what

8:18

if this is me too ? And I want

8:20

to tell you what

8:24

if this is me too ? And I want to tell you I know I've said it on the podcast

8:26

before , but let's say you did have BPD . Okay , you're

8:28

not your parent . You're listening to me

8:30

talk on this podcast . Bpd

8:32

is very treatable and

8:34

very manageable . What I would

8:37

highly recommend you do is find

8:39

a DBT program near you

8:41

if you truly are concerned that

8:43

you have BPD , and

8:46

start as soon as you can

8:48

Work with a therapist who

8:50

is trained in DBT , who specializes

8:52

in BPD . Even if you

8:54

don't have BPD , dbt

8:57

is awesome for learning skills

8:59

that we were never taught when we grew up

9:01

with BPD and MPD parents . So

9:03

that is okay . It

9:05

is manageable . The fact that you are afraid

9:08

means that you're willing to go

9:10

to therapy and do the work to

9:12

make sure that you do everything

9:14

in your power not to harm other people

9:16

. That is wonderful . That

9:19

in and of itself makes you different from your parent

9:21

, but I think what's far more

9:23

likely if you have found yourself

9:25

here listening to me talk

9:27

than you having BPD is that

9:29

you have some codependent traits that

9:32

are really a result of not

9:34

having that consistent , stable

9:37

, secure attachment to your parents

9:40

. When you're growing up , you can grow up

9:42

to become an adult who

9:44

is really fixated

9:47

on having

9:49

that secure attachment in your

9:51

relationships , and yet

9:53

when you don't grow up with

9:56

that , the way we go about it

9:58

is just not

10:00

productive . We go about

10:02

it in a way that is reflective of the

10:04

relationship we had with our own parents

10:06

, not with what is actually healthy

10:08

amongst two adults , and so

10:11

when you're looking at codependency and

10:13

working on codependent traits , there

10:15

are some things that are really important for you to

10:17

understand about that . One

10:19

is that most

10:21

adults are capable

10:24

of taking care

10:26

of their own emotions . Most

10:28

adults are capable of handling

10:31

things like being let

10:33

down or anxious . Most

10:35

adults can navigate that

10:37

, and even the ones who

10:39

can't are responsible

10:42

for figuring it out . They're responsible

10:44

for going and seeking out

10:47

support and education and knowledge

10:49

in order to figure out

10:51

how to manage their

10:53

difficult emotions . It

10:55

is never up

10:58

to other adults around them

11:00

to manage their emotions for

11:02

them . That is codependency

11:05

right there . Growing up

11:07

, you were convinced

11:10

that it was up to

11:12

you to

11:14

regulate your parents' emotions . You

11:16

were conditioned to believe

11:18

that if you acted , if you said

11:21

certain things , if you behaved

11:23

in the right way , if you followed

11:27

unspoken rules that

11:29

were constantly changing , if you could

11:31

figure them out and get two steps ahead

11:33

, that you could make everything

11:35

be okay because you could control

11:38

and regulate your parents' emotions for

11:40

them . And in large part that's

11:42

a fallacy . But even when

11:44

it is true , it's

11:46

not healthy and that

11:48

is codependency right there . Codependency

11:51

is this belief that

11:53

I can take care

11:55

of this conflict

11:57

or stressor or issue

12:00

that is happening with

12:02

this person that I'm in some sort

12:05

of relationship with , by

12:07

going around

12:10

them and regulating their

12:12

emotions for them . The

12:14

way that I used to do this

12:16

a lot that I

12:19

have done a lot of work on and

12:21

am much better about now is

12:24

I would get very

12:26

uncomfortable if my husband

12:29

was upset , and not

12:31

just uncomfortable . I

12:34

would try to fix that

12:36

, and by fix that I mean make

12:39

it so he was never upset . And

12:41

that's not reasonable and that's not

12:43

necessary , because my husband is

12:46

, overall , a very lovely

12:48

human being who is quite capable of

12:50

regulating his own emotions and

12:52

while he is definitely not perfect

12:55

, he is a capable

12:58

adult who has

13:00

the ability and the willingness to

13:02

ask for help when he needs

13:04

it . And so this

13:06

was unnecessary and

13:09

I wasn't even aware I was doing

13:11

it for a very long time . But

13:13

once I became aware

13:15

of this , it was so

13:18

hard to not step in and

13:20

try to fix things when he was

13:22

upset and he didn't have to be upset

13:24

with me or our relationship

13:26

, it was just being upset

13:28

in general because for so

13:30

long of my life someone

13:33

my parent being

13:35

upset with me or upset

13:37

in general , felt so

13:39

unsafe . That couldn't be okay

13:42

for me . And even

13:44

though I've chosen a much

13:46

more emotionally healthy partner

13:48

for myself , even though

13:50

I have chosen to surround myself

13:53

with much more emotionally

13:56

healthy friends and colleagues

13:58

, that doesn't

14:00

mean that underlying

14:03

tendency that I had

14:05

just goes away . Another

14:08

way codependency has shown up in

14:10

my life and that I've had

14:13

to work on is with asking

14:15

for help . It can be really hard

14:17

to ask for help , and something

14:19

I used to do a lot is , on

14:22

the rare times that I did ask

14:24

for help , I would preface

14:26

it by saying it's completely

14:28

fine if you don't want to do

14:30

this or you don't have the capacity to

14:32

do this , or if you just

14:34

make sure you can definitely

14:37

tell me . If you're not interested

14:39

in doing this and I'm not going to lie

14:41

sometimes I still find

14:43

myself prefacing things

14:45

with that whole unnecessary

14:48

intro where I

14:50

am assuming responsibility

14:53

for someone else , knowing what

14:55

their capacity is and

14:57

being able to tell me yes or

14:59

no . I'm assuming that because

15:01

it's hard for me to say

15:03

no to people if I don't have the capacity

15:06

that . It's hard for other people , and

15:09

that's not my job . My job

15:11

is to recognize

15:13

what I have the capacity for

15:15

emotionally , what I'm experiencing

15:18

and what I need to help myself with those

15:20

feelings , and so

15:22

I actively work

15:24

on trying not

15:27

to get

15:30

two steps ahead of myself and

15:32

answer on behalf of someone

15:34

else and instead be much more

15:36

present and mindful

15:39

and know

15:41

that it's okay to ask for help

15:43

and it's okay for people

15:45

to say no , and as

15:49

adults , these are very normal

15:51

things that we have to

15:53

go through in order to be a healthy person

15:56

. We have to ask for help . We have

15:58

to be understanding

16:00

that not everyone that we ask for help is

16:02

going to be able to accommodate us or accommodate

16:05

us in the way that we hope

16:07

or want or need . And

16:10

when that's the case , that

16:12

we're okay figuring

16:14

it out by ourselves , going to ask someone

16:17

else for help who is more capable or

16:19

available to us at the time that

16:21

we are not depending

16:24

on another person to

16:26

feel emotionally stable and safe

16:29

and secure , because that

16:31

is what we did with our

16:33

parent for so long . We

16:35

really gave our parent

16:38

this power to decide

16:40

whether or not we felt safe

16:42

and okay or not . If they were

16:44

happy with us , if they were pleasant

16:46

, if they were not

16:48

upset with us , then we

16:51

felt okay , and if

16:53

they were upset with us , if they

16:55

were not happy with us , our

16:58

world was not okay , and so our

17:01

well-being did

17:03

very much revolve around

17:06

our parents' emotions , which is why

17:08

we develop codependency , where

17:11

we try to regulate other adults'

17:13

emotions , because that

17:15

has been our survival skill

17:17

, that has been our survival tool , our

17:19

mechanism for keeping ourselves feeling

17:22

safe and being safe . And the

17:24

reality is when you start choosing

17:27

safer people , when you start choosing

17:30

healthier people to be a part of your life

17:32

. You don't have

17:34

to protect yourself in that way and

17:36

you really need to relearn

17:38

how to approach relationships

17:41

in a way that isn't trying to

17:43

regulate someone else's emotions for

17:45

them , because that , inadvertently

17:47

, is trying to control the other person

17:49

, and I know if you're listening to my

17:52

podcast , that's like the last thing

17:54

that you want to do . I'm sure of

17:56

it . I know for a fact

17:58

you do not want to be out there controlling

18:00

other people and that is not

18:03

your intention . But that is , in fact , what

18:05

we do when we are exhibiting

18:07

codependent tendencies . We're

18:09

assuming that we know better

18:12

than that other person how

18:14

to

18:16

make sure they're okay , how to

18:18

regulate and manage their emotions

18:20

, how to anticipate

18:23

and respond to

18:25

their capacity levels , and we just don't

18:28

know better . They know them best . We

18:30

need to focus on ourselves

18:32

and what we need and we want

18:34

, and that is also a

18:36

really good redirection to getting more

18:39

familiar with yourself and learning

18:41

about yourself and developing that trust

18:43

in yourself of saying this

18:45

is my capacity , this is what I need , this

18:48

is what I want and I'm capable of

18:50

handling the consequences

18:52

of that right . I'm capable

18:54

of feeling a little uncomfortable

18:56

if my husband is upset

18:59

. And because

19:01

I love him and I don't want him to

19:04

feel upset , I don't want him to be

19:06

sad or disappointed

19:08

or afraid or angry

19:10

or all those things because it's painful

19:13

to see someone that I care about

19:15

experience distressing

19:17

emotions and , at the same time

19:19

, it's okay for him to

19:22

, because he's human and it's a good thing

19:24

, it's a healthy thing , and I

19:27

can just be with him

19:29

, I can just be there around

19:31

him . I don't have to step in

19:33

and do anything , I

19:35

don't have to make it my emotional

19:38

experience , and he doesn't want

19:40

that , frankly , because he is a grown

19:42

adult who is a healthy adult , who

19:44

tries his best to

19:47

be the healthiest version of himself

19:49

. I hope that diving

19:51

into the basics of codependency

19:54

today added some clarity

19:56

to what it means . This is something that comes

19:58

up so frequently with

20:01

the people that I work with and , like I said

20:03

, this is a journey that I am on as

20:06

well , and I'm sure this will

20:08

not be our last episode on

20:10

codependency at all . So

20:12

thank you so much

20:15

for tuning in for another week

20:17

of You're Not Crazy , don't

20:19

forget Before . Boundaries

20:21

and the Boundaries Workshop are

20:23

both available over at confidentboundariescom

20:26

and in the Confident

20:29

Boundaries online community on-demand

20:31

library Until next

20:33

week . I'll see you guys then Bye

20:35

. Thanks

20:48

so much for joining me for another episode of you're not crazy . If you like the podcast , please leave

20:50

a review and rate us five stars . It helps so much , and

20:53

make sure to check the show notes for links

20:55

to bonus podcast episodes and

20:57

other ways I can help . See you soon

20:59

.